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(Atlanta Journal Constitution)   County Commissioner dead, found in lake with hands tied and a gunshot wound to the head, to be ruled suicide. Not sure I agree with you a 100% on your police work, there, Lou   (ajc.com) divider line 81
    More: Scary, county commission, gunshot wound, Georgia Bureau of Investigation, holster, medical examiners, suicides, prescription bottle, death ruled  
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12628 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Feb 2013 at 2:37 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-02 05:22:57 AM

Mitch Mitchell: PunGent: nmemkha: Police found the body of 52-year-old Glynn County Commissioner Tom Sublett early on Dec. 11 in the water beside a docked boat on St. Simons Island. His wallet was in his back pocket and still contained his driver's license and credit cards. An empty gun holster and a magazine loaded with 9mm bullets were found in Sublett's car nearby, but no gun was recovered.

Where did it go? Guns don't float nor do they move on their own accord. If it was a suicide, wouldn't the gun be nearby?

He tied it to a balloon, so it floated away after he shot himself.

/it's possible I watch too much TV

Some kid in Africa is going to be so happy.  God does give out Glocks.


You must be crazy
 
2013-02-02 05:26:27 AM
2.bp.blogspot.com

Hail Mary, Full of Grace...
 
2013-02-02 05:27:37 AM
NameDot
You must be crazy


Link
 
2013-02-02 05:27:52 AM

RacySmurff: BeSerious: ..dropped off a friend who had ridden with him.. Ridden? Really?  Wow.

? Huh?


Seconded.
 
2013-02-02 05:29:06 AM
Sometimes, hanging suicides tie their own hands behind their backs--it's difficult, but can be done if you're desperate enough--so they can't attempt to untie themselves while they're hanging there. Since this guy's hands were tied in front, the question becomes, Would someone out to commit murder be dumb enough to tie his victim's hands IN FRONT, since that gives the victim a fair chance to get away or fight back (or, if the intent was drowning, to swim away). Most killers, however dumb, are bright enough to tie the victim's hands in back, since it renders the victim reasonably helpless.

Otoh, if your intent is to make your suicide look like "foul play" to trick the insurance company, you almost have to bind your own hands in front, if you want to shoot yourself, since it's nearly impossible to tie your hands in back and still shoot yourself in the head. I mean, there's shoddy police work and all, but I can't credit anyone with being so insanely clever as to make this one look like a murder disguised as a suicide disguised as a murder....when a simple suicide would be so much easier to create.
 
2013-02-02 05:42:00 AM

Gyrfalcon: Would someone out to commit murder be dumb enough to tie his victim's hands IN FRONT, since that gives the victim a fair chance to get away or fight back (or, if the intent was drowning, to swim away).


Considering the fact that a lot of people are murdered without anyone bothering to tie their hands at all? Yeah, maybe. You're kind of into belt-and-suspenders territory at that point anyway. It's hardly slam-dunk evidence of suicide, especially when the weapon is missing.
 
2013-02-02 06:08:50 AM
Maybe he shot himself and fell into the water and the gun landed on the dock.  Someone else found the gun on the dock and took it, not seeing the body in the water or ignoring it.  Quite a stretch, I know.  Usually there is not much current in a lake to move floating bodies, but a breeze could have move the body away from the dock.  I wonder how long it was between the time of death and the discovery of the body?  To the internets!
 
2013-02-02 06:16:59 AM
Oh but surely he just shot himself and then hid the gun!
 
2013-02-02 06:21:58 AM
After an exhaustive search of the internet... this happened on a river near the ocean with current and tidal influences, so the body could have floated away, but it was found between a boat and the dock.  My theory is still plausible!  Too soon to declare the case solved?
 
2013-02-02 06:57:47 AM
hollywoodhatesme.files.wordpress.com

//hotlinks.
 
2013-02-02 07:33:50 AM
"It was an apparent suicide, apparently he climbed in the trunk and shot himself 10 times!"
s11.postimage.org
 
2013-02-02 08:28:27 AM
I once took an abnormal psych class with a section on suicide. It was quite interesting. Pretty much everyone who intentionally goes into the water to die empties their pockets first. It's automatic. Almost all of them take off their shoes. This guy had his shoes on and his pockets full. So even without the headshot from the ghost gun, I'm saying no.
 
2013-02-02 08:48:52 AM
Well, here's a scenario... Get about a hundred feet of twine, tie one end to the gun, the other to a rock. Hang the rock over the edge of a dock or boat about 90 feet away and shoot yourself. Once you drop the gun, the weight of the rock pulls it into the water a goodly distance away from you. Might be far enough that nobody searched for the gun there. An yes, it does need to be rather deep water for the rock to pull the gun far enough in this case, but it's a possibility.

Yeah.. I've read way too many Sherlock Holmes stories.
 
2013-02-02 09:12:39 AM

TheHubby: Well, here's a scenario... Get about a hundred feet of twine, tie one end to the gun, the other to a rock. Hang the rock over the edge of a dock or boat about 90 feet away and shoot yourself. Once you drop the gun, the weight of the rock pulls it into the water a goodly distance away from you. Might be far enough that nobody searched for the gun there. An yes, it does need to be rather deep water for the rock to pull the gun far enough in this case, but it's a possibility.

Yeah.. I've read way too many Sherlock Holmes stories.


You've thought this out ahead, have you?
 
2013-02-02 09:44:11 AM
If he shot himself, there would be residue on his hands.  And the ties would probably have dug in to his skin as he was trying to break them if someone else tied them.  This doesn't seem like rocket science to figure out.
 
2013-02-02 09:48:54 AM

Somaticasual

Actually, what a brilliant life insurance plot. It won't cover suicide, so you pull a rural cobain and rig it so that you fall in the lake with your hands bound after being shot. Might have to be a little clever with the rigging, but it's not unimaginable.Naturally, it's kindof hard not to assume homicide in that case, and voila! Your family gets a check.

and tie a lot of helium balloons to your gun so it quietly floats away from the scene, never to be found
 
2013-02-02 10:16:17 AM
media.tiscali.co.uk

Wanted for questioning.
 
2013-02-02 10:26:27 AM
Follow up tag hanging from a tree?

Yeah.  I think there is much more going on here.
 
2013-02-02 10:31:52 AM

Twitch Boy: Now is not the time to have the discussion on lake control.


Uh...It was an ocean inlet.
 
2013-02-02 10:48:52 AM

Another Government Employee: Twitch Boy: Now is not the time to have the discussion on lake control.

Uh...It was an ocean inlet.


wooosh?
 
2013-02-02 11:11:34 AM

Sgt Otter: To play devil's advocate, since most insurance companies won't pay out for a suicide, I could see staging your suicide to look like a murder.

Although it could also backfire and the police might think your spouse murdered you for the insurance.



Somaticasual: Actually, what a brilliant life insurance plot. It won't cover suicide, so you pull a rural cobain and rig it so that you fall in the lake with your hands bound after being shot. Might have to be a little clever with the rigging, but it's not unimaginable.Naturally, it's kindof hard not to assume homicide in that case, and voila! Your family gets a check.

//it's been a morbid evening.


Except life insurance DOES cover suicide, once the insured has lived beyond the "suicide clause" present in their policy.  Typically, life insurance will not pay out for suicide in the first 1-2 years of the policy...after that, you can waste yourself and your beneficiaries collect the money.

http://www.bankrate.com/finance/insurance/life-insurance-policy-pay- 1. aspx

"James Miles, consulting staff fellow for the Society of Actuaries, says a life insurance policy typically contains only one outright exclusion: the suicide clause.
"Depending on the state, it will be either a one-year or two-year suicide clause. If you commit suicide within the first year or two years of the contract, the beneficiary would receive the premiums back but not the death benefit," he says."
 
2013-02-02 11:36:03 AM
Must be the Clinton Official in charge of the death list ....
 
2013-02-02 11:47:36 AM

nmemkha: Police found the body of 52-year-old Glynn County Commissioner Tom Sublett early on Dec. 11 in the water beside a docked boat on St. Simons Island. His wallet was in his back pocket and still contained his driver's license and credit cards. An empty gun holster and a magazine loaded with 9mm bullets were found in Sublett's car nearby, but no gun was recovered.

Where did it go? Guns don't float nor do they move on their own accord. If it was a suicide, wouldn't the gun be nearby?


It would be easy enough--tie a float to the gun.  Put a *SMALL* leak in it so after a while it sinks.  The gun is in the water but well away from the body.  Some people who don't want it to be known it was suicide come up with some pretty elaborate ways of hiding it.

Enemabag Jones: MrBentor
If he had a gunshot to the head - then in most likelihood, he would no longer be breathing; then when he fell in the water, how could he drown? Unless he was still breathing when he entered the water.  To drown, one must breathing.

If the first shot hits the wrong part of the brain, then the coward that commits suicide is not lying in a coma in a hospital waiting to die.

Gabriel Giffords was hit with a 9mm right in the skull, still living.  It's possible.


Exactly.  Using multiple simultaneous methods is a defense against something not working perfectly.

Arumat: Enemabag Jones: Discussion time, what is the best way to commit suicide but make it look like foul play.

Points awarded for creativity and farked up situations.

Take a trip to the Grand Canyon, along the way borrow somebody's boot, put a little oil/grease on the sole, and put a big boot print in the back of your jacket.  When you get to the Canyon, wait till nobody's looking and throw yourself over the edge.  When they find your broken fleshbag at the bottom, it'll look like somebody kicked you over.


You're not going to fall all that far, although it probably would be far enough to die of the fall.

namegoeshere: I once took an abnormal psych class with a section on suicide. It was quite interesting. Pretty much everyone who intentionally goes into the water to die empties their pockets first. It's automatic. Almost all of them take off their shoes. This guy had his shoes on and his pockets full. So even without the headshot from the ghost gun, I'm saying no.


Remember, though, that we are looking at a case of suicide disguised as murder.  He's not going to do those things.
 
2013-02-02 11:51:11 AM
I love that every fat-ass, beer-guzzling, hot wing-eating battard in Amurrica is a forensics expert, now that we've all seen CSI reruns for years.
 
2013-02-02 12:13:10 PM

Enemabag Jones: Gabriel Giffords was hit with a 9mm right in the skull, still living.  It's possible.


Well, the answers right there.

IRT article: sounds like my Uncle's defense attorney who suggested my Aunt committed suicide by shooting herself in the back of the head with a .357, from far enough away not to leave any powder residue/burns.

/hung jury but he was found guilty in a re-trial
 
2013-02-02 01:04:09 PM

Sgt Otter: To play devil's advocate, since most insurance companies won't pay out for a suicide, I could see staging your suicide to look like a murder.

Although it could also backfire and the police might think your spouse murdered you for the insurance.


Interesting points.
 
2013-02-02 01:14:59 PM

IamSoSmart_S_M_R_T: Sgt Otter: To play devil's advocate, since most insurance companies won't pay out for a suicide, I could see staging your suicide to look like a murder.

Although it could also backfire and the police might think your spouse murdered you for the insurance.


Somaticasual: Actually, what a brilliant life insurance plot. It won't cover suicide, so you pull a rural cobain and rig it so that you fall in the lake with your hands bound after being shot. Might have to be a little clever with the rigging, but it's not unimaginable.Naturally, it's kindof hard not to assume homicide in that case, and voila! Your family gets a check.

//it's been a morbid evening.

Except life insurance DOES cover suicide, once the insured has lived beyond the "suicide clause" present in their policy.  Typically, life insurance will not pay out for suicide in the first 1-2 years of the policy...after that, you can waste yourself and your beneficiaries collect the money.

http://www.bankrate.com/finance/insurance/life-insurance-policy-pay- 1. aspx

"James Miles, consulting staff fellow for the Society of Actuaries, says a life insurance policy typically contains only one outright exclusion: the suicide clause.
"Depending on the state, it will be either a one-year or two-year suicide clause. If you commit suicide within the first year or two years of the contract, the beneficiary would receive the premiums back but not the death benefit," he says."


I am extremely glad I didn't know that several years ago when I was seriously considering suicide.
 
2013-02-02 02:59:47 PM

Gleeman: Enemabag Jones: Gabriel Giffords was hit with a 9mm right in the skull, still living.  It's possible.

Well, the answers right there.

IRT article: sounds like my Uncle's defense attorney who suggested my Aunt committed suicide by shooting herself in the back of the head with a .357, from far enough away not to leave any powder residue/burns.

/hung jury but he was found guilty in a re-trial


Thanksgiving dinner must be a hoot in your family.
 
2013-02-02 03:02:50 PM
I don't think it's too likely in any individual case, but using the math from this page:
http://science.howstuffworks.com/science-vs-myth/everyday-myths/ques ti on185.htm
Plus the weight of typical empty revolver being about 350-400 grams, a helium baloon with a one-meter radius (about 6-foot diameter) would be required to lift a handgun and carry it far enough away that it would be lost, at least for a good while.  Or you could use about 30-40 regular balloons, whatever.
Still, not too likely.  And the mass of balloons would probably be spotted in trees somewhere.
 
2013-02-02 10:13:12 PM

Mitch Mitchell: Enemabag Jones: Discussion time, what is the best way to commit suicide but make it look like foul play.

Points awarded for creativity and farked up situations.

Easiest way:

Put a Sign around your neck "You're Next".  Hang yourself.  Rinse.  Repeat.


wat
 
2013-02-03 12:02:02 AM

oukewldave: If he shot himself, there would be residue on his hands.  And the ties would probably have dug in to his skin as he was trying to break them if someone else tied them.  This doesn't seem like rocket science to figure out.


He put his arms inside a garbage bag and tied the end of the bag and the gun to a large weather balloon. When he shot himself the garbage bag protected his hands and arms from the gunpowder residue while the balloon would pull off the bag and carry the both it and the gun off into the heavens.
 
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