miniflea: . Vegetarians and vegans don't bother me as long as they aren't pushy and condescending, which most of them aren't. I also dislike the sort who act all gung ho about their meat eating and come into these threads and are just as pushy as those they complain about.
meep3d: The reality is that the majority of animals destined for food, especially poultry, are treated incredibly badly, kept in cramped conditions and often suffer traumatic and horrible deaths, largely due to consumers pressing for 'cheaper'.
ansius: Interesting analysis of the effects of a vegetarian diet and of modern farming practices used to grow vegetables for your table:It takes somewhere between two to ten kilos of plants, depending on the type of plants involved, to produce one kilo of animal. Given the limited amount of productive land in the world, it would seem to some to make more sense to focus our culinary attentions on plants, because we would arguably get more energy per hectare for human consumption. Theoretically this should also mean fewer sentient animals would be killed to feed the ravenous appetites of ever more humans.But before scratching rangelands-produced red meat off the "good to eat" list for ethical or environmental reasons, let's test these presumptions.Published figures suggest that, in Australia, producing wheat and other grains results in:at least 25 times more sentient animals being killed per kilogram of useable proteinmore environmental damage, anda great deal more animal cruelty than does farming red meat.
ZeroPly: Snakeophelia: I went vegetarian four months ago for health/GI reasons. I try my best not to be insufferable and don't mention my diet unless someone asks. My diet is really 90% vegan, but I can't force myself to use that word. Too many negative connotations. I say my diet is "raw plant based" and stick with that. I live in a big city with a lot of varied cuisines, so it's probably easier for me to be on this diet than for others.Yeah, as soon as people hear "vegan", it's some sort of dog whistle for them to jump in and save you from starving to death. Which is sometimes funny. One of the programmers I worked with was vegan and was a sub-3 marathon runner, I remember at a Xmas party one of the other guys lecturing him that it was impossible to have any energy on a vegan diet because amino-acid-canine-teeth-protein-evolution-wharrgarrbl...
Lith: quietwalker:If you're going to be a vegetarian, do it for justifiable reasons, like morality or conservation.Incredibly well put. But there is no justifiable reason for what is simply a lifestyle choice. One's morality is not another's and some of the best conservationist are avid hunter and meat eaters, they want their game to be around and health for generations to come to pass on a sport and a traditional link to our food.
To Wish Impossible Things: It's not so much eating no meat, as it is eating far less meat, IMO.Humans evolved as lousy hunters, and the meat we did get achieve was pretty lean. We tended to eat a lot of plants to make up for our hunting skills. Vegetarians come closer to this diet (less fat with their protein, far more vegetables) than the standard American diet. Thus their bodies are better adapted to their diet.
log_jammin: meep3d: I don't really see the difference between a pet dog and a pet goatI do.we domesticated dogs something like 30,000 years ago. and not because we thought they were tasty, but because both species found the relationship to be mutually beneficial. Mankind in a sense back a part of the dogs pack just as much as they became a part of ours. and right up until today that relations ship continues.goats were domesticated for food leather and whatever parts of the animal we could use.meep3d: From a moral standpoint if you think it's 'wrong' to eat dog, you shouldn't eat any other animals.from that standpoint you shouldn't eat any animals unless your willing to eat humans as well. unless you're saying humans are a "special" animal.
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