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(Evansville Courier Press)   Grandmother has unsecure Wi-Fi, and someone uses connection to post threats to local police department. Police respond with flash grenades and a raid. Grandmother sues   (courierpress.com) divider line 158
    More: Obvious, Wi-Fi, hand grenades, Police Chief Billy Bolin, internet, Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution, tow, Evansville, grenades  
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8092 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Jan 2013 at 9:56 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-29 09:17:02 AM  
Evansville....farking shiathole
 
2013-01-29 09:29:51 AM  
FTA: The actions of the officers "were done with malicious intent to cause severe mental and emotional distress to Milan," according to the lawsuit.

Which is why everybody involved in this (or any similar) incident should be sent to Gitmo and tortured until they confess, then shot.
 
2013-01-29 09:36:30 AM  
They are lucky they didn't own a dog.
 
2013-01-29 09:59:13 AM  
Is it wrong that I was hoping the stains on the carpet were from granny losing bowel control when they tossed the flashbangs?
 
2013-01-29 10:03:52 AM  
I've always wondered why the police don't just check to see if they can access  the router without a password  themselves before unleashing the hounds. If they can, it's a much safer bet someone is leeching off their network. It's not like it's the first thing something like this has happened, so they should have better plans in place other than "scare the crap outta everyone and detain them until they are proven innocent".
 
2013-01-29 10:05:03 AM  
So before they went in full bore with a militarized strike on a grandma, it never occurred to any of these chuckleheads that wireless routers exist, and the person it is registered to very likely wouldn't be stupid enough to use their own router to threaten the cops?  And that probably meant the actual culprit was probably literally anybody but the network's owner?

I guess kicking in doors and farking shiat up is so much easier and more fun than actual dreary police work.
 
2013-01-29 10:05:42 AM  
What good is a SWAT team if you don't get to use it?
 
2013-01-29 10:05:52 AM  
They didn't taze her? You're slipping, coppers.
 
2013-01-29 10:05:55 AM  
Weak. The cops dragged a camera crew along? I hate hopped up cowboy cops, but cowboy cops showing off for TV takes it too a whole new level.

I would say the family has a pretty good case, especially since a tiny bit of detective work was all that was required to catch the real perp (a known gang member living next door). Shame the cops will use tax payer dollars to make their mistake go away. Screw ups like that should have more consequences for those at fault.
 
2013-01-29 10:07:24 AM  

Real Women Drink Akvavit: I've always wondered why the police don't just check to see if they can access  the router without a password  themselves before unleashing the hounds. If they can, it's a much safer bet someone is leeching off their network. It's not like it's the first thing something like this has happened, so they should have better plans in place other than "scare the crap outta everyone and detain them until they are proven innocent".


If you haven't noticed, the people that become police are not the type to apply long term critical analysis, particularly on the technical side of the stratosphere.
 
2013-01-29 10:07:28 AM  

gilgigamesh: So before they went in full bore with a militarized strike on a grandma, it never occurred to any of these chuckleheads that wireless routers exist, and the person it is registered to very likely wouldn't be stupid enough to use their own router to threaten the cops?  And that probably meant the actual culprit was probably literally anybody but the network's owner?

I guess kicking in doors and farking shiat up is so much easier and more fun than actual dreary police work.


Seriously? How many "dumb criminal" stories have we seen here on Fark? Stupid criminals do stupid things all the time. It's not unreasonable to assume that the threats came from whoever owned the router.
 
2013-01-29 10:07:37 AM  
They even brought a TV crew? WTF?

cretinbob: Evansville....farking shiathole


I'll second that.

Carn: Is it wrong that I was hoping the stains on the carpet were from granny losing bowel control when they tossed the flashbangs?


Yep.
 
2013-01-29 10:07:54 AM  
She's just lucky they didn't shoot her dog or taze her........they'd get away with that too.
 
2013-01-29 10:08:12 AM  
Seems like a knock on the door would have been a good place to start.
 
2013-01-29 10:08:21 AM  
Good. Maybe a few consequences for their actions will cause them to wisen up... Naa, who am I kidding. They'll double-down on stupid.
 
2013-01-29 10:08:43 AM  
Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.
 
2013-01-29 10:10:21 AM  

Helena Handbasket: gilgigamesh: So before they went in full bore with a militarized strike on a grandma, it never occurred to any of these chuckleheads that wireless routers exist, and the person it is registered to very likely wouldn't be stupid enough to use their own router to threaten the cops?  And that probably meant the actual culprit was probably literally anybody but the network's owner?

I guess kicking in doors and farking shiat up is so much easier and more fun than actual dreary police work.

Seriously? How many "dumb criminal" stories have we seen here on Fark? Stupid criminals do stupid things all the time. It's not unreasonable to assume that the threats came from whoever owned the router.


This is a good point, and I don't doubt that there was sufficient evidence to justify the search warrant - but why not, you know, knock on the door and wait for someone to answer it when serving it? Do we need to smash windows, toss in grenades, force old women to the floor at gunpoint? Sure, it's fun, and everyone loves that sort of stuff, but is it really the best approach to this?
 
2013-01-29 10:10:34 AM  
"a way that ensures officer safety"

I think this saying is way over used, worn out even. A blanket statement to cover up for poor judgment.
 
2013-01-29 10:11:30 AM  

Carn: Is it wrong that I was hoping the stains on the carpet were from granny losing bowel control when they tossed the flashbangs?


That was the remainder of the small dog she owned.
 
2013-01-29 10:12:11 AM  

Helena Handbasket: Seriously? How many "dumb criminal" stories have we seen here on Fark? Stupid criminals do stupid things all the time. It's not unreasonable to assume that the threats came from whoever owned the router.


It is pretty stupid keeping your router unprotected, but you are missing the point.

But cops have lap tops in their patrol cars.  All they have to do is pull up in front of the building, verify the router is unsecured, at which point they would know basically anyone living in range is just as likely to be sending the message as anyone else.

In fact I would go so far as to say that may defeat probable cause to search the owner's residence.
 
2013-01-29 10:12:18 AM  
so, what type of warrant were they executing? search? arrest? both? either way, you usually need to find out something about the house. I'm guessing that they should have realized this was some grandmother's house. and they still went for the SWAT approach? for why? boredom? and then the catch the real guy with no real to-do.

fark 'em, sue 'em high, cause a scandal, get someone in trouble. let this be the story when someone is running for office (like the judge/magistrate signing the warrant, the da, whoever).
 
2013-01-29 10:12:18 AM  
WTF happened to "Knock on the door and ask a few questions"!?!?!?!
 
2013-01-29 10:12:30 AM  
And the cops continue to close ranks issue lame-sounding excuses, waste taxpayers money on the case rather than acting morally and compensating the homeowner and most importantly - those that actually made the mistake suffer zero consequences,

Cops, this is why people hate your guts.
 
2013-01-29 10:13:30 AM  

KidneyStone: Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.


Yah, biatch had it coming.

That's the take-a-way here for sure.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-01-29 10:13:43 AM  
Evil hackers are everywhere! Even some disguised as little old ladies.

We're going to show you how we deal with evil hackers, citizen.

Har har hardy har har.
 
2013-01-29 10:15:05 AM  

KidneyStone: Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.


Good point. If there is one thing we ALL know about grandmothers is that they are typically up to date on high tech security w/ regards to wireless digital technology. And I am sure there is NO CHANCE that the cable guy just plopped in the router w/ no password and left it for her telling her it was fine.
 
2013-01-29 10:15:46 AM  
i1151.photobucket.com
'ello, lads! Come in fer a cup o' tea-
*BOOM-FLASH*
Wat the feck? Look at me bleedin' carpet, ya twatters!
 
2013-01-29 10:16:25 AM  

KidneyStone: Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.


This. I agree the actions of the police were totally unwarranted. But the warning should be to secure your router. If you have friends or relatives who are not techies, help them secure it.

I'm still amazed at how many unsecure networks I detect when going through residential areas.
 
2013-01-29 10:18:05 AM  

eKonk: Helena Handbasket: gilgigamesh: So before they went in full bore with a militarized strike on a grandma, it never occurred to any of these chuckleheads that wireless routers exist, and the person it is registered to very likely wouldn't be stupid enough to use their own router to threaten the cops?  And that probably meant the actual culprit was probably literally anybody but the network's owner?

I guess kicking in doors and farking shiat up is so much easier and more fun than actual dreary police work.

Seriously? How many "dumb criminal" stories have we seen here on Fark? Stupid criminals do stupid things all the time. It's not unreasonable to assume that the threats came from whoever owned the router.

This is a good point, and I don't doubt that there was sufficient evidence to justify the search warrant - but why not, you know, knock on the door and wait for someone to answer it when serving it? Do we need to smash windows, toss in grenades, force old women to the floor at gunpoint? Sure, it's fun, and everyone loves that sort of stuff, but is it really the best approach to this?


someone didn't do their homework before committing to a raid. This was not necessarily a violation of her constitution rights if they did have a warrant...but this is likely a poor decision making process in evidence. "a way that ensures officer safety". Huh...sounds like to ensure officer safety you should just execute every potential criminal you come across...because *who knows what could happen we have to keep our angelic officers safe from all potential harm*. This police chief needs his damned head examined. That's a poor excuse for not even bothering to check out the person who lived at that address.

Couldn't even spare 1 detective? Or just bored. I think they were bored and wanted to get their militarized rocks off. Yeah you had a warrant...but the warrant doesn't include flashbangs. There was no cause for that reaction. Could have had a detective maybe do a stop by and knock on the door and interview the person? yeah the warrant probably wasn't gotten properly now that I think about it...police lie all the time even about testing their radar guns/ladar guns before and after use. This seems likely.
 
2013-01-29 10:18:21 AM  

NameDot: "a way that ensures officer safety"

I think this saying is way over used, worn out even. A blanket statement to cover up for poor judgment.


Agreed. Our military men and women's safety is endangered by being deployed to the middle east. So nuke them all. Seems reasonable.
 
2013-01-29 10:18:26 AM  

Private_Citizen: Weak. The cops dragged a camera crew along? I hate hopped up cowboy cops, but cowboy cops showing off for TV takes it too a whole new level.

I would say the family has a pretty good case, especially since a tiny bit of detective work was all that was required to catch the real perp (a known gang member living next door). Shame the cops will use tax payer dollars to make their mistake go away. Screw ups like that should have more consequences for those at fault.


Police have move from "peace officers" to "law enforcement officers". There is a difference: the former views their role as serving the community, the later views their role as keeping the community in order.
 
2013-01-29 10:19:35 AM  
Disarm yourselves and let law enforcement officials like these protect you citizen.

Whats the worst that could happen?
 
2013-01-29 10:20:37 AM  

SpectroBoy: WTF happened to "Knock on the door and ask a few questions"!?!?!?!


Kind of what I was wondering. You know, maybe do a little surveillance for a few days. See if anything looks strange. Then a couple of officers knock on the front door to see whats up. Just common sense stuff.
Luckily for the woman, it was all caught on video.
 
2013-01-29 10:21:01 AM  

stuhayes2010: Seems like a knock on the door would have been a good place to start.


This. It's hard to believe that anonymous threats on the internet are enough to justify a full tactical response without further investigation.
 
2013-01-29 10:21:12 AM  
When you have paramilitary gear and a tv crew, everyone looks like Osama, even peaceful, law abiding citizens sitting quietly at home.
 
2013-01-29 10:21:43 AM  

TDBoedy: someone didn't do their homework before committing to a raid. This was not necessarily a violation of her constitution rights if they did have a warrant...but this is likely a poor decision making process in evidence. "a way that ensures officer safety".


It would be nice if judges didn't basically rubber stamp this stuff, because that probably justifies the actions of the cops and will kill her lawsuit.

Unfortunately, judges have absolute immunity, so this kind of thing will probably continue.
 
2013-01-29 10:21:59 AM  

Day_Old_Dutchie: And the cops continue to close ranks issue lame-sounding excuses, waste taxpayers money on the case rather than acting morally and compensating the homeowner and most importantly - those that actually made the mistake suffer zero consequences,

Cops, this is why people hate your guts.


Yep.

Any cop that doesn't come forward and call for the firing of the people behind this type of BS are just as bad.
 
2013-01-29 10:22:17 AM  

KidneyStone: Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.


Of course it's stupid to have an unsecured wireless router. The problem is, most people are incredibly stupid when it comes  to technology. Hell, I'm a chef and even  I know my wireless signal is not blocked by my walls, which is  why we have a very complex password and change it monthly. However, I've been online for  decades now so I know the dangers  that lurk out there. Most people don't even think about it though, let  alone realize you could conceivably pick up an unsecured signal from blocks away.

/I leeched off someone's wireless for nearly a month before I got mine - I had four to choose from, too
//I  just looked up heavy metal bands and cruised recipe sites  for inspiration, though
 
2013-01-29 10:23:20 AM  

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: SpectroBoy: WTF happened to "Knock on the door and ask a few questions"!?!?!?!

Kind of what I was wondering. You know, maybe do a little surveillance for a few days. See if anything looks strange. Then a couple of officers knock on the front door to see whats up. Just common sense stuff.
Luckily for the woman, it was all caught on video.


You don't understand. They we're mad. They were going to show them a little about respecting authoritah. Police have become addicted to raiding. It's a real rush.
 
m00
2013-01-29 10:23:25 AM  

Real Women Drink Akvavit: ...so they should have better plans in place other than "scare the crap outta everyone and detain them until they are proven innocent".


Yeah but this is way more fun, and serves the additional purpose of conditioning citizens to accept a tyrannical state.
 
2013-01-29 10:24:01 AM  

Helena Handbasket: gilgigamesh: So before they went in full bore with a militarized strike on a grandma, it never occurred to any of these chuckleheads that wireless routers exist, and the person it is registered to very likely wouldn't be stupid enough to use their own router to threaten the cops?  And that probably meant the actual culprit was probably literally anybody but the network's owner?

I guess kicking in doors and farking shiat up is so much easier and more fun than actual dreary police work.

Seriously? How many "dumb criminal" stories have we seen here on Fark? Stupid criminals do stupid things all the time. It's not unreasonable to assume that the threats came from whoever owned the router.


Even if that were a reasonable assumption the response is totally farking ridiculously unreasonable.
 
2013-01-29 10:24:08 AM  

Giltric: Disarm yourselves and let law enforcement officials like these protect you citizen.

Whats the worst that could happen?


Hey genius: I will give you three guesses what happens to your ass when you shoot a cop who enters your home under a lawful warrant.
 
2013-01-29 10:24:36 AM  

Carn: Is it wrong that I was hoping the stains on the carpet were from granny losing bowel control when they tossed the flashbangs?


yes
 
2013-01-29 10:25:53 AM  

Helena Handbasket: gilgigamesh: So before they went in full bore with a militarized strike on a grandma, it never occurred to any of these chuckleheads that wireless routers exist, and the person it is registered to very likely wouldn't be stupid enough to use their own router to threaten the cops?  And that probably meant the actual culprit was probably literally anybody but the network's owner?

I guess kicking in doors and farking shiat up is so much easier and more fun than actual dreary police work.

Seriously? How many "dumb criminal" stories have we seen here on Fark? Stupid criminals do stupid things all the time. It's not unreasonable to assume that the threats came from whoever owned the router.


I'm guessing slightly fewer than "overzealous cop" stories but I have not been keeping a good tally.
 
2013-01-29 10:27:23 AM  
Maybe I'm naive, but I'm thinking that a quick bit of searching would've made this whole thing much easier. That would likely show that the owner is an old lady, unlikely to be a threat. However, if they wanted to have even more proof that she's not a threat, simple surveillance would do. That should confirm that she's old and likely alone. Then send up two officers to ask her a few questions, ask politely if they can check the router out (not sure about whether or not routers keep access logs or the like since I can talk to women without vomiting all over myself). Then, if she refuses, show the warrant and do it anyway. No need for the SWAT techniques.
 
2013-01-29 10:27:24 AM  

wombatsrus: KidneyStone: Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.

This. I agree the actions of the police were totally unwarranted. But the warning should be to secure your router. If you have friends or relatives who are not techies, help them secure it.

I'm still amazed at how many unsecure networks I detect when going through residential areas.


only a criminal rattles door handles to see if they are unlocked.
 
2013-01-29 10:27:33 AM  

Giltric: Disarm yourselves and let law enforcement officials like these protect you citizen.

Whats the worst that could happen?


While I genuinely feel bad dignifying this ridiculous attempt to make this about gun control I will note the following:

If she'd been armed she would most likely be dead by now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jose_Guerena_shooting
 
2013-01-29 10:28:06 AM  

wombatsrus: KidneyStone: Of course nobody has anything to say about how dumb it is to have an unsecured wireless router.

This. I agree the actions of the police were totally unwarranted. But the warning should be to secure your router. If you have friends or relatives who are not techies, help them secure it.

I'm still amazed at how many unsecure networks I detect when going through residential areas.


Secure your router? Eff that. Free wifi for all. It's the internet, not a weapon or controlled substance.

/guest network
 
2013-01-29 10:28:15 AM  

Giltric: Disarm yourselves and let law enforcement officials like these protect you citizen.

Whats the worst that could happen?


Are you suggesting that this would have gone better if granny had whipped out a gun and opened up on the coppers when they assaulted her residence?

That sounds like what you're saying.

And it's really stupid.
 
2013-01-29 10:28:59 AM  
And none of the people involved in the many aspects of this terroristic action will pay a dime for their dumb. Some overpaid ambulance chaser will get granma big bucks courtesy of the towns taxpayers, taking the money away from the schools, snow plowing etcetera. The biggest chunk of lawsuit cash will probably go to doosh lawyer thanks to all the hard work his secretary will do.
 
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