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(Crooks & Liars)   Turns out, Fox was wrong when it reported that millionaires were abandoning California for the ultra-low tax rates in Texas. On both counts   (crooksandliars.com) divider line 144
    More: Interesting, Texas, Chuck DeVore, Freudian slip, high taxes, tax rates, property taxes, Tax Foundation, sales taxes  
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5709 clicks; posted to Politics » on 28 Jan 2013 at 11:35 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-28 11:07:28 AM
Does anyone ever really want to move to Texas?  Or to California?  Unless you want to work for a company specifically headquartered there, there's something to be said for local education, talent, cost of living and livability.  Rock-bottom taxes and sparse government services won't necessarily get you there (and may have the opposite effect).
 
2013-01-28 11:17:39 AM
"If I owned Texas and Hell, I would rent Texas and live in Hell"
-Gen. Sheridan
 
2013-01-28 11:25:18 AM
I'd imagine it's a lot easier to avoid income taxes by finessing your "taxable" income than it is to get out of paying property taxes.
 
2013-01-28 11:29:56 AM
Why go to Texas when you can move to Florida?!
 
2013-01-28 11:33:37 AM

wxboy: I'd imagine it's a lot easier to avoid income taxes by finessing your "taxable" income than it is to get out of paying property taxes.


That, and income taxes are always proportional to how much money you make, so your tax liability is reduced during bad years.
 
2013-01-28 11:34:43 AM
But... but... PHIL MICKELSON
 
2013-01-28 11:38:32 AM
Maybe we should all save time and just post links when it "turns out" Fox is right
 
2013-01-28 11:40:12 AM
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-01-28 11:41:30 AM
Fox News was wrong?

Where is my fainting couch?
 
2013-01-28 11:43:39 AM

Philip Francis Queeg: [4.bp.blogspot.com image 230x173]


Well, we're done here. Good night, everybody!
 
2013-01-28 11:44:10 AM
So what even if they were? Texas has a bunch of millionaires that don't pay taxes, while the rest of the population gets the worst public education in the country and a 1/4th of them don't have health insurance.

Let Texas race to the bottom to compete with third world countries' tax rates.
 
2013-01-28 11:44:24 AM
Stories about the imminent downfall of the place where you don't live will always sell. It reminds us that we're wise to live where ever we live.

I've been hearing about how Commiefornia is doomed and everyone is leaving because it sucks from people who live in places like suburban Phoenix.

Really, any story about why you're awesome to live in bumfark and not a more expensive place will always sell to the people in bumfark.
 
2013-01-28 11:44:25 AM
Ever wonder why conservatives need to lie to convince people that they are right?
 
2013-01-28 11:45:21 AM

rufus-t-firefly: Fox News was wrong?

Where is my fainting couch?


Too late -- I've already fainted onto it.
 
2013-01-28 11:46:27 AM

rufus-t-firefly: Fox News was wrong?

Where is my fainting couch?


Here, sniff these salts my dear.

www.buzzle.com
 
2013-01-28 11:50:28 AM

Lumpmoose: Does anyone ever really want to move to Texas? Or to California?


I can't speak to Texas, but I lived in California for a few years, and it's absolutely beautiful. Napa, Yosemite, Big Sur, Monterey/Carmel, essentially the entire Pacific Coast Highway, the Bay, Tahoe/Truckee, etc. It's a gigantic state with endless entertainment, no matter what you're interested in. Sure, SF is expensive as hell, but I definitely understand the appeal.
 
2013-01-28 11:51:24 AM

organizmx: So what even if they were? Texas has a bunch of millionaires that don't pay taxes, while the rest of the population gets the worst public education in the country and a 1/4th of them don't have health insurance.

Let Texas race to the bottom to compete with third world countries' tax rates.


Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.
 
2013-01-28 11:55:59 AM
Eh, certainly not a millionaire, but I'll take Massachusetts over both California or Texas any day of the week.

Though, I do like San Francisco and Austin. Great towns.
 
2013-01-28 11:57:03 AM

Car_Ramrod: Lumpmoose: Does anyone ever really want to move to Texas? Or to California?

I can't speak to Texas, but I lived in California for a few years, and it's absolutely beautiful. Napa, Yosemite, Big Sur, Monterey/Carmel, essentially the entire Pacific Coast Highway, the Bay, Tahoe/Truckee, etc. It's a gigantic state with endless entertainment, no matter what you're interested in. Sure, SF is expensive as hell, but I definitely understand the appeal.


Yup. I love California.

Parents actually just moved back there despite the taxes. It's worth it.
 
2013-01-28 12:01:11 PM
The other thing people leave out of discussions about Texas is how they balanced their state budgets for a couple of years there with stimulus money from mean ol' President Obama! Now that the stimulus money has been bludgeoned out of existence by the Tea Tard Brigade, Texas is well into the red and sinking fast. They whored themselves out to supposedly bring business to the state and they are trying to fill the revenue shortfalls by nickel and diming public schools and other services and they're still in the red.

Funniest Texas story I read recently was how Texas Instruments moved their Dallas manufacturing facility to Malaysia after their government cut them a big fat check. A company synonymous in namesake with the state that is "open for business" packs up and moves to follow the almighty dollar. Hilarious.
 
2013-01-28 12:01:31 PM

Dr Dreidel: organizmx: So what even if they were? Texas has a bunch of millionaires that don't pay taxes, while the rest of the population gets the worst public education in the country and a 1/4th of them don't have health insurance.

Let Texas race to the bottom to compete with third world countries' tax rates.

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.


Easy enough to fix, just move a couple of military bases and federal facilities. Heck, they want independence anyway, right? Why risk vital equipment and information falling in he hands of a foreign nation? Just farking move vital material and people out. After Federal funding and employees (soldiers, office workers, and so on) are gone it should be sweet for them. No more Federal gubbermint polluting them with impure money.

I imagine they'll fight tooth and nail for every penny they'd stand to lose in a fit of cognitive dissonance. Fort Bliss didn't get the nickname Fort Ignorance for nothing.
 
2013-01-28 12:01:37 PM
Turns out, Fox was wrong when it reported that millionaires were abandoning California for the ultra-low tax rates in Texas. On both counts

ftfy
 
2013-01-28 12:02:07 PM

joness0154: Car_Ramrod: Lumpmoose: Does anyone ever really want to move to Texas? Or to California?

I can't speak to Texas, but I lived in California for a few years, and it's absolutely beautiful. Napa, Yosemite, Big Sur, Monterey/Carmel, essentially the entire Pacific Coast Highway, the Bay, Tahoe/Truckee, etc. It's a gigantic state with endless entertainment, no matter what you're interested in. Sure, SF is expensive as hell, but I definitely understand the appeal.

Yup. I love California.

Parents actually just moved back there despite the taxes. It's worth it.


I love how all the 'tards on the right think taxes are the only thing people care about. I live in the middle of nowhere. Sure the taxes are cheap but there's a reason everybody I know, including me, are desperately trying to get the hell out. Zero culture, nothing to do, it looks like people of Walmart invaded.

California looks pretty nice to me, frankly. I understand the appeal. Only RON PAUL level idiots want to save a few bucks and sit around bored.
 
2013-01-28 12:02:39 PM

organizmx: So what even if they were? Texas has a bunch of millionaires that don't pay taxes, while the rest of the population gets the worst public education in the country and a 1/4th of them don't have health insurance.


Not to mention the highest home insurance premiums in the country as the state government has been bribed to look the other way as private insurance sector is given free reign to price gouge.

But hey, at least you're not "forced at gunpoint" to pay for home insurance ... unless you ever want to take out a mortgage or rent from someone who had to take out a mortgage. So .... ugh .... FREE MARKET!!!!
 
2013-01-28 12:03:58 PM
Californians leave their ocean front properties on the beautiful beaches and come scout out Galveston, take one look at the snot colored water and immediately run back to California on foot out of sheer terror
 
2013-01-28 12:06:13 PM

Dr Dreidel: .

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.


How long can Texas keep winning though? It was already noted that 25% of their population has no health insurance, so their health costs have to be killing them; that 25% will get at least emergency care sooner or later. And their bragging about lower taxes that aren't really that much lower will also sooner or later bite them in the ass.
 
2013-01-28 12:08:15 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: But... but... PHIL MICKELSON


I have a Republican marketing professor who was going on about this last Thursday.  I would love to throw this article in her face if she tries it again
 
2013-01-28 12:10:43 PM

cmb53208: Dr Dreidel: .

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.

How long can Texas keep winning though? It was already noted that 25% of their population has no health insurance, so their health costs have to be killing them; that 25% will get at least emergency care sooner or later. And their bragging about lower taxes that aren't really that much lower will also sooner or later bite them in the ass.


Not to mention 2/3 of Texas local school districts have filed suit against the state claiming the funding for education is so irrevocably insufficient that it's preventing them from the Constitutionally mandated obligation to provide children a competitive public education.

Winning!!!!
 
2013-01-28 12:10:55 PM
I am shocked and appalled to learn of this dishonesty by Real American Conservative Patriotic Americans. Why would these people who have businesses dedicated to getting businesses to leave California lie about such a thing?
 
2013-01-28 12:15:38 PM

Lumpmoose: Does anyone ever really want to move to Texas?  Or to California?  Unless you want to work for a company specifically headquartered there, there's something to be said for local education, talent, cost of living and livability.  Rock-bottom taxes and sparse government services won't necessarily get you there (and may have the opposite effect).


Some of the cities in Texas are nice and relatively liberal compared to the rest of the state. Austin for example is a good place to be if you like music and hate the cold or humidity. The environment is certainly different than the lushness of California but it is gorgeous all the same and parks and greenbelts abound if you love the outdoors. Of course there is a price to pay for that and it is in the form of a 8.25% sales tax (higher on some goods, none on groceries) and really high property tax rates to support the school system which is underfunded by the state.
 
2013-01-28 12:15:44 PM

cmb53208: Dr Dreidel: .

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.

How long can Texas keep winning though? It was already noted that 25% of their population has no health insurance, so their health costs have to be killing them; that 25% will get at least emergency care sooner or later. And their bragging about lower taxes that aren't really that much lower will also sooner or later bite them in the ass.


They'll get more than just emergency care. Sure, it'll start in the ER, but if they need some non-emergency surgery, they'll get it. The people who do the surgery, and the hospital where they stay, will have to do it for free, but they'll get it.

On the other hand, in Texas, hospital administrators can pull the plug on someone on life support if they feel it's no longer financially beneficial to keep them alive. I remember around the time of Shiavo, there was a lady from Africa who was dying of lung cancer, had machines breathing for her, only wanted to live long enough to see her mother one last time. Hospital pulled the plug on her, against her and her siblings' wishes. This was a person who was actually awake and alert. In Texas, this is legal.
 
2013-01-28 12:15:53 PM
Texas has taxes like anywhere else.  Its on travel instead of income.

Seriously I have never seen so many farking toll roads in the cities as well as between.  The latest is that the shiatty road between Houston and Austin is now a toll road.  You'd think they'd at least improve it as a justification.
 
2013-01-28 12:18:12 PM

LectertheChef: cmb53208: Dr Dreidel: .

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.

How long can Texas keep winning though? It was already noted that 25% of their population has no health insurance, so their health costs have to be killing them; that 25% will get at least emergency care sooner or later. And their bragging about lower taxes that aren't really that much lower will also sooner or later bite them in the ass.

They'll get more than just emergency care. Sure, it'll start in the ER, but if they need some non-emergency surgery, they'll get it. The people who do the surgery, and the hospital where they stay, will have to do it for free, but they'll get it.

On the other hand, in Texas, hospital administrators can pull the plug on someone on life support if they feel it's no longer financially beneficial to keep them alive. I remember around the time of Shiavo, there was a lady from Africa who was dying of lung cancer, had machines breathing for her, only wanted to live long enough to see her mother one last time. Hospital pulled the plug on her, against her and her siblings' wishes. This was a person who was actually awake and alert. In Texas, this is legal.


Hey, they can probably come in and shoot you for "stealing" services if you don't pay. You can kill someone for minor property crimes in Texas.
 
2013-01-28 12:18:25 PM

InmanRoshi: cmb53208: Dr Dreidel: .

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.

How long can Texas keep winning though? It was already noted that 25% of their population has no health insurance, so their health costs have to be killing them; that 25% will get at least emergency care sooner or later. And their bragging about lower taxes that aren't really that much lower will also sooner or later bite them in the ass.

Not to mention 2/3 of Texas local school districts have filed suit against the state claiming the funding for education is so irrevocably insufficient that it's preventing them from the Constitutionally mandated obligation to provide children a competitive public education.

Winning!!!!


Meh, that part won't cause the state any budgetary problems. South Carolina school districts tried pulling the same stunt about 20 years ago - complaining that the state required them to supply a 'minimally adequate' education, but wasn't giving them the tools to do so. Sure, they won the case, and every single appeal afterwards, but they still haven't got any cash, and the republicans keep cutting funding anyway.

Neat tidbit of information: that case has made its way (again) to the state Supreme Court - which ruled that both sides have to present their entire case all over again, since all the lawyers and judges involved in the original case are either retired or dead.
 
2013-01-28 12:18:50 PM

falcon176: Californians leave their ocean front properties on the beautiful beaches and come scout out Galveston, take one look at the snot colored water and immediately run back to California on foot out of sheer terror


I would think that the hurricane threat in Texas being a million times higher than in Cali would be a factor as well.
 
2013-01-28 12:21:51 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Why go to Texas when you can move to Florida?!


Why go to Hell when you can move to Purgatory?
 
2013-01-28 12:24:36 PM
Texas f*cking sucks. I've lived in California and visited Texas on several occasions (All work-related), and nothing about Texas has ever lead to me wanting to come back voluntarily.

The only guys I know who moved to Texas voluntarily are vets who work in defense, and most of those dickholes are too ignorant to even appreciate California's coolness in the first place. They'd gladly give up oceans, mountains and hot chicks for a flat hellscape in Amarillo or Greenville because, "Derrr, California taxes too high and gun laws, herrrr." Fine. Go be happy in your misery, dicks.
 
2013-01-28 12:24:41 PM

falcon176: Californians leave their ocean front properties on the beautiful beaches and come scout out Galveston, take one look at the snot colored water and immediately run back to California on foot out of sheer terror


The last time I was in Galveston the water was full of dead shad.  Thousands upon thousands on the beach, floating in the water; little Latino kids playing in the shallow water with rotten, stinking fishkill floating all around them.  The smell was unbelievable.  All in all another glorious day on the Texas beach; we turned around and drove all the way back to Houston after about 8 minutes.

Galveston Bay is surrounded by refineries.  The official line was that the fishkill resulted from oxygen depletion due to a heat wave.

I was.... skeptical.
 
2013-01-28 12:27:15 PM

Dr Dreidel: organizmx: So what even if they were? Texas has a bunch of millionaires that don't pay taxes, while the rest of the population gets the worst public education in the country and a 1/4th of them don't have health insurance.

Let Texas race to the bottom to compete with third world countries' tax rates.

Problem is, Texas would be ranked like 15th in a list of the world's top GDPs if it was independent. Yes, lots of that GDP comes from its status as a US state (from federal revenue-sharing), but that's the reality at present.

The problem is that Texas is winning.


Texas is beating Cali in the race to repatriate low end manufacturing jerbs from China, that's for sure. We suck at creating those jobs, true, but we're doing okay at the higher ends, and I suspect our situation is better in the long run.
 
2013-01-28 12:27:30 PM
FTA: What draws less attention is that sales, property and wireless service taxes are higher in Texas than in most other states.

...At the state level, Texas draws most of its revenue from federal funding and sales taxes. At the local level, property taxes play a major role.

...Combining state and local rates, Texas has the 14th-highest sales tax rates in the country and the 22nd-highest property tax rates, according to the Tax Foundation.

...Texas ranks near the top in property taxes as a percentage of home value.

"Once you start adding it all up and writing the check, you see there is no free lunch," (Texas Republican pollster David Hill) said. "Texas is a nice state with medium-to-high taxes."

...Texas has the fifth-most-regressive tax system in the country, according to a 2009 study by the Institute on Taxation & Economic Policy.


I wouldn't mind living in Austin and/or the Central Highlands of Texas. But the rest of the state isn't much to brag about, IMHO.
 
2013-01-28 12:28:12 PM

verbaltoxin: Texas f*cking sucks. I've lived in California and visited Texas on several occasions (All work-related), and nothing about Texas has ever lead to me wanting to come back voluntarily.


I'd say that my experience of living in California vs. living in Texas is the polar opposite.

Of course, you also have to realize that I'm comparing 29 Palms, California (a half hour by bus to the nearest walmart, and meth capital of the Mojave) as an enlisted man in training living in the barracks, to Austin, where I had a rental car and bunked in a holiday inn.
 
2013-01-28 12:29:35 PM
Turns out, Fox was wrong when it reported that millionaires were abandoning California for the ultra-low tax rates in Texas. On both counts

just a time saver for any future fox links
 
2013-01-28 12:31:39 PM

Karac: verbaltoxin: Texas f*cking sucks. I've lived in California and visited Texas on several occasions (All work-related), and nothing about Texas has ever lead to me wanting to come back voluntarily.

I'd say that my experience of living in California vs. living in Texas is the polar opposite.

Of course, you also have to realize that I'm comparing 29 Palms, California (a half hour by bus to the nearest walmart, and meth capital of the Mojave) as an enlisted man in training living in the barracks, to Austin, where I had a rental car and bunked in a holiday inn.


There's a reason Austin is so unique though. It's in Texas. So it's that one place in Texas that's like that. California has several Austins, each of varying sizes and degrees of weirdness.
 
2013-01-28 12:32:09 PM

joness0154: Car_Ramrod: Lumpmoose: Does anyone ever really want to move to Texas? Or to California?

I can't speak to Texas, but I lived in California for a few years, and it's absolutely beautiful. Napa, Yosemite, Big Sur, Monterey/Carmel, essentially the entire Pacific Coast Highway, the Bay, Tahoe/Truckee, etc. It's a gigantic state with endless entertainment, no matter what you're interested in. Sure, SF is expensive as hell, but I definitely understand the appeal.

Yup. I love California.

Parents actually just moved back there despite the taxes. It's worth it.


Yup, this is a beautiful place to live and work. I love it here. Unfortunately, most of our business is on the East Coast, so we're considering moving our business to North Carolina when our lease expires in 2 years. It's going to be a painful cluster fark, but probably worth it.
 
2013-01-28 12:33:58 PM
Fox "News" wasn't wrong.

/they lied per usual
//duh
 
2013-01-28 12:35:04 PM
I have been to Texas twice in my life.

The first time was when I lived in New Orleans and my band played a job in some little burg about 100 miles inside the Texas state line. (don't remember the town). This was on a Saturday night and since it was late, we all decided to grab a hotel and head out in the morning.

On our way back, we stopped for gas at some just off the interstate gas station. At the time, Texas had a law that forbade sales of alcohol on Sunday before noon. It was about seven minutes to noon when we stopped. Two other band members and myself went inside to get something to drink and a snack. The line to pay was about six people deep. Person number one paid for their items and left. The next line person had a six pack of beer. At this point it was about 3 minutes until noon, so the cashier went ahead and rang up the beer sale. Unbeknowst to any of us was that also in line was an off duty Texas state trooper, who proceeded to flash his badge, detain the purchaser and the cashier, made the cashier lock the door to the station and announced to everyone there that we were all being held to be questioned as witnesses to this horrible crime and that we would all be required to give statements, provide contact information, the whole works. It took almost half an hour for an on-duty patrol car to arrive, and we were there for another 45 minutes waiting to give our statements. The other band guy outside had no idea what was going on and had to wait for almost an hour and a half for the rest of us to be let out of the station. During that time, the station couldn't sell any gas to other customers who stopped in meanwhile (this was before credit card swiping at the pump). This was in late June so it was hot as hell outside, and our band van had no air conditioning so the other guy had to wait outside in the noontime Texas June sun. As much as I hated Louisiana, I was never so glad to cross that state line as I was that day.

The second time was when I was on my way to Phoenix. We were traveling somewhat along the old Route 66 which required a pass through the Texas panhandle. When we left Oklahoma it was sunny and beautiful. Three miles into Texas we hit a blizzard grade snowstorm which we were in the entire way across the panhandle. When we crossed into New Mexico, the sun came back out and it was warm again.

We went home through Utah.
 
2013-01-28 12:36:17 PM

Rapmaster2000: I've been hearing about how Commiefornia is doomed and everyone is leaving because it sucks from people who live in places like suburban Phoenix.


Just the idea of living in suburban Phoenix is enough to get me excited about the snowstorm that's coming through this evening.
 
2013-01-28 12:36:54 PM
Texas wishes it were in competition with California.

As it stands, it is more closely in competition with Mexico.

What's worse is that if you look at economic indicators and out-migration statistics, it seems to be losing. To a failed narco-state. Think about that for a minute.
 
2013-01-28 12:37:10 PM
Call me when CA quits being the 8th largest economy in the world. And the rest of the US...can we get back some of that federal tax money we've sent out to you? You might want to send a thank you note too.
 
2013-01-28 12:38:35 PM
Also, God bless the God of All Texas. (as NSFW they come)
 
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