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(AZ Family)   Woman who posted her wish on Facebook while at work gets to see it come true. "I wish I could get fired some days, it would be easier to be at home than to have to go through this"   (azfamily.com) divider line 170
    More: Dumbass, Facebook, Christine LaCroix, National Labor Relations Act, Daily Star  
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14876 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jan 2013 at 9:16 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



170 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-01-24 08:55:09 AM  
10000birds.com
 
2013-01-24 09:19:28 AM  
Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.
 
2013-01-24 09:20:35 AM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.
 
2013-01-24 09:22:12 AM  
Because, "Just give us a reason to fire you!" employment is the new American reality.
 
2013-01-24 09:23:00 AM  
Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."
 
2013-01-24 09:23:39 AM  

mooseyfate: If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.


What if it was made during a break?
 
2013-01-24 09:23:41 AM  
Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook
 
2013-01-24 09:23:47 AM  
Wait, wait, wait!!! What if...this is a IF, I post on Face Book that I wish my employer would hire a bunch of super hot women to fark my brains out on a daily basis?
 
2013-01-24 09:24:37 AM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


So if you're paying someone to do a job for you, and they publicly ridicule you while under your employment, you'd be cool with that? Should employers have the right to publicly ridicule their employees?
 
2013-01-24 09:26:28 AM  
One simple rule: Don't post anything on facebook you wouldn't want your mother or your boss to see.
Are we supposed to feel bad for these people?

iusedtohavehair.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-01-24 09:26:54 AM  
is facebook some sort of something that can be installed on The Fark? because I love the Fark. forsure.
 
2013-01-24 09:27:04 AM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


She posted it while she was at work, and the comments were about the job itself. If the job wanted to keep her, they could have asked her if everything was alright and worked with her. They didn't want to work with her. There was probably a very good reason why she felt harried and like she wanted to be anyplace but there. Unfortunately, she didn't have anyplace to go which wasn't there.

If she'd had another job lined up, it would have probably mattered to her less.

If you're going to vent, vent under an assumed name after office hours. And that still might not be enough, because of cases where folks have successfullly sued for IP info.

/there is no hope
//got folks on FR bragging about firing 'Obama supporters' and folks here at Fark stating they don't hire people with common free email addresses
 
2013-01-24 09:27:26 AM  

FullMetalPanda: Wait, wait, wait!!! What if...this is a IF, I post on Face Book that I wish my employer would hire a bunch of super hot women to fark my brains out on a daily basis?


You would be fired because now you are liability in the office if any woman in the office ever chooses to file a sexual harassment or discrimination claim.

Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work. And don't use Facebook.
 
2013-01-24 09:31:39 AM  
This reminds me of the dinosaur media companies. The fact is, employers are going to have to adjust to the employees, not the other way around. There are generations of people coming up that post every thought on the Internet. That isn't going to change so unless they want no employees they are going to have to adapt.
 
2013-01-24 09:31:56 AM  

The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."


Or use Facebook.
 
2013-01-24 09:32:50 AM  
Wait, we AREN'T supposed to post stuff from work?
 
2013-01-24 09:32:57 AM  

ongbok: FullMetalPanda: Wait, wait, wait!!! What if...this is a IF, I post on Face Book that I wish my employer would hire a bunch of super hot women to fark my brains out on a daily basis?

You would be fired because now you are liability in the office if any woman in the office ever chooses to file a sexual harassment or discrimination claim.

Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work. And don't use Facebook.

Yea, that.
 
2013-01-24 09:33:27 AM  
Cue that image of the girl posting about how she hates her job and thinks her boss is hitting on her.

Turns out the boss is gay, and she was a slacker.
 
2013-01-24 09:33:45 AM  
While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.
 
2013-01-24 09:34:10 AM  
How hard is it to change your privacy settings and not add coworkers? I do it so I'm free to b*tch about work
 
2013-01-24 09:34:25 AM  

The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."


Make that "don't have coworkers as 'friends.'". If there's one thing I learned after almost a decade of internal investigations it's that many coworkers with rat you out for no apparent reason or gain.
 
2013-01-24 09:34:48 AM  

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

So if you're paying someone to do a job for you, and they publicly ridicule you while under your employment, you'd be cool with that? Should employers have the right to publicly ridicule their employees?


They already do with my paycheck.
 
2013-01-24 09:35:38 AM  
it was one of the most powerful sentences I've ever typed in my life

She sounds simple and uninteresting.
 
2013-01-24 09:36:18 AM  

ongbok: Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work.


Do you work at a law firm or something? Yeah the limits at work are different from the limits at, say, a bar. But if you can't even talk about last night's game, you're in a sad, dysfunctional place.
 
2013-01-24 09:36:53 AM  

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

So if you're paying someone to do a job for you, and they publicly ridicule you while under your employment, you'd be cool with that? Should employers have the right to publicly ridicule their employees?


Where did she ridicule anybody? Her comment didn't necessarily mean that she was ripping on her employer.
 
2013-01-24 09:37:36 AM  

McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook


I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.
 
2013-01-24 09:38:11 AM  
Corporate will grind you under their heel at any chance they get.
We realize the man behind the desk is just a worthless pussy waiting to act out, you just have to be careful not to give them reason to do so. If they aggravate you that much, deal with them after you are working somewhere else.
 
2013-01-24 09:38:36 AM  
Worked at a place where the receptionist vented about job satisfaction and her boss her MySpace account. She said all sorts of shiat "I wish he would just die" and other indirect violent statements. She forgot that she had befriended her bosses wife.

She was fired the next day.
 
2013-01-24 09:39:45 AM  

Smoky Dragon Dish: One simple rule: Don't post anything on facebook you wouldn't want your mother or your boss to see.
Are we supposed to feel bad for these people?

[iusedtohavehair.files.wordpress.com image 430x555]


That's the whole pathological aspect of facebook: We treat different people with different degrees of formality and familiarity and informality. Your boss isn't your mom, who isn't your wife, who isn't your rabbi, who isn't your child or whoever. The premise that everyone should know all of your thoughts and personal commentary on any given subject is catastrophically absurd.
As this woman learned. Nobody needs to know all my business and certainly everyone I know isn't qualified to know everything everybody else knows about what I'm doing, have done, or am thinking.

Facebook is sociopathic in the sense that it is emotionally and politically tone deaf for personal expressions beyond the strictly public. Use a pseudonym that all your friends know or just don't bother with it. Facebook sucks, Ray.
 
2013-01-24 09:40:32 AM  

mooseyfate: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.


generally, employers can fire you without cause, unless the are firing you for a reason that is protected. she could have been more easily fired for saying nothing. then there wouldn't have been a hearing before the labor board.

but, since it appeared there was a reason to fire her, specifically her comment, the issue becomes whether her comment was protected. certain things under the right circumstances are protected. most relevent, discussions of work problems that ultimately have the goal of bettering the working relationship, for example, attempts to organize the workforce to say, hey, this sucks, fix this.

but, just saying, i want to be home because i'm stressed is probably not all that motivating to change the relationship. had she said, i am overworked and not properly compensated, then she would have had a better argument that her activity was protected.
/ although, sometimes 'organizing' during company time can get you in trouble.
 
2013-01-24 09:40:52 AM  

MythDragon: While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.


In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

/they CAN fire her for using social media at work while clocked in
//oh hai boss...
 
2013-01-24 09:41:02 AM  
I also enjoy seeing folks post on Fark about how awesome they are because they don't use Facebook.
 
2013-01-24 09:41:10 AM  

MythDragon: While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.



You have to keep something in mind... In this economy, employers KNOW that you should feel privelidged to have your job to start with. So, if you are the slightest bit on the fence about your job, they'll be more than happy to replace you for someone cheaper, and more productive. And probably better looking.

I'm friends with my boss on Facebook. But I've known her for 10 years longer than I've been working here. And in any case, we never say shiat about work on FB.
 
2013-01-24 09:41:13 AM  

vodka: This reminds me of the dinosaur media companies. The fact is, employers are going to have to adjust to the employees, not the other way around. There are generations of people coming up that post every thought on the Internet. That isn't going to change so unless they want no employees they are going to have to adapt.


There are many ways to adapt. Ask the air traffic controllers, the twinkie bakers and anyone whose job was outsourced to an illegal or third-worlder overseas.
 
2013-01-24 09:41:22 AM  
As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.
 
2013-01-24 09:42:37 AM  
Stupid biatch.

Why would anyone say anything derogatory about your job/place of employment, in a public forum, and then get all shocked when opening your mouth and letting the dumb run out has consequences.
 
2013-01-24 09:43:43 AM  
We had a couple of OR nurses fired for posting dumb shiat during work hours. I closed my Facebook account so no one can see the dumb shiat my friends sometimes post to my account. Staying anonymous is the way to go.
 
2013-01-24 09:44:19 AM  
declubz.com
 
2013-01-24 09:44:40 AM  

JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.


Luckily, I don't talk about work online. My pathological liar ex-girlfriend, on the other hand...
 
2013-01-24 09:45:04 AM  

MythDragon: While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.


I'd call the person in and tell him it is time to start looking for another job. He'd get notice that his time in my employ is coming to an end and be allowed to search for a new job. Someone who hates his job so much that he vents to others at work cannot possibly be effective in it. Worse, he can destroy morale. It's time for him to go someplace where he will be happy.
 
2013-01-24 09:48:04 AM  

The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."


THIS!!!!

Yesterday an email came across asking for us to "Like" the company we work for. Although they've been on Facebook for a year or two now their Like's have been under double-digits and believe that having so few actually hurts the company's online presence.

This opened up an interesting discussion as to what the potential risks existed for refusing to. There's about a 70% chance that the "Social Media Director" will be counting heads and about 50% chance that he will push further or be able to dole out a threat if we don't comply.
 
2013-01-24 09:48:15 AM  

KidneyStone: If there's one thing I learned after almost a decade of internal investigations it's that many coworkers with rat you out for no apparent reason or gain.


Too damn true.

CSB:

Back when I was 18, I had lunch with a coworker saying I wasn't happy with the crap I was having to put up with and I was thinking of moving to Dallas. The only ones who knew that were my fiancee at the time and this coworker. I get fired some short time later and in the process I'm told that since I was planning on moving to Dallas, I obviously didn't have any company loyalty. Yeah, I was planning on moving to Dallas in a year or so after I'd saved up enough from my crappy minimum wage ($3.35/hr) job to afford living in a real city.

Oh well, it made me piss or get off the pot, so I joined the Navy and got some real job experience. Pay still sucked.

/Never figured out why she ratted me out.
//I was a semi IT/gopher type for an itty bitty company.
///She was a temp who answered phones and made xeroxes.
////She picked up an STD and her husband dumped her and actually got to keep the kids.
//Karma, biatch!
 
2013-01-24 09:48:54 AM  

onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.


Heh.
At my last real big-time job, I suspected we had key loggers installed. Randomly, I used to type really, really rude sentences about my bosses doing unnatural sexual acts with each other and animals.
Hee-haw.
What a bullshiat world we've made for ourselves.
 
2013-01-24 09:49:27 AM  
After clocking a 93 hour hour workweek (professional, no overtime) in order to make a deadline, I posted a picture of the very bottom of my timesheet in disgust. No company info, just my hours. A couple of internal project names were seen, but those make no sense to...hell, anyone. I get biatched out the next day, because our managers gf is friends with me on fb. Apparently I showed poor judgement by publishing confidential internal documents online. So....I'm not friends with any of those people on fb anymore. In my mind the issue isn't internal documents, it was fark, we don't want people seeing how we overwork our employees. And the post itself wasn't even really negative, it was just along the lines of "getting things done, holy shiat, crazy hours". Wasn't even disparaging. It was annoying as f*ck. Instead of biatching me out about this,let's address the work environment problems (lack of planning, understaffing, inability to stand up to clients, viciously overselling our capabilities and then hanging workers out to dry, etc) that create that sort of situation. Zero things have been done to address any of that. I don't typically biatch about work on fb other than "super busy, crazy deadlines" or something like that, so getting the third degree over something innocuous for a reason that wasn't a real reason was annoying as shiat. I've seen pictures of rigs and parts that are way more confidential posted online, so the ass end of a.time sheet doesn't mean fark all. You just don't want potential employees to know they're gonna be farked if they work here.
 
2013-01-24 09:50:31 AM  

JakeStone: /Never figured out why she ratted me out.
//I was a semi IT/gopher type for an itty bitty company.
///She was a temp who answered phones and made xeroxes.
////She picked up an STD and her husband dumped her and actually got to keep the kids.
//Karma, biatch!


Never trust a temp.
 
2013-01-24 09:53:08 AM  

KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.


No, it is not, and yes, they can. It may not seem fair, but that's the way it is. Your employer cannot fire you for your political views or religious beliefs, but that's about as far as your free speech guarantee protects you.
 
2013-01-24 09:54:39 AM  

KidneyStone: The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."

Make that "don't have coworkers as 'friends.'". If there's one thing I learned after almost a decade of internal investigations it's that many coworkers with rat you out for no apparent reason or gain.


That.
There's always an informer.
Always.
 
2013-01-24 09:57:39 AM  
Adults still use FB? Thats cute.
 
2013-01-24 09:58:16 AM  
Skarekrough

Yesterday an email came across asking for us to "Like" the company we work for. Although they've been on Facebook for a year or two now their Like's have been under double-digits and believe that having so few actually hurts the company's online presence.

This opened up an interesting discussion as to what the potential risks existed for refusing to. There's about a 70% chance that the "Social Media Director" will be counting heads and about 50% chance that he will push further or be able to dole out a threat if we don't comply.


I was in this situation with a company, the HR/Social media director was had no business being in HR since her tact and personality surely didn't suit it.
I declined the option to "like" the company page and friend her and my boss at that time since they were not my friends and really my personal business was not my own.
Thank goodness I was on my way out so I didn't get the chance to experience the fall out.
 
2013-01-24 09:59:02 AM  
If I post anything on FB it's usually sports related or replying to someone.  I never talk about work.  I don't even have where I work on my profile.
 
2013-01-24 10:01:06 AM  

JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.


i1197.photobucket.com

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.
 
2013-01-24 10:01:17 AM  

Smoky Dragon Dish: One simple rule: Don't post anything on facebook you wouldn't want your mother or your boss to see.
Are we supposed to feel bad for these people?

[iusedtohavehair.files.wordpress.com image 430x555]


Better:

"I don't always derp, but when I do, I make sure everyone with internet access can know about it, and attribute it to me."
 
2013-01-24 10:03:26 AM  
If you are not a teenager or a bored housewife what the hell are you doing on facebook??
 
2013-01-24 10:04:23 AM  

The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."


Or any of your coworkers. In France, some people got fired because one of their coworker "friends" rated them to their boss. It was a comment that was solely destined for the friend list, and was not public whatsoever.
 
2013-01-24 10:04:49 AM  

HotIgneous Intruder: I suspected we had key loggers installed


I don't know your employer, and I'm not defending things like keyloggers. That being said, many large and well known enterprises have keyloggers on all corporate machines. The odds are not as small as you might think.

Understand that whatever IT has done they are doing because /your/ boss, or someone above your boss has asked them to do it. These things cost money, time and resources and are looked down upon by people in IT. Generally IT people only like them insofar as making sure that people aren't emailing out private health records of running afoul of SEC rules or the like.
 
2013-01-24 10:05:17 AM  

JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

No, it is not, and yes, they can. It may not seem fair, but that's the way it is. Your employer cannot fire you for your political views or religious beliefs, but that's about as far as your free speech guarantee protects you.


politics and religion are not the limits of protected speech. federal labor law protects certain types of labor related speech.

National Labor Relations Act, section 7:

***

RIGHTS OF EMPLOYEES

Sec. 7. [§ 157.] Employees shall have the right to self-organization, to form, join, or assist labor organizations, to bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing, and to engage in other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid or protection, and shall also have the right to refrain from any or all such activities except to the extent that such right may be affected by an agreement requiring membership in a labor organization as a condition of employment as authorized in section 8(a)(3) [section 158(a)(3) of this title].

***

work related speech whose purpose is for collective bargaining or mutual aid and protection is protected. here, the labor board said her speech didn't reach that level. had she made the speech more about the conditions of her employment, and other employees would have read it, it probably would have been protected.
 
2013-01-24 10:05:34 AM  

karmaceutical: If you are not a teenager or a bored housewife what the hell are you doing on facebook??


Where else am I gonna hear about the odor, color, and texture of my friends' baby poops?
 
2013-01-24 10:06:38 AM  

KingsleyZisou: MythDragon: While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.

In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

/they CAN fire her for using social media at work while clocked in
//oh hai boss...


We have a no social media use while working policy. I know people check FB and such on their phones at breaks and it's ok. However, I had a night shift employee posting, during working hours, that she was bored, wished there was some more excitement, and that she was pissed that she didn't have more time off (our employees get 4 weeks paid vacation and two weeks of sick time a year). After about two weeks of this one of her coworkers told me about this; so I checked out her FB wall that she, for some stupid reason, left public. I made copies of two-three posts a night that she was working, copied her time sheets and the schedule for those pay periods and sent her on her merry way. Unemployment denied her claim because A) She violated our policies and B) She obviously didn't care enough to tell her supervisor that she was dissatisfied.

/And this is why I am glad fark isn't specifically prohibited in our social media policy.
 
2013-01-24 10:12:37 AM  
Maybe people should work at work and do personal stuff on their own time? Before Facebook and cell phones, people didn't pull out the newspaper and read it at their desk, did they? It seems like all they do now is.........oops gotta go, somebody's coming down the hall.
 
2013-01-24 10:12:56 AM  
I wish I was dead some days, it would be easier to be dead than to have to go through this...
 
2013-01-24 10:15:40 AM  

vodka: This reminds me of the dinosaur media companies. The fact is, employers are going to have to adjust to the employees, not the other way around. There are generations of people coming up that post every thought on the Internet. That isn't going to change so unless they want no employees they are going to have to adapt.


LOL, no. STFU and GBTW.
 
2013-01-24 10:17:05 AM  

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

So if you're paying someone to do a job for you, and they publicly ridicule you while under your employment, you'd be cool with that? Should employers have the right to publicly ridicule their employees?


I think that would be a lawsuit waiting to happen. Hostile work environment, etc.

/ianal
 
2013-01-24 10:19:34 AM  
Assume everything you post anywhere on the internet is viewable by the general public and you'll be fine, if you're not excessively stupid.
 
2013-01-24 10:20:35 AM  

HotIgneous Intruder: Because, "Just give us a reason to fire you!" employment is the new American reality.


Ha. Not where I work.
 
2013-01-24 10:22:03 AM  

karmaceutical: If you are not a teenager or a bored housewife what the hell are you doing on facebook??


shut-in pretending to have friends
 
2013-01-24 10:22:10 AM  

JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

No, it is not, and yes, they can. It may not seem fair, but that's the way it is. Your employer cannot fire you for your political views or religious beliefs, but that's about as far as your free speech guarantee protects you.


You might want to check the National Labor Relations Act, specifically section 7. Sorry I can't link from my mobile device.

Punishing someone for saying this stuff produces "a chilling effect" on the rights of workers to organize and form unions. At least that's the NLRB's position. Is it right? Well the courts haven't said anything yet. But NLRB is aggressively pursuing this issue.

/why yes I am writing my company's social media policy
 
2013-01-24 10:23:22 AM  

FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.


You aren't very bright, are you? It's not a conspiracy theory. We know it isn't because here's and FA about how someone got caught. The company I work for does it every day and knows exactly what employees are doing (looking for a job, posting disparaging comments about the company, revealing proprietary information, etc.). Hell, buddy, there are a number of softwares available just for this purpose and any network administrator worth can capture/read packets to/from a specific MAC or IP address on his network. What you don't know can hurt you. Best policy: don't bad-mouth your job on the internet. And if your HR department has its own recruiters, let your boss know you're looking for a new job. They are going to find out anyway.
 
2013-01-24 10:26:34 AM  

ongbok: FullMetalPanda: Wait, wait, wait!!! What if...this is a IF, I post on Face Book that I wish my employer would hire a bunch of super hot women to fark my brains out on a daily basis?

You would be fired because now you are liability in the office if any woman in the office ever chooses to file a sexual harassment or discrimination claim.

Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work. And don't use Facebook.


But what if I fark somebody from work? Are we allowed to talk about it at work?
 
2013-01-24 10:26:39 AM  
I think it's funny
be careful what you wish for

One of my bosses is on my fb
but I never use names, and he digs all the insane shiat I post
He's a bishop at his church and a secret perv so it works out great
climbing class=rope class
andy (she was dancing with andy)= st andrew's cross
hanging from the rafters=hook/suspension
apparently my weekends are far more interesting than his
 
2013-01-24 10:28:12 AM  

vodka: This reminds me of the dinosaur media companies. The fact is, employers are going to have to adjust to the employees, not the other way around. There are generations of people coming up that post every thought on the Internet. That isn't going to change so unless they want no employees they are going to have to adapt.


I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to adjust to keep a job. Unless you are independently wealthy, you're pretty much going to have to STFU.
 
2013-01-24 10:29:39 AM  

spunkymunky: KingsleyZisou: MythDragon: While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.

In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

/they CAN fire her for using social media at work while clocked in
//oh hai boss...

We have a no social media use while working policy. I know people check FB and such on their phones at breaks and it's ok. However, I had a night shift employee posting, during working hours, that she was bored, wished there was some more excitement, and that she was pissed that she didn't have more time off (our employees get 4 weeks paid vacation and two weeks of sick time a year). After about two weeks of this one of her coworkers told me about this; so I checked out her FB wall that she, for some stupid reason, left public. I made copies of two-three posts a night that she was working, copied her time sheets and the schedule for those pay periods and sent her on her merry way. Unemployment denied her claim because A) She violated our policies and B) She obviously didn't care enough to tell her supervisor that she was dissatisfied.

/And this is why I am glad fark isn't specifically prohibited in our social media policy.


Sorry if I wasn't clear. You likely don't need a policy governing social media use at work. But you likely already have a policy that says basically while at work you do your job and not goof around. That's what you can use to fire someone and it seems you did. Kudos to you for focusing on the actions and not the words.
 
2013-01-24 10:29:53 AM  

JackieRabbit: FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.

You aren't very bright, are you? It's not a conspiracy theory. We know it isn't because here's and FA about how someone got caught. The company I work for does it every day and knows exactly what employees are doing (looking for a job, posting disparaging comments about the company, revealing proprietary information, etc.). Hell, buddy, there are a number of softwares available just for this purpose and any network administrator worth can capture/read packets to/from a specific MAC or IP address on his network. What you don't know can hurt you. Best policy: don't bad-mouth your job on the internet. And if your HR department has its own recruiters, let your boss know you're looking for a new job. They are going to find out anyway.


One of my friends was telling about this place he once worked at were it was policy that once you were hired that you had to delete any profiles you had on any job boards. After you were hired you got 1 warning if they found out you didn't comply, after that it was immediate grounds for termination.
 
2013-01-24 10:35:10 AM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


Depending on the state, you do not need a valid reason to fire someone. You just cannot fire someone for an illegal reason.

But negative work attitude and complaining in public about your work conditions are most definitely actionable, no matter the state.
 
2013-01-24 10:35:55 AM  

karmaceutical: If you are not a teenager or a bored housewife what the hell are you doing on facebook??


Because it was a slow day on FARK?
 
2013-01-24 10:36:15 AM  

ongbok: JackieRabbit: FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.

You aren't very bright, are you? It's not a conspiracy theory. We know it isn't because here's and FA about how someone got caught. The company I work for does it every day and knows exactly what employees are doing (looking for a job, posting disparaging comments about the company, revealing proprietary information, etc.). Hell, buddy, there are a number of softwares available just for this purpose and any network administrator worth can capture/read packets to/from a specific MAC or IP address on his network. What you don't know can hurt you. Best policy: don't bad-mouth your job on the internet. And if your HR department has its own recruiters, let your boss know you're looking for a new job. They are going to find out anyway.

One of my friends was telling about this place he once worked at were it was policy that once you were hired that you had to delete any profiles you had on any job boards. After you were hired you got 1 warning if they found out you didn't comply, after that it was immediate grounds for termination.


Wow. That sounds unethical if not outright illegal.

/I might have passed on that job
 
2013-01-24 10:36:15 AM  
You can be fired for pretty much anything that isn't protected. And even those protections on the federal level only apply to companies with more than 15 employees (Your state may have protective status laws in addition to the federal ones). If I all of a sudden decide that I don't like converse shoes, I can go ahead and fire everyone who wears converse shoes legally (barring an employment agreement that prevents it, and being in a right to work state). Now that employee may be allowed to receive unemployment because their termination was without reasonable cause but I certainly wouldn't be held to any further compensation because of your chuck taylors. Now if i were to inform an employee before hand so that they knew of the terminable offense of wearing chuck taylors before hand, and they did so anyways, that would be considered termination with cause, because the employee knew they could be fired for wearing converse shoes.

Now for facebook, you could fire someone for anything they say, on work time or off work time, whether you're an hourly employee or a salaried employee. If they said they hate salt on their margarita glasses and you don't want someone who believes that to work for you, peace out, you're fired. If they like the Mets and youre a Yankees fan, and you refuse to work with Mets fans, peace out, you're fired. The only protection of speech in social media has to with your right to form a union and discuss working conditions / compensation with other employees to establish fair practices between employees. So if you say "I hate my job, the pay is shiat, and my boss is unfair" you can be fired for that unless it forms a discussion between employees in agreeance and what they should do about it to change it. The simple way for it to become protected, regardless if you were able to start a discussion between coworkers, would be to phrase it as "I'm beginning to hate my job because the pay is shiat, and my boss is very unfair, do any of my coworkers feel the same?". That could be shown as you attempting to start a discussion with coworkers (or former coworkers) about your working conditions in an attempt to improve them or make them more fair, which is a protected federal labor law.
 
2013-01-24 10:36:45 AM  

KingsleyZisou: JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

No, it is not, and yes, they can. It may not seem fair, but that's the way it is. Your employer cannot fire you for your political views or religious beliefs, but that's about as far as your free speech guarantee protects you.

You might want to check the National Labor Relations Act, specifically section 7. Sorry I can't link from my mobile device.

Punishing someone for saying this stuff produces "a chilling effect" on the rights of workers to organize and form unions. At least that's the NLRB's position. Is it right? Well the courts haven't said anything yet. But NLRB is aggressively pursuing this issue.

/why yes I am writing my company's social media policy


Section 7 of the NLRA act does not apply in this case. Summarized language from the NLB site:

"Key Provisions

The most important sections of the NLRA are Sections 7, 8, and 9.
Section 7, is the heart of the NLRA. It defines protected activity. Stripped to its essential, it reads:

Employees shall have the right to self-organization, to form, join, or assist labor organizations, to bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing, and to engage in other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid and protection.

Section 7 applies to a wide range of union an collective activities. In addition to organizing, it protects employees who take part in grievances, on-the-job protests, picketing, and strikes.
"

Your boss can't fire you for trying to organize a union or for participating in one, but he can fire you for having a bad attitude about your job and posting it to the internet.
 
2013-01-24 10:37:50 AM  

MycroftHolmes: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

Depending on the state, you do not need a valid reason to fire someone. You just cannot fire someone for an illegal reason.

But negative work attitude and complaining in public about your work conditions are most definitely actionable, no matter the state.


Scratch "complaining about your work" conditions and you're right.
 
2013-01-24 10:38:43 AM  

MythDragon: While I think it's stupid to biatch about your job on social media where anyone could see (such as your boss) I don't think it's right to get fired over it. People are entitled to their opinions. If I was a boss, and I hear a worker tell another they hate their job, I chalk it up to venting between to people. If they come tell me they hate their job (and it's not something that should be fixed by me, such as 'water cooler too far away' or 'can't play games at work') then I'd suggest they find a job they do like.


People are entitled to their opinions. They are not entitled to their jobs.

I happen to agree with you, though, about venting. I always told my guys that venting is natural, just take it offiste or someplace where they couldn't be overheard. If I had a guy actively undermining the credibility of my department by complaining to outsiders about his job, the company, or his boss, he would likely be written up and ultimately fired.
 
2013-01-24 10:39:49 AM  

FullMetalPanda: Wait, wait, wait!!! What if...this is a IF, I post on Face Book that I wish my employer would hire a bunch of super hot women to fark my brains out on a daily basis?


no you wouldn't be fired for writing an impossibility.
 
2013-01-24 10:41:00 AM  

JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

No, it is not, and yes, they can. It may not seem fair, but that's the way it is. Your employer cannot fire you for your political views or religious beliefs, but that's about as far as your free speech guarantee protects you.

You might want to check the National Labor Relations Act, specifically section 7. Sorry I can't link from my mobile device.

Punishing someone for saying this stuff produces "a chilling effect" on the rights of workers to organize and form unions. At least that's the NLRB's position. Is it right? Well the courts haven't said anything yet. But NLRB is aggressively pursuing this issue.

/why yes I am writing my company's social media policy

Section 7 of the NLRA act does not apply in this case. Summarized language from the NLB site:

"Key Provisions

The most important sections of the NLRA are Sections 7, 8, and 9.
Section 7, is the heart of the NLRA. It defines protected activity. Stripped to its essential, it reads:

Employees shall have the right to self-organization, to form, join, or assist labor organizations, to bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing, and to engage in other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid and protection.

Section 7 applies to a wide range of union an collective activities. In addition to organizing, it protects employees who take part in grievances, on-the-job protests, picketing, and strikes."

Your boss can't fire you for trying to organize a union or for participating in one, but he can fire you for having a bad attitude about your job and posting it to the internet.


The OGC's memorandum to American medical response of Connecticut and their memo on social media cases published in August of 2011 beg to differ.
 
2013-01-24 10:41:23 AM  
Maybe I read the article wrong, but didn't this lady get exactly what she asked for?

She said (in essence) that she wanted to be fired - and was subsequently fired. How is this not a "be careful what you ask for" situation?

/ Here comes my boss - back to the helpdesk app.
 
2013-01-24 10:41:25 AM  

pute kisses like a man: but, since it appeared there was a reason to fire her, specifically her comment, the issue becomes whether her comment was protected. certain things under the right circumstances are protected. most relevent, discussions of work problems that ultimately have the goal of bettering the working relationship, for example, attempts to organize the workforce to say, hey, this sucks, fix this.


KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.



Can either of you guys elaborate on the types of comments that are protected? I did not know about this and now my interest is piqued.
 
2013-01-24 10:44:26 AM  

padraig: Or any of your coworkers. In France, some people got fired because one of their coworker "friends" rated them to their boss. It was a comment that was solely destined for the friend list, and was not public whatsoever.


Because, as we all know, when you send things to your friends on the internet, there isn't the slightest chance it will ever spread further.
 
2013-01-24 10:47:09 AM  

durbnpoisn: I'm friends with my boss on Facebook. But I've known her for 10 years longer than I've been working here. And in any case, we never say shiat about work on FB.


Still the best policy. The hens around here are all on each other's FB, and it constantly causes problems when one biatches about another or how someone works.
 
2013-01-24 10:47:11 AM  

McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook


This.
 
2013-01-24 10:48:43 AM  
This is an NLRB memorandum we used to help draft our social media policy last year. It's a year old, but i'm pretty sure this is still the stance of the NLRB on social media policies. It includes a few case examples.

It's 35 pages long, so if you're interested, have at it.

NLRB Memorandom OM 12-31
 
2013-01-24 10:49:11 AM  

mooseyfate: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.


Was facebook blocked by the IT dept? Was there a policy stating not to go on these sites during work hours? Was that clearly stated to employees? Were there any previous verbal or written warnings?

You're skipping the legal parts.

I'm not convinced this would fly here in Toronto and have never heard of it happening.
 
2013-01-24 10:49:13 AM  

JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.


I don't perceive HR or IT people to be any level of common sense smart; so I'm sure people get away with saying certain things without alerting those guys.
 
2013-01-24 10:50:06 AM  

KingsleyZisou: ongbok: JackieRabbit: FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.

You aren't very bright, are you? It's not a conspiracy theory. We know it isn't because here's and FA about how someone got caught. The company I work for does it every day and knows exactly what employees are doing (looking for a job, posting disparaging comments about the company, revealing proprietary information, etc.). Hell, buddy, there are a number of softwares available just for this purpose and any network administrator worth can capture/read packets to/from a specific MAC or IP address on his network. What you don't know can hurt you. Best policy: don't bad-mouth your job on the internet. And if your HR department has its own recruiters, let your boss know you're looking for a new job. They are going to find out anyway.

One of my friends was telling about this place he once worked at were it was policy that once you were hired that you had to delete any profiles you had on any job boards. After you were hired you got 1 warning if they found out you didn't comply, after that it was immediate grounds for termination.

Wow. That sounds unethical if not outright illegal.

/I might have passed on that job


The thing is is that it was in the terms of employment agreement that they signed when they were hired. Nobody ever reads through that, so most people didn't know it was there until they received their first and only warning a few weeks into their employment.
 
2013-01-24 10:53:46 AM  

JackieRabbit: FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.

You aren't very bright, are you? It's not a conspiracy theory. We know it isn't because here's and FA about how someone got caught. The company I work for does it every day and knows exactly what employees are doing (looking for a job, posting disparaging comments about the company, revealing proprietary information, etc.). Hell, buddy, there are a number of softwares available just for this purpose and any network administrator worth can capture/read packets to/from a specific MAC or IP address on his network. What you don't know can hurt you. Best policy: don't bad-mouth your job on the internet. And if your HR department has its own recruiters, let your boss know you're looking for a new job. They are going to find out anyway.


The article didn't say how the former employee was caught, just that she was caught. Please keep insinuating that every company in the world has deep enough pockets or the inclination to afford the software, infrastructure, and bandwidth to implement the monitoring system you speak of. Yes the software exists, but not everyone's using it.
 
2013-01-24 10:55:04 AM  

MycroftHolmes: pute kisses like a man: but, since it appeared there was a reason to fire her, specifically her comment, the issue becomes whether her comment was protected. certain things under the right circumstances are protected. most relevent, discussions of work problems that ultimately have the goal of bettering the working relationship, for example, attempts to organize the workforce to say, hey, this sucks, fix this.

KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.


Can either of you guys elaborate on the types of comments that are protected? I did not know about this and now my interest is piqued.


Pute posted the NLRA section up thread. To try and put it in common parlance: any speech that can be construed to pertain to the organization of workers is protected. You organize to bargain collectively. So things like working conditions, pay, and hours are all fair game. This includes vague references such as "my job sucks" and even "my boss is an asshole."

Another way that might be easier to think about it is what speech isn't protected. Defaming someone or the company isn't. You for instance can't talk about your boss's sexual orientation (unless it deals with work like "she only promotes other straight women").

This all stems from a period in history when organized labor was becoming more powerful. It's really too bad that it became synonymous with corruption and in many ways lost the longer war with big business.
 
2013-01-24 10:55:12 AM  

Red_Fox: mooseyfate: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.

Was facebook blocked by the IT dept? Was there a policy stating not to go on these sites during work hours? Was that clearly stated to employees? Were there any previous verbal or written warnings?

You're skipping the legal parts.

I'm not convinced this would fly here in Toronto and have never heard of it happening.


I'm pretty sure that there aren't any policies saying not to piss in the bathroom floor, but if you do it I'm sure you will get fired. Going to these sites would probably be covered under using work time for personal business or using work time improperly, which would be used against you if your company wanted to get rid of you.
 
2013-01-24 10:56:36 AM  

Rwa2play: I don't perceive HR or IT people to be any level of common sense smart


Posted that at work, did ya?

IT doesn't have time to follow your damn facebook posts because we're too busy trying to retrieve your files you stupidly deleted for no apparent reason. If we want to know what you're doing we'll put an app on your pc to spy on everything you do so we don't have to waste our time doing it.
 
2013-01-24 10:56:42 AM  

KingsleyZisou: The OGC's memorandum to American medical response of Connecticut and their memo on social media cases published in August of 2011 beg to differ.


This memo is considered high highly controversial and viewed my many legal scholars in the field as over-reaching and a misinterpretation of the NLRA by the NLRB. Had AMR challenged in court, they would probably have won, since AMR is a non-union company and so, the NLRB would not have applied unless the activity in question - to wit, posting disparaging comments about the company to social media without prior permission - was in connection with union organization or other collective bargaining.

But without regard to the NLRA, most states now are at will, which means that an employer can terminate you anytime they want. Such termination is supposed to be for case, because of a lack of work, or for the elimination of a given position. In practice, however, it is very difficult to bring a wrongful termination action against employers in these states.

So if you hate your job find another and move on or change your attitude, if that isn't possible. If you are terminated and receive a severance package, your severance agreement will have a non-disparagement clause. You can count on that, unless your employer is a moron.
 
2013-01-24 11:00:22 AM  
@ongbok oh I figured it was in the contract. Doesn't make it right.

/ever since I started working in compliance I started reading eulas
//curse your constant updates iTunes!
///a talented attorney might try to make that a UDAP violation
 
2013-01-24 11:01:01 AM  
These stories are always amusing.
 
2013-01-24 11:03:15 AM  

KidneyStone: The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."

Make that "don't have coworkers as 'friends.'". If there's one thing I learned after almost a decade of internal investigations it's that many coworkers with rat you out for no apparent reason or gain.


THIS x 1000

& they're usually gossipy as hell, so the less info they have, the better.

/computer forensics for 15 years
 
2013-01-24 11:03:34 AM  

ongbok: I'm pretty sure that there aren't any policies saying not to piss in the bathroom floor, but if you do it I'm sure you will get fired. Going to these sites would probably be covered under using work time for personal business or using work time improperly, which would be used against you if your company wanted to get rid of you.


Even so....if you're past your probationary period that is not enough to legally fire someone on the first warning where I live. They'd have to give you at least one warning and most likely 2 warnings before they can legally fire you.

But then again maybe you're from the USA where you allow yourselves to be randomly drug tested for regular office jobs....that would totally be a violation of our personal rights and freedoms up here. So yeah I guess in a country that would treat it's employees that way probably would fire you over something so trivial as this.
 
2013-01-24 11:03:48 AM  

KingsleyZisou: MycroftHolmes: pute kisses like a man: but, since it appeared there was a reason to fire her, specifically her comment, the issue becomes whether her comment was protected. certain things under the right circumstances are protected. most relevent, discussions of work problems that ultimately have the goal of bettering the working relationship, for example, attempts to organize the workforce to say, hey, this sucks, fix this.

KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.


Can either of you guys elaborate on the types of comments that are protected? I did not know about this and now my interest is piqued.

Pute posted the NLRA section up thread. To try and put it in common parlance: any speech that can be construed to pertain to the organization of workers is protected. You organize to bargain collectively. So things like working conditions, pay, and hours are all fair game. This includes vague references such as "my job sucks" and even "my boss is an asshole."

Another way that might be easier to think about it is what speech isn't protected. Defaming someone or the company isn't. You for instance can't talk about your boss's sexual orientation (unless it deals with work like "she only promotes other straight women").

This all stems from a period in history when organized labor was becoming more powerful. It's really too bad that it became synonymous with corruption and in many ways lost the longer war with big business.


No it doesn't. The discussions can not be vague, they have to actually show intent to discuss things like working conditions, benefits, and compensation or you run the risk of being fired over it. It can become protected simply by coworkers responding and agreeing with the facebook status, because even though the initial intent was not to begin a discussion, it can evolve into that discussion.
 
2013-01-24 11:06:49 AM  

JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: The OGC's memorandum to American medical response of Connecticut and their memo on social media cases published in August of 2011 beg to differ.

This memo is considered high highly controversial and viewed my many legal scholars in the field as over-reaching and a misinterpretation of the NLRA by the NLRB. Had AMR challenged in court, they would probably have won, since AMR is a non-union company and so, the NLRB would not have applied unless the activity in question - to wit, posting disparaging comments about the company to social media without prior permission - was in connection with union organization or other collective bargaining.

But without regard to the NLRA, most states now are at will, which means that an employer can terminate you anytime they want. Such termination is supposed to be for case, because of a lack of work, or for the elimination of a given position. In practice, however, it is very difficult to bring a wrongful termination action against employers in these states.

So if you hate your job find another and move on or change your attitude, if that isn't possible. If you are terminated and receive a severance package, your severance agreement will have a non-disparagement clause. You can count on that, unless your employer is a moron.


I agree with this statement. I do not like those memos either but until challenged it's a large portion of the small amount of governance employers have on this issue.

I'm surprised you are that familiar with the subject. Your initial comment sounded so off handed to me that I thought bringing this up would be a service. It seems I was mistaken in my first impression.

/the memo on Sears offers hope!
 
2013-01-24 11:07:31 AM  

JakeStone: KidneyStone: If there's one thing I learned after almost a decade of internal investigations it's that many coworkers with rat you out for no apparent reason or gain.

Too damn true.

CSB: Back when I was 18, I had lunch with a coworker saying I wasn't happy with the crap I was having to put up with and I was thinking of moving to Dallas. The only ones who knew that were my fiancee at the time and this coworker. I get fired some short time later and in the process I'm told that since I was planning on moving to Dallas, I obviously didn't have any company loyalty. Yeah, I was planning on moving to Dallas in a year or so after I'd saved up enough from my crappy minimum wage ($3.35/hr) job to afford living in a real city.

Oh well, it made me piss or get off the pot, so I joined the Navy and got some real job experience. Pay still sucked.

/Never figured out why she ratted me out.
//I was a semi IT/gopher type for an itty bitty company.
///She was a temp who answered phones and made xeroxes.
////She picked up an STD and her husband dumped her and actually got to keep the kids.
//Karma, biatch!


Because you can't trust coworkers with personal information. At all. Even if one doesn't have ill intent, they might tell your personal business/opinion to someone who does. At least you learned that by losing a shiatty job, and not one you actually like.

Basically, don't unburden yourself to coworkers. Just don't. Find a friend or a therapist. Or write it all down in your (offline) diary. Don't put it on Facebook, for fark's sake.
 
2013-01-24 11:09:13 AM  

jfivealive: KingsleyZisou: MycroftHolmes: pute kisses like a man: but, since it appeared there was a reason to fire her, specifically her comment, the issue becomes whether her comment was protected. certain things under the right circumstances are protected. most relevent, discussions of work problems that ultimately have the goal of bettering the working relationship, for example, attempts to organize the workforce to say, hey, this sucks, fix this.

KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.


Can either of you guys elaborate on the types of comments that are protected? I did not know about this and now my interest is piqued.

Pute posted the NLRA section up thread. To try and put it in common parlance: any speech that can be construed to pertain to the organization of workers is protected. You organize to bargain collectively. So things like working conditions, pay, and hours are all fair game. This includes vague references such as "my job sucks" and even "my boss is an asshole."

Another way that might be easier to think about it is what speech isn't protected. Defaming someone or the company isn't. You for instance can't talk about your boss's sexual orientation (unless it deals with work like "she only promotes other straight women").

This all stems from a period in history when organized labor was becoming more powerful. It's really too bad that it became synonymous with corruption and in many ways lost the longer war with big business.

No it doesn't. The discussions can not be vague, they have to actually show intent to discuss things like working conditions, benefits, and compensation or you run the risk of being fired over it. It can become protected simply by coworkers responding and agreeing with the facebook status, because even though the initial intent was not to begin a discussion, it can evolve into that discussion.


You're right that's a key point.

/ianal
 
2013-01-24 11:10:53 AM  

Red_Fox: Rwa2play: I don't perceive HR or IT people to be any level of common sense smart

Posted that at work, did ya?

IT doesn't have time to follow your damn facebook posts because we're too busy trying to retrieve your files you stupidly deleted for no apparent reason. If we want to know what you're doing we'll put an app on your pc to spy on everything you do so we don't have to waste our time doing it.


Uh huh...that's if I didn't know this ahead of time. And since I do, I wouldn't a) post to facebook (esp. since I don't have a facebook account) b) post about my line of work or c) go somewhere to talk about anything unless I have downtime on my own.

Also, one would assume that a work pc of any kind is bugged in one form or another because the IT guys are pretty anal-retentive about such things.

So yeah, if the place I'm working at doesn't allow me to use the pc for something other than work I'd stay the hell away from my usual sites.
 
2013-01-24 11:18:41 AM  
I love social media. It makes it so easy to spot the idiots.
 
2013-01-24 11:18:43 AM  

HotIgneous Intruder: Smoky Dragon Dish: One simple rule: Don't post anything on facebook you wouldn't want your mother or your boss to see.
Are we supposed to feel bad for these people?

[iusedtohavehair.files.wordpress.com image 430x555]

That's the whole pathological aspect of facebook: We treat different people with different degrees of formality and familiarity and informality. Your boss isn't your mom, who isn't your wife, who isn't your rabbi, who isn't your child or whoever. The premise that everyone should know all of your thoughts and personal commentary on any given subject is catastrophically absurd.
As this woman learned. Nobody needs to know all my business and certainly everyone I know isn't qualified to know everything everybody else knows about what I'm doing, have done, or am thinking.

Facebook is sociopathic in the sense that it is emotionally and politically tone deaf for personal expressions beyond the strictly public. Use a pseudonym that all your friends know or just don't bother with it. Facebook sucks, Ray.


Heartland likes this.

This is the exact argument I give people explaining why I don't use Facebook. And I think it is precisely why facebook will fail, buy not before many, many more people get burned.
 
2013-01-24 11:20:52 AM  

onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.


What law requires employers to monitor employees' online comments?
 
2013-01-24 11:21:57 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: How hard is it to change your privacy settings and not add coworkers? I do it so I'm free to b*tch about work


It wouldn't be hard at all if they'd stop changing the options every few months and resetting all your permissions to maximum sharing.
 
2013-01-24 11:24:49 AM  

ChrisDe: Maybe people should work at work and do personal stuff on their own time? Before Facebook and cell phones, people didn't pull out the newspaper and read it at their desk, did they? It seems like all they do now is.........oops gotta go, somebody's coming down the hall.


Sure. But there also was a time where your job didn't follow you home.

I work in a place where if the boss knows you will pick up then he will call you, and will do so at all hours. The advice I got the first week was if he calls you off hours then don't answer. The downside is that he won't give you a shiny new smartphone and laptop, but the upshot is that he'll figure it out and you won't get pestered at all hours and on weekends and on vacation.
 
2013-01-24 11:25:45 AM  

the_foo: Tat'dGreaser: How hard is it to change your privacy settings and not add coworkers? I do it so I'm free to b*tch about work

It wouldn't be hard at all if they'd stop changing the options every few months and resetting all your permissions to maximum sharing.


This; that's the primary reason I stay the hell away from Facebook.
 
2013-01-24 11:28:01 AM  

FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.


Can't IT provide reports to HR on internet activity based on key words? I wouldn't believe that there is not one employer who regularly receives information on people visiting shady sites. I also wouldn't believe there isn't one employer out there who wouldn't remotely install a keylogger onto a questionable employee's system for investigative purposes. It doesn't mean every single one does, but it's not something I'd be surprised to hear was true.
 
2013-01-24 11:28:14 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.

What law requires employers to monitor employees' online comments?


I'd imagine that the SEC could make a case for that in the effort to prevent ponzi schemes. Obviously national defense type jobs would need to do so (hello general petraeus). Even local law enforcement would be wise to do so.

/is it really an invasion of privacy if you posted it on the world wide web?
 
2013-01-24 11:29:24 AM  

onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.


As an IT buy in the healthcare industry I think that your post, at least as the US is related, if full of shiat.

Frankly, I don't give a damn what you do while on the clock as long as it doesn't end with me having to do more work. I don't care if you spend your day trolling Fark.com, that's between you and your supervisor.
 
2013-01-24 11:32:38 AM  

KingsleyZisou: jfivealive: KingsleyZisou: MycroftHolmes: pute kisses like a man: but, since it appeared there was a reason to fire her, specifically her comment, the issue becomes whether her comment was protected. certain things under the right circumstances are protected. most relevent, discussions of work problems that ultimately have the goal of bettering the working relationship, for example, attempts to organize the workforce to say, hey, this sucks, fix this.

KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.


Can either of you guys elaborate on the types of comments that are protected? I did not know about this and now my interest is piqued.

Pute posted the NLRA section up thread. To try and put it in common parlance: any speech that can be construed to pertain to the organization of workers is protected. You organize to bargain collectively. So things like working conditions, pay, and hours are all fair game. This includes vague references such as "my job sucks" and even "my boss is an asshole."

Another way that might be easier to think about it is what speech isn't protected. Defaming someone or the company isn't. You for instance can't talk about your boss's sexual orientation (unless it deals with work like "she only promotes other straight women").

This all stems from a period in history when organized labor was becoming more powerful. It's really too bad that it became synonymous with corruption and in many ways lost the longer war with big business.

No it doesn't. The discussions can not be vague, they have to actually show intent to discuss things like working conditions, benefits, and compensation or you run the risk of being fired over it. It can become protected simply by coworkers responding and agreeing with the facebook status, because even though the initial intent was not to begin a discussion, it can evolve into that discussion.

You're right that's a key point.

/ianal


well, vague is not really the right word to use in this analysis. think: is this concerted activity to open the discussion to protect and assist employees? sometimes a vague statement might be that concerted activity. while, in another context, that very same vague statement might fail to meet this standard. The words, while relevant, are not the main focus of the analysis. the focus is on whether this is concerted activity with purpose to X. In concert means it should probably hit some other employees. purpose is a subjective analysis, so it's always going to be a little screwy and incident specific. basically, it's pretty hard to predict, which makes it a squirrelly area of law.

/ iana(employment)lawyer, but I did take an employment law class many years ago, i'm very rusty on the stuff, and but for my citation earlier, basing my opinion on an unreliable memory.  although, in law, it's a pretty safe explanation to just say, "it's complicated" or "it depends".
 
2013-01-24 11:34:17 AM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: At least you learned that by losing a shiatty job, and not one you actually like.


Yep, and fortunately, I was young enough that I could figure out something else to do. It's been 20+ years, so it doesn't really much, but it definitely was an eye opener, and it led to me keeping my various interests online in relation to my job and to each other as opaque to each other as possible. You do not need to know what XYZ sites I'm also on, or what names I use there, and when I talk to coworkers, I can easily say, "Well, if there's a Jake Stone on Facebook, it's not me."
 
2013-01-24 11:34:25 AM  
I'm gonna develop a simple app that adds "haha j/k ;)" to the end of every facebook post...
 
2013-01-24 11:36:50 AM  

mooseyfate: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.


Do I not get federally mandated breaks?

Cause I believe I do.

/You sound like it's your fault that US labor is treated more and more like a slave-force than a labor-force.
 
rpm
2013-01-24 11:37:20 AM  

onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.


As someone who removes company certs from the CA list, no, you can't.

/wrote several apps using SSL
//They checked their certs and failed if incorrect
///Broke the SSL interception device of the company that acquired us
//hoo boy, that sucker was insecure
 
2013-01-24 11:38:27 AM  

KingsleyZisou: BarkingUnicorn: onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.

What law requires employers to monitor employees' online comments?

I'd imagine that the SEC could make a case for that in the effort to prevent ponzi schemes. Obviously national defense type jobs would need to do so (hello general petraeus). Even local law enforcement would be wise to do so.

/is it really an invasion of privacy if you posted it on the world wide web?


I worked for JP Morgan in IT for a while. And yes, because of SEC regulations, certain employees, traders, investment bankers and the like, had to have all of their instant messaging, email and any online correspondence archived. This was to prevent things like insider trading and other financial crimes.
 
2013-01-24 11:40:40 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: How hard is it to change your privacy settings and not add coworkers? I do it so I'm free to b*tch about work


I know right. It's not like "privacy" settings have ever been compromised.
 
2013-01-24 11:41:36 AM  

JackieRabbit: I'd call the person in and tell him it is time to start looking for another job. He'd get notice that his time in my employ is coming to an end and be allowed to search for a new job. Someone who hates his job so much that he vents to others at work cannot possibly be effective in it. Worse, he can destroy morale. It's time for him to go someplace where he will be happy.


Then you are a power-tool who has never actually done a day of *work* in his life.

Sorry. If you think that way, YOU are the one who is destroying morale.

I can't really intimate how reprehensible this viewpoint is. It can't be over-exaggerated.
 
2013-01-24 11:42:46 AM  

Skarekrough: The Angry Hand of God: Write whatever you want on Facebook, just don't be so god damned stupid to have your boss as your "friend."

THIS!!!!

Yesterday an email came across asking for us to "Like" the company we work for. Although they've been on Facebook for a year or two now their Like's have been under double-digits and believe that having so few actually hurts the company's online presence.

This opened up an interesting discussion as to what the potential risks existed for refusing to. There's about a 70% chance that the "Social Media Director" will be counting heads and about 50% chance that he will push further or be able to dole out a threat if we don't comply.


Pay a third worlder to spam likes from fake accounts. The boss will no longer care, and everybody else can get back to keeping their private lives "private".
 
2013-01-24 11:43:06 AM  

dragonchild: ongbok: Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work.

Do you work at a law firm or something? Yeah the limits at work are different from the limits at, say, a bar. But if you can't even talk about last night's game, you're in a sad, dysfunctional place.


Hmm, around here the limits aren't much different from being at a bar. Today a couple of us were discussing whether you should also watch Angel while rewatching all the Buffy series this afternoon and the managing director is in ear shot. If you work in an environment where you are scared to relax and get to know your co-workers even the slightest amount, that seems pretty toxic and demotivating, and way more damaging than any potential work time that might be lost if people occasionally get too distracted by non-work stuff for a while.
 
US1
2013-01-24 11:45:26 AM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


she did it at work
 
2013-01-24 11:45:43 AM  

xria: dragonchild: ongbok: Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work.

Do you work at a law firm or something? Yeah the limits at work are different from the limits at, say, a bar. But if you can't even talk about last night's game, you're in a sad, dysfunctional place.

Hmm, around here the limits aren't much different from being at a bar. Today a couple of us were discussing whether you should also watch Angel while rewatching all the Buffy series this afternoon and the managing director is in ear shot. If you work in an environment where you are scared to relax and get to know your co-workers even the slightest amount, that seems pretty toxic and demotivating, and way more damaging than any potential work time that might be lost if people occasionally get too distracted by non-work stuff for a while.


All it takes is for one person to decide that they are pissed off at you for whatever reason, and go to your boss and say that you harassed them with something you said or they over heard you talking about something that made them feel uncomfortable.
 
2013-01-24 11:47:19 AM  
sure sure, private sector rights and all that to fire whomever they please. But Im just glad the company did its due diligence to be sure there wasn't an actual problem among employees that could cause turnover, lower productivity, and hurt customer relations. I mean, it can cost 60% of an annual salary to do all the paperwork and get someone up to speed when you bring on a new hire and that's especially true of administrative positions where the predecessor may be the person who thought up the whole organization scheme or oversaw the software. So I'm sure the company looked into the matter after they went to the trouble and expense of firing, hiring, onboarding, and training over someone having a bad day.

/lemme guess that they didn't
//back to work, Citizen
 
2013-01-24 11:47:39 AM  

jennies1897: FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.

Can't IT provide reports to HR on internet activity based on key words? I wouldn't believe that there is not one employer who regularly receives information on people visiting shady sites. I also wouldn't believe there isn't one employer out there who wouldn't remotely install a keylogger onto a questionable employee's system for investigative purposes. It doesn't mean every single one does, but it's not something I'd be surprised to hear was true.


They can, but JRs assertion that every company has the time or resources to do it is just silly. That's why he/she got the purple asshat award.
 
2013-01-24 11:51:44 AM  

durbnpoisn: You have to keep something in mind... In this economy, employers KNOW that you should feel privelidged to have your job to start with. So, if you are the slightest bit on the fence about your job, they'll be more than happy to replace you for someone cheaper, and more productive. And probably better looking.

I'm friends with my boss on Facebook. But I've known her for 10 years longer than I've been working here. And in any case, we never say shiat about work on FB.


depends on what you do. I have unique experience and an in-demand skill, plus I've been here for years and thus have 'paid my dues'. I get away with a lot more than other folks who think they're hot shiat until they reach a senior position and are replaced because they're too expensive (and their skills are a dime a dozen)

/also, you spelled 'privileged' wrong
 
2013-01-24 11:53:14 AM  

ongbok: KingsleyZisou: ongbok: JackieRabbit: FTDA: JackieRabbit: McPoonDanlcrat: Reason #4859384 for not being on Facebook

I think the number is a lot higher than that. Folks, if you think your HR (or IT) department isn't scanning social media and other sites for what you are doing, both on and off duty, think again. Using a pseudonym will not save you.

[i1197.photobucket.com image 399x582]

Presented to you for the most interesting conspiracy theory of the day.

You aren't very bright, are you? It's not a conspiracy theory. We know it isn't because here's and FA about how someone got caught. The company I work for does it every day and knows exactly what employees are doing (looking for a job, posting disparaging comments about the company, revealing proprietary information, etc.). Hell, buddy, there are a number of softwares available just for this purpose and any network administrator worth can capture/read packets to/from a specific MAC or IP address on his network. What you don't know can hurt you. Best policy: don't bad-mouth your job on the internet. And if your HR department has its own recruiters, let your boss know you're looking for a new job. They are going to find out anyway.

One of my friends was telling about this place he once worked at were it was policy that once you were hired that you had to delete any profiles you had on any job boards. After you were hired you got 1 warning if they found out you didn't comply, after that it was immediate grounds for termination.

Wow. That sounds unethical if not outright illegal.

/I might have passed on that job

The thing is is that it was in the terms of employment agreement that they signed when they were hired. Nobody ever reads through that, so most people didn't know it was there until they received their first and only warning a few weeks into their employment.


So if you own your own company, and you make yourself available through your own company, the employment agreement is basically asking you to dissolve it for the duration of your employment with them? Is that legal?
 
2013-01-24 11:57:10 AM  

JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: JackieRabbit: KingsleyZisou: In fact this sort of speech is specifically protected. They can't fire her for what she said.

No, it is not, and yes, they can. It may not seem fair, but that's the way it is. Your employer cannot fire you for your political views or religious beliefs, but that's about as far as your free speech guarantee protects you.

You might want to check the National Labor Relations Act, specifically section 7. Sorry I can't link from my mobile device.

Punishing someone for saying this stuff produces "a chilling effect" on the rights of workers to organize and form unions. At least that's the NLRB's position. Is it right? Well the courts haven't said anything yet. But NLRB is aggressively pursuing this issue.

/why yes I am writing my company's social media policy

Section 7 of the NLRA act does not apply in this case. Summarized language from the NLB site:

"Key Provisions

The most important sections of the NLRA are Sections 7, 8, and 9.
Section 7, is the heart of the NLRA. It defines protected activity. Stripped to its essential, it reads:

Employees shall have the right to self-organization, to form, join, or assist labor organizations, to bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing, and to engage in other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid and protection.

Section 7 applies to a wide range of union an collective activities. In addition to organizing, it protects employees who take part in grievances, on-the-job protests, picketing, and strikes."

Your boss can't fire you for trying to organize a union or for participating in one, but he can fire you for having a bad attitude about your job and posting it to the internet.


What if you are not in a union. Can you still be fired for trying to file a grievance?

/I know someone who was.
//She tried to complain to HR, and HR ended up lying about her complaint to her boss
///Two weeks later, she was terminated for "poor performance," despite the fact that she was the best chemist on her shift
 
2013-01-24 12:01:07 PM  

Red_Fox: IT doesn't have time to follow your damn facebook posts because we're too busy trying to retrieve your files you stupidly deleted for no apparent reason


Jokes on you, I deleted those files on purpose so you wouldn't have time to follow my facebook posts.

Sucka.
 
2013-01-24 12:02:38 PM  
Just FYI, filtering your posts through friend groupings doesn't always work on Facebook.
 
2013-01-24 12:03:01 PM  

Holocaust Agnostic: Wait, we AREN'T supposed to post stuff from work?


Shhhhh, you idiot.  My boss is right behind me.
 
2013-01-24 12:06:14 PM  
So, maybe you're having a bad day. Maybe your boss is an asshole. Maybe you have a shiatty job. Maybe all of the above. I'm sure that all of us have been there a time or two.

What are you going to do? There are several things you can do, but I can tell you what you DON'T do. You DON'T post disparaging comments about your job, boss, or employer in a public forum WITH YOUR FARKING NAME ON IT! How does anyone not know this?

I would have fired her on the principle that I don't want anyone that STUPID working for me, because she's bound to screw up something that'll cost the company real money.
 
2013-01-24 12:06:53 PM  

vodka: This reminds me of the dinosaur media companies. The fact is, employers are going to have to adjust to the employees, not the other way around. There are generations of people coming up that post every thought on the Internet. That isn't going to change so unless they want no employees they are going to have to adapt.


It's not going to work that way. People who want employment better get used to holding their tongues (and their thumbs) for eight hour stretches.
 
2013-01-24 12:09:38 PM  

dragonchild: ongbok: Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work.

Do you work at a law firm or something? Yeah the limits at work are different from the limits at, say, a bar. But if you can't even talk about last night's game, you're in a sad, dysfunctional place.


My bosses are really into sports, so talking about last night's game is not only work-related, it's highly encouraged.
 
2013-01-24 12:09:45 PM  

ongbok: xria: dragonchild: ongbok: Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work.

Do you work at a law firm or something? Yeah the limits at work are different from the limits at, say, a bar. But if you can't even talk about last night's game, you're in a sad, dysfunctional place.

Hmm, around here the limits aren't much different from being at a bar. Today a couple of us were discussing whether you should also watch Angel while rewatching all the Buffy series this afternoon and the managing director is in ear shot. If you work in an environment where you are scared to relax and get to know your co-workers even the slightest amount, that seems pretty toxic and demotivating, and way more damaging than any potential work time that might be lost if people occasionally get too distracted by non-work stuff for a while.

All it takes is for one person to decide that they are pissed off at you for whatever reason, and go to your boss and say that you harassed them with something you said or they over heard you talking about something that made them feel uncomfortable.


Yep, you're farking gone.
 
2013-01-24 12:13:59 PM  
<Ben174> : If they only realized 90% of the overtime they pay me is only cause i like staying here playing with Kazaa when the bandwidth picks up after hours.
<ChrisLMB> : If any of my employees did that they'd be fired instantly.
<Ben174> : Where u work?
<ChrisLMB> : I'm the CTO at LowerMyBills.com
*** Ben174 (B­enWrigh­t[nospam-﹫-backwards]1­4­-33or­P­are­T*LowerM­yBi­l­ls*com) Quit (Leaving)

/Oldie, but goodie
 
GBB
2013-01-24 12:18:49 PM  
Facebook wishes come true??

farm8.staticflickr.com
 
2013-01-24 12:34:14 PM  
This happens a lot at my company. People friend the company page to get some free stuff with the company logo on it. Not a smart move.

But I also work with some idiots that think that being able to post stuff on FB, check email, do personal stuff in full view of our clients is a god given right. I dont care that people do it just make sure your work is done.
 
2013-01-24 01:02:48 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


I'll bet this has been covered extensively, but in many states, they don't even need a reason. At-will employment means just what it says.
 
2013-01-24 01:07:57 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


Right to work
 
2013-01-24 01:09:28 PM  

Holocaust Agnostic: Wait, we AREN'T supposed to post stuff from work?


No. And one humdred Farkers who are posting from work right now have a million smart ass comments to make because they think their Fark posts can never be linked to them.
 
2013-01-24 01:11:40 PM  
I love my job but there are a lot of days where I might say "I wish I could get fired some days, it would be easier to be at home than to have to go through this". Not super serial, but I'd say it.

/posted from work
 
2013-01-24 01:12:28 PM  
CSB:

My boss of five years is retiring, so we get moved to new boss. I'm friends with new boss on Facebook. After move, I sit down with him and say, "You're my boss now. I have to unfriend you." He's fine with it, but points out that he has a strict What-Happens-On-Facebook-Stays-On-Facebook policy.

Fark: I'm still friends with his partner.

Double Fark: We'll probably end up hanging out more socially now that he's my boss, lol.

/CSB
 
2013-01-24 01:19:07 PM  
I had a particularly hard day at work one day (getting yelled at by customers for their own mistakes will do that to you), so I just made a little benign "Customers are asshats" comments on my FB page later that night. The next day, I get this scathing FB message from the social media person at my previous job who I was FB friends with. Yes, my PREVIOUS job. I unfriended her and anyone else connected to any job I ever had, and to this day maintain a policy of 'no co-workers' in my friends list.

/not to mention my mom griped me out for saying "asshats"
//didn't unfriend her
 
2013-01-24 01:30:24 PM  

Gabrin_Kinoda: I had a particularly hard day at work one day (getting yelled at by customers for their own mistakes will do that to you), so I just made a little benign "Customers are asshats" comments on my FB page later that night. The next day, I get this scathing FB message from the social media person at my previous job who I was FB friends with. Yes, my PREVIOUS job. I unfriended her and anyone else connected to any job I ever had, and to this day maintain a policy of 'no co-workers' in my friends list.

/not to mention my mom griped me out for saying "asshats"
//didn't unfriend her


Really? She got her panties in a bunch for you being honest about people like me?

/not an asshat
//but I've seen people who are asshats
///so that statement is (mostly) true
 
2013-01-24 01:31:06 PM  

ongbok: KingsleyZisou: BarkingUnicorn: onyxruby: As an IT guy, anything you post online can be read -even if you use SSL.

If you work in health, financial or anything regulated you should assume all such posts and emails are monitored by professionals.

Don't write or say anything at work you wouldn't otherwise say without your boss standing there.

For many industries monitoring like this is required by law. They do it because they have to.

What law requires employers to monitor employees' online comments?

I'd imagine that the SEC could make a case for that in the effort to prevent ponzi schemes. Obviously national defense type jobs would need to do so (hello general petraeus). Even local law enforcement would be wise to do so.

/is it really an invasion of privacy if you posted it on the world wide web?

I worked for JP Morgan in IT for a while. And yes, because of SEC regulations, certain employees, traders, investment bankers and the like, had to have all of their instant messaging, email and any online correspondence archived. This was to prevent things like insider trading and other financial crimes.


Yep. It was pretty much all management and any thread for anyone that had anything to do with the law, legal advice, or lawsuits. Everything else was intentionally purged after 30(?) days.
 
2013-01-24 01:35:47 PM  

freewill: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

I'll bet this has been covered extensively, but in many states, they don't even need a reason. At-will employment means just what it says.


YOU have to prove discrimination and that it effects your job.
Just look at the Paula Jones case.
 
2013-01-24 01:39:52 PM  

rpm: As someone who removes company certs from the CA list, no, you can't.


As someone who works with security I happen to know you can. One such example is this one by Metronome. Your SSL certificate is worthless if exposed to a MITM attack which is what happens when someone, like your employer, owns the network.
 
2013-01-24 01:41:33 PM  

EViLTeW: As an IT buy in the healthcare industry I think that your post, at least as the US is related, if full of shiat.


As an IT guy with a lot of experience in IT in healthcare I can promise you that /every/ major health insurance company does this.
 
2013-01-24 01:41:37 PM  

ongbok: FullMetalPanda: Wait, wait, wait!!! What if...this is a IF, I post on Face Book that I wish my employer would hire a bunch of super hot women to fark my brains out on a daily basis?

You would be fired because now you are liability in the office if any woman in the office ever chooses to file a sexual harassment or discrimination claim.

Don't talk to anybody at work about anything except for work. And don't use Facebook.


I would be a happier person if I'd heard and heeded those words of wisdom years ago.
 
2013-01-24 01:42:46 PM  
Jesus, listening to you guys I feel ever so much more lucky about where i work and what I do. I interact closely with coworkers. A few are friends. When we have certain phases of projects going on we leave our offices, take a big conference room and fill it with terminals and all work in there for a year or so together. It allows us to combine our knowledge base and get shiat done more quickly.
Anyways, the atmosphere in that room "the war-room" is pretty informal. When I first started in there a few years ago I was the youngest by far (20 years or so) and was the constant recipient of unending teasing, but it was all in good fun. and a good time was had by all.

Anyways, all this talk of only talking about work while at work... it sounds horrible.
 
2013-01-24 01:42:48 PM  

onyxruby: rpm: As someone who removes company certs from the CA list, no, you can't.

As someone who works with security I happen to know you can. One such example is this one by Metronome. Your SSL certificate is worthless if exposed to a MITM attack which is what happens when someone, like your employer, owns the network.


Did she use her personal cellphone or company resources?

/you can guess what I didnt do
 
2013-01-24 01:45:26 PM  

GBB: Facebook wishes come true??

[farm8.staticflickr.com image 599x273]


Beautiful big breasted naked women don't just fall from the sky!
 
2013-01-24 01:49:42 PM  

Uchiha_Cycliste: Jesus, listening to you guys I feel ever so much more lucky about where i work and what I do. I interact closely with coworkers. A few are friends. When we have certain phases of projects going on we leave our offices, take a big conference room and fill it with terminals and all work in there for a year or so together. It allows us to combine our knowledge base and get shiat done more quickly.
Anyways, the atmosphere in that room "the war-room" is pretty informal. When I first started in there a few years ago I was the youngest by far (20 years or so) and was the constant recipient of unending teasing, but it was all in good fun. and a good time was had by all.

Anyways, all this talk of only talking about work while at work... it sounds horrible.


I agree with you completely.

It's not, "only talk about work at work", it's, DON'T TALK ABOUT WORK ON FACEBOOK.
 
2013-01-24 02:29:44 PM  

henryhill: Adults still use FB? Thats cute.


No way, all the adults are here on Fark, where everyone is a proper and mature individual...just kiddin...ur dog wunts steak...lollol...it's a streetlight lmao!

High five for feeling better about yourself depending on what URL is in your browser. Who says there are no more heroes?
 
2013-01-24 03:02:02 PM  

BeesNuts: mooseyfate: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

If it was made during work hours, Adios motherfarker.

Do I not get federally mandated breaks?

Cause I believe I do.

/You sound like it's your fault that US labor is treated more and more like a slave-force than a labor-force.


I don't sound like any of that, actually. I sound like I said "if you're talking shiat about your employer at work (against most company policies) on your Facebook (visiting social networking sites at work is also against most company policies) while on the clock, adios motherfarker.". Some places of business are more lenient or forgiving than others, but the general rule is that you don't go online and talk shiat about your employment on the clock, and especially where your boss can easily see it. See, I actually feel the opposite of those shiatty words you tried to put in my post. I think a person's work should be something that enriches their lives or is at least something they take pride in. If you hate your job, especially if the only reason you hate your job is because you're expected to actually DO IT, then find a new job. It's not draconian, it's common sense. Why would you purposefully work at a job you farking hate, then spend all day biatching about it. Not to put words in YOUR post, but you seem like the type to engage in this kind of behavior. You seem like the exact kind of person that would scoff at the idea of doing what you're paid to do without biatching about it audibly and often. You seem like the type that believes you deserve your paycheck simply for being there. You also seem like the type to biatch and moan that no one ever gives you the "credit you deserve" or the "compensation you deserve" when you're just scraping by with the bare minimum and gnashing your teeth the entire time to boot. I'm kidding, it's very likely you're not like this at all, but every work place has at least on person that matches my fake description of you, and one of those people is the subject of this article. You'll have a hard time convincing me that I should feel bad for this person.

/I hated my last job, so I found one I did love
//no Facebook biatching necessary, I just went out and found one
///crazy, huh?
 
2013-01-24 03:05:33 PM  
I have skills that are in demand at my work, and I can get away with a lot of things others could not, but I know that they are watching for a later point in time so when there are more of us, they can replace myself and anyone else who they catch goofing off. So I don't goof off. Honestly, if you have the time, I will happily find something for you to do. I work with three women who spend much of their day checking their phones. When we get to the point having more employees, they will lose their jobs. I have no problem with that, as the loss of the dead weight will make everyone else's job much easier as we will not be covering for them.
In the end, do your job and you won't have any issues. Screw around and you will get what you deserve.

/service industry
//customers have gotten to the point of coming in only when I am at work
///it is a nice thing to be known, but the work load is killer
 
2013-01-24 03:10:47 PM  

StoPPeRmobile: Did she use her personal cellphone or company resources?


Your point is dead on. Use your personal cell phone with your cell phone companies 3g or 4g network. It still won't save your from your provider if they go bad, but it will protect you workwise.
 
2013-01-24 03:26:03 PM  

Tio_Holtzmann: After clocking a 93 hour hour workweek (professional, no overtime) in order to make a deadline,

I was told in both, Political Science major and Business Finance major, that the the "Function" of government is to keep the RICH in POWER, the POOR from STARVING and the MIDDLE SCARED shiatLESS of being POOR that they SHOW UP TO WORK.

/Put in my two weeks a week ago, work at a private corporate banking institution and so far, all of the above is true.

 
2013-01-24 04:30:07 PM  
I dont know any company who could legally just fire you like that in Quebec. This place might be a shiathole but I can't get fired for saying "Boy I wish I got fired" on Facebook.
 
2013-01-24 04:36:02 PM  
Perhaps I'm in the minority here, but I work for a buddy of mine, and it's a three-man shop.

The boss don't care if I surf the net or post about the job on Facebook.

"Just don't post any identifiable stuff", like names, pics of customers, things like that.

"And don't open any questionable sites when a customer can see the screen"

15 years and no problems.

All three of us are FB friends, and we biatch about all kinds of things, even each other, and there's no hard feelings.

Your mileage may vary...
 
2013-01-24 05:40:38 PM  

Smoky Dragon Dish: One simple rule: Don't post anything on facebook you wouldn't want your mother or your boss to see.


Then, in all honesty, what's the farking point?

Facebook used to be interesting, now it's like Chris Rock's dating metaphor : you're not meeting them, you're meeting their representative.
 
2013-01-24 05:42:21 PM  

Tat'dGreaser: How hard is it to change your privacy settings and not add coworkers? I do it so I'm free to b*tch about work


the "share" button would like a word.
 
2013-01-24 09:26:33 PM  

moothemagiccow: HotIgneous Intruder: Because, "Just give us a reason to fire you!" employment is the new American reality.

Ha. Not where I work.


You go on thinking that.
 
2013-01-25 12:47:43 AM  

Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.


One of my coworkers may or may not be employed any longer because of comments (s)he made on her/his own time, suggesting that (s)he sympathized with work place shootings, and might carry one out themselves if not for that whole prison thing.

Protip: don't post stupid shiat on your FB page when you have co-workers as friends and your page is public. HR can see that shiat.
 
2013-01-25 01:16:08 AM  

Trance354: I have skills that are in demand at my work, and I can get away with a lot of things others could not, but I know that they are watching for a later point in time so when there are more of us, they can replace myself and anyone else who they catch goofing off. So I don't goof off. Honestly, if you have the time, I will happily find something for you to do. I work with three women who spend much of their day checking their phones. When we get to the point having more employees, they will lose their jobs. I have no problem with that, as the loss of the dead weight will make everyone else's job much easier as we will not be covering for them.
In the end, do your job and you won't have any issues. Screw around and you will get what you deserve.

/service industry
//customers have gotten to the point of coming in only when I am at work
///it is a nice thing to be known, but the work load is killer


I hate to burst your bubble but you're easily replaceable by someone who's willing to work cheaper and do a better job. You're really not so valuable that your employer won't fire you tomorrow you only think you are.
 
2013-01-25 07:03:51 AM  

Your Average Witty Fark User: Popcorn Johnny: Have any cases like this made their way through the court system.  I'm not convinced  that employers have the right to fire somebody for comments made by somebody on their own time.

One of my coworkers may or may not be employed any longer because of comments (s)he made on her/his own time, suggesting that (s)he sympathized with work place shootings, and might carry one out themselves if not for that whole prison thing.

Protip: don't post stupid shiat on your FB page when you have co-workers as friends and your page is public. HR can see that shiat.


i had to cancel my FB acct. and seriously . because every thing i posted was utterly stupid/creative
 
2013-01-25 12:06:26 PM  

borg: Trance354: I have skills that are in demand at my work, and I can get away with a lot of things others could not, but I know that they are watching for a later point in time so when there are more of us, they can replace myself and anyone else who they catch goofing off. So I don't goof off. Honestly, if you have the time, I will happily find something for you to do. I work with three women who spend much of their day checking their phones. When we get to the point having more employees, they will lose their jobs. I have no problem with that, as the loss of the dead weight will make everyone else's job much easier as we will not be covering for them.
In the end, do your job and you won't have any issues. Screw around and you will get what you deserve.

/service industry
//customers have gotten to the point of coming in only when I am at work
///it is a nice thing to be known, but the work load is killer

I hate to burst your bubble but you're easily replaceable by someone who's willing to work cheaper and do a better job. You're really not so valuable that your employer won't fire you tomorrow you only think you are.


So he says "I work hard enough and am good enough at my job that I COULD get away with things others could not, but I don't do those things because in the long run I'm just as replaceable as anyone else" and you counter with that weak shiat? Really?
 
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