gh0strid3r: Interesting that you know this when there have been no studies on the subject.
gh0strid3r: zerth: Gas chromotography of exhaled vapor is unable to detect the presence of nicotine, although mass spectrometry can(in the parts per billion range).You'd get more nicotine if you licked the roof of a smoker's mouth(approx 2% of nicotine vapor gets absorbed by saliva).[...]Yet the effects are still unknown.Studies done: 0I don't care what people do to their own bodies. That's their business and I don't think anyone, including the government, should have any say about it. But when you start affecting others against their will, that's where I have a problem.
Gyrfalcon: Tobacco isn't regulated because it's tobacco, it's regulated because nicotine is on the pharmacological schedule. Being, you know, a drug.
gh0strid3r: I support this. There may be no tobacco and no smoke, but there is nicotine. While we don't know the amount, that nicotine is present in the vapor that's produced. Nobody knows what kind of affect that may have on bystanders. Former smokers have a real concern here, because nicotine is the chemical they struggled to break their addiction to. What kind of affect will this new exposure have on someone still struggling with the habit? Now, before we hear the arguments about nicotine being found in every day products such as tomatoes, remember that we don't know the nicotine levels of second-hand vapors from e-cigs and this is being inhaled, not ingested. The natural biological filters of the digestive system are being bypassed.
JohnnyC: I decided today that I'm going to get the patch and try to quit smoking. I'm just tired of being addicted to them. Walgreens sells a "Walgreen" brand version for pretty cheap. Here's to quitting the habit.Oh... E-Cigs are shiat... everyone I know who's ever tried using them did so for about two weeks before giving up on them. They're a novelty at best.
harrydorcas: The American FDA should listen to Dr. Patrick Basham, founding director of the Democracy Institute and an adjunct scholar with Cato's
harrydorcas: The American FDA should listen to Dr. Patrick Basham, founding director of the Democracy Institute and an adjunct scholar with Cato's Center for Representative Government. He says that there are inconvenient facts about public health regulation the government are ignoring.
gweilo8888: Except you're breathing back out some of that nicotine, and I'm sitting next to you inhaling it, and wondering why I suddenly want a cigarette. (Or actually, feel nauseous, because it's been long enough now since I smoked that there's no longer any craving when others smoke around me, just mild nausea.)
gweilo8888: Except that there is a suggestion (yes, not entirely proven yet, but certainly pointed towards by the data) that nicotine itself can cause cancer.There is exactly zero evidence to support this. Not just "not entirely proven yet," not even remotely proven. No credible source has been able to find a single link between pharmaceutical-grade nicotine extract and cancer.gweilo8888: But yeah, other than that. And the fact that you're mixing it with god-only-knows-what that hasn't been tested or regulated. And you're making those around you breathe it too.I know exactly what I'm mixing it with. I buy mix it myself. USP propylene glycol, USP vegetable glycerine, USP nicotine in a PG base, and food-grade flavourings in a PG base. All food-grade or better, all within the GRAS statute. God doesn't need to know what. I already do. And regarding breathing it, once again, read the air quality studies I linked to. Or, if you're in the tl;dr camp: You're tilting at windmills.
gweilo8888: I also don't believe they in any way help with quitting. They merely replace one dependency with another
MBZ321: I really got to try e-cigs seriously. I bought a cheap-o one years ago, when they were still pretty much a novelty, and it was okay, but didn't really taste like a cigarette.I ordered another one (there was a penny special kit from "Victory" e-cigs). Turned out to be a POS and doesn't produce a lot of vapor. I lost it about a week after I had it anyway. Damn company keeps trying to auto-bill me for refills even though there was not supposed to be a reoccuring chagre. Luckily I used a VCC.Now leaning towards the BullSmoke brand when I do order another e-cig. Anyone try this one?The problem is, Googling e-cig reviews brings up a bunch of fake-review sites, or the e-cigs that are supposedly rated as good, look NOTHING like a real cigarette (seriously, black with a green LED on the end?)
The Goat Men Are Rampaging In The Fields: I would prefer that they be regulated as drugs/medical devices, personally. I have used one for four years now. I was able to quit a 15-year long pack-a-day habit literally instantly, and dread the tobacco companies finding ways to make them so expensive and heavily taxed that they become less financially viable than cigarettes. At this point, I can spend $100 a year to support my desire for nicotine delivered in a manner that satisfies my oral fixation with no smoke, no second-hand smoke, no discoloration of my teeth, no nastiness to my breath or personal odor, and no side effects yet seen or known. I'm sure that the tobacco lobby is livid at the prospect of even 10% of smokers doing the same. I'd rather get the solid tests and trials to make certain that it's safe and keep them available and practical.
gh0strid3r: nteresting that you know this when there have been no studies on the subject.
ceebeecates4: For anyone looking to quit, try Chantix.It's expensive (esp if you have shiatty insurance) and it's dangerous (esp if you have mental issues).It's also extremely effective.
Boojum2k: Puffing on Juicy Fruit flavored vapor right now, so Im getting a. . . ah hell, you know.Been off cigarettes for three months now. Still have to go outside at work to puff, but it means I still get to take "smoke breaks" so I'm cool with it./work harder than any of the non-smokers ever did
D_Evans45: Real Women Drink Akvavit: When I have to go visit family overseas, I use those NicoDerm CQ patches. Unless they also work as shark reprellants and tiny flotation devices, they're fairly worthless. I say we just fill up bubble gum machines with Ativan or Zanax for those who want to quit smoking or vaping. Benzodiazepines are much more effective for controlling sudden bursts of nicotine-deprived rage anyway.Making a leap from tobacco to benzos would be unwise. Although stuff like Xanax is considered less addictive than hard opiate pharms, it's still addictive and far more powerful than tobacco. A cigarette will provide juust enough relief to stop me from shaking my leg in anxiety for 30-45 minutes or so and exceeding the recommended dosage is unpleasant. A Xanax will make me feel all warm and fuzzy for several hours, and exceeding the recommended dosage will make me feel heavenly.Also, benzos have a strong propensity for causing physical dependence. If you think your nic fits are bad, watch someone trying to kick a Xanax habit cold turkey. It isnt even medically recommended to do so; long time Xanax users can have seizures if they try to quit without tapering their doses over several weeks/months. Stuff is pretty powerful. Ive accidentally blacked out just by taking a 2nd standard dose before an anxiety-inducing situation, full on booze style blackout where I woke up wondering where the hell I was and how I got home.The first couple weeks of kicking tobacco are tough, but once you quit youll wonder how the hell you smoked so long. Taper off at least a week or two in advance to make it more bearable. You get your breath back, you dont smell like shiat, your breath and teeth dont suffer, you get healthy. I havent bought a pack in close to 3 years, and breaking that addiction made me stronger as a person./If I can quit anyone can quit//Meth was easier to quit than tobacco for me back in the day...
Real Women Drink Akvavit: When I have to go visit family overseas, I use those NicoDerm CQ patches. Unless they also work as shark reprellants and tiny flotation devices, they're fairly worthless. I say we just fill up bubble gum machines with Ativan or Zanax for those who want to quit smoking or vaping. Benzodiazepines are much more effective for controlling sudden bursts of nicotine-deprived rage anyway.
ng2810: lewismarktwo: JohnnyC:Oh... E-Cigs are shiat... everyone I know who's ever tried using them did so for about two weeks before giving up on them. They're a novelty at best.Bullshiat.My boyfriend sells e-cigs and he works from 12 pm to 9 pm every day. Both stores constantly sell out of merchandise and they recently had to hire several new full-time workers to keep up with demand.E-cigs are NOT one size fits all. There are so many different brands with many different functions (not to mention the types of e-juice out there!) It took me a while of experimenting before I found an e-cig I liked and juice flavor that I enjoyed (blueberry muffin ftw!). The juice even comes in non-nicotine mixtures. Luckily at the bar where my bf works you can test out various e-cigs and mix flavors to suit your tastes before you invest in one./Non-smoker.//Casual Vaper
Atomic Spunk: I bet nicotine suppositories would work pretty well. Wouldn't do much to help your oral fixation though. Unless, of course, you like to...ummm...well...never mind.
AverageAmericanGuy: This isn't news to anyone paying attention the last couple decades. The government wants to take away your freedoms.It's all for your health and wellbeing, citizen./formerly nicotine-stained fingers
StreetlightInTheGhetto: JohnnyC: That's cool. Glad to hear he kicked the habit. I hope he manages to stay smoke free. It's a tough thing to do.He's bummed one, while we had quite a few folks over for drinks-and-bonfire night. He could only make it through half, so that's something.
odisae: Good luck. Here's my "Quit Smoking" story
Oznog: Nicotine itself is implicated in heart disease, but there's no tar in e-cigs, and shouldn't be any polonium-210 either.
The Goat Men Are Rampaging In The Fields: I would prefer that they be regulated as drugs/medical devices, personally.
RedPhoenix122: Good, considering we still don't know the long term effects.
The Goat Men Are Rampaging In The Fields: I have used one for four years now.
JohnnyC: There are also a bunch of plants that produce nicotine as well. Some examples are tomatoes,
untaken_name: So things with caffeine are all coffee products? Interesting.
gh0strid3r: Nobody knows what kind of affect that may have on bystanders
Bonzo_1116: So what is the source material for the nicotine in the e-cig mixes?If it's synthesized Ok, maybe it's not a tobacco product...but if it's a tobacco extract process to get the nicotine, then it's still a tobacco product.
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