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(NBC News)   In the end, the GOP Rape Brigade was successful in moving the needle on abortion - support for Roe v. Wade is at an all time high of 70%   (firstread.nbcnews.com) divider line 261
    More: Obvious, GOP Rape Brigade, President Obama, GOP, Bill McInturff, Dan Balz, Matthew Continetti, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, National Cathedral  
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2247 clicks; posted to Politics » on 22 Jan 2013 at 10:56 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-22 09:58:51 AM
But Pat Robertson said that victory in the culture wars was in sight!  Surely, he cannot be the second coming of Baghdad Bob, right?
 
2013-01-22 10:03:27 AM
 
2013-01-22 10:25:36 AM
Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.
 
2013-01-22 10:25:46 AM

Dusk-You-n-Me: 40th anniversary.


Wow. And so many women are *still* fighting for the right to control their own reproductive health. Amazing.
 
2013-01-22 10:26:39 AM
early indications are that the GOP is already going to hit the f*cking roof over Obama's speech.  #tcot exploded yesterday with fits of rage and insanity as Obama gave his speech.  not to mention that most GOP pundits and media figures seemed to either be very low profile and/or took inauguration day off...
 
2013-01-22 10:28:37 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


OH NO! DON'T YOU LIBS GET IT? YOUR LIB LOGIC IS WHAT IS RUINING AMERICA!

ABSTINENCE ONLY WORKS GODDAMMIT!
 
2013-01-22 10:29:13 AM
The current incarnation of the GOP is the greatest threat ever to face the current incarnation of the GOP.

/Or, way to shoot yourself in the foot, Repugs.
//Keep up the good work.
 
2013-01-22 10:30:08 AM
If this keeps up, the Republicans will run out of issue
 
2013-01-22 10:32:43 AM
People are now pro 156th trimester abortion for Paul Ryan.

Quite the success there.
 
2013-01-22 10:35:24 AM

Summer Glau's Love Slave: The current incarnation of the GOP is the greatest threat ever to face the current incarnation of the GOP.


lol. absolutely true. if it weren't for the derp brigade, the GOP would've controlled the senate in '10 and '12.
 
2013-01-22 10:39:41 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


That's a position that a whole heck of a lot of people have.  the problem is, it's hard to hear them over the F5 derpnado that continues to roll through the landscape.
 
2013-01-22 10:39:41 AM

nekom: Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?


Because in the real world, pro-life is a phrase which means you want abortion to be illegal and pro-choice means you want abortion to be legal.

You can't be both unless you want to change what words mean.
 
2013-01-22 10:43:46 AM
 
2013-01-22 10:45:41 AM

DamnYankees: nekom: Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?

Because in the real world, pro-life is a phrase which means you want abortion to be illegal and pro-choice means you want abortion to be legal.

You can't be both unless you want to change what words mean.


What then is the proper political term to describe someone who believes that we should make abortion virtually unnecessary by promoting access to contraceptives?
 
2013-01-22 10:46:41 AM

nekom: What then is the proper political term to describe someone who believes that we should make abortion virtually unnecessary by promoting access to contraceptives?


Sane? Regardless of what word you choose to describe that, it has no relevant as to whether you are pro-choice or pro-life.
 
2013-01-22 10:47:45 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


I believe that's where we'd like to be eventually.  I'm not keen on abortion either, especially as one's primary choice in birth control. Free birth control and sex education are excellent options in preventing unwanted pregnancies. For those who planned their pregnancies, the option should remain available as sometimes pregnancies go wrong sadly.

My favorite line from a GYN doctor I recall back when abortion first became legal nationwide: "Two 14-year-old kids fooling around in a barn loft doesn't result in an 'Act of God.'"
 
2013-01-22 10:50:16 AM
It's crazy how the anti-choice people are generally also anti-contraceptive. There are a few who have a shred of sanity, but the overlap is uncanny.

It's almost as if it's not about the babies, but rather it's about controlling the women.
 
2013-01-22 10:51:28 AM

unlikely: It's crazy how the anti-choice people are generally also anti-contraceptive.


How is it crazy? It's perfectly logical.
 
2013-01-22 10:53:31 AM
AirForceVet:
For those who planned their pregnancies, the option should remain available as sometimes pregnancies go wrong sadly.

Well, this is why I can't really say I oppose abortion in all circumstances. If you have something like a tube pregnancy that 99% of the time would result in the loss of the child AND the mother, it's a quite unfortunate choice, but an option I could never say we should rob any woman of. But this kind of abortion is probably VERY rare, which is why I use the qualifier virtually when I say that we could make abortion virtually unnecessary by simply making contraceptives available, free of charge, to absolutely anyone who wants them. Isn't that a goal that everyone should be able to get behind?
 
2013-01-22 10:54:46 AM

nekom: AirForceVet:
For those who planned their pregnancies, the option should remain available as sometimes pregnancies go wrong sadly.

Well, this is why I can't really say I oppose abortion in all circumstances. If you have something like a tube pregnancy that 99% of the time would result in the loss of the child AND the mother, it's a quite unfortunate choice, but an option I could never say we should rob any woman of. But this kind of abortion is probably VERY rare, which is why I use the qualifier virtually when I say that we could make abortion virtually unnecessary by simply making contraceptives available, free of charge, to absolutely anyone who wants them. Isn't that a goal that everyone should be able to get behind?


except that contraception is considered a sin by the Catholic Church.
 
2013-01-22 10:55:34 AM

Rev.K: ABSTINENCE ONLY WORKS GODDAMMIT!


What about teh Buttsex?

Well, I guess their could be a trickle down effect.

/eeeewwww
 
2013-01-22 10:56:11 AM

Ennuipoet: their


there...damnit.
 
2013-01-22 10:57:48 AM

nekom: What then is the proper political term to describe someone who believes that we should make abortion virtually unnecessary by promoting access to contraceptives?


notreligious
 
2013-01-22 10:58:49 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


Done in 2.

//because Baby Jesus, that's why.
 
2013-01-22 10:59:24 AM

Weaver95: nekom: AirForceVet:
For those who planned their pregnancies, the option should remain available as sometimes pregnancies go wrong sadly.

Well, this is why I can't really say I oppose abortion in all circumstances. If you have something like a tube pregnancy that 99% of the time would result in the loss of the child AND the mother, it's a quite unfortunate choice, but an option I could never say we should rob any woman of. But this kind of abortion is probably VERY rare, which is why I use the qualifier virtually when I say that we could make abortion virtually unnecessary by simply making contraceptives available, free of charge, to absolutely anyone who wants them. Isn't that a goal that everyone should be able to get behind?

except that contraception is considered a sin by the Catholic Church.


Along with anything else pertaining to the naughty bits

/but they can confess and it's all good again
//the priests love the stories, too
 
2013-01-22 10:59:53 AM

Weaver95: nekom: AirForceVet:
For those who planned their pregnancies, the option should remain available as sometimes pregnancies go wrong sadly.

Well, this is why I can't really say I oppose abortion in all circumstances. If you have something like a tube pregnancy that 99% of the time would result in the loss of the child AND the mother, it's a quite unfortunate choice, but an option I could never say we should rob any woman of. But this kind of abortion is probably VERY rare, which is why I use the qualifier virtually when I say that we could make abortion virtually unnecessary by simply making contraceptives available, free of charge, to absolutely anyone who wants them. Isn't that a goal that everyone should be able to get behind?

except that contraception is considered a sin by the Catholic Church.


This. I have a coworker who has been going ape-shiat for a while now over "Obamacare FORCING Catholic organizations to pay for contraceptive violate mah religous rtes!!1"
 
2013-01-22 11:00:23 AM

nekom: DamnYankees: nekom: Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?

Because in the real world, pro-life is a phrase which means you want abortion to be illegal and pro-choice means you want abortion to be legal.

You can't be both unless you want to change what words mean.

What then is the proper political term to describe someone who believes that we should make abortion virtually unnecessary by promoting access to contraceptives?


sane.

We could start a campaign to replace the term "pro-life" with "pro-birth," as a shocking number of these people seem to stop giving a shiat once the umbilical cord is cut.
 
2013-01-22 11:00:48 AM
There is no escaping that god wanted those kids aborted.
 
2013-01-22 11:02:01 AM
For no reason at all, I like to call the sides "anti-choice" and "anti-life".
 
2013-01-22 11:03:32 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


Because most pro-life people don't actually value life. They just want to punish women for having sex.
 
2013-01-22 11:04:14 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: If this keeps up, the Republicans will run out of issue


If democrats found a way to gain the prolifers support by offering an alternative that benefits almost all sides, the republican party would be done. My parents are republican and hate democrats just because of the abortion issue.
 
2013-01-22 11:04:24 AM
If you personally would not have an abortion but don't believe others should tell people what to do with their bodies, that makes you PRO-CHOICE. What's the confusion here folks. Only time you can be called "Pro-life" is if you would make abortion illegal, otherwise you've given someone a choice and therefore are pro-choice. Wonder how many people go around saying they are pro-life when in reality they just don't understand what the terms mean in the debate.
 
2013-01-22 11:04:53 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


The mantra of the pro-choice movement is "Safe, Legal, and Rare"
 
2013-01-22 11:05:21 AM
kid_icarus:
This. I have a coworker who has been going ape-shiat for a while now over "Obamacare FORCING Catholic organizations to pay for contraceptive violate mah religous rtes!!1"

I hear that sort of statement quite a lot.  when I point out that nobody is saying THEY have to use contraception, merely that the courts are saying that you have to cover it as a valid medical expense...they refuse to listen and generally stomp off in a huff.
 
2013-01-22 11:05:30 AM
Linking rape and abortion is so disingenuous. Much like linking cancer and TSA scanners. Yes, somehow these two things are mildly linked by some stretch of the imagination.

But the real reason to support abortion and reject TSA scanners is the same: the right of individuals to privacy and command of their own bodies.
 
2013-01-22 11:05:37 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


Actually that's the Pro-Choice position. Wanting to keep something safe and legal doesn't mean you have to like it.
 
2013-01-22 11:05:41 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


Because, then we don't get to punish women for being filthy, sex-having whores, of course.
 
2013-01-22 11:06:03 AM

AirForceVet: I'm not keen on abortion either, especially as one's primary choice in birth control.


Except that this rarely happens. I know/have known many women who call themselves whores. Funny thing is they use abortion as a last resort, not their "primary choice in birth control." They use condoms and/or the pill. Both of which are not 100% effective.

If you can find a citation of people that do use it as their "primary choice in birth control" I'd like to read it.
 
2013-01-22 11:06:26 AM

nekom: Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?


Because that requires thinking and there isn't a simple solution.

Take the economy as an example. It was very important during the election and everyone promised some sort of quick fix. But, if you look at unemployment and salary by education level, the more education you have is better. Right now, we are bragging that the Texas has the highest graduation rate ever at about 80%.

So maybe if we fix education, we can fix the economy. We've tried a bunch of stuff in the past 50 years, and we are graduating more students, but their level of knowledge is about the same.

So what we tried did not work. Well, middle class and upper class students actually did better. Low-income students fell. If we look at the low-income students in the US compared to other nations, you will see that we actually do better.

So, if we really want to do something about the economy, we have to tackle education and poverty. But teachers are evil, so we can't help them. People who are poor are just lazy, so we can't help them. That's were we come up with brilliant ideas like a trillion dollar coin.
 
2013-01-22 11:07:32 AM
All they wanted to do was use law to force women to endanger their lives by carrying the children of psychopaths to full term because one of them might be the superpowered 2nd coming of the saviour of mankind.

Sheesh.
 
2013-01-22 11:08:28 AM
I'm more pro-autonomy. When does a parasite have rights? When it can live outside my uterus.
 
2013-01-22 11:08:37 AM
Snapper Carr:
The mantra of the pro-choice movement is "Safe, Legal, and Rare"

I suppose then, I should count myself among the pro-choice, but with added emphasis on the rare part. I honestly do believe that we can make abortion unnecessary except in extreme medical circumstances and we can do it at what would be in the long run a financial net gain for the nation. Just seems sensible to me.
 
2013-01-22 11:09:15 AM

AverageAmericanGuy: Linking rape and abortion is so disingenuous.


It is the major exception to all restrictions on abortion, and by far the most popularly-supported one, so as an anti-abortion idiot it is actually kind of the one you'd have to undermine first to bring people around to your view.
 
2013-01-22 11:11:00 AM
talkingpointsmemo.com

"[In ten years, I predict that t]he rise of conservative values will drown out the promotion of values and issues from the far left. Increasing percentages of those who call themselves "Pro-Life" in the polls will make clear that the abortion debate has been won by the Pro-Life side and Roe may or may not be repealed, but it won't matter. Even where abortion remains legal it will be impossible to find a place to get one. The Pro Life movement will have run the abortion industry out of business more effectively than the anti-nuclear movement shut down nuclear power. And vast majorities of the public will approve of this."
 
2013-01-22 11:11:05 AM
The GOP is little more than a coalition of TeaTards, Bible Pounders, and Corporate Raiders. Individually these causes would get crushed into oblivion on a national level which is why they back each other's causes even when it directly opposes their own personal beliefs. The problem is that their coalition is faltering as the demographics are changing and they are beginning to truly despise one another.
 
2013-01-22 11:11:08 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


Why is every debate on guns presented as "Lefty Libberton wants to melt down every firearm to build a food bank; Righty McAmendmentSecond buys guns just because the Second Amendment gives him the right to."?

I saw this very "debate" presented on my local news last night, and the fact that local news hasn't moved from this 100,000-foot view of the same debate we've been having for 30-odd years - on this topic or any other - means the needle only moves when something unexpected, like a Congressman's careless (or mean-spirited) words or another gun tragedy forces action from the outside.

Democrats had "safe, legal and rare" as their approach to abortion for the better part of 20 years, and yet the GOP cast us all as unrepentant babykillers, who can't pass opposite genitalia or an abortion clinic without satisfying our most carnal desires. The Left literally wanted to do what you asked, and the god-squadders in Congress put (are still putting, right Mr Ryan?) the kibosh on any and all plans.

Not to mention state-level meddling.
 
2013-01-22 11:11:25 AM

Weaver95: nekom: AirForceVet:
For those who planned their pregnancies, the option should remain available as sometimes pregnancies go wrong sadly.

Well, this is why I can't really say I oppose abortion in all circumstances. If you have something like a tube pregnancy that 99% of the time would result in the loss of the child AND the mother, it's a quite unfortunate choice, but an option I could never say we should rob any woman of. But this kind of abortion is probably VERY rare, which is why I use the qualifier virtually when I say that we could make abortion virtually unnecessary by simply making contraceptives available, free of charge, to absolutely anyone who wants them. Isn't that a goal that everyone should be able to get behind?

except that contraception is considered a sin by the Catholic Church.


Altar boys can't get pregnant, so you can see why the Catholic Church feels that contraception is unnecessary.
 
2013-01-22 11:11:50 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand: Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?



It's not about life and death, it's about the proliferation of the species. If you don't want more humans to rule the world as the superior creature then you must be some sort of insect worshipper.
 
2013-01-22 11:11:58 AM

nekom: Here's what I don't understand:  Why can't you be pro-life AND pro-choice?  Look I hate abortion, I think it's a very unfortunate thing, but I have no right to tell a woman what to do with her body.  Instead, why can't we attack the root causes?  You know, STOP unwanted pregnancies by offering free contraceptives?  It's a GREAT investment, cheaper than abortions, FAR cheaper than another child in the world.  Yet the very people who oppose abortion also oppose this common sense step to make it unnecessary.  It really boggles the mind.


Somewhere around here (it may even be posted by the time I finish writing this) there's a list of policies and a comparison between what a truly "pro-life" person would believe vs what someone who is simply anti-sex would believe. Things like HPV vaccination are universally opposed by the pro life crowd even though it has nothing to do with the process of abortion. Likewise, increased access to contraception would unquestionably reduce the need for abortion, particularly among lower income women, but pro-lifers are universally against it.
 
2013-01-22 11:12:03 AM

Jim_Callahan: AverageAmericanGuy: Linking rape and abortion is so disingenuous.

It is the major exception to all restrictions on abortion, and by far the most popularly-supported one, so as an anti-abortion idiot it is actually kind of the one you'd have to undermine first to bring people around to your view.


The rape exception also accidentally reveals the motivation behind a lot of anti-choice sentiment: Pregnancy is a punishment for slutty girls. Nice virgins who get legitimately raped shouldn't be punished. Unless they were asking for it.
 
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