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(AZ Family)   Just like the rest of us, Phil Mickelson is feeling the squeeze of recent tax hikes and is rethinking plans to buy a major league baseball team   (azfamily.com) divider line 20
    More: Sad, Phil Mickelson, Rancho Santa Fe, HSBC Champions, Farmers Insurance Open  
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Archived thread
2013-01-22 08:16:10 AM
3 votes:
Yeah, you dumbass liberals can start complaining about Mickelson or anyone else after you actually start paying income taxes like the rest of us. He pays more tax in one year than you freeloading tax-cheats will in your entire lives. When you make almost no actual contribution to our society via taxes, you sure as hell shouldn't get any say in how those taxes are spent.
2013-01-22 08:34:58 AM
2 votes:

WhoopAssWayne: Yeah, you dumbass liberals can start complaining about Mickelson or anyone else after you actually start paying income taxes like the rest of us. He pays more tax in one year than you freeloading tax-cheats will in your entire lives. When you make almost no actual contribution to our society via taxes, you sure as hell shouldn't get any say in how those taxes are spent.


Hurr durr 2/10
2013-01-22 08:28:53 AM
2 votes:
what a great culture we have where a golfer can cry about being taxed so much he can't buy a major league sports team.
2013-01-22 11:54:02 AM
1 votes:

craig328: Mutated-Snoopy: kronicfeld: dsmith42: ...snipped...

While I don't match my initial calculation (off by 200k), it's still about 46%.

If you deduct the state taxes from from the Federal it drops down to $25,970,265, or about 42.6%.

Like I said, I'm not an accountant and I'm not a tax expert. I'm just trying to remember what the line items are from my paycheck and seeing how they hit him. I don't know how his business structure works and what that does for/against him. I'm just trying to see how he's getting to 2/3rds of his income going to gubmint.

He's likely also including the increased capital gains tax and California property taxes in that. For example, California property taxes are paid on 100% of the cash value (basically market value) of the property. Where I live by comparison (Georgia) property taxes are based on 40% of the market value. Right off the bat, the same valued property in both state would have the California owner paying 250% of what the Georgia owner would.

wearetheworld
...(sales tax, gas tax, etc..) as well as long term taxes he needs to pay (taxes on investments, Inheritance tax to his estate, death tax, capital gains taxes...



Most expensive property listed for sale on Zillow in Rancho Santa Fe, California is listed at 16.5 Million. Assessor has the property at 4,123,403. Taxes paid last year were 43,114. The next few properties in the 8 digit range are assessed higher - at around 50% of the asking price and taxes are about 1% of assessed value. So, if Phil lives in a 50 million dollar home, he's looking at $250,000 in property taxes.

Let's imagine Phil spends about 10% of his income on stuff subject to local sales taxes (8%). That's $488,000 per year.

Gas tax. Assume 8 mpg and 25k miles per year (is that high enough?)- 3125 gallons at 5 pre-tax-dollars a gallon. That's 38 cents per gallon state and federal + 2.25% state sales. So (3125 x 0.38) + (3125 x 5 x 2.25%) = $1,539 per year

Capital gains: Worst case, it's taxed as regular income. Best case it's taxed at 18% or 20%. I don't think the 61 million income from above includes investments. But the taxes are on income, not assets, so if anything this would bring his burden AS A PERCENT OF INCOME down or keep it the same.

Inheritance/death tax. He may go Brewster's Millions or donate all that to some group. Either way, unless he was planning on dying this year, I don't think he should include it in his tax burden.

I'm not going to get into titling fees on his cars. That's cost of ownership in my opinion. And I'm getting lazy.

I can't find evidence of local income tax.

That's 28.2 million + 0.25 million property + 0.5 million in sales + 0.001539 million in gas taxes. 28.95 million. Round it to 30 million.

Still not at 50%.

/I'm not arguing what the right level of taxation is
//Or how righteous his statements are
///I'm just checking the farking numbers. Numbers have farking meanings and are specific.
////As Tom Slick said, it probably relates to his business operations
2013-01-22 11:29:34 AM
1 votes:

Space Monkey 39: Nabb1: Space Monkey 39: .....

He just needs to stop biatching about it because it makes him look like an asshole and it is self defeating since he makes his money partially due to his image.

Yes, because complaining about taxes is a real turn off to most Americans.

Complaining about taxes is ok when you aren't super rich by most peoples standards. Again I don't fault him for feeling that way, whining about it publicly will just upset a lot of people (you can see them above in this thread). If he does it enough his sponsors will reconsider, find some other guy smart enough not to gripe publicly about a money problem that alomst everyone would love to have.


Most of his sponsors sell products aimed at people who have a good bit of money themselves and probably agree with Phil.  I doubt too many people wailing in this thread are suddenly going to change their mind about which top-shelf driver they are buying based on these comments.
2013-01-22 10:45:17 AM
1 votes:

craig328: kronicfeld: craig328: So yeah, 2/3 = 66.66% percent and that's close to 62-63...so I did this nifty thing called "rounding". Surely, you've heard of it. It was all the rage in second grade math classes. Sorry if that caused you to tighten the chin strap on your helmet. It's just numbers and people making responsible decisions. Ask a grown up about it sometime.

Oh, so you're just taking his whining as gospel. I see.

It's as valid as dismissing it for no reason whatsoever (what you seem to be doing). I'll go ahead and say that a man who has a home and has founded and raised a family there would require more than a token insult to his wallet to prompt him to leave that home. You may envy his position in life and his wealth but he operates under the same financial rules as the rest of us. If he decides that having over half his income confiscated is too onerous, he has the option to do something about it.


Where is he going to pay less?
2013-01-22 10:33:33 AM
1 votes:

kronicfeld: dsmith42: I think you counted his whole income for the SS tax. That tax ends after $110k (for 2012).

azpenguin: If he's paying 60+% in taxes, then he needs to either fire his accountant or hire one. Social Security phases out after a certain income level, so that doesn't affect much. Then the tax rate increases are on marginal rates, not on all income. He might be biatching about that now, but those marginal rates used to be much, much higher.

And let's not forget that he can deduct his state and local taxes on his federal return.


I didn't include ANY deductions whatsoever. I just saw the 65% quote felt the need to double check that. Top marginal rate in CA is 10.3%. Top Federal rate is 35%. Those two combined is still almost 20 points lower than what he's saying and those are the two big ones. So my math is this:

CA taxes
1%x7124 + 2%x9,766 + 4%x9,767 + 6%x10,348 + 8%x9,761 + 9.3%x953,234 + 10.3%x60E6 = $6,270,710 (98% of that from the top bracket)

Federal income taxes
10%x12400 + 15%x34,950 +25%x74,950 + 28%x75,750 + 33%x190,300 + 35%x60611650 = $21,323,307 (99.5% of that from the top bracket)

Medicare tax (0.9% on everything over 200k)
(61E6 - 200,000) x 0.9% = $547,200

Social Security
12.4% (self employed rate) on the first 113,700 = $14,099

Total - $28,155,315 out of $61,000,000.

While I don't match my initial calculation (off by 200k), it's still about 46%.

If you deduct the state taxes from from the Federal it drops down to $25,970,265, or about 42.6%.

Like I said, I'm not an accountant and I'm not a tax expert. I'm just trying to remember what the line items are from my paycheck and seeing how they hit him. I don't know how his business structure works and what that does for/against him. I'm just trying to see how he's getting to 2/3rds of his income going to gubmint.
2013-01-22 10:10:59 AM
1 votes:

craig328: So yeah, 2/3 = 66.66% percent and that's close to 62-63...so I did this nifty thing called "rounding". Surely, you've heard of it. It was all the rage in second grade math classes. Sorry if that caused you to tighten the chin strap on your helmet. It's just numbers and people making responsible decisions. Ask a grown up about it sometime.


Oh, so you're just taking his whining as gospel. I see.
2013-01-22 09:56:41 AM
1 votes:
Call me crazy but even if he paid 62% he still made 20+ million for swinging a club. Maybe he can move some place where there are no taxes and watch his sponsorship money start to dry up. Nobody likes a greedy ass.
2013-01-22 09:54:15 AM
1 votes:

craig328: give 2/3 of his income to the government


Derp.
2013-01-22 09:48:45 AM
1 votes:
So, jacking up tax rates on the wealthy means they'll just up and move someplace that DOESN'T rob them? Wow, didn't see that com...no, wait. Yeah, pretty much everyone who isn't an effing retard saw that one coming.

But when those of you who are shaking your tiny fists at the guy who doesn't feel like he should give 2/3 of his income to the government and has the means to ensure that he doesn't are done...think about who the government will tax next to pay for their lavish spending.

Gee, who WILL they turn to once the rich aren't within reach anymore? I mean, apparently reducing spending is a ludicrous idea so we can go ahead and scrap that idiot notion, right? But where oh where will they get that money from? Yep...that's a real stumper isn't it?
2013-01-22 09:47:36 AM
1 votes:

dsmith42: I think you counted his whole income for the SS tax. That tax ends after $110k (for 2012).


azpenguin: If he's paying 60+% in taxes, then he needs to either fire his accountant or hire one. Social Security phases out after a certain income level, so that doesn't affect much. Then the tax rate increases are on marginal rates, not on all income. He might be biatching about that now, but those marginal rates used to be much, much higher.


And let's not forget that he can deduct his state and local taxes on his federal return.
2013-01-22 09:46:08 AM
1 votes:
If he's paying 60+% in taxes, then he needs to either fire his accountant or hire one. Social Security phases out after a certain income level, so that doesn't affect much. Then the tax rate increases are on marginal rates, not on all income. He might be biatching about that now, but those marginal rates used to be much, much higher.
2013-01-22 09:38:53 AM
1 votes:

Mutated-Snoopy: Phil made 61 million in 2011, mostly from endorsements. About the same in 2010. Link

I'm feeling lazy, so I'm just gonna use the first google hits on this for brackets and stuff. Assuming Head of Household, filing single, paying both halves of social security (12.4%), and the 0.9% Medicare tax on income over 200k . Link

I'm not an accountant, just a schlub avoiding work but I'm getting ~28.3 million in taxes. That's an effective rate of 46.3%.

"If you add up all the federal and you look at the disability and the unemployment and the Social Security and the state, my tax rate's 62, 63 percent," Of course I don't know what unemployment is for him. As far as I know that's paid by employers, so I guess he's got his own Phil Mickelson, Inc. kind of thing going on, but then we're talking business taxes and not personal taxes and everything goes tits up.
Anyone want to expand on this?


I think you counted his whole income for the SS tax. That tax ends after $110k (for 2012).
2013-01-22 09:31:48 AM
1 votes:

steamingpile: I love people who just read one part and then say shiat like this, what's really a travesty is that they are starting what amounts to a 65% tax rate


A 65% tax rate? I'd love to see the math on that.
2013-01-22 08:43:29 AM
1 votes:

Rav Tokomi: "If you add up all the federal and you look at the disability and the unemployment and the Social Security and the state, my tax rate's 62, 63 percent," Mickelson said

Yeah right, I wonder how much he really pays after his tax lawyer is done putting it through all the loopholes and accounting tricks.


At his income level and the way he gets his money (endorsements & prize winnings) I wouldn't be surprised if it was that high. It's not like he can use carried interest, etc. like the Wall Street guys can.

I consider myself fairly liberal but anyone paying 60% of their income in taxes is getting the shaft. No one should be paying that much.
2013-01-22 08:30:13 AM
1 votes:
"If you add up all the federal and you look at the disability and the unemployment and the Social Security and the state, my tax rate's 62, 63 percent," Mickelson said

Yeah right, I wonder how much he really pays after his tax lawyer is done putting it through all the loopholes and accounting tricks.
2013-01-22 08:21:30 AM
1 votes:
Really surprised he hasn't already moved to a state with no income taxes. Anybody that makes over $250K that can relocate their job/company to a state with no income tax should move. Those states want you there and the states that you're leaving behind are filled with crybaby libersals that only like you for the money they can steal from you. It's a win-win.
2013-01-22 08:15:35 AM
1 votes:
Is this the guy with the dead eyes, starring in some pharma commercial? He needs to save up his money and buy a human soul.
2013-01-22 08:11:08 AM
1 votes:
Booo farking hoo
 
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