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(The Register)   "'Engineers are cold and dead inside,' research shows, 'Unable to care or love'" In other news, trolling for web-hits is easy   (theregister.co.uk) divider line 360
    More: Obvious, surveying, School of Engineering, computer engineering, trolls  
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11354 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Jan 2013 at 3:29 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-21 05:32:22 PM

Necronic: brantgoose: ....

I'm not sure if self-aggrandizing or desperation are the better terms for what I am reading here.


Just ignore the liberal arts major pontificating on the milk crates and get back to coding.
 
2013-01-21 05:32:24 PM

Necronic: My father is an engineer and one of the nicest men I have ever met. But there's a part of me that wonders if it's because he has run through a series of DOE's on us and determined that general kindness is the best path.


You say that as if it was a bad thing.....
 
2013-01-21 05:33:06 PM
I've worked with a lot of engineers, and I'm starting to think that the fact I've found most of them to be completely normal people says more about me than it does about them.
 
2013-01-21 05:34:09 PM

meat0918: cgraves67: meat0918: I am sure it has been said already, but most of the engineers I know would rate a "high functioning autism/Aspberger's". I'm sure I could self diagnose that myself as well, but I don't.

//Fear of social interaction (i.e. extreme shyness around new people) is completely different neurosis, isn't it?

Schizoid personality disorder?

No, I want the relationships, and I do well once I'm comfortable (or have a few beers in me), but the anxiety leading up to that point can be overwhelming.

I hear Xanax helps, but given the choice between those side effect and alcohol's, I'll take the alcohol.


As someone recovering from moderate agoraphobia & social anxiety disorder, Xanax is helpful only to a point, and alcohol doesn't work well as a coping mechanism, for the same reason - the point at which you're relaxed enough to function comfortably, but lucid enough to function well, is a tiny, tiny point on a long line, and it moves around a lot. By the time you think you're OK enough to deal with the panic attack or the situation, you're already over-medicated and might as well just go somewhere else to crash. Cognitive therapy and exposure therapy helped a lot more - the medication just makes that therapy go better & easier, and helps to manage the occasional panic attack.

For the last four years or so, I've carried a "security blanket" - a small aluminum screw-top pill container, containing enough Xanax to deal with the possibility of panic attack. The last time I used it was about a year and a half ago. These days, the few Xanax kept in it slowly grind each other to a powder, but I still carry it as, well, a security blanket.
 
2013-01-21 05:36:22 PM

Arthur Jumbles: Necronic: My father is an engineer and one of the nicest men I have ever met. But there's a part of me that wonders if it's because he has run through a series of DOE's on us and determined that general kindness is the best path.

You say that as if it was a bad thing.....


I'm 95% confident it was a very good thing
 
2013-01-21 05:37:39 PM

aprentic: Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: Finance major - Braindead inside

You're probably talking about undergrad finance majors and I don't really know what their curriculum is like but I can tell you from personal experience that graduate level finance isn't doable if you're braindead. Econometrics and game theory are not for the dull of mind.


I'm in the process of working on my MPA to pursue a career in public service after a double major in Finance/Econ. I love graduate work just because it IS so challenging, and I agree with you on the undergraduate work.
 
2013-01-21 05:39:10 PM
My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?
 
2013-01-21 05:41:00 PM

brantgoose: Finally, you have the smarter sort of engineers. They take English literature courses once they graduate and have jobs because they would like to have been English majors instead of engineers, or because they realize something is missing that leaves them cold and empty inside, or simply because they realize that engineers can't communicate their way around a cardboard box.


Or maybe, as I tore through most of the Russian, German and ancient classics, world folktales and philosophy while working towards my engineering degree, it was just so much better than suffering conversations with people who write like you.
 
2013-01-21 05:41:42 PM

two towns over: My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?


People are gonna shiat on me for it, but I'd say yes. An engineer doesn't have to be limited to certain disciplines, at it's root an engineer is someone who comes up with ways to solve technical problems.
 
2013-01-21 05:42:34 PM
and I used it's instead of its...whatever, listening to music.
 
2013-01-21 05:42:37 PM
"Journalists are lazy and inept. Unable to work or research."
 
2013-01-21 05:44:11 PM

two towns over: My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?


No farking way.
 
2013-01-21 05:44:31 PM
Reading TFA, I am at a loss for words; Tongue tied, if you will.
 
2013-01-21 05:45:39 PM

FormlessOne: meat0918: cgraves67: meat0918: I am sure it has been said already, but most of the engineers I know would rate a "high functioning autism/Aspberger's". I'm sure I could self diagnose that myself as well, but I don't.

//Fear of social interaction (i.e. extreme shyness around new people) is completely different neurosis, isn't it?

Schizoid personality disorder?

No, I want the relationships, and I do well once I'm comfortable (or have a few beers in me), but the anxiety leading up to that point can be overwhelming.

I hear Xanax helps, but given the choice between those side effect and alcohol's, I'll take the alcohol.

As someone recovering from moderate agoraphobia & social anxiety disorder, Xanax is helpful only to a point, and alcohol doesn't work well as a coping mechanism, for the same reason - the point at which you're relaxed enough to function comfortably, but lucid enough to function well, is a tiny, tiny point on a long line, and it moves around a lot. By the time you think you're OK enough to deal with the panic attack or the situation, you're already over-medicated and might as well just go somewhere else to crash. Cognitive therapy and exposure therapy helped a lot more - the medication just makes that therapy go better & easier, and helps to manage the occasional panic attack.

For the last four years or so, I've carried a "security blanket" - a small aluminum screw-top pill container, containing enough Xanax to deal with the possibility of panic attack. The last time I used it was about a year and a half ago. These days, the few Xanax kept in it slowly grind each other to a powder, but I still carry it as, well, a security blanket.


The cognitive behavior therapy and pills helped in college, but my insurance covered the meds back then and the therapy sessions were free through the university.

Now it's all out of pocket and I can't afford it, even with insurance at my current workplace.
 
2013-01-21 05:45:45 PM
I am an electrical engineer and I can assure you I am not dead inside. If I was, it would be rather difficult to type something in this thread.
 
2013-01-21 05:47:08 PM
Does this apply to architects? Cause I'm drunk inside.
 
2013-01-21 05:47:11 PM
Engineers also trend way more conservative than the average, especially the college-educated average.

Having worked with a few engineers in my day, my anecdotal experience aligns with the article. Exceptions aside, the range of emotion in the engineering field tends to be a binary value of either "angry" or "busy". I have never felt more pity than when watching a Kurosawa movie with an engineer. "Not getting it" would be putting it lightly.
 
2013-01-21 05:47:51 PM

WhippingBoy: two towns over: My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?

No farking way.


Why not? What part of their job precludes them from referring to themselves as an engineer? You don't have to have a P.Eng or a license to be called an Engineer in the strictest sense of the word.
 
2013-01-21 05:48:23 PM
I can turn it on or off, but when it's on, the caring algorithm still needs a little work.
 
2013-01-21 05:50:23 PM

ProfessorOhki: That's not entirely true; some engineers remain quite capable of anger.


Or as it's more commonly known, "People skills"

www.mnpokermag.com


SultanofSchwing: An engineer doesn't have to be limited to certain disciplines, at it's root an engineer is someone who comes up with ways to solve technical problems.


Pretty much this, as opposed to, say, "Sanitation Engineer" meaning the guy who throws the trash into the truck...

=Smidge=
/"Software Engineer" means "code monkey" more often than not...
 
2013-01-21 05:55:41 PM

SultanofSchwing: Necronic: brantgoose: ....

I'm not sure if self-aggrandizing or desperation are the better terms for what I am reading here.

Just ignore the liberal arts major pontificating on the milk crates and get back to coding.


Are you aware how difficult it is to obtain milk crates these days? It's much easier to get empty boxes the bags of coffee came in.
 
2013-01-21 05:55:49 PM
Meh, engineers are still better than accountants.
 
2013-01-21 05:56:01 PM

Smidge204: Pretty much this, as opposed to, say, "Sanitation Engineer" meaning the guy who throws the trash into the truck...

=Smidge=
/"Software Engineer" means "code monkey" more often than not...


Yeah I can see terms like "Sanitation Engineer" being a thorn in the side, but I'm pretty sure nobody is meant to take that title seriously, ever. The core of my education was given under the umbrella term "Network Engineer," I'm certainly no Professional Engineer nor do I wear a steel ring at the end of my digits. But my training and job involves coming up with creative means to interconnect devices and their users while observing cost restraints and practicality to create a successful plan and implementation. So I definitely put "Network Engineer" on my resume, because it's true.
 
2013-01-21 05:57:41 PM

SultanofSchwing: two towns over: My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?

People are gonna shiat on me for it, but I'd say yes. An engineer doesn't have to be limited to certain disciplines, at it's root an engineer is someone who comes up with ways to solve technical problems.


Eeeh. I thought the alternative title for gaffer was "Chief Lighting Technician". The difference usually being execution vs. design. IMHO, a lighting engineer would be someone designing new lighting equipment. The same way an "audio engineer" is the one designing the speakers, not the guy running the mixer. YMMV.
 
2013-01-21 06:00:16 PM

89 Stick-Up Kid: Meh, engineers are still better than accountants.


They are natural enemies. Accountant: "How much will it cost?" Engineer: "How the heck would I know? I'm not an accountant."
 
2013-01-21 06:01:18 PM

ProfessorOhki: SultanofSchwing: two towns over: My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?

People are gonna shiat on me for it, but I'd say yes. An engineer doesn't have to be limited to certain disciplines, at it's root an engineer is someone who comes up with ways to solve technical problems.

Eeeh. I thought the alternative title for gaffer was "Chief Lighting Technician". The difference usually being execution vs. design. IMHO, a lighting engineer would be someone designing new lighting equipment. The same way an "audio engineer" is the one designing the speakers, not the guy running the mixer. YMMV.


I suppose, I see it as they're designing the layout for it or coming up with a means to light a particularly difficult set or in a particular manner in a practical way. Now if they're just someone being told to put light A at spot B, then I would agree that they're not engineers and just technicians.
 
2013-01-21 06:03:25 PM
Somewhere, a team of psych researchers are screaming in fury and banging their heads against the wall.

/Psychologists  love how much journalists extrapolate
//Or figure out how to make money from it
///Love it or hate it, unless you want a one-way ticket to the loony bin...
 
2013-01-21 06:04:05 PM
Nuclear engineers like me will leave you with a warm glow inside.

/Take that any way you want
 
2013-01-21 06:07:24 PM

Nurglitch: A little confusion about means and averages maybe?


In arithmetic the mean is one of several types of averages. When most people say "average" they arithmetic mean. When modern IQ tests are devised, the mean (average) score within an age group is set to 100 and the standard deviation (SD) almost always to 15.

Neglecting extreme outliers (which would not affect the statistic much anyway) and assuming the distribution is close to normal (it nearly is), then YES, about 1/2 the people are below average.

Also, in a normal distribution, mean, median, mode are the same. So YES, I would say there is some "confusion about means and averages" and I would say it lies with you.
 
2013-01-21 06:08:37 PM

simplicimus: 89 Stick-Up Kid: Meh, engineers are still better than accountants.

They are natural enemies. Accountant: "How much will it cost?" Engineer: "How the heck would I know? I'm not an accountant."


And I've cleaned up many accountants' messes. I've never seen a profession so well set up will policies and procedure and that is so inept at following them.

/Thanks for ruining the economy accounting and finance people
 
2013-01-21 06:10:39 PM
Besides, I think the real definition of an engineer is someone who is excited to get a screwdriver set for Christmas.
 
2013-01-21 06:11:26 PM
So...

An engineer, a scientist, and a mathematician are riding on a train through Scotland. Out the window, on the hillside, they see a black sheep. The engineer says "I guess the sheep in Scotland are black!". The scientist scowls and smugly corrects him; "All we know at this point is that SOME sheep in Scotland are black."

Finally the mathematician can stand no more and says; "All we REALLY know is that at least one sheep in Scotland is black on at least one side at least some of the time.


/ Tip your sheep and shave your waitress
 
2013-01-21 06:14:55 PM

meat0918: FormlessOne: meat0918: cgraves67: meat0918: I am sure it has been said already, but most of the engineers I know would rate a "high functioning autism/Aspberger's". I'm sure I could self diagnose that myself as well, but I don't.

//Fear of social interaction (i.e. extreme shyness around new people) is completely different neurosis, isn't it?

Schizoid personality disorder?

No, I want the relationships, and I do well once I'm comfortable (or have a few beers in me), but the anxiety leading up to that point can be overwhelming.

I hear Xanax helps, but given the choice between those side effect and alcohol's, I'll take the alcohol.

As someone recovering from moderate agoraphobia & social anxiety disorder, Xanax is helpful only to a point, and alcohol doesn't work well as a coping mechanism, for the same reason - the point at which you're relaxed enough to function comfortably, but lucid enough to function well, is a tiny, tiny point on a long line, and it moves around a lot. By the time you think you're OK enough to deal with the panic attack or the situation, you're already over-medicated and might as well just go somewhere else to crash. Cognitive therapy and exposure therapy helped a lot more - the medication just makes that therapy go better & easier, and helps to manage the occasional panic attack.

For the last four years or so, I've carried a "security blanket" - a small aluminum screw-top pill container, containing enough Xanax to deal with the possibility of panic attack. The last time I used it was about a year and a half ago. These days, the few Xanax kept in it slowly grind each other to a powder, but I still carry it as, well, a security blanket.

The cognitive behavior therapy and pills helped in college, but my insurance covered the meds back then and the therapy sessions were free through the university.

Now it's all out of pocket and I can't afford it, even with insurance at my current workplace.


I understand - I was a contractor for the last couple of years, and while the money was good, medical costs were slowly killing us. Late last year, I took a permanent position with my last client, in part, because of the healthcare benefits. Therapy's expensive as hell, and medication prices have gone insane. My wife takes a raft of medications to keep her out of a wheelchair (she's had osteo & rheumatoid arthritis since her late teens), and paying for that out of pocket was expensive (like "additional mortgage payment each month" expensive.)
 
2013-01-21 06:15:48 PM
So the article is saying that individuals who like people and emotional drama go into fields where they work with people and emotional drama occurs, and individuals who are analytical, find dealing with people draining and don't like drama go into careers where they can work with data rather than people, and emotional drama is a detriment?

What a surprise!
Someone call Rick Romero

Mechanical engineer here. It's not that we hate everyone, we only hate stupid people. The problem comes in when everyone is stupid.
The problem is that an IQ of 100 or lower is FREAKIN STUPID and that covers ~ 1/2 the population.

Shocking to think that people who use their brain all the time would have trouble dealing with people who don't use it ever!

Actually, a lot of people that apparently come across as warm, empathetic, and friendly to most seem terribly fake to me. They're all big smiles and "Hi! I'm a friendly happy person! I'm lovable! You should love me!" to which I respond "No," like that grumpy cat.

This
Just because you are waiting on my table or taking my bank deposit doesn't mean you have to be my best buddy.
 
2013-01-21 06:15:50 PM
What's the difference between a Mechanical Engineer and a Civil Engineer?

Mechanical Engineers build weapons, Civil Engineers build targets.
 
2013-01-21 06:16:06 PM

SultanofSchwing: Besides, I think the real definition of an engineer is someone who is excited to get a Torx screwdriver set for Christmas.


FTFY. And, yes, I was. :)
 
2013-01-21 06:18:36 PM

FormlessOne: SultanofSchwing: Besides, I think the real definition of an engineer is someone who is excited to get a Torx screwdriver set for Christmas.

FTFY. And, yes, I was. :)


The highlight of my day out last weekend was getting a 280 piece bit set for $30 at Canadian Tire...thing has like 50 PH2 heads in it, so excited to lose them all.
 
2013-01-21 06:20:36 PM

SultanofSchwing: FormlessOne: SultanofSchwing: Besides, I think the real definition of an engineer is someone who is excited to get a Torx screwdriver set for Christmas.

FTFY. And, yes, I was. :)

The highlight of my day out last weekend was getting a 280 piece bit set for $30 at Canadian Tire...thing has like 50 PH2 heads in it, so excited to lose them all.


That's part of the fun, isn't it? And it's always the ones you need (because, after all, those are the ones you take out...)
 
2013-01-21 06:21:31 PM
Depends how you cook them, I guess. Microwaving them does leave the inside cold.
 
2013-01-21 06:22:46 PM

FormlessOne: SultanofSchwing: FormlessOne: SultanofSchwing: Besides, I think the real definition of an engineer is someone who is excited to get a Torx screwdriver set for Christmas.

FTFY. And, yes, I was. :)

The highlight of my day out last weekend was getting a 280 piece bit set for $30 at Canadian Tire...thing has like 50 PH2 heads in it, so excited to lose them all.

That's part of the fun, isn't it? And it's always the ones you need (because, after all, those are the ones you take out...)


Yeah my last set has a full supply of flats but only like 2 or 3 of the original phillips with a couple I've found, no robertsons at all anymore, I was in dire need of a new set.
 
2013-01-21 06:27:27 PM

SultanofSchwing: ProfessorOhki: SultanofSchwing: two towns over: My job is a gaffer. A lighting guy, designer yes. The word is old english, anyway: some of my collegues say they are the "Chief Lighting Engineer" in their credits instead of gaffer. My question: are they right to claim engineer status?

People are gonna shiat on me for it, but I'd say yes. An engineer doesn't have to be limited to certain disciplines, at it's root an engineer is someone who comes up with ways to solve technical problems.

Eeeh. I thought the alternative title for gaffer was "Chief Lighting Technician". The difference usually being execution vs. design. IMHO, a lighting engineer would be someone designing new lighting equipment. The same way an "audio engineer" is the one designing the speakers, not the guy running the mixer. YMMV.

I suppose, I see it as they're designing the layout for it or coming up with a means to light a particularly difficult set or in a particular manner in a practical way. Now if they're just someone being told to put light A at spot B, then I would agree that they're not engineers and just technicians.


Yeah, the line between the two blurs quite a bit. In the SW world, it sort of seems like it's just there to distinguish hourly from salaried. Who cares about titles anyway; that sounds like marketing talk. From an engineering stand point, as long as the set gets lit, who cares if they're credited as "Photon Emitter Spatial Placement Coordination Designers." :)
 
2013-01-21 06:36:26 PM
A doctor, a lawyer and an engineer had into the washroom to do their business at the urninal.
After, the Doctor washes his hands and says " I deal with patients all day so I have to make sure my hands are clean"

The lawyer washes his hands and says " I am a lawyer and I deal with signing papers all day so I take extra care to make sure my hands are clean
The engineer passes by the wash basins as the other two look at him with disgust
He says "what? I am an engineer. I don't piss on my hands"
 
2013-01-21 06:39:04 PM
<b><a href="http://www.fark.com/comments/7547831/82032231#c82032231" target="_blank">Russ1642</a>:</b> <i>Mayhem_2006: As a former Civil Engineer, I would like to refute the headline/

I'd like to, but I can't.

/so lonely

There's no such thing as a civil engineer</i>

Ha! True. There's also no such thing as a software engineer.
 
2013-01-21 06:40:00 PM
"Unable to care or love, claims Swedish trick-cyclist"

Yeah, this girl sounds legit.
 
2013-01-21 06:43:06 PM
<b><a href="http://www.fark.com/comments/7547831/82032339#c82032339" target="_blank">oldfarthenry</a>:</b> <i>ProfessorOhki: That's not entirely true; some engineers remain quite capable of anger.

That's because we have to work with those marketing people:
[i1151.photobucket.com image 380x293]
YES - WE RERAN THE SOFTWARE MODEL WITH THE INCREASED ENVIRONMENTAL CRITERIA!!
WE EVEN FACTORED IN A LAYER OF PIGEON SH*T ON THE STRUCTURE!!!</i>

Seriously, what the hell is the deal with marketing types anyway?

/ee here
 
2013-01-21 06:44:06 PM
All professions can be explained in terms of 'Star Trek.'

Engineers come in three flavors, Scotty, Geordi and Data. The Data ones are the best at sheer technical prowess, but the worst at dealing with others.

Doctors come in three flavors, Dr. Crusher, Dr. McCoy and Dr. Bashir. Bashirs are a little arrogant, Crushers have the best bedside manner, and McCoys typically wind up being the surgeons.

I.T. professionals are either Klingons, Cardassians or Trill. If your I.T. person is the kind of person who will irritatedly shove you out of the way, fix it without telling you how and then head back to the office, that's the Klingon variety. The Cardassian variety will block or disable stuff if you mess it up and takes great glee in having authority. And the Trill, being a joined species, is typically a person who started in I.T. but has another skillset, and is thus markedly more chill and fun at parties.

The receptionists, who seem to always be female, are also always Betazeds. Ever notice how a pudgy, middle-aged lady whose skillset includes phones, faxes, copies and typing somehow always knows everything that's going on with a staff of engineers, doctors and I.T.? It's because she's the team mom and everyone brings their problems to her, much like Counselor Troi. Same goes for the tendency of some younger receptionists to be quite busty.

And Human Resources are all Borg. No exceptions.
 
2013-01-21 06:46:29 PM
Article is total nonsense. I'm an engineer and i'm not cold or unable to love. I have simply made some remarkable improvements to my thermal efficiencies and introduced some dampening feedback to my emotional responses for improved stability and concentration.
 
2013-01-21 06:50:24 PM
I'm a coder. I think about three things:
1. 1's
2. 0's
3. Murdering your family in their sleep
 
2013-01-21 06:52:15 PM
<b><a href="http://www.fark.com/comments/7547831/82032128#c82032128" target="_blank">mr_fulano</a>:</b> <i>Civil engineer here. Don't care what you guys think.</i>

me too. fark off.
 
2013-01-21 06:57:13 PM
<b><a href="http://www.fark.com/comments/7547831/82033815#c82033815" target="_blank">sxacho</a>:</b> <i>My 96 Volvo keeps me perpetually busy with new and interesting problems. Last weekend, I had to take apart the door lock mechanism to see why it wasn't working. I had it all laid out on the kitchen table for about 5 hours, just banging my head trying to figure it out, until all of a sudden I got it. It was a glorious breakthrough. I went running into the other room to show my wife how, look, the door is locked, now it's unlocked, now it's open, and here it is closed again. She was somewhat less enthusiastic about it than I was.</i>

Given that the evil car you just described is a Volvo, and that the study in TFA was done in Sweden, is it possible that only <i>Swedish </i>engineers are horrible human beings? Seems logical.
 
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