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(C|Net)   Microsoft blazes trail to next PC. And by trail, we mean the Trail of Tears. And by blaze, we mean literally on fire, with people running and screaming, chased by brightly colored non resizable tiles   (reviews.cnet.com) divider line 191
    More: Obvious, Microsoft, Trail of Tears, templates, application software, trails, Windows XP  
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8084 clicks; posted to Geek » on 20 Jan 2013 at 9:02 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-20 11:28:31 AM

LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: You know what would be really nice? Some kind of "window" that could be resized to whatever percent I wanted, both horizontally and vertically. Maybe one day, we will have that technology.

Desktop windows still exist, do that if you want to. Nothing stopping you. I have an entire monitor devoted to assorted small windows.


Serious question: is there anything you can do in Win8 that you could not have done in Win7?

One of the big reasons I haven't switched is that I need to be productive at work every day. Losing a day or two (or even an hour or two) to getting all of this reorganized and figured out really isn't an option. I could sell it, if I had something new that would make my life easier and make me more productive, but I haven't seen that "killer app" yet. So, what is it?
 
2013-01-20 11:34:05 AM

East Avenue Arse: LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: You know what would be really nice? Some kind of "window" that could be resized to whatever percent I wanted, both horizontally and vertically. Maybe one day, we will have that technology.

Desktop windows still exist, do that if you want to. Nothing stopping you. I have an entire monitor devoted to assorted small windows.

Serious question: is there anything you can do in Win8 that you could not have done in Win7?

One of the big reasons I haven't switched is that I need to be productive at work every day. Losing a day or two (or even an hour or two) to getting all of this reorganized and figured out really isn't an option. I could sell it, if I had something new that would make my life easier and make me more productive, but I haven't seen that "killer app" yet. So, what is it?


You can mount ISOs directly from the filesystem, which is nice. There are lots of performance improvements to core things, like networking.

Overall, though, would I recommend updating from Windows 7? Not really. If you have a good thing going with Windows 7, just wait on it until you upgrade your PC.
 
2013-01-20 11:36:41 AM

LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: I totally don't get your adamant defense of Win8, unless it is financially motivated. You still seem confused as to why people hate it, and constantly say it is because they have only used it for 5 minutes.

I do not say that. I think it's a fine OS because I use it like 15 hours a day. I know that Metro can be EASILY avoided if you dislike it, and the REST of the OS is quite fine. That's my whole argument - people are too willing to dismiss it for metro, when it's NOT hard to avoid. They ignore the rest of the OS and focus on this single point.

I'm not paid, I'm not a shill. I do have complaints (I think they failed to take advantage of snapping, as I already explained, and Microsoft bought Skype and Metro Skype blows). I just disagree with you, and in every thread in which I do that to the positive I get called a shill or fanboy (for Apple, for Microsoft, name it).


I apologize. It was WhippingBoy who mentioned the 5 minute thing, not you.

You say it is a fine OS, but is it better than Win7? People focus on Metro, because it is forced on them. You say you can EASILY avoid it, but it really isn't a checkbox you can click. You actually have to install new software if you want to ignore it. It also seems to be the biggest difference between 7 and 8, so why wouldn't people focus on it?

Beside Metro, what can you do in Win8 that you can't do in Win7? I really want to know...
 
2013-01-20 11:50:10 AM

East Avenue Arse: LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: I totally don't get your adamant defense of Win8, unless it is financially motivated. You still seem confused as to why people hate it, and constantly say it is because they have only used it for 5 minutes.

I do not say that. I think it's a fine OS because I use it like 15 hours a day. I know that Metro can be EASILY avoided if you dislike it, and the REST of the OS is quite fine. That's my whole argument - people are too willing to dismiss it for metro, when it's NOT hard to avoid. They ignore the rest of the OS and focus on this single point.

I'm not paid, I'm not a shill. I do have complaints (I think they failed to take advantage of snapping, as I already explained, and Microsoft bought Skype and Metro Skype blows). I just disagree with you, and in every thread in which I do that to the positive I get called a shill or fanboy (for Apple, for Microsoft, name it).

I apologize. It was WhippingBoy who mentioned the 5 minute thing, not you.

You say it is a fine OS, but is it better than Win7? People focus on Metro, because it is forced on them. You say you can EASILY avoid it, but it really isn't a checkbox you can click. You actually have to install new software if you want to ignore it. It also seems to be the biggest difference between 7 and 8, so why wouldn't people focus on it?

Beside Metro, what can you do in Win8 that you can't do in Win7? I really want to know...


Depends on what interests you.
 
2013-01-20 12:07:53 PM

East Avenue Arse: Beside Metro, what can you do in Win8 that you can't do in Win7? I really want to know...


Pinball Fx 2!

I got Windows 8 because it was the same price as Windows 7 I can get the 'Personal Use License' with 8, but the added pinball bonus is pretty sweet.
 
2013-01-20 12:14:47 PM

LasersHurt: Metro goes full-monitor on whatever monitor you've got it set on. When you snap an app, it takes about 20% - whatever else is on that monitor, be it desktop or metro, fills that space. There is no way to make it use more than 20%, which is a shame - I'd like to be able to snap several apps, in 20% increments. 40-40-20 with 3 apps, for example, would be nice.


Having done a bit of digging the MS website says screen resolution must be at least 1366 by 768 and I run two 1024 by 768 monitors. So no Snap for me.
 
2013-01-20 12:18:40 PM

East Avenue Arse: LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: You know what would be really nice? Some kind of "window" that could be resized to whatever percent I wanted, both horizontally and vertically. Maybe one day, we will have that technology.

Desktop windows still exist, do that if you want to. Nothing stopping you. I have an entire monitor devoted to assorted small windows.

Serious question: is there anything you can do in Win8 that you could not have done in Win7?

One of the big reasons I haven't switched is that I need to be productive at work every day. Losing a day or two (or even an hour or two) to getting all of this reorganized and figured out really isn't an option. I could sell it, if I had something new that would make my life easier and make me more productive, but I haven't seen that "killer app" yet. So, what is it?


I think it really depends on what you do with it. For me, the loss the start menu has been unexpectedly jarring to the point that I've gone from thinking I was going to be underwhelmed to the point where I now actively hate Windows 8. I need to access a lot of different systems so I had a lot of things on the start menu and it has been surprisingly disruptive to lose it.

If all you use is email, web and word processing? You probably won't notice that huge of a difference. That said, I don't think it would be worth the upgrade. Windows 7 will be around for many, many more years. Well beyond the introduction of whatever replaces Windows 8.
 
2013-01-20 12:18:42 PM

East Avenue Arse: WhippingBoy: East Avenue Arse: LasersHurt: Again, you are not forced to use Metro, or trapped in it in any way. I spend 99.9% of my time on the desktop in Windows 8.

You have said that before, but it is not entirely true. I was hanging out with a friend last night and he was Skyping his gf. He had to leave the Desktop UI to go to the Metro UI to get back to the Skype program. Could he have done it another way? Maybe, but it sure looked like he was trapped into using the Metro UI.

He could have installed the desktop (regular) version of Skype. It sounds like he had the Skype app installed instead.

Sooooo...he should have removed the Skype app that came pre-installed on his new Windows 8 laptop and installed a different version of the same application?

I totally get why he hates Windows 8 now.

I didn't really want to believe it, but I now think LasersHurt really must be a paid MS shill who cries himself to sleep each night, drinking a quart of vodka to help him forget the horrible lies he is forced to tell.


Why didn't you just say "MICROSOFT SUX!!! FANBOIS SUX!!! SUCK MY DICK" like everyone else instead of oh so cleverly setting up your derp in the guise of a reasonable question?
 
2013-01-20 12:24:42 PM

LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: I totally don't get your adamant defense of Win8, unless it is financially motivated. You still seem confused as to why people hate it, and constantly say it is because they have only used it for 5 minutes.

I do not say that. I think it's a fine OS because I use it like 15 hours a day. I know that Metro can be EASILY avoided if you dislike it, and the REST of the OS is quite fine. That's my whole argument - people are too willing to dismiss it for metro, when it's NOT hard to avoid. They ignore the rest of the OS and focus on this single point.

I'm not paid, I'm not a shill. I do have complaints (I think they failed to take advantage of snapping, as I already explained, and Microsoft bought Skype and Metro Skype blows). I just disagree with you, and in every thread in which I do that to the positive I get called a shill or fanboy (for Apple, for Microsoft, name it).


It's not just Metro, it's that they changed the way the traditional desktop works by hiding controls in the corners. If you bought a new car and found that Ford had hidden the ignition key in the glove box and the brake pedal is now a button on the steering wheel you'd complain. Those changes offer no improvement at all to desktop PC mouse and keyboard users, and in fact hinder them by being unfamiliar and slower, for the sake of features that only touch screen users will use.

Had they left Desktop alone (XP/W7 layout) and had Metro as an option then I'm convinced W8 would have been a fantastic hit. Future proof! Touchscreen ready! Perfect for this Surface machine that can be used as a tablet or as a laptop!
Instead they took away lots of Desktop controls and replaced them with touchscreen controls and/or keyboard shortcuts.

Classic Shell proves they can coexist happily, that they could have left the old Start Menu and still have the new touch controls. So why didn't MS do that instead of driving lots of people to a third-party app?
 
2013-01-20 12:27:30 PM

LasersHurt: Again, you are not forced to use Metro, or trapped in it in any way. I spend 99.9% of my time on the desktop in Windows 8.


Can't interrupt the latest Fark tech circle jerk with facts,or anything.
 
2013-01-20 12:29:27 PM

East Avenue Arse: Serious question: is there anything you can do in Win8 that you could not have done in Win7?

One of the big reasons I haven't switched is that I need to be productive at work every day. Losing a day or two (or even an hour or two) to getting all of this reorganized and figured out really isn't an option. I could sell it, if I had something new that would make my life easier and make me more productive, but I haven't seen that "killer app" yet. So, what is it?


I traded up from XP so the differences are quite a lot, not sure exactly what W7 had in what versions but I like the restore functions, the auto backup functions, programmes locked on the taskbar, very fast boot and it is supposed to take less system resources to run.
 
2013-01-20 12:33:58 PM

Millennium: Dude, I'm no fan of Microsoft, and especially not Windows 8, but isn't invoking the Trail of Tears kind of a sideways Godwin?


No one went broke waxing hyperbolic in anti-Microsoft screeds.
 
2013-01-20 12:35:16 PM

meatofmystery: LasersHurt: Again, you are not forced to use Metro, or trapped in it in any way. I spend 99.9% of my time on the desktop in Windows 8.

Can't interrupt the latest Fark tech circle jerk with facts,or anything.


Yep. I'm baffled by some of the bizarre statements apparently made by folks who haven't used Windows 8, but it's FARK - the Geek tab is getting almost as bad as the Politics tab.
 
2013-01-20 12:39:16 PM
Flint Ironstag:
2002: Bill Gates introduces the Tablet PC. No one cares.

2010: Steve Jobs introduces the iPad. The world pisses itself like an excited dog.

2012: Steve Ballmer introduces the Surface. People claim they stole the idea from Apple.



Made me look up the early evolution of tablet-ish devices... Whippersnappers!

1987 Linus Write-Top (gigantic)

1989 GRiDPad (better)

1993 Newton MessagePad (slightly smaller than iPad mini

Not new ideas at all. A friend owned the Newton years ago, it was quite awesome at the time.
 
2013-01-20 12:44:36 PM

FormlessOne: meatofmystery: LasersHurt: Again, you are not forced to use Metro, or trapped in it in any way. I spend 99.9% of my time on the desktop in Windows 8.

Can't interrupt the latest Fark tech circle jerk with facts,or anything.

Yep. I'm baffled by some of the bizarre statements apparently made by folks who haven't used Windows 8, but it's FARK - the Geek tab is getting almost as bad as the Politics tab.


I hear Obama is going to force people to use Metro applications to pay their new gun taxes
 
2013-01-20 12:46:03 PM
It sounds like Microsoft had a good idea, and instead of making it seamless and transparent to the user, implemented it in the most confusing way possible.
 
2013-01-20 12:51:59 PM
I love my farking Surface. You can have it when you pry it from my cold dead hands.

Surface in real life, just two days ago.

Me: End of day, playing solitare. Up walks Highly Respected Coworker.

HRC: What's happenin'

Me: Nothing much. Hey, you have a minute, I want to walk you through a business plan I'm cooking up.

HRC: Sure.

Me: Flips to PowerPoint, opens presentation stored on DropBox, walks through presentation.

HRC: That's a good idea, where did your revenue and cost figures come from?

Me: Flips to Excel, opens up financing spreadsheets also on DropBox, walks HRC through the numbers.

HRC: That makes sense, give me a call next week and we can do some more work ont it.

Me: No problems. Thanks for the ear. Goes back to playing solitaire.

I like the Surface because I can Angry Bird as much as I want, and still do real work.
 
2013-01-20 12:54:17 PM
I have Win8 now on a tablet, a touch-screen laptop, and also a desktop. On the tablet and touch-screen laptop, it's nice to have the Modern/Metro interface, and I'm now pretty use to touching the screen for everyday tasks (e.g., browsing, reading documents, etc). On the desktop machine, I pretty much stay in Desktop mode all the time, and in that case Win8 is just like Win7, with some improvements to things like file copying, task manager, etc.
 
2013-01-20 12:55:28 PM
Woohoo, it's today's W8 hate thread!

Good job, Internet. You never disappoint.
 
2013-01-20 01:04:14 PM
Hybrid tablets/laptops are the future and Microsoft is leading the way. Give it a couple years and everybody will be using them.
 
2013-01-20 01:13:56 PM
meh, the whole apple vs. microsoft argument is a moot point, it's never been about having the idea first on the market, it's always been about foresight, timing and gradual market product releases

basically, think of the tech market as a relay race where the team that wins is the one in which each member contributes towards the progress of the next member as they hand off the baton, in this case the ipad benefited from the progress that the iphone made, which benefited from the progress than the ipod made, which benefitted from the taboo-nature of the wild-west mp3 market

apple has been really smart to gradually lead customers towards what they want, and to do so requires placing the building blocks at the right time with the right product (apple maps aside)

microsoft's market strategy has basically been two-faced, on the one hand they want to keep iterating on windows into infinity on the other hand they're constantly starting and stopping on the hardware front, they recognize the growth just isn't there in the PC space compared to the portable space but they're always too slow to recognize their own faults (Re: portable showed signs of larger growth almost a decade ago)

as such, if you look at the market like a relay race, each member of the team is starting over or not doing their part, it's incredibly difficult then to demand that users hop onto the windows 8 surface bandwagon when there's no userbase for it... and on top of that they're ruining whatever progress windows 7 made towards their bottom line

it's really got nothing to do with who has the idea first on the market, and more about what the market wants and being there right when they want it (hence why the galaxy s3 has taken off as the market wanted at least 1 alternative to the iphone ever since the iphone came out)
 
2013-01-20 01:16:06 PM

Popcorn Johnny: Hybrid tablets/laptops are the future and Microsoft is leading the way. Give it a couple years and everybody will be using them.


maybe if somebody else comes up with a tablet/laptop hybrid combo that is comfortable to use on your lap
 
2013-01-20 01:18:29 PM

East Avenue Arse: LasersHurt: East Avenue Arse: I totally don't get your adamant defense of Win8, unless it is financially motivated. You still seem confused as to why people hate it, and constantly say it is because they have only used it for 5 minutes.

I do not say that. I think it's a fine OS because I use it like 15 hours a day. I know that Metro can be EASILY avoided if you dislike it, and the REST of the OS is quite fine. That's my whole argument - people are too willing to dismiss it for metro, when it's NOT hard to avoid. They ignore the rest of the OS and focus on this single point.

I'm not paid, I'm not a shill. I do have complaints (I think they failed to take advantage of snapping, as I already explained, and Microsoft bought Skype and Metro Skype blows). I just disagree with you, and in every thread in which I do that to the positive I get called a shill or fanboy (for Apple, for Microsoft, name it).

I apologize. It was WhippingBoy who mentioned the 5 minute thing, not you.

You say it is a fine OS, but is it better than Win7? People focus on Metro, because it is forced on them. You say you can EASILY avoid it, but it really isn't a checkbox you can click. You actually have to install new software if you want to ignore it. It also seems to be the biggest difference between 7 and 8, so why wouldn't people focus on it?

Beside Metro, what can you do in Win8 that you can't do in Win7? I really want to know...


Storage spaces are pretty neat. Take the 2TB drive, that old 100GB drive, your slightly newer 250GB drive and the 500GB external HD you have sitting around for some reason and make a storage pool. And then partition that into however many storage spaces you want at whatever size with RAID like redundancy. (want 8 50TB drives? go for it doesn't matter how much actual space you have) When the drive space you're using starts to approach the physical amount of storage you have, it bugs you to plug something else in. If a drive dies or you feel like pulling it for other uses you just disconnect it and it.
 
2013-01-20 01:22:36 PM
Don' forget the Palm Zoomer, introduced in 1992.
www.8bit-micro.com
/hot
 
2013-01-20 01:24:40 PM
This is going to be hilarious.
 
2013-01-20 01:26:36 PM

AdamK: maybe if somebody else comes up with a tablet/laptop hybrid combo that is comfortable to use on your lap


They're already out there.

cdn-static.zdnet.com
 
2013-01-20 02:03:29 PM

Popcorn Johnny: AdamK: maybe if somebody else comes up with a tablet/laptop hybrid combo that is comfortable to use on your lap

They're already out there.

[cdn-static.zdnet.com image 620x527]


how about one that doesn't look like it belongs in a circus?
 
2013-01-20 02:09:55 PM
www.technostall.com
I like this style better. Screen folds flat and slides shut.
 
2013-01-20 02:28:53 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: FormlessOne: meatofmystery: LasersHurt: Again, you are not forced to use Metro, or trapped in it in any way. I spend 99.9% of my time on the desktop in Windows 8.

Can't interrupt the latest Fark tech circle jerk with facts,or anything.

Yep. I'm baffled by some of the bizarre statements apparently made by folks who haven't used Windows 8, but it's FARK - the Geek tab is getting almost as bad as the Politics tab.

I hear Obama is going to force people to use Metro applications to pay their new gun taxes


Huh. I heard that conservatives loved Metro's interface - bright colors, sharp angles, no gradients, and they didn't have to use that complicated keyboard any more. Just press their greasy, jam-covered hands right on the screen, and Rush appears with the Blowhard Benedicition of the Day.

Plus, the boot cycle is so much bootstrappier!
 
2013-01-20 02:33:04 PM
Also, of course I "remember" the netbook. Out here in the real world where we're not tech reviewers who get handed new hardware like it's farking candy, I see them all the time.

This. I've bought three of the damned things in the last two years, two for my use (work, home) and one for my grandmother (along with a keyboard, and wired the display output to her TV). They are, so far as I can tell, still more popular among people that actually _use_ computers (as opposed to dicking around with them) than tablets or full-screen laptops.


This
Netbooks are awesome for travel computers. Most the capabilities of a laptop with a size just a little larger than a tablet. I can watch movies during the flight and then run a powerpoint presentation at the meeting from the same machine. Full laptops often have much more power than the traveler is going to use. The net guy at my last place of employment used a netbook at home and pushed it to see how far he could take it. It did all his normal stuff without a qualm and only complained when he was doing really heavy data work. In addition, if a netbook gets damaged in travel, you are only out ~$200.


Popcorn Johnny: Hybrid tablets/laptops are the future and Microsoft is leading the way. Give it a couple years and everybody will be using them.

maybe if somebody else comes up with a tablet/laptop hybrid combo that is comfortable to use on your lap


You mean like a netbook?
 
2013-01-20 02:52:36 PM
This thread again. As a person with a WP I have no problem with metro. Hell my friend with a Android and iPod touch have no beef with Windows 8
 
2013-01-20 03:07:41 PM
The tile screen is a PITA I wish I could turn off along with the default applications that switch from desktop to a tablet screen.

That said the interface changes are only a minor annoyance.

I even see some promise in the idea of a tablet like the lenovo helix that snaps into a base to become a laptop but has everything necessary like battery and processor behind the glass so you can detach it from the base when using it like a tablet.

I want a computer like that and a windows 8 that is smart enough to act like 7 when docked and use the metro stuff when the computer is in tablet mode.
This would include things like different default programs for opening files depending on mode so I have the option of using software optimized for mouse/keyboard when those are available and simpler touch friendly software in tablet mode.
I don't want to try and emulate a mouse's precision with my finger tip or waste that precision when I have it available.
 
2013-01-20 03:25:13 PM

Marcus Aurelius: I'm looking for Microsoft to provide some REAL innovation, like hiding the entire file name instead of just the extension.


I like how it's 2013 and Windows is still dependent on extensions for application associations.

The *nix world did away with that in the 90's. Call the file whatever you want, the OS will figure it out.
 
2013-01-20 03:31:32 PM

Marine1: Actually, the Metro interface has some real advantages I'm discovering as a developer. Not sure what Subby's all on about.


From a user point of view, Windows 8's interface is neither good at being a desktop machine or a tablet. No one wants two completely separate desktop environments that have two different modes of operation and two different application interfaces on the same same machine.

To think otherwise is to be delusional.
 
2013-01-20 03:37:40 PM

Renowned transvestite sexologist: From a user point of view, Windows 8's interface is neither good at being a desktop machine or a tablet. No one wants two completely separate desktop environments that have two different modes of operation and two different application interfaces on the same same machine.

To think otherwise is to be delusional.


You couldn't be more wrong. A tablet/laptop combo is exactly what everybody wants.
 
2013-01-20 03:47:18 PM

Flint Ironstag: illegal.tender: One of our admins at work had Win 8 on his comp. I do t know for how long, but I walked by his desk on Friday and noticed he had put 7 back on it.

Yeah.

How could you tell by walking past? W8 Desktop can look exactly the same as 7.


Not if you see a start button.
 
2013-01-20 03:49:30 PM

Flint Ironstag: [img252.imageshack.us image 724x432]


You're going to have to change some of the dates around, 2002 sounds very late; I distinctly remember 'Pen Editions' of Win3.1x.

If you're going to try and bait people you should at least do so in a way that doesn't make you look like an idiot hmm?
 
2013-01-20 03:54:30 PM
As soon as you take away a consumer's ability to build their own device from component parts, you take away their power. You take away their bargaining position, their ability to comparison shop. You take away their ability to haggle price, to get the most for their money. You force them to choose one of two solutions: Microsoft or Apple.

There is a reason Apple and other companies want to sell you hardware that is proprietary, closed, and all hardwired onto one board. That way they can overprice it and you can't do anything about it. You can't just yank out the malfunctioning memory stick and replace it with another, a cost of only $30. If it's under warranty, you can get a limited warranty refurb, sure. If it's not under warranty, you'll be paying several hundred dollars for a new one though. That's in their interest, not yours.

That's why Apple pays so much attention to case design. Because they know a consumer will choose against their own interest if the thing is shiny and smooth and curvy enough. They'll pay out the nose for it, and they'll ask for more.

That's why I'll post this message every time some "tech writer" writes one of these stupid articles.
 
2013-01-20 04:03:39 PM

Rent Party: I love my farking Surface. You can have it when you pry it from my cold dead hands.

Surface in real life, just two days ago.

Me: End of day, playing solitare. Up walks Highly Respected Coworker.

HRC: What's happenin'

Me: Nothing much. Hey, you have a minute, I want to walk you through a business plan I'm cooking up.

HRC: Sure.

Me: Flips to PowerPoint, opens presentation stored on DropBox, walks through presentation.

HRC: That's a good idea, where did your revenue and cost figures come from?

Me: Flips to Excel, opens up financing spreadsheets also on DropBox, walks HRC through the numbers.

HRC: That makes sense, give me a call next week and we can do some more work ont it.

Me: No problems. Thanks for the ear. Goes back to playing solitaire.

I like the Surface because I can Angry Bird as much as I want, and still do real work.


Wow you store sensitive company data on Dropbox. That has stupid written all over it. I'm sure both your IT department and IT Security would love to hear their stuff is being stored on a server they have no control over.
 
2013-01-20 04:07:11 PM
The thing I find funny is the people who claim Metro is great and then go on to give us the ways that they avoid Metro like having multiple monitors, or installing 3rd party apps to handle PDF docs, etc.
 
2013-01-20 04:11:37 PM
Flint Ironstag

Had they left Desktop alone (XP/W7 layout) and had Metro as an option then I'm convinced W8 would have been a fantastic hit. Future proof! Touchscreen ready! Perfect for this Surface machine that can be used as a tablet or as a laptop!
Instead they took away lots of Desktop controls and replaced them with touchscreen controls and/or keyboard shortcuts.

I think you hit the nail on the head there. But unfortunately that also flies in the face of Corporate interests in promoting a "universal" interface and allowing them to (hopefully) bridge the gap between all the product lines.

They also have to compete on the "new, shiny" factor. If they're not offering something new on the interface front every other generation; then just as many people here would be complaining that they are growing stagnant and outdated (as happend a few Windows versions back).
 
2013-01-20 04:21:53 PM

Seequinn: Had they left Desktop alone


OMFG they took my start button!
 
2013-01-20 04:24:04 PM

tomerson: Flint Ironstag: illegal.tender: One of our admins at work had Win 8 on his comp. I do t know for how long, but I walked by his desk on Friday and noticed he had put 7 back on it.

Yeah.

How could you tell by walking past? W8 Desktop can look exactly the same as 7.

Not if you see a start button.


I have Windows 8 and a start button.

Classic Shell FTW.
 
2013-01-20 04:25:48 PM

Vaneshi: Flint Ironstag: [img252.imageshack.us image 724x432]


You're going to have to change some of the dates around, 2002 sounds very late; I distinctly remember 'Pen Editions' of Win3.1x.

If you're going to try and bait people you should at least do so in a way that doesn't make you look like an idiot hmm?


It's an image I found on Fark months ago. I'm not going to cry myself to sleep over it. If there were tablets even earlier then that's just more proof Apple didn't invent them.
 
kab
2013-01-20 04:28:16 PM

Popcorn Johnny: A tablet/laptop combo is exactly what everybody wants.


You have an unusual definition of 'everybody'.

Here's the issue. PC users, as well as general consumers, have a 'good enough' point. W7 felt like a needed upgrade for most users wanting to move over to 64 bit and use larger amounts of memory. But there's very little out there from an app or hardware point of view that really makes people say 'hey, this is making me consider an OS upgrade', especially when the GUI in W8 is considered more of a drawback than anything.

In short, it's simply too new, too different, and unnecessary for most users. Hence, it will be considered a dud, even if most of that is word-of-mouth opinion.
 
2013-01-20 04:31:42 PM

kab: You have an unusual definition of 'everybody'.


Tablets are outselling desktops and laptops these days. Yeah, everybody.
 
2013-01-20 04:34:37 PM

natmar_76: As soon as you take away a consumer's ability to build their own device from component parts, you take away their power. You take away their bargaining position, their ability to comparison shop. You take away their ability to haggle price, to get the most for their money. You force them to choose one of two solutions: Microsoft or Apple.

There is a reason Apple and other companies want to sell you hardware that is proprietary, closed, and all hardwired onto one board. That way they can overprice it and you can't do anything about it. You can't just yank out the malfunctioning memory stick and replace it with another, a cost of only $30. If it's under warranty, you can get a limited warranty refurb, sure. If it's not under warranty, you'll be paying several hundred dollars for a new one though. That's in their interest, not yours.

That's why Apple pays so much attention to case design. Because they know a consumer will choose against their own interest if the thing is shiny and smooth and curvy enough. They'll pay out the nose for it, and they'll ask for more.

That's why I'll post this message every time some "tech writer" writes one of these stupid articles.


This is why traditional desktop PCs are going to be around for a long time. I bought my XP PC in 2001 from a PC store. Three months later the power supply died. Though it was under warranty it was far quicker and easier for me to walk into Maplins (sort of like Radio Shack) and say "Power supply for a PC" and have the guy hand one over without even needing to ask what make it was. Cost me £17 (about $25) and that lasted five years until I needed to replace it when I upgraded the mobo and needed more power. Over the next ten years I upgraded everything in that PC at least once apart from the case and the floppy drive. I still use it as my second PC. Repairing or upgrading it is like playing LEGO, you can just swap parts around with ease.

I also had a Sony all in one PC that I picked up very cheap. It's PSU died, and the thing became a paperweight. It's PSU was a one-off Sony design that only they sold and they charged a couple of hundred pounds for it.

Thanks to IBM deciding to build their first PC quickly using off the shelf parts we still have to this day the ability to fix and upgrade PCs with ease that no other consumer product can match.
 
2013-01-20 04:37:34 PM

zeroeffect: Newton


Eat up Martha.
 
2013-01-20 04:40:10 PM

Popcorn Johnny: Seequinn: Had they left Desktop alone

OMFG they took my start button!


If you bought a new Ford and found they'd hidden the ignition key in the glove box or behind the passenger seat you'd complain.

It was the main control for opening programmes, settings, searches etc. They took it away and replaced it with making you move the mouse to a hidden corner for some uses, a different corner for other uses, and having to slide down from those corners for other uses again.

If you had to reach over to the glove box to start your new car you'd get over it. But why should you when leaving the key on the steering wheel, where you are used to it being and where it is quick and easy to reach is far better?
 
2013-01-20 04:47:57 PM

Flint Ironstag: Vaneshi: Flint Ironstag: [img252.imageshack.us image 724x432]


You're going to have to change some of the dates around, 2002 sounds very late; I distinctly remember 'Pen Editions' of Win3.1x.

If you're going to try and bait people you should at least do so in a way that doesn't make you look like an idiot hmm?

It's an image I found on Fark months ago. I'm not going to cry myself to sleep over it. If there were tablets even earlier then that's just more proof Apple didn't invent them.


Alexander Graham Bell didn't invent the telephone and Edison didn't invent the light bulb. People who get credit for major inventions usually aren't the first person to think of it but the first to market and sell it effectively.
 
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