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(A letter to some guy)   "Where's my magic button, the switch I can flip to show men like you what it feels like on the other side of your 'jokes' and 'compliments'?"   (rolereboot.org) divider line 1001
    More: Scary, Liam Payne, female politicians, magic, patriarchy  
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22238 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Jan 2013 at 8:58 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-19 09:36:04 PM

Bored Horde: WhippingBoy: DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: DrPainMD: Don't worry DNWPG. If your real-life personality is anything like your Fark personality, they'll leave you alone as soon as they get to know you.

Yea, because the last guy who groped my ass in a crowded subway car wanted to know what I thought of the dual Higgs discovery, you moron.

Do you think that this doesn't happen to men? When I was younger, I had my ass groped (without my consent) a number of times. I imagine that men who are more attractive then me have experienced this even more.

Groping a woman carries the implicit threat of rape in a way that a woman groping a man doesn't. However uncomfortable you felt being groped, remember that women are taught that it's their fault they got groped, that all men are groping raping monsters and it's the woman's fault if they let them get close.

For you, it was the simple act of violation of your body. For women, it's that AND a reminder that their body's positive assets belong to society.


That's what it is to self-obsessed professional victims, and maybe women sold as sex slaves in bad movies. To everyone else....notsomuch.
 
2013-01-19 09:36:09 PM

ElectricPeterTork: cryinoutloud:

/the ignore list is the greatest thing on Fark

Here's a handy translation for this type of comment we've seen from so many who love bragging about the size of their *ahem* ignore list (sounds kind of like a male thing, doesn't it... bragging about size...)

I ONLY WANT TO READ THINGS FROM PEOPLE WITH LIKEMINDED VIEWPOINTS!!! HOW DARE YOU DISAGREE WITH ME!

/Remember, kids, anyone who brags about their ignore list is generally someone whose opinion means nothing in the first place... less than the opinion of those people who are ignored by the high and mighty.


The ignore list is a tool for the closed minded people.
 
2013-01-19 09:39:37 PM

Benjimin_Dover: ElectricPeterTork: cryinoutloud:

/the ignore list is the greatest thing on Fark

Here's a handy translation for this type of comment we've seen from so many who love bragging about the size of their *ahem* ignore list (sounds kind of like a male thing, doesn't it... bragging about size...)

I ONLY WANT TO READ THINGS FROM PEOPLE WITH LIKEMINDED VIEWPOINTS!!! HOW DARE YOU DISAGREE WITH ME!

/Remember, kids, anyone who brags about their ignore list is generally someone whose opinion means nothing in the first place... less than the opinion of those people who are ignored by the high and mighty.

The ignore list is a tool for the closed minded people.


Actually, it's a great way to cut out the crap of known trolls who provide nothing of substance to any thread they shiat in. I don't want to waste my time having to skim through their bullshiat.
 
2013-01-19 09:40:58 PM

dopekitty74: As a woman with woman friends, I can confidently say that not one of us lives in fear every day of being raped. And the funny thing is, the girls I hang out with, like me, have lots of male friends, who joke around and say sexual things and we don't get all offended about it. If we're in public and some douche yells out "Hey baby, why don't you suck my dick?" we either ignore them or laugh derisively and make comments about what a prick he is. We don't get all victimy like half the women in this thread seem to think is the thing to do.


Unpossible. I've just been told that moronic unwanted comments from men are indicators of imminent rape. According to the perpetually offended commenters in this thread, you don't exist.
 
2013-01-19 09:45:57 PM

Bored Horde: WhippingBoy: Bored Horde: In the business world, if you're a man, as long as your hair is short and under control, everyone ignores it. It's a check box item. Women's hair gets graded. Men's clothing is the same - it's pass/fail, either the suit is clean, pressed, and fits or it's bad. Women's clothing gets graded for appearance, fashion, and riding the thin line between dowdy and slutty.

Are you sure about this? Do you have anything to back it up instead of your personal impressions or a ranting post from Jezebel?

Yes - this is basic perceptual research into photos of people, established in the 20th century and now a staple item of undergraduate introductory projects because the experiment is completely understood, the results fully analyzed, and it's still repeatable with the same findings.

Men's hair attracts comments like "professional" or "unprofessional", women's hair attracts comments like "fashionable" "stylish" "flirty" "professional" - it's graded on a spectrum. Again, if you've never understood this stuff and have any interest in learning what it's like to live as a woman in the Western world, then go read some books on the matter. You're not going to get a comprehensive education from a Fark thread, you're going to read a few nuggest of perspective among a flowing river of shiat from the internet misogynists.


So, your saying that women are allowed a greater range of expression and even opportunity in a lot of ways, whereas men are held to inflexible, dehumanizing roles....and this is evidence of oppression of women? Even though outside of a few narrow career paths (where men are held to just as high, if less varied standards), it's generally a matter of personal choice?

Jeez, how farking terrible they have it.

Funny how feminists use what very little actual science they do to completely misinterpret reality....
....I just hope I never have to fight in a war, because the women in my life will be the REAL victims if I die! (thanks, Hillary Clinton, for dehumanizing the men you send to their deaths, you're a great feminist!)
 
2013-01-19 09:52:41 PM

Bored Horde: Oblio13: I've made a list of things Angry Feminists like about men:

Who are "Angry Feminists" other then a strawman you've summoned forth to excuse your shiatty attitudes?

Oh look at me I'm a poor oppressed man, curse my every advantage.


Every advantage.....lols. You actually believe that idiot dogshiat.

Bored Horde: someonelse: letrole: Sexual harrassment is the wrong man noticing your tits.

You can't troll a thread where the most blatantly ignorant opinions are already being expressed in earnest, dude. You can't make a sh*thouse smell worse.

It's true. It's The Onion's problem. When Republicans elected to the Federal Government are lamenting the dearth of rights we give Rapists over the women they've raped, how can you satirize life?


Okay, there it is......an idiot and a disgusting liar for political purposes. What a surprise!

.
 
2013-01-19 09:54:34 PM

Buffalo77: ...I'm not a feminist...


You don't believe women should have the right to vote or equal pay? That's what "feminism" is, though I believe you're confusing it for "misandry".
 
2013-01-19 10:11:17 PM
Well, this thread ended up pretty much the way I thought it would.

Sadly.
 
2013-01-19 10:11:52 PM

tirob: I must have misinterpreted you, because in the above paragraph you do indeed appear to me to claim that a generally audible comment directed at a single person does not constitute disorderly conduct.


generally audible =/= disruptive or disorderly

loud and obnoxious attention grabbing = disruptive and disorderly

There is a distinct difference in concept that you're failing to grasp there.

Pincy: Women should continue to speak out when they are harassed but it's not their job to make men stop harassing them, that's up to men. It's evident from this very thread that there is still way too much victim blaming and not enough self-reflection.


Hypocrisy at it's finest.

Pincy: I'm not calling myself a sexist pig.


You would be if you were intelligent and honest, you're rationalizing sexist behavior, dictating what men are responsible for even if they're not part of it.(see bold, again....this is getting old.)
 
2013-01-19 10:37:32 PM

Pincy: THE GREAT NAME: toomuchmarisa: [img685.imageshack.us image 300x391]

Jesus farking christ I am SO TIRED of women complaining all the time about everything. If you're an attractive woman you are like a celebrity, and celebrities have to deal with getting harassed in public. Period. On the other hand, you are also A FARKING CELEBRITY, which has a plethora of perks.

This is how life goes, there are upsides and downsides to everything. Incessantly complaining about the negative aspects, especially while ignoring the positives, just makes you look like a whiny, spoiled, and naive 12 year old. Grow the fark up.

/life is hard
//welcome to the real world
///rich white people problems ftl

Feminists like Pincy ensure women have no challenges in life, and hence no reason to grow up. At least until it is too late. Feminism's gift to women is a poisoned chalice.

I take it you are implying that being called a feminist is a bad thing?

And yes, in a perfect world, I don't think women should have to have the "challenge" of trying not to be raped. If that makes me a bad person then so be it.


1.bp.blogspot.com

It is frustrating that people like you make discussions which are largely about sexual harassment into discussions about rape. Can the two be related? Of course. However, the OVERWHELMING majority of people who engage in sexual harassment (of the kind discussed in the article) do not commit rape. This is highlighted by the author herself, who speaks of countless harassment encounters, but no rapes.

You remind me of the people who fiercely ensure that any debate over the politics of Hilary Clinton or Barack Obama become debates about feminism or racism. It's narrow-minded and utterly unproductive.
 
2013-01-19 10:45:48 PM

Wayne 985: You don't believe women should have the right to vote or equal pay? That's what "feminism" is, though I believe you're confusing it for "misandry".


I believe in equal rights and equal opportunity because I'm a humanist. And it has nothing to do with feminism. For example, I also support eliminating sentencing disparities between genders (men get sentenced to 275% more prison time for the same crimes). Something feminists are dead silent about, and even biatch about when it is brought up. In short, I believe in equal rights in a true sense, across the board, which is why I could never be a feminist.
 
2013-01-19 10:54:30 PM

toomuchmarisa: You remind me of the people who fiercely ensure that any debate over the politics of Hilary Clinton or Barack Obama become debates about feminism or racism.


and presidential rape fantasies

every single time
 
2013-01-19 10:56:32 PM

ThrobblefootSpectre: Wayne 985: You don't believe women should have the right to vote or equal pay? That's what "feminism" is, though I believe you're confusing it for "misandry".

I believe in equal rights and equal opportunity because I'm a humanist. And it has nothing to do with feminism. For example, I also support eliminating sentencing disparities between genders (men get sentenced to 275% more prison time for the same crimes). Something feminists are dead silent about, and even biatch about when it is brought up. In short, I believe in equal rights in a true sense, across the board, which is why I could never be a feminist.


You're applying your own definition to a word that already has one. If you're a humanist, then by nature you're also a feminist.
 
2013-01-19 11:06:42 PM

PsiChick: Bisu: You DON'T have to teach her that. Now she'll end up as cold and bitter as you. You're definitely not close to the "fine line." You're pretty clearly on one side of it.

And how you choose to see men is pathetic. Because not 100% of guilty men are found guilty of their crimes, you claim you HAVE to treat ALL MEN like they are guilty. That's some great logic there. So it's better for tens of millions of innocent men to be seen as guilty than thousands of guilty men to be seen as innocent? So you believe in the OPPOSITE of Blackstone's formulation.

I HOPE HOPE HOPE you are trolling or exaggerating.

I love this logic. "B-b-but I'M not a rapist! How can you not see that I'M a sweet, sensitive guy who just chose to try and flirt on the bus! WHY ARE YOU SUCH A COLD BIATCH?!"

Well, here's the thing: Rapists don't come with warning signs. And since there's a bat's chance in hell anyone will punish the rapist if a woman is raped (never mind that nobody tries to prevent the rape in the first place), what other option is there? If you chat me up on a bus and I chat back, guess who gets blamed if you rape me? It ain't you, bud.

But hey, congrats on supporting a system where 94% of  actual literal rapes, according to the FBI, are never reported because of that exact mentality.


And here comes the FEMINIST MATH. Where it is suddenly possible to quantify UNREPORTED CRIMES, and come up with an unrealistically huge number!. (and flog them around for political purposes, knowing they aren't real).

The idea that rape is not taken seriously by law enforcement and the courts is one of the most pernicious feminist lies. Nobody can say for sure how many rapes go unreported, but if the 94% number doesn't ring your warning bells, you're a moron. Especially considering other research that says the majority by far of known rapes are pedophilic....parents just not following up? Really? I know three rape victims(including one male)....not one failed to report. (anecdotal, I know, but you'd think there would be ONE.) No failed convictions, either, although one perp committed suicide rather than face jail as a rapist.

You want to get away with rape or sexual assault? Be a woman and coerce an unwilling male, or sexually abuse your kids.

Rape is taken very seriously in western societies. It is harshly punished, and accusations, even if completely false, tend to ruin lives...yet some feminists are already pushing for the standards of evidence to be reversed in rape cases....meaning an accusation is a conviction, unless there is definitive, airtight proof of innocence. In addition to "shield laws" already in place.

Feminists and government orgs love to make up ridiculous numbers about rape...this is common knowledge for the non-kool-aid crowd. If you hear about 1 in 4 women being assaulted in college, or 1 in 6 being raped in their lifetime, it's FEMINIST MATH.

The only studies that get to numbers like 1 in 6 women being raped do so by using self-selecting surveys (people who don't fit the profile generally don't complete them). Then they never ask if a woman was raped, they ask about having sex and "feeling abused" or "feeling taken advantage of" the next day, or asking if they drank alcohol. Then THEY decide who was raped, with no personal knowledge. Generally, only a quarter or less of the women identified as rape victims actually identify themselves as victims.

Also, neat little tricks to boost numbers....if a couple of teens are making out, and heavy petting is occurring, and a fingertip goes in, that is considered rape, even if there was consent and then revoked consent, and no type of force or coercion, or refusal to stop.

The best real rape numbers anyone can really come up with usually amount to at worst, 1 in 17-20 women being raped (still with some questionable definitions, though).

Same kind of numbers juggling for "sexual assault" and domestic abuse Define it so that it means "a man did something to a woman that she didn't like". Hey presto! A SEXUAL ASSAULT AND ABUSE EPIDEMIC!

Feminist math even extends to family court, and "abuse" allegations. The real numbers, non-redacted and fairly compared, say that women are just as abusive as men, and tend to hit first. They also abuse children more than men, by a good margin. But arrests, conviction rates, and sentences are a fraction of those for men.
Some lawyers with years if experience in family courts estimate that up to 50% of abuse and sexual abuse allegations in divorce cases are false. But that won't stop a judge from his social duty of white knighting and male punishment.

But sure....94% of rape victims don't report it to authorities....I guess that's a usable number, if your main goal is to scare the shiat out of women and demonize men without regard for truth or consequences. But given the reliability of feminist math, I have a hard time believing it.
 
2013-01-19 11:13:02 PM

Wayne 985: If you're a humanist, then by nature you're also a feminist.


I don't think they are necessarily overlapping sets. As I mentioned, there are some equal rights issues that feminists seem to not only be silent about, but downright hostile to discussing. So in the venn digram, count me in the part of the group that wants equal rights for everyone. Not feminists.
 
2013-01-19 11:15:04 PM

toomuchmarisa: Pincy: THE GREAT NAME: toomuchmarisa: [img685.imageshack.us image 300x391]

Jesus farking christ I am SO TIRED of women complaining all the time about everything. If you're an attractive woman you are like a celebrity, and celebrities have to deal with getting harassed in public. Period. On the other hand, you are also A FARKING CELEBRITY, which has a plethora of perks.

This is how life goes, there are upsides and downsides to everything. Incessantly complaining about the negative aspects, especially while ignoring the positives, just makes you look like a whiny, spoiled, and naive 12 year old. Grow the fark up.

/life is hard
//welcome to the real world
///rich white people problems ftl

Feminists like Pincy ensure women have no challenges in life, and hence no reason to grow up. At least until it is too late. Feminism's gift to women is a poisoned chalice.

I take it you are implying that being called a feminist is a bad thing?

And yes, in a perfect world, I don't think women should have to have the "challenge" of trying not to be raped. If that makes me a bad person then so be it.

[1.bp.blogspot.com image 460x278]

It is frustrating that people like you make discussions which are largely about sexual harassment into discussions about rape. Can the two be related? Of course. However, the OVERWHELMING majority of people who engage in sexual harassment (of the kind discussed in the article) do not commit rape. This is highlighted by the author herself, who speaks of countless harassment encounters, but no rapes.

You remind me of the people who fiercely ensure that any debate over the politics of Hilary Clinton or Barack Obama become debates about feminism or racism. It's narrow-minded and utterly unproductive.


Ya, most sexual harassment does not end in rape, didn't mean to imply that it does. A lot of people in this thread are trying to make the argument that sexual harassment toward women isn't really that much of a big deal because men can be sexually harassed as well and men don't freak out about it. Seems to me there is quite the difference between the two though. I'm guessing most men never even consider the possibility that harassment from a women could escalate and thus are able to laugh it off. The woman in the article was trying to tell men that she can't always laugh it off, partly because there is always a threat of escalation. I asked my wife about this and she seemed to agree. I've heard other women say the same thing. So I'm giving the author the benefit of the doubt.

So ya, I suppose it is easy to start talking about violence and rape when discussing sexual harassment. But to me at least, it seems like that threat is the main reason why men and women experience sexual harassment differently.
 
2013-01-19 11:23:42 PM

ThrobblefootSpectre: Wayne 985: If you're a humanist, then by nature you're also a feminist.

I don't think they are necessarily overlapping sets. As I mentioned, there are some equal rights issues that feminists seem to not only be silent about, but downright hostile to discussing. So in the venn digram, count me in the part of the group that wants equal rights for everyone. Not feminists.


I think that person is confused, or equivocating, what feminism can mean. It can be anything from flagrant misandry to something more benign and more relative to humanism(In that women are "behind" in some area's relative to men, ie wage disparity). There is an overlap, but there are parts of feminism entirely outside the scope of humanism.
 
2013-01-19 11:25:48 PM

Canned Tamales: PsiChick: Bisu: You DON'T have to teach her that. Now she'll end up as cold and bitter as you. You're definitely not close to the "fine line." You're pretty clearly on one side of it.

And how you choose to see men is pathetic. Because not 100% of guilty men are found guilty of their crimes, you claim you HAVE to treat ALL MEN like they are guilty. That's some great logic there. So it's better for tens of millions of innocent men to be seen as guilty than thousands of guilty men to be seen as innocent? So you believe in the OPPOSITE of Blackstone's formulation.

I HOPE HOPE HOPE you are trolling or exaggerating.

I love this logic. "B-b-but I'M not a rapist! How can you not see that I'M a sweet, sensitive guy who just chose to try and flirt on the bus! WHY ARE YOU SUCH A COLD BIATCH?!"

Well, here's the thing: Rapists don't come with warning signs. And since there's a bat's chance in hell anyone will punish the rapist if a woman is raped (never mind that nobody tries to prevent the rape in the first place), what other option is there? If you chat me up on a bus and I chat back, guess who gets blamed if you rape me? It ain't you, bud.

But hey, congrats on supporting a system where 94% of  actual literal rapes, according to the FBI, are never reported because of that exact mentality.

And here comes the FEMINIST MATH. Where it is suddenly possible to quantify UNREPORTED CRIMES, and come up with an unrealistically huge number!. (and flog them around for political purposes, knowing they aren't real).

The idea that rape is not taken seriously by law enforcement and the courts is one of the most pernicious feminist lies. Nobody can say for sure how many rapes go unreported, but if the 94% number doesn't ring your warning bells, you're a moron. Especially considering other research that says the majority by far of known rapes are pedophilic....parents just not following up? Really? I know three rape victims(including one male)....not one failed to report. (anecdot ...


Wow. That's one of the most impressive conspiracy theories I've seen all day. You forgot to throw out 'sheeple', though.
 
2013-01-19 11:33:31 PM

PsiChick: Wow. That's one of the most impressive conspiracy theories I've seen all day.


Wow. That's one of the most heinously intellectually dishonest excuses I've read all day.
 
2013-01-19 11:39:44 PM

omeganuepsilon: ThrobblefootSpectre: Wayne 985: If you're a humanist, then by nature you're also a feminist.

I don't think they are necessarily overlapping sets. As I mentioned, there are some equal rights issues that feminists seem to not only be silent about, but downright hostile to discussing. So in the venn digram, count me in the part of the group that wants equal rights for everyone. Not feminists.

I think that person is confused, or equivocating, what feminism can mean. It can be anything from flagrant misandry to something more benign and more relative to humanism(In that women are "behind" in some area's relative to men, ie wage disparity). There is an overlap, but there are parts of feminism entirely outside the scope of humanism.


I rely of the dictionary's definition of the term: "The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men."

I know a lot of people in society remain uncomfortable with women asserting themselves, and therefore "feminism" has come to mean "radical man-hater", but that's irrelevant.
 
2013-01-19 11:43:49 PM

omeganuepsilon: PsiChick: Wow. That's one of the most impressive conspiracy theories I've seen all day.

Wow. That's one of the most heinously intellectually dishonest excuses I've read all day.


So here's our options:

A) The FBI is lying, and  literally no agency in the world has  ever called them on it. Because a conspiracy against men involving the entire government isn't a human rights violation or anything.

B) The FBI, which has access to  insane amounts of information, and are probably counting each rape as separate (i.e. a marital rape case with three rapes across a week equals three rapes),and therefore have discovered that, logically, when a woman is raped by someone she cares about, she does not tend to report it (and probably that the same goes for men).

Occam's Razor, anybody?
 
2013-01-19 11:46:47 PM

omeganuepsilon: PsiChick: Wow. That's one of the most impressive conspiracy theories I've seen all day.

Wow. That's one of the most heinously intellectually dishonest excuses I've read all day.


You're arguing with someone who, among other things, believes that she's psychic. You're wasting valuable seconds of your life.
 
2013-01-19 11:55:43 PM
Am I the only one who found it incredulous that they weren't drunk when they're discussing where to get tacos well after dinner time after leaving a bar? I'm betting they were both over the legal limit, and consequently her perception and judgement were impaired.
 
2013-01-20 12:03:32 AM

Wayne 985: I rely of the dictionary's definition of the term: "The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men."


Now, we just need people to push for women to take RESPONSIBILITY equal to men., and we'll be all set.
 
2013-01-20 12:03:54 AM
Or she could just stop biatching and take a lesson from Dixie Carter in Designing Women:
There's no need for introductions, Ray Don. We know who you are...
 
2013-01-20 12:06:10 AM

fredklein: Wayne 985: I rely of the dictionary's definition of the term: "The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men."

Now, we just need people to push for women to take RESPONSIBILITY equal to men., and we'll be all set.


Go on...
 
2013-01-20 12:07:44 AM

PsiChick: The FBI, which has access to insane amounts of information


Some of the FBI's information about rape since you seem to like them as a source:

"Every year since 1989, in about 25 percent of the sexual assault cases referred to the FBI where results could be obtained, the primary suspect has been excluded by forensic DNA testing. Specifically, FBI officials report that out of roughly 10,000 sexual assault cases since 1989, about 2,000 tests have been inconclusive, about 2,000 tests have excluded the primary suspect, and about 6,000 have "matched" or included the primary suspect."

Statistically speaking a man accused of rape only has his DNA match the DNA found in the sperm of the woman accusing him of rape 60% of the time. Can you back up your claim that the FBI says 94% of all rapes aren't reported, or is this another one of those 1 in 4 woman have been raped claims?

FUD is FUD and bullshiat claims like 94% of all rapes go unreported are what cause people like the author of the story to walk around thinking that random men are going to rape her. Not a rape apologist, I've had female and male friends get raped and it's reprehensible. But let's get real here and quit blowing things out of context.
 
2013-01-20 12:11:23 AM

Wayne 985: I know a lot of people in society remain uncomfortable with women asserting themselves, and therefore "feminism" has come to mean "radical man-hater", but that's irrelevant.


It has also garnered a stigma because actual "man-haters" self identify under the more credible "feminism", allying themselves with a more respectable cause. There are a few in this thread, therefore, not irrelevant.

Wayne 985: I rely of the dictionary's definition of the term


That is why you fail, classic equivocation fallacy. Misandrists do exist, pretending otherwise only makes you look willfully ignorant.

WhippingBoy:
You're arguing with someone who, among other things, believes that she's psychic. You're wasting valuable seconds of your life.


Oh, I know its reputation. I've got the time to spare, though I am about to go to bed.

PsiChick: Occam's Razor, anybody?


Appeal to authority
Straw Man
Completely ignoring any and all points of the original post (How exactly do you quantify unreported rapes?)
Reduction to Absurdity
Among others throughout the thread I'm sure...

If you want to be taken with any seriousness, don't shift the topic, don't misdirect, don't ....creatively paraphrase. Simply deal with the points made. It's really simple if you've got any sort of intelligence and are actually correct.
Makes it sort of obvious when you dance around the topic so much with the wookie defense.
 
2013-01-20 12:19:12 AM
Holy fark, this is a creepy thread. So much anger towards the author. I'm not sure whether to put some of you on ignore, or tag you so I can keep an eye on you in the future,
 
2013-01-20 12:25:49 AM

omeganuepsilon: That is why you fail, classic equivocation fallacy. Misandrists do exist, pretending otherwise only makes you look willfully ignorant.


Speaking of looking ignorant, you may wish to re-read what I wrote, because I singled out misandry specifically (acknowledging its existence).
 
2013-01-20 12:36:48 AM

Theaetetus: Holy fark, this is a creepy thread. So much anger towards the author. I'm not sure whether to put some of you on ignore, or tag you so I can keep an eye on you in the future,


The article struck a nerve, more so with men then women. Frankly I'm rather surprised how big it got, so obviously this is something that people feel strongly about. All things considered I'm inclined to think the author of the article was trolling men just for lulz. If it makes you feel any better I've seen plenty of articles on Fark where the women had plenty to say about the men as well.

In my case I never defended the men that made cat calls or the like. My issues were with the presumption that women don't like getting hit on. I've had enough female friends over the years to know that they hate becoming invisible, and you'd have to be blind to miss the billions of dollars spent advertising products to make invisible women look younger. My bigger point was more that it's women giving other women a hard time far more often than it is the men.
 
2013-01-20 12:37:14 AM

Theaetetus: Holy fark, this is a creepy thread. So much anger towards the author. I'm not sure whether to put some of you on ignore, or tag you so I can keep an eye on you in the future,


Why don't you accuse us of perpetrating the crime in question. You're quite good at that.
 
2013-01-20 12:39:22 AM

omeganuepsilon: PsiChick: Occam's Razor, anybody?

Appeal to authority
Straw Man
Completely ignoring any and all points of the original post (How exactly do you quantify unreported rapes?)
Reduction to Absurdity
Among others throughout the thread I'm sure...

If you want to be taken with any seriousness, don't shift the topic, don't misdirect, don't ....creatively paraphrase. Simply deal with the points made. It's really simple if you've got any sort of intelligence and are actually correct.
Makes it sort of obvious when you dance around the topic so much with the wookie defense.


So you can't read, nice. My point is that the FBI has access to more databases than what you or I do. Interestingly enough, I apparently misread the article. It wasn't the FBI, it was RAINN, an organization which  would have more access to informal statements to the FBI, making the claim: Linky. I don't know if you've ever read a thread where Fark discusses child abuse, but people are  more willing to talk about illegal activity when there's anonymity. If you read the rest of the article, you'll notice that part of the problem is that women are raped by people they care about. It's hard to bring up something that could result in charges for people they still love.

onyxruby: PsiChick: The FBI, which has access to insane amounts of information

Some of the FBI's information about rape since you seem to like them as a source:

"Every year since 1989, in about 25 percent of the sexual assault cases referred to the FBI where results could be obtained, the primary suspect has been excluded by forensic DNA testing. Specifically, FBI officials report that out of roughly 10,000 sexual assault cases since 1989, about 2,000 tests have been inconclusive, about 2,000 tests have excluded the primary suspect, and about 6,000 have "matched" or included the primary suspect."

Statistically speaking a man accused of rape only has his DNA match the DNA found in the sperm of the woman accusing him of rape 60% of the time. Can you back up your claim that the FBI says 94% of all rapes aren't reported, or is this another one of those 1 in 4 woman have been raped claims?

FUD is FUD and bullshiat claims like 94% of all rapes go unreported are what cause people like the author of the story to walk around thinking that random men are going to rape her. Not a rape apologist, I've had female and male friends get raped and it's reprehensible. But let's get real here and quit blowing things out of context.


Welp, scroll up and read what I just told the other dude.

Also, you might care to note that the statistics for 1996 just  maybe aren't the same as the statistic for  2012. Or anything even in the same  decade.
 
2013-01-20 12:39:37 AM

The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: UlandaUnicorn: As a 'decent looking' woman, I cry foul at the author. She travels the world and everywhere she goes men follow her and salivate? Doubt it. Get over yourself. You are absolutely paranoid. Rape happens. It isn't something you can prepare for. You can't live life with your kind of mindset and actually enjoy living. Is rape okay? No. Can you change the world with your whining? No. Enjoy your youth while you can because what you don't want is to die tomorrow and everyone know you as the girl who was everyone's victim.

So don't talk about rape and the culture that allows it?


Or... quit pretending that western women face daily oppression, and quit pretending that western culture is rape-encouraging.

Making up pseudo-scientific dogshiat to force your politics on others and police their choices and speech is not the same as "talking about rape." Demanding a return to Victorian mores so that a few women never feel uncomfortable is not "talking about rape".

modern feminism=patriarchy, except with the added bonus of absolutely no benefit for men, just the joy of being the socialist workhorse with no family rights. It's a sport for rich white women who don't think the world has handed them enough of other people's stuff.
 
2013-01-20 12:41:44 AM

PsiChick: omeganuepsilon: PsiChick: words ...


Disclaimer: I'm not saying there aren't false accusations, especially if there's other factors like drugs involved (let's be honest, you can't ID someone if you're too doped to remember their face). I'm saying that's the wrong statistic. There certainly are false accusations and\or mistaken identity. But that's not the bigger problem.
 
2013-01-20 12:43:14 AM

onyxruby: My issues were with the presumption that women don't like getting hit on.


This article wasn't about a woman getting "hit on".
 
2013-01-20 12:44:25 AM

DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: It's amazing to me how many sexual harassment apologists there are in this thread.

To sum them up:

1. The haters. Women are screwed up and delusional, they really WANT the harassment, they'll miss the attention when they get old. What are women worried about? Men would love that kind of attention!
2. The ad hominem. The author of TFA is an obese hack who is lying or just an attention whore.
3. The deniers. They never heard of this kind of behavior and neither has their sister/wife/whatever, so TFA must be exaggerated.
4. The equivocators. Men have it as bad if not worse than women, so this author is complaining about nothing at all. Men suffer more.
5. The straw men : they believe the author is insinuating all men are rapists, therefore this made-up position is wrong and the article is wrong.
6. The resigned. It's just society/fashion/life, so women like the author should just deal with it. Complaints are useless.

I think I got most of them.


yeah, except they're not categories for your dishonest, shiat-eating checklist...they are other human beings, who don't agree with you, and you can't come up with anything to rebut them except idiocy and your continued worshipping at the altar of victimhood. (as long as it's women victims, of course).
 
2013-01-20 12:46:46 AM

The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: Smackledorfer: /would love to have strangers comment on my looks.

Because you need validation from complete strangers why?


Maybe because not everybody is an over-privileged anti-social asshole looking to take offense at everything anyone else does without their permission? They don't hate first and ask questions later?
 
2013-01-20 12:46:53 AM

Canned Tamales: The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: UlandaUnicorn: As a 'decent looking' woman, I cry foul at the author. She travels the world and everywhere she goes men follow her and salivate? Doubt it. Get over yourself. You are absolutely paranoid. Rape happens. It isn't something you can prepare for. You can't live life with your kind of mindset and actually enjoy living. Is rape okay? No. Can you change the world with your whining? No. Enjoy your youth while you can because what you don't want is to die tomorrow and everyone know you as the girl who was everyone's victim.

So don't talk about rape and the culture that allows it?

Or... quit pretending that western women face daily oppression, and quit pretending that western culture is rape-encouraging.

Making up pseudo-scientific dogshiat to force your politics on others and police their choices and speech is not the same as "talking about rape." Demanding a return to Victorian mores so that a few women never feel uncomfortable is not "talking about rape".

modern feminism=patriarchy, except with the added bonus of absolutely no benefit for men, just the joy of being the socialist workhorse with no family rights. It's a sport for rich white women who don't think the world has handed them enough of other people's stuff.


We get it, women are making shiat up, this stuff almost never happens.
 
2013-01-20 12:48:48 AM
fake
 
2013-01-20 12:49:16 AM

Canned Tamales: The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: Smackledorfer: /would love to have strangers comment on my looks.

Because you need validation from complete strangers why?

Maybe because not everybody is an over-privileged anti-social asshole looking to take offense at everything anyone else does without their permission? They don't hate first and ask questions later?


Do you love to have strangers comment on your looks? If so why? If not, then you can't really answer my question now can you.
 
2013-01-20 12:49:54 AM

Canned Tamales: DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: It's amazing to me how many sexual harassment apologists there are in this thread.

To sum them up:

1. The haters. Women are screwed up and delusional, they really WANT the harassment, they'll miss the attention when they get old. What are women worried about? Men would love that kind of attention!
2. The ad hominem. The author of TFA is an obese hack who is lying or just an attention whore.
3. The deniers. They never heard of this kind of behavior and neither has their sister/wife/whatever, so TFA must be exaggerated.
4. The equivocators. Men have it as bad if not worse than women, so this author is complaining about nothing at all. Men suffer more.
5. The straw men : they believe the author is insinuating all men are rapists, therefore this made-up position is wrong and the article is wrong.
6. The resigned. It's just society/fashion/life, so women like the author should just deal with it. Complaints are useless.

I think I got most of them.

yeah, except they're not categories for your dishonest, shiat-eating checklist...they are other human beings, who don't agree with you, and you can't come up with anything to rebut them except idiocy and your continued worshipping at the altar of victimhood. (as long as it's women victims, of course).


Well, you just qualified for 2, 4, and 5.
 
2013-01-20 12:53:20 AM

The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: We get it, women are making shiat up, this stuff almost never happens.


Kind of sucks when people trivialize what, to you, are real problems, doesn't it?
 
2013-01-20 12:55:22 AM

toomuchmarisa: Pincy: THE GREAT NAME: toomuchmarisa: [img685.imageshack.us image 300x391]

Jesus farking christ I am SO TIRED of women complaining all the time about everything. If you're an attractive woman you are like a celebrity, and celebrities have to deal with getting harassed in public. Period. On the other hand, you are also A FARKING CELEBRITY, which has a plethora of perks.

This is how life goes, there are upsides and downsides to everything. Incessantly complaining about the negative aspects, especially while ignoring the positives, just makes you look like a whiny, spoiled, and naive 12 year old. Grow the fark up.

/life is hard
//welcome to the real world
///rich white people problems ftl

Feminists like Pincy ensure women have no challenges in life, and hence no reason to grow up. At least until it is too late. Feminism's gift to women is a poisoned chalice.

I take it you are implying that being called a feminist is a bad thing?

And yes, in a perfect world, I don't think women should have to have the "challenge" of trying not to be raped. If that makes me a bad person then so be it.

[1.bp.blogspot.com image 460x278]

It is frustrating that people like you make discussions which are largely about sexual harassment into discussions about rape. Can the two be related? Of course. However, the OVERWHELMING majority of people who engage in sexual harassment (of the kind discussed in the article) do not commit rape. This is highlighted by the author herself, who speaks of countless harassment encounters, but no rapes.

You remind me of the people who fiercely ensure that any debate over the politics of Hilary Clinton or Barack Obama become debates about feminism or racism. It's narrow-minded and utterly unproductive.


I used to think that feminists would stop being such asshats if they realized that their idiocy and dishonesty was one of the major forces keeping loudmouth conservatives in the spotlight....then I realized that as long as we keep getting more socialism for womens' benefit, and less regard for men as people, (which our culture has no problem doing) they are happy to have the convenient "enemy" on hand. At least, the smart ones are. The dumb ones spend time vilifying random men, and men as a class, for no reason.

Good work, brave social justice warriors!
 
2013-01-20 01:00:28 AM

The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: Canned Tamales: The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: Smackledorfer: /would love to have strangers comment on my looks.

Because you need validation from complete strangers why?

Maybe because not everybody is an over-privileged anti-social asshole looking to take offense at everything anyone else does without their permission? They don't hate first and ask questions later?

Do you love to have strangers comment on your looks? If so why? If not, then you can't really answer my question now can you.


I certainly don't mind it. Why would I? I work around mostly women, they do it all the time, positively and negatively. But when women do it, it's not considered claiming some kind of power over men (even when that is the intent). But in feminist logic, ALL men have power over ALL women ALL of the time, and so a random pleasant comment (or polite criticism, or recognition of novelty, or anything) becomes a horrible weapon against a woman's self-image and a claim on her body. No man would ever spend a lot of time on his appearance and expect no feedback. That would be silly. Like feminism.
 
2013-01-20 01:01:59 AM

WhippingBoy: The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: We get it, women are making shiat up, this stuff almost never happens.

Kind of sucks when people trivialize what, to you, are real problems, doesn't it?


Yes, I admit it, men are the real victims of sexual harassment. If only I were born a woman.
 
2013-01-20 01:05:29 AM

Pincy: The woman in the article was trying to tell men that she can't always laugh it off, partly because there is always a threat of escalation


img692.imageshack.us

If I'm not mistaken (too lazy to re-read it), the vast majority of her examples, if not all of them, were in public with lots of other people around. If she lived in India, fair enough, but she doesn't.

On the other hand: If she's all alone, late at night, with no one around except a group of guys walking towards her, then we're talking about something completely different. However, as I mentioned, her examples were not of this nature. Accordingly, my initial reaction was as I posted, and that's why I don't think making the conversation about rape is appropriate, given the contexts that she herself put forward.

/haven't read other peoples' posts
//not trying to validate/invalidate their POVs
 
2013-01-20 01:05:54 AM

Wayne 985: ThrobblefootSpectre: Wayne 985: You don't believe women should have the right to vote or equal pay? That's what "feminism" is, though I believe you're confusing it for "misandry".

I believe in equal rights and equal opportunity because I'm a humanist. And it has nothing to do with feminism. For example, I also support eliminating sentencing disparities between genders (men get sentenced to 275% more prison time for the same crimes). Something feminists are dead silent about, and even biatch about when it is brought up. In short, I believe in equal rights in a true sense, across the board, which is why I could never be a feminist.

You're applying your own definition to a word that already has one. If you're a humanist, then by nature you're also a feminist.


BWAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA.....

Now THAT'S a great joke.

Humanists believe in equality for all. Feminism is a supremacy movement and social cult based on bad math, lies, pseudoscience and traditionalist gender roles hidden in rhetoric. Not the same.

Plus, humanists tend to be intelligent and concerned about others besides themselves.
 
2013-01-20 01:08:42 AM

Wayne 985: Canned Tamales: DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: It's amazing to me how many sexual harassment apologists there are in this thread.

To sum them up:

1. The haters. Women are screwed up and delusional, they really WANT the harassment, they'll miss the attention when they get old. What are women worried about? Men would love that kind of attention!
2. The ad hominem. The author of TFA is an obese hack who is lying or just an attention whore.
3. The deniers. They never heard of this kind of behavior and neither has their sister/wife/whatever, so TFA must be exaggerated.
4. The equivocators. Men have it as bad if not worse than women, so this author is complaining about nothing at all. Men suffer more.
5. The straw men : they believe the author is insinuating all men are rapists, therefore this made-up position is wrong and the article is wrong.
6. The resigned. It's just society/fashion/life, so women like the author should just deal with it. Complaints are useless.

I think I got most of them.

yeah, except they're not categories for your dishonest, shiat-eating checklist...they are other human beings, who don't agree with you, and you can't come up with anything to rebut them except idiocy and your continued worshipping at the altar of victimhood. (as long as it's women victims, of course).

Well, you just qualified for 2, 4, and 5.


Hell, why not go for all 6, it would be just as accurate.
 
2013-01-20 01:09:22 AM

The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: WhippingBoy: The Short Bald Guy from Benny Hill: We get it, women are making shiat up, this stuff almost never happens.

Kind of sucks when people trivialize what, to you, are real problems, doesn't it?

Yes, I admit it, men are the real victims of sexual harassment. If only I were born a woman.


That's not even remotely what I said, and you know it.
 
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