I actually like what little I've seen of the Surface - satisfied with my Android, so not going to swap soon - and probably would have bought one if I'd waited a year. MS's only mistake seems to have been coming a tad late to the picnic.

I also wonder why Microsoft decided to make hardware. The reason Microsoft owned the market in the 1990s was because its software would run on any Intel or AMD licensed hardware, while an Apple was an Apple was an Apple. Android seems to be doing now what Microsoft did 20 years ago, while Microsoft is chasing Apple. At least, that's the hasty conclusion I draw from the available marketing materials.

I could be wrong; I haven't used the Surface enough to know whether it's a pile of junk and probably won't as long as I can get more utility out of the Acer. But that's how I feel from the advertising I'm seeing. It makes Microsoft look out of touch.

fatbear: I'm jnProfessorOhki: fatbear: KFBR392: Owning an ipad is more about saying "I own an ipad" than it is about anything the ipad can do or the tech specs.

I'm going to guess you have no real use for a tablet. Most of the iPad owners truly couldn't give a fark about Apple OR the tech specs - it's about what they can *do* with the tablet.

The same tasks as everything else on the market, but while having something cool and newfangled? Tablet's have got some niche applications, but c'mon now don't be intentionally dense about the reality of the consumer market.

In a side-by-side comparison multiple tablets doing several tasks I needed to accomplish, the iPad came out faster, more usable, and more stable. In addition, I like the particular piece of software that's written for my most critical task, and it's iPad only - the Android competition is ok but not as good.

It's simple. I use what works best for me. I suspect most others do the same. I don't give a fark what tech I use as long as it gets the job done better than any reasonable alternative.

You seem to think I'm trying to say one brand of slate is superior to the other. What I'm actually saying is slates are gimmicky and only good for some super specific instances. If you're doing field work where there's not a table to be hand for miles, sure. If you're in an office. you're just wasting time because you think tablets are neat. If you're at home on the couch, whatever floats your boat, I guess... but let me know when you can hit a reasonable WPM on a tablet you haven't converted into an underpowered laptop with peripherals.

Now, convertible tablets I have some respect for and because of that, despite not being a fan of the OS, I hope the (non-RT) Surface products are successful; you can use them as a PC in the 99% cases where that's the optimal and you can still use them as a tablet that one time it seems more useful.

ProfessorOhki:
You seem to think I'm trying to say one brand of slate is superior to the other. What I'm actually saying is slates are gimmicky and only good for some super specific instances. If you're doing field work where there's not a table to be hand for miles, sure. If you're in an office. you're just wasting time because you think tablets are neat. If you're at home on the couch, whatever floats your boat, I guess... but let me know when you can hit a reasonable WPM on a tablet you haven't converted into an underpowered laptop with peripherals.

Now, convertible tablets I have some respect for and because of that, despite not being a fan of the OS, I hope the (non-RT) Surface products are successful; you can use them as a PC in the 99% cases where that's the optimal and you can still use them as a tablet that one time it seems more useful.

No, I think you're trying to say "Owning an ipad is more about saying "I own an ipad" than it is about anything the ipad can do."

I generally hit 0-1 WPM when I use my iPad. When I'm using it, I don't need or want a PC. It's not all about data entry and CPU cycles, you know.

I'm saying most people who own an iPad (and there are millions) think the iPad is the best tool for the job at hand, not a fashion statement.

fatbear: ProfessorOhki:
You seem to think I'm trying to say one brand of slate is superior to the other. What I'm actually saying is slates are gimmicky and only good for some super specific instances. If you're doing field work where there's not a table to be hand for miles, sure. If you're in an office. you're just wasting time because you think tablets are neat. If you're at home on the couch, whatever floats your boat, I guess... but let me know when you can hit a reasonable WPM on a tablet you haven't converted into an underpowered laptop with peripherals.

Now, convertible tablets I have some respect for and because of that, despite not being a fan of the OS, I hope the (non-RT) Surface products are successful; you can use them as a PC in the 99% cases where that's the optimal and you can still use them as a tablet that one time it seems more useful.

No, I think you're trying to say "Owning an ipad is more about saying "I own an ipad" than it is about anything the ipad can do."

I generally hit 0-1 WPM when I use my iPad. When I'm using it, I don't need or want a PC. It's not all about data entry and CPU cycles, you know.

I'm saying most people who own an iPad (and there are millions) think the iPad is the best tool for the job at hand, not a fashion statement.

Well, they've sold something like 100.1 million of them, so sure, I'll concede: at least 2% of iPad purchases were because they thought an iPad would be the best tool for the job with no regard for their trendiness or cool-factor.

/Ignoring people who bought multiples, obviously

It must be refreshing to be able to look at a group of 100 million people you've never met and say to yourself, "98% of you are idiots." Does wonders for your self-esteem, I imagine.

Wow. Another Windows tablet. Bet that'll be huge. Just like the last 45 Windows tablets.

fatbear: It must be refreshing to be able to look at a group of 100 million people you've never met and say to yourself, "98% of you are idiots." Does wonders for your self-esteem, I imagine.

You're putting words in my mouth. You're not an idiot for buying something because you think it's cool looking, futuristic, trendy, or fashionable. I'm just saying that most consumer slate purchases aren't primarily driven by, "wow, this does X so much better than my laptop/phone."

Don't you find it funny people always seem to feel the need to justify their purchase to strangers? I could say, "slates are absolute garbage" and you could reply, "actually, my iPad is great; I've been really happy with it," but no on ever does, it's always, "It does things no other device could match! I've done the research! Nothing else could fill this need better! It has the features that are right for me!" That disproportionately defensive posture is a pretty good indicator of denial and regret, just sayin'

I find it more funny that you find you need to denigrate 98 million people.

StoPPeRmobile: Show me a small business that doesn't run some version of Win server?

Well.... mine doesn't, but that's because we just don't need anything centralized. I'm pretty sure lots of restaurants and gas stations and small offices don't need server either. I think you misunderstood my post. I like a lot of stuff Microsoft does. Utilitarian is a good thing, just like Chevy/Ford trucks. People like to hate on Office, but holy crap does every other option blow chunks by comparison. I have Windows 7 on numerous machines and it rocks. All the software I need, some of it way more expensive than any one computer, runs on windows, and wine is still not good enough.

I complain specifically because it's so painful to see a company that makes products I need, one that is innovating, internally, screw up so badly. Those innovations are killed by senior marketing assholes in favor of mediocre junk. Like SkyDrive over Live Mesh. Too many examples lately. It's like being a Bears fan. Fire Ballmer like we dumped Lovie.

Bacontastesgood: I complain specifically because it's so painful to see a company that makes products I need, one that is innovating, internally, screw up so badly. Those innovations are killed by senior marketing assholes in favor of mediocre junk. Like SkyDrive over Live Mesh. Too many examples lately. It's like being a Bears fan. Fire Ballmer like we dumped Lovie.

Gabe Newell recently leveled the same criticism. Middle managers and marketing departments are dictating the direction companies are going and it ends up releasing products that are mediocre, playing catch up, and helps drive companies further away from the pulse of their customers. He specifically called out Microsoft because they saw what happened to IBM during the rise of MS in the 90's and apparently learned nothing from it.

fatbear: I find it more funny that you find you need to denigrate 98 million people.

I think it's funny that you think 98 million iPad sales means 98 million people buying them.

MightyPez: Gabe Newell recently leveled the same criticism. Middle managers and marketing departments are dictating the direction companies are going and it ends up releasing products that are mediocre, playing catch up, and helps drive companies further away from the pulse of their customers. He specifically called out Microsoft because they saw what happened to IBM during the rise of MS in the 90's and apparently learned nothing from it.

I'll have to look him up. Yeah, IBM is a great example - I was there in the early 90s when the diarrhea was going into the turboprop. In a weird way i'm proud of how they finally stopped the slide and turned things around. Compared to ATT who turned bell labs and bellcore into worthless toilets.

In fairness I think it's really hard to have a set of managers who can do technology right. MBA programs in particular seem to ruin people who previously had good brains.

Bacontastesgood: I'll have to look him up.

In case you have time to kill:

Nerdist Podcast

Episode 306 primarily talks about games, but 307 talks heavily about Valve and their corporate philosophy and structure.

Surface and RT are not going to sell as much as it should because it uses/is an OS from msft that is not able to run the programs that people already have for their current OS from msft. Consumers know there is a different from android and windows, along with knowing that ios is different from mac. Consumers do not know there is a difference from the x86 OS and RT, nor should there be a difference besides power consumption.

MightyPez: In case you have time to kill:

Nerdist Podcast

Episode 306 primarily talks about games, but 307 talks heavily about Valve and their corporate philosophy and structure.

Thanks, will give a listen. I should have recognized Newell as the Valve guy, D'oh!

All tablets are pieces of garbage. My phone does what they do just fine. My computer does everything else.

Surface Pro to replace my laptop on the other hand sounds like a good proposition.

fatbear: I'm jnProfessorOhki: fatbear: KFBR392: Owning an ipad is more about saying "I own an ipad" than it is about anything the ipad can do or the tech specs.

I'm going to guess you have no real use for a tablet. Most of the iPad owners truly couldn't give a fark about Apple OR the tech specs - it's about what they can *do* with the tablet.

The same tasks as everything else on the market, but while having something cool and newfangled? Tablet's have got some niche applications, but c'mon now don't be intentionally dense about the reality of the consumer market.

In a side-by-side comparison multiple tablets doing several tasks I needed to accomplish, the iPad came out faster, more usable, and more stable. In addition, I like the particular piece of software that's written for my most critical task, and it's iPad only - the Android competition is ok but not as good.

It's simple. I use what works best for me. I suspect most others do the same. I don't give a fark what tech I use as long as it gets the job done better than any reasonable alternative.


Let me be more clear. ipads (and tablets in general) serve no real purpose. They fill an artificially created void. It's a solution in search of a problem.

Laptops took desktops and made them portable. Smartphones took laptops and put them in the palm of your hand and gave you broadband internet wherever you are......tablets allow you play angry birds on a larger screen....(one of these things just doesn't belong).

Don't get me wrong. They are fun. And apple makes a great tablet. But people buy it because it says apple on box. Not because of anything under the hood.

KFBR392: tablets in general serve no real purpose.

"all the calculations that would ever be needed in this country could be done on the three digital computers which were then being built-one in Cambridge, one in Teddington, and one in Manchester. No one else, he said, would ever need machines of their own, or would be able to afford to buy them."

"Remote shopping, while entirely feasible, will flop"

"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home"

"The world potential market for copying machines is 5000 at most"

"Fooling around with alternating current is just a waste of time. Nobody will use it, ever"

"But what... is it good for?"

The biggest difference between the above statements and yours is that most of the world doesn't give a fark what you think.