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(Huffington Post)   Upon further review, we have determined that Syria did use chemical weapons on its own people. Please set the war clock to "Soon"   (huffingtonpost.com ) divider line
    More: Scary, State Department, chemical weapons, Homs, Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, Syrian Army, Golan Heights, children playing, girl play  
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13100 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Jan 2013 at 8:42 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-16 12:19:23 AM  

mjbok: We are not the world police, that is the job of the UN. That and letter writing.


Exactly. No UN resolution = no intervention. I'd like to see Syria overthrow Assad and all that, but without global consensus, we cannot and should not act.
 
2013-01-16 12:19:48 AM  

halfof33: Amos Quito: halfof33: Call me a retard again.


Okay, so you're a retard again.


War creates debt
Debt creates loans
Loans generate interest
Interest translates into profit$

/War is hell?
//Depends on the perspective
///Doesn't it?


Yeah, man, the Kaiser's creditors were ROLLING in it, holla holla holla!



Look up the Treaty of Versailles, and the associated "reparations".

Silly lad.
 
2013-01-16 12:23:55 AM  

frenchcheesemuseum: OH hell is right make me some tea.  I'm not signing up to any site just to read a freaking article.


styckx: LOGIN WITH YOUR FOREIGNPOLICY.COM ACCOUNTNo...


Say whut? It's HuffPo. No login required.

Or am I missing something?
 
2013-01-16 12:25:29 AM  

Amos Quito: Look up the Treaty of Versailles, and the associated "reparations".

Silly lad.


I'm not sure you are getting the whole "things didn't work out to good for the Germans," who might have had a wee bit to do with the whole "war" thing.

Just a, you know, thought?
 
2013-01-16 12:30:06 AM  

Amos Quito: scubamage: Solid State Vittles: To be fair, I would need to know the chemical before I would make that leap into calling it a "weapon." What if Syria was just making it rain fluoxetine, lysergic acid diethylamide, and tadalifil on its citizenry?

That's crazy talk, why, someone capable of doing that would probably want to start putting flouride in the drinking supply!

BLAH!

Fluoride is harmless.

/Unless it is used in combination with chlorine, of course


And That's The End Of The Whole Mess.
 
2013-01-16 12:30:57 AM  

d23: [2.bp.blogspot.com image 243x320]

"The language of the Great Convention is clear enough: Use of atomics chemical burn yer-ass agents against humans shall be cause for planetary obliteration of your stinking shiatty country."


That makes total sense. The civilians the gas doesn't kill can be killed when we carpet bomb the place.

The correct answer is to send in hit teams and take out the top 3 layers of leadership. But that will never happen because the Boss Class never attacks their own. It's just not done. Tacky. Makes for bad precedent. The function of the Boss Class is to lead; the function of the Unwashed Masses is to die.

And, yes, that goes for the United States, too (no matter who is President).
 
2013-01-16 12:35:57 AM  

halfof33: leadmetal: Perhaps Hermann Goering can explain it to you:

Well, then, the non-peasant is quoting Hermann Goering. From the Nuremburg Trials.That CERTAINLY settles that. Any other words of wisdom from some of history's greatest criminals you want to share with us? Hitler perhaps?

He really quoted that, I am at a loss.

But he meant "retarded" in the positive, non-insulting way.


It's a shame you are governed by emotions and conditioning rather than any sort of objective rational thought. The sociopaths that often rise to the top of political systems are practiced the art of manipulating people. That's how they get to be such positions. Perhaps if you could put aside your emotions you would understand it. About now your only hope is to be a troll but given your initial lack of a grasp on history... well...

optional: Except, leadmetal, you insulted halfof33 earlier saying he was emotionally and rationally retarded. So yeah, I guess you are also unable to read and comprehend by this logic?


There's name calling and then there is observation. There was no name calling from me, just my observation of what was posted. Something that was clearly a state of being slowed, or perhaps delayed academic progress. A retardation. It is a correct word to use for that observation. As one would retard spark advance. I I admit the choice of words a bit of a troll to see the reaction. I could have easily used others. But seeing someone key in on a word like Beavis and Butthead can be slightly amusing.
 
2013-01-16 12:37:11 AM  

leadmetal: halfof33: leadmetal: Ahh yes, The Germans are killing babies. The Iraqis are tossing babies out of incubators. When will americans start looking at these manipulative stories with a critical eye? Never? Probably.

The American people drawn into another war, another regime change. The state department wouldn't lie to get what they want. No. Never. When has government ever lied to get what those in it desire?

New century. Same manipulation.

We'll find out it's bullshiat in a few years. Just like has happened many times before.

Yeah, except for that whole Holocaust thing.

That Holocaust thing was not used to get the american people to go to war or support a war or support a revolution or regime change. By the time the american people knew about it, the war was essentially over. Of course one can never let logic get in the way of discrediting those who point out the manipulations.

Remember the Maine!


Presumably you were referring to propaganda about German cruelty in WWI, but it certainly crippled your argument to invoke atrocities that were WORSE than anything that propaganda claimed.
 
2013-01-16 12:39:49 AM  
...pretense.
 
2013-01-16 12:42:47 AM  
BronyMedic:

No, the issue is that Syria is using a weapon that the entire world the tame press and hypocritical politicos of the USA and NATO views as anathema and unthinkable to use on their worst enemies on their own citizens secular-liberal and/or Islamist Sunnis...

Brony, guy, you know that for ~1200 years the Sunni Arab majority has viewed the region's ethnic and/or religious minorities as "not really real people" at best, that they didn't get a decent break till the Assads and their friends slapped together a coalition of those minorities and imposed it on the majority by force. It's as if The Rainbow Coalition had been truly multi-colored and come to power, the big difference being that Syria literally never had a "democratic republican" electoral tradition like we do so the only way the Syrian version could have come to power is by a military coup and the inevitable "necessary measures" that go with that. And ever since then the Sunni Arab majority, in one guise or another, has been protesting against the "injustice," just as the Tea Party here has been on the warpath against Obama since Fall 2008, with the difference again being that here the Teapartiers' talk about armed insurrection against the minority usurpers has been only talk.

The Sunni view of the Baathist regime does resemble the ex-Confederate rhetoric about "Negro rule" during Radical Reconstruction except that in Syria the "carpetbaggers" and "freedmen" did come to power and stayed in power for 40 years. Imagine if Frederick Douglass had been Lincoln's vice president instead of Andrew Johnson, and then two generations later outside powers had decided to help the downtrodden ex-slaveowners rebel against their "oppression."

This is not to say the Assadists are anything less than murderous bastards, only that (thanks in large part to the Baathists' own doing) they're absolutely right that a Sunni victory would mean a bloodbath against the minorities. So now the only way to avert reciprocal massacres is to partition the country along ethnic/religious lines as the French wanted to do before WW2, letting the Sunni Arabs have their own way in their own area without pushing the others around as they did through over a millennium of dhimmitude.

The only involvement "outside" (i.e. US-dominated) forces should have is to separate the combatants and rearrange the demographics. Before it's done by the Syrians themselves, with all the mess that would entail. And before "Al Qaeda" inherits the country.

Modern Syria and Lebanon are as artificial as the ex-colonies of Africa. Fix it by fragmenting the territory into "dukedoms" and then knit them together loosely under the NATO aegis.

The alternative, a secular democratic republic like the US and NATO countries have, is simply beyond the ken of the average Syrian of whatever persuasion for the foreseeable future. Maybe once they're separated they can start viewing each other as people instead of "those people."

Of course we probably should just nuke it from orbit and go on to the next humanitarian crisis. But, well, you know...
 
2013-01-16 12:44:59 AM  
I'm still not sure why ""We can't definitely say 100 percent, but Syrian contacts made a compelling case that Agent 15 was used in Homs on Dec. 23," the official said." equals "SYRIA USED CHEMICAL WEAPONS ON THEIR OWN PEOPLE" in so many people's minds. Let's break this down.

We can't definitely say = we can't say for sure, or, we can't make a positive statement, or, we aren't saying with any certainty;
100% = as in, we're not 100% sure. So how sure are they? 99% sure? 50% sure? Are they even remotely sure?
Syrian contacts = as in, not American agents? Who's telling us this? Anyone who doesn't have a vested interest in getting American boots on the ground ASAP?
Made a compelling case = Is that better than "beyond a reasonable doubt"? More than "preponderance of evidence"?

Not that I doubt Syria WOULD do it, of course; it's just that it sounds awfully like the assurances we got "Oh, yes, there's weapons of mass destruction all over Iraq! You can hardly move without tripping over them!" Chalabi was giving us.
 
2013-01-16 12:52:59 AM  
"We can't definitely say 100 percent, but Syrian contacts made a compelling case that Agent 15 was used in Homs on Dec. 23," the official said.

Big deal. Agent 15 a.k.a. 3-Quinuclidinyl benzilate a.k.a. BZ is not toxic.
 
2013-01-16 12:55:42 AM  
The lies will continue being told as long as you idiots keep believing them.
 
2013-01-16 01:00:39 AM  
If they had guns in Syria, they wouldn't have this problem.
 
2013-01-16 01:00:39 AM  

Fano: Presumably you were referring to propaganda about German cruelty in WWI, but it certainly crippled your argument to invoke atrocities that were WORSE than anything that propaganda claimed.


I didn't invoke anything such thing. Please read the exchange. I posted about the lies to get americans into war. One specifically was world war one. Then someone who didn't understand history got really confused and then acted to "invoke atrocities that were WORSE than anything that propaganda claimed" from a later war, world war two. They aren't even from the same war and in that later war weren't known to americans until the war was nearly over. Thus the concentration camps of WW2 were totally irrelevant. The post you replied to is me explaining that they had no bearing on convincing people to go to war whatsoever.
 
2013-01-16 01:10:47 AM  

leadmetal: Fano: Presumably you were referring to propaganda about German cruelty in WWI, but it certainly crippled your argument to invoke atrocities that were WORSE than anything that propaganda claimed.

I didn't invoke anything such thing. Please read the exchange. I posted about the lies to get americans into war. One specifically was world war one. Then someone who didn't understand history got really confused and then acted to "invoke atrocities that were WORSE than anything that propaganda claimed" from a later war, world war two. They aren't even from the same war and in that later war weren't known to americans until the war was nearly over. Thus the concentration camps of WW2 were totally irrelevant. The post you replied to is me explaining that they had no bearing on convincing people to go to war whatsoever.


You ARE retarded if you didn't think you weren't blowing a dog whistle, troll. I responded from reading up to that point in the thread. Reading the rest indicated that you were intentionally vague to put a worm on the hook.

That said, are you pro-isolationist or pro-central powers regarding WWI?
 
2013-01-16 01:12:02 AM  
So Obama redraws the line in the sand to suit his political agenda. Wat else is new?
 
2013-01-16 01:15:15 AM  

Doktor_Zhivago: Amos Quito: scubamage: Solid State Vittles: To be fair, I would need to know the chemical before I would make that leap into calling it a "weapon." What if Syria was just making it rain fluoxetine, lysergic acid diethylamide, and tadalifil on its citizenry?

That's crazy talk, why, someone capable of doing that would probably want to start putting flouride in the drinking supply!

BLAH!

Fluoride is harmless.

/Unless it is used in combination with chlorine, of course

Or hydrogen... Then it can etch glass. Or dissolve bodies.
[community.us.playstation.com image 450x317]


img.photobucket.com
 
2013-01-16 01:30:39 AM  
Hurr Obama the WAR President HURR extending Bush's POLICIES DURR
 
2013-01-16 01:35:42 AM  
sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2013-01-16 01:41:47 AM  

DoctorCal: I don't understand what everyone is so concerned about. The whole "used WMDs on their own people" think is only used as a rationalization after the stated reason for invading a country is proven to be a blatant lie.


Ayup. Next they will be telling us that the regime is oppressive to women folk... and libs can't say no when it comes to sticking up for broads.
 
2013-01-16 01:47:02 AM  

leadmetal: halfof33: leadmetal: Perhaps Hermann Goering can explain it to you:

Well, then, the non-peasant is quoting Hermann Goering. From the Nuremburg Trials.That CERTAINLY settles that. Any other words of wisdom from some of history's greatest criminals you want to share with us? Hitler perhaps?

He really quoted that, I am at a loss.

But he meant "retarded" in the positive, non-insulting way.

It's a shame you are governed by emotions and conditioning rather than any sort of objective rational thought. The sociopaths that often rise to the top of political systems are practiced the art of manipulating people. That's how they get to be such positions. Perhaps if you could put aside your emotions you would understand it. About now your only hope is to be a troll but given your initial lack of a grasp on history... well...

optional: Except, leadmetal, you insulted halfof33 earlier saying he was emotionally and rationally retarded. So yeah, I guess you are also unable to read and comprehend by this logic?

There's name calling and then there is observation. There was no name calling from me, just my observation of what was posted. Something that was clearly a state of being slowed, or perhaps delayed academic progress. A retardation. It is a correct word to use for that observation. As one would retard spark advance. I I admit the choice of words a bit of a troll to see the reaction. I could have easily used others. But seeing someone key in on a word like Beavis and Butthead can be slightly amusing.


Yes, but you deliberately phrased it as an insult. Your point had already been made, making an ad hominem unnecessary.

Therefore, by your own standards, you are unable to read or comprehend anything. Which also makes this a waste of text, as you will not be able to understand it. Oh well.
 
2013-01-16 02:29:26 AM  

make me some tea: mjbok: We are not the world police, that is the job of the UN. That and letter writing.

Exactly. No UN resolution = no intervention. I'd like to see Syria overthrow Assad and all that, but without global consensus, we cannot and should not act.


Fark the UN and their consensus. They'll never have a consensus with Russia and China cool with Assad. And neither will do sh*t if we intervene.

I don't want us to go to "war" war. But if this is true(and I'm not without doubt), I don't mind us helping the resistance with some targeted airstrikes. Chemical weapons are just something else entirely, If Assad is at a point to do that to his own people then he is a threat to the region, a threat to Israel, and if Israel gets hit, you know what? I don't want WWIII right now.

I don't see why using our air power to help the freedom fighters was cool in Libya but is suddenly taboo in Syria. Oh yeah, that was an actual war for oil.
 
2013-01-16 02:34:00 AM  

violentsalvation: make me some tea: mjbok: We are not the world police, that is the job of the UN. That and letter writing.

Exactly. No UN resolution = no intervention. I'd like to see Syria overthrow Assad and all that, but without global consensus, we cannot and should not act.

Fark the UN and their consensus. They'll never have a consensus with Russia and China cool with Assad. And neither will do sh*t if we intervene.

I don't want us to go to "war" war. But if this is true(and I'm not without doubt), I don't mind us helping the resistance with some targeted airstrikes. Chemical weapons are just something else entirely, If Assad is at a point to do that to his own people then he is a threat to the region, a threat to Israel, and if Israel gets hit, you know what? I don't want WWIII right now.

I don't see why using our air power to help the freedom fighters was cool in Libya but is suddenly taboo in Syria. Oh yeah, that was an actual war for oil.


maybe because these Syrian "freedom fighters" are Al Qaeda.
 
2013-01-16 02:35:07 AM  
so 60000 folks have died, but the way these 5 died means war?
 
2013-01-16 02:49:59 AM  

mr lawson: violentsalvation: make me some tea: mjbok: We are not the world police, that is the job of the UN. That and letter writing.

Exactly. No UN resolution = no intervention. I'd like to see Syria overthrow Assad and all that, but without global consensus, we cannot and should not act.

Fark the UN and their consensus. They'll never have a consensus with Russia and China cool with Assad. And neither will do sh*t if we intervene.

I don't want us to go to "war" war. But if this is true(and I'm not without doubt), I don't mind us helping the resistance with some targeted airstrikes. Chemical weapons are just something else entirely, If Assad is at a point to do that to his own people then he is a threat to the region, a threat to Israel, and if Israel gets hit, you know what? I don't want WWIII right now.

I don't see why using our air power to help the freedom fighters was cool in Libya but is suddenly taboo in Syria. Oh yeah, that was an actual war for oil.

maybe because these Syrian "freedom fighters" are Al Qaeda.


Oh, without a doubt there are extremists jumping into the fray. We can bomb them when and if we need to, but for now I choose to believe the Syrian people can govern themselves and deal with the extremists hiding among their ranks as they see fit.

I remember in the middle of the worst fighting in Iraq 2.0 pundits were calling for a benevolent dictator to rule the country, someone like Mubarak, they said. And it was somewhere around that point that I realized nobody gave a shiat about democracy in the middle east. It was all a lie.
 
2013-01-16 03:19:05 AM  
They didn't attack us with them, so it's none of our business.
 
2013-01-16 03:21:05 AM  
What an attack with chemical weapons might look like:

media-1.web.britannica.com
 
2013-01-16 04:05:52 AM  
Get your war cock up, chicken hawk farktards. i hate you.
 
2013-01-16 04:15:48 AM  
why so syria
 
2013-01-16 04:31:34 AM  
Because not actually having WMDs will certainly prevent a US invasion, right?
 
2013-01-16 04:57:25 AM  
And why should that mean anything?

Just because you have absolute proof of chemical weapons being used should never be evidence that a country probably has them and might use them again.

That's what liberals kept telling me about Iraq anyway. Saddam used them on his own people, all during the 90s during the Clinton presidency we heard about them from everyone including the UN.

Then suddenly nobody had ever heard of Saddam having or using chemical weapons and the fact that we couldn't find massive stock piles of them now was all that was important.
 
2013-01-16 07:41:33 AM  

BronyMedic: Krymson Tyde: Apparently the Newtown murders were faked by our government. At least according to some of the more unhinged folks on Facebook

You mean people who need a good cockpunch.

Aarontology: So using chemical weapons, the Syrian government killed fewer people than were killed in Newtown.

And for some, this is evidence we need to go to war.

Makes total sense.

No, the issue is that Syria is using a weapon that the entire world views as anathema and unthinkable to use on their worst enemies on their own citizens, even people who have done nothing to support or fight against the rebel faction.


the syrian gov't have been carpet bombing their own citizens for awhile

but chemical weapons show up and ZOMG!1

whatever response we have is already a farce imo
 
2013-01-16 07:53:28 AM  
Anyone else not believe any of this?
 
2013-01-16 08:03:50 AM  
Don't everyone get your shorts in a twist about this. Bashar al-Asshat, who reads the news just like the rest of us, knows that the Obama administration has recalled our troops from Iraq and that it is in the process of recalling the rest of our troops from Afghanistan. We won't intervene and he knows it, which is one of the reasons he is staying put, hanging on, and killing his enemies instead of packing his suitcases and moving to Russia.
 
2013-01-16 09:14:37 AM  

leadmetal: t's a shame you are governed by emotions and conditioning rather than any sort of objective rational thought. The sociopaths that often rise to the top of political systems are practiced the art of manipulating people. That's how they get to be such positions. Perhaps if you could put aside your emotions you would understand it. About now your only hope is to be a troll but given your initial lack of a grasp on history... well...

optional: Except, leadmetal, you insulted halfof33 earlier saying he was emotionally and rationally retarded. So yeah, I guess you are also unable to read and comprehend by this logic?

There's name calling and then there is observation. There was no name calling from me, just my observation of what was posted. Something that was clearly a state of being slowed, or perhaps delayed academic progress. A retardation. It is a correct word to use for that observation. As one would retard spark advance. I I admit the choice of words a bit of a troll to see the reaction. I could have easily used others. But seeing someone key in on a word like Beavis and Butthead can be slightly amusing.



Bro, you seem mad because someone disagreed with you. Awww.

And sport? Everyone is pointing out the reference to "retard" because you are a drooling hypocrite who was hoisted by your own "retard." (It's a pun!)

I like you, you think you are smart, and also think that WWI was started by Propaganda posters seeking recruits after the declaration of war. THAT is precious.

I don't mind trolling, just bring your farking A game next time.
 
2013-01-16 09:33:34 AM  

halfof33: Amos Quito: halfof33: Call me a retard again.


Okay, so you're a retard again.


War creates debt
Debt creates loans
Loans generate interest
Interest translates into profit$

/War is hell?
//Depends on the perspective
///Doesn't it?

Yeah, man, the Kaiser's creditors were ROLLING in it, holla holla holla!


Just because some investors bet on the wrong side, doesn't mean there weren't profits:

http://www.nber.org/digest/jan05/w10580.html
 
2013-01-16 09:35:10 AM  

Bennie Crabtree: make me some tea: Oh hell.

Don't worry, the USA has zero credibility in this department. Nobody relevant will follow them into war over over this kind of claim again.


Unless there's money to be made.

Just watch.
 
2013-01-16 09:38:08 AM  

randomjsa: And why should that mean anything?

Just because you have absolute proof of chemical weapons being used should never be evidence that a country probably has them and might use them again.

That's what liberals kept telling me about Iraq anyway. Saddam used them on his own people, all during the 90s during the Clinton presidency we heard about them from everyone including the UN.

Then suddenly nobody had ever heard of Saddam having or using chemical weapons and the fact that we couldn't find massive stock piles of them now was all that was important.


Skipped over a couple important parts of the chain of events there, chuckles.

By all means, put up a Mossad quote backing the WMD rationale for invading Iraq.

Go on, we'll wait.
 
2013-01-16 10:41:57 AM  
So, not to poke the badger with a stick or taunt the dynamite monkey or anything, but how does Assad's government feel towards Israel? I know that Israel and Syria really don't get along THAT well, but could Israel be concerned that any government led by the rebels would cause new and different (more shooty) problems in the Golan Heights? They're probably nervous enough about regime change in Egypt, since now they might have to worry about Gaza and the Sinai again.
 
2013-01-16 12:57:46 PM  

violentsalvation: make me some tea: mjbok: We are not the world police, that is the job of the UN. That and letter writing.

Exactly. No UN resolution = no intervention. I'd like to see Syria overthrow Assad and all that, but without global consensus, we cannot and should not act.

Fark the UN and their consensus. They'll never have a consensus with Russia and China cool with Assad. And neither will do sh*t if we intervene.

I don't want us to go to "war" war. But if this is true(and I'm not without doubt), I don't mind us helping the resistance with some targeted airstrikes. Chemical weapons are just something else entirely, If Assad is at a point to do that to his own people then he is a threat to the region, a threat to Israel, and if Israel gets hit, you know what? I don't want WWIII right now.

I don't see why using our air power to help the freedom fighters was cool in Libya but is suddenly taboo in Syria. Oh yeah, that was an actual war for oil.


It wasn't. Intervening in an internal matter of a sovereign nation us none of our business.
 
2013-01-16 01:22:06 PM  

mjbok: violentsalvation: make me some tea: mjbok: We are not the world police, that is the job of the UN. That and letter writing.

Exactly. No UN resolution = no intervention. I'd like to see Syria overthrow Assad and all that, but without global consensus, we cannot and should not act.

Fark the UN and their consensus. They'll never have a consensus with Russia and China cool with Assad. And neither will do sh*t if we intervene.

I don't want us to go to "war" war. But if this is true(and I'm not without doubt), I don't mind us helping the resistance with some targeted airstrikes. Chemical weapons are just something else entirely, If Assad is at a point to do that to his own people then he is a threat to the region, a threat to Israel, and if Israel gets hit, you know what? I don't want WWIII right now.

I don't see why using our air power to help the freedom fighters was cool in Libya but is suddenly taboo in Syria. Oh yeah, that was an actual war for oil.

It wasn't. Intervening in an internal matter of a sovereign nation us none of our business.


Not without UN consensus by all member nations. We made the mistake of going unilaterally into Iraq. A few trillion later and 500,000 people dead, we probably realized we shouldn't have done that. Libya and the Bosnian War were perfect examples of the types of international intervention that are allowable. If we could get a UN resolution on Syria, I'd be all for NATO intervention there as well.
 
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