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(io9)   Nineteen-year-old activist makes life hell for Louisiana's creationists   (io9.com) divider line 416
    More: Hero, Zack Kopplin, Louisiana, Education Act, science books, Discovery Institute, scientific inquiry, AlterNet, Southeastern Louisiana University  
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34272 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Jan 2013 at 9:27 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-15 10:19:01 PM
I think there should be a separate class that teaches world beliefs. It should teach general beliefs about the major world religions and the beliefs of athiests. This way people are informed at least some what as to what others believe and they are given a choice of what to believe. It will cover creationism and why people believe it in this class. However this may be too logical and not enough Jesus for some people.
 
2013-01-15 10:19:17 PM

ModernLuddite: As a (former) Floridian, I genuinely hope - FERVENTLY - for a hurricane of such magnitude to hit the gulf of Mexico that it just destroys the south. Completely. No survivors. Raze the Earth.

Luckily, retarded policy decisions may be helping this scenario along. So drill, baby, drill, I guess.


Yeah, I support anyone who wants complete eradication of life in regions that they don't like! What if I don't like the Middle East? Do I get a Hurricane too? Or is it just your prejudice that gets sky support?
 
2013-01-15 10:20:26 PM
I think the Hero tag is well deserved in this case.

Without an understanding of evolution, we wouldn't have modern agriculture, domestic pets, vaccines, disinfection, epidemiology, pest control, etc.

You can make up whatever rules you want in religion, politics or other social constructs, but science is a cruel mistress and you can't conduct modern biological research without knowing evolution any more than you can revoke the law of gravity.
 
2013-01-15 10:21:23 PM
Silly question, I haven't been paying attention to the ID/creationism threads (my mind got made up back when creationtheory.org was still being routinely updated), but is SkinnyHead the new Bevets?
Do people still post the "Summon Bevets" Magic:The Gathering card?
Does rum go better with Pepsi Max or Coke Zero?
 
2013-01-15 10:21:34 PM
Brought to you by the state that is ranked one of the lowest in the nation for education.
 
2013-01-15 10:22:23 PM

4seasons85!: I think there should be a separate class that teaches world beliefs. It should teach general beliefs about the major world religions and the beliefs of athiests. This way people are informed at least some what as to what others believe and they are given a choice of what to believe. It will cover creationism and why people believe it in this class. However this may be too logical and not enough Jesus for some people.


If you think there was a shiatstorm about teaching science to the kids of these people, wait until the government tries to inform their kids about other religious beliefs.
 
2013-01-15 10:22:24 PM
"Kopplin would like to see $1 trillion of new science funding..."

Here you go:

fitsnews.com
 
2013-01-15 10:23:34 PM

Raharu: phlegmmo: Equilibrist: FARK needs a Creationist tab.

It would have to be intelligently designed.


And never change over time.


Awesome. You're all awesome.
Goddammitsomuch. That was beautiful.
 
2013-01-15 10:23:34 PM

queezyweezel: FTFA:He also has his eyes set on vouchers. After an Alternet story came out about a school in the Louisiana voucher program teaching that the Loch Ness Monster was real and disproved evolution, Kopplin looked deeper into the program and found that this wasn't just one school, but at least 19 other schools, too.Oh. My. God......that's scary. And I'm not talking about a possible monster.


Are you trying to say it's not real?

l2.yimg.com
 
2013-01-15 10:24:23 PM
(skipped: comment text contains 2 ignored login names 'SkinnyHead', 'Bevets')
 
2013-01-15 10:24:57 PM

Dokushin: ModernLuddite: As a (former) Floridian, I genuinely hope - FERVENTLY - for a hurricane of such magnitude to hit the gulf of Mexico that it just destroys the south. Completely. No survivors. Raze the Earth.

Luckily, retarded policy decisions may be helping this scenario along. So drill, baby, drill, I guess.

Yeah, I support anyone who wants complete eradication of life in regions that they don't like! What if I don't like the Middle East? Do I get a Hurricane too? Or is it just your prejudice that gets sky support?


It's not about "not liking" somebody, it's about destroying an enemy of America. The same group of self-righteous evil-doers who insisted on using human beings as farm machinery are still here today, doing everything in their power to destroy this country. They were our enemy once and still.
 
2013-01-15 10:25:02 PM
DeathCipris: Brought to you by the state that is ranked one of the lowest in the nation for education.

not in abstinence-only education!
 
2013-01-15 10:25:07 PM
has the stupid wrestler fan "it's real to me" dude shown up yet? I'm late for the party as usual.
 
2013-01-15 10:25:41 PM
"Just search creationism on Monster Jobs or Career Builder and tell me how many creationist jobs you find," he asks.

Big Laugh OL on that one. Good for him.
 
2013-01-15 10:27:06 PM

Dokushin: ModernLuddite: As a (former) Floridian, I genuinely hope - FERVENTLY - for a hurricane of such magnitude to hit the gulf of Mexico that it just destroys the south. Completely. No survivors. Raze the Earth.

Luckily, retarded policy decisions may be helping this scenario along. So drill, baby, drill, I guess.

Yeah, I support anyone who wants complete eradication of life in regions that they don't like! What if I don't like the Middle East? Do I get a Hurricane too? Or is it just your prejudice that gets sky support?


No, only I decide who lives or dies.
 
2013-01-15 10:27:11 PM

Insatiable Jesus: Dokushin: ModernLuddite: As a (former) Floridian, I genuinely hope - FERVENTLY - for a hurricane of such magnitude to hit the gulf of Mexico that it just destroys the south. Completely. No survivors. Raze the Earth.

Luckily, retarded policy decisions may be helping this scenario along. So drill, baby, drill, I guess.

Yeah, I support anyone who wants complete eradication of life in regions that they don't like! What if I don't like the Middle East? Do I get a Hurricane too? Or is it just your prejudice that gets sky support?

It's not about "not liking" somebody, it's about destroying an enemy of America. The same group of self-righteous evil-doers who insisted on using human beings as farm machinery are still here today, doing everything in their power to destroy this country. They were our enemy once and still.


Good job endearing yourselves to rational southerners who hold the fundies in even more contempt than you.
 
2013-01-15 10:27:42 PM
Geez, folks, why do you keep responding to the troll ShiattyHead? I can block his posts, but I can't block responses to his posts and every time I accidentally read something he wrote, I lose brain cells. Please don't feed the trolls, already!!!
 
2013-01-15 10:27:55 PM

spidermilk: The other day two church chicks came to my door and I thought "Ok, stay cool, don't be an asshole" and they gave me a little pamplet and told me where their church was. I said "Great, thanks! have a good one." and they didn't turn around to leave. Instead, the chick goes "Let me ask you- if you died today are you SURE-" and right there I rudely cut her off and said 'I'm an athiest so I don't believe in god." and she just said "WELL THERE IS A GOD!" and I said "ok, we all have our own beliefs- bye!"


And you let them go?

/always wanted to do two church chicks at once
 
2013-01-15 10:28:01 PM
SkinnyHead. Bringing the derp to the hole. For America.
 
2013-01-15 10:30:14 PM

Insatiable Jesus: It's not about "not liking" somebody, it's about destroying an enemy of America. The same group of self-righteous evil-doers who insisted on using human beings as farm machinery are still here today, doing everything in their power to destroy this country. They were our enemy once and still.


We certainly have some number of enemies in the Middle East. Surely they too must be razed to the ground?
 
2013-01-15 10:31:04 PM

ModernLuddite: Dokushin: ModernLuddite: As a (former) Floridian, I genuinely hope - FERVENTLY - for a hurricane of such magnitude to hit the gulf of Mexico that it just destroys the south. Completely. No survivors. Raze the Earth.

Luckily, retarded policy decisions may be helping this scenario along. So drill, baby, drill, I guess.

Yeah, I support anyone who wants complete eradication of life in regions that they don't like! What if I don't like the Middle East? Do I get a Hurricane too? Or is it just your prejudice that gets sky support?

No, only I decide who lives or dies.


Okay, I laughed. Go have a beer or something.
 
2013-01-15 10:32:28 PM
If fiercely enforcing a theory with no basis ever proven makes you a hero, the Fark's hero tag is not even worth wiping your butt with. That makes me sad.

Find any proponent of the Theory of Evolution, and they'll tell you that it's only a theory because it can't be proven.

Fark is choosing sides now?
 
2013-01-15 10:33:55 PM

Psycat: I can't block responses to his posts


Sure you can.
 
2013-01-15 10:34:09 PM
I'm pretty sure you don't have to be 19 to give a creationist hell. I have a 10 year old niece who I'm pretty sure has a more factual grasp on science than anyone who could truly believe in creationism. We could conduct some tests and see if my theory holds true, but if you understood why theories require testing and proof, then the chances are quite high that you wouldn't turn out to be a creationist in the first place.
 
2013-01-15 10:34:39 PM
This thread:
t1.gstatic.com
 
2013-01-15 10:35:06 PM
Why do TFers even acknowledge skinnyhead? Pretty bad that you can't pick out the serial trolls.
 
2013-01-15 10:35:34 PM

4seasons85!: I think there should be a separate class that teaches world beliefs. It should teach general beliefs about the major world religions and the beliefs of athiests. This way people are informed at least some what as to what others believe and they are given a choice of what to believe. It will cover creationism and why people believe it in this class. However this may be too logical and not enough Jesus for some people.


While I would love to see proper comparative religions, world cultures, critical thinking, philosophy, etc., courses in our public school system, I fear "proper" is not plausible except in a small amount of schools. Considering how often teachers ignorantly promote Christian beliefs and practices while exposing children to other beliefs in a manner which seems them as quaint, and considering how often there are efforts to directly promote religious beliefs in the place of substantiated and essential science, few branches of Christianity and few religions, if any, would be taught and discussed in an objective and proper light.
 
2013-01-15 10:35:38 PM

Dokushin: Insatiable Jesus: It's not about "not liking" somebody, it's about destroying an enemy of America. The same group of self-righteous evil-doers who insisted on using human beings as farm machinery are still here today, doing everything in their power to destroy this country. They were our enemy once and still.

We certainly have some number of enemies in the Middle East. Surely they too must be razed to the ground?


They're fine in the Mid-East. The Southern racists would do well there too. Anywhere but here. They hate it here anyways, since we smacked them down and told them to do their own work. Seccession by boat.
 
2013-01-15 10:36:03 PM

veryequiped: If fiercely enforcing a theory with no basis ever proven makes you a hero, the Fark's hero tag is not even worth wiping your butt with. That makes me sad.

Find any proponent of the Theory of Evolution, and they'll tell you that it's only a theory because it can't be proven.

Fark is choosing sides now?


1/10. The all bold didn't help.
 
2013-01-15 10:36:20 PM

BronyMedic: SkinnyHead: I guess people who oppose academic freedom and support censorship would see this young man as a hero.  People who support academic freedom and freedom of thought probably don't.

And now it's time for a blast from the past!


Whoa, I missed that one. That's pretty Time Cubey...
 
2013-01-15 10:36:35 PM

veryequiped: Find any proponent of the Theory of Evolution, and they'll tell you that it's only a theory because it can't be proven.


OK, troll, I'll bite. 'Theory' to a scientist means 'best explanation we have at present'. Only to idiots with a limited education does 'theory' mean 'wild guess'. Evolution has been proven a zillion times in fossils, geologic strata, carbon-14 and other radioactivity measurements, and genetics among many other things. Do cretinists, er, creationists have any proof for the 'Divine Poof Theory'? I'll take a wild guess--hell, no.
 
2013-01-15 10:37:10 PM
Seriously, WTF is wrong with you "Christians"? Isn't mankind old enough NOT to believe in fairy tales anymore?
 
2013-01-15 10:37:42 PM
Here's the biggest issue: you want to teach your religious beliefs, please do so. In the context of them being YOUR religious beliefs, and in the church or religious institution of your choice.


Public education is exactly that: public. If you don't want to teach in a public institution, and instead wish to teach in a religious school, please do so. Trying to weasel your beliefs into being taught on the public dime is a violation of the separation of church and state. It promotes your faith over others, and thus is a greater danger to the freedom of religion that folks claim to cherish so much.


You want to teach Creationism, then do so, in a the private school of your choice. With your own dollars going to its upkeep, and the possible loss of accreditation and the possibility of not being able to be placed in many universities after graduation. Your call. Go for it.


When you take the public dollar, you are then beholden to teach folks of all faiths, and even those who don't have any. Equally. Not just teach your own faith. That means actually respecting the fact that not all faiths share your zeal for the Biblical teachings. There are places to teach this: in your own churches and synagogues and mosques and temples. Teach them at home, if you are REALLY into the idea, but understand, that they aren't held by the scientific community, and that the only REAL controversy, is that you want public dollars to teach your faith. And keep anyone else from teaching their own.


I have no problem if you want to teach the "alternatives" at home. I have no problem if you want to teach the "alternatives" in a Sunday school. Or in a summer camp. Please, do so. But knowing, that they do not coincide with good science, and that if you insist on injecting your faith over all others, it's not going to make you real popular, and it may hamper you like a Bob Jones degree may keep you from a post at a real university that has actual accreditation, as opposed to some lackadaisical standard that you pull out of your tochis.


Admit it. ID and the rest are just this, and in the words of the founder of your movement...

lh5.googleusercontent.com
 
2013-01-15 10:37:57 PM
Good for him. If private religious schools want to push creationism, let them. My problem is when the state contributes funding to them. That should definitely not happen. Likewise public schools should not be able to throw out legitimate science textbooks or even be allowed to teach young earth stuff side by side with established science.
 
2013-01-15 10:38:25 PM
fark these neanderthal nutjob creationists.

I never believed in creationism even when I was still a Christian (brainwashing is a terrible thing).
 
2013-01-15 10:38:38 PM
A well deserved Hero tag! There needs to be more folks like this taking on the Theocrats and their ignorant, superstitious constituents.
 
2013-01-15 10:38:38 PM

BronyMedic: SkinnyHead: I guess people who oppose academic freedom and support censorship would see this young man as a hero.  People who support academic freedom and freedom of thought probably don't.

And now it's time for a blast from the past!

[img716.imageshack.us image 594x372]


"not particularly effective against an insurgency"
 
2013-01-15 10:38:47 PM

SkinnyHead: I guess people who oppose academic freedom and support censorship would see this young man as a hero. People who support academic freedom and freedom of thought probably don't.


SkinnyHead, you've been lied to. Probably all your life, and most likely by those closest to you. You should be pissed about that. Instead, you attack the messenger. Have you given much thought to your own motivations?

For everyone else, here's how to help:

National Center for Science Education

Freedom from Religion Foundation

Americans United for Separation of Church and State

People like SkinnyHead are expected to give 10% of their pretax income to help us all back into the Dark Ages, and quite a few of them actually live up to their commitment. Is it too much to ask that the rest of us pony up $50 every once in awhile to support organizations that, in turn, support people like Zack Kopplin?
 
2013-01-15 10:39:11 PM

HighZoolander: 4seasons85!: I think there should be a separate class that teaches world beliefs. It should teach general beliefs about the major world religions and the beliefs of athiests. This way people are informed at least some what as to what others believe and they are given a choice of what to believe. It will cover creationism and why people believe it in this class. However this may be too logical and not enough Jesus for some people.

If you think there was a shiatstorm about teaching science to the kids of these people, wait until the government tries to inform their kids about other religious beliefs.


Oh I know I can see it now: "government trying to make Johnny a mooslim!!" ... It's just a dream I guess.
 
2013-01-15 10:40:35 PM

Asphyxium: I never believed in creationism even when I was still a Christian (brainwashing is a terrible thing).


I'm also a recovering Christian myself. I fear any organization that makes any otherwise sane and intelligent adult believe in silly crap like Cretinism or Transubstantiation. Seriously, Catholics, if the bread and wine are literally Jesus' body and blood, then you are literally practicing cannibalism...
 
2013-01-15 10:41:04 PM

spidermilk:

The other day two church chicks came to my door and I thought "Ok, stay cool, don't be an asshole" and they gave me a little pamplet and told me where their church was. I said "Great, thanks! have a good one." and they didn't turn around to leave. Instead, the chick goes "Let me ask you- if you died today are you SURE-" and right there I rudely cut her off and said 'I'm an athiest so I don't believe in god." and she just said "WELL THERE IS A GOD!" and I said "ok, we all have our own beliefs- bye!"

and then I felt bad the rest of the day like I should have just said thanks and bye again instead of getting made and freaking her out.


No reason for you to feel bad about anything. She knocked on YOUR door with the intent to challenge YOUR beliefs. They're out there proselytising to sway people to join their "one true path" and if she can't handle a little atheist push back, she shouldn't be knocking on stranger's doors like that.
 
2013-01-15 10:42:06 PM

Psycat: Geez, folks, why do you keep responding to the troll ShiattyHead? I can block his posts, but I can't block responses to his posts and every time I accidentally read something he wrote, I lose brain cells. Please don't feed the trolls, already!!!


welcometofark.jpg

/had to be done
 
2013-01-15 10:42:45 PM
biatch about the south all you want, and you would be justified, but PLEASE remember that there are good things too. How about we as a country get rid of Bostonian pallid trash, and we all get the benefit of decent biscuits? We could lose the fundamentalism, and enjoy manners and shrimp-and-grits? We could blow up Bob Jones University, and have a big Low Country boil? Alternately, we could get rid of TERRIBLE southern dirvers, and get decent bagels, lox, and a non-laughable universtiy system...

/p.s. i know I'm generalizing, thank you.
 
2013-01-15 10:45:40 PM
How about we teach ALL the possibilities...

lh5.googleusercontent.com
lh3.googleusercontent.com
lh6.googleusercontent.com
lh6.googleusercontent.com
lh6.googleusercontent.com

And while we're at it...

lh3.googleusercontent.com
 
2013-01-15 10:45:56 PM
I don't give a shiat about creation and/or evolution, religion nor politics, but I find this amusing FTA:

"Kopplin, who is studying history at Rice University, had good reason to be upset after"

...he will be flipping burgers soon.
 
2013-01-15 10:46:20 PM

spidermilk: My first thought was "Please let this kid not be an asshole." and then I read the article and he sounds like a total non-asshole. Just calmly and semi-quietly doing what he thinks is right. And not just to prove that he is smarter than him, but because he wants Louisianans to be successful.

The other day two church chicks came to my door and I thought "Ok, stay cool, don't be an asshole" and they gave me a little pamplet and told me where their church was. I said "Great, thanks! have a good one." and they didn't turn around to leave. Instead, the chick goes "Let me ask you- if you died today are you SURE-" and right there I rudely cut her off and said 'I'm an athiest so I don't believe in god." and she just said "WELL THERE IS A GOD!" and I said "ok, we all have our own beliefs- bye!"

and then I felt bad the rest of the day like I should have just said thanks and bye again instead of getting made and freaking her out.


Don't sell yourself short. I think you should feel good about yourself for not locking them both up in your rape dungeon.

/kidding
//unless you really have a rape dungeon
 
2013-01-15 10:46:30 PM

saturn badger: Psycat: Geez, folks, why do you keep responding to the troll ShiattyHead? I can block his posts, but I can't block responses to his posts and every time I accidentally read something he wrote, I lose brain cells. Please don't feed the trolls, already!!!

welcometofark.jpg

/had to be done


I've already blocked ShiattyHead. I'd hate to block everybody who responds to him because some of those Farkers might have something intelligent to contribute...
 
2013-01-15 10:47:28 PM
 
2013-01-15 10:48:08 PM
www.dudelol.com
 
2013-01-15 10:49:16 PM

Charlie Chingas: Seriously, WTF is wrong with you "Christians"? Isn't mankind old enough NOT to believe in fairy tales anymore?


The issues isn't believing in fairy tales, it's that fairy tales are being taught as science. If people want to believe that a benevolent force created the universe and cares about each and every human being out there, who cares? Teaching highschool science students that the rules and processes that govern the universe and its components can only be found in an infallible 2000 year old book is the real issue. The technology and sciences that drive our civilization (and our economies) forward is based on those governing rules; teaching students that the scientific method, arguably the most powerful thing humans have created, can be replaced by reading a book that basically says "A wizard did it" undermines future discovery, growth and progress.
 
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