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(TampaBay.com (St. Petersburg Tim)   While you were busy clearing your thetans, Agents Mulder and Scully were conducting the first FBI investigation into Scientology in 30 years   (tampabay.com) divider line 116
    More: Interesting, FBI, Scientology, First Amendment, David Miscavige, Marty Rathbun, Sea Org, mind control, Church of Scientology  
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16560 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Jan 2013 at 11:45 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-13 10:47:01 AM
Did they finally google Lisa McPherson?
 
2013-01-13 10:51:09 AM
And I thought the Mormons were bad...
 
2013-01-13 10:51:33 AM
No word from the smoking man?
 
2013-01-13 10:51:57 AM
Who cares about Scientology? of all the stupid things to hitch a war wagon to, what made people picked a lame duck target for their ire?
 
2013-01-13 11:00:00 AM
I say it every time one of these threads comes up... but kudos to the Times for being the one paper with the stones to stand up to the Co$. Someday if the feds DO manage to bust Scientology and the whole thing crumbles, I hope the Times goes down in history for being the one media outlet that was actually reporting the abuses from the beginning in spite of the threats they've endured for it.
 
2013-01-13 11:03:53 AM

Tali: I say it every time one of these threads comes up... but kudos to the Times for being the one paper with the stones to stand up to the Co$. Someday if the feds DO manage to bust Scientology and the whole thing crumbles, I hope the Times goes down in history for being the one media outlet that was actually reporting the abuses from the beginning in spite of the threats they've endured for it.


Living here in St. Pete as long as I have and with a bent for this stuff I've met Times reporters who have been crazy harassed for reporting on this stuff. I think it's sort of personal at this point cause the Times is sure hell-bent on ruining the "church" now, and good for them, they are one of the few good newspapers left.
 
2013-01-13 11:06:21 AM
I can pay you thousands of dollars for bad sci-fi and get punched in the face when my free labor isn't up to your standards?

Sign me up!
 
2013-01-13 11:09:00 AM

duffblue: Who cares about Scientology? of all the stupid things to hitch a war wagon to, what made people picked a lame duck target for their ire?


So don't come into threads about Scientology.

Problem solved!

You don't even need to share your feelings about it.
 
2013-01-13 11:11:49 AM
How is this different from what the Jehovah's Witnesses did at their HQ in Bethel (and now at Walkill, NY)? Forced servitude for the duration of their commitment or you get shunned by your family for failing the "privilege", A $34 per month "salary" in exchange for 80 hour work weeks that include 50-60 in the plant or farm and an additional 60 hours per month service obligation to maintain Pioneer status, frequent room searches, controlled I-Net access, frequent verbal abuse from the "bosses".

All cults are the same; a bunch of functional sociopaths manage to find each other for their personal gain and amusement.
 
2013-01-13 11:13:54 AM

Turbo Cojones: How is this different from what the Jehovah's Witnesses did at their HQ in Bethel (and now at Walkill, NY)? Forced servitude for the duration of their commitment or you get shunned by your family for failing the "privilege", A $34 per month "salary" in exchange for 80 hour work weeks that include 50-60 in the plant or farm and an additional 60 hours per month service obligation to maintain Pioneer status, frequent room searches, controlled I-Net access, frequent verbal abuse from the "bosses".

All cults are the same; a bunch of functional sociopaths manage to find each other for their personal gain and amusement.


I think the argument is that we sane people should stop allowing these lunatics to get away with this crazy nonsense, and all tax-free and religious-exempt.
 
2013-01-13 11:14:28 AM

Lionel Mandrake: duffblue: Who cares about Scientology? of all the stupid things to hitch a war wagon to, what made people picked a lame duck target for their ire?

So don't come into threads about Scientology.

Problem solved!

You don't even need to share your feelings about it.


He's attempting to shame us, you know, like he's been programmed to.
 
2013-01-13 11:14:35 AM
disinfo.s3.amazonaws.com
 
2013-01-13 11:14:47 AM
Remember, Scientology doesn't have to pay taxes.

AT ALL.
 
2013-01-13 11:17:32 AM
At least Katie Holmes got away from them.
 
2013-01-13 11:19:06 AM

duffblue: Who cares about Scientology? of all the stupid things to hitch a war wagon to, what made people picked a lame duck target for their ire?


i.imgur.com
 
2013-01-13 11:19:47 AM

Confabulat: Living here in St. Pete as long as I have and with a bent for this stuff I've met Times reporters who have been crazy harassed for reporting on this stuff. I think it's sort of personal at this point cause the Times is sure hell-bent on ruining the "church" now, and good for them, they are one of the few good newspapers left.


I believe it. Those people are absolutely, unrepentantly evil, and they genuinely believe they have such a stranglehold on the world - or at least our local Bay area - that they're going to get away with it forever.

Hubby once worked for a small software company in Clearwater that turned out to be owned by Scientologists. Funny how they suddenly 'didn't need a tech support/webmaster anymore, the sales team can handle it' (the 'sales team' was one sixty-odd-year-old woman who couldn't check email without referring to hardcopy instructions) and he got 'laid off' a week after refusing to bring home a bunch of church books for the family and refusing to bring me to some kind of meeting after work one day to explain why the whole family needed to read and observe what was in the books.
 
2013-01-13 11:22:14 AM
FTFA: He could come and go from the church's International Base with a freedom other workers didn't enjoy.

W. T. F.?

/should that last period be there?
 
2013-01-13 11:22:49 AM
For those of you who missed it, see The Master. Amazingly, it didn't get an Oscar nod.
 
2013-01-13 11:24:56 AM

orbister: FTFA: He could come and go from the church's International Base with a freedom other workers didn't enjoy.

W. T. F.?

/should that last period be there?


I think so, as it is denoting the abbreviation.
 
2013-01-13 11:26:00 AM

Tali: Confabulat: Living here in St. Pete as long as I have and with a bent for this stuff I've met Times reporters who have been crazy harassed for reporting on this stuff. I think it's sort of personal at this point cause the Times is sure hell-bent on ruining the "church" now, and good for them, they are one of the few good newspapers left.

I believe it. Those people are absolutely, unrepentantly evil, and they genuinely believe they have such a stranglehold on the world - or at least our local Bay area - that they're going to get away with it forever.

Hubby once worked for a small software company in Clearwater that turned out to be owned by Scientologists. Funny how they suddenly 'didn't need a tech support/webmaster anymore, the sales team can handle it' (the 'sales team' was one sixty-odd-year-old woman who couldn't check email without referring to hardcopy instructions) and he got 'laid off' a week after refusing to bring home a bunch of church books for the family and refusing to bring me to some kind of meeting after work one day to explain why the whole family needed to read and observe what was in the books.


Yeah I rented from the CO$ for a year but didn't realize it until I wandered into the realty office with the LRH quotes all over the walls. Eh, I've had worse landlords.

One of the oddest things I've noticed about Scientologists over the years is how many of them smoke. It's like 1972 with those guys.
 
2013-01-13 11:38:34 AM
subtlebluntness.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-01-13 11:45:21 AM
Buildings they have Ybor are kind of creepy. Video cameras at head level every 30 feet or so all the way around the building. Aluminum vertical antennas on every building that I heard are used to communicate to their Sea Org ship, when it is out to sea. Lots of folks wearing black shirts, pants and coats, carrying brief cases and such.
 
2013-01-13 11:51:53 AM
whstevs. religious people are stupid sheeple. no laws broken-- they are getting what they signed up for
 
2013-01-13 11:54:10 AM

Turbo Cojones: All cults religions are the same; a bunch of functional sociopaths manage to find each other for their personal gain and amusement.


Fixed that for you.
 
2013-01-13 12:02:01 PM

gaslight: For those of you who missed it, see The Master. Amazingly, it didn't get an Oscar nod.


Troll Tom Cruise and have him announce the best picture noms?
 
2013-01-13 12:03:41 PM

willfullyobscure: whstevs. religious people are stupid sheeple. no laws broken-- they are getting what they signed up for


You dont pay much attention to anything, do you?
 
2013-01-13 12:04:54 PM
*I* want to believe...

/that we can shut the whole thing down
 
Ral
2013-01-13 12:04:55 PM
I don't understand how it is legal, regardless of religious freedom, to hold people captive and to violate state and Federal labor laws. Because that's basically what we're talking about here.
 
2013-01-13 12:09:07 PM

duffblue: Who cares about Scientology? of all the stupid things to hitch a war wagon to, what made people picked a lame duck target for their ire?


Quick question? Who was it that initiated the largest infiltration of the US Government and it's associated intelligence, law enforcement, and administrative functions in the nation's history during the cold war.

Hint: It wasn't the Russians.

Go google "Operation Snow White"
 
2013-01-13 12:11:46 PM

Ral: I don't understand how it is legal, regardless of religious freedom, to hold people captive and to violate state and Federal labor laws. Because that's basically what we're talking about here.


It's not legal, but someone has to have the balls to prove it.
 
2013-01-13 12:11:48 PM

gaslight: For those of you who missed it, see The Master. Amazingly, it didn't get an Oscar nod.


That makes me wonder how powerful Scientology is within Hollywood's social circles...

/ this movie didn't even make it to my small city
// all of the other stuff churned out by Hollywood finds its way here
/// watched the trailer; film looks pretty good, looks like I missed out....
 
2013-01-13 12:12:16 PM

Lionel Mandrake: duffblue: Who cares about Scientology? of all the stupid things to hitch a war wagon to, what made people picked a lame duck target for their ire?

So don't come into threads about Scientology.

Problem solved!

You don't even need to share your feelings about it.


But then how would he let other people know that he's better than them?! D=
 
2013-01-13 12:13:30 PM

Uranus Is Huge!: I can pay you thousands of dollars for bad sci-fi and get punched in the face when my free labor isn't up to your standards?

Sign me up!


Just send your money and address to me, and i'll comb the internet for the worst sci fi fanfics i can deliver to you, deal
 
2013-01-13 12:18:21 PM
Scientology is a pretty bad religion, but any argument you can use to bring them down can be used against any organized religion. Once a country gets first world and civilized organized religions should be laughed at and shut down. You can pray to whatever made up crap you want to on your own time, but anything that gives pedos and stalinist types power and control over people/wealth needs to be terminated with extreme prejudice.
 
2013-01-13 12:20:07 PM

Confabulat: One of the oddest things I've noticed about Scientologists over the years is how many of them smoke. It's like 1972 with those guys.


Hubbard spoke out in favor of smoking, he smoked like a freight train and encouraged it.

Rather notoriously, amongst his other pseudo-scientific babble he actually claimed that not smoking caused lung cancer, and smoking prevents lung cancer. Thus, it's sacred scripture and holy doctrine to the Cult of Xenu.

"And they say that the cigarette causes lung cancer. And they've - you've been hearing something of this, I'm sure. Yeah. Not smoking enough will cause lung cancer. Not smoking enough will cause lung cancer!"

L. Ron Hubbard - SHSBC 35, 6107C19 (19th October 1961), "Question and Answer Period: Auditor Effect on Meter".
 
2013-01-13 12:23:04 PM

willfullyobscure: whstevs. religious people are stupid sheeple. no laws broken-- they are getting what they signed up for


That's not what the former Scientologists allege. So the FBI is obligated to investigate and make sure you are correct that no laws have been broken.

The article is a very interesting read.
 
2013-01-13 12:30:44 PM

Rathbun's five-hour interview with the FBI, Miscavige's former right-hand-man described oppressive workplace conditions and recounted incidents of abuse he had seen



Rathbun keeps claiming he didn't abuse church members, but he was the enforcer. Either he abused the members or someone following his orders did.

His testimony will never hold up in court.

I think that's the problem with a lot of the informers, they themselves are guilty of a lot of things. The church will provide plenty of "auditing" sessions where the informers admit doing bad things.

LRH was a genuis when it came to oppressing people.
 
2013-01-13 12:31:08 PM

loonatic112358: Uranus Is Huge!: I can pay you thousands of dollars for bad sci-fi and get punched in the face when my free labor isn't up to your standards?

Sign me up!

Just send your money and address to me, and i'll comb the internet for the worst sci fi fanfics i can deliver to you, deal


Sadly, your offer lacks any mention of forced labor or face punches.
 
2013-01-13 12:37:04 PM
If you want to know more about Scientology indoctrination techniques, beliefs and methods, check out Operation Clambake, which has been online since 1996.
 
2013-01-13 12:40:55 PM

Uranus Is Huge!: Sadly, your offer lacks any mention of forced labor or face punches.


you remodel my house for me, and if you fail to meet my high expectations you get a free punch to the face
 
2013-01-13 12:54:35 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-01-13 12:54:47 PM
Meh I heard same propaganda against Soviet Union, pre-war Germany and North Korea

Why CIA hates their freedom?
 
2013-01-13 01:03:50 PM
There is no way Scientology is a religion. It's more like a self-help scam that also believes in aliens. Here comes the snarkiness about how all religions are goofy but only the reason they scammed the gov't was to be tax-free. They don't worship anything except maybe Cruise, they do no charity work. Scientology isn't a religion by almost any metric.
 
2013-01-13 01:05:37 PM

Bomb Mecca: can be used against any organized religion


All religion is delusion. Imaginary beings and ghosts. Until religion is treated like a mental health issue, these problems will continue forever.

Look at all the abuse stories. They have the same theme. We reported it and were shunned. We were afraid to report it because we might be shunned. We reported and were attacked. We have data about all the reported abuse, but we wont turn it over to the police/authorities.

Dangerous delusions.
/Until someone raids the vatican and digs through all the dirty secrets ...
 
2013-01-13 01:07:25 PM
Confabulat One of the oddest things I've noticed about Scientologists over the years is how many of them smoke. It's like 1972 with those guys.

Funny, I just read this in Gawker:

Cigarette smoking (in honor of Hubbard's own habit) is "still a feature of the church's culture at the upper levels," along with 1950s slang, "casual misogyny," and a ban on perfume and scented deodorant, which leaves you with the most delightful image of high-profile Scientologists acting like disaffected greasers.
 
2013-01-13 01:10:34 PM

Mugato: There is no way Scientology is a religion. It's more like a self-help scam that also believes in aliens. Here comes the snarkiness about how all religions are goofy but only the reason they scammed the gov't was to be tax-free. They don't worship anything except maybe Cruise, they do no charity work. Scientology isn't a religion by almost any metric.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_controversies#L._Ron_Hubbar d_ and_starting_a_religion_for_money

(The following letter, written by L. Ron Hubbard, was discovered by the FBI during its raid on Scientology headquarters)
The arrangements that have been made seem a good temporary measure. On a longer look, however, something more equitable will have to be organized. I am not quite sure what we would call the place - probably not a clinic - but I am sure that it ought to be a company, independent of the HAS [the Hubbard Association of Scientologists] but fed by the HAS. We don't want a clinic. We want one in operation but not in name. Perhaps we could call it a Spiritual Guidance Center. Think up its name, will you. And we could put in nice desks and our boys in neat blue with diplomas on the walls and 1. knock psychotherapy into history and 2. make enough money to shine up my operating scope and 3. keep the HAS solvent. It is a problem of practical business. I await your reaction on the religion angle. In my opinion, we couldn't get worse public opinion than we have had or have less customers with what we've got to sell. A religious charter would be necessary in Pennsylvania or NJ to make it stick. But I sure could make it stick. We're treating the present time beingness, psychotherapy treats the past and the brain. And brother, that's religion, not mental science.

So yah, it is a scam. Like all other religions. A way for people to make money.
Sure, some of them "help" people along the way. But in the end, it is a tax break.
WHY, in this day and age, I have no idea.
 
2013-01-13 01:10:58 PM

Mugato: There is no way Scientology is a religion. It's more like a self-help scam that also believes in aliens. Here comes the snarkiness about how all religions are goofy but only the reason they scammed the gov't was to be tax-free. They don't worship anything except maybe Cruise, they do no charity work. Scientology isn't a religion by almost any metric.


Sure they do!
 
2013-01-13 01:14:54 PM

ajgeek: And I thought the Mormons were bad...


Umm, yeah.... About that...

The FBI has been getting stocked with clean cut Mormons in recent years.

So this might be one bunch of cultists investigating another bunch of cultists.
 
2013-01-13 01:15:32 PM

namatad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_controversies#L._Ron_Hubbar d_ and_starting_a_religion_for_money


I understand he called it a religion for the tax break. I could call Jennifer Lawence my girlfriend but that doesn't make it so.
 
2013-01-13 01:20:16 PM

Mugato: namatad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_controversies#L._Ron_Hubbar d_ and_starting_a_religion_for_money

I understand he called it a religion for the tax break. I could call Jennifer Lawence my girlfriend but that doesn't make it so.


I still dont understand why they havent lost tax-exempt status in the US.
Probably one of those, "sure, but all the other religions are the same, we would have to strip all of them from tax exempt status"
 
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