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(Talking Points Memo)   Government launches "Rare Earths" department. Great, now we're blowing our money on 60's tribute bands   (idealab.talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 33
    More: Interesting, rare earths, Critical Materials Institute, Idaho National Laboratory, chemical agents, tribute bands, U.S. Department of Energy, water purification, Fields of science  
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1458 clicks; posted to Geek » on 10 Jan 2013 at 3:34 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-10 02:24:46 PM
PANIK
PEAK RARE EARTHS

Some time in the next 20 years, global climate warming cooling change and peak oil/NG will go out of favor and be replaced with we are running out of rare earths.

Oh wait, but the prices have already collapsed.
http://www.metal-pages.com/metals/cerium/metal-prices-news-informati on /

PANIK
 
2013-01-10 02:26:34 PM
i don't know about you, big brother, but i just want to celebrate.
 
2013-01-10 02:26:59 PM
That makes me just want to celebrate
 
2013-01-10 02:28:38 PM
sunnuvabiatch
 
2013-01-10 03:01:53 PM
What do I need to do to get ready for this?
 
2013-01-10 03:36:44 PM

downstairs: What do I need to do to get ready for this?


start buying massive amounts of rare earths. EVERYONE knows that resources are limited and we will start to run out and the prices will skyrocket!!!

or you can read one book by a very respected scholar (not your typical quackery) and go back to taking a nap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ultimate_Resource_(book)
 
2013-01-10 03:44:58 PM
I'd go into depth on the subject but, I know I'm losing you.
 
2013-01-10 03:49:29 PM

namatad: downstairs: What do I need to do to get ready for this?

start buying massive amounts of rare earths. EVERYONE knows that resources are limited and we will start to run out and the prices will skyrocket!!!

or you can read one book by a very respected scholar (not your typical quackery) and go back to taking a nap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ultimate_Resource_(book)


"Get Ready" is a Rare Earth hit.  ;)

/Guess my funny isn't working.
 
2013-01-10 03:59:13 PM
dl.dropbox.com

He may have an opinion about this.

/Turn the camera on and get him a soda from the nurses stash.
/and none of that diet crap.
 
2013-01-10 04:04:43 PM
Help! We must stockpile neodymium! Quick, buy all the magnets!
 
2013-01-10 04:09:42 PM
Time to corner the market on unobtanium.
 
2013-01-10 04:11:54 PM
"In 2002, the price was US$94 per kilogram. The recent changes in demand and supply have resulted in high and fluctuating prices of indium, which from 2006 to 2009 ranged from US$382/kg to US$918/kg."

/Indium
//LCDs, touchscreens, solar panels
///They're sort of popular lately.
 
2013-01-10 04:21:22 PM
Ummmmmm...... give me a grant, I have a solution!!!!

jfgreenline.com
 
2013-01-10 04:56:32 PM
Rather than export restrictions, China should just use this as an opportunity to improve regulatory standards in its mines, prices wouldn't change, or might increase but it would result in far happier people, better environmental impact and the extra costs of production involved would still flow internally albeit through different channels with the same amount (or greater) of foreign money flowing in.

US couldn't complain about the increasing prices because there would effectively be no breaches and supply would be maintained, if they want cheaper rare earths they can mine them themselves, last I heard production is incredibly demanding on the environment and workers.
 
2013-01-10 04:59:02 PM

ProfessorOhki: "In 2002, the price was US$94 per kilogram. The recent changes in demand and supply have resulted in high and fluctuating prices of indium, which from 2006 to 2009 ranged from US$382/kg to US$918/kg."

/Indium
//LCDs, touchscreens, solar panels
///They're sort of popular lately.


Yeah, indium scarcity is going to become a problem very, very fast.
 
2013-01-10 05:14:45 PM

maniacbastard: Ummmmmm...... give me a grant, I have a solution!!!!

[jfgreenline.com image 850x838]


PLEASE
they are already doing this around the world and starting to do it here
 
2013-01-10 05:16:55 PM

dyhchong: US couldn't complain about the increasing prices because there would effectively be no breaches and supply would be maintained, if they want cheaper rare earths they can mine them themselves, last I heard production is incredibly demanding on the environment and workers.


THE ONLY reason that we get stuff from elsewhere is that it is cheaper. Slave labor, no regulations? What's not to like?!
And as soon as the prices get high enough, the future kicks in: recycling, reopening mines, more research on improved methods of extraction and separation.

Oh look, our own government is investing in this today?!!
 
2013-01-10 05:19:32 PM
LazarusLong42 :

1) Indium is not a rare earth. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_earth_element
2) The conventional wisdom on Fark is that technology and sheer human will can solve any problem.
 
2013-01-10 05:26:58 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: LazarusLong42 :

1) Indium is not a rare earth. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_earth_element
2) The conventional wisdom on Fark is that technology and sheer human will can solve any problem.


most of these scarcities are artificial.
As soon as it is profitable for someone in the US or non-china to open a mine and refinery, they will do it.
Of course, the risk is that you will build out, start digging and china will relax the market.

We already know HOW to do this, cost to do it cleanly is all that is left.
New research will bring down those costs. Sooner or later.
 
2013-01-10 05:33:19 PM
i.i.com.com
 
2013-01-10 05:42:07 PM
namatad: I agree. I was just waiting for some nutjob to come screaming naked out of the bushes yelling "we need to mine asteroids LOL!".
 
2013-01-10 07:12:41 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: namatad: I agree. I was just waiting for some nutjob to come screaming naked out of the bushes yelling "we need to mine asteroids LOL!".


I'm worried about them slamming into the Earth as much as the next guy, but I hardly think an orbital minefield is a good solution.
 
2013-01-10 07:27:17 PM

ProfessorOhki: Quantum Apostrophe: namatad: I agree. I was just waiting for some nutjob to come screaming naked out of the bushes yelling "we need to mine asteroids LOL!".

I'm worried about them slamming into the Earth as much as the next guy, but I hardly think an orbital minefield is a good solution.


Why? I'm genuinely curious why you guys are shiatting on the idea of mining resources in space, sure it might be absurdly expensive for what we have going on right now but the trend seems to be gravitating towards becoming more and more permanent in space, and it would absolutely be cheaper to harvest space loot than blast it off our rock using a million gallons of fuel.

/also need to invest in starting infrastructure to start a market for prices to drop.
//or am i just wrong?
 
2013-01-10 07:53:16 PM

Dr. Goldshnoz: ProfessorOhki: Quantum Apostrophe: namatad: I agree. I was just waiting for some nutjob to come screaming naked out of the bushes yelling "we need to mine asteroids LOL!".

I'm worried about them slamming into the Earth as much as the next guy, but I hardly think an orbital minefield is a good solution.

Why? I'm genuinely curious why you guys are shiatting on the idea of mining resources in space, sure it might be absurdly expensive for what we have going on right now but the trend seems to be gravitating towards becoming more and more permanent in space, and it would absolutely be cheaper to harvest space loot than blast it off our rock using a million gallons of fuel.

/also need to invest in starting infrastructure to start a market for prices to drop.
//or am i just wrong?


Because Quantum Apostrophe hates anything that has to do with space exploration. Not even worth arguing with - seriously, look at their profile and have a good chuckle. It's basically, "space is big and hard, so why bother."

Me? I just thought it was funny to interpret "mine" in that post as "to lay explosives."
 
2013-01-10 07:53:59 PM

Dr. Goldshnoz: ProfessorOhki: Quantum Apostrophe: namatad: I agree. I was just waiting for some nutjob to come screaming naked out of the bushes yelling "we need to mine asteroids LOL!".

I'm worried about them slamming into the Earth as much as the next guy, but I hardly think an orbital minefield is a good solution.

Why? I'm genuinely curious why you guys are shiatting on the idea of mining resources in space, sure it might be absurdly expensive for what we have going on right now but the trend seems to be gravitating towards becoming more and more permanent in space, and it would absolutely be cheaper to harvest space loot than blast it off our rock using a million gallons of fuel.

/also need to invest in starting infrastructure to start a market for prices to drop.
//or am i just wrong?


I am all for space industry. But, right now it is infinitely cheaper to move materials to orbit.
Other than maybe water, N2 and O2, which would require minimal processing, mining, smelting, processing, fabricating materials in space would currently require massive amounts of infrastructure which just isnt there yet.

Even something as simple as smelting iron .... LOL
Now, maybe if you were going to do it on the moon. Cheap plentiful solar power.

but in the end, everything will need to be bootstrapped ...
and someone with billions to invest
 
2013-01-10 07:56:32 PM
I like to imagine QA is the exact opposite of the space personality sphere. Just cruises around and goes, "nooooo spaaaaaaace," "musn't go to space," "space space, fark space," "no thank you, no space," etc.
 
2013-01-10 10:05:41 PM
Maybe we should just buy a quarry in Sweden....

/Is anything too obscure for Fark???
 
2013-01-10 10:13:15 PM
ProfessorOhki: Why don't we just mine deeper into the Earth? Too hard and expensive? Why don't we try to extend our lifespan? Too hard and expensive? And what, precisely, will you be exploring? Do you think there are different elements out there than we have here?
 
2013-01-10 11:08:38 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: ProfessorOhki: Why don't we just mine deeper into the Earth? Too hard and expensive? Why don't we try to extend our lifespan? Too hard and expensive? And what, precisely, will you be exploring? Do you think there are different elements out there than we have here?


certainly a number of benefits to mining/smelting/processing on the moon.
no environmental/pollution issues

GIANT SLAG PILE? no problem
boot strapping is the problem with all advances though
 
2013-01-10 11:49:07 PM

namatad: downstairs: What do I need to do to get ready for this?

start buying massive amounts of rare earths. EVERYONE knows that resources are limited and we will start to run out and the prices will skyrocket!!!

or you can read one book by a very respected scholar (not your typical quackery) and go back to taking a nap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ultimate_Resource_(book)


Finally, someone who knows and appreciates Julian Simon. Malthusians (such his modern disciple, Ehrlich) never die, they just find another "critical resource" we're about to run out of because apparently we've never been able to find substitutes for scarce resources or ways to use them more efficiently. And there are always companies who are more than willing to feed that hysteria in order to secure subsidies and protections so they can stave off the inevitable day when they'll finally have to compete.

The U.S. government in March 2012 filed a trade case against China, the major producer of rare earths for the globe, over export restrictions.

China could make a similar complaint that the US is keeping oil prices artificially high by refusing to open up ANWR and other areas to oil exploration.
 
2013-01-11 04:42:52 AM

Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: namatad: downstairs: What do I need to do to get ready for this?

start buying massive amounts of rare earths. EVERYONE knows that resources are limited and we will start to run out and the prices will skyrocket!!!

or you can read one book by a very respected scholar (not your typical quackery) and go back to taking a nap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ultimate_Resource_(book)

Finally, someone who knows and appreciates Julian Simon. Malthusians (such his modern disciple, Ehrlich) never die, they just find another "critical resource" we're about to run out of because apparently we've never been able to find substitutes for scarce resources or ways to use them more efficiently. And there are always companies who are more than willing to feed that hysteria in order to secure subsidies and protections so they can stave off the inevitable day when they'll finally have to compete.

The U.S. government in March 2012 filed a trade case against China, the major producer of rare earths for the globe, over export restrictions.

China could make a similar complaint that the US is keeping oil prices artificially high by refusing to open up ANWR and other areas to oil exploration.


Too much complaining could lead people to ask about the current state of our trading relationship.
Probably not happening.
 
2013-01-11 06:20:51 AM
This should of been done years ago.

Welp, I expect things to start breaking down when rare earths become too rare to find.
 
2013-01-11 02:58:11 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: ProfessorOhki: Why don't we just mine deeper into the Earth? Too hard and expensive? Why don't we try to extend our lifespan? Too hard and expensive? And what, precisely, will you be exploring? Do you think there are different elements out there than we have here?


This might come as a shock to you, but many things in the universe aren't elemental. No, I don't think asteroid mining is reasonable given the resources on Earth, but yours a stupid argument anyway: "oh, why go west, do you think there's different elements in California than Virginia?!" You explore because stuff is there and you haven't studied it yet; it's that simple.

Doesn't have to be space, there's plenty of things on Earth that warrant exploration. Space just happens to be big and out there; the frontier so to speak. If you haven't noticed, we do try to extend our lifespans. You seem to think that you can only do one type of exploration or research at a time; that's retarded.
 
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