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(New York Magazine)   If Jack Lew is confirmed as Treasury secretary, he's either going to have to change his penmanship or US dollar bills are going to start bearing the most craptacular signature ever   (nymag.com) divider line 61
    More: Scary, Jack Lew, United States, dollars, drinking straws, treasury secretary  
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22969 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Jan 2013 at 4:57 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-01-09 05:06:18 PM  
5 votes:
It's a little dangerous because it makes you question why we do anything with signatures (99.9% of the time they aren't checked, they are never identical, wtf 12th-century-bs-is-this?). Rather like minting a trillion dollar coin makes you question what the fark a dollar is. They're both pertinent questions, but they're questions everyone would rather not have raised.
2013-01-09 05:41:48 PM  
4 votes:

Nehllah: I acknowledge that you're trolling, but now that everyone can type almost as fast as they can think cursive is pretty pointless.


When modern Americans think of cursive, they imagine that they're part of a long unbroken cultural tradition going back hundreds of years. They see a loss of cursive as a loss of cultural tradition; we are abandoning the handwriting of our forefathers.

But what we think of as cursive was basically just a number of different scripts that were developed by educators in the late 19th century because they were a suitable match for the type of fountain pens that were available to students at the time, and because the body motions used to teach those scripts matched whatever crackpot theories of industrial education the creators happened to believe in.

What I'm saying is that cursive has existed only because of false nostalgia since the invention of the ball point pen.
2013-01-09 06:17:44 PM  
3 votes:
He'll change. Geitner did.
www.marketplace.org
2013-01-09 06:06:50 PM  
3 votes:
Stop making dollar bills, make $1 coins instead. Problem solved. You're welcome. For bonus points, eliminate the penny, and maybe the nickel too.
2013-01-09 05:22:24 PM  
3 votes:

pudding7: Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.


Banker didn't know his stuff - the answer is "your signature".

With respect to the promissory note, UCC 3-401 validated your chicken scratch signature, even if it was just an "X". UCC 3-401 states "(b) A signature may be made . . . (ii) by the use of any name, including a trade or assumed name, or by a word, mark, or symbol executed or adopted by a person with present intention to authenticate a writing. . ." With respect to a lot of the other instruments, it's covered by state law, but I'm not aware of any state law that requires a signature to be legible letters...
2013-01-09 05:15:56 PM  
3 votes:

pudding7: Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.


Bad idea to ask certain types of people to make a decision on the spot, particularly anyone who's work involves constantly checking people against a checklist provided by someone else before passing that info on to another person who rechecks and actually signs off on it. Just scrawl down your signature and let them work out later if there is an issue.
2013-01-09 05:09:23 PM  
3 votes:
americanbuilt.us
2013-01-09 04:59:10 PM  
3 votes:
Am I the only who found the caption on TFA picture hilarious?
2013-01-09 04:49:17 PM  
3 votes:
Meh.  A more interesting article would have been "Treasury secretaries through history changing their signatures when it actually comes time to sign US money."  They briefly referenced one example at the end.
2013-01-09 04:32:48 PM  
3 votes:
Thanks for stealing my "worst signature anyone has ever seen" throne. Seriously, people mock mine all the time. Even doctors recoil in horror when they see it. Am not sure how I developed it, but it seems to have happened around college when I had to sign so many forms that one day I said, "Fark it, I'm going in dry" and began scribbling. Prior to that it was legible.

/the lady at the DMV actually said, "Really? This is your signature?"
//she also didn't remind me to take off my baseball cap, so now my license is apparently issue to a retard in a New Orleans Saints hat who can't write his own name
2013-01-09 04:02:25 PM  
3 votes:
Love it.
2013-01-10 08:45:02 AM  
2 votes:

The Larch: Lawnchair: It's a little dangerous because it makes you question why we do anything with signatures (99.9% of the time they aren't checked, they are never identical, wtf 12th-century-bs-is-this?). Rather like minting a trillion dollar coin makes you question what the fark a dollar is. They're both pertinent questions, but they're questions everyone would rather not have raised.

Well, if it makes you feel any better, all across America election clerks with absolutely no training in handwriting analysis used signature validation to throw out tens of thousands of absentee ballots in our last election. So, signatures are still used as a pretext to systematically disenfranchise voters. You can't say that we don't use them for anything.


I don't sign the back of cards because they never farking look anyway. And when they do, it's a *signature* are they looking to see if it's the same name even? Nope... I prefer to give them a clear, obvious reason, if they are told to look at the backs of cards, to ask for ID.

Elsewise, I've signed my name as Shamu before. That shiat doesn't matter and nobody cares. Cursive is stupid and art is dead.
2013-01-09 11:13:52 PM  
2 votes:
pixel.nymag.com
2013-01-09 05:19:55 PM  
2 votes:

2xhelix: Geez it looks like Billy's path home in Family Circus.  Maybe he should switch to a plain simple X.


It's actually a very good signature. Signatures with loops are much harder to forge because the strokes are heavily tied to the geometry of your hand. Something like this would be very difficult to replicate and still look smooth. If you don't believe me try it. Note that the arc traced by the lowest point of each loop is distinctive.
2013-01-09 05:19:38 PM  
2 votes:
When people look at my signature, I say, "I don't have the education of a doctor, but I do have the signature of one". It is bad. And it seems like the harder I try, the worse it gets.
2013-01-09 05:17:23 PM  
2 votes:

toraque: AngryTeacher: If this is the worst of our problems, we are in pretty good shape.

It's not.  We've just decided to focus on the piddly small problems, since we've given up trying to solve the horrible, world-destroying ones.


Remember when we were the country that could accomplish anything?
2013-01-09 05:16:26 PM  
2 votes:
I'll just leave this here.,..
galeri5.uludagsozluk.com
2013-01-09 05:13:35 PM  
2 votes:

Thisbymaster: Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.


Cursive is kind of unnecessary.
2013-01-09 05:13:20 PM  
2 votes:

pudding7: Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.


In my state it only legal to write our your ENTIRE (first, middle, and last) name when buying a house, no shortcuts. The lawyer was definitely prepared for this, he basically instructed me "not your signature, just write it our in cursive", knowing the two are rarely the same.
2013-01-09 05:13:03 PM  
2 votes:
I actually think that's a cool signature.
2013-01-09 02:54:35 PM  
2 votes:
Geez it looks like Billy's path home in Family Circus.  Maybe he should switch to a plain simple X.
2013-01-10 06:04:25 AM  
1 votes:
pumasunleashed.files.wordpress.com

"Lew's nomination was followed with criticism[32][33][34][35] after renewed reports that he received over $900,000 in bonuses while working as COO of Citigroup, following the company's $45 billion in TARP rescue funds"


Hmmm, no conflict of interest there.

The fox guarding the henhouse...
2013-01-10 06:00:34 AM  
1 votes:
"In June 2006, Lew was named chief operating officer of Citigroup's Alternative Investments unit, a proprietary trading group. The unit he oversaw invested in a hedge fund "that bet on the housing market to collapse.""


Great, just what we need. Exchanging one crooked Wall Street insider (Geithner) that was an accessory to the financial Crash of 2008 for another (Lew).

Whether Democrat or Republican, TBTB that run and own this country can't be stopped.
2013-01-10 01:50:20 AM  
1 votes:

theknuckler_33: Thisbymaster: Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.

My kid is in 4th grade and has learned cursive... in public school.

Her penmanship is better than mine.


I was required to use nothing but cursive in the 4th grade(back in 1980). Soon as it was over, no more of that.

"But your handwriting was so nice!"
"Yeah, it took me 2 seconds per letter for everything!"
x23
2013-01-10 01:41:25 AM  
1 votes:
all i know is that my previous very nice handwriting is practically illegible these days... thanks to the last 15-20 years of using a computer as a primary means of writing anything. even worse now that i don't even use it to write shopping lists / to-do lists (thanks smartphone).

in high school / college my mom could write in cursive in a mirror image faster than she could normally. would take all her notes that way. it looks pretty weird. but if you hold it to a mirror it looks just like it would had she written it correctly. /csb
2013-01-10 01:02:20 AM  
1 votes:
CSB time:

When I trained in pro-wrestling, one of the traveling and off-time things my trainer did (And he was very big on the non-ring stuff... the things that make you a good character) was to learn to sign things. Signing our name - not our real name of course, and not our real signature, but our character or a fake version of our signature. Fake because use your "Real" signature and people could try to sign checks with it. Heels signed with sharp points and very fast - like they didn't want to do it. Faces sign with loopy, interesting, clean letters that look distinctive and are friendly.

For about 3 months after a day of signing a notebook repeatedly as my character at the time while on a long train ride I couldn't sign my real signature. It permanently changed how I do it in real life - everyone says I have an awesome signature.

/no, no examples
//no, I never got anywhere wrestling, got hurt before I got to do anything fun
///and McMahon sucks.
2013-01-09 11:41:18 PM  
1 votes:

911Jenny: pudding7: Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.

People make comments on my signature all the time. One cashier actually cleared mine off the digital pad and told me to use my real one. I said it was and showed her my license and FOID card.

Everyone says I made it up but when I write my name in cursive next to my signature is when they can suddenly see the J,q, and s. it just mutated along the years.

Someone once asked if it would change should I get married and change my last name. I really don't know.


I have two signatures, basically.  I have to sign off on stuff at work all the stupid time, for credit card slips, etc., and it's illegible but unique, fairly consistent, and damn quick.  For anything official, I have something that's still unique but fair more legible, and takes more annoying time.. so that one for drivers license, taxes, etc.  I just do the quick illegible but unique one for the bank 'cause they know me anyway, unless there's a new teller.

As I've grown older, essentially, my signature's just changed into my Dad's, and more or less is just 5 lines even though my name has 16 letters.

/I LEARNED IT FROM WATCHING YOU, DAD.
2013-01-09 11:15:54 PM  
1 votes:
I hope he doesn't change it. At least sign your real signature to those bogus bucks.
2013-01-09 09:41:36 PM  
1 votes:
Hmmm. If you change the first letters in Jack Lew around, you get "Lack Jew."

Does Obama's cabinet have any Jews in it? Is this his way of trolling the Jewish population and punishing Israel?

Think about it.
2013-01-09 08:09:00 PM  
1 votes:

1. Put snakes on plane: cptjeff: For a few hundred years, it's been the dominant form of written english. It's still in regular use by a whole hell of a lot of people, myself included, and learning to write cursive is how you learn to read it. It's necessary.

Nothing written in cursive is necessary for anyone else to read. If it's imperative that someone else understand, print or type it. Cursive is dead and needs to be buried because it's stinking up the joint.


I'm sorry, but the onus is on you to be able to read and write the english language, and cursive script is still a pretty major part of the written form of the language. If you can't do that, I don't particularly feel like it's my responsibility to go out of my way to accommodate your deficiency. You lacking the basic skills required to read your own language is not really my problem.
2013-01-09 08:00:59 PM  
1 votes:

Nehllah: I acknowledge that you're trolling, but now that everyone can type almost as fast as they can think cursive is pretty pointless.


The most useful class I ever took was keyboarding class when I was in Jr High in the 80s.
2013-01-09 07:55:51 PM  
1 votes:
I have , for all intents and purposes, forgotten how to write by hand, at least in cursive. I can still print in big caps because my job requires it. I do have a pretty legible signiture.

John Lew's the man, credited with a lot of the Obama win and putting the GOP in the hot seat over the fiscal cliff.

Like Hagel and Kerry, he will be an excellent Cabinet secretary
2013-01-09 07:46:19 PM  
1 votes:

dickfreckle: Thanks for stealing my "worst signature anyone has ever seen" throne. Seriously, people mock mine all the time. Even doctors recoil in horror when they see it. Am not sure how I developed it, but it seems to have happened around college when I had to sign so many forms that one day I said, "Fark it, I'm going in dry" and began scribbling. Prior to that it was legible.

/the lady at the DMV actually said, "Really? This is your signature?"
//she also didn't remind me to take off my baseball cap, so now my license is apparently issue to a retard in a New Orleans Saints hat who can't write his own name


Silver lining: that'll give you a little bit more leeway on a DUI stop.

"Honestly occifer. I'm naturally this idiotic looking!"
2013-01-09 07:27:09 PM  
1 votes:
Not to sound judgemental myself, but man, what a stupid thing to be so judgemental over. Who cares how he signs his name?

American priorities are baffling. If he scrawled it on his gun, would you still make him change it? Or would that count as registering the firearm?
2013-01-09 07:15:18 PM  
1 votes:
Oh, and fwiw I like Lew's signature as is.
2013-01-09 07:01:21 PM  
1 votes:
Who the fark even looks at the signature on their money?
2013-01-09 06:58:58 PM  
1 votes:

The Larch: Nehllah: I acknowledge that you're trolling, but now that everyone can type almost as fast as they can think cursive is pretty pointless.

When modern Americans think of cursive, they imagine that they're part of a long unbroken cultural tradition going back hundreds of years. They see a loss of cursive as a loss of cultural tradition; we are abandoning the handwriting of our forefathers.

But what we think of as cursive was basically just a number of different scripts that were developed by educators in the late 19th century because they were a suitable match for the type of fountain pens that were available to students at the time, and because the body motions used to teach those scripts matched whatever crackpot theories of industrial education the creators happened to believe in.

What I'm saying is that cursive has existed only because of false nostalgia since the invention of the ball point pen.


Wrong. STANDARDIZED Cursive has only existed since the late 19th Century. People before that still wrote in cursive script, it's just that the exact choice of how to write various letters varied from person to person- see John Hancock's J upthread. My cursive isn't precisely standard, either- I hate the loopy A in the standard script, so I use one that looks pretty much like the one the Braves use on their hat. My S doesn't have that diagonal line and loop at the top, and some of my letter to letter transitions join with a point rather than the smooth hump that the standard form tells you to use. Cursive isn't used because of nostalgia or whatever, it's just a very practical and efficient way to write.


wingnut396: Nehllah: Thisbymaster: Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.

I acknowledge that you're trolling, but now that everyone can type almost as fast as they can think cursive is pretty pointless.

Since they are no longer writing with quills and ink or fountain pens, cursive is pretty farking pointless. Better to teach them to properly and efficiently use a keyboard.


Because all written communication ever will be done with a computer and a keyboard? Hate to break it to ya, but while typing is obviously the dominant form of writing today, handwriting will never, ever, go away. And yes, knowing how to read the system of handwriting that has dominated for centuries because it can create a fairly neat result easily and quickly is a pretty damn useful skill.
2013-01-09 06:33:24 PM  
1 votes:
2013-01-09 06:29:52 PM  
1 votes:

Nehllah: Thisbymaster: Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.

I acknowledge that you're trolling, but now that everyone can type almost as fast as they can think cursive is pretty pointless.


Since they are no longer writing with quills and ink or fountain pens, cursive is pretty farking pointless. Better to teach them to properly and efficiently use a keyboard.
2013-01-09 06:29:38 PM  
1 votes:
What use are those signatures on credit card machines? I purposely make the most unintelligible scribble I can.
The technology exists that every one of those could be a thumbprint reader, it would do away with a massive amount of CC fraud.
2013-01-09 06:00:39 PM  
1 votes:
I read 'craptacular' as 'caterpillar' surprised by the accuracy.
2013-01-09 05:56:50 PM  
1 votes:
Lew could change us over to the Lev, Bulgaria's special currency. While the bills today have a readable signature, the old commie ones didn't.

thedesigninspiration.com

www.shopbulgaria.com
2013-01-09 05:48:00 PM  
1 votes:
Also when I first started at my job the director told me I had to change my signature to make it legible in case I ever had to sign court documents or whatever.

I refused and said that would probably only cause more problems should the validity of my signature ever come into question. May as well stay consistent and know it is mine.

FWIW, I have beautiful penmanship.
2013-01-09 05:38:56 PM  
1 votes:
I think his signature is hilarious! Can't wait to see it on money.
2013-01-09 05:36:29 PM  
1 votes:

pudding7: Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.


I thought the whole point of a signature was that it was a signifier for the person signing? As in, any jackass could just sign someone's name and not actually be that person, but a signature is something unique to the individual and more difficult to forge. In defense of all the Bank guys you've dealt with, there's usually a spot on a legal document to print the signee's names, and it's sort of assumed that the signature in all the different spots is done by the signee mentioned in the document.
2013-01-09 05:34:41 PM  
1 votes:
a.abcnews.com
2013-01-09 05:32:08 PM  
1 votes:
For comparison's sake

http://www.uspapermoney.info/sign/secretaries.html

Henry H Fowler FTW
2013-01-09 05:26:17 PM  
1 votes:
His penmanship may suck, but I heard a story about Jack Lew on NPR a few weeks ago. Apparently, Boehner and Cantor don't like negotiating with him because he's too smart for their wharrgarble.

That's reason enough for me to confirm him.
2013-01-09 05:23:32 PM  
1 votes:

pudding7: Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.


Maybe I'm completely missing the point, but a signature isn't supposed to be legible so much as it's supposed to be consistent, hard to replicate, and identifiable based on a known sample (not that any one ever has any reason to bother). A sort of random looking scribble can be that, a loopy line that I can draw right now having looked at it for 15 seconds, not so much.

Thisbymaster: Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.


I acknowledge that you're trolling, but now that everyone can type almost as fast as they can think cursive is pretty pointless.
2013-01-09 05:22:11 PM  
1 votes:

AngryTeacher: toraque: AngryTeacher: If this is the worst of our problems, we are in pretty good shape.

It's not.  We've just decided to focus on the piddly small problems, since we've given up trying to solve the horrible, world-destroying ones.

Remember when we were the country that could accomplish anything?


Not really.
2013-01-09 05:21:59 PM  
1 votes:

Lawnchair: It's a little dangerous because it makes you question why we do anything with signatures (99.9% of the time they aren't checked, they are never identical, wtf 12th-century-bs-is-this?). Rather like minting a trillion dollar coin makes you question what the fark a dollar is. They're both pertinent questions, but they're questions everyone would rather not have raised.


Well, if it makes you feel any better, all across America election clerks with absolutely no training in handwriting analysis used signature validation to throw out tens of thousands of absentee ballots in our last election. So, signatures are still used as a pretext to systematically disenfranchise voters. You can't say that we don't use them for anything.
2013-01-09 05:18:48 PM  
1 votes:

Thisbymaster: Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.


My kid is in 4th grade and has learned cursive... in public school.

Her penmanship is better than mine.
2013-01-09 05:10:07 PM  
1 votes:

AngryTeacher: If this is the worst of our problems, we are in pretty good shape.


It's not.  We've just decided to focus on the piddly small problems, since we've given up trying to solve the horrible, world-destroying ones.
2013-01-09 05:07:50 PM  
1 votes:
Well the next generation isn't being taught how to write in cursive so this is only going to get worse.
2013-01-09 05:02:22 PM  
1 votes:
I like these:
upload.wikimedia.org

Christopher Columbus.
2013-01-09 05:02:11 PM  
1 votes:
Sounds like a conversation I've had the few times we've refinanced our mortgage.

Bank guy: "sign your name everywhere there's a tab"
Me: "do you want my signature or do you want me to sign my name?"
Bank guy: "Huh?"
Me: "Well, my signature is illegible and no longer has much to do with the letters in my name.  Or I could just write my name in cursive, but that's not really my signature.  Which do you want?"
Bank guy: "Uhm...."

I think we've refinance three times, and each time they seem completely unprepared for this situation.  I can't be the only one who's signature looks nothing like their name.
2013-01-09 05:01:24 PM  
1 votes:
So the new Treasury Secretary is OoooooO?
2013-01-09 04:12:46 PM  
1 votes:
www.catherineomega.com

Even the bill from Idiocracy seems to have a legible signature on it, instead of a squiggle.
2013-01-09 04:06:22 PM  
1 votes:
i105.photobucket.com
2013-01-09 04:02:37 PM  
1 votes:
I may have to revise my "Obama's cabinet is his prerogative" position now.
2013-01-09 03:26:12 PM  
1 votes:
That's some mighty fine penmanship there, Lew.
 
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