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(Huffington Post)   In other news, the TSA is still a dick   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 80
    More: Obvious, TSA, consumer advocacy, human dignity, TSA agents, public humiliation, Medical glove, major airline  
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13630 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Jan 2013 at 4:07 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-09 06:08:13 PM

Roukzeptea23: I've opted out twice. That's also the number of times I've flow since the scanners have been in use. Both times, the women giving me the pat down were professional and nice. The second time, though, the guy managing the line gave me a lot of crap for opting out. He said, "They don't use X-rays, so you don't need to opt out." while using a tone like I was a moron. I said that I didn't care and still wanted the pat down and he griped at me, saying, "You can opt out if you want, but you don't need to because the machines don't use x-rays." Look, I'm getting the pat down because I'm more comfortable with a woman touching me a little bit than I am with creepy TSA dudes looking at my generic naked outline while they're being dicks. For me, it's not about how much cancer I am or am not getting.


I don't get this. Who cares who looks at a blurry B&W picture of your junk? It's not like they print it out, and then follow you through the airport passing out copies and laughing. I couldn't give a fark. By the time they are passing around the pic, I'm halfway to my gate, it doesn't bother me. I'd rather get through security and get on with my day.
 
2013-01-09 06:08:58 PM

what_now: Nofun: Now step through the damn scanner.

No. I had cancer once, I'd rather not have it again "..but they haven't tested.." exactly. They haven't tested it.


There are two kinds of scanners: x-ray and microwave.

Yes, the x-rays are dangerous and if I were a TSA agent working around it I'd ask yourself why you don't have to wear a dosimeter like medical x-ray techs do.

The more common microwave scanners don't emit ionizing radiation which causes cancer, but they still do show your naked body to the TSA monitoring room.

Know your radiation:

upload.wikimedia.org

This is why people who worry about cell phone radiation are idiots. You get more damaging radiation from the sun. There is no ionizing radiation from radios -- wrong side of spectrum. The worst thing you will get is warmth.
 
2013-01-09 06:10:33 PM
And flying is still a priveledge, not a human right, subby.
 
2013-01-09 06:24:16 PM

Phins: I have a knee replacement so before the scanners, I always got the pat down because the implant set off the metal detector. I did usually have to wait in a little plexiglass box but it didn't really bother me. If the wait was more than a couple minutes (for a female agent), I got multiple apologies. I do live in Austin where people are generally nice and fly in and out of Florida a lot, where there are lots of passengers with hip/knee replacements. I think this guy might be overreacting.

Or maybe he's flying out of Dulles, where they really seem to think most people have a good chance of being actual terrorists.


Hell, I flew out of Portland Maine, which is a tiny airport with very paranoid security(Most of the 9/11 terrorists came through there), and I never had an issue. I never had a rude comment, nothing. The most I had was they couldn't figure out my collapsible laptop stand, I showed the lady what it was and how it worked, and she very nicely asked if she could take it over to show the other TSA people, so that if they saw one again, they would know what it was. I had no problem waiting an extra 2 or 3 minutes, and like I said, everyone was nice.

I also got thanked when flying out of Salt Lake, as I was shipping a server, and had all of the hard drives in my carryon. I put them 3 or 4 to a bin, didn't stack any, and was till through security in 15 minutes. Afterwards, 2 or 3 of the agents thanked me for setting them up that way, because usually people pile the shiat on top of each other, and they have to stop the line...

Maybe the author of TFA is just a prick?
 
2013-01-09 06:29:32 PM

Macular Degenerate: And flying is still a priveledge, not a human right, subby.


So you're fine with using this as a precedent for being forced through security theater for everything that is not a human right? How's that shoepolish taste?
 
2013-01-09 07:06:00 PM

duffblue: Nofun: This moron's articles for the last few months (if not longer, didn't bother to check), have nearly all been TSA related.

Author is a moron and a scumbag. I don't see him writing about the soldiers still fighting this war, or about the 9/11 rescue workers still waiting for medical care. These things are all fine, but the TSA: they're outrageous!

We get it, you have a small dick. Now step through the damn scanner.

Gun thread is further down the page


Why does everyone care about penis size?

Pro-gun, anti-TSA, anti-Drug war, pro-ACLU, libertarian, pro-EFF...

I'm lonely. I get flamed by trolls in every thread. :(
 
2013-01-09 07:09:52 PM

illegal.tender: a) fark the TSA.
b) If the NRA had any credibility about their "fear the gummint" line they would be going after the TSA with both barrels, so to speak, and they would have started yesterday.


To be fair, the NRA has achieved its goals with respect to airline travel. Checking firearms through the airlines is pretty damned easy, and as a gun owner, that's about all I want.

(Though I would love to see the TSA reduced to metal-detectors, and explosive sensors only. Possibly hand out those little 18" novelty baseball bats to all passengers)

That argument is the same that I've used against the ACLU though... The ACLU's silence (almost anti-freedom) stance with respect to firearms irks me, but the rationale from the ACLU has always been, 'There are other organizations which sufficiently represent the 2nd Amendment.'

So the ACLU is basically saying, our silence on the gun issue is because the NRA is doing enough.
 
2013-01-09 07:19:51 PM
Someone explain how the scanner radiation even begins to compare with the dose of cosmic rays you get on the flight. I hate the scanners and I hate the groping but I'm not seeing the cost/benefit analysis coming out in favor of groping.
 
2013-01-09 07:26:18 PM

TheWizard: duffblue: Nofun: This moron's articles for the last few months (if not longer, didn't bother to check), have nearly all been TSA related.

Author is a moron and a scumbag. I don't see him writing about the soldiers still fighting this war, or about the 9/11 rescue workers still waiting for medical care. These things are all fine, but the TSA: they're outrageous!

We get it, you have a small dick. Now step through the damn scanner.

Gun thread is further down the page

Why does everyone care about penis size?

Pro-gun, anti-TSA, anti-Drug war, pro-ACLU, libertarian, pro-EFF...

I'm lonely. I get flamed by trolls in every thread. :(


I feel your pain bro.....

/Internet fist bump.....
 
2013-01-09 07:28:55 PM

TheWizard: That argument is the same that I've used against the ACLU though... The ACLU's silence (almost anti-freedom) stance with respect to firearms irks me, but the rationale from the ACLU has always been, 'There are other organizations which sufficiently represent the 2nd Amendment.'

So the ACLU is basically saying, our silence on the gun issue is because the NRA is doing enough.


The 2nd amendment was written when the musket was the high-tech gun of choice. They did not foresee high-precision semi-automatic long-distance tools of mass slaughter hanging over every person's shoulder.
 
2013-01-09 07:45:32 PM

Space Squid: usually cracking a joke or two to lighten the mood


Did you not read the signs? You're not allowed to tell jokes while standing near TSA employees.

legacy-cdn.smosh.com

It shouldn't really be a surprise -- they've been ignoring the 4th amendment all along so there's no reason they should respect the 1st.
 
2013-01-09 07:48:13 PM

profplump: Space Squid: usually cracking a joke or two to lighten the mood

Did you not read the signs? You're not allowed to tell jokes while standing near TSA employees.

[legacy-cdn.smosh.com image 500x412]

It shouldn't really be a surprise -- they've been ignoring the 4th amendment all along so there's no reason they should respect the 1st.


The way that sign is written, if you say anything during the "process", anything at all, you can be prosecuted.
 
2013-01-09 07:56:42 PM
i fly a lot--weekly-sometimes more than two a week. my home airport has all the latest and greatest machines, but no pre check. some of the destination airports have it---and man, it is a breeze.

but i always opt out. you have to take the stuff out of your pockets anyway, so why should i go thru a machine when i have to do the same thing at opt out. i have gotten to know a bunch of tsa agents, they know me as a regular at the airport, and we have a lot of fun. i get all the wrinkles out of my clothes, and look quite sharp when they get done.

just wished a couple of the female agents would do the pat down. i mean--we're all professionals, aren't we????
 
2013-01-09 07:57:16 PM
I don't give a shiat what you guys do just don't slow me down.
 
2013-01-09 08:22:41 PM

profplump: Space Squid: usually cracking a joke or two to lighten the mood

Did you not read the signs? You're not allowed to tell jokes while standing near TSA employees.

[legacy-cdn.smosh.com image 500x412]

It shouldn't really be a surprise -- they've been ignoring the 4th amendment all along so there's no reason they should respect the 1st.


cdn.crushable.com
 
2013-01-09 08:44:11 PM
We in Canada watch in amazement as Americans submit to this. Watching the NRA calling the shots is pretty weird too.
 
2013-01-09 08:44:25 PM
lolphatThe 2nd amendment was written when the musket was the high-tech gun of choice. They did not foresee high-precision semi-automatic long-distance tools of mass slaughter hanging over every person's shoulder.

Umm... that has nothing to do with anything I posted.

Did you want to discuss the legal positions of the ACLU, or the waste that is the TSA? Cause, that's all I'm willing to feed to trolls anymore.
 
2013-01-09 08:47:22 PM

profplump: Space Squid: usually cracking a joke or two to lighten the mood

Did you not read the signs? You're not allowed to tell jokes while standing near TSA employees.

[legacy-cdn.smosh.com image 500x412]

It shouldn't really be a surprise -- they've been ignoring the 4th amendment all along so there's no reason they should respect the 1st.


The photographer is lucky not to have been tazed for taking a picture of that sign. Sick.
 
2013-01-09 10:19:01 PM
I don't fly much, but my experiences in Rochester, Chicago, Honolulu and Venice have been less horrible than I feared.

The experience at JFK was another matter. Besides nearly breaking our new Murano wine glasses, my wife was "patted down" so thoroughly she still feels violated to this day. They didn't offer her a private area, and the agent was not a pleasant person. I went through the backscatter machine and still swear I felt tingling.

The experience at JFK has convinced my wife that, like me, if we can physically drive there, we will, even if it takes LOTS longer.

And that's without the whole libertarian argument I wanna make. TSA is yet another example of the incremental deletion of our individual rights. We're so far down that rabbit hole, I don't know how the ACLU goes without bursting into flame. Except for the First Amendment (mostly) the other 9 Amendments in the "Bill of Rights" are about as meaningful as the tissue I blew my nose with earlier tonight.

But... we'll keep electing Republicans and Democrats to office and keep getting what we f**king deserve.
 
2013-01-10 12:15:17 AM
In my several opt outs in the last few years, my only complaint is when I get a male agent to pat me down instead of a single, horny, redheaded, female agent.

/flu-like typing detected
 
2013-01-10 12:33:19 AM
Obama co-opts Bush's private army. Dreams of Brown Shirts and ovens for Jews.
 
2013-01-10 12:44:32 AM

profplump: Space Squid: usually cracking a joke or two to lighten the mood

Did you not read the signs? You're not allowed to tell jokes while standing near TSA employees.

[legacy-cdn.smosh.com image 500x412]

It shouldn't really be a surprise -- they've been ignoring the 4th amendment all along so there's no reason they should respect the 1st.


Depends on the joke.

Responding to a question about customer service with "I think you're doing a fantastic job shoveling money towards L-3 (NYSE:LLL) and OSI Systems and (NASDAQ:OSIS), Chertoff, and whatever company hires Napolitano, a boatload of money. [points at himself and then waves in the general direction to the rest of the cattle in line] Of course, I'd say the same about myself and the rest of my fellow cattle" might be snarky, but it's not a joke.

i.imgur.com

Here's a 15-year chart of OSIS going from $8 to $80 since 9/11 with only two hiccups: the crash of 2008, and last November when the TSA itself had some questions. LLL did well, but not that well.

/so it's technically not a joke.
//shiat I think of while waiting in line with my fellow cattle.
 
2013-01-10 04:15:23 AM

jack21221: Until recently, I would have agreed with TFA, but the scanners are SO fast and easy most people don't want to opt out. In my last trip through Logan, the agents by the old metal detector looked bored as everybody went to the line with the scanner. They were practically begging for opt outs so they'd have something to do.

I've flown 3 times in the past few weeks (4th time tonight) and every time has been a fast, pleasant experience.


You work for TSA, don't you? That reads like an advertisement by a shill.
 
2013-01-10 07:02:02 AM
[i.imgur.com image 530x395]

Here's a 15-year chart of OSIS going from $8 to $80 since 9/11 with only two hiccups: the crash of 2008, and last November when the TSA itself had some questions. LLL did well, but not that well.

/so it's technically not a joke.
//shiat I think of while waiting in line with my fellow cattle.


That's just NOBama's Hyperinflation. The REAL price of that stock is still $8.
 
2013-01-10 09:15:36 AM

Dictatorial_Flair: jack21221: Until recently, I would have agreed with TFA, but the scanners are SO fast and easy most people don't want to opt out. In my last trip through Logan, the agents by the old metal detector looked bored as everybody went to the line with the scanner. They were practically begging for opt outs so they'd have something to do.

I've flown 3 times in the past few weeks (4th time tonight) and every time has been a fast, pleasant experience.

You work for TSA, don't you? That reads like an advertisement by a shill.


I don't think federal agencies pay for advertisement shills. Many other people in this thread have posted the same things. I understand the psychological need to seek out evidence which supports your preconceived notions and reject evidence which goes against them, but that's a flaw in logical thinking.

Thing is, I used to agree with the people with all of the TSA hate. The first two times I went to Boston, I took a train because I didn't want to be hassled by the TSA, and there's no security screen to get on a train. But when I was moving up here with my girlfriend, she said she did not want to sit through another 7 hour train ride, and would rather sit through a 1.5 hour flight, so we decided to fly.

I braced myself for a hassle from the TSA, but the worst I got was them handing me my backpack back telling me to remove my laptop from it and put it through the scanner again. Even with that, I was through in about 10 minutes. It went better than expected. When my apprehensions didn't meet reality, reality won out and I changed my mind about flying.

I gave them another chance on Christmas Eve (returning on Christmas Day), and security took MAYBE 2 minutes each way. The screeners hardly said a word, it was just in-and-out.

Then, Saturday, I flew back to visit family for a longer period of time (returned last night). There was a fairly long line on the way out on Saturday, so it took about 20-25 minutes to get through security. The guy checking IDs and boarding passes was polite and pleasant, smiling at the passengers as he chatted with them. There was one derpy moment where the couple in front of me were trying to bring their baby's car seat onto the plane, and the car seat was just barely too big for the x-ray scanner, so it took them a while to get that sorted out. There were two lines, one leading to the millimeter scanner and the other leading to the old fashioned metal detector for opt-outs. In all that time I was sitting there, I saw zero people opt out. They would put their bags on the conveyor belt next to the metal detector, and then cram themselves into the scanner line. The guy who did the scanner made a comment about my "98% chimp" shirt, saying "You don't really believe that, do ya?" But, that exchange was friendly banter and not some kind of interrogation.

On the way home last night, I already posted my experience. There was nobody in line anywhere, and when I put my bags on the conveyor belt and walked up to the scanner, the scanner guy had his back turned talking to another agent about something. So the guy at the metal detector waved us over through his machine, and when it didn't go off he told us to have a nice flight. My girlfriend had a small (~8 cubic inches) tupperware container half-filled with a translucent yellow liquid (it was cough syrup), and security didn't even seem to notice. She was afraid she'd be hassled about it. Easiest security ever.

When I used to read all those stories about people being detained for wearing an odd watch or a t-shirt with LEDs on it or something, I assumed it was because the TSA are just a bunch of power-hungry assholes looking for any excuse to pounce on somebody. That may still be true, but all of the ones I've met in my past 5 flights has been cool, or at least neutral. So if they are dicks, they hide it well.

Sure, I think they go way overboard with their rules and the actual security gained is very small compared to the enormous cost. And yes, this is a violation of our 4th amendment rights. However, sometimes you need to pick your battles. When they make this expensive violation of your 4th amendment rights last about 30 seconds and send you on your way with a smile, it's hard to get angry. There are so many other problems in this country that we should REALLY be getting angry at, but the TSA seems to be the one to dive on that grenade and take the brunt of the hate.

I suggest taking that hate of the TSA and redirecting at other efforts of Homeland Security, like warrentless wiretaps, national security letters, etc.
 
2013-01-10 10:13:48 AM

jack21221: Dictatorial_Flair: jack21221: Until recently, I would have agreed with TFA, but the scanners are SO fast and easy most people don't want to opt out. In my last trip through Logan, the agents by the old metal detector looked bored as everybody went to the line with the scanner. They were practically begging for opt outs so they'd have something to do.

I've flown 3 times in the past few weeks (4th time tonight) and every time has been a fast, pleasant experience.

You work for TSA, don't you? That reads like an advertisement by a shill.

I don't think federal agencies pay for advertisement shills. Many other people in this thread have posted the same things. I understand the psychological need to seek out evidence which supports your preconceived notions and reject evidence which goes against them, but that's a flaw in logical thinking.

Thing is, I used to agree with the people with all of the TSA hate. The first two times I went to Boston, I took a train because I didn't want to be hassled by the TSA, and there's no security screen to get on a train. But when I was moving up here with my girlfriend, she said she did not want to sit through another 7 hour train ride, and would rather sit through a 1.5 hour flight, so we decided to fly.

I braced myself for a hassle from the TSA, but the worst I got was them handing me my backpack back telling me to remove my laptop from it and put it through the scanner again. Even with that, I was through in about 10 minutes. It went better than expected. When my apprehensions didn't meet reality, reality won out and I changed my mind about flying.

I gave them another chance on Christmas Eve (returning on Christmas Day), and security took MAYBE 2 minutes each way. The screeners hardly said a word, it was just in-and-out.

Then, Saturday, I flew back to visit family for a longer period of time (returned last night). There was a fairly long line on the way out on Saturday, so it took about 20-25 minutes to get through security. The ...


As long as you're willing to ignore their attempts to 'secure' buses, Amtrak trains, truck stops, highways, and public sports arenas, your point has merit. It's not just air travel. TSA needs to go.
 
2013-01-11 12:02:11 PM

redmid17: As long as you're willing to ignore their attempts to 'secure' buses, Amtrak trains, truck stops, highways, and public sports arenas, your point has merit. It's not just air travel. TSA needs to go.


I've been on a lot of busses, Amtrak trains, highways and public sports arenas, and I've never run into a TSA agent there. It's really easy to ignore something that I haven't experienced.
 
2013-01-11 12:38:25 PM

jack21221: I don't think federal agencies pay for advertisement shills. Many other people in this thread have posted the same things. I understand the psychological need to seek out evidence which supports your preconceived notions and reject evidence which goes against them, but that's a flaw in logical thinking.


I'm flattered you think I have the ability to think logically, even if it's flawed.
 
2013-01-11 12:54:10 PM

jack21221: redmid17: As long as you're willing to ignore their attempts to 'secure' buses, Amtrak trains, truck stops, highways, and public sports arenas, your point has merit. It's not just air travel. TSA needs to go.

I've been on a lot of busses, Amtrak trains, highways and public sports arenas, and I've never run into a TSA agent there. It's really easy to ignore something that I haven't experienced.


Good for you. Most of us try not to.
 
2013-01-12 07:09:45 PM

jack21221: redmid17: As long as you're willing to ignore their attempts to 'secure' buses, Amtrak trains, truck stops, highways, and public sports arenas, your point has merit. It's not just air travel. TSA needs to go.

I've been on a lot of busses, Amtrak trains, highways and public sports arenas, and I've never run into a TSA agent there. It's really easy to ignore something that I haven't experienced.


They are called VIPR: Visible Intermodal Prevention and Response: Link

Basically they were an attempt by the TSA to branch out into all other forms of transportation. They tried setting up checkpoints at Amtrak stations, without even letting Amtrak management know. The Amtrak Police were kinda upset, especially since they are actual sworn Federal LEOs with specific jurisdiction there, as opposed to the TSA rent-a-cops.

The TSA has made it clear they want to have airport-style security checkpoints at bus lines, passenger trains, and basically all passenger transportation in the US. However, their attempts to branch out have been met with heavy resistance, because they are generally hated and thought of as farkwits that are barely tolerated at the airport.
 
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