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(Huffington Post UK)   Did Luis Suárez deliberately handle the ball in scoring what proved to be the winning goal in mighty Liverpool's 2-1 victory against semi-pro Mansfield Town in the FA Cup's 3rd Round? Does the pope fark in the woods?   (huffingtonpost.co.uk) divider line 60
    More: Obvious, Luis Suarez, FA Cup, Mansfield Town, Liverpool, Patrice Evra, Daniel Sturridge, PSV Eindhoven, jockeys  
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1005 clicks; posted to Sports » on 07 Jan 2013 at 12:49 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-07 11:42:28 AM  
Yes. And it's a scandal. And I don't much like football. But it's a scandal and just wrong. No idea what can be done about it.
Check TV footage, but then not all matches have any cameras let alone so many. And it all goes to holding up the game. And people will demand a TV check for every little incident. Tough call for a game that is so fluid
 
2013-01-07 12:14:06 PM  

colinspooky: Yes. And it's a scandal. And I don't much like football. But it's a scandal and just wrong. No idea what can be done about it.
Check TV footage, but then not all matches have any cameras let alone so many. And it all goes to holding up the game. And people will demand a TV check for every little incident. Tough call for a game that is so fluid


there are natural pauses in the game though, and most of those pauses tend to coincide with important calls (e.g. cards, goals). why not limit replays only to those incidents?
 
2013-01-07 12:23:25 PM  
Because someone will find a way to exploit any additional rules and the game will stall on a regular basis. And do read "exploit" the rules.
 
2013-01-07 12:26:30 PM  

colinspooky: Because someone will find a way to exploit any additional rules and the game will stall on a regular basis. And do read "exploit" the rules.


right, but any "exploit" would probably only be used to slow down the game, as opposed to right now where a lack of replay review allows people to "exploit" the rules by flopping in the box and using illegal means to score goals.
 
2013-01-07 12:56:43 PM  
No video in the link, has been removed.
 
2013-01-07 12:59:41 PM  
Still no explanation for why there is "stoppage time" rather than simply stopping the clock during stoppages.
 
2013-01-07 01:00:02 PM  
 
2013-01-07 01:03:29 PM  
I was listening to the game and what really sucks is that Mansfield had Liverpool on the ropes for much of the second half. Without that goal I think they would have had a real chance at least to earn a replay. Leave it to Suarez to ruin the magic of the FA Cup.
 
2013-01-07 01:08:17 PM  

nodubs: Working Video


Holy cow, even the refs for my clubs' weekend games would have caught that one.
 
2013-01-07 01:09:05 PM  

Homer Nixon: I was listening to the game and what really sucks is that Mansfield had Liverpool on the ropes for much of the second half. Without that goal I think they would have had a real chance at least to earn a replay. Leave it to Suarez to ruin the magic of the FA Cup.


Read through the FA Cup thread and you'll see us Liverpool fans think that the goal shouldn't have been allowed and that Mansfield deserved at least a replay.

Either way, apparently the referee saw the handball and decided that it wasn't intentional and thus, didn't call it. So don't blame Saurez, blame the ref.
 
2013-01-07 01:10:07 PM  

CommiePuddin: Still no explanation for why there is "stoppage time" rather than simply stopping the clock during stoppages.


Poor people can't afford clocks that stop.
 
2013-01-07 01:13:47 PM  

desertgeek: Homer Nixon: I was listening to the game and what really sucks is that Mansfield had Liverpool on the ropes for much of the second half. Without that goal I think they would have had a real chance at least to earn a replay. Leave it to Suarez to ruin the magic of the FA Cup.

Read through the FA Cup thread and you'll see us Liverpool fans think that the goal shouldn't have been allowed and that Mansfield deserved at least a replay.

Either way, apparently the referee saw the handball and decided that it wasn't intentional and thus, didn't call it. So don't blame Saurez, blame the ref.


Boy that's a really tough one. There's some downward motion, but there's also what seems to be a jerky motion back to try and avoid touching it. I can't really tell if it's intentional or just a really lucky bounce of the ball. It's certainly no Mano de Dios goal.
 
2013-01-07 01:37:09 PM  
Do we still refer to them as "Liverpool FC" or have they changed their moniker officially to "Luis Suarez and the 10 other guys who just stand around and watch Luis Suarez FC"

/kinda meh for now on the Sturridge signing
//a bit intrigued though that Kalou and some other scoring punch though is being sought after as well reportedly
 
2013-01-07 01:41:38 PM  

Killer Cars: Do we still refer to them as "Liverpool FC" or have they changed their moniker officially to "Luis Suarez and the 10 other guys who just stand around and watch Luis Suarez FC"


That's a bit unfair. Sometimes Sterling runs quickly down one side of the field of the other.
 
2013-01-07 01:42:35 PM  
Even if Suarez had fessed up immediately, the official wasn't going to disallow that goal or give a retroactive card so folks need to quit whining. It sucks when this happens, but it's pretty infrequent.
 
2013-01-07 01:47:46 PM  

colinspooky: But it's a scandal and just wrong.


the only people who think it's a "scandal" are people who a) are mancs, or b) don't like football. at least we know which one applies to you.

was it unfortunate? absolutely. did it rise to the level of, say, and intentional head but or even kung fu kicking a spectator a la eric cantona? no. for fark's sake, let's have a little perspective here.
 
2013-01-07 02:00:43 PM  
Pretty hard to see from the video I've seen, but it looks pretty bad.

I chalk this one up to the horrendous offside call that cost Liverpool a victory against Everton earlier this season.
 
2013-01-07 02:01:03 PM  

CommiePuddin: Still no explanation for why there is "stoppage time" rather than simply stopping the clock during stoppages.


They want to have the same rules at all levels of soccer. The idea is that a single referee should be able to run the entire game without need for a scoreboard or whatever.
 
2013-01-07 02:07:05 PM  

CommiePuddin: Still no explanation for why there is "stoppage time" rather than simply stopping the clock during stoppages.


I always assumed that it was so the refs could add an arbitrary time to the end of games... just in case a few more minutes of play might lead to a more favorable outcome with respect to any bet they had made.
 
2013-01-07 02:15:25 PM  
Who the hell gets their soccer news from Huffington Post?
 
2013-01-07 02:17:37 PM  
For fark's sake, it's not cheating when you do something like that and the ref misses it. The ref should be less blind and do his freaking job!

It's the same thing as Suarez's handball against Ghana. NOT CHEATING. It was the same as intentionally fouling in basketball...you deliberately break the rules and are punished by the laws of the game. In that case, Suarez was given a red card and suspended for the next game...it's not his fault the Ghana player choked and sucks at penalties.
 
2013-01-07 02:26:35 PM  
Suarez could have taken a page out of Miroslav Klose and admitted the handball and ask they wave off the goal (new window). Would be a step in the right direction of breaking the perception that he is a cheat and asshole.
 
2013-01-07 02:40:33 PM  

socalnewwaver: colinspooky: But it's a scandal and just wrong.

the only people who think it's a "scandal" are people who a) are mancs, or b) don't like football. at least we know which one applies to you.

was it unfortunate? absolutely. did it rise to the level of, say, and intentional head but or even kung fu kicking a spectator a la eric cantona? no. for fark's sake, let's have a little perspective here.


Yes, I'm sure the Mansfield players and supporters are all completely fine with it. LFC blinkers detected!
 
2013-01-07 02:41:57 PM  
Huff po uk? Who knew?
 
2013-01-07 02:48:19 PM  

The Envoy: socalnewwaver: colinspooky: But it's a scandal and just wrong.

the only people who think it's a "scandal" are people who a) are mancs, or b) don't like football. at least we know which one applies to you.

was it unfortunate? absolutely. did it rise to the level of, say, and intentional head but or even kung fu kicking a spectator a la eric cantona? no. for fark's sake, let's have a little perspective here.

Yes, I'm sure the Mansfield players and supporters are all completely fine with it. LFC blinkers detected!


The coach doesn't think it's a "scandal"

From espn

Mansfield's manager, Paul Cox, despite being the victim of Suarez' gesture, believes it falls falls into the former camp: "Any striker would have done the same thing. It's up to the referees to spot it."
 
2013-01-07 03:15:02 PM  
Not a fan of Suarez at all, but this one is on the ref/AR. If the neither the ref or AR were in a position to spot the handball or had the confidence to blow the whistle I'd say they should be reviewed.
 
2013-01-07 03:26:30 PM  

error 303: Not a fan of Suarez at all


To be fair, I don't think many people at Anfield are fans of him per se. I like him when he scores goals, but he definitely seems like a prick and have no desire to meet him in person.
 
2013-01-07 03:27:27 PM  

battery668: For fark's sake, it's not cheating when you do something like that and the ref misses it. The ref should be less blind and do his freaking job!

It's the same thing as Suarez's handball against Ghana. NOT CHEATING. It was the same as intentionally fouling in basketball...you deliberately break the rules and are punished by the laws of the game. In that case, Suarez was given a red card and suspended for the next game...it's not his fault the Ghana player choked and sucks at penalties.



Headbutting some one is ok then and if the refs miss it tough luck?
 
2013-01-07 03:31:21 PM  
Looked deliberate to me, but not as bad as Henry's versus Ireland.

Deliberate or not it should have been called.
 
2013-01-07 03:35:54 PM  

Norfolking Chance: battery668: For fark's sake, it's not cheating when you do something like that and the ref misses it. The ref should be less blind and do his freaking job!

It's the same thing as Suarez's handball against Ghana. NOT CHEATING. It was the same as intentionally fouling in basketball...you deliberately break the rules and are punished by the laws of the game. In that case, Suarez was given a red card and suspended for the next game...it's not his fault the Ghana player choked and sucks at penalties.


Headbutting some one is ok then and if the refs miss it tough luck?


Depends.. When Zidane did it it was okay. Materazi had it comm'n. but comparing physical injury to what Suarez did / professional fouls is a bit disingenuous.
 
2013-01-07 03:36:19 PM  

Norfolking Chance: Headbutting some one is ok then and if the refs miss it tough luck?


this isn't my argument per se, but i think we can agree there is a difference between handling the ball and intentionally trying to injure someone? right?
 
2013-01-07 03:40:01 PM  

The Envoy: Yes, I'm sure the Mansfield players and supporters are all completely fine with it. LFC blinkers detected!


sorry you missed the broad generality in my statement. and the part where i said it's certainly unfortunate.

/somewhere in those trees, there's a forest.
 
2013-01-07 03:42:12 PM  

Norfolking Chance: battery668: For fark's sake, it's not cheating when you do something like that and the ref misses it. The ref should be less blind and do his freaking job!

It's the same thing as Suarez's handball against Ghana. NOT CHEATING. It was the same as intentionally fouling in basketball...you deliberately break the rules and are punished by the laws of the game. In that case, Suarez was given a red card and suspended for the next game...it's not his fault the Ghana player choked and sucks at penalties.


Headbutting some one is ok then and if the refs miss it tough luck?


That doesn't seem anything like what he said. I think he's referring to players who "break the rules" but have no intention to get away with it (or, at least, no illusions that they will get away with it) because they made a quick cost-benefit analysis and decided taking the punishment is better than the alternative. i.e. - Hooking to prevent an odd man rush in hockey. Intentional fouls to give up foul shots but stop the clock in hoops. Pass interference to prevent a long touchdown pass. Suarez's handball against Ghana.

Why did you think he meant malicious acts (a headbutt) is OK if not caught?
 
2013-01-07 03:50:52 PM  
I love how the act of committing a penalty that goes uncalled is treated as a huge scandal.

"He's a cheat! He's unworthy of fathering children! His soul shall be condemned to hell!"

I guess every uncalled Holding in the NFL makes the offensive lineman a terrible person, or every uncalled high stick makes an NHL player scum of the earth.
 
2013-01-07 04:09:09 PM  
It should have been a handball since his arm was extended, but I don't think it was intentional, more of a reaction to the ball bouncing back at him.
 
2013-01-07 04:22:44 PM  
On the other side of the likeability scale is Leighton Baines of Everton. To quote the BBC live text of today's match:

2028: Good reaction from Leighton Baines. He is clattered by Jermaine McGlashan as he gets forward, it's quite an ugly challenge but Baines is quickly to his feet and shakes the hand of the Cheltenham man. Bainesy may just be the most likable Premier League footballer I can think of. Anyone got a bad word to say about him?


2106: SUBSTITUTION He's so likeable, even the Cheltenham fans clap him off. Leighton Baines is replaced after a superb showing again...
 
2013-01-07 05:29:01 PM  
If the exact same thing happens to any other player its a story on how the ref missed the call.....
 
2013-01-07 05:30:23 PM  

Brosef13: If the exact same thing happens to any other player its a story on how the ref missed the call.....


But Suarez is literally Hitler.
 
2013-01-07 05:34:14 PM  

desertgeek: Either way, apparently the referee saw the handball and decided that it wasn't intentional and thus, didn't call it. So don't blame Saurez, blame the ref.


If you don't like playing games where a referee's judgement has an impact on the game then take up golf. Otherwise, unless you can prove the referee was on the take stop the complaining. Every referee will miss a call, that's just the way it goes.
 
2013-01-07 05:45:34 PM  

Pincy: desertgeek: Either way, apparently the referee saw the handball and decided that it wasn't intentional and thus, didn't call it. So don't blame Saurez, blame the ref.

If you don't like playing games where a referee's judgement has an impact on the game then take up golf. Otherwise, unless you can prove the referee was on the take stop the complaining. Every referee will miss a call, that's just the way it goes.


That's what I'm saying. But every time Suarez is involved in something, people act like he just shot their dog in cold blood.
 
2013-01-07 05:54:32 PM  

desertgeek: Pincy: desertgeek: Either way, apparently the referee saw the handball and decided that it wasn't intentional and thus, didn't call it. So don't blame Saurez, blame the ref.

If you don't like playing games where a referee's judgement has an impact on the game then take up golf. Otherwise, unless you can prove the referee was on the take stop the complaining. Every referee will miss a call, that's just the way it goes.

That's what I'm saying. But every time Suarez is involved in something, people act like he just shot their dog in cold blood.


Ya, sorry, I didn't mean "you" as in you personally, it was the universal "you" as in "everyone".
 
2013-01-07 07:29:16 PM  

desertgeek: That's what I'm saying. But every time Suarez is involved in something, people act like he just shot their dog in cold blood.


There's something to be said for the sheer volume of times Suarez is "involved in something."
 
2013-01-07 07:40:33 PM  
Suarez is the futbol equivalent of that girl you know who "totes hates drama."
 
2013-01-07 10:27:55 PM  
Such a joke. Who cares? Saved us from a painful Mansfield at Anfield massacre.
 
2013-01-08 04:28:35 AM  

socalnewwaver: The Envoy: Yes, I'm sure the Mansfield players and supporters are all completely fine with it. LFC blinkers detected!

sorry you missed the broad generality in my statement. and the part where i said it's certainly unfortunate.

/somewhere in those trees, there's a forest.


Sorry, when you enumerate those who care and qualify that by saying that they are the "only" ones who care, then the generality you were allegedly striving for is gone. Sorry you were forced to backpedal from your stupid statement. Unless of course you can show that the Mansfield players and supporters are, generally, fine with it then you still have those red blinkers on, weaselly use of the word "unfortunate" notwithstanding.

ScouserDuck: The coach doesn't think it's a "scandal"

From espn

Mansfield's manager, Paul Cox, despite being the victim of Suarez' gesture, believes it falls falls into the former camp: "Any striker would have done the same thing. It's up to the referees to spot it."


A couple of observations:
This is what people call "sportsmanship". It's the exact opposite type of behaviour to, say, intentionally handling a ball in to the goal.
Is Paul Cox the official spokesman for the fans? No? Then see above and my statement still stands.
 
2013-01-08 07:37:48 AM  

SomebodyElsesShoes: On the other side of the likeability scale is Leighton Baines of Everton. To quote the BBC live text of today's match:

2028: Good reaction from Leighton Baines. He is clattered by Jermaine McGlashan as he gets forward, it's quite an ugly challenge but Baines is quickly to his feet and shakes the hand of the Cheltenham man. Bainesy may just be the most likable Premier League footballer I can think of. Anyone got a bad word to say about him?


2106: SUBSTITUTION He's so likeable, even the Cheltenham fans clap him off. Leighton Baines is replaced after a superb showing again...


And on the other end of the scale is farkin' Wreck-it-Ralph (Bale); going to ground mortally wounded if there is an opposition player within the same quadrant.
 
2013-01-08 08:15:42 AM  

CommiePuddin: Still no explanation for why there is "stoppage time" rather than simply stopping the clock during stoppages.


Define stoppage. IIRC in US football the clock doesn't always stop. do you stop for every goal-kick, throw-in, free-kick etc or just the substitutions and goals? Anyway, having stoppage time makes the end more exciting/ nerve-wracking.

Suarez isn't a cheat. As he lashes the ball in his demeaner says he's expecting the whistle to go. It didn't. Given the ref saw it and didn't give it it means it's not on Suarez. These things balance over a season. I'm sure he's had a clear penalty not given alread.
 
2013-01-08 10:18:44 AM  

The Envoy: Sorry, when you enumerate those who care and qualify that by saying that they are the "only" ones who care, then the generality you were allegedly striving for is gone. Sorry you were forced to backpedal from your stupid statement


that's not what i said, moron. i said the only people who think it's a "scandal". there is a huge difference in the level of caring between "unfortunate event" and "scandal". i do think it was unfortunate, as do most of the 'pool supporters who have posted in this thread. but none of us think it's the tragedy or scandal that some are portraying it to be. sorry you think i'm backpedaling in response to your stupid statement.
 
2013-01-08 10:23:29 AM  

error 303: Not a fan of Suarez at all, but this one is on the ref/AR. If the neither the ref or AR were in a position to spot the handball or had the confidence to blow the whistle I'd say they should be reviewed.


This. Remember the France?ireland WC qualifier? Henri said he handled the ball. The officials have to officiate
 
2013-01-08 10:43:01 AM  

socalnewwaver: The Envoy: Sorry, when you enumerate those who care and qualify that by saying that they are the "only" ones who care, then the generality you were allegedly striving for is gone. Sorry you were forced to backpedal from your stupid statement

that's not what i said, moron. i said the only people who think it's a "scandal". there is a huge difference in the level of caring between "unfortunate event" and "scandal". i do think it was unfortunate, as do most of the 'pool supporters who have posted in this thread. but none of us think it's the tragedy or scandal that some are portraying it to be. sorry you think i'm backpedaling in response to your stupid statement.


Let's not get in to your spurious "levels of caring" crap, it's irrelevant. I simply pointed out the fact that, in identifying singular groups who were scandalised by the action, you failed to address the fact that there are Mansfield players and supporters who probably do think it's scandalous. The point is that in identifying those singular groups affected you effectively nix any semblance of generality.
 
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