If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(The Newspaper)   Courts in Florida split on the most burning question of our time: whether motorists should be subjected to stop-and-search simply because they repainted their car a new color   (thenewspaper.com) divider line 93
    More: Florida, Courts of Florida, Department of Highways, motorists, vehicle registrations, traffic stops  
•       •       •

5176 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Jan 2013 at 11:57 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



93 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2013-01-04 08:14:22 PM
From the TFA:
on June 22, 2010 when an Escambia County Deputy Sheriff saw a bright green Chevy. The deputy ran the plate and the record showed the vehicle was registered to a blue Chevy. The deputy initiated a traffic stop, and Kerick Van Teamer, the driver, explained his car had recently been painted. A search turned up drugs leading to Teamer's arrest. Teamer sought to suppress the evidence because he never should have been pulled over in the first place.

A stop I can understand. Questioning the driver about the colour of the car I can understand. But how did this stop lead to a search? Did the cop think he'd find something in the car that would prove it had, or had not, been painted? On what grounds did he ask to search the car, apart from the old "I smell drugs" line?

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.
 
2013-01-04 09:01:49 PM

Flint Ironstag: From the TFA:
on June 22, 2010 when an Escambia County Deputy Sheriff saw a bright green Chevy. The deputy ran the plate and the record showed the vehicle was registered to a blue Chevy. The deputy initiated a traffic stop, and Kerick Van Teamer, the driver, explained his car had recently been painted. A search turned up drugs leading to Teamer's arrest. Teamer sought to suppress the evidence because he never should have been pulled over in the first place.

A stop I can understand. Questioning the driver about the colour of the car I can understand. But how did this stop lead to a search? Did the cop think he'd find something in the car that would prove it had, or had not, been painted? On what grounds did he ask to search the car, apart from the old "I smell drugs" line?

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.


Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?
 
2013-01-04 09:34:56 PM
Have the cops been playing Grand Theft Auto?
 
2013-01-04 10:49:36 PM

sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all? Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?


Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
 
2013-01-04 10:50:40 PM

sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?


Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.
 
2013-01-04 11:10:35 PM
jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?
 
2013-01-04 11:59:36 PM
userserve-ak.last.fm
 
2013-01-05 12:03:38 AM
Simple color change? Maybe not.

This on the other hand:

4.bp.blogspot.com

Might be considered probable cause.
 
2013-01-05 12:03:48 AM

sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?


??

Police have always been allowed to run your plates. Just like they can follow you for 50 miles down the road for no reason at all to see if you do something. "Land of the free" doesn't mean "Land where cops don't exist till YOU want them."

You're not one of those ones who always post "When seconds count, the police are minutes away!" crap, are you? Cuz this is what's known as "proactive policing"--checking to see if a car is stolen BEFORE someone reports it stolen, you know? Would you prefer the cop wait till the car gets reported, or would you be the one whining that "The cop saw that car driving down the road and didn't do anything! What a lazy pig!"
 
2013-01-05 12:05:05 AM
ghettofamous.net
 
2013-01-05 12:05:34 AM

CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.


Our local cops have plate scanners to do that automatically. They don't even have to lift a finger - the system scans every plate of every car, and checks for tickets or other pertinent info. They're getting ready to connect that system to our street cameras as well.
 
2013-01-05 12:05:35 AM
It wasn't the color of the car... it was the color of the driver.
 
2013-01-05 12:07:57 AM
Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no. Have a nice day officer.

/As a side note, allowing police to pull over and cite vehicles for having modified exhausts based on an ambiguous noise level (can be heard from a block away) is complete bull for numerous reasons. I would not be surprised if it is in fact a run around anti-profiling measures.
 
2013-01-05 12:08:01 AM
I blame this on the changes in GTA4. Before then you could drive into a Pay n' Spray with a six star wanted level and the whole army right behind you, and could get away with a simple spray. NOW, if the law sees you driving into a Pay n' Spray in GTA4, they won't let up.
 
2013-01-05 12:08:02 AM

Flint Ironstag: From the TFA:
on June 22, 2010 when an Escambia County Deputy Sheriff saw a bright green Chevy. The deputy ran the plate and the record showed the vehicle was registered to a blue Chevy. The deputy initiated a traffic stop, and Kerick Van Teamer, the driver, explained his car had recently been painted. A search turned up drugs leading to Teamer's arrest. Teamer sought to suppress the evidence because he never should have been pulled over in the first place.

A stop I can understand. Questioning the driver about the colour of the car I can understand. But how did this stop lead to a search? Did the cop think he'd find something in the car that would prove it had, or had not, been painted? On what grounds did he ask to search the car, apart from the old "I smell drugs" line?

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.


Watch a few episodes of Cops and you'll see how it works. "AtthistimeyouarefreetogodoyoumindifIsearchyourvehicle?" "Go right ahead." Cops love low hanging fruit that drops right into their hands.
 
2013-01-05 12:09:24 AM
Meh; I'm not too concerned. It is the responsibility the owner of the car to update the state as to what color it has changed to.

Running random plates, as long as it does not create a permanent mark against the vehicle in question, I'm fine with.

The owner did not have to consent to a search.

/ I know, I know; often the result of a refusal of consent, is a warrant to search the vehicle.
 
2013-01-05 12:10:52 AM
www.gta.cz

/seems legit
 
2013-01-05 12:11:02 AM

Kraftwerk Orange: Simple color change? Maybe not.

This on the other hand:

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 850x454]

Might be considered probable cause.


I despise seeing vehicles like that. A perfectly fine Chevy or Caddilac turned into a garish nightmare with even poorer gas mileage and a speedo that won't work right because of the oversized wheels. Oh well. They want the attention, they can have it.
 
2013-01-05 12:11:40 AM

CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.


Massachusetts State Police are notorious for this. The local PD's can usually care less, but the State po pos are constantly riding your ass, running your tags, and pulling you over for any minor infraction. I got my car towed and had to walk home in the middle of the night in an ice storm because my insurance was one day expired and I stopped in rest stop near my house to tinkle so I didn't wet my pants. Nanny state, indeed. Thank god I don't live in that festering, pus-filled fistula of a state any more.
 
2013-01-05 12:19:57 AM

Loaded Six String: Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no.


Odd, I would think "yes". Different color = different vehicle. Kinda the whole point of noting the vehicle's color in the first place.

Seriously, I always thought one would have to report a color change to the DMV. No?
 
2013-01-05 12:22:55 AM

Macular Degenerate: CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Massachusetts State Police are notorious for this. The local PD's can usually care less, but the State po pos are constantly riding your ass, running your tags, and pulling you over for any minor infraction. I got my car towed and had to walk home in the middle of the night in an ice storm because my insurance was one day expired and I stopped in rest stop near my house to tinkle so I didn't wet my pants. Nanny state, indeed. Thank god I don't live in that festering, pus-filled fistula of a state any more.


Hey, just because you chose to live outside of the 95 belt doesn't mean Boston sucks. Even worse if you lived outside of 495. Then you might as well be living in Dueling Banjos country.
 
2013-01-05 12:28:33 AM
Loaded Six String:
I despise seeing vehicles like that. A perfectly fine Chevy or Caddilac turned into a garish nightmare with even poorer gas mileage and a speedo that won't work right because of the oversized wheels. Oh well. They want the attention, they can have it.

It's even funnier when you see one of those things sitting by the side of the road with a broken wheel. Between the low-profile tires and the cheap metal in most of those Hot Wheels rims, they shatter with hilarious frequency. There's a spot in the road near my house that breaks them on a regular basis (a sharp dip in the road that's uncomfortable in a normal car).

Don't forget the blown transmissions and burned out brakes - the extra few inches of tire diameter makes a big difference. Fifty percent more wheel radius = more than twice as much stress. A 6000 pound SUV with too-big wheels and not enough extra engineering is a recipe for a short vehicle life.
 
2013-01-05 12:31:14 AM

Loaded Six String: Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no. Have a nice day officer.

/As a side note, allowing police to pull over and cite vehicles for having modified exhausts based on an ambiguous noise level (can be heard from a block away) is complete bull for numerous reasons. I would not be surprised if it is in fact a run around anti-profiling measures.


So they pull over a lot of skinny, white kids?

www.lotustalk.com
/Probably sounds like a revved up weedeater on meth.
 
2013-01-05 12:31:45 AM

ArcadianRefugee: Loaded Six String: Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no.

Odd, I would think "yes". Different color = different vehicle. Kinda the whole point of noting the vehicle's color in the first place.

Seriously, I always thought one would have to report a color change to the DMV. No?


In what time frame? Admittedly, he should have said no to a search of the vehicle. Then they bring the dogs because you refused the search. You have nothing to hide, so you have no reason to not want me to search your vehicle is b.s.

/Something is wrong here. Captain Picard doesn't like what we've become.
//You're my bestest friend if you know the episode :D
 
2013-01-05 12:35:49 AM

Loaded Six String: /Something is wrong here. Captain Picard doesn't like what we've become.
//You're my bestest friend if you know the episode :D


Measure of a Man or Drumhead are my initial guesses.
 
2013-01-05 12:36:14 AM

Indypendy: Loaded Six String: Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no. Have a nice day officer.

/As a side note, allowing police to pull over and cite vehicles for having modified exhausts based on an ambiguous noise level (can be heard from a block away) is complete bull for numerous reasons. I would not be surprised if it is in fact a run around anti-profiling measures.

So they pull over a lot of skinny, white kids?

[www.lotustalk.com image 500x277]
/Probably sounds like a revved up weedeater on meth.


They did in my case. You should have seen the look on the deputy's face when he saw a skinny white kid and his ~50 year old father in the vehicle. You could tell we weren't the droids he was looking for.

/Low rumbly sound, more like a 6 cylinder than the 4-banger that's actually under the hood.
//Will be glad to be rid of the car.
///Previous owner installed the exhaust can.
 
2013-01-05 12:36:36 AM
let us not miss the point that the little nubian had DRUGS in his car. cop should have shot the little druge dealer on the spot.
 
2013-01-05 12:37:27 AM

pedrop357: Loaded Six String: /Something is wrong here. Captain Picard doesn't like what we've become.
//You're my bestest friend if you know the episode :D

Measure of a Man or Drumhead are my initial guesses.


You will have to settle for new friend, since you couldn't commit to one answer :D
 
2013-01-05 12:39:21 AM

cirby: Loaded Six String:
I despise seeing vehicles like that. A perfectly fine Chevy or Caddilac turned into a garish nightmare with even poorer gas mileage and a speedo that won't work right because of the oversized wheels. Oh well. They want the attention, they can have it.

It's even funnier when you see one of those things sitting by the side of the road with a broken wheel. Between the low-profile tires and the cheap metal in most of those Hot Wheels rims, they shatter with hilarious frequency. There's a spot in the road near my house that breaks them on a regular basis (a sharp dip in the road that's uncomfortable in a normal car).

Don't forget the blown transmissions and burned out brakes - the extra few inches of tire diameter makes a big difference. Fifty percent more wheel radius = more than twice as much stress. A 6000 pound SUV with too-big wheels and not enough extra engineering is a recipe for a short vehicle life.


Haven't seen one broken yet, but every time I see one take a corner I'm amazed it doesn't roll like a Reliant Robin.
 
2013-01-05 12:46:43 AM
I dont understand why the color was even on the registration. Maybe I have not looked in enough detail but I dont think that appears on CA registration. Why would it? The plate should be tied to the VIN of the car, not to something like color that is relatively commonly changed.
 
2013-01-05 12:46:52 AM

Gyrfalcon: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

??

Police have always been allowed to run your plates. Just like they can follow you for 50 miles down the road for no reason at all to see if you do something. "Land of the free" doesn't mean "Land where cops don't exist till YOU want them."

You're not one of those ones who always post "When seconds count, the police are minutes away!" crap, are you? Cuz this is what's known as "proactive policing"--checking to see if a car is stolen BEFORE someone reports it stolen, you know? Would you prefer the cop wait till the car gets reported, or would you be the one whining that "The cop saw that car driving down the road and didn't do anything! What a lazy pig!"


Mostly I was just being an ass, I usually try not to as a rule, but Americans are so fond of talking about being free, and there are so many little things like this that are eroding those freedoms in small often unnoticed ways. Cops have not always randomly run plates, that started once they started putting computers in cars. Before that they could call one in, but they would only do that after some something had their suspicion up.  Ultimately this guy's search should never have happened. I guess it's up in the air just exactly where the cop crossed the line.
But if the cop was assuming the car is stolen if the car shows up with the wrong paint colour, it's been gone long enough to paint it and have it dry. Typically long enough for the owner to know it's gone and report it stolen.

One time about 7 or 8 years ago, I got stopped in a speed trap, the officer noticed (somehow I hadn't, I'm usually pretty good about this sort of thing) that the colour listed on my ownership was green GN, the car was grey GY and always had been.  Fortunately she finally figured out to look at the vin numbers which matched, including the paint colour code but that was a much longer stop than it should have been.  (even got out of the speeding ticket by the end.)

So I guess the lesson is check your ownership, and if you paint your car a different colour, get your ownership updated.
 
2013-01-05 12:48:37 AM
farm8.staticflickr.com
 
2013-01-05 12:48:42 AM

jaylectricity: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all? Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.


Why would it give him any ideas?
 
2013-01-05 12:50:54 AM
"So I guess the lesson is check your ownership, and if you paint your car a different colour, get your ownership updated."

How? As the article pointed out the state had no form for an owner to do so.
 
2013-01-05 12:56:43 AM

Ima4nic8or: "So I guess the lesson is check your ownership, and if you paint your car a different colour, get your ownership updated."

How? As the article pointed out the state had no form for an owner to do so.


What the hell do they do when you move?  Or change your name?
 
2013-01-05 12:57:17 AM
He consented then it's his problem.
 
2013-01-05 01:01:55 AM

Flint Ironstag:

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.


From the link below the article:

y. During the stop, however, the deputy
smelled marijuana emanating from the car and conducted a search of appellant, his
passenger, and the vehicle. Marijuana and crack cocaine were recovered from the
vehicle, and about $1,100 in cash was recovered from appellant. Appellant was
charged with trafficking in cocaine (between 28-200 grams), possession of
marijuana (less than 20 grams), and possession of drug paraphernalia, scales.
 
2013-01-05 01:06:10 AM
After seeing a pic of the dude, I'm okay with this.
 
2013-01-05 01:08:42 AM
New York State tried for a money grab. Our cops have the automatic plate scanners that scan every car. The state wanted some money so they tried to say that the current license plates were hard for the scanners to read and that everyone, even the people who just got them, would have to pay to get new plates in the new colors. It was pretty close to going through until the police came out and said the scanners worked fine on the old colors and basically said the governor was full of it. So glad Patterson is gone.
 
2013-01-05 01:12:11 AM

iheartscotch: Meh; I'm not too concerned. It is the responsibility the owner of the car to update the state as to what color it has changed to.

Running random plates, as long as it does not create a permanent mark against the vehicle in question, I'm fine with.

The owner did not have to consent to a search.

/ I know, I know; often the result of a refusal of consent, is a warrant to search the vehicle.


FTA: "Changing the color of a vehicle is not illegal, and the state does not require an owner to report the change in color to the DHSMV [Department of Highway Safety, Motor Vehicles Division],"

The matter is complicated further because the state has no form a driver can use to report a change in vehicle color

So, it's neither illegal to change the color of one's vehicle, nor is there a way to report a change of vehicle color to the state. What would you suggest?
 
2013-01-05 01:12:18 AM

Macular Degenerate: CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Massachusetts State Police are notorious for this. The local PD's can usually care less, but the State po pos are constantly riding your ass, running your tags, and pulling you over for any minor infraction. I got my car towed and had to walk home in the middle of the night in an ice storm because my insurance was one day expired and I stopped in rest stop near my house to tinkle so I didn't wet my pants. Nanny state, indeed. Thank god I don't live in that festering, pus-filled fistula of a state any more.


That's OK. The state is filled with Massholes as it is.
 
2013-01-05 01:25:08 AM

Bathia_Mapes: iheartscotch: Meh; I'm not too concerned. It is the responsibility the owner of the car to update the state as to what color it has changed to.

Running random plates, as long as it does not create a permanent mark against the vehicle in question, I'm fine with.

The owner did not have to consent to a search.

/ I know, I know; often the result of a refusal of consent, is a warrant to search the vehicle.

FTA: "Changing the color of a vehicle is not illegal, and the state does not require an owner to report the change in color to the DHSMV [Department of Highway Safety, Motor Vehicles Division],"

The matter is complicated further because the state has no form a driver can use to report a change in vehicle color

So, it's neither illegal to change the color of one's vehicle, nor is there a way to report a change of vehicle color to the state. What would you suggest?


Smoke signals?

I can see both sides; on one hand, someone might have ganked someone else's licence plate. In that case; it is perfectly legitimate to stop a car that doesn't match the description of the licensed car.

On the other hand, if you are going to use that as a factor for stops; then it is reasonable to have the latest information about the vehicle.

With an additional forms comes additional trips to the DMV and an additional cost to the state.

/ maybe, you shouldn't change the color of your car in Florida.
 
2013-01-05 01:31:53 AM

CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.


Yes they do, and that's illegal.
 
2013-01-05 01:36:02 AM

President Merkin Muffley: Yes they do, and that's illegal.


What?
 
2013-01-05 01:38:13 AM

iheartscotch: Bathia_Mapes: iheartscotch: Meh; I'm not too concerned. It is the responsibility the owner of the car to update the state as to what color it has changed to.

Running random plates, as long as it does not create a permanent mark against the vehicle in question, I'm fine with.

The owner did not have to consent to a search.

/ I know, I know; often the result of a refusal of consent, is a warrant to search the vehicle.

FTA: "Changing the color of a vehicle is not illegal, and the state does not require an owner to report the change in color to the DHSMV [Department of Highway Safety, Motor Vehicles Division],"

The matter is complicated further because the state has no form a driver can use to report a change in vehicle color

So, it's neither illegal to change the color of one's vehicle, nor is there a way to report a change of vehicle color to the state. What would you suggest?

Smoke signals?

I can see both sides; on one hand, someone might have ganked someone else's licence plate. In that case; it is perfectly legitimate to stop a car that doesn't match the description of the licensed car.

On the other hand, if you are going to use that as a factor for stops; then it is reasonable to have the latest information about the vehicle.

With an additional forms comes additional trips to the DMV and an additional cost to the state.

/ maybe, you shouldn't change the color of your car in Florida.


In Ontario, the ownership itself is the form for any changes, name, address, colour change, new plate, whatever... the back has space for any changes or corrections, you fill that it, swing by the Service Ontario with whatever back-up info you need, bing bang boom, all the new info is in the system and the new ownership arrives in the mail usually in less than 2 weeks.
 
2013-01-05 01:40:54 AM

sno man: In Ontario, the ownership itself is the form for any changes, name, address, colour change, new plate, whatever... the back has space for any changes or corrections, you fill that it, swing by the Service Ontario with whatever back-up info you need, bing bang boom, all the new info is in the system and the new ownership arrives in the mail usually in less than 2 weeks.


Do they give you a temporary registration for those 2 weeks?
 
2013-01-05 01:47:59 AM

Happy Hours: sno man: In Ontario, the ownership itself is the form for any changes, name, address, colour change, new plate, whatever... the back has space for any changes or corrections, you fill that it, swing by the Service Ontario with whatever back-up info you need, bing bang boom, all the new info is in the system and the new ownership arrives in the mail usually in less than 2 weeks.

Do they give you a temporary registration for those 2 weeks?


You get a stamp or sticker (been a while) on the front of your old one (with the updated info written on the back), plus all the updates are in the system if you do get stopped in the mean time.
 
2013-01-05 01:48:41 AM

sno man: Flint Ironstag: From the TFA:
on June 22, 2010 when an Escambia County Deputy Sheriff saw a bright green Chevy. The deputy ran the plate and the record showed the vehicle was registered to a blue Chevy. The deputy initiated a traffic stop, and Kerick Van Teamer, the driver, explained his car had recently been painted. A search turned up drugs leading to Teamer's arrest. Teamer sought to suppress the evidence because he never should have been pulled over in the first place.

A stop I can understand. Questioning the driver about the colour of the car I can understand. But how did this stop lead to a search? Did the cop think he'd find something in the car that would prove it had, or had not, been painted? On what grounds did he ask to search the car, apart from the old "I smell drugs" line?

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.

Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?


It's about 'beyond the stop' and performance objectives.

cop runs plates to come up with excuses for stops which go towards his performance objectives. If he can go 'beyond the stop' to make some sort of bust on some victimless crime that really scores well on his performance objectives. If he scores well for the year he could get promoted, increase in salary, OT, shift preference, etc and so forth.
 
2013-01-05 02:07:44 AM
i142.photobucket.com

OK, what color is this truck? Go ahead Mr. Pig, what color is it?
 
2013-01-05 02:12:17 AM

sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?


Are the cops where you live not allowed to run plates?
 
2013-01-05 02:13:29 AM

Gyrfalcon: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

??

Police have always been allowed to run your plates. Just like they can follow you for 50 miles down the road for no reason at all to see if you do something. "Land of the free" doesn't mean "Land where cops don't exist till YOU want them."

You're not one of those ones who always post "When seconds count, the police are minutes away!" crap, are you? Cuz this is what's known as "proactive policing"--checking to see if a car is stolen BEFORE someone reports it stolen, you know? Would you prefer the cop wait till the car gets reported, or would you be the one whining that "The cop saw that car driving down the road and didn't do anything! What a lazy pig!"


I do believe that the phrase "Oh snap!" can be used here.
 
2013-01-05 02:14:19 AM

Smeggy Smurf: [i142.photobucket.com image 640x480]

OK, what color is this truck? Go ahead Mr. Pig, what color is it?


If no plates are visible then that I have no problem with the police stopping the vehicle.
 
2013-01-05 02:18:47 AM
I bet that cop was using SCMODS.
 
2013-01-05 02:18:57 AM

Gyrfalcon: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

??

Police have always been allowed to run your plates. Just like they can follow you for 50 miles down the road for no reason at all to see if you do something. "Land of the free" doesn't mean "Land where cops don't exist till YOU want them."

You're not one of those ones who always post "When seconds count, the police are minutes away!" crap, are you? Cuz this is what's known as "proactive policing"--checking to see if a car is stolen BEFORE someone reports it stolen, you know? Would you prefer the cop wait till the car gets reported, or would you be the one whining that "The cop saw that car driving down the road and didn't do anything! What a lazy pig!"


How the fark would a cop know that the car has been stolen until it has been reported? Is he/she supposed to psychic as well?
 
2013-01-05 02:28:24 AM

Mock26: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

Are the cops where you live not allowed to run plates?


They can, but to pull you over they have a very short list of reasons, which, oddly would include the wrong colour bit this guy was pulled over for, but should not have been.
 
2013-01-05 02:34:05 AM

sno man: Mock26: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

Are the cops where you live not allowed to run plates?

They can, but to pull you over they have a very short list of reasons, which, oddly would include the wrong colour bit this guy was pulled over for, but should not have been.


Why should he not have been pulled over? The plates did not match the description of the car. To me that is a very legitimate reason to pull someone over.
 
2013-01-05 02:37:47 AM

Mock26: sno man: Mock26: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

Are the cops where you live not allowed to run plates?

They can, but to pull you over they have a very short list of reasons, which, oddly would include the wrong colour bit this guy was pulled over for, but should not have been.

Why should he not have been pulled over? The plates did not match the description of the car. To me that is a very legitimate reason to pull someone over.


that there is apparently no way to update that information in Florida might be a mitigating factor...
 
2013-01-05 02:40:59 AM

HoratioGates: New York State tried for a money grab. Our cops have the automatic plate scanners that scan every car. The state wanted some money so they tried to say that the current license plates were hard for the scanners to read and that everyone, even the people who just got them, would have to pay to get new plates in the new colors. It was pretty close to going through until the police came out and said the scanners worked fine on the old colors and basically said the governor was full of it. So glad Patterson is gone.


Well, in Patterson's defense, he had a very hard time reading the plates.
 
2013-01-05 03:01:20 AM

Ima4nic8or: I dont understand why the color was even on the registration. Maybe I have not looked in enough detail but I dont think that appears on CA registration. Why would it? The plate should be tied to the VIN of the car, not to something like color that is relatively commonly changed.


I know in Missouri that color is listed in the registration information. Would seem to make sense that if you have to report it originally for registration, that you would need to report any change to the color.
 
2013-01-05 03:01:55 AM

Flint Ironstag: From the TFA:
on June 22, 2010 when an Escambia County Deputy Sheriff saw a bright green Chevy. The deputy ran the plate and the record showed the vehicle was registered to a blue Chevy. The deputy initiated a traffic stop, and Kerick Van Teamer, the driver, explained his car had recently been painted. A search turned up drugs leading to Teamer's arrest. Teamer sought to suppress the evidence because he never should have been pulled over in the first place.

A stop I can understand. Questioning the driver about the colour of the car I can understand. But how did this stop lead to a search? Did the cop think he'd find something in the car that would prove it had, or had not, been painted? On what grounds did he ask to search the car, apart from the old "I smell drugs" line?

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.


This is news to you?

Once you're legally stopped, there's scant protection against a search.
They can say they "smelled marijuana", which cannot be disproved in court, as a smell cannot be entered into evidence.
They can say you "appeared nervous".
They can search your person "for weapon, for the officer's safety", however, anything they find is admissible, even if not a weapon.

Just the way it is. The strongest legal protection is in proving they had no legal reason to stop you in the first place. If you can prove the stop was unreasonable, that's a violation of Constitutional rights. You won't get paid a million bucks for your rights being violated or anything, but the Exclusionary Rule pretty much guarantees all the evidence and thus all the charges will get thrown out.

Ironically, if you're searched but not charged with anything, there's very little legal remedy.
 
2013-01-05 03:04:04 AM

Loaded Six String: pedrop357: Loaded Six String: /Something is wrong here. Captain Picard doesn't like what we've become.
//You're my bestest friend if you know the episode :D

Measure of a Man or Drumhead are my initial guesses.

You will have to settle for new friend, since you couldn't commit to one answer :D


I promise I didn't google, but I think it was drumhead. because Picard was on the stand with admiral satee (?) and that sounds like something he would have said then. I thought The measure of a man was a lot about slavery and self determination and drumhead about random/baseless persecution and I think that fits with this more.

I've got amazon prime and now I have to watch them again. While I'm there, I'll end up watching Inner Light and probably Darmok again.
 
2013-01-05 03:06:46 AM

Smeggy Smurf: OK, what color is this truck? Go ahead Mr. Pig, what color is it?


Doesn't matter... plate isn't visible, good for a stop.
 
2013-01-05 03:07:27 AM

President Merkin Muffley: CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Yes they do, and that's illegal.


And why is it illegal exactly?
 
2013-01-05 03:11:22 AM

Ima4nic8or: I dont understand why the color was even on the registration. Maybe I have not looked in enough detail but I dont think that appears on CA registration. Why would it? The plate should be tied to the VIN of the car...


Good sir, I run CA plates all day at work and I can confirm that CA does not have the color specified in the DMV system unless it's on the DOJ stop flag for a stolen vehicle. CA doesn't even list the model, just a code for the body type. All states list the VIN and the plate though, that way we can always make sure the plate and VIN match.

jaybeezey:

How the fark would a cop know that the car has been stolen until it has been reported? Is he/she supposed to psychic as well?


It may not be this exact situation, but when a cop pulls someone over that isn't the registered owner they can try to contact the owner and see if they know who has it.
I'm a dispatcher, and I talked to someone just this morning whose daughter's car was stolen while the daughter was out of state for winter break. Whomever had it was speeding like crazy and got pulled over. They couldn't explain why they had possession of the car so we called the registered owner (at 3am) and they let us know that it was stolen.
 
2013-01-05 03:22:16 AM

pedrop357: Loaded Six String: pedrop357: Loaded Six String: /Something is wrong here. Captain Picard doesn't like what we've become.
//You're my bestest friend if you know the episode :D

Measure of a Man or Drumhead are my initial guesses.

You will have to settle for new friend, since you couldn't commit to one answer :D

I promise I didn't google, but I think it was drumhead. because Picard was on the stand with admiral satee (?) and that sounds like something he would have said then. I thought The measure of a man was a lot about slavery and self determination and drumhead about random/baseless persecution and I think that fits with this more.

I've got amazon prime and now I have to watch them again. While I'm there, I'll end up watching Inner Light and probably Darmok again.


Indeed, it was Drumhead.

Worf: "But if he has nothing to hide than he has nothing to fear."
Picard: "Oh no Mr. Worf. We cannot allow ourselves to think that. The Seventh Gauruntee is one of the founding principles of the Federation. Something is wrong here Mr. Worf. I do not like what we've become."

Good parallel with McCarthy's Red Scare.

/Part of why I love Star Trek are the stories which mirror current and historical events and give the viewer cause to explore a moral dilemma.
//Done exposing myself now.
 
2013-01-05 03:34:46 AM

Ima4nic8or: I dont understand why the color was even on the registration. Maybe I have not looked in enough detail but I dont think that appears on CA registration. Why would it? The plate should be tied to the VIN of the car, not to something like color that is relatively commonly changed.


in my state color is most certainly on the registration as is logical for identification. it is the owners responsibility to update their documents at DMV. it doesn't matter that your taxes pay for most roads, your buying American cars keeps Americans employed and our (rich people owned) government makes sure you use and buy gasoline for the most part. they still tell you "driving is a privilege not a right" and they make up all the rules, laws and statutes.

take a look at your driver license. got it at 17, weighed 179? now you're a fast food 324 but the driver license still reads 179? that is falsified documentation and you can get screwed for that. so something as lare as car color - a/k/a it may be stolen and repainted - could wind up in having a bad day. surprised Farkers don't know this but hey, it's one of the few things i happen to know.
 
2013-01-05 04:33:27 AM
It's no mystery people.
I bought a used motorcycle in Jacksonville. When I registered it, the clerk asked me if it was still the same color.
 
2013-01-05 05:55:58 AM
What about if the car is covered in multiple layers of shelf pape[checks thread]

Well played, calbert. You win this time.
 
2013-01-05 07:01:25 AM
How about no.
 
2013-01-05 07:04:04 AM
wanted for questioning
stblogs.hotrod.com
 
2013-01-05 08:47:42 AM

HoratioGates: New York State tried for a money grab. Our cops have the automatic plate scanners that scan every car. The state wanted some money so they tried to say that the current license plates were hard for the scanners to read and that everyone, even the people who just got them, would have to pay to get new plates in the new colors. It was pretty close to going through until the police came out and said the scanners worked fine on the old colors and basically said the governor was full of it. So glad Patterson is gone.


I would suspect Patterson had a very difficult time reading the scanners
 
2013-01-05 09:02:32 AM

Loaded Six String: Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no. Have a nice day officer.

/As a side note, allowing police to pull over and cite vehicles for having modified exhausts based on an ambiguous noise level (can be heard from a block away) is complete bull for numerous reasons. I would not be surprised if it is in fact a run around anti-profiling measures.


I proudly got a ticket for excessive loud exhaust on my 84 Buick regal. V6
Was driving to muffler shop at the time.
The judge laughed his arse off and dismissed the ticket.
 
2013-01-05 09:24:28 AM

Kraftwerk Orange: CruiserTwelve: sno man: Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?

Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Our local cops have plate scanners to do that automatically. They don't even have to lift a finger - the system scans every plate of every car, and checks for tickets or other pertinent info. They're getting ready to connect that system to our street cameras as well.


Most people don't even know about these and the police don't like to talk about it. The police can scan every car in a parking lot in seconds. Soon they will be scanning every car on the road. It is real life Orwellian 1984 stuff. Nobody cares.
 
2013-01-05 09:38:55 AM

sno man: Flint Ironstag: From the TFA:
on June 22, 2010 when an Escambia County Deputy Sheriff saw a bright green Chevy. The deputy ran the plate and the record showed the vehicle was registered to a blue Chevy. The deputy initiated a traffic stop, and Kerick Van Teamer, the driver, explained his car had recently been painted. A search turned up drugs leading to Teamer's arrest. Teamer sought to suppress the evidence because he never should have been pulled over in the first place.

A stop I can understand. Questioning the driver about the colour of the car I can understand. But how did this stop lead to a search? Did the cop think he'd find something in the car that would prove it had, or had not, been painted? On what grounds did he ask to search the car, apart from the old "I smell drugs" line?

TFA doesn't explain this, or say whether the guy consented to the search.

Back up even further, why was the cop running the plate at all?  Speeding? Blowing a stop sign? Driving a shiny car while black?


Its what cops do... All day, every day. If they are not busy pulling you over for a real violation, then they are randomly running the license plates of the vehicles around them, hoping to find something.
 
2013-01-05 10:12:52 AM
Most motor vehicle laws exist solely as a pretext for "probable cause" to stop and search a vehicle, so this is not surprising.
 
2013-01-05 10:22:37 AM

Maul555: Its what cops do... All day, every day. If they are not busy pulling you over for a real violation, then they are randomly running the license plates of the vehicles around them, hoping to find something.


How is this significantly different from stopping random people on the street and demanding 'Papers Please', just to be sure there isn't any outstanding warrants, tickets, missed child support payments, etc? Just because it's quicker and can be done surreptitiously doesn't make it any less a 'fishing expedition'.
 
2013-01-05 11:20:28 AM

wambu: Most motor vehicle laws exist solely as a pretext for "probable cause" to stop and search a vehicle, so this is not surprising.


It's all unconstitutional bullshiat. The founding fathers would not have put up with this crap in their horse and buggies.
 
2013-01-05 11:54:47 AM

DigitalCoffee: Maul555: Its what cops do... All day, every day. If they are not busy pulling you over for a real violation, then they are randomly running the license plates of the vehicles around them, hoping to find something.

How is this significantly different from stopping random people on the street and demanding 'Papers Please', just to be sure there isn't any outstanding warrants, tickets, missed child support payments, etc? Just because it's quicker and can be done surreptitiously doesn't make it any less a 'fishing expedition'.


Three words: License Plate Scanners

/now you can be afraid
 
2013-01-05 01:08:01 PM

Gyrfalcon: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

??

Police have always been allowed to run your plates. Just like they can follow you for 50 miles down the road for no reason at all to see if you do something. "Land of the free" doesn't mean "Land where cops don't exist till YOU want them."

You're not one of those ones who always post "When seconds count, the police are minutes away!" crap, are you? Cuz this is what's known as "proactive policing"--checking to see if a car is stolen BEFORE someone reports it stolen, you know? Would you prefer the cop wait till the car gets reported, or would you be the one whining that "The cop saw that car driving down the road and didn't do anything! What a lazy pig!"


Don't drive a car that someone wants to steal. There, problem solved.

I could care farking less if someone stole one of my cars.
 
2013-01-05 01:14:36 PM

sno man: Mock26: sno man: Mock26: sno man: jaylectricity: Every one knows that cops run random plates just for something to do. That's why I always turn off the road when a cop pulls in behind me. I don't want him getting any ideas.
CruiserTwelve: Cops run plates at random all the time. Checking to see if the car is stolen, the plates are being misused, warrants for the registered owner, etc.

Fair enough...
How's that whole "Land of the Free" thing working out?

Are the cops where you live not allowed to run plates?

They can, but to pull you over they have a very short list of reasons, which, oddly would include the wrong colour bit this guy was pulled over for, but should not have been.

Why should he not have been pulled over? The plates did not match the description of the car. To me that is a very legitimate reason to pull someone over.

that there is apparently no way to update that information in Florida might be a mitigating factor...


Can you provide citation for this? I am not doubting you, I just did not think that would be the case. Seems to me that if they can enter the initial color into the database that they can update it.
 
2013-01-05 01:22:55 PM

Mock26: Can you provide citation for this? I am not doubting you, I just did not think that would be the case. Seems to me that if they can enter the initial color into the database that they can update it.


FTA:
"Changing the color of a vehicle is not illegal, and the state does not require an owner to report the change in color to the DHSMV [Department of Highway Safety, Motor Vehicles Division]," Judge James R. Wolf wrote for the three-judge panel. "The question then is what degree of suspicion attaches to this particular noncriminal act?"

Aside from three cases, the First District judges found most court decisions it reviewed from around the country did not believe a color mismatch on its own justified a stop. The First District suggested this is the same situation as a motorist driving with a temporary license plate tag. Though it is possible such tags could be expired, that would amount to no more than a hunch. The matter is complicated further because the state has no form a driver can use to report a change in vehicle color.

 
Yea, I totally agree that is weird, and if there is no way to update the info, why ask for it in the first place?
 
2013-01-05 01:23:28 PM

iheartscotch: Meh; I'm not too concerned. It is the responsibility the owner of the car to update the state as to what color it has changed to.

Running random plates, as long as it does not create a permanent mark against the vehicle in question, I'm fine with.

The owner did not have to consent to a search.

/ I know, I know; often the result of a refusal of consent, is a warrant to search the vehicle.


Better to document than not.
 
2013-01-05 01:44:56 PM
By the way, given all the outrage, concerns of privacy, talk of abuse, etc. of vehicle registration information, is it any wonder why gun owners don't want their guns registered?
 
2013-01-05 02:34:24 PM

pedrop357: is it any wonder why gun owners don't want their guns registered


You're under arrest for changing the color of the grips on your .45 without updating your registration. (P.S. there's no way you can update your registration)
 
2013-01-05 04:04:34 PM

sno man: Mock26: Can you provide citation for this? I am not doubting you, I just did not think that would be the case. Seems to me that if they can enter the initial color into the database that they can update it.

FTA:
"Changing the color of a vehicle is not illegal, and the state does not require an owner to report the change in color to the DHSMV [Department of Highway Safety, Motor Vehicles Division]," Judge James R. Wolf wrote for the three-judge panel. "The question then is what degree of suspicion attaches to this particular noncriminal act?"

Aside from three cases, the First District judges found most court decisions it reviewed from around the country did not believe a color mismatch on its own justified a stop. The First District suggested this is the same situation as a motorist driving with a temporary license plate tag. Though it is possible such tags could be expired, that would amount to no more than a hunch. The matter is complicated further because the state has no form a driver can use to report a change in vehicle color.

Yea, I totally agree that is weird, and if there is no way to update the info, why ask for it in the first place?


Thanks for the info. It is much appreciated. I wonder, though, if someone can just go down to the DMV and have them update their database without a form?
 
2013-01-05 04:05:23 PM

ArcadianRefugee: Loaded Six String: Unless you can articulate how the plate being on the same model vehicle yet a different color constitutes probably cause, no.

Odd, I would think "yes". Different color = different vehicle. Kinda the whole point of noting the vehicle's color in the first place.

Seriously, I always thought one would have to report a color change to the DMV. No?


Do we have to report "Clear coat peeling"? Man, are they going to be busy.
 
2013-01-05 08:07:59 PM
Little by little liberty dies.
 
2013-01-05 10:44:10 PM

DigitalCoffee: How is this significantly different from stopping random people on the street and demanding 'Papers Please', just to be sure there isn't any outstanding warrants, tickets, missed child support payments, etc? Just because it's quicker and can be done surreptitiously doesn't make it any less a 'fishing expedition'.


The difference is that running your license plate is unobtrusive. It doesn't require that the officer detain you or question you.
 
2013-01-06 12:57:25 AM

CruiserTwelve: The difference is that running your license plate is unobtrusive. It doesn't require that the officer detain you or question you.


That's not what the Florida Highway Patrolwoman thinks. She's suing over a variety of harassing actions, including having her info run numerous times. If running her info is invasive, what is running plates without a reason?

I wonder how receptive police departments would be to a law requiring them to reveal when/why they ran a person's plates say 6 months after the fact.
 
2013-01-06 12:59:57 AM

Ima4nic8or: I dont understand why the color was even on the registration. Maybe I have not looked in enough detail but I dont think that appears on CA registration. Why would it? The plate should be tied to the VIN of the car, not to something like color that is relatively commonly changed.


Someone else has probably already mentioned this, but look harder. Yes your cars color is on your CA registration.
 
2013-01-06 03:36:24 AM

pedrop357: That's not what the Florida Highway Patrolwoman thinks. She's suing over a variety of harassing actions, including having her info run numerous times. If running her info is invasive, what is running plates without a reason?


That's a totally different situation. They were pulling her driver's license photo repeatedly just to see what she looked like. That's not nearly the same as randomly checking license plates for evidence of a crime. One is intrusive, the other is not.
 
2013-01-06 08:26:55 AM

Agent Smiths Laugh: Little by little liberty dies.


You're hysterical.

No, really.

You really are gonna say we live in tyranny because the cops got a hinky feelin at a car that got LOLwhoops Earl Scheibed and they actually did their jobs and checked up on it??
 
2013-01-06 10:25:17 AM

Ima4nic8or: I dont understand why the color was even on the registration. Maybe I have not looked in enough detail but I dont think that appears on CA registration. Why would it? The plate should be tied to the VIN of the car, not to something like color that is relatively commonly changed.


The VIN actually includes the original car color.
 
Displayed 93 of 93 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report