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(Kotaku)   So I'm fighting this giant eyeball. I don't know why it's an eyeball ...I guess it's a demon or something. Why boss battles matter   (kotaku.com) divider line 131
    More: Interesting, JRPG, Big Bad Antagonist, Final Fantasy VI, NPCs, Kotaku  
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7322 clicks; posted to Geek » on 04 Jan 2013 at 7:46 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-04 09:37:13 PM  
media.giantbomb.com
 
2013-01-04 09:38:44 PM  

duffblue: New Vegas didn't have boss battles and that's why it's the best.

/it's 2013 can we stop boss battles, escort missions, and no saving between checkpoints?


Well... Lanius was the big bad end boss, but you could Speech check your way around him.
 
2013-01-04 09:41:36 PM  

Arumat: "Safer Sephiroth" was mistranslated, it should've been "Seraph Sephiroth" to go with his One-Winged Angel Theme.
Yu Yevon was actually dead and became a fiend like Seymour, and devolved into...whatever the heck he was at the end of the game over the centuries.
Exdeath is a tree because as a tree, he was used as a container for sealed evil spirits. Eventually the evil power in the tree was enough for it to become sentient, and turned it into Exdeath.

/I've probably spent more of my life than is healthy playing Final Fantasy games.


I know these things. I meant more that the fights seemed very disjointed and nonsensical because of the changes, unlike the seamless flow of Kefka's fight. With the three I mentioned, it seemed more like they were just throwing bosses at me, rather than making it impactful. The same would go for Necron showing up at the end of 9 or the 5 or 6 times you have to beat Ultimecia into the ground in 8.
7 briefly came back to sanity with the final Cloud/Sephiroth showdown. That was pretty awesome, but the whole Jenova > Bizarro Sephiroth > Safer/Seraph Sephiroth didn't fit together in my head, even though it seemed like it was going for the same pacing as the Kefka fight without the endscene.
 
2013-01-04 09:46:13 PM  

NeoCortex42:
What about this gem from Blue Dragon:
[www.fangirl.eu image 500x345]
King Poo. An actual piece of shiat is giving you shiat.


images2.wikia.nocookie.net

Better: From Conker's Bad Fur Day, a singing fecal mountain who throws s--t at you, and you toss back toilet paper while climbing slippery ramps to a flush handle.

And Weird Al Yankovic had a hand in the song, if I'm not mistaken.

Truly, a worthy boss battle in the pantheon of video games.
 
2013-01-04 09:46:33 PM  

Smackledorfer: Psychonauts I miss you.


Now remember, only use your power only when it's very, very important. Or it's really, really entertaining. :)
 
2013-01-04 09:48:06 PM  
The boss battle in Dragon's Dogma was great. You spend this whole time knowing you are going to go against the dragon and when you finally do they made it pretty darn awesome. Different stages. You chasing the dragon, the dragon chasing you. Every stage was pretty awesome until you finally take him down. You feel like you actually accomplished something. Probably my favorite boss battle.
 
2013-01-04 09:48:52 PM  
Mr. Freeze, Arkham City, new game +. My favorite boss fight in a long while.
 
2013-01-04 09:52:09 PM  

Smackledorfer: NeoCortex42: lordargent: Crazy boss battles? Can't get much crazier than monster party.
For example

http://cdn.gamerant.com/wp-content/uploads/monster-party-shrimp.gif

A giant piece of shrimp tempura is giving you shiat?

What about this gem from Blue Dragon:

King Poo. An actual piece of shiat is giving you shiat.

This stuff makes me wish okage the shadow king hadn't changed gears from awesome to tedious midway.

I like weird games. With my xbox still worked. Psychonauts I miss you.


Psychonauts is often on sale on Steam. I took advantage of such a sale and copied my save game from my XBox console.

/XBox still works.
 
2013-01-04 10:00:11 PM  
Without the boss battle how would we find out that our princess is actually in another castle.
 
2013-01-04 10:01:22 PM  

NeoCortex42: The warthog runs (in Halo 1 and 3) were still loads more fun than Halo 2's craptastic attempts at actual boss fights. Those ones just felt really shoehorned in.


This! I actually really enjoyed the warthog runs, especially Halo 1. My brother and I used to play that part over and over again. It's a change of pace from the rest of the game, but I think it's almost better because it's a tense situation----the first time in that game where you face the "ticking clock."
 
2013-01-04 10:02:12 PM  

RedPhoenix122: Elandriel: I like boss battles when you have to incorporate skills or techniques you've learned over the past while, but when it's just a case of "here's a guy with a million health that hits like a train and is basically an endless fight" well that gets old.

A valid point.  I also hate boss battles that are half quick-time button pressing events.  However, while frustrating, I do enjoy multi-stage bosses if unexpected and well thought out.


Qte boss action can suck dicks in hell. Also switching from buttons to stylus like the Ds castelvania blew.
 
2013-01-04 10:03:54 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: The only "boss" battle in Skyrim is the three assholes that use the disarm shout and cause you to lose your weapon in the water. I hate them. I'm going to shoot arrows into their dicks when my new character reaches them. Because dickshots are funny.

/dick


Oh lord I'd almost forgotten about them! Those guys are farking assholes. The first time I tried to fight them I died because I spent the entire fight running around the room looking for my bow while they shouted/fired arrows at me. The second time I got wise, and made sure I had like 4 or 5 bows in my inventory, so if they disarmed me, I could just grab another one.
 
2013-01-04 10:08:05 PM  

xelnia: Well then do I have the game for you! Shadow of the Colossus!


I was wondering if this might be the centerpiece of the article. Give credit for team ICO for trolling gamers. One game is all boss battles, the other is a game long escort mission. Both should not be masterpieces on the face of it, but there we care.
 
2013-01-04 10:13:46 PM  
sticktwiddlers.com
 
2013-01-04 10:14:00 PM  
I loved Half-Life's giant floating open-cranium baby ending, because I could jump into his cranium and beat the fark out of him with the crowbar in a place where he couldn't shoot me. Most fun and satisfying boss-fight ever.
 
2013-01-04 10:29:54 PM  
pushstartselect.com
Myria - Breath of fire III

*Spoiler*

A dragon Manipulating false god techno-mage with an ability called Holocaust. What's not to love?
 
2013-01-04 10:30:14 PM  

badLogic: And a poorly done final non-boss fight can really kill the entire game.  Assassin's Creed III for example.


Ugh... I'll never know, because there's no way I'm going to bother finishing that suckfest... slow story, wooden voice-acting, vast tracts of land to constantly traverse... screw that. I picked up a cheap Steam code for Hitman:Absolution, and haven't played ACIII since.
 
2013-01-04 10:39:37 PM  
Then there was The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion where you fought the final boss over and over and over and over until you got tired of repeating the same mission and decided the game was over (that's how I played it anyway).
 
2013-01-04 10:40:50 PM  

Ego edo infantia cattus: A dragon Manipulating false god techno-mage with an ability called Holocaust. What's not to love?


That one attack where her stomach bursts open and her intestines attack you.
 
2013-01-04 10:45:34 PM  
i36.photobucket.com

Hey guysth, wahs goin' on indis thwead?
 
2013-01-04 10:47:21 PM  
Giant eyeball? Why did every Zelda game come to mind?

/loves me some Zelda
 
2013-01-04 10:52:20 PM  

Sergeant Grumbles: Ego edo infantia cattus: A dragon Manipulating false god techno-mage with an ability called Holocaust. What's not to love?

That one attack where her stomach bursts open and her intestines attack you.


Lol, forgot that one. Reaaaaly need to get that game again. Gave it to a friend, and he sold it for five bucks. It's worth sixty now. :(
 
2013-01-04 10:55:07 PM  

Practical_Draconian: Glitchwerks: Ed Finnerty: This is what keeps me from buying Deus Ex on Steam. I had it on PS3 and the bosses really killed it for me.

Every boss in Deus Ex: HR can be beaten within a minute at the most. 2 of them can be taken down within 10 seconds.

I hate boss battles too, but the Deus Ex ones can be resolved with little to no fuss so I didn't mind them.

In the original Deus Ex, two of the bosses could be killed just by uttering a phrase, if you looked around and were empathetic enough.

Also, making the final boss in Fallout die of a heart attack by letting him know his grand master plan wouldn't work.


God I wish they made more games like Fallout 1. Where text choices actually mattered, and the dialogue and options did things, rather than just endlessly pointing you to the same routes regardless of what you 'choose'. That's what I miss most about the old-school games vs. the new ones (Fallout in particular), the sense that, if I built a charismatic talker, I could go through a lot of the game talking people into/out of things, hacking stuff, talking my way into better gear (scoped hunting rifles?) instead of playing a FPS with some tacked on levelups.

Ego edo infantia cattus: [pushstartselect.com image 225x225]
Myria - Breath of fire III

*Spoiler*

A dragon Manipulating false god techno-mage with an ability called Holocaust. What's not to love?


Are those games available (legally) anywhere other than the PSN? I've missed old school JRPGs, and never got to play the BoF games through, and won't buy a shiatty console for a handful of good 20 year old games. Which is irritating. No one makes JRPGs like that any more either, and now I feel old.
 
2013-01-04 11:13:06 PM  
images2.wikia.nocookie.net

Boss battles are essential because there is nothing better than telling a world-destroying space locust just where he can shove his spawn. Especially when you can tell the rest of your team to hang back and go solo because hey, you got this.
 
2013-01-04 11:16:32 PM  

kroonermanblack: Are those games available (legally) anywhere other than the PSN? I've missed old school JRPGs, and never got to play the BoF games through, and won't buy a shiatty console for a handful of good 20 year old games. Which is irritating. No one makes JRPGs like that any more either, and now I feel old.


Don't think there are any legal avenues.

I think BoF 1 & 2 were remade for Gameboy Advance. Not sure of 3 and 4.
Remakes can be your friend, though. Star Ocean 1 and 2 for the PSP are good, and SO2 is a lot more polished over the PS1 version. The Mario & Luigi games for GBA and DS have a good old school feel to them, and Paper Mario as well.
If you want to go crazy, there's Pier Solar, developed in 2010 for, no joke, the Sega Genesis, and it's coming to Xbox soon.

There's several Phantasy Star collections you can get, too. Those are some good games...
Hell, I probably need my own list...
 
2013-01-04 11:16:49 PM  
Going old school with this one..
.
i46.tinypic.com

Sure you had unlimited continues, that just meant you could stay up all night trying to beat that farking hornet,
 
2013-01-04 11:17:58 PM  

Smackledorfer: I just played it last month. There is zero explanation for why the statues obey him. Oh, you just give them orders?


Actually, yes.

(SPOILERS)

It's not so much that they obey him as they're completely controlled by him. Recall that destroying the statues was supposed to be the event that destroyed magic in the human world; but it didn't work. One of the last lines before the final fight remarked that Kefka had already absorbed the power of the statues by that point. It's implied that the statues are pretty much his puppets by that time, and that's why it was Kefka's admittedly low resolution death that caused the end of magic.

I agree with you about the blue shiny esper capturing sparks though. Should have been just a bit harder for him that that.
 
2013-01-04 11:24:58 PM  

StrangeQ: [images2.wikia.nocookie.net image 425x208]

Boss battles are essential because there is nothing better than telling a world-destroying space locust just where he can shove his spawn. Especially when you can tell the rest of your team to hang back and go solo because hey, you got this.


I actually beat that game NOT using Chrono. Magus was that cool.
/great theme song that emo fark had too
 
2013-01-04 11:29:17 PM  

Smackledorfer: I know we are supposed to accept the convenient massive shifting of boss power levels so that all your efforts are meaningless, but ff6's bugged me more than any rpg I've played, I think.


I've always thought that was because you were always supposed to be behind. You were fighting the evil Empire, who'd practically already won the war. They already knew how to extract living Esper essence and shunt it into a person or machine to imbue them with magic. But however powerful, it was an imperfect process. Once they figured out keeping the Esper alive actually impeded the process, they could literally go over 9000. In the beginning of the game, you're faced with a Kefka who is only slightly weaker magically than Terra. Once the Empire figured out magicite, though, they could pump Kefka so full of magic he could obliterate just about anything.
 
2013-01-05 12:16:27 AM  

Flt209er: Smackledorfer: I just played it last month. There is zero explanation for why the statues obey him. Oh, you just give them orders?

Actually, yes.

(SPOILERS)

It's not so much that they obey him as they're completely controlled by him. Recall that destroying the statues was supposed to be the event that destroyed magic in the human world; but it didn't work. One of the last lines before the final fight remarked that Kefka had already absorbed the power of the statues by that point. It's implied that the statues are pretty much his puppets by that time, and that's why it was Kefka's admittedly low resolution death that caused the end of magic.

I agree with you about the blue shiny esper capturing sparks though. Should have been just a bit harder for him that that.


Saying in retrospect that kefka had secretly soaked tge magic power out of them still falls under the same classification of story-breaking shenanigans imo.

But there is plenty of room to agree to disagree.

All they would have needed was a couple extra scenes placed in the right spot. Moving the statues to break their balance was fine. Asking them to shoot lightning and do his bidding just struck me as dumb.
 
2013-01-05 12:21:55 AM  

the_sidewinder: Ed Finnerty: This is what keeps me from buying Deus Ex on Steam. I had it on PS3 and the bosses really killed it for me.

If you haven't, get the Missing Link DLC, the boss battle in that is waaaaay truer to the rest of the game

/Asshole in a locked room past a bunch of bots and assorted bad guys. A couple ways into the room, and a few ways to deal with the bad guys (normal set, hack turrets, guns blazing, sneak through vents n stuff, or what I did, energy efficient cloak, with the silent spring mod, and run by everything, silent takedown of the boss)


Can also snipe him from the halfway point.
 
2013-01-05 12:27:44 AM  
JRPGs: All final bosses are god. All of them. A god. "The" god. A false god. Some thing called "Deus", which just means "god" in some other language.
 
2013-01-05 01:10:12 AM  
Like every other game design decision, boss fights are one means to making a game better or worse.  They are not inherently good or bad.  The end.  Dumb thread.
 
2013-01-05 01:10:43 AM  
Dark Souls has some pretty great boss battles. Some pretty great everything else too.
 
2013-01-05 01:40:40 AM  
Speaking of boss battles, I finally played KOTOR for the first time and defeated Malak less than an hour ago!

/I'll probably take a little time of before playing #2
 
2013-01-05 01:48:30 AM  
Loved the heck out of Devil May Cry 3 and their boss battles with the exception of the 2nd last. Giant blobs with tentacles have to be up there as one of the more uninspired boss fights a game can pull.

QTE needs to be shot and left to die. Only recently started working on my backlog with Mass Effect 2 and 3 and while its all great to be cinamatic I'd rather get absorbed in dialogue than sit like a tweaked waiting for the paragon/renegade QTE.
 
2013-01-05 01:57:33 AM  

neuroflare: Speaking of boss battles, I finally played KOTOR for the first time and defeated Malak less than an hour ago!

/I'll probably take a little time of before playing #2


That's a fun fight. The one right before is one of favs too.
 
2013-01-05 02:25:38 AM  

Mentalpatient87: Mr. Freeze, Arkham City, new game +. My favorite boss fight in a long while.


that fight just annoyed me. If you didn't use the top railings for both the takedowns you can do on them then you unofficially lose. That, and the takedown by falling through the glass was ridiculously hard to lure him to.
 
2013-01-05 02:40:28 AM  
Giant eyeball?
upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-01-05 03:03:15 AM  

DenisBergkamp: Loved the heck out of Devil May Cry 3 and their boss battles with the exception of the 2nd last. Giant blobs with tentacles have to be up there as one of the more uninspired boss fights a game can pull.

QTE needs to be shot and left to die. Only recently started working on my backlog with Mass Effect 2 and 3 and while its all great to be cinamatic I'd rather get absorbed in dialogue than sit like a tweaked waiting for the paragon/renegade QTE.


QTE is half of what ruined the new Castlevania games for me.  The other half is the 'stage select' screen.  I wanted a seamless world to explore, not a narrow path I have to take.
 
2013-01-05 03:12:36 AM  

CZMisfitsFan: Giant eyeball?
[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x220]


I'm gonna throw that album on right now...
 
2013-01-05 03:27:01 AM  

Counter_Intelligent: Ys and Zelda are where you go for the best boss fights. No, your dissenting opinion is wrong.


Metroid says hi.

images3.wikia.nocookie.net

images.mylot.com

www.capsulecomputers.com.au

cdn.wikimg.net

media.giantbomb.com

image.gamespotcdn.net
 
2013-01-05 03:32:38 AM  
And the most iconic Metroid boss picture failed to load.

images3.wikia.nocookie.net

ENGAGE RIDLEY MOTHER F*CKER
 
2013-01-05 03:37:04 AM  
DenisBergkamp: QTE needs to be shot and left to die.

What about QTE done right, like in Heavy Rain.

// need to do my second playthrough

// first playthrough, FBI agent died, boy rescued, killer escaped.

// I regret not looking in the medicine cabinet for painkillers, because that voice actor is good at acting out pain, sheesh.
 
2013-01-05 04:01:49 AM  
www.contraweb.org


/A man's got to have a code to live by
www.gamefob.com
 
2013-01-05 04:04:12 AM  
The level 7, lava chamber boss from Descent still haunts my dreams.
 
2013-01-05 04:30:53 AM  

lordargent: DenisBergkamp: QTE needs to be shot and left to die.

What about QTE done right, like in Heavy Rain.

// need to do my second playthrough

// first playthrough, FBI agent died, boy rescued, killer escaped.

// I regret not looking in the medicine cabinet for painkillers, because that voice actor is good at acting out pain, sheesh.


Very good point. I completely forgot about that or what I assume the walking dead games do with it. Maybe the problem comes from games who slap some QTE on sporadically rather than devoted ones like HR.

// might need to dust that off again now that you mention it...
 
2013-01-05 07:12:39 AM  

Dingleberry Dickwad: INeedAName: Personally, I also found Deux-Ex ruined by the boss battles. I spent man hours slogging through a very stealth-oriented character only to get locked in a room with a guy with a huge gun and not enough places for me to hide. It was stupid and I frankly didn't have the patience to play the fight over and over so I could find the right nooks and crannies game developers were kind enough to bless me with.

Shiat like that has led me to spending more time with table top games.

Pretty much all the boss fights in DX: HR can be beaten in a few seconds, even on hard mode. Put 2 points into the Typhoon augment. On regular mode it only takes 2 hits from your typhoon to kill all the bosses except for the final fight. And the final fight can be won ridiculously easily too. Laser rifle, get one from the room with all the creepy looking muscle statues where you fight the guy that beat the crap out of you at the beginning of the game. Couple seconds with that and the boss is toast.

Use whatever items you have to boost your battery power, cloak, walk up to boss, typhoon once wait a second, typhoon again, profit.


Thank you for underscoring my point for me. It's an RPG, but if you want to be successful, you should spend your points in very specific things that may or may not have anything to do with the character you actually want to play. Yay?
 
2013-01-05 07:38:15 AM  

Keizer_Ghidorah: Counter_Intelligent: Ys and Zelda are where you go for the best boss fights. No, your dissenting opinion is wrong.

Metroid says hi.

[media.giantbomb.com image 480x320]


I had forgotten about this guy, gave me fits back in the day, The Ridley battles in Super and Fusion are pretty tough if you aren't familiar with them. I remember Zero Mission being pretty easy overall though.

The classic Mega Man series has a pretty good swath of easy/hard bosses, especially if you use the default buster only. A lot of it is perfecting pattern recognition rather than reaction, but I remember Hard Man, Crystal Man, Yellow Devil, Ring Man among others being quite demanding in terms of your mobility and precision, and would get you in about 10 seconds if you screwed up the jumps (just played through 1-6, 9, 10 recently). Most of the MM Zero games are difficult overall too, and almost all the Sigma battles from the end of the X series are extremely frustrating without crap like the Shoryuken.

God of War's boss battles weren't usually too hard, but they usually had some awesome spectacle or gimmick. I definitely looked forward to them because each one was something a bit different.
 
2013-01-05 08:05:56 AM  

INeedAName: Dingleberry Dickwad: INeedAName: Personally, I also found Deux-Ex ruined by the boss battles. I spent man hours slogging through a very stealth-oriented character only to get locked in a room with a guy with a huge gun and not enough places for me to hide. It was stupid and I frankly didn't have the patience to play the fight over and over so I could find the right nooks and crannies game developers were kind enough to bless me with.

Shiat like that has led me to spending more time with table top games.

Pretty much all the boss fights in DX: HR can be beaten in a few seconds, even on hard mode. Put 2 points into the Typhoon augment. On regular mode it only takes 2 hits from your typhoon to kill all the bosses except for the final fight. And the final fight can be won ridiculously easily too. Laser rifle, get one from the room with all the creepy looking muscle statues where you fight the guy that beat the crap out of you at the beginning of the game. Couple seconds with that and the boss is toast.

Use whatever items you have to boost your battery power, cloak, walk up to boss, typhoon once wait a second, typhoon again, profit.

Thank you for underscoring my point for me. It's an RPG, but if you want to be successful, you should spend your points in very specific things that may or may not have anything to do with the character you actually want to play. Yay?


So in other words you take the role playing part way too seriously. Maybe it's just me, but I get enough role playing kicks from other game play decisions in games. Do I play the character as a cold callous killer or a good guy that doesn't want to kill everything in sight? Sneak by, kill everything, or knock everyone out? Snipe them from a distance or up close and personal? Hack everything in sight or only what's necessary? Do I double cross so and so or play it straight? Do I lie to this person and keep this or play the good guy and be honest? I look at upgrades and skill bonuses like this, "Ok, I need x ability to take out y, but after that everything is gravy and I can pick what I want." I realize that no game is going to be exactly everything I want and I won't be able to do exactly everything I want so I just roll with it.
 
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