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(Digital Spy)   Proving they hate their customers, Sony is working on technology that would make it impossible to play used or borrowed games on the PS4   (digitalspy.com) divider line 182
    More: Fail, Sony, ps3 games, debris disk  
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3053 clicks; posted to Geek » on 04 Jan 2013 at 8:49 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-04 08:29:15 AM
Old news?

We saw this in the summer.  Both Sony and Microsoft are looking to do this with their next gen consoles.  I DNRTA completely, but I know with the Xbox, their goal is to have you buy the game every time it is put in to a new console.  If you buy a used version, it will lock content, and you will have to DLC the rest of the game, which will cost about the same as a new copy.

They really won't do it...they will turn away a lot of people.  I think both companies let the news leak out to test the waters, and it's mighty frigid.
 
2013-01-04 08:47:11 AM
Best part about this?  When your PS4 or XBox 720 dies (RROD, power supply fries, etc) and you go to replace it, none of your games will work.  Tada!
 
2013-01-04 08:52:28 AM
Never trust anything to anyone who works in that industry.
 
2013-01-04 08:53:12 AM
Yeah thanks Sony, but I think I'll stick with downloading $10 indie games off Steam if its all the same.
 
2013-01-04 08:55:20 AM
Considering the used game market rips off the devs/publisher...I'm okay with this. But I know I'm in the minority,
 
2013-01-04 08:57:00 AM

Neverhood9: Considering the used game market rips off the devs/publisher...I'm okay with this. But I know I'm in the minority,


The used car market doesn't rip off the car manufacturers so why is this true for video games?
 
2013-01-04 08:58:33 AM

Neverhood9: Considering the used game market rips off the devs/publisher...I'm okay with this. But I know I'm in the minority,


Yeah, about that:

Kredal: Best part about this?  When your PS4 or XBox 720 dies (RROD, power supply fries, etc) and you go to replace it, none of your games will work.  Tada!


I have two 360s in my house, and I already own two of every MP game I play, now I'd also need to buy two of every single player? Suddenly the Steam console doesn't sound half as bad.
 
2013-01-04 08:59:00 AM
Does anyone remember that prior to their releasing Blu-ray, Sony had this idea about making those blu-ray disks playable on only one machine? Once they played for the first time in a particular machine, they could only be played in that particular machine. That way you couldn't sell them as used, nor lend them out, nor even play them on another Blu-ray player in your home. They later dropped that idea but the mentality is still there. And lets not forget some years earlier when they had extra software on their music CD's that when played on a PC, would install software without the users knowledge that ended up affecting that PC's security. Sony has a history of trying to screw their customers under the guise of fighting piracy.
 
2013-01-04 08:59:17 AM
You'd think for companies that deal with software, they'd understand that no data protection scheme can be perfect and distributable at the same time.
 
2013-01-04 09:02:20 AM
Glad I'm too old to spend time playing games. I wish I could. My cousin's kid loaned me Borderlands about 3 months ago and I've logged about 15 minutes.

Sony pisses me off. I think I need to be logged into the PSN in order to watch Amazon instant videos? Are they that interested in what I watch? F em.
 
2013-01-04 09:02:22 AM

Egoy3k: Neverhood9: Considering the used game market rips off the devs/publisher...I'm okay with this. But I know I'm in the minority,

The used car market doesn't rip off the car manufacturers so why is this true for video games?


Yeah, I never heard music or movie people biatching about this (unless I wasn't listening close enough). How is the video game market different from any other market where you can resell something?
 
2013-01-04 09:04:17 AM
cache.kotaku.com

Be the industry leader on this one, Sony. Guarantee that places like Gamestop and Best Buy won't carry the PS4 and that consumers hate you even more than they already do. That'll surely recover from the PS3 fiasco and retake the lead in the console wars.
 
2013-01-04 09:07:16 AM
Extremely shiatty if not understandable decision. I think it will cause too much bad blood with their users for them to go through with it.

They can just let the developers take the heat when they start releasing pared down titles with everything good trapped in DLC packages.

Or my nightmare scenario, where everything turns in to a Maple Story-esque scheme of endless micro transactions.
 
2013-01-04 09:08:10 AM
Funny... there will be a hack that breaks the scheme approximately 15 minutes after it's introduced to the public. They never learn.

Stuff like this makes me glad I'm a customer of Steam.
 
2013-01-04 09:08:53 AM
The next consoles are still going to require discs??

How quaint.
 
2013-01-04 09:09:39 AM

Latinwolf: Does anyone remember that prior to their releasing Blu-ray, Sony had this idea about making those blu-ray disks playable on only one machine? Once they played for the first time in a particular machine, they could only be played in that particular machine. That way you couldn't sell them as used, nor lend them out, nor even play them on another Blu-ray player in your home. They later dropped that idea but the mentality is still there. And lets not forget some years earlier when they had extra software on their music CD's that when played on a PC, would install software without the users knowledge that ended up affecting that PC's security. Sony has a history of trying to screw their customers under the guise of fighting piracy.


Was is Sony that tried to sue that blogger for telling everyone to just turn off autoplay?
 
2013-01-04 09:11:00 AM

the opposite of charity is justice: That'll surely recover from the PS3 fiasco and retake the lead in the console wars.


i220.photobucket.com
 
2013-01-04 09:13:24 AM
I used to buy about one new game a month back in day, starting in the early 90's. Around 2000 that number started dropping. Now I either buy used (about 6-12 months after it comes out) and maybe 1 new game a year. It might be that I have changed somewhat, but it just seems like such a hassle anymore, and I grew up with making boot disks, CONFIG.SYS and HIMEM.

/has a library of at least 200 games over about 5 different systems, most of them are PC.
//"collector"
 
2013-01-04 09:15:58 AM
And there's technology that allows me to ignore the ps4. It's called only buy products without bullshiat drm involved
 
2013-01-04 09:16:32 AM

HotWingConspiracy: They can just let the developers take the heat when they start releasing pared down titles with everything good trapped in DLC packages.


except they'll still charge $60-80 for that piece of garbage
 
2013-01-04 09:16:45 AM
a used 2008 toyota tacoma doesn't have the same quality and longevity as a new 2013 toyota tacoma and that is why it is cheaper. i'm waiting for the day a car always works and never wears out unless it gets a scratch in the paint and then will never work again.
that disc either works or it doesn't.
if a disc aged like a car or like how just about anything else it would be a better comparison. maybe they should start doing the limited plays system again. didn't best buy have a movie player years ago that let you play a disc a few times? it bombed.
 
2013-01-04 09:18:12 AM

Burr: I used to buy about one new game a month back in day, starting in the early 90's. Around 2000 that number started dropping. Now I either buy used (about 6-12 months after it comes out) and maybe 1 new game a year. It might be that I have changed somewhat, but it just seems like such a hassle anymore, and I grew up with making boot disks, CONFIG.SYS and HIMEM.

/has a library of at least 200 games over about 5 different systems, most of them are PC.
//"collector"


You know Nintendo won't go this route, and I think Microsoft was just throwing it out there to see if would stick.  But, with that said, if both companies DID do this, you can look at PC gaming to take a huge jump again, especially if people start throwing emulators out there that can crack these discs.

And discs?  Really?  Do flash drives have a lower life expectancy vs discs still?
 
2013-01-04 09:20:32 AM
This seems fairly straight forward, you are not buying a game you are purchasing a license to use the game on one specific device. It is equally straight forward that a license is worth much less to the customer base so should be priced at about 20% to 25% the cost of buying a copy of the game.
 
2013-01-04 09:21:37 AM
Yeah, i'd pass on the console if it tried this. While I don't buy many used games during a console gen, I buy a ton after the gen, to catch up on out of print titles I missed. I'm still buying ps1 and ps2 era games, nearly doubling my collection of both in the last few years.

Honestly though, we saw the same rumor during the ps3 pre-launch, and earlier during the first ps4 rumors. I seriously hope sony's japanese execs are not dumb enough to force this on the console. Do it, and quite a few people woud ignore the console and just buy an Xbox or wii ?U instead.
 
2013-01-04 09:25:35 AM
this will be a vast improvement over the ps3 which simply did not have games
 
2013-01-04 09:26:10 AM

Antimatter: I'm still buying ps1 and ps2 era games, nearly doubling my collection of both in the last few years.


Hell, since it takes an average of about a week of soild gaming to finish a major title anymore, I don't think I will ever run out of games to play, especially with GoG and Steam around.
 
2013-01-04 09:29:36 AM

FinFangFark: Burr: I used to buy about one new game a month back in day, starting in the early 90's. Around 2000 that number started dropping. Now I either buy used (about 6-12 months after it comes out) and maybe 1 new game a year. It might be that I have changed somewhat, but it just seems like such a hassle anymore, and I grew up with making boot disks, CONFIG.SYS and HIMEM.

/has a library of at least 200 games over about 5 different systems, most of them are PC.
//"collector"

You know Nintendo won't go this route, and I think Microsoft was just throwing it out there to see if would stick.  But, with that said, if both companies DID do this, you can look at PC gaming to take a huge jump again, especially if people start throwing emulators out there that can crack these discs.

And discs?  Really?  Do flash drives have a lower life expectancy vs discs still?


technabob.com
That's how we did it back in the day... also a lot harder to copy.

/everything old is new again
 
2013-01-04 09:30:07 AM

sprawl15: this will be a vast improvement over the ps3 which simply did not have games


Cheron: This seems fairly straight forward, you are not buying a game you are purchasing a license to use the game on one specific device. It is equally straight forward that a license is worth much less to the customer base so should be priced at about 20% to 25% the cost of buying a copy of the game.


What logic are you using for that one? Most licensed PC software, for example is just as expensive if not more so then any console game.

You are still buying a copy of the game, like any other game, it just can't be resold. you know, like the vast majority of PC games released in the last decade or more.
 
2013-01-04 09:30:31 AM

sprawl15: this will be a vast improvement over the ps3 which simply did not have games


wat?

God of War
Uncharted series
Resistance series
Mass Effect series
Skyrim
Gran Turismo 5

/not sure if trolling or serious
 
2013-01-04 09:32:19 AM

Cheron: This seems fairly straight forward, you are not buying a game you are purchasing a license to use the game on one specific device. It is equally straight forward that a license is worth much less to the customer base so should be priced at about 20% to 25% the cost of buying a copy of the game.


You're precious... really.
 
2013-01-04 09:32:21 AM

HindiDiscoMonster: FinFangFark: Burr: I used to buy about one new game a month back in day, starting in the early 90's. Around 2000 that number started dropping. Now I either buy used (about 6-12 months after it comes out) and maybe 1 new game a year. It might be that I have changed somewhat, but it just seems like such a hassle anymore, and I grew up with making boot disks, CONFIG.SYS and HIMEM.

/has a library of at least 200 games over about 5 different systems, most of them are PC.
//"collector"

You know Nintendo won't go this route, and I think Microsoft was just throwing it out there to see if would stick.  But, with that said, if both companies DID do this, you can look at PC gaming to take a huge jump again, especially if people start throwing emulators out there that can crack these discs.

And discs?  Really?  Do flash drives have a lower life expectancy vs discs still?

[technabob.com image 520x485]
That's how we did it back in the day... also a lot harder to copy.

/everything old is new again


Carts were not flash based, they were roms. They were also very expensive to produce.

I think what keeps the main consoles from adopting flash is well, stuff like blu-ray is dirt cheap per disc, compared to the size you get. Probably pennies per stamped disc these days.
 
2013-01-04 09:35:29 AM
That's too bad, I'll miss the God of War games.

I ditched the XBOX when they wanted to make me buy their new console to find out what happened to Master Chief after the shiatty non-ending of Halo 2. I can ditch Sony, too.

As has been said in this thread multiple times, Steam for the win.
 
2013-01-04 09:37:47 AM

Starhawk: I ditched the XBOX when they wanted to make me buy their new console to find out what happened to Master Chief after the shiatty non-ending of Halo 2. I can ditch Sony, too.


Of all the reason to ditch the xbox this has got to be the dumbest.
 
2013-01-04 09:39:24 AM

Kredal: Best part about this?  When your PS4 or XBox 720 dies (RROD, power supply fries, etc) and you go to replace it, none of your games will work.  Tada!


The only way to avoid that is if they do what Blizzard has been doing, which is having the games tied to your account. Once the game is tied to your account it doesn't matter what disc I use or if I download the game straight from them, but then you would have to be always online and that is another bag of problems that get consumers irate.
 
2013-01-04 09:39:26 AM

FinFangFark: If you buy a used version, it will lock content, and you will have to DLC the rest of the game, which will cost about the same as a new copy.


I feel like GameStop would file a creative lawsuit to stop this since it will destroy the most profitable part of their business model.
 
2013-01-04 09:42:31 AM

tricycleracer: FinFangFark: If you buy a used version, it will lock content, and you will have to DLC the rest of the game, which will cost about the same as a new copy.

I feel like GameStop would file a creative lawsuit to stop this since it will destroy the most profitable part of their business model.


Based on what? Pc games have done similar for years. The console publishers aren't bound by any agreement to let you resell their games no more then PC publishers are.
 
2013-01-04 09:44:07 AM

tricycleracer: FinFangFark: If you buy a used version, it will lock content, and you will have to DLC the rest of the game, which will cost about the same as a new copy.

I feel like GameStop would file a creative lawsuit to stop this since it will destroy the most profitable part of their business model.


Don't forget Gamefly...their revenue is solely generated from mailing off used games.
 
2013-01-04 09:44:11 AM

Burr: Antimatter: I'm still buying ps1 and ps2 era games, nearly doubling my collection of both in the last few years.

Hell, since it takes an average of about a week of soild gaming to finish a major title anymore, I don't think I will ever run out of games to play, especially with GoG and Steam around.


I could stop buying games today and it would probably a good year and a half till my backlog was cleared. Between steam games, unfinished console/PC games, and a ton of older games, i've no shortage of stuff to play.

Its one reason i'm basically ignore steam sales now, i've no time to play what I have, let alone all the new stuff.
 
2013-01-04 09:46:44 AM
I think a better strategy is to pair DLC/in game items/bonuses with new copies of the game, and once you redeem the code and link it to your account its done.

That would tempt some people to pay $50 for the new version which comes with horse armor DLC or whatever, rather than paying shiatty gamestop $35 for a used copy.
 
2013-01-04 09:46:57 AM

Egoy3k: Neverhood9: Considering the used game market rips off the devs/publisher...I'm okay with this. But I know I'm in the minority,

The used car market doesn't rip off the car manufacturers so why is this true for video games?


The used book market doesn't rip off publishers so why is this true for video games?
 
2013-01-04 09:47:04 AM
PS3 already has something like this for a bunch of games. If you buy the used version part of the game is locked out. For Arkham City the Catwoman part was unavailable if you got the game used unless you bought the DLC. For Assassins Creed 3 the multi-player was locked out on a used game, same with MLB13. This is not going to be different just comprehensive .
 
2013-01-04 09:48:50 AM

dmars: Kredal: Best part about this?  When your PS4 or XBox 720 dies (RROD, power supply fries, etc) and you go to replace it, none of your games will work.  Tada!

The only way to avoid that is if they do what Blizzard has been doing, which is having the games tied to your account. Once the game is tied to your account it doesn't matter what disc I use or if I download the game straight from them, but then you would have to be always online and that is another bag of problems that get consumers irate.


Read an article last night saying the way the cable companies are going, they are trying to force tiered/capped bandwidth for high speed internet connections...

If they do start pushing that, I can imagine how that will hurt a lot of commercial sectors, not just online gaming, but all these cloud services, and small businesses that use the internet to do a lot of their business.
 
2013-01-04 09:49:20 AM

tricycleracer: FinFangFark: If you buy a used version, it will lock content, and you will have to DLC the rest of the game, which will cost about the same as a new copy.

I feel like GameStop would file a creative lawsuit to stop this since it will destroy the most profitable part of their business model.


Well, no they would react like all physical retailers do. Refuse to stock the related products/ redeem codes. The majority of sales for consoles is still to the demographic that learns about games, and their game systems, by finding the box on a shelf.
 
2013-01-04 09:51:39 AM

tricycleracer: FinFangFark: If you buy a used version, it will lock content, and you will have to DLC the rest of the game, which will cost about the same as a new copy.

I feel like GameStop would file a creative lawsuit to stop this since it will destroy the most profitable part of their business model.


They're not the only ones doing this, either. Best Buy and Amazon are also invested in the used games market juuust enough.


This all comes from a potentially fatal flaw in the console sales model. The console companies such as Microsoft and Sony sell their system at an initial per-unit loss and make their money on selling the license to developers/distributors, so they make their initial money entirely on software sales.

But the reason Gamestop started expanding the role of used games in their business was the rather thin margin of profit on new titles. That's why the pre-order system gets pushed SO hard in their stores - it gives them a better picture of the new inventory they need to distribute to stores, and the number munchers in Grapevine would rather have a store sit on used inventory the company paid $50 for than a comparable number of new titles that cost them $400.
 
2013-01-04 09:52:19 AM

Burr: Egoy3k: Neverhood9: Considering the used game market rips off the devs/publisher...I'm okay with this. But I know I'm in the minority,

The used car market doesn't rip off the car manufacturers so why is this true for video games?

Yeah, I never heard music or movie people biatching about this (unless I wasn't listening close enough). How is the video game market different from any other market where you can resell something?


Because music and movies generally aren't quite so overpriced. A movie cost millions to make, but copies are sold for $15-$20. A video game cost similar millions to make, and copies are sold for $60 or more. 6 months later, that same movie will lose about 50% of its value and sell for $10 used. That video game will lose 75% or more of its value and go for $10-$15 used.
 
2013-01-04 09:52:33 AM

satanorsanta: PS3 already has something like this for a bunch of games. If you buy the used version part of the game is locked out. For Arkham City the Catwoman part was unavailable if you got the game used unless you bought the DLC. For Assassins Creed 3 the multi-player was locked out on a used game, same with MLB13. This is not going to be different just comprehensive .


oh yes, 'Project $10'. It was an EA started thing designed to discourage used sales that other publishers picked up fairly rapidly. It's now basically the standard for many games on ps3, 30, or even the PC at times.
 
2013-01-04 09:52:39 AM

satanorsanta: PS3 already has something like this for a bunch of games. If you buy the used version part of the game is locked out. For Arkham City the Catwoman part was unavailable if you got the game used unless you bought the DLC. For Assassins Creed 3 the multi-player was locked out on a used game, same with MLB13. This is not going to be different just comprehensive .


Neither of those things have anything to do with the PS3. Those are put in place by the game publishers.
 
2013-01-04 09:52:47 AM

Antimatter: Based on what?


First-sale doctrine

It gets fuzzy when you get into the argument of how much of a game is physically on the disc and how much is a "digital copy" downloaded from the publisher.
 
2013-01-04 09:53:19 AM

Antimatter: Most licensed PC software, for example is just as expensive if not more so then any console game.


Someone doesn't use Steam.
 
2013-01-04 09:54:03 AM

dmars: but then you would have to be always online


The console makers know better than this, because they still sell a third of their consoles in North America to people who don't connect the system to the internet - the state of broadband connection in this country is still pretty putrid.
 
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