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(Deadline)   Barnes & Noble reports dismal holiday sales. Nook it. Done   (deadline.com ) divider line
    More: Fail, Barnes & Noble, CEO William Lynch  
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2176 clicks; posted to Business » on 03 Jan 2013 at 12:10 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-03 12:16:31 PM  
Too bad Borders can't go out of business again.
 
2013-01-03 12:24:15 PM  
Uh, Nook Color and Tablet were both discontinued this year, weren't they?
 
2013-01-03 12:25:09 PM  
Hope B&N holds on. They make pretty good e-readers and tablets, and that market could use the competition to Apple and Amazon.

Kind of crazy that the Nooks aren't selling better. The Nook HD is a better tablet in a lot of ways than the Kindle Fire, with a better display than the Fire or the iPad or iPad mini.

Personally, I have two Nooks. One original recipe e-Ink Nook (WiFi + 3G) and one 16gb Nook Tablet (with a bootable Android SD card).

Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.
 
2013-01-03 12:27:05 PM  
Extremely poor software ecosystem is the reason a Kindle Fire was purchased by me this holiday season. Heck, even side loading that doesn't require jump through lots of hoops and throwing away your UI just to use side loaded apps. I like the Nook UI and the children's books are really unmatched, but B&N seem to be utterly against going beyond books.
 
2013-01-03 12:28:35 PM  
I have an OG NC running CM. It's been great. Have the Kindle and Nook apps on it. I hope they hold on. I'm more compelled to root for them by the farking annoying Amazon ads to the right of this page. No, I have no interest whatsoever in the "Girl With the Dragon Tattoo" Blu-ray, thx.
 
2013-01-03 12:29:56 PM  
We tried to get a few books for my Father in Law from B&N for Xmas. They were twice as much in store as they were online. When asked why the employee at the info desk just shrugged. We ordered them online and a few days before Xmas they bumped back the delivery a week. Dont think we'll be contributing to their holiday sales figures ever again...
 
2013-01-03 12:36:02 PM  
The Nook is great hardware, but I prefer the Kindle ecosphere so I went with their touch device (even though at the time it had no light vs. the Nook w/ a GlowLight). Borrowing library books with ePub is a major PITA and Kindle is two clicks. Calibre (free program) converts ePub to Mobi for the non-DRM books you may own.

As for B&N, I was there last night and the books were way more expensive than Amazon. I can tell you that it wasn't the 9% sales tax that had me ordering from Amazon, it was the 35% discount on the actual books.
 
2013-01-03 12:37:16 PM  
The problem is that Barnes & Noble thinks they can keep getting away with selling books at MSRP based on the pricetag on the book jacket, and that's just not a viable business plan anymore.

Books on Amazon are VASTLY cheaper, sometime $15 - $20 or more than they are at B&N, and the selection is way better. B&N generally only stocks newer titles on their shelves, with the occasional oddball catalog title that someone special ordered and never picked up, or just came in on a random shipment.

Not only that, but due to B&N's library policy of letting people pick up books off the shelves and sit in the store all day reading them, it's almost impossible to go in there and find a new copy of any book that isn't already grimy, or worn. I never have trouble buying books on Amazon, and the rare time I want something right away, even Costco has much better prices than B&N. If they go under, it will be no big loss.
 
2013-01-03 12:39:53 PM  

Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct.


Books-A-Million doesn't count anymore?
 
2013-01-03 12:40:24 PM  

Gig103: The Nook is great hardware, but I prefer the Kindle ecosphere so I went with their touch device (even though at the time it had no light vs. the Nook w/ a GlowLight). Borrowing library books with ePub is a major PITA and Kindle is two clicks. Calibre (free program) converts ePub to Mobi for the non-DRM books you may own.


Calibre is a great program. And theres a plugin that strips DRM so that you can convert formats easier. Plus it's a just good sense in general to archive a DRM-free copy of all your ebooks. You don't want to wake up one day to find that a DRM-scheme is obsolete and all the books you bought are no longer accessible.

I've bought a number of ebooks only available from Amazon and used Calibre to convert them to ePubs and put them on my Nook.
 
2013-01-03 12:41:51 PM  

dj_spanmaster: Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct.

Books-A-Million doesn't count anymore?


Considering that I've never seen one, probably not.

What is that, a local or regional chain?
 
2013-01-03 12:43:22 PM  

Doc Daneeka: dj_spanmaster: Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct.

Books-A-Million doesn't count anymore?

Considering that I've never seen one, probably not.

What is that, a local or regional chain?


They're small and regional, mostly located down south

http://www.booksamillion.com/storefinder
 
2013-01-03 12:47:25 PM  
I don't own an e-reader, but like many others I do own a tablet. I downloaded the Kindle app, there is a Nook app as well, and haven't purchased a physical book in quite a while and have no plans to do so in the future. Like with my music it's now so easy to tap the screen a couple times and have Cloud Atlas ready for reading in about three minutes or less.

Anyway, I think my point is that as more and more people buy tablets they'll just read books on those rather than buying a separate device for that purpose. It wouldn't surprise me if "Nook device" sales and in-store purchases continue to decline

I hope book stores don't go away, but here's some irony for you, just as the big book stores squeezed out the little mom and pop stores all over the country, online sales will be squeezing out the big retailers, hell it has already started with Borders going under.
 
2013-01-03 01:00:39 PM  

Gig103: The Nook is great hardware, but I prefer the Kindle ecosphere so I went with their touch device (even though at the time it had no light vs. the Nook w/ a GlowLight). Borrowing library books with ePub is a major PITA and Kindle is two clicks. Calibre (free program) converts ePub to Mobi for the non-DRM books you may own.

As for B&N, I was there last night and the books were way more expensive than Amazon. I can tell you that it wasn't the 9% sales tax that had me ordering from Amazon, it was the 35% discount on the actual books.


I like my Nook, I got the Simple Touch for Christmas last year, and I spend an hour or two reading each day. I love it, I don't want anything else on my reader but a reader. Maybe a simple browser for word lookups when the dictionary doesn't have what I'm looking for. Otherwise, I want my Nook just for reading. B&N would have had another sale this season if they had discounted the GlowLight model, I plan on upgrading and giving the current one to my wife.

As for books, until they are cheaper, no matter the distributor, I will pirate with no qualms. There is no justification for ANYONE charging the prices they do, and both Amazon and B&N do it. It's a ripoff, and the publishers already got caught price-fixing once... I'm supposed to get a rebate at some point, but I'm not holding my breath.
 
2013-01-03 01:00:58 PM  
I was in a B & N just after Xmas and was browsing the shelves when I saw a book I was interested in:

Duane Shulz, Coming Through Fire: George Armstrong Custer and Chief Black Kettle
In Store Price for Hardcover $28
Online for Hardcover $18.55
Kindle: $15.40

And, no, the clerk wouldn't do a price adjustment, "...but you can save 10% if you have a B & N card which is only $25 for one year!"

Gee, I wonder why they are going out of business!?! Bookstores will be around, just not the big brand name stores. The Mom and Pop stores will have a resurgence when B & N is gone.

*I still miss Borders! Worked for both B & N and Borders but Borders was way more fun to work at.
 
2013-01-03 01:01:46 PM  

dennerman: I hope book stores don't go away, but here's some irony for you, just as the big book stores squeezed out the little mom and pop stores all over the country, online sales will be squeezing out the big retailers, hell it has already started with Borders going under.


If you check on Amazon, you'll see the mom-and-pops are alive and well. They're just all online storefronts now.
 
2013-01-03 01:11:40 PM  

Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.


Well, now that I am hooked on e-books as a reading platform, I've decided that I'll just start collecting books. Rare, first edition, whatever I can afford... For that reason, I don't NEED a B&N, I need a local used book dealer. For example: I found a copy of 'Astounding Science Fiction' magazine the other day, the one with the Introduction to Dianetics, for $60. I could give two squirts about Scientology, but I knew that issue existed as a 'unique' object, so owning it would give me a small piece of history. I have a few used bookstores for that, two in Salt Lake, and a small chain back in AZ. If B&N scews themselves out of business, it's their own fault.
 
2013-01-03 01:16:15 PM  

Doc Daneeka: Gig103: The Nook is great hardware, but I prefer the Kindle ecosphere so I went with their touch device (even though at the time it had no light vs. the Nook w/ a GlowLight). Borrowing library books with ePub is a major PITA and Kindle is two clicks. Calibre (free program) converts ePub to Mobi for the non-DRM books you may own.

Calibre is a great program. And theres a plugin that strips DRM so that you can convert formats easier. Plus it's a just good sense in general to archive a DRM-free copy of all your ebooks. You don't want to wake up one day to find that a DRM-scheme is obsolete and all the books you bought are no longer accessible.

I've bought a number of ebooks only available from Amazon and used Calibre to convert them to ePubs and put them on my Nook.


I'm really liking Calibre. It's helped me fix Cover art(I like organization and aesthetics, same thing with my music), and it's let me fix some "broken" books as well. I guess if I was really ambitious, I could use it to edit and fix all of the typos in some of these books and then re-upload them, but that's a LOT of ambition right there...
 
2013-01-03 01:19:12 PM  

Mikey1969: Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.

Well, now that I am hooked on e-books as a reading platform, I've decided that I'll just start collecting books. Rare, first edition, whatever I can afford... For that reason, I don't NEED a B&N, I need a local used book dealer. For example: I found a copy of 'Astounding Science Fiction' magazine the other day, the one with the Introduction to Dianetics, for $60. I could give two squirts about Scientology, but I knew that issue existed as a 'unique' object, so owning it would give me a small piece of history. I have a few used bookstores for that, two in Salt Lake, and a small chain back in AZ. If B&N scews themselves out of business, it's their own fault.


That's what I do know. I do my leisure reading on Kindle or used paperbacks and then shop for cool, old editions of the classics for my bookshelf.
 
2013-01-03 01:20:10 PM  

Mikey1969: As for books, until they are cheaper, no matter the distributor, I will pirate with no qualms. There is no justification for ANYONE charging the prices they do, and both Amazon and B&N do it. It's a ripoff, and the publishers already got caught price-fixing once... I'm supposed to get a rebate at some point, but I'm not holding my breath.


I have no qualms downloading something I already own in print. In fact, I'll buy the cheaper paperback and then get the ePub/mobi version online, and figure it's fair use.
 
2013-01-03 01:26:19 PM  

Bleyo: Mikey1969: Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.

Well, now that I am hooked on e-books as a reading platform, I've decided that I'll just start collecting books. Rare, first edition, whatever I can afford... For that reason, I don't NEED a B&N, I need a local used book dealer. For example: I found a copy of 'Astounding Science Fiction' magazine the other day, the one with the Introduction to Dianetics, for $60. I could give two squirts about Scientology, but I knew that issue existed as a 'unique' object, so owning it would give me a small piece of history. I have a few used bookstores for that, two in Salt Lake, and a small chain back in AZ. If B&N scews themselves out of business, it's their own fault.

That's what I do know. I do my leisure reading on Kindle or used paperbacks and then shop for cool, old editions of the classics for my bookshelf.


The advent of e-readers has basically eliminated paperbacks for me. Most of the books and magazines I read these days on my Nook. But I still buy nice hardbound editions of my favorite books and authors. They have a better keepsake value than an ebook ever will, and they look nicer on a shelf.
 
2013-01-03 01:29:09 PM  

Doc Daneeka: Bleyo: Mikey1969: Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.

Well, now that I am hooked on e-books as a reading platform, I've decided that I'll just start collecting books. Rare, first edition, whatever I can afford... For that reason, I don't NEED a B&N, I need a local used book dealer. For example: I found a copy of 'Astounding Science Fiction' magazine the other day, the one with the Introduction to Dianetics, for $60. I could give two squirts about Scientology, but I knew that issue existed as a 'unique' object, so owning it would give me a small piece of history. I have a few used bookstores for that, two in Salt Lake, and a small chain back in AZ. If B&N scews themselves out of business, it's their own fault.

That's what I do know. I do my leisure reading on Kindle or used paperbacks and then shop for cool, old editions of the classics for my bookshelf.

The advent of e-readers has basically eliminated paperbacks for me. Most of the books and magazines I read these days on my Nook. But I still buy nice hardbound editions of my favorite books and authors. They have a better keepsake value than an ebook ever will, and they look nicer on a shelf.


Do you still buy cd's and just download the mp3's later because the jewel case looks good on a shelf?
 
2013-01-03 01:31:09 PM  
Doc Daneeka:
Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.

That times infinity.
 
2013-01-03 01:40:56 PM  

frepnog: Doc Daneeka: Bleyo: Mikey1969: Doc Daneeka: Additionally, B&N is the last major brick and mortar bookseller around, and I'd hate to see bookstores go extinct. As much as I love gadgets and have a ton of ebooks, nice hardcover paper books will always have a place in my heart and on my shelf.

Well, now that I am hooked on e-books as a reading platform, I've decided that I'll just start collecting books. Rare, first edition, whatever I can afford... For that reason, I don't NEED a B&N, I need a local used book dealer. For example: I found a copy of 'Astounding Science Fiction' magazine the other day, the one with the Introduction to Dianetics, for $60. I could give two squirts about Scientology, but I knew that issue existed as a 'unique' object, so owning it would give me a small piece of history. I have a few used bookstores for that, two in Salt Lake, and a small chain back in AZ. If B&N scews themselves out of business, it's their own fault.

That's what I do know. I do my leisure reading on Kindle or used paperbacks and then shop for cool, old editions of the classics for my bookshelf.

The advent of e-readers has basically eliminated paperbacks for me. Most of the books and magazines I read these days on my Nook. But I still buy nice hardbound editions of my favorite books and authors. They have a better keepsake value than an ebook ever will, and they look nicer on a shelf.

Do you still buy cd's and just download the mp3's later because the jewel case looks good on a shelf?


In other words, you don't get it. That's cool, we get it for you.
 
2013-01-03 01:47:55 PM  

frepnog: Do you still buy cd's and just download the mp3's later because the jewel case looks good on a shelf?


Poor analogy. The printed book has been an artifact of human civilization for thousands of years, and if well-maintained, a printed book will remain readable for centuries. The compact disc has only been around for a couple of a decades, and in hundred years I doubt you will be able to find a device capable of reading one.

I'm not overly sentimental about format changes in tech. I didn't shed any tears when VHS was superseded by DVD, or when that was subsequently superseded by Blu-Ray. But I'm hesitant to class books, given their importance to human history, culture, and civilization, as just another data format to be discarded and replaced.

Not that I have anything against ebooks. Like I said, I have a ton of them.

/btw, some people who collect LPs do so, in part, because they like the cover art. Album artwork is one of the things that has been generally lost in the digitization of music.
 
2013-01-03 01:48:31 PM  

dennerman: Anyway, I think my point is that as more and more people buy tablets they'll just read books on those rather than buying a separate device for that purpose. It wouldn't surprise me if "Nook device" sales and in-store purchases continue to decline


The benefits of the dedicated readers are that they last forever on a charge(2 or 3 hours a night for 2 weeks or more), they don't blind you with a bright screen(I'd rather deal with having a light to read with than stare at a white screen for those 2-3 hours a night), and they are dedicated, you actually read, no going off and browsing in the middle of your book because you saw something shiny...

I like specialization. I like an e-reader for reading, an iPod for music, a smartphone for mobile stuff, and a tablet for in between the phone and the laptop. Yeah, it's a lot of devices, but each does its particular job very well. Trying to manage my music on my phone, for example, is a PITA, I have about 55 GB of tunes, and that equals not enough space for music, apps AND pictures/video on a 64 GB SD card. Fits just fine on my iPod. Same reason that I like my reader to be separate, although the books are nowhere near as big.
 
2013-01-03 01:59:02 PM  

I am Wee Todd Ed: I was in a B & N just after Xmas and was browsing the shelves when I saw a book I was interested in:

Duane Shulz, Coming Through Fire: George Armstrong Custer and Chief Black Kettle
In Store Price for Hardcover $28
Online for Hardcover $18.55
Kindle: $15.40

And, no, the clerk wouldn't do a price adjustment, "...but you can save 10% if you have a B & N card which is only $25 for one year!"

Gee, I wonder why they are going out of business!?! Bookstores will be around, just not the big brand name stores. The Mom and Pop stores will have a resurgence when B & N is gone.

*I still miss Borders! Worked for both B & N and Borders but Borders was way more fun to work at.


I'm still impressed that stores think they can make money by selling things at two different prices. Best Buy has 3 prices for every item: online price, store price, and the online price on their secret website that only shows up inside the store.
 
2013-01-03 02:02:53 PM  
The Nook Tablet works rather well once you rooted it and you can actually do something on there and can even add my own books collection that I already own to it and have a decent email ability etc on there. The screen was a little flimsy though. Mine cracked along time and would cost more to fix than to replace.
 
2013-01-03 02:07:31 PM  

limeyfellow: The Nook Tablet works rather well once you rooted it and you can actually do something on there and can even add my own books collection that I already own to it


You don't need to root the device to sideload books to a Nook.
 
2013-01-03 02:10:40 PM  

Mikey1969: In other words, you don't get it. That's cool, we get it for you.


You are part of the last generation who remotely cares about the pretty binder and how it sits on a shelf.  Those younger than us can care less.  Physical books are a horrible method of delivering content.  Its time to dump them into the trashheap of history and move on to something better.

/after a recent move got rid of over 90% of my books - only kept the cookbooks
 
2013-01-03 02:11:05 PM  
Hey y'all. Don't be so hard on the Barnes & Noble employees because they won't match the prices of print books to their electronic counterparts. They are not allowed to do that. B&N is clinging to a very outdated sales model and they also don't treat their employees very well. So if you're met with a helpless shrug when you ask why there's such a discrepancy in price points, keep in mind that that employee probably genuinely has no idea why the corporate office has the policies they do and has absolutely no power to do anything about it. Reporting it upwards to management is pointless, but they should at least offer to do that.
 
2013-01-03 02:15:50 PM  
Oh, also- print books cost a lot more to produce and distribute. If you absolutely have to own the print version of a book, it's going to cost more. If you decide you don't really need to own it, why not visit your local library instead?
 
2013-01-03 02:19:23 PM  

gingerjet: Physical books are a horrible method of delivering content.


That's not really true.

A book a fairly durable object. Can survive being dropped, sat on, stepped on, thrown, or even run over by a car. It requires absolutely no power to be usable. It can easily be transferred from one person to another without needing to bypass any sort of DRM. It can be bought or sold used. It's pretty good as an archival medium - a printed book, properyly maintained, will still be completely readable centuries from now, long after the bits on your hard drive or flash drive or optical disc have degraded and become unreadable.
 
2013-01-03 02:25:15 PM  

spman: The problem is that Barnes & Noble thinks they can keep getting away with selling books at MSRP based on the pricetag on the book jacket, and that's just not a viable business plan anymore.

Books on Amazon are VASTLY cheaper, sometime $15 - $20 or more than they are at B&N, and the selection is way better. B&N generally only stocks newer titles on their shelves, with the occasional oddball catalog title that someone special ordered and never picked up, or just came in on a random shipment.


For hardbacks. I've done several checks on paperbacks and the prices were the same. I rarely buy hard cover books. I can be patient and wait a year for it to come out in paperback and buy two-three paperbacks for the cost of the hardback. No reason for me to go to amazon when I can stop on the way home and pick up what I want.

I know it is a preference thing but it always made more sense to buy paperbacks, cost less, take up less space and are easier to stuff in a pocket.
 
2013-01-03 02:29:47 PM  
gingerjet:  Physical books are a horrible method of delivering content.  Its time to dump them into the trashheap of history and move on to something better.

As a technological form, 500 year old books still function completely. At the same time, I can't find a slot for a 20 year old floppy disc on this computer. The idea that books are a horrible method of delivering content is absurd.

Physical books have one fundamental problem, and that is storage. Digital readers solve this one problem only, while making the "book" vulnerable to all sorts of other problems. Bad trade off.
 
2013-01-03 02:35:51 PM  
i.imgur.com
 
2013-01-03 02:36:39 PM  

merkinpeeble: gingerjet:  Physical books are a horrible method of delivering content.  Its time to dump them into the trashheap of history and move on to something better.

As a technological form, 500 year old books still function completely. At the same time, I can't find a slot for a 20 year old floppy disc on this computer. The idea that books are a horrible method of delivering content is absurd.

Physical books have one fundamental problem, and that is storage. Digital readers solve this one problem only, while making the "book" vulnerable to all sorts of other problems. Bad trade off.


Digital books are better if you highlight, annotate, search, bookmark or need to carry more than one book. Physical books look pretty on shelves but other than that digital copies are better.

Your 20 year old floppy drive is easy to read just get a USB floppy drive. Although you might not want to go 20 years between data backups since that is a stupid way to do things.
 
2013-01-03 02:37:16 PM  

engrishmajor: Oh, also- print books cost a lot more to produce and distribute. If you absolutely have to own the print version of a book, it's going to cost more. If you decide you don't really need to own it, why not visit your local library instead?


While print books certainly do cost more to produce and distribute, the sad fact is that many ebooks cost as much or more than a new paperback (looking at you, Amazon). I still buy quite a few paperbacks for casual reading even though I would prefer to use my kindle because I can't get my mind around the stupidity of this - eBook for $12 or paperback for $10 (delivered)? Plus, I can probably resell the paperback for $4 or so when I'm done - is the eBook worth twice the paperback? Does the author see any advantage?
 
2013-01-03 02:45:20 PM  

frepnog: Do you still buy cd's and just download the mp3's later because the jewel case looks good on a shelf?


I understand what you're saying, and I got rid of my CDs several years ago.

I guess the best way I can explain it is I see a CD as an art distribution item. The music is the art, the CD and jewel case are just standardized pieces of plastic. I see hard cover books as actual art. Moby Dick in a blue hardcover with a golden whale embroidered into it, or a Lovecraft anthology that looks like an actual Necronomicon are awesome to look at/collect.

My little brother thinks I'm crazy. I guess I'm just getting old.
 
2013-01-03 02:48:06 PM  

eKonk: engrishmajor: Oh, also- print books cost a lot more to produce and distribute. If you absolutely have to own the print version of a book, it's going to cost more. If you decide you don't really need to own it, why not visit your local library instead?

While print books certainly do cost more to produce and distribute, the sad fact is that many ebooks cost as much or more than a new paperback (looking at you, Amazon). I still buy quite a few paperbacks for casual reading even though I would prefer to use my kindle because I can't get my mind around the stupidity of this - eBook for $12 or paperback for $10 (delivered)? Plus, I can probably resell the paperback for $4 or so when I'm done - is the eBook worth twice the paperback? Does the author see any advantage?


That is why I buy paperbacks, as well. Ten dollars for a few kilobytes of text is ridiculous.
 
2013-01-03 02:48:58 PM  

Mikey1969: I like specialization. I like an e-reader for reading, an iPod for music, a smartphone for mobile stuff, and a tablet for in between the phone and the laptop. Yeah, it's a lot of devices, but each does its particular job very well


Same here. I have a variety of devices that, at least in theory, can all do pretty much the same thing, yet I prefer them in different situations.

On weekdays, I use my Nook Color (1st gen, rooted) the most. I read books on my morning and evening train commutes (Kindle app), and watch movies/TV shows during lunch. I like the small size because it easily fits inside my lunch bag. At home, I use my Kindle Touch if I'm going to read, and use my larger tablet (HP Touchpad, also rooted) if I want to browse the net, check scores, etc. I use my smartphone for all of my music and mobile needs (and even some reading), although I don't use the phone to manage my music.

Although I have hundreds of books, I prefer the convenience of ebooks. I can take a single device on vacation (typically my Touchpad) and load a huge variety of reading material to suit whatever mood I might be in, as well as videos. Plus, my kids can play the apps and read their own ebooks as well.

I doubt I'll ever get rid of all of my books, but I'm in the process of selling most of them. As soon as I have their ebook counterparts, most will be gone for good. I've moved dozens of boxes of books too many times through the years.
 
2013-01-03 02:51:36 PM  

Carth: merkinpeeble: gingerjet:  Physical books are a horrible method of delivering content.  Its time to dump them into the trashheap of history and move on to something better.

As a technological form, 500 year old books still function completely. At the same time, I can't find a slot for a 20 year old floppy disc on this computer. The idea that books are a horrible method of delivering content is absurd.

Physical books have one fundamental problem, and that is storage. Digital readers solve this one problem only, while making the "book" vulnerable to all sorts of other problems. Bad trade off.

Digital books are better if you highlight, annotate, search, bookmark or need to carry more than one book. Physical books look pretty on shelves but other than that digital copies are better.

Your 20 year old floppy drive is easy to read just get a USB floppy drive. Although you might not want to go 20 years between data backups since that is a stupid way to do things.


You are only reinforcing my point. My book does not need a back-up, nor will it ever need a file conversion. Your digital file will need both if you want to keep it for any length of time. Books last. Your electronic file will not, at least not without constant conversions with every shift in technology. If you don't think beyond the next year, you don't have a problem. If you are thinking beyond the horizon you do. Books last centuries and longer.
 
2013-01-03 02:54:55 PM  

gingerjet: Mikey1969: In other words, you don't get it. That's cool, we get it for you.

You are part of the last generation who remotely cares about the pretty binder and how it sits on a shelf.  Those younger than us can care less.  Physical books are a horrible method of delivering content.  Its time to dump them into the trashheap of history and move on to something better.

/after a recent move got rid of over 90% of my books - only kept the cookbooks


Well, aren't you special??

There's nothing inefficient or "horrible" about printed books. They aren't susceptible to electric discharge, you can drop them and they won't get damaged the way a hard drive can, you don't need electricity to use them, you aren't dependent on a third party provider, or an internet connection to use them, and even cheaply printed paperbacks can last 80+ years with minimal care.
 
2013-01-03 02:56:36 PM  

merkinpeeble: You are only reinforcing my point. My book does not need a back-up, nor will it ever need a file conversion. Your digital file will need both if you want to keep it for any length of time. Books last.


Unless they get burned in a fire, stolen, destroyed in a flood, etc. Digital copies purchased through someone like Amazon or B&N are always backed up on their servers and available for download at any time.

As others have pointed out about DRM, I don't rely solely on Amazon either. Every book I purchase is downloaded, stripped of the DRM with Calibre, and backed up regularly to multiple locations (external hard drive and my own remote web server).
 
2013-01-03 02:58:56 PM  

Bleyo: frepnog: Do you still buy cd's and just download the mp3's later because the jewel case looks good on a shelf?

I understand what you're saying, and I got rid of my CDs several years ago.

I guess the best way I can explain it is I see a CD as an art distribution item. The music is the art, the CD and jewel case are just standardized pieces of plastic. I see hard cover books as actual art. Moby Dick in a blue hardcover with a golden whale embroidered into it, or a Lovecraft anthology that looks like an actual Necronomicon are awesome to look at/collect.

My little brother thinks I'm crazy. I guess I'm just getting old.


i get you here. i still own an incredibly cool old old edition of Fellowship of the Rings, for example - the cover is embossed with a really cool eye of sauron and it has a HUGE fold out map of middle earth.

It is still a book on a shelf that I rarely take down and look at - however, I read my epub of LOTR fairly regulary (well, re-reading the hobbit right now).

My analogy was perfect. Was a time that tons of people had tons of space taken up by tons of little plastic discs. Most people just.... don't anymore, and now that I can do the same thing to my books - most those space eating motherfarkers got sold, gave away, donated and I have a lot of clear space because the library on my e-reader is far more extensive than anything I ever owned in meatspace. I don't need a bunch of shelves full of books to look cool - it only looks really good if you have an entire farking library in your home. Now my bookshelf has my wife's Spongebob lego sitting on it, and that looks far cooler than a bunch of book spines anyway for display.

/love books, had a shiat ton of them, fark those paper albatrosses, hard to move, hard to store, fark 'em.
 
2013-01-03 03:00:06 PM  

Carth: Your 20 year old floppy drive is easy to read just get a USB floppy drive. Although you might not want to go 20 years between data backups since that is a stupid way to do things.


Oh, so you have to keep upgrading equipment to use those digital files? I have books from 1930 "looking pretty" on my bookshelf that work fine with no upgrades. They aren't in a file format that is proprietary either. They'll also never be truly obsolete.
 
2013-01-03 03:08:12 PM  

The Crepes of Wrath:

Unless they get burned in a fire, stolen, destroyed in a flood, etc. Digital copies purchased through someone like Amazon or B&N are always backed up on their servers and available for download at any time.


These vulnerabilities are shared by electronic media as well.

Your kindle isn't flammable? It works underwater? Amazon will last forever? BN is certainly looking like it is heading down the drain, who will back up their servers when they are insolvent?
 
2013-01-03 03:19:19 PM  

merkinpeeble: These vulnerabilities are shared by electronic media as well.

Your kindle isn't flammable? It works underwater? Amazon will last forever? BN is certainly looking like it is heading down the drain, who will back up their servers when they are insolvent?


If my Kindle burns or is destroyed by flood, I buy another for $75, and can access all of my content. If your books are burned or destroyed by flood, you're out hundreds or thousands of dollars, depending on how many books you own. If you're insured, great -- you're reimbursed for the financial loss, but you have to repurchase all of the books again. I'm still only out the $75 (or whatever the current cost is).

As for Amazon lasting forever, you apparently missed the part about redundant backups. If Amazon goes out of business, I still have all of my content backed up in multiple locations, both remote and local. The only scenario where I lose everything is extremely unlikely -- Amazon goes out of business, my house burns down, and my remote web server is wiped out, all on the same day. If that happens, I'm guessing I have bigger issues than losing some books.
 
2013-01-03 03:22:00 PM  

eKonk: While print books certainly do cost more to produce and distribute, the sad fact is that many ebooks cost as much or more than a new paperback (looking at you, Amazon)



That wasn't by Amazon's choice.
 
2013-01-03 03:29:16 PM  

bsharitt: Extremely poor software ecosystem is the reason a Kindle Fire was purchased by me this holiday season. Heck, even side loading that doesn't require jump through lots of hoops and throwing away your UI just to use side loaded apps. I like the Nook UI and the children's books are really unmatched, but B&N seem to be utterly against going beyond books.


Yes, agreed. I love my Nook tablet, but they must make it ridiculously hard to develop for, or something because there is NOTHING available in their app store. Not even to buy.

This is why if / when I buy a new smaller tablet, I will have to think long and hard about whether I want to go the Nook route again. For now, I have the bootable sd card that allows me to have different utility, but since my kids books and such on are the Nook proper, I'm always switching back and forth between the two. My next nook cover needs to have a pocket for my sd card.
 
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