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(Kansas City)   We're not saying potheads are bad at running a business, but Colorado's first recreational marijuana club officially closed a day after it officially opened   (kansascity.com) divider line 122
    More: Sad, Colorado, marijuana, Del Norte  
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19525 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 Jan 2013 at 10:55 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-01 11:37:02 PM
Why have a "club" in the first place? If its legal to grow six plants, go an hang at your buddies house or your house etc...
seems like the landlord issue would always be there as long as the feds continue thier "war on drugs". SWIM has run under the radar for this long, why not stick with it? My particular state will never legalize overall or for medical.. everybody just needs to chill out, and proceed as before. Trusting govt. Is not the way to go. If you live in co. Or wash. Great, but just keep it low key.
 
2013-01-01 11:37:28 PM

boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"


i229.photobucket.com
 
2013-01-01 11:38:05 PM
well if the landlord had it in the lease that he could do it nothing can be done. Still seems like a rotten deal , and i have to wonder if he knew what the business was going into the space he rented out.
 
2013-01-01 11:38:56 PM

Markoff_Cheney: boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"

well that really changed the tone and tempo of the thread...
who pays 100 for a bj?
like... dinner at a decent place would be 45-65.
hell, you can pull one for a movie at 24 bucks, maybe ten more for snacks.
kids these days.


I call b/s. There's no forfeiture laws that cover a simple prostitution arrest. Either the payment was in blow or the set up was with the FBI agent who made the bust.
 
2013-01-01 11:39:13 PM

Gyrfalcon: jaytkay: Hector Remarkable: Breakfast at Tiffany's starring Mary Tyler Moore in 1966 closed after only 4 previews and never even made it to opening night.

Wut?

Gdalescrboz: But I'm sure gun regulations will be very reasonable, right gun grabbers? Actually, I'm pretty sure you don't even care, it's more "neener neener neener you can't have guns anymore" than anything else; you're after political points, not safety

Wut?

I'm not saying potheads can't keep their minds on one topic for very long but the Steelers aren't going to the Superbowl this year.


But enough about marsupials. Lincoln was fantastic. Daniel Day-Lewis really stole the show as the butcher.
 
2013-01-01 11:40:15 PM

boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"


Either move to Nevada, Istanbul or Amsterdam or lobby the government to change the law.
 
2013-01-01 11:41:14 PM

Gyrfalcon: Markoff_Cheney: boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"

well that really changed the tone and tempo of the thread...
who pays 100 for a bj?
like... dinner at a decent place would be 45-65.
hell, you can pull one for a movie at 24 bucks, maybe ten more for snacks.
kids these days.

I call b/s. There's no forfeiture laws that cover a simple prostitution arrest. Either the payment was in blow or the set up was with the FBI agent who made the bust.


nope, i just paid for dinner, went back to my place and got a beej.
i pulled anal off a fancier dinner. no feds.
 
2013-01-01 11:42:31 PM

thorthor: Why have a "club" in the first place? If its legal to grow six plants, go an hang at your buddies house or your house etc...
seems like the landlord issue would always be there as long as the feds continue thier "war on drugs". SWIM has run under the radar for this long, why not stick with it? My particular state will never legalize overall or for medical.. everybody just needs to chill out, and proceed as before. Trusting govt. Is not the way to go. If you live in co. Or wash. Great, but just keep it low key.


The war on drugs isn't even relevant in this case. Landlords have the right to prohibit smoking cigarettes on their premises, why should pot be any different?
 
2013-01-01 11:44:21 PM

jaytkay: Hector Remarkable: Breakfast at Tiffany's starring Mary Tyler Moore in 1966 closed after only 4 previews and never even made it to opening night.

Wut?


I meant that they shouldn't be discouraged from this one failure. Mary Tyler Moore went on to have a very successful career. Not that she has any particular connection to pot, I was just saying, you know, Chico, don't be discouraged, using some sort of non sequiturical Broadway comparison - don't ask me why - and I apologize deeply for it.
 
2013-01-01 11:44:42 PM

boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"


I bet that left a bad taste in your mouth.
 
2013-01-01 11:45:17 PM

skinink: For all anyone knows the landlord might have language written in the lease regarding drugs, or at least what actions can cancel a lease. But it didn't help the renter's cause that he opened the place before the lease took effect.


Every lease I've ever signed had a provision forbidding any illegal activities, and pot is still illegal under federal law.
 
2013-01-01 11:48:29 PM

Uranus Is Huge!: boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"

I bet that left a bad taste in your mouth.


Nothing a few beers won't take care of.
 
2013-01-01 11:50:50 PM

boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"


Here's an idiot that doesn't know how to use OkCupid or Plenty of Fish for his beejay trolling needs. biatches give it up freely on those sites.

/favorited as idiot that pays for blow jobs, not dinner.
 
2013-01-01 11:51:09 PM
Pheelix:The war on drugs isn't even relevant in this case. Landlords have the right to prohibit smoking cigarettes on their premises, why should pot be any different.

My point exactly, why involve a landlord,club or any other establishment. Smoke in your own property (as long as you own it, and you arent charging admission) they cant do shiat.
 
2013-01-01 11:51:09 PM

thorthor: Why have a "club" in the first place?


Well, making money is the club owner's reason.

Members might join a club because they have reasons not to smoke at home, i. e., kids, SO who won't have it, uptight landlord or neighbors, etc.  And they just may want to socialize like members of any other club do.
 
2013-01-01 11:54:30 PM
They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"

(nelsonlaughing.jpeg)
 
2013-01-01 11:55:30 PM

BarkingUnicorn: thorthor: Why have a "club" in the first place?

Well, making money is the club owner's reason.

Members might join a club because they have reasons not to smoke at home, i. e., kids, SO who won't have it, uptight landlord or neighbors, etc.  And they just may want to socialize like members of any other club do.


Ok I buy that. I guess individual situations are different in each case. Once you leave your club look out for the DUI.
 
2013-01-01 11:57:20 PM

ZAZ: They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Landlord wins by citing federal law saying he can't let his property be used for illegal drugs. He can legitimately say he risks losing his property by renting it out for drug sales or use. In my area the feds are trying to seize a motel because it was the local place to go for drugs. (story) See also RAVE act.


10th Amendment says Colorado can tell the Fed to fark off.
 
2013-01-01 11:58:28 PM

thorthor: Pheelix:The war on drugs isn't even relevant in this case. Landlords have the right to prohibit smoking cigarettes on their premises, why should pot be any different.

My point exactly, why involve a landlord,club or any other establishment. Smoke in your own property (as long as you own it, and you arent charging admission) they cant do shiat.


That's certainly the prudent thing to do at this point.  But someone always has to jump the gun and try to be first through a perceived loophole in the law.  Colorado's amendment says you can't smoke "openly and publicly," so that leaves your home and whatever some idiot like this tries to make "non-public."

If you want a club, buy your own building.  Then the feds will take your property instead of your landlord's.
 
2013-01-02 12:00:34 AM

thorthor: Why have a "club" in the first place? If its legal to grow six plants, go an hang at your buddies house or your house etc..


Why are there bars when I can drink at the house?
 
2013-01-02 12:01:36 AM

Baloo Uriza: ZAZ: They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Landlord wins by citing federal law saying he can't let his property be used for illegal drugs. He can legitimately say he risks losing his property by renting it out for drug sales or use. In my area the feds are trying to seize a motel because it was the local place to go for drugs. (story) See also RAVE act.

10th Amendment says Colorado can tell the Fed to fark off.


Colorado might do that if Colorado ran pot clubs.  But Colorado has no obligation to defend its citizens against federal law.
 
2013-01-02 12:01:59 AM
Well yeah, it sucks, but it's all baby steps towards more complete legalization. It will get there eventually. I think.
 
2013-01-02 12:02:12 AM
If you want a club, buy your own building. Then the feds will take your property instead of your landlord's.

Yeah, you are correct. Long way to go on this issue before its all worked out. I heard that certain States didn't remove prohibition till the 60s. And hell there are still dry counties everywhere.
 
2013-01-02 12:04:58 AM
Owner Paul Lovato tells the newspaper that he wanted to be first in the nation to open a marijuana club. He beat a marijuana club in Denver by a few hours.   Lovato says his lease on the building didn't start until Tuesday. Lovato said that when his landlord saw the publicity about the club, he canceled the lease before it took effect.

So, it's true that marijuana use makes you stupid?
 
2013-01-02 12:05:21 AM
Wow, that was a disingenuous headline, subby.

Nothing in TFA about potheads going "oh wow, I'm too high to count money," it was a very likely non-stoned landlord being a total asshole about it.
 
2013-01-02 12:06:21 AM

BummerDuck: HotWingAgenda: As much as I dislike potheads, it sounds like they were properly organized and on the legal up and up.  They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Why do you dislike potheads? Not saying I like them, but would rather meet a pothead on the road, then a drunk...

Came here to say sounds like they might have legal recourse. See that you covered it.


I just find them annoying.  The ones I have known use it as a social crutch, much like alcoholics do... except there is no socially acceptable way to point out that someone relies to heavily on weed to function.  And, thanks to the prohibition on their drug of choice, a lot of potheads have a serious hate-on for anyone who doesn't despise law enforcement like they do.
 
2013-01-02 12:06:22 AM
That $30 a month model in one of the states seems doomed. It needs to be a commodity that can be purchased freely like booze or tobacco. Lets quit the taboo bullshiat and members only garbage. There's no need to start charging exorbitant fees for an already-overpriced species of flower. And imagine trying to go to different spots for variety? Do you have to pay $30/month there to?

My local shop has 175 varieties of different pot for you to walk in and smell, from $5 a gram decent to $15 amazing stuff. You pay $35 a year for a doctors visitation, so the state of CA knows you still have a need cannabis. If I had to pay that every month for every shop I went to, Id go back to buying pot from the streets.

/Ounce of good is cheaper on the streets than most shops anyway
 
2013-01-02 12:08:42 AM

Amos Quito: ZAZ: See also RAVE act.

The RAVE act?

Thanks. Wow.

Check out the language this Federal Law.

Excerpt:

"
SEC. 3. OFFENSES.(a) IN GENERAL- Section 416(a) of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 856(a)) is amended-- (1) in paragraph (1), by striking 'open or maintain any place' and inserting 'open, lease, rent, use, or maintain any place, whether permanently or temporarily,'; and (2) by striking paragraph (2) and inserting the following: '(2) manage or control any place, whether permanently or temporarily, either as an owner, lessee, agent, employee, occupant, or mortgagee, and knowingly and intentionally rent, lease, profit from, or make available for use, with or without compensation, the place for the purpose of unlawfully manufacturing, storing, distributing, or using a controlled substance.'. (b) TECHNICAL AMENDMENT- The heading to section 416 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 856) is amended to read as follows: 'SEC. 416. MAINTAINING DRUG-INVOLVED PREMISES.'. (c) CONFORMING AMENDMENT- The table of contents to title II of the Comprehensive Drug Abuse and Prevention Act of 1970 is amended by striking the item relating to section 416 and inserting the following: 'Sec. 416. Maintaining drug-involved premises.'.

END QUOTE

Weed is still a "controlled substance" at the Federal level, and they could easily (and quite profitably) make the lives of private citizens very miserable as these states struggle to come to grips with the logistics of their insurrection. All they have to do is start seizing property from anyone who is in any way involved in the distribution OR use.

From above: "unlawfully manufacturing, storing, distributing, or using a controlled substance.  Under this language, if the landlord knew that such activity might take place and leased the property, HE would be found in violation of the RAVE act, and would be subject to any and all punishments and/or forfeitures spelled out by the law.

CO and WA just "legalized" the ganja, but can t ...


alcohol is technically a controlled substance
 
2013-01-02 12:10:05 AM

HotWingAgenda: BummerDuck: HotWingAgenda: As much as I dislike potheads, it sounds like they were properly organized and on the legal up and up.  They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Why do you dislike potheads? Not saying I like them, but would rather meet a pothead on the road, then a drunk...

Came here to say sounds like they might have legal recourse. See that you covered it.

I just find them annoying.  The ones I have known use it as a social crutch, much like alcoholics do... except there is no socially acceptable way to point out that someone relies to heavily on weed to function.  And, thanks to the prohibition on their drug of choice, a lot of potheads have a serious hate-on for anyone who doesn't despise law enforcement like they do.


There are stoners I like and stoners I find irritating. Ditto for drinkers... hell, ditto for health nuts. The only group I universally loathe? People that paint with broad strokes.
 
2013-01-02 12:11:28 AM

tukatz: Owner Paul Lovato tells the newspaper that he wanted to be first in the nation to open a marijuana club. He beat a marijuana club in Denver by a few hours.   Lovato says his lease on the building didn't start until Tuesday. Lovato said that when his landlord saw the publicity about the club, he canceled the lease before it took effect.

So, it's true that marijuana use makes you stupid?


Or stupidity makes you use marijuana.  Chicken/egg thing.
 
2013-01-02 12:11:49 AM

BarkingUnicorn: Baloo Uriza: ZAZ: They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Landlord wins by citing federal law saying he can't let his property be used for illegal drugs. He can legitimately say he risks losing his property by renting it out for drug sales or use. In my area the feds are trying to seize a motel because it was the local place to go for drugs. (story) See also RAVE act.

10th Amendment says Colorado can tell the Fed to fark off.

Colorado might do that if Colorado ran pot clubs.  But Colorado has no obligation to defend its citizens against federal law.


It doesn't matter who runs the pot club. Murder is still illegal under federal law but Oregon and Washington have successfully defended death with dignity on 10th Amendment grounds.
 
2013-01-02 12:12:01 AM
Excuse me people, but I live in the very town where this happened. I had to google white horse inn to find the place after I saw the story on the news,. I still can't figure out where the building is located. I still don't understand how this guy thinks he can earn anything, most of the smokers here grow their own and smoke whenever they want. My hubs calls it "living the Del Norte Dream".  Most of the property owners are very conservative and I understand their not wanting the publicity of the place.
 
2013-01-02 12:17:17 AM

HotWingAgenda: BummerDuck: HotWingAgenda: As much as I dislike potheads, it sounds like they were properly organized and on the legal up and up.  They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Why do you dislike potheads? Not saying I like them, but would rather meet a pothead on the road, then a drunk...

Came here to say sounds like they might have legal recourse. See that you covered it.

I just find them annoying.  The ones I have known use it as a social crutch, much like alcoholics do... except there is no socially acceptable way to point out that someone relies to heavily on weed to function.  And, thanks to the prohibition on their drug of choice, a lot of potheads have a serious hate-on for anyone who doesn't despise law enforcement like they do.


Yeah, I used to like women, gays, illegal immigrants, and fat people until they became irreproachable and started hating on anyone who questioned their causes.

And no, Lovato has no legal recourse.
 
2013-01-02 12:19:41 AM

Uranus Is Huge!: boozerman: They can and will pretty much take anything they want from you. I got picked up on solicitation a few years ago. They took my computer (used it to find the ad), my cell phone (used it to call and set up an appointment), and took my car (drove it to the hotel). All for a $100 bj. Fark the hell out of them stealing your property for "crimes"

I bet that left a bad taste in your mouth.


Bacon sausage?
 
2013-01-02 12:22:30 AM

Baloo Uriza: BarkingUnicorn: Baloo Uriza: ZAZ: They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Landlord wins by citing federal law saying he can't let his property be used for illegal drugs. He can legitimately say he risks losing his property by renting it out for drug sales or use. In my area the feds are trying to seize a motel because it was the local place to go for drugs. (story) See also RAVE act.

10th Amendment says Colorado can tell the Fed to fark off.

Colorado might do that if Colorado ran pot clubs.  But Colorado has no obligation to defend its citizens against federal law.

It doesn't matter who runs the pot club. Murder is still illegal under federal law but Oregon and Washington have successfully defended death with dignity on 10th Amendment grounds.


I'm not arguing who would win.  I'm saying that Colorado has no obligation to fight.
 
2013-01-02 12:22:54 AM
So do any of the anti-smoking (tobacco) laws come into play with any of this?
 
2013-01-02 12:31:16 AM

BarkingUnicorn: The first rule of Recreational Marijuana Club is...


"Dude, I don't remember either. Here, try this."
 
2013-01-02 12:35:02 AM

mjbok: So do any of the anti-smoking (tobacco) laws come into play with any of this?


Good question.  Colorado's Clean Indoor Air Act deals only with tobacco.
 
2013-01-02 12:37:33 AM
the guy jumped the gun 'cause he wanted to be first. probably could've gotten away with it if he didn't explicitly advertise the place as a pot club.
 
2013-01-02 12:56:09 AM

lantawa: The club will be fine. The location of the club will change. The pay to play charges will still most likely continue to be $29.99, bring your own. Pioneering in the legalized pot biz; Not a bad way to try to earn a legal buck.


Is your TF ultrafark address working?  Mine is not but I have some questions about your biz.
 
2013-01-02 01:21:35 AM

HotWingAgenda: BummerDuck: HotWingAgenda: As much as I dislike potheads, it sounds like they were properly organized and on the legal up and up.  They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Why do you dislike potheads? Not saying I like them, but would rather meet a pothead on the road, then a drunk...

Came here to say sounds like they might have legal recourse. See that you covered it.

I just find them annoying.  The ones I have known use it as a social crutch, much like alcoholics do... except there is no socially acceptable way to point out that someone relies to heavily on weed to function.  And, thanks to the prohibition on their drug of choice, a lot of potheads have a serious hate-on for anyone who doesn't despise law enforcement like they do.


So what you hate is idiots and addicts. People who use marijuana occasionally are no different from anyone else.
 
2013-01-02 01:31:11 AM

Amos Quito: ZAZ: They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Landlord wins by citing federal law saying he can't let his property be used for illegal drugs. He can legitimately say he risks losing his property by renting it out for drug sales or use. In my area the feds are trying to seize a motel because it was the local place to go for drugs. (story) See also RAVE act.

They're looking for any excuse to seize property under the guise of the Drug War, and they don't give a shiat whether the property owners are guilty or not. They just want to steal property (but only if it's valuable enough to make it worth their trouble).

If anyone EVER wondered whether the War On Drugs, the DEA (and the farking Federal Government in general) have the "best interests" of the People of the US at heart, read that farking article.


And I'd wager that once they snap it up at fire sale prices, they will turn around and sell it for cheap to a multinational hotel chain. Also consider that government agencies are consistently looking for revenue streams due to budget cuts. Forfeiture is just one of these streams.

 
2013-01-02 01:37:28 AM
Well, there goes that Fark tailgate party.....
 
2013-01-02 01:51:29 AM

Gyrfalcon: HotWingAgenda: BummerDuck: HotWingAgenda: As much as I dislike potheads, it sounds like they were properly organized and on the legal up and up.  They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Why do you dislike potheads? Not saying I like them, but would rather meet a pothead on the road, then a drunk...

Came here to say sounds like they might have legal recourse. See that you covered it.

I just find them annoying.  The ones I have known use it as a social crutch, much like alcoholics do... except there is no socially acceptable way to point out that someone relies to heavily on weed to function.  And, thanks to the prohibition on their drug of choice, a lot of potheads have a serious hate-on for anyone who doesn't despise law enforcement like they do.

So what you hate is idiots and addicts. People who use marijuana occasionally are no different from anyone else.


Like he said:  "potheads."
 
2013-01-02 01:58:59 AM
There should be a pot party at the homes of the government lawyers involved in civil forfeiture. The only reason for this is that they're stealing property. Without the stealing, people wouldn't be there smoking pot, so the property owner has facilitated a "drug crime" and his assets should be seized.
 
2013-01-02 02:50:56 AM

CourtroomWolf: There should be a pot party at the homes of the government lawyers involved in civil forfeiture.


You think there aren't pot parties at the homes of government lawyers?
 
2013-01-02 03:11:32 AM
In CA, the business model for medical mj is evolving to be a delivery model, like ordering out for pizza. It's cash only also. The dispensary has your 215 info. It's hard to imagine a federal law enforcement operation netting a new glorified pizza delivery dudes could be much to brag about.
 
2013-01-02 03:34:29 AM
CourtroomWolf:
"There should be a pot party at the homes of the government lawyers involved in civil forfeiture. The only reason for this is that they're stealing property. Without the stealing, people wouldn't be there smoking pot, so the property owner has facilitated a "drug crime" and his assets should be seized."

Whoah man. You just like, totally blew my mind.
 
2013-01-02 04:58:35 AM
I have an idea. Allow the sellers to ply their trade from state property with armed state police on guard. Let the feds try to seize state property from armed state troopers. That ought to bring this nonsense to a head real quick, one way or the other. Then we'll see how far the federal government is willing to go in order to ignore the will of the people.
 
2013-01-02 05:59:37 AM

Amos Quito: ZAZ: They should be able to sue the landlord for screwing them over.

Landlord wins by citing federal law saying he can't let his property be used for illegal drugs. He can legitimately say he risks losing his property by renting it out for drug sales or use. In my area the feds are trying to seize a motel because it was the local place to go for drugs. (story) See also RAVE act.


Oh, this IS sweet.

From you link:

QUOTE

The DEA set the U.S. attorney into motion. It has a special agent here in Boston who seeks out targets for forfeiture.

Civil Forfeiture

"As he describes his job, he looks through the newspapers and looks at the Internet, looking for news stories of properties that might be forfeitable and brings them to the attention of the U.S. attorney," Caswell's attorney, Larry Salzman, said.

According to the agent's sworn testimony, he then goes to the Registry of Deeds to determine the value of the targeted property. The DEA rejects anything with less than $50,000 equity.

In the case of the Caswell, the agent saw its worth close to $1.5 million with no mortgage. That made it a fat target for the U.S. attorney, says another of Caswell's lawyers, Scott Bullock.

END QUOTE

They're looking for any excuse to seize property under the guise of the Drug War, and they don't give a shiat whether the property owners are guilty or not. They just want to steal property (but only if it's valuable enough to make it worth their trouble).

If anyone EVER wondered whether the War On Drugs, the DEA (and the farking Federal Government in general) have the "best interests" of the People of the US at heart, read that farking article.


/Ready to give up your guns, yet?
//Land of the Free
///Pukes


Yeah, and they're probably building detention centers with sniper towers for the gun owners on that seized property.
 
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