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(PCWorld)   Should 2013 be the year you switch to Linux? One penguin seems to think so   (pcworld.com) divider line 186
    More: Interesting, linux, PC users, class switching, Start Button, online banking, ubuntu, switches  
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3874 clicks; posted to Geek » on 01 Jan 2013 at 6:30 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-02 07:32:16 AM  

ThunderPelvis: Unity finally broke my loyalty to Ubuntu, and, consequently, I haven't been using linux much in the last 6 months or so. Mint looks really good, though, so I'm going to give it a spin.


This might work for you:
sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop

xubuntu flies on my vintage 2005 laptop.

I think someone at Ubuntu's trying to make things -too- friendly. Clean installs of the newest versions install a "guest account," and there's no clear or easy way to remove the thing. Strikes me as "Fresh version of Linux, now with Microsoft Bob!"
 
2013-01-02 08:16:03 AM  
Meh. An OS is an OS is an OS. They only exist to let us get stuff done on our computers. They all suck, just (usually) in different ways.

All I want from my OS is the ability to set my own wallpaper, to run apps that I want/need, and to stay the heck out of my way. The more transparent an OS is to the user: that is, the less aware of the OS the user is, the better in my opinion.

I have yet to see this perfect OS in any flavor, Windows, Linux, Mac, real Unix- they all have their issues which require futzing around with instead of doing what I turned on the computer to do. At least Linux is free to get and use, so I'm not having to pay for the privilege of those headaches.

/PCLinuxOS 2012, with XP in VirtualBox for the few proggies that don't run well in WINE.
 
2013-01-02 08:31:49 AM  
2011 was the year of the Linux Desktop, but not in the way that anyone ever envisioned.

That was the year that Canonical intruduced Unity, which completely fractured the already splintered
world of Linux graphical interfaces.
 
2013-01-02 08:34:09 AM  

stucka: ThunderPelvis: Unity finally broke my loyalty to Ubuntu, and, consequently, I haven't been using linux much in the last 6 months or so. Mint looks really good, though, so I'm going to give it a spin.

This might work for you:
sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop

xubuntu flies on my vintage 2005 laptop.

I think someone at Ubuntu's trying to make things -too- friendly. Clean installs of the newest versions install a "guest account," and there's no clear or easy way to remove the thing. Strikes me as "Fresh version of Linux, now with Microsoft Bob!"


Just finished installing Mint and I'm poking around now...I've used the Xfce in the past, but it's a bit light.  I'll probably stick with Mint for a while and see how I like it.  So far, so good...

Incidentally, if anybody else wants to try it, make sure that you do *not* try to import your settings off of a windows installation unless you have a farking huge linux partition.  Damn thing can barely load the desktop once the partition is completely full  :/
 
2013-01-02 08:38:44 AM  

StoPPeRmobile: "Get use to disappointment."

You sound edumacated.


I'm lazy and used cut-and-paste. Which the last time I installed Linux was something that only worked for some apps but far from all of them.
 
2013-01-02 08:41:57 AM  

phlatulence: Apart from serving files and DB what does Linux actually do?


It has really cool screen savers.

(Seriously, quite a few are based on real world physics instead of cartoon physics.)
 
2013-01-02 09:37:26 AM  
Another reason 2013 won't be the year of Linux?

You can get Windows 8 for $15 without too much wrangling (upgrade price plus "I bought a computer with Windows 7 on it in the past few months" discount). Even if you didn't actually do the latter. They don't check or anything.

Ahem, not that I'd advocate gaming the system like that.

I like Mint and Ubuntu (yes, even Unity, shut up), but there is NOTHING wrong with Windows 8 that hasn't been blown out of proportion by people who are terrified of and/or confused by change. Metro isn't even as radical a change as Ubuntu's switch to the Unity environment.

Use what makes you happy, because haters gonna hate.
 
2013-01-02 09:49:23 AM  

skinink: Mitt Romneys Tax Return: skinink: "Linux is just as easy to install, configure and use as Windows. Period."
And which distros out of the hundreds out there are easy to install?

Ubuntu, Open SUSE, Mint. Debian isn't any harder to install than Windows XP. I know you're yanking my chain, but we have this thing called the Internet where it's pretty easy to find out which distros are best for new Linux users.

Ah yes, the linux attitude I talked of earlier.


I'm terribly sorry that I hurt your feelings. I'm sure that your initial question was asked with complete innocence and a genuine curiosity about which Linux distros would be appropriate for a new user.
 
2013-01-02 10:02:45 AM  

Gonz: If you know what you're doing with a computer, Linux (or BSD) is what you already use.


Yeah whatever internet tech tough guy. People like you really piss those of us off who are responsible for keeping corporate systems online for a living.

You assume a lot of BS.
 
2013-01-02 10:06:33 AM  

b0rscht: involving many kilolines of code that produce petabytes of data on supercomputers (that all run Linux)


I may have just located the snarkiest person on the internet.

KILO-lines? are you freakin kidding me.

Access to MULTIPLE "supercomputers" you are SO full of shiat.
 
2013-01-02 11:33:29 AM  
Thus far, Mint's distro with the cinnamon GUI is excellent.  We had a good run, Ubuntu, but your new UI is total shiat.
 
2013-01-02 12:25:50 PM  
I remember back in USENET days. January was the month of the "19xx will be the year of Linux" post.

There was some guy, I don't remember his first name, but his last name was like Schwartz or something. He'd collect every pro-Linux article along with a digest. He'd post a hundred and fifty or so articles / day. Teh dude was insane.
 
2013-01-02 01:10:13 PM  

DjangoStonereaver:
That was the year that Canonical intruduced Unity, which completely fractured the already splintered
world of Linux graphical interfaces.


And still none of them can handle having windows inside a window, so you can tile multiple documents inside one window and compare them side by side. Something that windows 3.11 could do.

/or it has been able to for the past year or so and none of the programs for Linux have bothered to use the functionality.
 
2013-01-02 01:22:17 PM  

t3knomanser: i have issues


I think I've had that conversation before.

If you were a little less contrarian troll and sarcastic contrarian, you might be worth talking to.

Pardon me for having not removed your favorite that says only posititve things about you. I will rectify the situation so that I remember to never talk to you about os/filesystems because of your geeked out kneejerk obsessive compulsive reactions.

Easy example:

t3knomanser: omeganuepsilon: As it is, the system emulating an actual file cabinet

No it isn't. A filing cabinet does not allow you to nest folders to an arbitrary depth. The filesystem doesn't emulate anything- it's a tree datastructure that calls its nodes and leaves things that sound sort of like what we're familiar with.


You sure are twitchy when people say emulate.

FYI, a folder system IS a filing cabinet idealized, without physical structure constraints of paper folders. If you can't grasp how the concepts are the same, you really do need some mental help.
 
2013-01-02 03:03:30 PM  
Linux advocates would do well for their cause if they'd take a few days off to read one of Dale Carnegie's books.
 
2013-01-02 04:24:46 PM  

Benni K Rok: I've got a desktop I'd like to get up and running again, but...

When I try to install Windows 7, the external USB DVD I'm using can't find drivers for the player that the Windows 7 disk is in.
When I try to install Mint Linux via USB, I get all kinds of errors.
I don't try to install OSX because it's not a hackintosh.


If you don't mind a little bit of work to get win7 going on it,
Link
 
2013-01-02 04:30:03 PM  

t3knomanser:
VMS. It was here before you, and it will be here long after you.


Who still uses VMS?
 
2013-01-02 04:44:02 PM  

Honest Bender: Can I run all of my games natively? No? Then it's still not my year to switch.

I love linux, don't get me wrong. I work with hundreds of linux servers every day. Damn fine OS. But when I'm at home... gots to be the windows. Games, man... games.


THIS^

get over yourself you buncha hipsters
 
2013-01-02 05:53:18 PM  

EngineerAU: Linux advocates would do well for their cause if they'd take a few days off to read one of Dale Carnegie's books.


They'd be wiser to read "The Tragedy of the Commons". Then they might stop trying to mess up a good thing by being "Linux Advocates".
 
2013-01-02 05:58:35 PM  

Red_Fox: Access to MULTIPLE "supercomputers" you are SO full of shiat.


You should see what the beowolf cluster of those can do!
 
2013-01-02 06:06:43 PM  
I use Linux on my desktop and laptop to do real work. As a sysadmin, I am much faster working from a command line than I ever was working in a Windows GUI.

As I've said before, Windows has its own horrible flaws that everyone just seems to accept as normal, and troubleshooting why something doesn't work in Windows is about 10x harder than figuring out why it doesn't work in Linux if it falls outside normal use. (Go ahead and try to run ProSeries 20xx using a Windows 2003 Server and Windows 7 64 bit)

That all being said, all of my techs use Windows. To each their own.

The only way Linux will become dominant on the desktop is if there is a streamlined cheap commodity desktop running Linux with some reason for people to use it. There already are a few, that have much simpler UIs (such as the Roku box), but being that they are using proprietary skins, no one really learns anything of the OS underneath.
 
2013-01-02 07:09:54 PM  
Sent from my brand new, pretty darn cool Chromebook. I believe the chrome OS is a Linux kernel, IIRC
 
2013-01-02 08:11:28 PM  

Phaeon: Sent from my brand new, pretty darn cool Chromebook. I believe the chrome OS is a Linux kernel, IIRC


You can download ISOs for installation on older hardware from here.

I thought it was quite Red Hat-like when I tinkered with it.
 
2013-01-02 09:17:19 PM  
Until Gnome and KDE get their shiat together . . . no thanks . . .

/ recently left linux
// linux is good, Gnome and KDE must catchup
/// fark Unity
 
2013-01-03 12:38:38 AM  
aw-geeze-not-this-shiat-again.jpg
 
2013-01-03 02:58:05 AM  

lordargent: MrEricSir: Open source != zero cost to develop and test. Volunteers are great, but for the most part you get what you pay for. Just look at all the low quality bugs on Launchpad, or all the "expired" bugs where testers never bothered to respond to questions.

If nobody is willing to test/respond to inquiries about a bug, then is that bug really of big importance?

IE, if you ran into a bug that affected you, and someone responded to you asking for details, and you just ignore them, then what gives? If the person that submitted the bug doesn't even care enough to respond then fark that bug.

Like One Hundred Papercuts.

From my personal experience, I used Windows OSes for around 20 years (3.11 was released in 1993), and in Ubuntu 10.04, I finally have an OS that doesn't annoy me to use it. Sure there are some issues, but those issues are dwarfed by all of the crazy shiat I encountered over the years (and still encounter) on windows OSes.

// unfortunately, versions of Ubuntu newer than 10.04 bring back that annoyance factor. I don't know what I'm going to do when 10.04 goes out of the support window :(


You could look into Linux Mint with either MATE or Cinnamon. With MATE, you get the Classic GNOME 2 feel. I believe Cinnamon is either based off of or forked from GNOME 3 (I don't understand the difference between based on/forked from.) I'm currently using Linux Mint 13 with MATE and have set up the top and bottom panels I got used to with Ubuntu as opposed to keeping the bottom panel with the Mint Menu. Also, I think Linux Mint's software center looks better and more functional than the Ubuntu one you posted above although it can be slow.
 
2013-01-03 03:58:53 AM  
b0rscht:
You can make Linux pointy clicky but it does still require a learning curve to some extent. So does Windows, it's just that everyone's used it and knows where the control panel is.

Apparently you didn't read TFA... The major point of the article was that Windows 8 means you WILL be making a major paradigm shift in your computer use, or waiting for Windows 7 to go obsolescent. Since you HAVE to switch in a major way, why not switch to something much better? Familiar interface? Not yours. But, BETTER, you CAN have, by switching to Linux.

And, VirtualBox does a seamless job of running your Windows only stuff -- much less clumsily than WINE. As more people check out Win 8, Linux has a chance to make it bigtime in the desktop world. I'd say the odds are against a shift to Linux, but usage could easily triple, or more, as some percentage of people get off the Windows merry-go-round, and start using a real operating system.

If a reasonable shift to Linux starts, it would encourage the game makers to make a Linux version of their games, and THAT could well start an avalanche. Microsoft has had a good run -- time for them to go into the archives of PC history.
 
2013-01-03 04:21:19 AM  
Mr. Eugenides:
3) Supeior securi... Sorry couldn't finish that it's too damn funny. Linux security may be almost on a par with XP. It's certainly better than Windows 95, but to suggest that Linux is more secure than Vista/7/8 is only to demonstrate that you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

Oh, so YOU know nothing about security.... Well, let me see if I can find you some pictures to illustrate....


farm9.static.flickr.com

Windows Security Structure

www.zdistrict.com

Linux Security Structure

This house can be viewed with this link.
 
2013-01-03 04:29:20 AM  
WhippingBoy:
If everyone switched to Linux, what would all the current Linux users switch to?

God Mode.
 
2013-01-03 11:06:32 AM  

GeneralJim: Mr. Eugenides: 3) Supeior securi... Sorry couldn't finish that it's too damn funny. Linux security may be almost on a par with XP. It's certainly better than Windows 95, but to suggest that Linux is more secure than Vista/7/8 is only to demonstrate that you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Oh, so YOU know nothing about security.... Well, let me see if I can find you some pictures to illustrate....


[farm9.static.flickr.com image 500x333]

Windows Security Structure

[www.zdistrict.com image 500x333]

Linux Security Structure

This house can be viewed with this link.


Let me tell you what I know about security.

Last year, there were about as many Linux OS vulnerabilities as there were Windows OS vulnerabilities. You can go to CERT and look at the data yourself if you don't belive me. This despite the fact that the number of people targeting Windows probably outnumbers the people targeting Linux by 1000 to 1.

Windows also has in Windows Update, a consistent stable platform for determining vulnerabilities and delivering updates to computers including computers running out of date software. Microsoft will still release a patch for XP if the vulnerability is critical where the Linux community will say "well, that's 2 versions old, you can't expect that to be secure."

You may personally have a secure linux system, but for most users, who install the OS and forget, Windows is a far better choice.
 
2013-01-03 11:59:58 AM  

Mr. Eugenides: Windows also has in Windows Update, a consistent stable platform for determining vulnerabilities and delivering updates to computers including computers running out of date software. Microsoft will still release a patch for XP if the vulnerability is critical where the Linux community will say "well, that's 2 versions old, you can't expect that to be secure."


Or the linux distribution could provide you a security website that can be tied right into your update system, which can be manual, assisted, or fully automatic.

http://www.debian.org/security/

Once I actually got an update to handle a change in the legal definition of daylight savings times days before MS sent one.

But then I'm sure you'd miss things like having your overnight jobs interrupted because MS decided to reboot after it is used MS Update to push an update to Skype to handle Facebook better, even when you have auto-updates in Skype turned off.
 
2013-01-03 12:34:15 PM  

WhippingBoy: If everyone switched to Linux, what would all the current Linux users switch to?


i172.photobucket.com
 
2013-01-03 01:48:52 PM  

GeneralJim: why not switch to something much better?


Windows 8 it is!

/Windows 8 is actually very nice.
//The problem is more that windows 7 already works, so why pay $60 - $100 for an upgrade?
///They offer a real cheap upgrade path from Vista to windows 8 though, know several people doing that.
////Pretty sure you can even turn off Metro, which is the only thing people biatch about.
 
2013-01-04 12:10:08 AM  
washu:
Foobar2000 is just one example, there are lots of tools aimed at the power user that are built for Windows but just don't seem to exist on Linux.

Users want to accomplish task "A" which requires steps 1, 2 and 3. Linux almost certainly has programs to do steps 1, 2 and 3, but nothing to tie them together in a polished package. That's the problem. When users go searching for how to do "A" on Linux they find nothing, because there is no one program to do it.

Well, yeah...

It is assumed that the user, if they want a sorted directory listing, can list the directory, and run the output into the sort program. It's a different paradigm than the "One huge program that does everything one might possibly need." But that does not mean that it is an inferior paradigm. If you're trying to get an O/S that has the classic user-friendly interface (Do what I WANT, not what I SAID) so that ANY moron can use it, first, only a moron will WANT to use it, and, second, success will NOT be achieved.

I am amazed at what people cannot do on computers they have owned for literally years. And, I'm talking almost exclusively Windows-based computing. I've seen several people who, after using pretty much only games, e-mail and Web browsing, don't understand the concepts of cut and paste, or bookmarks. It is NOT POSSIBLE to make something so easy that everyone will understand it. When users wander off the "games / browser / e-mail client / document production" dude ranch, they are out in the world of computers, even if only dipping in a toe. It is better if that world is a rational computer system, like Linux, than a Rube Goldberg structure held together with tar paper and chicken wire, as Windows is. If you're going to use the computer, use the damned thing. If not, go back to the dude ranch.

Think about it... Do you want to use a computer so simple that people who cannot set their VCR (Betamax, no doubt) clocks can use all of its features? I sure don't.
 
2013-01-04 02:10:07 AM  
Mr. Eugenides:
Let me tell you what I know about security.

Last year, there were about as many Linux OS vulnerabilities as there were Windows OS vulnerabilities. You can go to CERT and look at the data yourself if you don't belive me. This despite the fact that the number of people targeting Windows probably outnumbers the people targeting Linux by 1000 to 1.

Windows also has in Windows Update, a consistent stable platform for determining vulnerabilities and delivering updates to computers including computers running out of date software. Microsoft will still release a patch for XP if the vulnerability is critical where the Linux community will say "well, that's 2 versions old, you can't expect that to be secure."

You may personally have a secure linux system, but for most users, who install the OS and forget, Windows is a far better choice.

Wow. I guess you DON'T know much about security... One at a time, here....

You say "Last year, there were about as many Linux OS vulnerabilities as there were Windows OS vulnerabilities." Okay. How many of the Linux vulnerabilities can muck about as root? Typically, Linux vulnerabilities, if exploited, do little to no damage. Windows, on the other hand, is buns up and kneeling for hackers.

You say "This despite the fact that the number of people targeting Windows probably outnumbers the people targeting Linux by 1000 to 1." Do your own math here... With a thousand to one ratio of hackers (just using your number here) and the same number of vulnerabilities, how many times less likely is Linux to be hacked than Windows? And that figure ignores the greater damage hacks of Windows generally do.

You say "Windows also has in Windows Update, a consistent stable platform for determining vulnerabilities and delivering updates to computers including computers running out of date software." I use SuSE Linux, and I use the updater (YOU) all the time...

You say "Microsoft will still release a patch for XP if the vulnerability is critical where the Linux community will say 'well, that's 2 versions old, you can't expect that to be secure.'" There are a couple of problems with that logic, Sparky... First, Microsoft says they're done with XP updates. And, for Microsoft, done is done. With Linux, the source code is out there, and someone can patch it to fix a bug, even after the "target" has moved on.

Second, you DO know that one can update the kernel on a Linux system without disrupting it, right? The kernel, where any serious vulnerabilities would be, is a whole separate issue from the accoutrements of packages, commercial software, etc., etc. in an average Linux system. Windows is arranged such that, to go from XP to Windows 7, say, you have to yank out and start over. So, why would people NOT update the Linux kernel, at LEAST if they discover a vulnerability in it? It sounds like you're just making up bizarre situations, and trying to use them to justify Windows.
 
2013-01-04 10:40:04 PM  
i49.tinypic.com
 
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