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(CNN)   Will Republicans remember to come into work today? Will Nancy Pelosi bite anyone? Will John Boehner replace his gavel with a whiskey bottle? It's your "House of Representatives fiscal cliff vote" thread (House starts their session at noon today)   (politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com) divider line 592
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2155 clicks; posted to Politics » on 01 Jan 2013 at 12:00 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-01-01 11:17:22 AM  
Another dumb question, dumb question, dumb question, "It's your!" declarative statement Fark headline, and people wonder why political discussions are treated like sports?
 
2013-01-01 11:34:14 AM  
If the House doesn't pass it by tomorrow morning, then the stock market is open and it'll spook the market.
 
2013-01-01 11:38:43 AM  

Therion: Another dumb question, dumb question, dumb question, "It's your!" declarative statement Fark headline, and people wonder why political discussions are treated like sports?


Because this is CSPAN's version of WWE and MLP:FiM.

*sigh* Will the Koch Brothers let it through, or will the Tea Party use their boomsticks to kill it?

Stupid, ignorant single-minded assholes need to be slapped repeatedly to snap out of it. It's not the black guy. It's the rich guys screwing you over.
 
2013-01-01 11:43:59 AM  
Anyone else actually hoping for more Boehner incompetence?  Kicking this thing down the road two months so the GOP can lump it into the debt ceiling and we can do that again is 15 different kinds of bad.  Biden all but guaranteed that we'll have to deal with demands for spending cuts for passing the debt ceiling.

This deal needs to die.
 
2013-01-01 11:44:09 AM  
I really wish someone could get these morons to understand that doing something is better than doing nothing.  Any partial fix is better than making the whole mess worse.  Right now is not the time to worry about getting your unicorns and rainbows, it's time to get out of the rain.

There are just too many issues in the budget to lump them all in one place and fix with one swipe.  Its going to take time, they need to accept that and fix the easy things first.   Then they can sit back and argue about how many more tanks to buy that we don't need.   Maybe prioritize the order that they tackle the issues by the order of how they impact the country/economy.

The house strikes me to be a petulant child that is breaking all of their new toys just because they didn't get that special Nerf gun that they wanted for Christmas.
 
2013-01-01 11:58:04 AM  

GAT_00: Anyone else actually hoping for more Boehner incompetence?  Kicking this thing down the road two months so the GOP can lump it into the debt ceiling and we can do that again is 15 different kinds of bad.  Biden all but guaranteed that we'll have to deal with demands for spending cuts for passing the debt ceiling.

This deal needs to dies


ah.... But who gets blamed for the cuts?  The party that ties them to the debt ceiling.  Republicans.  Between that and making a bunch of Rs vote to raise taxes (primary from the tea-tards time) the Ds have a shot at the house.  POTUS plays the long game masterfully.  As to today's bill.  It really isn't tht bad a bill and we get the farm bill through.  My kids need milk at less then $8 a gallon.
 
2013-01-01 11:58:09 AM  
I'm actually tired of this being the status quo:
thinkprogress.org
 
2013-01-01 12:00:26 PM  
Obama you suck ass.
 
2013-01-01 12:01:08 PM  
Nice to see a Catholic Priest in Congress. How lovely.
 
2013-01-01 12:01:26 PM  
Let's get ready to rumble!!!!!
 
2013-01-01 12:02:30 PM  
So, even if it passes, my taxes went up for a day? I pay at one rate for 364 days and a different rate for a day?
 
2013-01-01 12:02:30 PM  

cbuhler: I really wish someone could get these morons to understand that doing something is better than doing nothing.  Any partial fix is better than making the whole mess worse.  Right now is not the time to worry about getting your unicorns and rainbows, it's time to get out of the rain.

There are just too many issues in the budget to lump them all in one place and fix with one swipe.  Its going to take time, they need to accept that and fix the easy things first.   Then they can sit back and argue about how many more tanks to buy that we don't need.   Maybe prioritize the order that they tackle the issues by the order of how they impact the country/economy.

Very well said.
The house strikes me to be a petulant child that is breaking all of their new toys just because they didn't get that special Nerf gun that they wanted for Christmas.
 
2013-01-01 12:03:06 PM  

mayIFark: So, even if it passes, my taxes went up for a day? I pay at one rate for 364 days and a different rate for a day?


No. The tax rates will be retroactive to Jan 1.
 
2013-01-01 12:03:20 PM  

mayIFark: So, even if it passes, my taxes went up for a day? I pay at one rate for 364 days and a different rate for a day?

It'll be retro

 
2013-01-01 12:04:52 PM  

RexTalionis: If the House doesn't pass it by tomorrow morning, then the stock market is open and it'll spook the market.


Jan 2. The stock market saw its shadow forecast 12 more weeks of a groundhog market. Sell. Sell. Sell.
 
2013-01-01 12:05:29 PM  
Raises taxes only on the super-rich, but leaves the rich making $250K-$400K untouched. Thanks for sticking with your principles, spineless Democrats. You could have just run out the clock but you caved.
 
2013-01-01 12:06:31 PM  
What a depressing topic. All I can think of is to quote Digby:

Many on the left live in a fantasy in which poor and middle-class white Republicans dwell in a world of false consciousness, simply failing to understand the degree to which Republican politicians betray them and their interests. The truth is far more disturbing: the people in these districts, particularly the ones who vote in Republican primaries, know precisely what their representatives are doing and what they stand for. They like it, and continue to vote for representatives even farther to the right year after year. Half of Republicans believe ACORN (read, black government workers) stole the election for Obama. 44% of Republicans either want to secede or simply aren't sure. Self-described conservatives were 14 percentage points more likely to want to a buy a gun after the Sandy Hook massacre than not.

No matter what Obama does, Republicans won't care and won't fold.

That's what we're up against, folks. Anyone thinking the Republicans are going to be reasonable on anything is taking a sucker bet.
 
2013-01-01 12:07:21 PM  

mayIFark: So, even if it passes, my taxes went up for a day? I pay at one rate for 364 days and a different rate for a day?


Are you one of those sooper-rich CEO bastards who have already made $400,000 in the first hours of the new year?
 
2013-01-01 12:08:37 PM  

GAT_00: Anyone else actually hoping for more Boehner incompetence?  Kicking this thing down the road two months so the GOP can lump it into the debt ceiling and we can do that again is 15 different kinds of bad.  Biden all but guaranteed that we'll have to deal with demands for spending cuts for passing the debt ceiling.

This deal needs to die.


I don't often agree with GAT_00, but I do on this.
 
2013-01-01 12:09:01 PM  

stiletto_the_wise: Raises taxes only on the super-rich, but leaves the rich making $250K-$400K untouched. Thanks for sticking with your principles, spineless Democrats. You could have just run out the clock but you caved.


150k difference isn't worth it in the grand scheme. This is a decent deal.  The economy can't take more of this BS.  Compromise means you aren't entirely satisfied.  Pass the bill and tackle the remaining issues one at a time.
 
2013-01-01 12:11:12 PM  

RexTalionis: If the House doesn't pass it by tomorrow morning, then the stock market is open and it'll spook the market.


Like FDR with the banks, I think Obama can shut down all US stock markets for a while. It would be good for the 'free market' derp lulz, anyway.
 
2013-01-01 12:11:29 PM  

AntiNerd: No matter what Obama does, Republicans won't care and won't fold.

That's what we're up against, folks. Anyone thinking the Republicans are going to be reasonable on anything is taking a sucker bet.


Exactly. As the D's compromise and compromise, the R's will keep moving their baseline position farther and farther to the right. I've never seen a group of people who are as good at taking a strong bargaining position and turning it into weakness as the Democrats.
 
2013-01-01 12:13:08 PM  
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeee. fark them all. They made their bed, now let them lie in it.
 
2013-01-01 12:15:24 PM  
Lets see the cuts!
 
2013-01-01 12:15:36 PM  

Waxing_Chewbacca: 150k difference isn't worth it in the grand scheme. This is a decent deal. The economy can't take more of this BS. Compromise means you aren't entirely satisfied. Pass the bill and tackle the remaining issues one at a time.


I guess it's the unspoken message: "We're keeping taxes low on the middle class!" Now, pundits can argue that $250K-$400K is now suddenly part of the middle class. At 250-260 working days a year, $250K-$400K is $961-$1600 A DAY. Folks, these are not middle class tax cuts. They're tax cuts for the rich, and now Democrats have made it part of their OFFER.
 
2013-01-01 12:18:30 PM  
Who's the republican strategist on cnbc crying about all those small business owners with 400k income that will be crushed with new taxes and unable to hire new workers or expand their business?

And how goddamn stupid are these fictional small business owners that they are seemingly avoiding tax write offs related to business expansion to pay for shiat out of their personal income?
 
2013-01-01 12:20:50 PM  
My prediction:

Obama gets sensible "entitlement" and military spending cuts.
Taxes cut for the 1% will go back to reasonable rates like the 1990's.
No taxes raised on middle class.

No guns are banned in 2013.

Troll Face Fartbama wins again and the GOP cries.
 
2013-01-01 12:21:28 PM  

AntiNerd: What a depressing topic. All I can think of is to quote Digby:

Many on the left live in a fantasy in which poor and middle-class white Republicans dwell in a world of false consciousness, simply failing to understand the degree to which Republican politicians betray them and their interests. The truth is far more disturbing: the people in these districts, particularly the ones who vote in Republican primaries, know precisely what their representatives are doing and what they stand for. They like it, and continue to vote for representatives even farther to the right year after year. Half of Republicans believe ACORN (read, black government workers) stole the election for Obama. 44% of Republicans either want to secede or simply aren't sure. Self-described conservatives were 14 percentage points more likely to want to a buy a gun after the Sandy Hook massacre than not.

No matter what Obama does, Republicans won't care and won't fold.

That's what we're up against, folks. Anyone thinking the Republicans are going to be reasonable on anything is taking a sucker bet.


That FEMA camp idea of theirs is sounding almost reasonable now.  A modest proposal if you will.
 
2013-01-01 12:21:36 PM  
The deal is fine. Raise taxes on the upper end, pretend they'll cut spending later.

The Republicans better not fark this up.
 
2013-01-01 12:22:48 PM  

Therion: Another dumb question, dumb question, dumb question, "It's your!" declarative statement Fark headline, and people wonder why political discussions are treated like sports?


Somebody's grumpy this mornin'!
 
2013-01-01 12:23:27 PM  

cbuhler: I really wish someone could get these morons to understand that doing something is better than doing nothing.


...no, I think you're the moron for thinking doing something half-assed is better than doing nothing at all. And this is yet another half-assed deal that fails to address any of the problems it claims to, all in the name of "bipartisanship"...which means, of course, that we get farked in the ass by "both"sides. If you think that's better than nothing, then I have to question your sanity.
 
2013-01-01 12:23:31 PM  
Was that Issa who invoked the name of corporate America? And then talked of putting his finger in a dyke?
 
2013-01-01 12:25:08 PM  

bulldg4life: Who's the republican strategist on cnbc crying about all those small business owners with 400k income that will be crushed with new taxes and unable to hire new workers or expand their business?

And how goddamn stupid are these fictional small business owners that they are seemingly avoiding tax write offs related to business expansion to pay for shiat out of their personal income?


This strategist has no idea what he's talking about, then, because like all income taxes, only the marginal amount above $400K will be taxed at the higher rate. So you can be this mythical starving small business owner with exactly $400K in before-taxes earnings, and all of that will be taxed at the low "middle class" tax rates.
 
2013-01-01 12:25:21 PM  

TheOther: GAT_00: Anyone else actually hoping for more Boehner incompetence?  Kicking this thing down the road two months so the GOP can lump it into the debt ceiling and we can do that again is 15 different kinds of bad.  Biden all but guaranteed that we'll have to deal with demands for spending cuts for passing the debt ceiling.

This deal needs to die.

I don't often agree with GAT_00, but I do on this.


Lindsey Graham unambiguously said this agreement is something Republicans will accept because it gives them cover to turn the debt ceiling fight into WW3.

That happens all of 8 weeks from now.

The progressive caucus hates this agreement and the tea party caucus hates this agreement. I guess the "adults" will try to cobble together a +1 in the House so that we can all reconvene after the Super Bowl and do this again.
 
2013-01-01 12:25:30 PM  

GAT_00: Anyone else actually hoping for more Boehner incompetence?  Kicking this thing down the road two months so the GOP can lump it into the debt ceiling and we can do that again is 15 different kinds of bad.  Biden all but guaranteed that we'll have to deal with demands for spending cuts for passing the debt ceiling.

This deal needs to die.


Pretty much; this is one instance I hope the TP-types just kill it altogether under the delusion that Obama will yield more ground...Only for Obama to put the middle-class tax cut bill up for Congress and practically putting the gun to the TP's heads and daring them to pull the trigger.
 
2013-01-01 12:27:55 PM  

Cletus C.: The deal is fine. Raise taxes on the upper end, pretend they'll cut spending later.

The Republicans better not fark this up.


>250K is the upper end. We're talking about the upper end of the upper end at this point. And the tax increase isn't even that substantial. I'd hope to see a ~75% or so bracket way up there if we want to see real social change.
 
2013-01-01 12:28:12 PM  
The Tealiban isn't going to go for this, they can't give up their hostage.
 
2013-01-01 12:28:31 PM  
Why would Joe Biden help get this deal together with the knowledge that the debt ceiling deal is going to be more handwringing and idiocy? Is sure seems like that's an awful lot of faith that the house GOP will screw this up out of spite
 
2013-01-01 12:29:04 PM  

Mistymtnhop: Therion: Another dumb question, dumb question, dumb question, "It's your!" declarative statement Fark headline, and people wonder why political discussions are treated like sports?

Somebody's grumpy this mornin'!


Pet peeve. Those headlines annoy the heck out of me.

Why are fish? Is blagoo purple? Whence-forth the hawk and the handsaw? It's YOUR OFFICIAL 11am surrealitiy discussion!
 
2013-01-01 12:29:38 PM  

Rwa2play: Pretty much; this is one instance I hope the TP-types just kill it altogether under the delusion that Obama will yield more ground...Only for Obama to put the middle-class tax cut bill up for Congress and practically putting the gun to the TP's heads and daring them to pull the trigger.


I think Obama's counting on that happening to some degree.

And so far, so good: apparently there are going to be at least two GOP meetings before they even schedule a vote. Boehner is still looking for Republicans to lead this thing.
 
2013-01-01 12:30:16 PM  

Waxing_Chewbacca: stiletto_the_wise: Raises taxes only on the super-rich, but leaves the rich making $250K-$400K untouched. Thanks for sticking with your principles, spineless Democrats. You could have just run out the clock but you caved.

150k difference isn't worth it in the grand scheme. This is a decent deal.  The economy can't take more of this BS.  Compromise means you aren't entirely satisfied.  Pass the bill and tackle the remaining issues one at a time.


No. This isn't compromise. This is fail.

Under this deal, and all deals made in light of it, the deficit will go up. No doubt about it. It does nothing to address the deficit, it does nothing to address economic instability, and it does nothing to address governmental revenue and/or spending problems. In fact, I would be skeptical if this deal really actually satisfies any of the conditions of the "fiscal cliff" triggers at all, though everyone will pretend that it does.
 
2013-01-01 12:30:34 PM  

bulldg4life: Why would Joe Biden help get this deal together with the knowledge that the debt ceiling deal is going to be more handwringing and idiocy? Is sure seems like that's an awful lot of faith that the house GOP will screw this up out of spite


The House is slightly reconfigured after tomorrow, so maybe they've done the math?
 
2013-01-01 12:31:34 PM  

Gosling: Rwa2play: Pretty much; this is one instance I hope the TP-types just kill it altogether under the delusion that Obama will yield more ground...Only for Obama to put the middle-class tax cut bill up for Congress and practically putting the gun to the TP's heads and daring them to pull the trigger.

I think Obama's counting on that happening to some degree.

And so far, so good: apparently there are going to be at least two GOP meetings before they even schedule a vote. Boehner is still looking for Republicans to lead this thing.


I have a feeling the GOP's in this "We're not even giving Obama THIS much~!" mode; which is good news...for Obama.
 
2013-01-01 12:31:57 PM  

Waxing_Chewbacca: stiletto_the_wise: Raises taxes only on the super-rich, but leaves the rich making $250K-$400K untouched. Thanks for sticking with your principles, spineless Democrats. You could have just run out the clock but you caved.

150k difference isn't worth it in the grand scheme. This is a decent deal. The economy can't take more of this BS. Compromise means you aren't entirely satisfied. Pass the bill and tackle the remaining issues one at a time.


"Aren't entirely satisfied?" $250k IS a huge compromise in my eyes; it's off by an order of magnitude. Raise taxes down to $25k of income for a single person. The really poor wouldn't be affected at all, the lower middle class would only be affected on a small portion of their salary, which wouldn't result in much of a dollar difference, and if they can survive on it, people above it wouldn't be starving to death either.
 
2013-01-01 12:33:11 PM  

IlGreven: Waxing_Chewbacca: stiletto_the_wise: Raises taxes only on the super-rich, but leaves the rich making $250K-$400K untouched. Thanks for sticking with your principles, spineless Democrats. You could have just run out the clock but you caved.

150k difference isn't worth it in the grand scheme. This is a decent deal.  The economy can't take more of this BS.  Compromise means you aren't entirely satisfied.  Pass the bill and tackle the remaining issues one at a time.

No. This isn't compromise. This is fail.

Under this deal, and all deals made in light of it, the deficit will go up. No doubt about it. It does nothing to address the deficit, it does nothing to address economic instability, and it does nothing to address governmental revenue and/or spending problems. In fact, I would be skeptical if this deal really actually satisfies any of the conditions of the "fiscal cliff" triggers at all, though everyone will pretend that it does.


It's a load of BS, but, since they defined 'fiscal cliff' to begin with, they can redefine it any way they want. All these drama queens really care about is the spotlight.
 
2013-01-01 12:33:27 PM  
"Just cut spending" is the new "some of my best friends are.." and "I only have a problem with ILLEGAL immigrants"..
 
2013-01-01 12:35:28 PM  

stiletto_the_wise: Cletus C.: The deal is fine. Raise taxes on the upper end, pretend they'll cut spending later.

The Republicans better not fark this up.

>250K is the upper end. We're talking about the upper end of the upper end at this point. And the tax increase isn't even that substantial. I'd hope to see a ~75% or so bracket way up there if we want to see real social change.


Nah, you need to aim higher with your class envy.
 
2013-01-01 12:35:38 PM  
i.imgur.com
 
2013-01-01 12:36:18 PM  

bulldg4life: Why would Joe Biden help get this deal together with the knowledge that the debt ceiling deal is going to be more handwringing and idiocy? Is sure seems like that's an awful lot of faith that the house GOP will screw this up out of spite


He claims they won't bargain on the debt ceiling, therefore that is irrelevant.  Which is really stupid.
 
2013-01-01 12:36:29 PM  

stiletto_the_wise: Exactly. As the D's compromise and compromise, the R's will keep moving their baseline position farther and farther to the right. I've never seen a group of people who are as good at taking a strong bargaining position and turning it into weakness as the Democrats.


I don't know how many times this has to be said: Nothing is official until the President signs a bill.  To this point, the Tea Party caucus in the House has scuttled every deal put before them, even by their own leadership.  If that stays true to form, Obama can offer any concessions he wants without fear of consequence.  If the Tea Party accepts the deal, Obama gets a decent bill and some grumbling from the liberal caucus.  If the Tea Party kills the deal, we officially go off the cliff and Obama can put the screws to them.  It's win-win for the Democrats.  Yes, I would like to see a better deal that doesn't involve going off the cliff, but this is politics.  Comparing this mess to the health care debacle and it's clear that Obama has learned something about dealing with the Tea Party and how to turn their own rage against them.  Save your outrage for whatever bill is actually signed into law, not for unofficial deals that stand a good chance of failing once they hit the House.
 
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