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(Huffington Post)   As more and more young people question the value of going $150,000 in debt so they can get a job as a Starbuck's barista, America's small liberal-arts colleges face a struggle for survival   (huffingtonpost.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, arts, Starbucks, U.S. universities, civic engagement, Beloit College, degree programs, academic major, climbing walls  
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5008 clicks; posted to Main » on 31 Dec 2012 at 12:59 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-31 01:49:22 PM  

Oliver Twisted: Great Janitor: More and more I question the value of college. I was fed the "Go to college, get an education, make more money." I did that, found that you can make more money not going into college and instead, going into sales or starting your own business. If you have a calling and a burning desire to become a lawyer, doctor, scientist or engineer, then college definitely. If not, them the debt isn't worth it.

Sales has never really required a degree. You just have to be a salesman. I have learned that I am not. It seems to be one of those things that is innate in people and then grows with better with the good ones.


I hear that quite a bit "I am just not a sales person." And in truth, people aren't sales people, they are just afraid of living on commission. They'd rather work 40 hours at $20/hour than work sales where you could earn what you would in a week at $20/hr just off of one sale that takes less than one day.

One guy said to me "I am not a sales person." I said "You are a douchebag who bangs a different hottie each week while living with your parents. You are probably the best salesman I know."
 
2012-12-31 01:50:23 PM  

vudukungfu: If you are paying for an education and have internet access, you are doing it wrong.


Right. Because people with no education are aces at distinguishing between online presentation of intelligent consideration of important issues, and the ignorant blog-ramblings of a poopflinging derp-monkey.
 
2012-12-31 01:51:08 PM  
I graduated from the University of Phoenix with a Bachelor's in Business with a concentration in Marketing. I'm making more money than anyone I grew up with, but I would recommend that path exclusively to people who:

1. Know what field they are entering
2. Are entering a field with a $50,000 or higher baseline salary
3. Definitely need a degree for their field
4. Will not be frowned upon for having a degree from Phoenix
5. Have experience outside of college such as business, working, wiping chin
6. Are articulate and confident enough to sell themselves to prospective employers
7. Are already literate, for the love of Mike

There are so many people in the University of Phoenix who don't know what they're doing, how to explain themselves, how to structure an argument, how to engage is a ******* conversation, or how to do anything that's worth money to other people. These people shall or should drop out before they rack up another $30G of debt in their quest for identity.

I speak only from personal experience. For all I know, the above may apply to every farking degree in existence.
 
2012-12-31 01:51:38 PM  

TWX: Classical education used to help broaden the minds of those who graduated from it. Those people would go on to be civic leaders and their broadened worldview and knowledge outside of the provincial education they otherwise would have been limited by would help them to be better civic leaders, politicians, and yes, bureaucrats. We now elect those with lesser educations tailored toward understanding one's fellow man, which is evident in political discourse these days.


I'm all for LIberal Arts but your classical liberals arts education has been destroyed by group identity politics. I'm in New England and I see alot of these "prestigious" schools exactly like the article is talking about, places with 400 students that you never heard of, but cost 50 grand a year to go to. All they seem to produce is a bunch of whiny petulant children with dreadlocks and facial piercing screaming about teh patriarchy and white privilege. You might get a basic job in Human Resources with that, but I honestly don't see what else they can do with that education. They certainly weren't taught to have a broadened worldview of knowledge and I can't see them demonstrating to an employer their critical thinking skills, nor will they likely be able to in self employment. Career students is their only goal and hopefully they can become so entrenched they join the system teaching critical theory or joining the bookwriting/lecture circuit. It's a pyramid scheme with the top 10% flush with money while the bottom 90% are cluesless retards blowing their family wealth down the drain or selling their own futures to debt slavery.

Classical Liberal Arts is dead.
 
2012-12-31 01:51:43 PM  
The College Degree is a Product that was invented by the Fed following WWII to give the Fightin' Man something to do with all his free time. GI Bill paid for it and introduced this new thing to the Jobs Marketplace. Soon it became a ticket, a requirement for anything beyond labor employment. The Junior College was created to help those who couldn't get the whole thing. Sort of like the text-message phone for those who can't afford the iPhone (yeah, shiatty metaphor since the one came before the other), but still. It's a racket. Then it's a prestige thing, like cars or giant televisions or giant houses full of giant televisions. Big ol' college degree dick-measuring contest. You want this job? You must first buy this degree.

Big racket.

Unless you're learning a particular skill like chemistry, engineering, biology, or the maths, it is a waste of time for all but the idle rich. Once upon a time a classical education was a thing of value, but now with giant industrial-age colleges and universities, it's all Scantron tests and memorize the materials. Very little teaching of critical thought, only how to take the test.

Our society is constantly at the mercy of hucksters and charlatans. That so many rubes buy into the scams and drag the rest of us along with them hurts my head.
 
2012-12-31 01:51:57 PM  

TyrantII: Even engineering isn't safe in this global economy at this time. I know several that have been laid off and can not find jobs.


Depends on what kind of engineering. Mining, Chemical, Electrical, etc are all pretty solid. Those are things that can't easily be outsourced since they're effectively local. Computer Science is a different animal, but as long as venture capitalists and angel investors exist, so will jobs for CompSci majors.
 
2012-12-31 01:51:57 PM  

Great Janitor: I hear that quite a bit "I am just not a sales person." And in truth, people aren't sales people, they are just afraid of living on commission. They'd rather work 40 hours at $20/hour than work sales where you could earn what you would in a week at $20/hr just off of one sale that takes less than one day.


Some people do not have an aggressive enough personality to be an effective salesmen though. We hired a lot of brokers out of shipping school (they do trade schools in Germany rather than make everyone go to college, I was the only person at my old company with a degree in anything), and a lot simply did not have personalities conducive to being successful, even though they wanted to try their hand in the commission game.
 
2012-12-31 01:51:58 PM  

lilplatinum: /the 1 in 10,000 Engineer who actually has some modicum of social skills actually can make himself pretty farking valuable, however.


It's more like 1 in 25, in my working experience. ( still not very good). I've worked under Mechanical & Electrical Engineers, who, if you sent them as a diplomat to Russia or China, could easily trigger WWIII shortly after stepping off the plane...
 
2012-12-31 01:52:13 PM  
Well, it's sorta a drag working this side of the mall. All the action happens by the movie theater where "Rat" works. Yeah, he once borrowed his sister's car to take Stacey Hamilton to a German eatery and someone broke into the car and stole the stereo. It's an old story. From 1982, I think.

danglinglegs.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-12-31 01:54:27 PM  

AngryJailhouseFistfark: but now with giant industrial-age colleges and universities, it's all Scantron tests and memorize the materials. Very little teaching of critical thought, only how to take the test.


Strange, after my third semester or so when I was done with the bullshiat intro classes I never once filled out a scantron...
 
2012-12-31 01:55:12 PM  
letrole: What you actually did was compare your business environment and you professional behaviour to a period tv drama that's riddled with inaccuracies and anachronisms.

lilplatinum: And? The fact that it might not be an accurate representation of a certain industry at a certain place in a certain point in time means it can have no similarity to a mentality that exists in a different industry in a different place in a different point of time?
Gotcha.


Got me with what? A lunchtime revelry? A lame comparison that you might expect someone to make if they actually did have a desktop cluttered with nic-nacs that said things like "You don't have to be crazy to work here -- but it helps"?
 
2012-12-31 01:56:05 PM  

Son of Thunder: vudukungfu: If you are paying for an education and have internet access, you are doing it wrong.

Right. Because people with no education are aces at distinguishing between online presentation of intelligent consideration of important issues, and the ignorant blog-ramblings of a poopflinging derp-monkey.


I said "Paying FOR an education"
I did not say "Going with OUT an education"

Some things like reading comprehension skills, something something, you won't read beyond this.
 
2012-12-31 01:56:53 PM  
haha you're doing it wrong!

Me + technical college (few thousand at most) + part time evening classes at Ottawa University = $50k/yr job ;) & no student loans! heh!
 
2012-12-31 01:56:54 PM  

lilplatinum: This industry is still stuck in Mad Men mentality.


"Stuck"? I'd be open to making the switch.
 
2012-12-31 01:57:06 PM  
I hear that pimps are always hiring!

/UpGrayedd
 
2012-12-31 01:57:30 PM  

factoryconnection: The older I get, the more lucky I feel that my parents were ball-busters when it came to academics AND activities throughout school.


I missed this. My parents did not tell me, "If you get excellent grades and/or can do something well in high school, people will pay you to go to college." The harder you work in high school, the less you have to work to pay for college.

At least I was smart enough to go the community college route. Got my first two years done cheap, transferred most of my credits to my four year school, and got out with only a semester's worth of debt. Still had 20k or so of loans, but that's manageable.
 
2012-12-31 01:57:36 PM  

Ed_Severson: lennavan: Your period license is temporarily suspended.

Sorry, both styles are acceptable. Try leaving America once in a while.


Yes, the grammar nazi from Indiana clearly meant to use the British style rather than the US style.
 
2012-12-31 01:57:40 PM  
FTA : In ancient Greece, liberal arts were the subjects that men free from work were at leisure to pursue

As it should be today. Leave the liberal arts to those young adults who are among the financially secure.

/ havent read the thread, so I hope Im not repeating others.
 
2012-12-31 01:58:53 PM  
Look, when they said I needed to boost sales, I went back to my old liberal arts college days and figured, "well, if the golfers can't come in the store with thier cleats on, then well, I should just set up shop here on the golf course". Seems to be working. I already sold one Chai, 5 pumps, no water....


cdn.racerxonline.com
 
2012-12-31 02:00:08 PM  

LtDarkstar: haha you're doing it wrong!

Me + technical college (few thousand at most) + part time evening classes at Ottawa University = $50k/yr job ;) & no student loans! heh!


You clearly got what you paid for.
 
2012-12-31 02:00:45 PM  
I paid for about half of my tuition by working while I went to school. It was difficult, sure, but I survived.

The day I graduated, I got a job. My income jumped by 20k--about the same as my student loans. So my schooling paid for itself in about two years (took about four to pay it all off, but still pretty good.) Sure, I could have learned it all on the internet and maybe from a couple textbooks from Amazon, but I feel like that degree got me in some doors those early years. It didn't get me the job, not by a longshot. It got me called into an interview by a guy that only calls college graduates. Hey, you got to start somewhere. Since then, my experience and interview skills have landed every single job, but that degree got me started, so I look at it as an investment that paid off.

I enjoy writing fictions as much as I enjoy my job. I could have gone for the arts degree, but I'd be making much less. I'd still be unpublished. My house would be an apartment. My car would be broke down. And by bills would be unpaid.

The weird thing is: I still get to write on occasion. It too is a craft I can learn about on the internets. But I find art is much less about education than about personal experience, talent and dedication, so I wonder what exactly these liberal arts majors hope to learn in college. The history or art? Google it. The technique? YouTube it. Social connections? Facebook and twitter.

I don't think a BS science or engineering degree will ever do more than get you in the door--but if you're going to go to college, why choose arts?
 
2012-12-31 02:00:48 PM  

FitzShivering: lilplatinum: gja: lilplatinum: Is this the thread where the IT monkeys with their CS Degrees and crappy jobs go and mock people who have the types of degrees that their bosses do?

LULZ, no. This is the thread where uwe bona fide engineers with the real degrees mock you ALL for choosing a line of work that is so volatile as we continue to get ahead even as our bosses come and go with their oh-so-wonderful-but-useless MBA's.

Yes, Engineers are the only profession with job stability in the world and the only profession that makes any money.

/the 1 in 10,000 Engineer who actually has some modicum of social skills actually can make himself pretty farking valuable, however.

I've tended to find that most engineers have a modicum of social skills. I used to believe that old stereotype, but I just haven't seen it in the real world. It could have something to do with confirmation bias, though, as I tend to run completely unskilled people out of an interview, even if they're technically brilliant. But I'm in an industry and company where social skills are just as important as your talent level, and you'll crash projects if you can't play nice with people who you have every justifiable reason to want to run over with your car.


There were certainly more less-than-terrific social skills engies in school than there are in the workplace, but even then, maybe 5% tops. Always seemed like that perceived gap was due to differences in preferred socializing activities, "that guy didn't want to come to my Superbowl party; said something about tabletop gaming night. How unsociable!"
 
2012-12-31 02:01:08 PM  

lennavan: Yes, the grammar nazi from Indiana clearly meant to use the British style rather than the US style.


Sure did. I quite like the British rule for this. It's far more logical than its American counterpart.

Glad we cleared that up.
 
2012-12-31 02:01:47 PM  

ChuDogg: TWX: Classical education used to help broaden the minds of those who graduated from it. Those people would go on to be civic leaders and their broadened worldview and knowledge outside of the provincial education they otherwise would have been limited by would help them to be better civic leaders, politicians, and yes, bureaucrats. We now elect those with lesser educations tailored toward understanding one's fellow man, which is evident in political discourse these days.

I'm all for LIberal Arts but your classical liberals arts education has been destroyed by group identity politics. I'm in New England and I see alot of these "prestigious" schools exactly like the article is talking about, places with 400 students that you never heard of, but cost 50 grand a year to go to. All they seem to produce is a bunch of whiny petulant children with dreadlocks and facial piercing screaming about teh patriarchy and white privilege. You might get a basic job in Human Resources with that, but I honestly don't see what else they can do with that education. They certainly weren't taught to have a broadened worldview of knowledge and I can't see them demonstrating to an employer their critical thinking skills, nor will they likely be able to in self employment. Career students is their only goal and hopefully they can become so entrenched they join the system teaching critical theory or joining the bookwriting/lecture circuit. It's a pyramid scheme with the top 10% flush with money while the bottom 90% are cluesless retards blowing their family wealth down the drain or selling their own futures to debt slavery.

Classical Liberal Arts is dead.


www.globalnerdy.com
 
2012-12-31 02:01:58 PM  

ChuDogg: It's a pyramid scheme with the top 10% flush with money while the bottom 90% are cluesless retards blowing their family wealth down the drain or selling their own futures to debt slavery.


THAT right there. Most of our stuff is organized around that very thing: making us debt slaves. Banks can't sell as many mortgages as they want. People say, fark that, I'll rent. They lobby Congress to make the mortgage interest deductable, so now I have an incentive to say, save up that 10% down and get on board with the mortage. Sah-WEET! look at me, boys, I'm a homeowner. fark all y'all, I got equity.

Except you don't not for at least 10 years or so in a 30-year. And even then it's just pennies on the dollar until the interest is paid out, and by then you've probably already paid the purchase price and still have that much more to go. But we all have a big, veiny hard-on for that sweet mortgage interest deduction come April 15 every year, right?

Same with the health insurance. Can't get it on your own, at least not if you have a family. Sure, some low-risk 20-something can get it reasonable, but once you have dependents, forget it. You've got to go to work for someone who'll provide it. THEN you're at their mercy because you can't afford to lose the insurance. Bullshiat. And the insurance gomers keep their lobbyists in congress on the job to make DAMN sure it stays that way, too.

Keep us serfs toiling 45, 60, 75 years, feeding that Big Machine. Give us enough cheap, carb-rich foods and Sports Entertainments to keep us mollified, stupid, and toiling away.
 
2012-12-31 02:02:01 PM  
Starbuck's? Starbuck's what? Her Viper? What happened to it?

The entire "education" system in the U.S. is fundamentally broken, from kindergarten to grad school. It's going to take a serious upheaval to even come close to reforming it.

On a topic slightly related to the headline: I worked at a Starbucks for a while. Lax attendance policy, no drug testing, lots of free food and drink, nubile young baristas, decent tips...what do you mean it's not awesome?
 
2012-12-31 02:02:44 PM  
contentmarketingtoday.com

Liberal Arts? Gee I am not even sure what a liberal is. Is that anything like the Statue of Liberty? Now, Arts, I understand. I used to read Calvin and Hobbes.
 
2012-12-31 02:03:47 PM  

AsprinBurn: The weird thing is: I still get to write on occasion. It too is a craft I can learn about on the internets. But I find art is much less about education than about personal experience, talent and dedication, so I wonder what exactly these liberal arts majors hope to learn in college. The history or art? Google it. The technique? YouTube it. Social connections? Facebook and twitter.


What you're describing is the difference between knowledge and information.
 
2012-12-31 02:05:37 PM  

AngryJailhouseFistfark: Keep us serfs toiling 45, 60, 75 years, feeding that Big Machine. Give us enough cheap, carb-rich foods and Sports Entertainments to keep us mollified, stupid, and toiling away.


Somewhere, later tonight, patrons at a bar somewhere are going to hear all of this in person and start backing very slowly away from you ...
 
2012-12-31 02:05:54 PM  

towatchoverme: LtDarkstar: haha you're doing it wrong!

Me + technical college (few thousand at most) + part time evening classes at Ottawa University = $50k/yr job ;) & no student loans! heh!

You clearly got what you paid for.


It was a good deal and I make more money than most people that live in this area :) (Web designer)
 
2012-12-31 02:07:31 PM  

LtDarkstar: towatchoverme: LtDarkstar: haha you're doing it wrong!

Me + technical college (few thousand at most) + part time evening classes at Ottawa University = $50k/yr job ;) & no student loans! heh!

You clearly got what you paid for.

It was a good deal and I make more money than most people that live in this area :) (Web designer)


You're in the wrong area. :-) You still in Ottawa? Self-employed or with a firm?
 
2012-12-31 02:08:52 PM  

vudukungfu: Son of Thunder: vudukungfu: If you are paying for an education and have internet access, you are doing it wrong.

Right. Because people with no education are aces at distinguishing between online presentation of intelligent consideration of important issues, and the ignorant blog-ramblings of a poopflinging derp-monkey.

I said "Paying FOR an education"
I did not say "Going with OUT an education"

Some things like reading comprehension skills, something something, you won't read beyond this.


They didn't say without. Their [pretty bad] point was someone with minimal education lacks the abilities to obtain further education from online resources due to an inability to distinguish fact from opinion. Really though, a high school education should be sufficient for that. If it's not... well, it's not really college's job to fix that.
 
2012-12-31 02:09:48 PM  

SkunkWerks: Oh, it's this schtick again.

/Liberal Arts Major.
//Gainfully Employed


THIS. I have taught at a Liberal Arts college for close to twenty years and can attest that the grads find lucrative and fulfilling jobs in a wide array of careers because they are smart, can adapt, and think for themselves. My institution is doing a lot of this value-added stuff to attract new students, which of course leads to tuition increase. Bigger schools are cheaper (subsidized by taxes), but maybe education isn't an area where we should apply economies of scale.

My two cents.
 
gja
2012-12-31 02:10:08 PM  

lilplatinum: gja: lilplatinum: Is this the thread where the IT monkeys with their CS Degrees and crappy jobs go and mock people who have the types of degrees that their bosses do?

LULZ, no. This is the thread where uwe bona fide engineers with the real degrees mock you ALL for choosing a line of work that is so volatile as we continue to get ahead even as our bosses come and go with their oh-so-wonderful-but-useless MBA's.

Yes, Engineers are the only profession with job stability in the world and the only profession that makes any money.

/the 1 in 10,000 Engineer who actually has some modicum of social skills actually can make himself pretty farking valuable, however.


/humor, please activate your sense, that is all...........
 
2012-12-31 02:11:09 PM  
The cost of books is outrageous. I get a tuition waiver in exchange for teaching/research thankfully so Im not getting any more student lons. But this is the first time I'm at a school who uses Barnes and Noble as their bookseller. I have never seen more overpriced books in my life. If I went with the school for my books this term, it would total $800 for 2 grad and 1 undergrad class. I had a few of the books already and only purchased books for the undergrad class......managed to skate for $320 using Amazon but that's for one class.

These better be the best programming books ever.
 
2012-12-31 02:11:12 PM  

gja: lilplatinum: gja: lilplatinum: Is this the thread where the IT monkeys with their CS Degrees and crappy jobs go and mock people who have the types of degrees that their bosses do?

LULZ, no. This is the thread where uwe bona fide engineers with the real degrees mock you ALL for choosing a line of work that is so volatile as we continue to get ahead even as our bosses come and go with their oh-so-wonderful-but-useless MBA's.

Yes, Engineers are the only profession with job stability in the world and the only profession that makes any money.

/the 1 in 10,000 Engineer who actually has some modicum of social skills actually can make himself pretty farking valuable, however.

/humor, please activate your sense, that is all...........


Sorry I live with an Engineer, and she is German - that sense has long since withered and died.
 
2012-12-31 02:11:14 PM  

vudukungfu: Son of Thunder: vudukungfu: If you are paying for an education and have internet access, you are doing it wrong.

Right. Because people with no education are aces at distinguishing between online presentation of intelligent consideration of important issues, and the ignorant blog-ramblings of a poopflinging derp-monkey.

I said "Paying FOR an education"
I did not say "Going with OUT an education"

Some things like reading comprehension skills, something something, you won't read beyond this.


TANSTAAFL. The closest thing to a free education is getting someone else to pay for your education. And that is something I heartily endorse. I frequently tell my (psychology) students about the merits of signing on to be a military shrink for a few years in exchange for a "free" degree

And if that is the case, then your point about having Internet access becomes meaningless.
 
2012-12-31 02:12:19 PM  

letrole: lilplatinum: Hey fix my computer, monkey, I have to go get loaded at lunch because I can.

You get loaded at lunch because you never deal with clients or make decisions. You can get away with such behavior if you're a passenger, or a bimbo. because you are unemployed.


FTFY
 
2012-12-31 02:13:21 PM  

ongbok: letrole: lilplatinum: Hey fix my computer, monkey, I have to go get loaded at lunch because I can.

You get loaded at lunch because you never deal with clients or make decisions. You can get away with such behavior if you're a passenger, or a bimbo. because you are unemployed.

FTFY


God I wish, Socialist countries have great unemployment benefits.
 
2012-12-31 02:15:12 PM  
.

Son of Thunder: I frequently tell my (psychology) students about the merits of signing on to be a military shrink for a few years in exchange for a "free" degree


Certainly explains the high rate of suicide amongst our troops
 
2012-12-31 02:15:12 PM  

Coastalgrl: The cost of books is outrageous. I get a tuition waiver in exchange for teaching/research thankfully so Im not getting any more student lons. But this is the first time I'm at a school who uses Barnes and Noble as their bookseller. I have never seen more overpriced books in my life. If I went with the school for my books this term, it would total $800 for 2 grad and 1 undergrad class. I had a few of the books already and only purchased books for the undergrad class......managed to skate for $320 using Amazon but that's for one class.

These better be the best programming books ever.


They were not. You only need the one book and it's like $45. $20 if you can convince an old UNIX guy to part with one of his copies.

cm.bell-labs.com
/fark textbook publishers
 
2012-12-31 02:15:39 PM  

Jim.Casy: The All-Powerful Atheismo: Engineering degree, $0 of debt.

Eat it.

History and Philosophy degree, $0 of debt. Gainfully and happily employed.

Did you have a point?


Amen. B.A., M.A., and Ph.D. with no debt. It's called hard work for scholarships.
 
2012-12-31 02:15:40 PM  

Ed_Severson: lennavan: Yes, the grammar nazi from Indiana clearly meant to use the British style rather than the US style.

Sure did. I quite like the British rule for this. It's far more logical than its American counterpart.

Glad we cleared that up.


I'd swear your previous two posts are like word-for-word straight off what I saw in a google search for it.
 
2012-12-31 02:20:03 PM  

towatchoverme:

[www.globalnerdy.com image 400x300]



AngryJailhouseFistfark: THAT right there. Most of our stuff is organized around that very thing: making us debt slaves. Banks can't sell as many mortgages as they want. People say, fark that, I'll rent. They lobby Congress to make the mortgage interest deductable, so now I have an incentive to say, save up that 10% down and get on board with the mortage. Sah-WEET! look at me, boys, I'm a homeowner. fark all y'all, I got equity.


Honestly I'm not ranting about college in general, just these small liberal arts colleges. These people aren't even chasing after a job or lifestyle, "they're above all that shiat". They produce nothing of value I can see whatsoever. Almost every single person I know who went down that route is bankrupt in six figure debt. I know somebody with a PHD in African Studies, never been to africa, and now works retail at the mall. It's the same story with them over and over. If they are lucky they can get a job at a non-profit. Often they will work for free, and be told they are lucky to working with no salary by bloated administrators (earning six or seven figures them self). Usually they finally get burnt out and "sell out," peddling their resume to their friends who went to State Colleges for business, engineering, or even liberal arts and now have corporate jobs. But honestly I don't blame employers who run from these resumes and they wind up at the mall or at Starbucks.

There was a time when the children of the elite went to these small colleges to develop them self as a man, make financial connections, and develop a worldly nuanced outlook. Those days are over. They are intellectually decrepit hangouts of groupthink educators who know of no moral or fiscal sense of responsibility to their students. Unless you are an underprivileged minority taking advantage of one of the plethora of free scholarships being handed out, anybody sending their children to these schools should have their head examined. The lottery would be a better ROI.
 
2012-12-31 02:21:18 PM  

lilplatinum: gja: lilplatinum: gja: lilplatinum: Is this the thread where the IT monkeys with their CS Degrees and crappy jobs go and mock people who have the types of degrees that their bosses do?

LULZ, no. This is the thread where uwe bona fide engineers with the real degrees mock you ALL for choosing a line of work that is so volatile as we continue to get ahead even as our bosses come and go with their oh-so-wonderful-but-useless MBA's.

Yes, Engineers are the only profession with job stability in the world and the only profession that makes any money.

/the 1 in 10,000 Engineer who actually has some modicum of social skills actually can make himself pretty farking valuable, however.

/humor, please activate your sense, that is all...........

Sorry I live with an Engineer, and she is German - that sense has long since withered and died.


Ordnung muss sein.
 
2012-12-31 02:22:36 PM  

The All-Powerful Atheismo: Engineering degree, $0 of debt.

Eat it.


I did a 3-2 engineering program at a small liberal arts college (Knox). I earned a physics degree and am now about a semester away from a mechanical engineering degree at the University of Kansas. I have to say, I learned a ton more at Knox about the world than at KU, and am a more well rounded person from it. Also, the people were more interesting and the parties were awesome.

Also, no debt. Eat it.
 
2012-12-31 02:23:44 PM  
not to worry, the great news is Obama was talking about getting school tuition under control before his first election (Video) the great news is they took about 300 pictures while he spoke with them.

www.lakevoicenews.org
 
2012-12-31 02:24:14 PM  
Man, this is getting a lot of airplay today:

Students are still deluded by the premise that a degree in anything is a direct pathway to fame and wealth. When are kids going to learn that there is a connection between education and gainful employment? Gone are the days when people went to college to gain a meaningful philosophy of life. We don't see hundreds of thousands of people going into buggy whip manufacturing, do we? I work in higher ed, and I can tell with you with absolute certainty that a liberal arts degree today puts you a half-step ahead of a high school dropout. Our "liberal studies" majors get degrees in indecision and have nearly zero job prospects upon graduation.
 
2012-12-31 02:24:37 PM  

ProfessorOhki: Coastalgrl: The cost of books is outrageous. I get a tuition waiver in exchange for teaching/research thankfully so Im not getting any more student lons. But this is the first time I'm at a school who uses Barnes and Noble as their bookseller. I have never seen more overpriced books in my life. If I went with the school for my books this term, it would total $800 for 2 grad and 1 undergrad class. I had a few of the books already and only purchased books for the undergrad class......managed to skate for $320 using Amazon but that's for one class.

These better be the best programming books ever.

They were not. You only need the one book and it's like $45. $20 if you can convince an old UNIX guy to part with one of his copies.


/fark textbook publishers


I'm going to check with the professor and make sure that all three are required. I took a course last term that 2 out of 3 were never used and crappy book IMHO.

Thanks for the reccomendation. Went back to school to learn programming correctly rather than people who thought they knew. Taking C++ and FORTRAN. among other things.
 
2012-12-31 02:25:23 PM  
Bah. This was supposed to be interspersed in my rant...

s2.postimage.org
 
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