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(Russia Today)   [Inshert your favorite 'Hunt for Red October' quote here]   (rt.com) divider line 104
    More: Interesting, Borei, Russian Defense Ministry, Russians, nuclear submarines, intercontinental ballistic missiles, Russian Navy, quoted-printable, particle displacement  
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4277 clicks; posted to Geek » on 31 Dec 2012 at 12:05 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-31 07:12:42 AM
I would have liked to see Montana
 
2012-12-31 07:14:57 AM
Get to the chhhoppppaaaa!!!
 
2012-12-31 07:21:30 AM
Y'know, I seen me a mermaid once. I even seen me a shark eat an octopus. But I ain't never seen no phantom Russian submarine.
 
2012-12-31 09:58:31 AM
Well, boys, I reckon this is it - nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies
 
2012-12-31 10:43:56 AM
Obvious.

One ping. One ping only.

Or just the tip....
 
2012-12-31 11:03:01 AM
i212.photobucket.com

This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it.
 
2012-12-31 11:16:22 AM
when he reached the new world, cortez burned his ships. as a result, his crew were well motivated.
 
2012-12-31 11:17:08 AM
Those crazy Ivans
 
2012-12-31 11:20:44 AM
Russians don't take a dump without a plan, Son.
 
2012-12-31 11:21:37 AM
I have an emergency supply, but I'm only allowed to use that in time of war. Mister, you don't get me on that submarine and that's just what you'll have!
 
2012-12-31 11:47:50 AM
Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.
 
2012-12-31 12:07:40 PM
Shuck it Trebek!
 
2012-12-31 12:08:40 PM
You're terminated, farker!
 
2012-12-31 12:10:22 PM
All Borei class submarines are equipped with a floating rescue chamber designed to fit in the whole crew.
 
2012-12-31 12:14:57 PM
"We named the dog Indiana."
 
2012-12-31 12:16:34 PM

WelldeadLink: All Borei class submarines are equipped with a floating rescue chamber designed to fit in the whole crew.


I found that interesting. It's like the Russians know their subs tend to have dives > surfacings.

Still, I wonder if the Boreis are really quiet enough to not be found. Much quieter than previous boomers does not mean we can't find and follow them. But then again, the Ohio class is now 15 years old for the newest ship in the class... I imagine they may not be as hard to find as they once were. It looks like we aren't anywhere close to a replacement design for those.
 
2012-12-31 12:18:28 PM

johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.


I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole
 
2012-12-31 12:22:34 PM

Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole


I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?
 
2012-12-31 12:23:28 PM
Yeah, horses're fascinating animals. Dumb as fenceposts but very intuitive. In that way they're not too different from high school girls: they may not have a brain in their head but they do know all the boys want to fark 'em.
 
2012-12-31 12:24:52 PM

akula: But then again, the Ohio class is now 15 years old for the newest ship in the class... I imagine they may not be as hard to find as they once were. It looks like we aren't anywhere close to a replacement design for those.


IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

/trying to find the quote where the soon-to-be-dead political officer said "Ours is better.", failing
 
2012-12-31 12:34:57 PM
No ticket.
 
2012-12-31 12:35:29 PM

pudding7: Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole

I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?


The only things they had in common were that there was a Russian sub, and some of the character names.

I've only seen the movie once, but I remember that everything involving the US and Russian fleets harassing each other was removed, the whole subplot with the American spy was removed, the whole subplot with Skip Tyler's backstory, and his developing a program to calculate the Red October's sound profile, which led to his being in the right place at the right time to come up with a plan to get the crew off of the October. In the book, they scuttled an old American nuclear sub instead of exploding an Alfa - that came much later, and they destroyed it by ramming it broadside because the two American subs sheperding the October could not legally fire their torpedoes.

Oh the subplot with the British carrier, and the four American agents that died when their helicopter crashed (leading to Jack Ryan having to take a chopper to the rescue ship since he was the only American agent in the vicinity...)

I understand the need for reduction, but they way they did it was so haphazard.
 
2012-12-31 12:38:11 PM
The
 
2012-12-31 12:45:05 PM
It's not noiseless.

The Russian media has been yelling about it for a couple of years now.

//Quit pissing, Yuri; the Kapitain knows what he's doing.
 
2012-12-31 12:46:48 PM

pudding7: Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole

I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?


In the book, they tricked the evacuated crew into thinking the Red October was destroyed by scuttling a decommissioned American sub underwater so the crew would see the explosion, so the Navy and CIA came off as being very clever. In the movie, they got lucky because the Akula attacked the Red October at JUST the right time to blow up act as a stand in for the Red October. Had this not happened, the crew would not have gone back home and reported the Red October scuttled. The movie also made it seem like the Navy destroyed the Red October, which would could have been used as a pretense for war based on the crew accounts, since it looked like a battle occurred between the Dallas and the Red October prior to it being destroyed, compared to the book where it looked to them like Ramius scuttled the sub.
 
2012-12-31 12:53:22 PM

Mister Peejay: IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.


I admit I am far from an expert in such things, but I would expect that the area of detection would be dependent upon the equipment being used to detect it. As Russian sonar improves, I would think the range of detection would also increase.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but then again, if all this is classified, there might not be any way for a knowledgable person to tell me I'm full of crap. Or at least to back it up with real facts. No point in risking jail to tell some punk on the internet that he's full of crap.
 
2012-12-31 12:57:55 PM
images3.wikia.nocookie.net

Intrigued by this development.
 
2012-12-31 12:57:58 PM
You arrogant ass! You've killed us!
 
2012-12-31 12:58:10 PM
A great day, comradesh; we shail into hishtory!
 
2012-12-31 01:05:48 PM
Bond... James Bond
 
2012-12-31 01:08:50 PM
I would like to have seen Montana...

/the Cold War is over.
/What does Vlad need with a missile ship?
 
2012-12-31 01:15:29 PM
poop deck
 
2012-12-31 01:18:22 PM

way south: /the Cold War is over.


The cold war seems to be heating back up.

/it was Paganini
 
2012-12-31 01:24:04 PM

Mad_Radhu: pudding7: Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole

I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?

In the book, they tricked the evacuated crew into thinking the Red October was destroyed by scuttling a decommissioned American sub underwater so the crew would see the explosion, so the Navy and CIA came off as being very clever. In the movie, they got lucky because the Akula attacked the Red October at JUST the right time to blow up act as a stand in for the Red October. Had this not happened, the crew would not have gone back home and reported the Red October scuttled. The movie also made it seem like the Navy destroyed the Red October, which would could have been used as a pretense for war based on the crew accounts, since it looked like a battle occurred between the Dallas and the Red October prior to it being destroyed, compared to the book where it looked to them like Ramius scuttled the sub.


Well in the movie the original plan was to detonate a torpedo to mimic the scuttling of the ship.  Although I find it hard to believe the crew would be able to see any indication of a scuttled ship at all if done at over 1,000ft or so.  Any air bubbles would emerge a couple of miles away from the boats by they time they made it to the surface.  And in the movie, the Navy destroying the boat was done at the request of the Soviet Union, so no pretense for war there.

After I saw the movie I read the book, I don't remember the book that well since it was so long ago, but I don't remember "I, Robot" level differences in the two. Just some condensed or dropped plot lines and maybe a little deus ex machina, which I think is to be expected.
 
2012-12-31 01:25:37 PM
There can be only one quote: "I'm not Spanish, I'm Egyptian."
 
2012-12-31 01:43:09 PM

Mister Peejay: pudding7: Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole

I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?

The only things they had in common were that there was a Russian sub, and some of the character names.

I've only seen the movie once, but I remember that everything involving the US and Russian fleets harassing each other was removed, the whole subplot with the American spy was removed, the whole subplot with Skip Tyler's backstory, and his developing a program to calculate the Red October's sound profile, which led to his being in the right place at the right time to come up with a plan to get the crew off of the October. In the book, they scuttled an old American nuclear sub instead of exploding an Alfa - that came much later, and they destroyed it by ramming it broadside because the two American subs sheperding the October could not legally fire their torpedoes.

Oh the subplot with the British carrier, and the four American agents that died when their helicopter crashed (leading to Jack Ryan having to take a chopper to the rescue ship since he was the only American agent in the vicinity...)

I understand the need for reduction, but they way they did it was so haphazard.


Well, most of that is just wrong. About 75% of what you referenced was actually in the movie but was condensed or just alluded to. You can't really have a 12 hour movie so they just picked the main plotline and filled in most of the subplots with dialog.  Which is how most book to movie conversions are done, especially Tom Clancy stuff.  To say that they had "nothing in common" is a little dramatic.
 
2012-12-31 01:44:42 PM

Mad_Radhu: pudding7: Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole

I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?

In the book, they tricked the evacuated crew into thinking the Red October was destroyed by scuttling a decommissioned American sub underwater so the crew would see the explosion, so the Navy and CIA came off as being very clever. In the movie, they got lucky because the Akula attacked the Red October at JUST the right time to blow up act as a stand in for the Red October. Had this not happened, the crew would not have gone back home and reported the Red October scuttled. The movie also made it seem like the Navy destroyed the Red October, which would could have been used as a pretense for war based on the crew accounts, since it looked like a battle occurred between the Dallas and the Red October prior to it being destroyed, compared to the book where it looked to them like Ramius scuttled the sub.


They also skipped over the british guy that went into the sub along with ryan and later got shot by the kgb spy/cook --- how they had to bring in a doctor from another sub to patch up the people that had been shot, and how jonesy made the russians fall in love with ET
 
2012-12-31 01:47:00 PM
upload.lhurgoyf.net

Red October, standing by.
 
2012-12-31 01:47:07 PM
He's hiding at the bottom like an addled schoolboy.
 
2012-12-31 01:47:47 PM
Also, let's see how long it takes for the US Navy to find this thing.

My guess is not long at all.
 
2012-12-31 01:48:29 PM
Becareful what you shoot at. Certain things in here don't react well to bullets.
 
2012-12-31 01:49:15 PM
Thairsh been a terrible acshident.
 
2012-12-31 01:53:13 PM
It reminds me of the heady days of Sputnik and Yuri Gagarin when the world trembled at the sound of our rockets. Now they will tremble again - at the sound of our silence.
 
2012-12-31 02:07:47 PM
He didn't really slip on his tea, did he?
 
2012-12-31 02:10:17 PM
Give me a ping, Vasili. One ping only, please.
 
2012-12-31 02:12:53 PM

Sybarite: Yeah, horses're fascinating animals. Dumb as fenceposts but very intuitive. In that way they're not too different from high school girls: they may not have a brain in their head but they do know all the boys want to fark 'em.


uh, good quote, wrong sub movie. never trust air you can't see....
 
2012-12-31 02:20:35 PM
He'd kill us if he had the chance.
 
2012-12-31 02:24:34 PM
Вхат'с оур миссион? Ресцуе Гиллиган?
 
2012-12-31 02:57:13 PM
Knew this was one way ticket. But you know I had to come.
 
2012-12-31 03:07:06 PM
Isn't Russia today the same news organization that pushes 9/11 conspiracy junk?
 
2012-12-31 03:09:29 PM

INeedAName: Knew this was one way ticket. But you know I had to come.


Keep your pantyhose on...
 
2012-12-31 03:24:01 PM
Sir, it's the Vladimir Monomakh. Someone just dropped 45 cents.

Are you sure?

Oh, yeah. A quarter and 2 dimes.
 
2012-12-31 03:30:54 PM
From the movie: "Listen, I'm a politician which means I'm a cheat and a liar, and when I'm not kissing babies I'm stealing their lollipops."
 
2012-12-31 03:33:01 PM
Wow. I hope they only use that as a Last Resort.
 
2012-12-31 03:37:11 PM

johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.


Yeah, like me. I don't react well to bullets.
 
2012-12-31 03:47:15 PM
You're the man now, dog!!
 
2012-12-31 03:48:51 PM
3-1-5.
 
2012-12-31 04:07:41 PM

LewDux: Вхат'с оур миссион? Ресцуе Гиллиган?


И доубт тхат маны Фаркерс цан реад тхат.
 
2012-12-31 04:13:33 PM
My grandfather use to take me fishing over there


Also NOISELESS MY ASS!!!!!
 
2012-12-31 04:38:47 PM
When I was twelve, I helped my daddy build a bomb shelter in our basement because some fool parked a dozen warheads 90 miles off the coast of Florida. Well, this thing could park a coupla hundred warheads off Washington and New York and no one would know anything about it till it was all over.
 
2012-12-31 04:42:16 PM
Then tell it right, COB. Pavarotti is a tenor, Paganini was a composer.
 
2012-12-31 04:49:49 PM
And it wasn't that light stuff either, it was that chunky industrial waste puke!

/You want a bite?
 
2012-12-31 04:52:57 PM
"You may fire when ready, Gridley"
 
2012-12-31 04:55:24 PM
It would sound like whales humping or a seismic anomaly; anything but a submarine.
 
2012-12-31 04:59:56 PM

Some Pilgrim: Sybarite: Yeah, horses're fascinating animals. Dumb as fenceposts but very intuitive. In that way they're not too different from high school girls: they may not have a brain in their head but they do know all the boys want to fark 'em.

uh, good quote, wrong sub movie. never trust air you can't see....


Mr Hunter. I've made a decision. I'm Captain of this boat. NOW SHUT THE F*CK UP!
 
2012-12-31 05:00:08 PM
Look, I'm a politician, which means that I'm a cheat and a liar. And if I'm not kissing babies, I'm stealing their lollipops. But, I means I keep my options open.
 
2012-12-31 05:03:05 PM

Slowdog: It reminds me of the heady days of Sputnik and Yuri Gagarin when the world trembled at the sound of our rockets. Now they will tremble again - at the sound of our silence.


Hello darkness, my old friend...
 
2012-12-31 05:04:08 PM

tmcottle: My grandfather use to take me fishing over there


Searsport ME. About 12 miles from me.

//like anyone cares
 
2012-12-31 05:30:18 PM
All right, Ryan - we just unzipped our fly.
 
2012-12-31 05:43:44 PM
Also, let's not forget--let's not forget, Dude--that keeping wildlife, an amphibious rodent, for uh, domestic, you know, within the city--that aint legal either.
 
2012-12-31 05:55:12 PM
We're going to kill a friend, Yevgeni. We're going to kill Ramius.
 
2012-12-31 06:04:42 PM
Andrei, you've lost another submarine?
 
2012-12-31 06:12:28 PM

akula: Mister Peejay: IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

I admit I am far from an expert in such things, but I would expect that the area of detection would be dependent upon the equipment being used to detect it. As Russian sonar improves, I would think the range of detection would also increase.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but then again, if all this is classified, there might not be any way for a knowledgable person to tell me I'm full of crap. Or at least to back it up with real facts. No point in risking jail to tell some punk on the internet that he's full of crap.


We're not talking about active sonar. Active sonar can be avoided because you can hear it coming from a long way off.

The Ohio's detection area is that area where its emitted noise (as would be detected by PASSIVE sonar) is above the noise floor.
 
2012-12-31 06:18:26 PM
That settles it. I'm watching either HFRO or Crimson Tide tonite. Fark it, maybe both.

Love me nuclear sub/end of the world type shiatstorm movies. And Gene Hackman is farking AWEsome in the latter.

//but when isn't he?
 
2012-12-31 06:35:11 PM
You can't drown, you fool, you're immortal!
 
2012-12-31 06:40:29 PM

Breathe Laugh Twitch: akula: Mister Peejay: IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

I admit I am far from an expert in such things, but I would expect that the area of detection would be dependent upon the equipment being used to detect it. As Russian sonar improves, I would think the range of detection would also increase.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but then again, if all this is classified, there might not be any way for a knowledgable person to tell me I'm full of crap. Or at least to back it up with real facts. No point in risking jail to tell some punk on the internet that he's full of crap.

We're not talking about active sonar. Active sonar can be avoided because you can hear it coming from a long way off.

The Ohio's detection area is that area where its emitted noise (as would be detected by PASSIVE sonar) is above the noise floor.


I understand the active/passive difference.

I did not know about the ambient background noise vs. the Ohio's own noise level.
 
2012-12-31 06:41:23 PM
Oh stewardess, I speak jive.
 
2012-12-31 06:52:44 PM

Mister Peejay: akula: But then again, the Ohio class is now 15 years old for the newest ship in the class... I imagine they may not be as hard to find as they once were. It looks like we aren't anywhere close to a replacement design for those.

IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

/trying to find the quote where the soon-to-be-dead political officer said "Ours is better.", failing


It's not just the mechanical part of silencing, there's also the operational side of it. Slower speeds, patrolling in the middle of nowhere (with at random course changes) and planning housekeeping evolutions to coincide with each other to minimize detection to a specific time and place of your choosing (followed by a series of counter-detection maneuvers to make sure that you are not being followed while clearing the datum of the housekeeping of course). If you give a boat an operational area with a "Box" of say 200 by 200 miles and move it say 20-40 miles a day in a set direction the CO can pick and choose where he will be inside that box. That's why not even the president knows where the boats (and more importantly the missiles) are. It's inherent to the overall anti-detection strategy that we use.

The only reason to even use a set operational area "Box" is to prevent collisions between 2 boats too silent to detect one another and with submarines you can stack the operation area "Boxes" so that there's a transit layer below the patrol layer and you can even make it so that there are small (call it 2 miles by 2 miles) "Dead zones" where a boomer cannot go into within their "Box" so that transiting boats below them can come up to periscope depth to make radio contact or whatever else they need to do (emergencies are always the exception of course). By being consistent in using these set layers the transiting boats will have no idea if they are underneath a patrol box or not thereby protecting any active patrol area from being targeted for a more concentrated search if someone somehow managed to leak their charts to an enemy.

For the Ohio class with their D5's this strategy is usually rendered moot as they can be sent almost anywhere in the world (short of the southern ocean, although it is possible to round the cape if the missiles aren't maxed out weight-wise with warheads). This is of course based upon Moscow being the target which was the gold standard during the cold war. If the target(s) are further south then the Southern Ocean comes into play as well. What this means is that they can be sent into the middle of nowhere where not even fishing vessels bother to go (and this is a huge percentage of the worlds oceans) to do their patrols if needed. However back in the days of the C3's and earlier where their ranges were considerably shorter they (by necessity) had to be in more crowded waters such as the Med for example, where the "Boxes" were placed under NATO control with only US officers in charge of designating all submarine operation areas just so they could protect their boomers operating areas from being revealed to foreign nationals.
 
2012-12-31 07:20:19 PM

traylor: LewDux: Вхат'с оур миссион? Ресцуе Гиллиган?

И доубт тхат маны Фаркерс цан реад тхат.


Ит'с qуите еаси
 
2012-12-31 07:29:40 PM

The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: Oh stewardess, I speak jive.


If you gotta quote the wrong movie, at least stick with submarine movies

1/10

Btw, my wife got a T-shirt from a subordinate  that says (with a skull & crossbones in the middle of the quote)  The Beatings Will Continue Until Moral Improves. That'd be 'Moral' not 'Morale'. We both thought it funny as hell and since it's too small for her (38DD....though I think she wears it well yuk, yuk) she gave it to me.

Happy New Year, TBWCUMI
 
2012-12-31 07:33:04 PM
Noiseless because its run by orphans using oars
 
2012-12-31 07:46:59 PM
Now, call me a prude if you want, but I don't think it's good policy for the Navy to hand over a billion-dollar piece of equipment to a man who has "Welcome Aboard" tattooed on his penis!
 
2012-12-31 08:36:18 PM
Based on the hull of the Akula... so roughly the same performance profile as a 688I with the addition of the Pump-Jet... I wonder how it would compare in a full speed run to a Seawolf or Virginia Class...
 
2012-12-31 09:35:52 PM

akula: Breathe Laugh Twitch: akula: Mister Peejay: IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

I admit I am far from an expert in such things, but I would expect that the area of detection would be dependent upon the equipment being used to detect it. As Russian sonar improves, I would think the range of detection would also increase.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but then again, if all this is classified, there might not be any way for a knowledgable person to tell me I'm full of crap. Or at least to back it up with real facts. No point in risking jail to tell some punk on the internet that he's full of crap.

We're not talking about active sonar. Active sonar can be avoided because you can hear it coming from a long way off.

The Ohio's detection area is that area where its emitted noise (as would be detected by PASSIVE sonar) is above the noise floor.

I understand the active/passive difference.

I did not know about the ambient background noise vs. the Ohio's own noise level.


Simplest way to put it: whales have a hard time hearing an Ohio nearby. You practically have to run one over to find'em. Yes, they're that quiet.
 
2012-12-31 10:47:04 PM
I rarely watch a DVD with commentary on, but John McTiernan's commentary on HfRO is fascinating.  Lots of good behind-the-scenes stuff.

Best quote, though, was how hard it would be today (~2001 at the time of the commentary, IIRC) to make a movie this cerebral -- too much dialogue, too much thinking and deducting required by the audience.  These days, studios want special effects and explosions.  Sad but true.

/What books?
 
2012-12-31 11:26:41 PM
"Emergency blow"
 
2012-12-31 11:38:02 PM
And I was never here.
 
2013-01-01 12:11:37 AM
I know this book. Your conclusions were all wrong, Ryan.
 
2013-01-01 12:52:11 AM

nealzebub: "Emergency blow"


Just when I thought all of the wiseacres quoting wrong movies and such were funny, you had to do this. Bravo.
 
2013-01-01 01:12:54 AM

Cybernetic: I know this book. Your conclusions were all wrong, Ryan.


Damn, was coming in to say this one.
 
2013-01-01 04:40:53 AM
I helped my daddy build a bomb shelter because some moron parked a couple of dozen warheads, 90 miles off the coast of Miami. This baby can park a couple of hundred warheads off the coast of Washington or New York, and no one would ever hear about until it was all over.
 
2013-01-01 06:45:45 AM

Radioactive Ass: Mister Peejay: akula: But then again, the Ohio class is now 15 years old for the newest ship in the class... I imagine they may not be as hard to find as they once were. It looks like we aren't anywhere close to a replacement design for those.

IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

/trying to find the quote where the soon-to-be-dead political officer said "Ours is better.", failing

It's not just the mechanical part of silencing, there's also the operational side of it. Slower speeds, patrolling in the middle of nowhere (with at random course changes) and planning housekeeping evolutions to coincide with each other to minimize detection to a specific time and place of your choosing (followed by a series of counter-detection maneuvers to make sure that you are not being followed while clearing the datum of the housekeeping of course). If you give a boat an operational area with a "Box" of say 200 by 200 miles and move it say 20-40 miles a day in a set direction the CO can pick and choose where he will be inside that box. That's why not even the president knows where the boats (and more importantly the missiles) are. It's inherent to the overall anti-detection strategy that we use.

The only reason to even use a set operational area "Box" is to prevent collisions between 2 boats too silent to detect one another and with submarines you can stack the operation area "Boxes" so that there's a transit layer below the patrol layer and you can even make it so that there are small (call it 2 miles by 2 miles) "Dead zones" where a boomer cannot go into within their "Box" so that transiting boats below them can come up to periscope depth to make radio contact or whatever else they need to do (emergencies are always the exception of course). By being consistent in using these set layers the transiting boats will have no idea if they are underneath a patrol box or not thereby protecting any active patrol area from being targeted for a more concentrated search if someone somehow managed to leak their charts to an enemy.

For the Ohio class with their D5's this strategy is usually rendered moot as they can be sent almost anywhere in the world (short of the southern ocean, although it is possible to round the cape if the missiles aren't maxed out weight-wise with warheads). This is of course based upon Moscow being the target which was the gold standard during the cold war. If the target(s) are further south then the Southern Ocean comes into play as well. What this means is that they can be sent into the middle of nowhere where not even fishing vessels bother to go (and this is a huge percentage of the worlds oceans) to do their patrols if needed. However back in the days of the C3's and earlier where their ranges were considerably shorter they (by necessity) had to be in more crowded waters such as the Med for example, where the "Boxes" were placed under NATO control with only US officers in charge of designating all submarine operation areas just so they could protect their boomers operating areas from being revealed to foreign nationals.


What he said.

/Hamilton, Boone, and Bama.
//Wife still doesn't let me watch Crimson Tide. Grrrr...
 
2013-01-01 08:11:51 AM
No papers.
 
2013-01-01 10:47:56 AM
Little known fact, Sean Connoery foretold the election of Obama in that movie.

Right at the beginning, he says "Barack. New Barack"
 
2013-01-01 11:04:35 AM

Mister Peejay: pudding7: Mister Peejay: johnsoninca: Most things in here don't react too well to bullets.

I think this is the only quote actually from the book.

/which was way better than the movie because it wasn't a 2 hour long plot hole

I don't remember the movie being that different than the book.  What changed to erase the plot from the movie?

The only things they had in common were that there was a Russian sub, and some of the character names.

I've only seen the movie once, but I remember that everything involving the US and Russian fleets harassing each other was removed, the whole subplot with the American spy was removed, the whole subplot with Skip Tyler's backstory, and his developing a program to calculate the Red October's sound profile, which led to his being in the right place at the right time to come up with a plan to get the crew off of the October. In the book, they scuttled an old American nuclear sub instead of exploding an Alfa - that came much later, and they destroyed it by ramming it broadside because the two American subs sheperding the October could not legally fire their torpedoes.

Oh the subplot with the British carrier, and the four American agents that died when their helicopter crashed (leading to Jack Ryan having to take a chopper to the rescue ship since he was the only American agent in the vicinity...)

I understand the need for reduction, but they way they did it was so haphazard.


If you're going to get all butt-clenchy do it over something that deserves it, like the stewardess on the international flight needing to have turbulence explained to her by a random passenger.
 
2013-01-01 11:22:53 AM
Do not open the doorsh
 
2013-01-01 11:44:00 AM
Your aircraft has dropped enough sonar buoys so that a man could walk from Greenland to Iceland to Scotland without getting his feet wet. Now, shall we dispense with the bull?
 
2013-01-01 12:07:30 PM
Now if that bastard so much as twitches, I'm gonna get your ass to Mars.

Something like that....
 
2013-01-01 02:03:20 PM
Read the book years and years ago, and have seen the movie many times since then. I remember watching the movie the first time and thinking "uh, THAT didn't happen in the book".

Last week, went traipsing all over the midwest visiting family, so decided to listen to HFRO audio book again while driving. Was surprised the find myself thinking "uh, THAT didn't happen in the movie".

The movie has become my frame of reference.

//sigh. I need to read more and watch less I guess.
 
2013-01-01 02:03:34 PM
"I think somebody just shot a torpedo at us"
"No s@#t dickweed, get the hell out of here!"

The mini-sub driver, that was his real job, and his real glasses.
Scott Glenn spent a week on an actual sub, with the crew ordered to treat him like the captain. How farking cool would that be?
 
2013-01-01 02:38:12 PM

MolsonCanadian: "I think somebody just shot a torpedo at us"
"No s@#t dickweed, get the hell out of here!"

The mini-sub driver, that was his real job, and his real glasses.
Scott Glenn spent a week on an actual sub, with the crew ordered to treat him like the captain. How farking cool would that be?


Scott Glenn is great. He should've played Bob Lee Swagger in  Shooterinstead of Mark Wahlberg.
 
2013-01-01 08:42:13 PM

Radioactive Ass: Mister Peejay: akula: But then again, the Ohio class is now 15 years old for the newest ship in the class... I imagine they may not be as hard to find as they once were. It looks like we aren't anywhere close to a replacement design for those.

IIRC, the area of detection for an Ohio is almost the size of the hull, so the only way to catch it on passive sonar is to have your ear up against it. So we have that going for us, which is nice.

/trying to find the quote where the soon-to-be-dead political officer said "Ours is better.", failing

It's not just the mechanical part of silencing, there's also the operational side of it. Slower speeds, patrolling in the middle of nowhere (with at random course changes) and planning housekeeping evolutions to coincide with each other to minimize detection to a specific time and place of your choosing (followed by a series of counter-detection maneuvers to make sure that you are not being followed while clearing the datum of the housekeeping of course). If you give a boat an operational area with a "Box" of say 200 by 200 miles and move it say 20-40 miles a day in a set direction the CO can pick and choose where he will be inside that box. That's why not even the president knows where the boats (and more importantly the missiles) are. It's inherent to the overall anti-detection strategy that we use.

The only reason to even use a set operational area "Box" is to prevent collisions between 2 boats too silent to detect one another and with submarines you can stack the operation area "Boxes" so that there's a transit layer below the patrol layer and you can even make it so that there are small (call it 2 miles by 2 miles) "Dead zones" where a boomer cannot go into within their "Box" so that transiting boats below them can come up to periscope depth to make radio contact or whatever else they need to do (emergencies are always the exception of course). By being consistent in using these set layers the transiting boats will have no ...


Not only would there be course corrections, but depth changes to optimize the ability to hide within
different current and temperature layers. Even moving into areas where there is a lot of surface noise
or undersea noise to help mask sounds. Every little trick that can be used to mask location is used.
Not just for the hunted, but the hunted..
 
2013-01-02 01:36:35 AM
"You will receive the Order of Lenin for this."
 
2013-01-02 11:20:26 AM
"Thairsh been a terrible acshident."


Link
 
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