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(Salon)   "We remember the killers' names, but not the names of the victims. We know the gory details. Media bloodlust is killing us as a society"   (salon.com) divider line 182
    More: Obvious, Dylan Klebold, forensic psychologist, public university, public good, CHS  
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5527 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Dec 2012 at 2:21 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



182 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2012-12-29 01:13:54 PM
as a society, we're more than a bit confused.  we hate/fear intelligence and education.  our religious beliefs are...well, 'misinformed' would be the polite way of putting it.  we love violence, but think sex is dirty.  we treat our politics like sports, and our sports like a religious cult.  we fear government control, yet cheer corporations when they pull crap that'd terrify George Orwell.  we want to make sure everyone is well armed, but are so afraid of terrorist attacks that we gate rape people before letting them get on a plane.

I could go on, but you get the point.  we're not consistent in what it is we say we value as a society.  what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.  'The american way'?  what does that even mean anymore?  sometimes I wonder just how much longer we can last.  we're turning inwards, becoming more self absorbed.  less concerned with knowledge, wisdom and freedom.  we're more concerned with control, greed and lust.  I think we are our own worst enemies.
 
2012-12-29 01:46:31 PM
Oh look, a member of the media just discovered that the media are vultures.  Welcome to 1775.
 
2012-12-29 02:22:37 PM
They got obama elected, so who cares? Let them have their sick perversions, as long as the important things are getting done.
 
2012-12-29 02:23:42 PM
Spree shootings are caused by a lack of personal restraint. In some cases, such as Charles Whitman, the fellow was suffering from madness with an organic cause ie a brain tumour. He left diaries and letters that showed jumbled and irrational thoughts.

But in nearly all cases, this lack of personal restraint comes from the breakdown of society.

1. If suicide is no longer a sin,
2. If public disobedience and defiance against authority are glorified,
3. If fame or celebrity is rewarded without merit,
4. If Right and Wrong are no longer absolute,
5. If erratic behaviour is no longer shameful,
6. If internal or self justification is held as a virtue,

-- then it will all continue along this path until society completely collapses, and a new order reforms from the ashes
 
2012-12-29 02:24:14 PM
If this is true, why has violence been going down in America steadily over the last 20 years?
 
2012-12-29 02:25:05 PM
I make my living off the Evening News
Just give me something-something I can use
People love it when you lose,
They love dirty laundry
 
2012-12-29 02:26:35 PM
This is why IMHO that we shouldn't be allowing criminals to get publicity. instead of knowing their names the Media should just report them as the crimes they are charged with "Mass murderer 1.. 2... 3" and all the information would be available online or with Freedom of information requests.
 
2012-12-29 02:27:27 PM

letrole: Spree shootings are caused by a lack of personal restraint. In some cases, such as Charles Whitman, the fellow was suffering from madness with an organic cause ie a brain tumour. He left diaries and letters that showed jumbled and irrational thoughts.

But in nearly all cases, this lack of personal restraint comes from the breakdown of society.

1. If suicide is no longer a sin,
2. If public disobedience and defiance against authority are glorified,
3. If fame or celebrity is rewarded without merit,
4. If Right and Wrong are no longer absolute,
5. If erratic behaviour is no longer shameful,
6. If internal or self justification is held as a virtue,


-- then it will all continue along this path until society completely collapses, and a new order reforms from the ashes


So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.
 
2012-12-29 02:30:01 PM
The killer has one name, the victims 27. It's a lot easier to remember one name than 27. Just sayin'.

On a serious note, I don't think the media is the problem. They're just reporting what we want to see/hear. The problem is us, not the media.
 
2012-12-29 02:30:35 PM
"We remember the killers' names, but not the names of the victims. We know the gory details. Media bloodlust is killing us as a society"

This is an idiotic point for several reasons.

1) In mass shootings, there are multiple victims, but only one killer.

2) The identities of the shooters are important, newsworthy public information. Except in general terms, the identities of the victims are not. This is not because of any moral judgment positive or negative of either the shooters or the victims. It is simply because the shooter did something newsworthy, while the victims really did not.

3) Publicizing the identities of the shooters involves fewer privacy issues for victims and families than publicizing the identities of the victims. I feel for the families of the shooters, I really do. But there is no question that the newsworthiness of the shooters' identities outweighs their privacy concerns. For the victims, this is less clear.

I mean, why do we remember Hitler's name, but not the names of his millions of innocent victims? Historians' blood lust is killing our world, because there is clearly causation between mass homicidal tyranny and what gets written about in the history books.

That argument is only marginally dumber than the the argument offered in the headline.
 
2012-12-29 02:31:39 PM
Like in the past, when we forgot the names of people like Jack the Ripper and remembered only the names of their victims? Bloodlust is part of our makeup as humans; media amplifies it, but was astonishingly even more gory in the past.
 
2012-12-29 02:31:48 PM

iollow: If this is true, why has violence been going down in America steadily over the last 20 years?


Glaucoma's steady march in the greatest generation is affecting aim.
 
2012-12-29 02:32:20 PM
We also tend to focus a bit too much on the weapon of choice while conveniently ignoring what might have driven the killer to that point.

Can we start talking about mental health yet?
 
2012-12-29 02:33:32 PM

mittromneysdog:

That argument is only marginally dumber than the the argument offered in the headline.


And yet treating it as a valid discussion point will divert attention from a functional solution just that little bit longer.

You know who has cold, dead hands? Heaps of children.
 
2012-12-29 02:34:21 PM
Of course they are vultures. They wait for a horrible tragedy, such as the last school shooting where 20 kids were killed, and then they swoop down and shove microphones in the suffering peoples faces to catch all the drama to up their ratings. It's all about ratings folks. The more blood, bodies, horror, they can show "while telling you not to watch if you're squeamish, guaranteeing that you WILL watch" the higher the ratings, the more advertisers are willing to pay to put their shiat up on commercials. I remember questions were beyond inhuman being asked of the people at the last shooting, and of the coroner.

How many times was each child shot?
Were they executed?
Did they suffer, or did they die right away?
What were they wearing?
Could you tell if they were cowering in the corner in terror while the gunman killed them?
How many shots did they take before they died?
How long did they lay there before they died?
Did they look upset?
(yes, someone actually asked those) to the coroner.

And to the random kid that was lucky enough to be in another classroom, they were caught by reporters while being walked from the school with their parents.

"Aw... Timmy, were you scared? What did you hear? Did you hear screaming? How many shots did you hear? Was your teacher upset? Did you cry? Are you scared to go back to school?

Then they would act like they had empathy, and puke up some bullshiat to make it look like they were actually human and had some morality and sense of right and wrong, once they got all they could out of the poor traumatized child. Then they would move on to the next. Not to mention, calling the parents of the dead children ON THE SAME DAY and firing questions and hoping for a good soggy sound bite to air, thus boosting their ratings again. So yes, the media are vultures, and they prey on tragedy and pain, and use the victims as tools to up their ratings, and thus their cash. They make me want to vomit. There were a few reporters who had class, and just REPORTED what happened, without ass farking the survivors for their tasty money making sound bites and clips, but in general, yes, they are assholes.
 
2012-12-29 02:34:33 PM

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Like in the past, when we forgot the names of people like Jack the Ripper and remembered only the names of their victims? Bloodlust is part of our makeup as humans; media amplifies it, but was astonishingly even more gory in the past.


I don't even see why remembering the killers' names implies "bloodlust." Like it or lump it, these people did something memorable. Of course it makes sense to remember their names.
 
2012-12-29 02:35:06 PM
So self-absorbed. Someone in the media blames the media. Look within yourself, dumbass.
 
2012-12-29 02:35:17 PM
I'm always rooting for a higher kill score. Twenty-seven was impressive, but we can do better.
 
2012-12-29 02:36:26 PM

HotWingConspiracy: letrole: Spree shootings are caused by a lack of personal restraint. In some cases, such as Charles Whitman, the fellow was suffering from madness with an organic cause ie a brain tumour. He left diaries and letters that showed jumbled and irrational thoughts.

But in nearly all cases, this lack of personal restraint comes from the breakdown of society.

1. If suicide is no longer a sin,
2. If public disobedience and defiance against authority are glorified,
3. If fame or celebrity is rewarded without merit,
4. If Right and Wrong are no longer absolute,
5. If erratic behaviour is no longer shameful,
6. If internal or self justification is held as a virtue,

-- then it will all continue along this path until society completely collapses, and a new order reforms from the ashes

So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.


Gawd, that's the same post he's been putting here on Fark for
AT LEAST A MONTH.


/but I like your answer, anyway
 
2012-12-29 02:39:19 PM

kkinnison: This is why IMHO that we shouldn't be allowing criminals to get publicity. instead of knowing their names the Media should just report them as the crimes they are charged with "Mass murderer 1.. 2... 3" and all the information would be available online or with Freedom of information requests.


Agreed -- I know that the local media at least make a policy of not reporting bridge jumpers, because they've found that such suicides being reported makes more of them happen (the copycat-suicide effect is mentioned in the article as well). Couldn't something similar be applied to these stories? I don't mean not reporting them altogether, but keeping the killer's name or any kind of "let's explore his motives to the point of interviewing the guy who cut his hair when he was 5" type of "coverage" under wraps. If people want posthumous fame, make sure that's what they absolutely won't get -- not even negative fame deriving from mockery, just no description whatsoever, kind of like how the Romans used to destroy busts and writings about people who had been condemned, so they would be completely forgotten. You'll never get rid of mass killings altogether, obviously, but this particular kind might be dampened considerably if we stopped making each one into a circus with the killer as the (usually posthumous) star.
 
2012-12-29 02:40:16 PM
panem et circenses.

Seriously.

If you are not familiar with the expression; it means bread and circuses; or in this case, it means bead and games.

The phrase originates from Rome in Satire X of the Roman satirist and poet Juvenal.

Basically; the roman senate/emperors would provide food and gladiator matches to keep the people from realizing how royally they were getting screwed.

Instead of gladiators and crusty bread; we get fast food and 24 hour news. While we argue about whatever is having its 15 minutes; politicians and special interest groups are robbing us blind.

Both sides are responsible.

/ I know, I know; you know of some mitigating factor for your side. I ask you, is it really a mitigating factor if it isn't 100% likely to get us out of our present circumstances? I know, I know; the other side is worse. They have been saying that about those bastards for years.
 
2012-12-29 02:40:42 PM

Matthew Keene: I'm always rooting for a higher kill score. Twenty-seven was impressive, but we can do better.


/oh you...didn't your mommy give you enough attention when you were a child? Or..perhaps....too much. OO.
Go troll somewhere else, grown ups are speaking here.
 
2012-12-29 02:41:07 PM
What a bunch of crock. Of course we can remember all the names, like I remember the name of John Wilkes Booth and the guy he killed with the beard and the stovepipe hat.
 
2012-12-29 02:42:03 PM
If we're going to blame "the media" for influencing crazy people and giving them ideas, then I guess we also have to blame TV and video games for the same thing. Right? Since they both glorify violence.

Or we could say that crazy people do crazy things, and are influenced by all kinds of things, some of which make no sense.

Weaver95: we're turning inwards, becoming more self absorbed. less concerned with knowledge, wisdom and freedom. we're more concerned with control, greed and lust. I think we are our own worst enemies.


Thank you Weaver. I have a whole treatise worked out about how consumerism has destroyed us and made everyone concerned with nothing but money, and themselves (because we're worth it). I don't give a fark what anyone says, I think the consumer society is one of the greatest evils, and the biggest mind control experiment ever unleashed on society. We have bought into it completely, and we are paying big-time for it.
 
2012-12-29 02:42:07 PM
I still don't know who killed JFK>
 
2012-12-29 02:42:07 PM
Quotes like that always bother me because it just seems ignorant of the way people think.

The reason we don't remember the names of the victims is that unless they were already famous they didn't do anything to garner recognition. We are horrified by the killers and remember their names because of it. It's easier to remember 1 name of the killer in Newtown than the names of 26 children.

Anyone can understand a crime of passion between family member. We understand that a wife killed a husband or vice versa. We don't think it's right but we can understand that someone snapped against one or two other people

We can't understand why someone would go into a movie theater and mow down dozens, or a pre-school. We want to understand why it happens. We want to understand it because it makes no sense. Mass murders like Newtown spark cognitive dissonance which we want to resolve. This is why we "remember the names of the killers."

TL;DR: We remember the named of the killers because they're farkING CRAZY.
 
2012-12-29 02:45:42 PM
HotWingConspiracy: So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.

Guns have always been there. Government used to be much smaller. Conservatives resist change to the status quo.

Yet the video-game emulation sort of killing spree is indubitably a new phenomenon.

How about no.
 
2012-12-29 02:47:17 PM
The media farking disgusts me. They abuse tragedy so mundane people can masturbate to the drama and feel excitement in their lives. Its farking pathetic.

/Why yes, I am better than you
 
2012-12-29 02:47:24 PM
I remember Hitlers name but, gun to my head, couldn't tell you 5 people he killed.
 
2012-12-29 02:48:16 PM
reporters are just doing their jobs, you blame the media, but all they do is serve the market.
 
2012-12-29 02:48:36 PM
The media one two things.

1) The vast majority of people want to know about the killer.

Is a bloodlust? Or maybe it's a survival instinct. While our high-minded selves are saying think of the victim, part of our minds are rightly asking the questions about the killer. Because we want to be able to identify the threats. How do you tell when the next one is coming and how do we stop it?

2) The vast number of people want to feel morally superior to the media, and will watch a lot of media to make themselves feell superior

Let's be honest, there are a lot of us here who only click links like this to feel better about ourselves. By sharing this story we feel like we're doing something for the dead children by honoring their memory. We breach on about how the media coverage makes these killers, with less evidence to back that up as the old fart Senators blaming video games and the old fart liberals blaming guns.
 
2012-12-29 02:50:03 PM
A killer story.
 
2012-12-29 02:52:02 PM
First, the victims were killed because of where they were. As awful as it sounds, there's very little to be learned from learning about the victims and their lives.

Second, shut up about "society" everyone. You have never ever been less likely to die violently than you are today.
 
2012-12-29 02:52:40 PM

letrole: HotWingConspiracy: So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.

Guns have always been there. Government used to be much smaller.


Tell me exactly how. Quantify it for me.

Yet the video-game emulation sort of killing spree is indubitably a new phenomenon.

You're just inventing shiat now and can't hope to establish a link between any of the massacres and video games. I can't draw a strait line to availability of guns though.
 
2012-12-29 02:52:46 PM

Weaver95: Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.


Wow, you get any taller a soapbox of hypocrisy, you'll fall and hurt yourself.
 
2012-12-29 02:52:54 PM
Nu uh, its all evil gun manufacturers fault! They should all be sued to oblivion so as to not spread their evil to everyone!
 
2012-12-29 02:52:58 PM

letrole: 4. If Right and Wrong are no longer absolute,
5. If erratic behaviour is no longer shameful,


I would word these two points a bit differently, but I think that they illustrate the real problem with our society. An increasing number of people no longer feel ashamed for doing things that are illegal or at least clearly unethical as long as they feel they can get away with it. They feel that pretty much any position they take or anything they choose to do is defensible. Bad behavior has always been around, and it always will be. But the problem is that it's accepted or even encouraged by growing segments of our population. We're in a race to the bottom.
 
2012-12-29 02:53:02 PM
kaispace.files.wordpress.com

His name was Robert Paulson.
 
2012-12-29 02:53:29 PM

HotWingConspiracy: letrole: HotWingConspiracy: So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.

Guns have always been there. Government used to be much smaller.

Tell me exactly how. Quantify it for me.

Yet the video-game emulation sort of killing spree is indubitably a new phenomenon.

You're just inventing shiat now and can't hope to establish a link between any of the massacres and video games. I can't can draw a strait line to availability of guns though.


oops
 
2012-12-29 02:53:46 PM

kkinnison: This is why IMHO that we shouldn't be allowing criminals to get publicity. instead of knowing their names the Media should just report them as the crimes they are charged with "Mass murderer 1.. 2... 3" and all the information would be available online or with Freedom of information requests.


Actually there should be a unified effort on the part of the media to vilify daily those in society that commit unspeakable acts.
A "loser of the month" award should be given and consistently publicized.
 
2012-12-29 02:54:14 PM
Weaver95:   what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.

you whine about Romney's campaign lies but say nothing about 0bama's campaign lies.
then you whine about CIA torture prisons but you say nothing about 0bama killing US Citizens without benefit of trial via drones, much less how he runs the Justice Department or Homeland security.

So what DOES your America stand for these days?  Based on your post, it stands for partisan hackery.
 
2012-12-29 02:54:22 PM

The My Little Pony Killer: We also tend to focus a bit too much on the weapon of choice while conveniently ignoring what might have driven the killer to that point.

Can we start talking about mental health yet?


NO! There are tiny penises to be fantasized about and the adult kids who possess them.

Humm, gun control nuts are repressed paedobears. I guess Freud was right.
 
2012-12-29 02:54:22 PM

kkinnison: This is why IMHO that we shouldn't be allowing criminals to get publicity. instead of knowing their names the Media should just report them as the crimes they are charged with "Mass murderer 1.. 2... 3" and all the information would be available online or with Freedom of information requests.


Then they won't be known by name - they will be known by code name. But that will not change the fact that people will remember the code names for those murderers and not remember the names of the victims.

Because...

mittromneysdog: I don't even see why remembering the killers' names implies "bloodlust." Like it or lump it, these people did something memorable. Of course it makes sense to remember their names.


This.

Insensitive as it might be to say it, the victims of these incidents were ordinary people who happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. They were students just going about their day, regular people out to see a movie, shoppers.

But the killers are interesting because they are/were not ordinary. They did something out of the ordinary, something horrifying, they were "broken" in an interesting way and it's only natural curiosity that makes other humans want to know just what exactly was going with them, to just wonder what can make a person do something so terrible.

I'm certainly no fan of endless interviews with surviving victims (haven't they been through enough?) - if someone decides the public should know some details of what went on to satisfy some of the curiosity, let some of the first responders give a press conference with details in it about the condition they found stuff in, or let them relay some anonymized points or timeline they got in their own investigating interviews about "the guy came in through the front door and people were hiding in the closet" or whatever it is.

I can say though that in Japan they do give code names to the killers (at least in the beginning, and particularly if they're juvenile) and yet all the talk is still always about "wow can you believe it" about the killer's horrible crime and not the victims because... that's the one that's out of the ordinary. Sakakibara, etc. I think it's just human nature.
 
2012-12-29 02:54:48 PM
This doom and gloom view of the decline of society comes from young folks with no sense of history. The phenomenon here is nothing new. Name some of Jack the Ripper's victims. Who did Lizzy Borden kill? Our brains are action oriented so we tend to identify the event by the active element rather than the passive.
 
2012-12-29 02:55:49 PM

steamingpile: Nu uh, its all evil gun manufacturers fault! They should all be sued to oblivion so as to not spread their evil to everyone!


They really should be, but they wisely paid for indulgences and their employees in our federal government granted them special dispensation.
 
2012-12-29 02:56:04 PM

letrole: HotWingConspiracy: So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.

Guns have always been there. Government used to be much smaller. Conservatives resist change to the status quo.

Yet the video-game emulation sort of killing spree is indubitably a new phenomenon.

How about no.


Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon
 
2012-12-29 02:58:26 PM
This actually came up at Christmas. My cousin was saying how her husband feels bad because the situation is tragic, but after about three days of wall-to-wall coverage of these types of things he's had enough. My response was "Three days? I'm done after three hours."

Of course these stories should be reported, but I don't like the way it's done. I don't see how it's helpful to anyone to make it a 24-hour media circus.

And I realize there's some degree of giving the people what they want, and maybe that's the larger issue.
 
2012-12-29 02:59:25 PM
I tend to agree with the headline. Part of what drives these mass killings is the attention they garner. I don't think that is a controversial statement.
 
2012-12-29 02:59:28 PM
Ed Willy: Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon.


No.
 
2012-12-29 03:00:35 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95:   what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.

you whine about Romney's campaign lies but say nothing about 0bama's campaign lies.
then you whine about CIA torture prisons but you say nothing about 0bama killing US Citizens without benefit of trial via drones, much less how he runs the Justice Department or Homeland security.

So what DOES your America stand for these days?  Based on your post, it stands for partisan hackery.


It stands for jingo spouting assholes like you. You should be thrilled.
 
2012-12-29 03:00:50 PM

mittromneysdog: 2) The identities of the shooters are important, newsworthy public information. Except in general terms, the identities of the victims are not. This is not because of any moral judgment positive or negative of either the shooters or the victims. It is simply because the shooter did something newsworthy, while the victims really did not.

3) Publicizing the identities of the shooters involves fewer privacy issues for victims and families than publicizing the identities of the victims. I feel for the families of the shooters, I really do. But there is no question that the newsworthiness of the shooters' identities outweighs their privacy concerns. For the victims, this is less clear.

I mean, why do we remember Hitler's name, but not the names of his millions of innocent victims? Historians' blood lust is killing our world, because there is clearly causation between mass homicidal tyranny and what gets written about in the history books.

That argument is only marginally dumber than the the argument offered in the headline.


You're confusing 'newsworthiness' with information that is actually useful or important to the public. The fact is that for a desperately unhappy person, who is bitter at the world and wants the whole world to know their suffering, their best chance is to go and commit a horrific murder and go down in history.

Most people are mentally stable enough to not want to take out their suffering on others and instead just kill themselves in a way that at most gets reported on page 12 of the local newspaper. But there's that small percentage who aren't content ending their own lives, but have to end that of others before they go. Familicide is the most common, but that's a different psychological problem, I think.

The media loves a shooting spree, and the more you kill, the more they'll talk about you. That's incentive enough for a relatively tiny number of young men who keep their feelings to themselves and have no one to talk them out of it.

It might also be a factor that they don't have the balls to kill themselves but once they've killed lots of innocent bystanders, they realise their lives are over anyway, so they may as well kill themselves. The guy that shot Giffords and the guy that shot up the Denver movie theater are notable in that they both survived, and both appear to be completely insane and dellusional, rather than bitter assholes who just want to make a point before they go.

Oh, and your point about genocidal leaders is utterly stupid, because they don't want to be remembered for their crimes, but for how great they were. No leader says 'I want to be known as the worst person in history', they say the exact opposite.
 
2012-12-29 03:00:55 PM

Ed Willy: Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon


Pretty sure people were being shot to death by semi-automatic magazine fed weapons a century ago.
 
2012-12-29 03:02:09 PM
Speak for yourself, Salon.com
 
2012-12-29 03:02:40 PM

Alonjar: Ed Willy: Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon

Pretty sure people were being shot to death by semi-automatic magazine fed weapons a century ago.


Oh, and before that, instead of an insane kid at your school, it was some strange dudes who would come to your village and massacre every living creature with blunderbusses.
 
2012-12-29 03:03:49 PM
i276.photobucket.com

FFS people, let's at least make the trolls get creative before responding.
 
2012-12-29 03:04:05 PM
FREEE MAHRKEEEEET!!!!  INVISUHBAL HAANNNND!!!

/Humanity is naturally brutal
//civilization was Man's attempt to fight Human nature
///we are not civilized in the US
 
2012-12-29 03:04:37 PM
I'm afraid the media is simply supplying demand in these cases.
 
2012-12-29 03:07:17 PM

Alonjar: Ed Willy: Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon

Pretty sure people were being shot to death by semi-automatic magazine fed weapons a century ago.


Or incinerated by fireballs spewed from the maw of a giant metal tarantula.
 
2012-12-29 03:07:50 PM
I have no idea what the shooter's name is. I didn't watch the news. I don't know what his victims look like either. It doesn't matter, I have a little cousin going to first grade so I can imagine what her head exploding looks like. I guess I just have to deal with the fact that one day some crazy person might make her head explode because you gun nuts need to masturbate to your guns without restricting semi-auto or having a registration or doing mental health checks. Cum away, American heroes!
 
2012-12-29 03:10:55 PM
Oh look, another concerned soul who doesn't know the difference between "newsworthy" and "praiseworthy." Or between Page One and Page Six.

This article is republished every time a mass murderer or serial killer gets his picture in the paper.
 
2012-12-29 03:11:53 PM

Zombie DJ: I remember Hitlers name but, gun to my head, couldn't tell you 5 people he killed.


Helen Keller, Amelia Eirhart, the Lindbergh baby, Lou Gehrig, and one of the Wayans brothers.
 
2012-12-29 03:12:05 PM

The My Little Pony Killer: We also tend to focus a bit too much on the weapon of choice while conveniently ignoring what might have driven the killer to that point.

Can we start talking about mental health yet?


Thank you. It needed to be said.
 
2012-12-29 03:12:29 PM
SKEET SKEET SKEET GUN NUTS! This shower of semen is so much more important than our children's safety!
 
2012-12-29 03:14:01 PM
Yes...do tell us, blogger

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-12-29 03:15:15 PM
So clearly we need to repeal the 1st Amendment and expand the 2nd Amendment. Right?
 
2012-12-29 03:16:26 PM

furiousxgeorge: SKEET SKEET SKEET GUN NUTS! This shower of semen is so much more important than our children's safety!




nathantimmel.com
 
2012-12-29 03:19:06 PM

letrole: Spree shootings are caused by a lack of personal restraint. In some cases, such as Charles Whitman, the fellow was suffering from madness with an organic cause ie a brain tumour. He left diaries and letters that showed jumbled and irrational thoughts.

But in nearly all cases, this lack of personal restraint comes from the breakdown of society.

1. If suicide is no longer a sin,
2. If public disobedience and defiance against authority are glorified,
3. If fame or celebrity is rewarded without merit,
4. If Right and Wrong are no longer absolute,
5. If erratic behaviour is no longer shameful,
6. If internal or self justification is held as a virtue,

-- then it will all continue along this path until society completely collapses, and a new order reforms from the ashes


I'm already tired of this copy/paste post and I've only seen it twice.
 
2012-12-29 03:19:46 PM
letrole: Government used to be much smaller.
HotWingConspiracy:You're just inventing shiat now [...].

Government used to be smaller. That refers to less expenditure, number of federal employees, as well as the scope of areas that various departments administer and control.

Whether this is a good or bad thing is of no importance to me. It seems to be important to you. You went off on a political tangent that frankly cannot be justified by fact.

Government used to be smaller. Grass be green. Sky be blue.
 
2012-12-29 03:22:50 PM
I don't remember the guy in Colorado's name, or that guy who shot all those school kids.
 
2012-12-29 03:24:23 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95:   what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.

you whine about Romney's campaign lies but say nothing about 0bama's campaign lies.
then you whine about CIA torture prisons but you say nothing about 0bama killing US Citizens without benefit of trial via drones, much less how he runs the Justice Department or Homeland security.

So what DOES your America stand for these days?  Based on your post, it stands for partisan hackery.


I tend to come down harder on the GOP because of their claims of moral superiority.  they're supposedly the party of personal responsibility and family values...but I see NOTHING in that party except for greed, lust and hypocrisy.  if you are going to claim to be the party of jesus and you pervert christian values in order to gain worldly power...you damn well better get used to being mocked and hated for it.  Occupy Wall Street has done more to follow the teaching of Jesus Christ than the ENTIRE leadership roster of the Republican party...and OWS is secular, humanist and partly comprised of hipster atheist jerks.

so yeah, I put a lot of blame on the GOP for destroying the 'American way of life'.  they pervert religion to get elected and use fear to keep voters in line.  they exploit situations for personal and corporate advantage, and seem hell bent on destroying what little is left of a rapidly shrinking middle class.  now i'm sure you want to change the subject and talk about the flaws of the Democratic party (of which there are many) but...and I say this with the greatest of respect - STFU and pay attention.  I'm talking about the REPUBLICAN party.  i'm talking about the flaws, weaknesses and practices of the Republicans.  lets stay focused on them for a moment.  CAN you stay focused on what's wrong with the GOP?  Because I've gotta tell ya - when I stopped and really thought about what the Republicans actually stood for...that was the moment I realized I wasn't actually a Republican anymore.  there is something deeply flawed on the Republican side of the aisle.  If the GOP doesn't confront those flaws, if they don't wake the hell up and fix their problems....then they're going to be run over by history.  they'll fail, fall apart, scattered to the winds forever.

pay attention now, because this is the important part - fix...your gotdamn....party.  admit you've got problems, admit you've become too radical for the majority of voters in this nation and move back to the center.  do it, or the voters in this country are going to force you to pay a very heavy price.  if you can't admit the Republicans are wrong on almost every issue and challenge we face today...then I have no sympathy for you, or for the Republican party as a whole.
 
2012-12-29 03:26:09 PM

epoc_tnac: mittromneysdog: 2) The identities of the shooters are important, newsworthy public information. Except in general terms, the identities of the victims are not. This is not because of any moral judgment positive or negative of either the shooters or the victims. It is simply because the shooter did something newsworthy, while the victims really did not.

...

I mean, why do we remember Hitler's name, but not the names of his millions of innocent victims? Historians' blood lust is killing our world, because there is clearly causation between mass homicidal tyranny and what gets written about in the history book.

...

That argument is only marginally dumber than the the argument offered in the headline.

You're confusing 'newsworthiness' with information that is actually useful or important to the public. The fact is that for a desperately unhappy person, who is bitter at the world and wants the whole world to know their suffering, their best chance is to go and commit a horrific murder and go down in history.

Most people are mentally stable enough to not want to take out their suffering on others and instead just kill themselves in a way that at most gets reported on page 12 of the local newspaper. But there's that small percentage who aren't content ending their own lives, but have to end that of others before they go. Familicide is the most common, but that's a different psychological problem, I think.

The media loves a shooting spree, and the more you kill, the more they'll talk about you. That's incentive enough for a relatively tiny number of young men who keep their feelings to themselves and have no one to talk th ...


mittromneysdog is 100% correct. If anything is stupid, it's the idea that news media should censor themselves for fear of encouraging psychopaths. For the most part, these people don't want fame. Absolutely nothing in the pasts of Adam Lanza or William Spengler (there, I said their names!) indicated a hunger for publicity. They just wanted to hurt people, preferably as many as possible.
 
2012-12-29 03:30:35 PM
I find it mind blowing that this country considers affordable medical care to be 'tyrannical' government control while at the same time making sure that powerful weapons are easily and readily available to even mentally ill individuals.  all you need is the cash, and you can get hold of a surprising amount of weaponry in a relatively short period of time.  But mental health screening and/or treatment?  THAT'S socialisms!  making sure crazy people don't get treated is 'government oppression'.

then along comes the press to film the carnage for posterity.  the rest of the world must think we're all insane or something.
 
2012-12-29 03:31:42 PM

had98c: The killer has one name, the victims 27. It's a lot easier to remember one name than 27. Just sayin'.

On a serious note, I don't think the media is the problem. They're just reporting what we want to see/hear. The problem is us, not the media.


Why do we remember Billy the Kid? The James Gang? lucky Luciano? Because we glorify the scalawags. Bad Boys always get the girls, including the pussified press. We'll always remember the outlaws
 
2012-12-29 03:32:52 PM

letrole: Government used to be smaller. That refers to less expenditure, number of federal employees, as well as the scope of areas that various departments administer and control


The population used to be smaller too, didn't it, Mr. Troll.
 
2012-12-29 03:32:56 PM
"But if everyone's mentally ill then no one will be allowed to buy guns!"
"Book 'em, Dr. Phil..."
 
2012-12-29 03:34:02 PM

Mikeyworld: had98c: The killer has one name, the victims 27. It's a lot easier to remember one name than 27. Just sayin'.

On a serious note, I don't think the media is the problem. They're just reporting what we want to see/hear. The problem is us, not the media.

Why do we remember Billy the Kid? The James Gang? lucky Luciano? Because we glorify the scalawags. Bad Boys always get the girls, including the pussified press. We'll always remember the outlaws


But we also remember Marshall Dillon and Wyatt Earp.
 
2012-12-29 03:34:05 PM
Speak for yourself.
 
2012-12-29 03:34:52 PM
Uh, knowing the shooter's name and not all the victims is perfectly normal. I don't really want a list of the victims. And just because journalists are subhuman does not mean that society is going the same route. But hopefully we'll just find a way to make this a big political spittlefest with idiots thinking they have joined the correct party and dying to show everyone how brainwashed they are.
 
2012-12-29 03:35:20 PM

letrole: letrole: Government used to be much smaller.
HotWingConspiracy:You're just inventing shiat now [...].

Government used to be smaller. That refers to less expenditure, number of federal employees, as well as the scope of areas that various departments administer and control.

Whether this is a good or bad thing is of no importance to me. It seems to be important to you. You went off on a political tangent that frankly cannot be justified by fact.


I didn't bring up small government.

Government used to be smaller. Grass be green. Sky be blue.

Thing is, you're wrong on a per capita basis in terms of cash and practical basis in terms of law. Also, the size of today's government has been trending downward.
 
2012-12-29 03:35:21 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Mikeyworld: had98c: The killer has one name, the victims 27. It's a lot easier to remember one name than 27. Just sayin'.

On a serious note, I don't think the media is the problem. They're just reporting what we want to see/hear. The problem is us, not the media.

Why do we remember Billy the Kid? The James Gang? lucky Luciano? Because we glorify the scalawags. Bad Boys always get the girls, including the pussified press. We'll always remember the outlaws

But we also remember Marshall Dillon and Wyatt Earp.


but we tend to forget about Tesla and think Edison was some kind of nice guy, hardworking genius.
 
2012-12-29 03:37:48 PM

tinfoil-hat maggie: The My Little Pony Killer: We also tend to focus a bit too much on the weapon of choice while conveniently ignoring what might have driven the killer to that point.

Can we start talking about mental health yet?

Thank you. It needed to be said.


Absolutely this↑↑↑↑↑

It's not movies, video games, music, magazines, or any other form of media.

It's not the type of guns, the availability of guns, the caliber of guns, the cosmetic design features of the guns, the magazine capacity, or any other variable pertaining to the guns themselves.

It is because (almost without exception) the friends, families, school administrators, and mental health professionals have begged for something to be done before the crazy person killed someone. But, they have been denied by a system that has been broken since the 1980's.


Link

Link


We need to change that system and make it work again. Make it easier to commit someone who is clearly violent. At the very least require some sort of supervision that ensures those who are incapable or unwilling actually take the medications that prevent them from becoming violent.

The newspapers need to stop publishing the names and addresses of legal gun owners and start publishing the names of the judges who deny commitment of the dangerous lunatics who are doing the killing.

The rest of the media need to stop blowing the stories of these tragedies completely out of proportion and perpetuating a constant state of fear.

The government needs to stop trying to restrict the rights of the law abiding based on the actions of the criminals.
 
2012-12-29 03:39:21 PM

HotWingConspiracy: steamingpile: Nu uh, its all evil gun manufacturers fault! They should all be sued to oblivion so as to not spread their evil to everyone!

They really should be, but they wisely paid for indulgences and their employees in our federal government granted them special dispensation.


I was being sarcastic, the problem is you are too obviously outed as trolling too many threads so we all knew you would get drawn in.

Oh and there is no direct line you can draw from video games to gun availability, but that has never stopped you from arguing before, just like you asked someone to prove government used to be smaller......
 
2012-12-29 03:40:36 PM

Weaver95: tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95:   what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.

you whine about Romney's campaign lies but say nothing about 0bama's campaign lies.
then you whine about CIA torture prisons but you say nothing about 0bama killing US Citizens without benefit of trial via drones, much less how he runs the Justice Department or Homeland security.

So what DOES your America stand for these days?  Based on your post, it stands for partisan hackery.

I tend to come down harder on the GOP because of their claims of moral superiority.  they're supposedly the party of personal responsibility and family values...but I see NOTHING in that party except for greed, lust and hypocrisy.  if you are going to claim to be the party of jesus and you pervert christian values in order to gain worldly power...you damn well better get used to being mocked and hated for it.  Occupy Wall Street has done more to follow the teaching of Jesus Christ than the ENTIRE leadership roster of the Republican party...and OWS is secular, humanist and partly comprised of hipster atheist jerks.


Wow. Jesus raped and pillaged? I must have missed that chapter in the Bible. Obviously, not everyone in OWS looted and violated but a good percentage did. My partisan mind can acknowledge the otherside makes some points sometimes and isn't a full force of evil. You seem to have lost that aspect of reality. You continue to look for others to blame during your decline and isolation, but ultimately all responsibility lies on your shoulders.
 
2012-12-29 03:42:01 PM
Why should I remember either, unless I knew them?

I'll remember the locations more than the names -- except for serial killers, just because they're such an odd anomaly in human behavior.

People do bad things. I'm not obligated to cry and mourn every time that happens around the world. I am obligated to do my best not to facilitate bad things, but truly, I'm not going to set up a candlelight vigil for every unjust death on the freaking planet.
 
2012-12-29 03:43:57 PM

HotWingConspiracy: Thing is, you're wrong on a per capita basis in terms of cash and practical basis in terms of law. Also, the size of today's government has been trending downward.


No
 
2012-12-29 03:43:59 PM

iheartscotch: panem et circenses.

Seriously.

If you are not familiar with the expression; it means bread and circuses; or in this case, it means bead and games.

The phrase originates from Rome in Satire X of the Roman satirist and poet Juvenal.

Basically; the roman senate/emperors would provide food and gladiator matches to keep the people from realizing how royally they were getting screwed.

Instead of gladiators and crusty bread; we get fast food and 24 hour news. While we argue about whatever is having its 15 minutes; politicians and special interest groups are robbing us blind.

Both sides are responsible.

/ I know, I know; you know of some mitigating factor for your side. I ask you, is it really a mitigating factor if it isn't 100% likely to get us out of our present circumstances? I know, I know; the other side is worse. They have been saying that about those bastards for years.


Well said.
 
2012-12-29 03:45:12 PM
Nemo's Brother:
Wow. Jesus raped and pillaged? I must have missed that chapter in the Bible. Obviously, not everyone in OWS looted and violated but a good percentage did.

WTF are you talking about?


My partisan mind can acknowledge the otherside makes some points sometimes and isn't a full force of evil. You seem to have lost that aspect of reality. You continue to look for others to blame during your decline and isolation, but ultimately all responsibility lies on your shoulders.

you do realize that's complete bullshiat, right?
 
2012-12-29 03:46:03 PM

Lenny_da_Hog: Why should I remember either, unless I knew them?


Thats a bigger point, I dont know any name but thats mainly because I chose not to watch any of the coverage, either I caught shows on DVR, used Roku, or just used the tablet and missed every single story on it after the initial barrage.
 
2012-12-29 03:46:31 PM
It's not the media. The media is only interested in what you're interested in.

/i mean, everyone else but you, of course
 
2012-12-29 03:47:23 PM
Well, duh. We also idolize people who throw a ball back and forth, calling them, "heroes." We give them free scholarships to schools that real scholars could only dream of getting into. Because they can play with balls, but can't even write a coherent sentence. We glorify chicks who sing songs that were written for them, simply because they are attractive and can dance simultaneously with a troop of other dancers. But these performers don't even know how to play one instrument nor read one note. Media humps murderers because people love to watch gore and then sob into their posts on Facebook that it's a terrible tragedy because, somehow, that will make them a better person for caring about it publicly on their chosen blog. Of course there is everything wrong with society.
 
2012-12-29 03:51:04 PM
It does society a service to not hide the identity and life story of a killer.  Private people/institutions want to study these guys.  There was probably quite a bit of benefit to knowing all about Jeffery Dahmer, the BTK Killer, etc.

Experts can learn and debate what drove these men to madness.  And maybe provide us with signs that someone else may be that type of person.
 
2012-12-29 03:51:20 PM
Weaver95: I find it mind blowing that this country considers affordable medical care to be 'tyrannical' government control while at the same time making sure that powerful weapons are easily and readily available to even mentally ill individuals.

One of the biggest problems that people have with universal health coverage is the inclusion of social programs and public assistance.

And yes, a lot of it goes back to the protestant work ethic and puritanical standards of behaviour. Only the most obtuse revisionists seem to think that the American Experiment has succeeded thus far without any benefit from these institutions. Remember, these were the norm for the majority of American history -- it's libertine excess and amoral self-actualisation that are new to the scene.

Perhaps it's worth eliminating rubbers for indigents, abortion on demand, and free school lunches for kids who have x-boxes and mobile phones. It might make universal health care a bit more palatable to those who have had paid their own way until now.
 
2012-12-29 03:53:11 PM

magicgoo: We glorify chicks who sing songs that were written for them...


Whoa, hey. No need to bring the Dicksy Chicks into this.
 
2012-12-29 04:00:48 PM
It's not just "outlaws" and "bad guys" we remember, and its not the mere fact that they're "bad" that draws our attention. We gravitate towards anything that seems personally incredible or unfathomable.

There is really very little difference between our fascination with criminals and our fascination with athletes, actors, musicians, scientists, inventors, politicians, etc. We marvel because in most cases they have done or are doing something we either can't do ourselves or would never have thought of doing on our own.

And yes, this also means that occasionally we are so inspired by what we've previously considered unthinkable or undoable that we attempt to emulate -- even improve upon -- what we've witnessed. Such is the magic of inspiration. We may like to believe its only used for good but occasionally it's used for bad. Either way, we are never NOT going to be fascinated with what falls outside our own sense of normal and personal capability.

Now then, build an action plan around that.
 
2012-12-29 04:01:27 PM
letrole: Government used to be smaller. That refers to less expenditure, number of federal employees, as well as the scope of areas that various departments administer and control

cameroncrazy1984: The population used to be smaller too, didn't it, Mr. Troll.

Yes. And there used to be only 48 states. Then they added Alaska and Hawaii. And before aeroplanes were invented, the FAA didn't exist. You go ahead and let those random thoughts continue to bounce around inside your skull. But don't come back until something relevant pops out.

And my surname is Le Trôle.
 
2012-12-29 04:04:31 PM
I have trouble deconstructing the mechanism of empathy here,

99.9% of the country never knew one of the victims. As such it is not a direct loss, there was never a personal relationship to begin with.

The victims were unlikely to qualify as "heroes", there's no evidence that they acted unusually to save others (the principal and psychologist might be exceptions, but there's no evidence). They of course did nothing wrong, and did not deserve to be harmed in any way, let alone killed.

I'm just confused as the deep personal relevance to complete strangers. I see two ways to interpret this.

One is that it's a higher, transcendent form of empathy and love if it's not tied to a real-world relationship.
OR, two, that it cheapens and objectifies empathy and love, that you never actually cared about this person specifically because you didn't even know them, but now care for them because they died tragically, and only share empathy out of flocking behavior, because the news told you to.

Perhaps one cares through identifying with the story. For example, Rosa Park's story on the bus was of interest because so many had in some way experienced the same or similar problem in their own life, and her struggle represented theirs. But in this case the life story is not the issue, only the tragic, senseless, unprompted, just plain unfortunate freak death.

I also noticed the term "honor" the victims of such tragedies. Honor denoted honorable actions or character, which aren't part of the story when it's a senseless tragedy like 9-11, school shooting, bridge collapse, or natural disaster. I'm not sure what nature of the term is intended here.

The potential horror is that essentially all meanings of the term "honor" is associated with greatness, fame, and merit. Yet the sole element of their life putting them into this set is dying tragically. That's what bothered me about the usage of this term, it literally equates to "these people died in a really great way", a glorious death? Well, that's why I hate the term.
 
2012-12-29 04:05:29 PM

Matthew Keene: I still don't know who killed JFK>


The more I study the movie JFK by Oliver Stone, the more I'm convinced it was suicide
 
2012-12-29 04:11:27 PM

iollow: If this is true, why has violence been going down in America steadily over the last 20 years?


Maybe because the media says so. Who else can we count on to inform us? Pravda me thinks.
 
2012-12-29 04:13:13 PM

Frankenstorm: So self-absorbed. Someone in the media blames the media. Look within yourself, dumbass.


Um, isn't that what you've just said they're doing?
 
2012-12-29 04:14:55 PM
HotWingConspiracy: Thing is, you're wrong on a per capita basis in terms of cash and practical basis in terms of law. Also, the size of today's government has been trending downward.

Random department has annual budget of $1000. A proposed budget of $1200 is submitted for next year. Not all line items get ticked, so the approved budget is $1150.

Voila, the department faces a 5% reduction, not a 15% increase. This is the figure that gets used in discussion by partisans and political whores and people who use weaslish words like 'trending'.

.
 
2012-12-29 04:16:16 PM

letrole: Yes. And there used to be only 48 states. Then they added Alaska and Hawaii. And before aeroplanes were invented, the FAA didn't exist. You go ahead and let those random thoughts continue to bounce around inside your skull. But don't come back until something relevant pops out.


Relevant

Now quit trolling
 
2012-12-29 04:22:20 PM
It doesn't boil down to guns, media, fame, or anything like that. It all comes down to HEALTH CARE.

We have people who are sick. Sick in the head, sick in the body, and as a result they're sick in the soul... And we just let them wander around continuing to be sick if they can't afford health care. We don't make taking care of each other a priority. We hear chants of "I'm not paying for your health care!" followed by chants of "Why did this crazy man kill my children?"

Gee, what a mystery.

It's pretty simple, people. If you leave people to be sick because they can't afford to pay for health care (and WHY can't they pay for health care? Because they're sick!) then you and every other member of this twisted society can just suck a wet fart when these same sick people walk into a mall and start shooting. If you fight against universal health care or socialized medicine, then YOU are the reason this sort of shiat happens. You have no excuse. You decided you were okay with your neighbors, coworkers, and members of your community having limited or no access to health care despite paying taxes on income, purchases, and everything else under the sun. You decided that since some people make less money than you, that you would be taking on an "unfair share" of the health care coverage under a universal health care system, and so you fought against it mostly out of SPITE for those less fortunate than you... You screamed "NOT WITH MY MONEY!" and then your mall, school, or movie theater got shot up and you wondered where all these sick people came from.

You stupid assholes. You know damn well where they came from, and you know why they were on the streets instead of in a hospital. It's because THEY couldn't pay for their health care, and because you made it DAMNED WELL CLEAR that you wouldn't like your tax dollars to pay for it, either.

So you reap what you so, you greedy f♥cks. You wanted a "fend for yourself" society, and you got it. Enjoy it, you selfish pricks. This is Ayn Rand's wet dream in action.
 
2012-12-29 04:23:16 PM

GORDON: They got obama elected, so who cares? Let them have their sick perversions, as long as the important things are getting done.


LOL
They the voters?
They fox news? (strangely enough, fox news is PART of the media, and by failing to report the news accurately, they provided the GOP with false information (lies) about how Rmoney was doing and led to Rmoney losing.
They, those evil mainstream media??

LOL
 
2012-12-29 04:23:26 PM

TheLopper: Zombie DJ: I remember Hitlers name but, gun to my head, couldn't tell you 5 people he killed.

Helen Keller, Amelia Eirhart, the Lindbergh baby, Lou Gehrig, and one of the Wayans brothers.


Eva Braun, too!
 
2012-12-29 04:24:22 PM
The media is just a reflection of society. If people switched channels and stopped watching they would change. But deep down people are morbid.
 
2012-12-29 04:24:41 PM
Dammit... Of course, I meant You reap what you sew, not "so". Minor typo there.

Although, if you think about it, "You reap what you so" does kind of work in that context.
 
2012-12-29 04:25:16 PM
ARGH!!!!

Sow
Sow Sow
SOW SOW SOW

It's been a long day.
 
2012-12-29 04:27:48 PM
The ACLU is the group most directly responsible for the increase in mass murders. They made the standards of proof so difficult for locking these bastards up that now they're free to roam around until they murder dozens of strangers. It usually happens when schizophrenics first come out in their early 20s or late teens like Columbine or the Batman guy or the campus guy or the elementary school guy. One of the Columbine kids was on meds and the Korean was in therapy. Elementary guy was obviously not functional and in retrospect all of them should have been in locked wards getting mandatory meds.
 
2012-12-29 04:29:48 PM
Media bloodlust is killing us as a society

But it helps corporations sell things. So it's a good thing, right?
 
2012-12-29 04:30:11 PM

OscarTamerz: The ACLU is the group most directly responsible for the increase in mass murders. They made the standards of proof so difficult for locking these bastards up that now they're free to roam around until they murder dozens of strangers. It usually happens when schizophrenics first come out in their early 20s or late teens like Columbine or the Batman guy or the campus guy or the elementary school guy. One of the Columbine kids was on meds and the Korean was in therapy. Elementary guy was obviously not functional and in retrospect all of them should have been in locked wards getting mandatory meds.


Yeah locking people up who have committed no crime is certainly the way to go.
 
2012-12-29 04:30:51 PM

The My Little Pony Killer: We also tend to focus a bit too much on the weapon of choice while conveniently ignoring what might have driven the killer to that point.

Can we start talking about mental health yet?


No. Because the people that don't want us talking about guns are generally the same people who've all but canonized the asshole who shut down all the mental hospitals, dumped the crazies out on the streets and left a generation to fester in their own sickened minds because there's no longer anywhere for them to go to get help. So yeah...don't talk about that either. Clearly, this is the result of video games and shunning Gawd.
 
2012-12-29 04:33:58 PM

gibbon1: I don't remember the guy in Colorado's name, or that guy who shot all those school kids.


Alferd Packer was the Colorado guy.
 
2012-12-29 04:34:51 PM

furiousxgeorge: I have no idea what the shooter's name is. I didn't watch the news. I don't know what his victims look like either. It doesn't matter, I have a little cousin going to first grade so I can imagine what her head exploding looks like. I guess I just have to deal with the fact that one day some crazy person might make her head explode because you gun nuts need to masturbate to your guns without restricting semi-auto or having a registration or doing mental health checks. Cum away, American heroes!


The unfortunate thing is that the gun nuts will be the better armed side in Civil War II.
 
2012-12-29 04:35:53 PM

kkinnison: This is why IMHO that we shouldn't be allowing criminals to get publicity. instead of knowing their names the Media should just report them as the crimes they are charged with "Mass murderer 1.. 2... 3" and all the information would be available online or with Freedom of information requests.


^ this.

Just hours before the attack on the children at Sandy Hook Elementary, there was an attack on children at an elementary school in the Henin province in China. While reading reports of both of these attacks on young children, I couldn't help but notice one huge discrepancy in the reports from each country. Here in the US,our reporters focused on the attacker's name, history of mental illness, relationship status, what he ate for breakfast, etc. etc. etc. In the incident in China, however, the majority of news articles didn't even list the attacker's name. I think that here in the US, reporting every single detail we can dig up on a mass murderer leads to infamy and a sort of celebrity-like status. Certain disturbed individuals may see the notoriety a mass-murderer garners and seek to replicate the actions in order to be remembered, at least in death. In China, withholding the names of attackers such as prevents them from receiving celebrity status, and hence there is less motivation for copycat attacks.
 
2012-12-29 04:36:25 PM

Matthew Keene: I'm always rooting for a higher kill score. Twenty-seven was impressive, but we can do better.


I know, I know... welcome to fark

I was reading a story about some student who placed fake turtles in the road and was shocked to see some drivers intentionally hit them instead of avoiding the defensless creature.

Are you one of the 1/50 who would hit the turtle?
 
2012-12-29 04:36:27 PM

Weaver95:
I could go on, but you get the point.  we're not consistent in what it is we say we value as a society.  what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.  'The american way'?  what does that even mean anymore?  sometimes I wonder just how much longer we can last.  we're turning inwards, becoming more self absorbed.  less concerned with knowledge, wisdom and freedom.  we're more concerned with control, greed and lust.  I think we are our own worst enemies.


You're going to criticize a politician for lying? As if this is some unique American (and, in your eyes, Republican specific) phenomena. Since your head has obviously been up your ass these past few hundred years, I've got a newsflash for you - Politicians lie in the hopes of getting elected. Once you recognize that absolute truth, maybe you'll start having more rational opinions.
 
2012-12-29 04:39:05 PM

Mentat: Oh look, a member of the media just discovered that the media are vultures.  Welcome to 1775.


What I dont understand is, if you dont LIKE what the media is reporting, TURN IT OFF, dont buy the newspaper. The real problem are the marching morons who blindly accept the "truth" of the media.
Without worshipers, fox news would go out of business.
 
2012-12-29 04:39:42 PM

ZeroCorpse: ARGH!!!!

Sow
Sow Sow
SOW SOW SOW

It's been a long day.


Sure, but you just made my day!!
 
2012-12-29 04:43:30 PM

Weaver95: as a society, we're more than a bit confused.  we hate/fear intelligence and education.  our religious beliefs are...well, 'misinformed' would be the polite way of putting it.  we love violence, but think sex is dirty.  we treat our politics like sports, and our sports like a religious cult.  we fear government control, yet cheer corporations when they pull crap that'd terrify George Orwell.  we want to make sure everyone is well armed, but are so afraid of terrorist attacks that we gate rape people before letting them get on a plane.

I could go on, but you get the point.  we're not consistent in what it is we say we value as a society.  what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.  'The american way'?  what does that even mean anymore?  sometimes I wonder just how much longer we can last.  we're turning inwards, becoming more self absorbed.  less concerned with knowledge, wisdom and freedom.  we're more concerned with control, greed and lust.  I think we are our own worst enemies.


You are either very young or just plain hate where you are living. Ignoring that obvious partisan slant as it is not like Democrats/Obama never lied (remember transparency or Green jobs for example). But you act like all this stuff is something new. Media has had a blood lust since there has been a media and it is not just in the US spend sometime overseas. Look at history some of the most written about people have been the most bloodthirsty. How many books ate there about Hitler or Stalin vs. Mother Teresa or Florence Nightingale. Who remembers the names of the victims of Jack the Ripper or John Dillinger?

Sports is the same way not just in America look at soccer thugs,. Even Cricket among those Nations that follow it rabidly India and Pakistan for example, can turn violent.

Distrust intelligence and education? I think the problem is the linking of the two. A person can be educated but not intelligent for example Ward Churchill, Peter Singer or Anthea Butler. The distrust lies in who we are calling educated and intelligent not in the characteristics themselves.

You do not like what the CIA did? Again look at your history. Was it a just nation that sent Japanese Americans to internment camps or prosecuted people under the Espionage act of 1917 for political views?

I find it a contradiction to claim to be interested in freedom while willing increasing your dependency on government by demanding it give you more free stuff and taking over doing things you should doing for yourself.

Of course we are more worried about government infringements on freedom than corporate excesses. Corporations are far easier to sue than government and it is government that can provide a shield for corporate excesses no the other way around . Throughout history government has been a far greater threat to individual liberty than any corporation It isn't xyz corporation oppressing the people of North Korea nor was it oppressing people behind the iron curtain during the cold war-government is/was.

Governments and people make mistakes we accept that. No nation as a squeaky clean history, not even Switzerland. What we hope for it that they don't keep making them. Countries should be viewed as works in progress. Some times some of the work completed needs to be remodeled.
If you want to get depressed about American get depressed about the voters on both sides.

How can obviously corrupt politicians such a Charley Rangel , John McCain (Keating Five), Ted Stevens (to be bipartisan) or John Murtha (Abscam) continuely be re-elected. In the most recent election the people of Michigan re-elected Jesse Jackson Jr, despite him being in a mental hospital and under Federal investigation. The people of Detroit elected a man to the State legislature with 8 felony convictions, It would seem there is no law against a convicted felony from holding office in the state legislature.

Why do we openly accept and live with the corruption in places like Chicago, The Texas Rio Grande Valley, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Louisana and New Jersey? These are things to get depressed about
 
2012-12-29 04:43:34 PM

OscarTamerz: The ACLU is the group most directly responsible for the increase in mass murders.


www.allmotivated.com
 
2012-12-29 04:47:14 PM
...and I think it's hilarious that Weaver95 writes several long posts with multiple issues confronting our society, and the righties focus on only one single point and basically scream "DEMOCRATS LIE TOO!!!1"
 
2012-12-29 04:49:36 PM

xalres: No. Because the people that don't want us talking about guns are generally the same people who've all but canonized the asshole who shut down all the mental hospitals, dumped the crazies out on the streets and left a generation to fester in their own sickened minds because there's no longer anywhere for them to go to get help. So yeah...don't talk about that either. Clearly, this is the result of video games and shunning Gawd.


The Supreme Court?   O'Connor v. Donaldson - 1975
I hate Saint Ronnie as much as the next guy, but this one wasnt his fault.
While it is true that funding was cut during the 80s, even if you had funding, you were not able to lock up the nuts until you could "prove" that they were a danger.

If we had funding today, what changes would we make that would have stopped columbine and all the other school massacres and waco and ruby ridge and Oklahoma and and

but yes, we need to have that conversation NOW, so we have any hope of even pretending to "fix" things
 
2012-12-29 04:53:25 PM

Alonjar: Ed Willy: Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon

Pretty sure people were being shot to death by semi-automatic magazine fed weapons a century ago.


Ah yes, but those weren't psychos, they were organized forces
 
2012-12-29 04:54:46 PM

Alonjar: Alonjar: Ed Willy: Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon

Pretty sure people were being shot to death by semi-automatic magazine fed weapons a century ago.

Oh, and before that, instead of an insane kid at your school, it was some strange dudes who would come to your village and massacre every living creature with blunderbusses.


Yes, but we don't remeber the names of those forces. A madmen back in the day couldn't do a lone mass killing with a blunderbuss. Too inaccurate and took to long to reload.
 
2012-12-29 05:00:59 PM
Eye on the TV
'cause tragedy thrills me
Whatever flavor
It happens to be like;
Killed by the husband
Drowned by the ocean
Shot by his own son
She used the poison in his tea
And kissed him goodbye
That's my kind of story
It's no fun 'til someone dies

Vicariously I, live while the whole world dies
You all need it too, don't lie
 
2012-12-29 05:13:07 PM

Weaver95: as a society, we're more than a bit confused.  we hate/fear intelligence and education.  our religious beliefs are...well, 'misinformed' would be the polite way of putting it.  we love violence, but think sex is dirty.  we treat our politics like sports, and our sports like a religious cult.  we fear government control, yet cheer corporations when they pull crap that'd terrify George Orwell.  we want to make sure everyone is well armed, but are so afraid of terrorist attacks that we gate rape people before letting them get on a plane.

I could go on, but you get the point.  we're not consistent in what it is we say we value as a society.  what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.  'The american way'?  what does that even mean anymore?  sometimes I wonder just how much longer we can last.  we're turning inwards, becoming more self absorbed.  less concerned with knowledge, wisdom and freedom.  we're more concerned with control, greed and lust.  I think we are our own worst enemies.


Yeah, I miss the good old days when Americans weren't greedy and everyone enjoyed equality. Let's see, when was that again?
 
2012-12-29 05:17:47 PM
Glorifying these guys in the media just encourages copycats.

Don't feed the trolls by giving them fame.

Reporting the news is fine, making it a three-ring circus is counterproductive.
 
2012-12-29 05:24:20 PM

had98c: The killer has one name, the victims 27. It's a lot easier to remember one name than 27. Just sayin'.

On a serious note, I don't think the media is the problem. They're just reporting what we want to see/hear. The problem is us, not the media.


It's both. The media says "Killer John Doe slays 27!" We the audience says "Oh, I wonder what else they know about Killer John Doe?" So the media obligingly tells us more about Killer John Doe. Since there's no immediate way to let the news director know we'd like to know something else--and we're watching the news about Killer John Doe--they assume we want to know more. And we do, because it is interesting.

If the media said "27 people slain! Here are their stories!" we the audience would say "Oh, how terrible, I wonder what else they know about the 27 victims" and we'd watch, and the media would tell us. It's just that over the years, news stories have gone with shorter stories (and one story about a killer is quicker than 27 about victims), the immediately newsworthy stories (stories about deadly killers need to be disseminated more than those about lawabiding victims), and the bizarre and unusual (rare killers are more interesting than normal citizens).

But media and audience feed each other. You can't blame the media alone for shoving awful images in people's unwilling faces OR blame people for demanding constant gore and the media for helplessly giving it to them. It's built up over a long period of time, and very gradually. When I was a wee lass, live news reports wouldn't even show covered bodies in the aftermath of traffic deaths or police shootings--now we routinely see people killing themselves post-car-chase LIVE ON CHANNEL 5! But it didn't happen all at once and nobody demanded to see it, nobody was calling in to Chanel 5 saying, Hey, we don't like that you cut away right before the perp gets shot down by the cops. If there's a problem it's that they showed it, and everybody didn't complain about it.
 
2012-12-29 05:55:09 PM
Gyrfalcon:But media and audience feed each other. You can't blame the media alone for shoving awful images in people's unwilling faces OR blame people for demanding constant gore and the media for helplessly giving it to them. It's built up over a long period of time, and very gradually. When I was a wee lass, live news reports wouldn't even show covered bodies in the aftermath of traffic deaths or police shootings--now we routinely see people killing themselves post-car-chase LIVE ON CHANNEL 5! But it didn't happen all at once and nobody demanded to see it, nobody was calling in to Chanel 5 saying, Hey, we don't like that you cut away right before the perp gets shot down by the cops. If there's a problem it's that they showed it, and everybody didn't complain about it.

Yeah I remember being about 6 and going to visit my grandparents... my grandfather was watching the Detroit news and they were talking about a drive by shooting. The reporter walked over by the snow drift one of the victims had fallen on top of (reporter arrived late, paramedics had already taken the bodies) and there was blood, bits of skull etc all over it. I'd never seen that before. I do remember a lot of stations, as you said, cutting away right before the person shot themselves/got shot by police etc.
 
2012-12-29 05:59:07 PM
2009-01-23: Azaz-ur-Rehman, 14, Pakistani
2009-02-14: Noor Syed, 8, Pakistani
2009-08-11: Ibad Ullah, teenager, Pakistani
2009-08-11: Mohammad Arif, teenager, Pakistani
2009-08-11: Abdul Qadeer, teenager, Pakistani
2009-08-11: Hazrat Ali, teenager, Pakistani
2009-08-21: Syed Wali Shah, 7, Pakistani
2009-08-21: Naeemullah,?, Pakistani
2009-08-21: Faizullah,?, Pakistani
2009-08-21: Rahima,?, Pakistani
2009-08-21: Shaista,?, Pakistani
2009-11-20: Sakeenullah, 15, Pakistani
2009-12-31: Zaenullah Khan, 17, Pakistani
2009-12-17: Nasser Mohammed Nasser, 6, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Arwa Mohammed Nasser, 4, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Fatima Mohammed Nasser, 2, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Afrah Ali Mohammed Nasser, 9, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Zayda Ali Mohammed Nasser, 7, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Hoda Ali Mohammed Nasser, 5, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Sheikha Ali Mohammed Nasser, 4, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Asmaa Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye, 9, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Salma Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye, 4, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Fatima Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye, 3, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Khadije Ali Mokbel Louqye, 1, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Hanaa Ali Mokbel Louqye, 6, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Mohammed Ali Mokbel Salem Louqye, 4, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Jawass Mokbel Salem Louqye, 15, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Sheikha Nasser Mahdi Ahmad Bouh, 3, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Soumaya Mohammed Saleh Mohammed, 9, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Shafika Mohammed Saleh Mohammed, 4, Yemeni
2009-12-17: Shafiq Mohammed Saleh Mohammed, 2, Yemeni
2010-01-03: Wajid Noor, 9, Pakistani
2010-01-08: Ayeesha, 3, Pakistani
2010-02-24: Naila, 10, Pakistani
2010-05-21: Fatima, ?, Pakistani
2010-05-21: Nisar, ?, Pakistani
2010-05-21: Naeem Khan, ?, Pakistani
2010-10-18: Naeem Ullah, 10, Pakistani
2011-06-15: Shahzada, ?, Pakistani
2011-10-14: Abdel-Rahman Anwar al-Awlaki, 16, American
2011-10-14: Ahmed Abdel-Rahman al-Awlaki, 17, Yemeni
2011-10-31: Tariq Aziz, 16, Pakistani
2011-10-31: Waheed, ?, Pakistani
2012-08-21: Osama Haqqani, 13, Pakistani
2012-09-02: Mabrook Mouqbal Al Qadari, 13, Yemeni
2012-09-02: Daolah Nasser, 10, Yemeni
2012-09-02: AbedalGhani Mohammed Mabkhout, 12, Yemeni
 
2012-12-29 06:01:21 PM
Maybe not all of them do it for fame, but they get the idea from the news. The Columbine kids said in their journals they wanted to one up Kip Kinkle and knew movies would be made about them. Cho called them martyrs and sent videos of himself to the news, which was played for days. So some of these psychos definitely do it for fame. The guy in tasmania mentioned the Dunblane massacre and was pleased at his kill count. Anders Brevik is enjoying his fame more-so since he didn't kill himself.
 
2012-12-29 06:08:41 PM
The victims are just average people. It's tragic they died but there is nothing particularly remarkable about them. To society, their individual identities will not be remembered. The killer, obviously, is not an average person. He's done something that most of us will never even contemplate. We don't love him or admire him, but he leaves a mark through his actions.

Not to Godwin but think of Hitler. Very few people would look upon his accomplishments as good but he is one of the most famous, or rather infamous/notorious, persons in all of history.

The fact that we remember a person for something terrible isn't bad IMHO.
 
2012-12-29 06:43:28 PM

mittromneysdog: "We remember the killers' names, but not the names of the victims. We know the gory details. Media bloodlust is killing us as a society"

This is an idiotic point for several reasons.

1) In mass shootings, there are multiple victims, but only one killer.

2) The identities of the shooters are important, newsworthy public information. Except in general terms, the identities of the victims are not. This is not because of any moral judgment positive or negative of either the shooters or the victims. It is simply because the shooter did something newsworthy, while the victims really did not.

3) Publicizing the identities of the shooters involves fewer privacy issues for victims and families than publicizing the identities of the victims. I feel for the families of the shooters, I really do. But there is no question that the newsworthiness of the shooters' identities outweighs their privacy concerns. For the victims, this is less clear.

I mean, why do we remember Hitler's name, but not the names of his millions of innocent victims? Historians' blood lust is killing our world, because there is clearly causation between mass homicidal tyranny and what gets written about in the history books.

That argument is only marginally dumber than the the argument offered in the headline.


I have seen the "we know the name of the killers, but not of the victims" argument quite a few times in the last couple of weeks and it has really irritated me.

The dead didn't ask to be part of a major news story. Some of their families talk to the media, but most prefer to withdraw and mourn in peace. That means it will be harder to get to know them. Plus, we don't actually get an accurate picture of them anyway. No one wants to speak ill of the dead, so they're presented in glowing, glossy terms that make them seem like characters in a tragedy and not real people.

The assailant, on the other hand, we free to talk about the light and dark aspects of his character and get a more complete picture of who he was. So of course it'll be easier to remember his name.

I can actually remember some victim names (Alex Sullivan, Rachel Scott, Rebecca Wingo and Anne Frank.), but not because I'm a more concerned citizen than the next person. It's just because something about them struck a chord with me and their names got stuck in my memory bank.

DRTFA, by the way.
 
2012-12-29 06:56:44 PM
we should ban freedom of the press, and let the government run the news.
they know how to treat sensitive subjects better than anyone not in government.
time for government to remove all these pesky 'rights' people abuse daily...
 
2012-12-29 07:00:27 PM

RanDomino: 2011-10-31: Tariq Aziz, 16, Pakistani
2011-10-31: Waheed, ?, Pakistani
2012-08-21: Osama Haqqani, 13, Pakistani
2012-09-02: Mabrook Mouqbal Al Qadari, 13, Yemeni
2012-09-02: Daolah Nasser, 10, Yemeni
2012-09-02: AbedalGhani Mohammed Mabkhout, 12, Yemeni


Union Carbide -- 2259 dead, 500,000 injured, Bhopal
BP Exploration -- 4 dead, Gulf of Mexico
BP Exploration -- 15 dead, Texas City
Massey Energy --29 dead, Montcoal, WV...
 
rka
2012-12-29 07:01:28 PM

Gyrfalcon: If the media said "27 people slain! Here are their stories!"


What do you mean if? Haven't we basically gotten a biographical overview of every kid yet? We knew after Columbine which ones were devout Christians and which ones were football players, we knew after the movie theater shootings which ones were just out of the Army or which ones were just divorced.

A day after the Sandy Hook massacre we had this in the Washington Post (first one that came up on google, there are thousands more)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/nation/newtown-school-sh o oting-victims/

Sorry folks, the information is there. If you're railing against the media for not reporting this stuff about the victims then you need to look a bit harder at your own filters because they did. Were you too busy to pay attention? Had to go see The Hobbit that night so you couldn't be bothered to read a bit more? Needed to rush out and buy that last minute piece of junk for a Christmas present so you turned off the TV? Too busy requesting BIE in some TotalFark thread? Mundane shiat piled upon mundane shiat.

But now you've got a few minutes in a Fark thread and you have time to type out a few words and feel superior. Shame on you.
 
2012-12-29 07:18:11 PM
If it bleeds, it leads.
 
2012-12-29 07:19:23 PM

Ed Willy: letrole: HotWingConspiracy: So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.

Guns have always been there. Government used to be much smaller. Conservatives resist change to the status quo.

Yet the video-game emulation sort of killing spree is indubitably a new phenomenon.

How about no.

Semi-automatic high capacity guns useful for a killing spree are indubitably a new phenomenon


Only for over a century
 
2012-12-29 07:27:45 PM
Matthew Keene: I still don't know who killed JFK>

Lee Harvey Oswald, acting alone from the book depository building
 
2012-12-29 07:41:30 PM
Dying isn't that unusual.
I plan to die myself one day.
 
2012-12-29 07:44:45 PM

God-is-a-Taco: Dying isn't that unusual.
I plan to die myself one day.


Well, that's a stupid plan. Me, I plan to live forever. The odds are against me but maybe I'll get lucky.
 
2012-12-29 08:03:03 PM

Weaver95: as a society, we're more than a bit confused.  we hate/fear intelligence and education.  our religious beliefs are...well, 'misinformed' would be the polite way of putting it.  we love violence, but think sex is dirty.  we treat our politics like sports, and our sports like a religious cult.  we fear government control, yet cheer corporations when they pull crap that'd terrify George Orwell.  we want to make sure everyone is well armed, but are so afraid of terrorist attacks that we gate rape people before letting them get on a plane.

I could go on, but you get the point.  we're not consistent in what it is we say we value as a society.  what DOES America stand for these days?  Truth?  not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle.  Justice?  can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'?  I think not.  'The american way'?  what does that even mean anymore?  sometimes I wonder just how much longer we can last.  we're turning inwards, becoming more self absorbed.  less concerned with knowledge, wisdom and freedom.  we're more concerned with control, greed and lust.  I think we are our own worst enemies.


i50.tinypic.com
I wonder what historians will say about us...
 
2012-12-29 08:07:34 PM

Bit'O'Gristle: Of course they are vultures. [lots of truth]...


I would simply tell them....
 
2012-12-29 08:10:24 PM

Matthew Keene: I'm always rooting for a higher kill score. Twenty-seven was impressive, but we can do better.


Congratulations!  That may very well be the worst troll attempt I have seen on the internet.
Wow, Just Wow . . .

Score:  -10 / potatoE
 
2012-12-29 08:11:46 PM

Zombie DJ: I remember Hitlers name but, gun to my head, couldn't tell you 5 people he killed.


a Jew,  a Jew,  a Jew,  a Jew,  a Jew

/bless me
//isle seat please
 
2012-12-29 08:35:02 PM

rka: Gyrfalcon: If the media said "27 people slain! Here are their stories!"

What do you mean if? Haven't we basically gotten a biographical overview of every kid yet? We knew after Columbine which ones were devout Christians and which ones were football players, we knew after the movie theater shootings which ones were just out of the Army or which ones were just divorced.

A day after the Sandy Hook massacre we had this in the Washington Post (first one that came up on google, there are thousands more)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/nation/newtown-school-sh o oting-victims/

Sorry folks, the information is there. If you're railing against the media for not reporting this stuff about the victims then you need to look a bit harder at your own filters because they did. Were you too busy to pay attention? Had to go see The Hobbit that night so you couldn't be bothered to read a bit more? Needed to rush out and buy that last minute piece of junk for a Christmas present so you turned off the TV? Too busy requesting BIE in some TotalFark thread? Mundane shiat piled upon mundane shiat.

But now you've got a few minutes in a Fark thread and you have time to type out a few words and feel superior. Shame on you.


Really? It was on every day like the news about the shooter? It was on every hour like the news about the shooter? It was on INSTEAD of news about the shooter? It was on in 30-second sound bites like news about the shooter?

And you were so outraged you only got to the first sentence of my post that you didn't bother to read to the end where I noted that this has been an ongoing process over many years and isn't something that's just happened lately? Shame on you.
 
2012-12-29 09:08:34 PM
Zombie DJ: I remember Hitlers name but, gun to my head, couldn't tell you 5 people he killed.

I don't think I could name 5 random people killed because they was Jews or Gypsies, or Homosexuals or what not, but I could name 5 July 20th conspirators or 5 SA leaders killed in the Night of the long knives
 
2012-12-29 09:21:12 PM
How the media usually remembers it:

Assault weapon Glock
Assault weapon ak-47
Assault weapon Glock
Assault weapon ak-47
Glock Glock Glock
Assault weapon Glock
Assault weapon ak-47
ak-47
ak-47
Assault weapon
Assault weapon
Assault weapon
Assault weapon
Assault weapon
 
2012-12-29 09:52:48 PM
A business who's job is to attract the most veiwers for ad revenue can use cheap shock and awe jouranlism? No way, don't believe it.

And like everything else that screws something over for a buck, pretty much every business in this country, we have to put up with it because capitalism duh.
 
2012-12-29 10:00:58 PM
That is why I am making sure that I remember the name "Victoria Soto." She hid her kids in closets and cabinets, and stood between them and Psycho Emo Philips.
 
2012-12-29 10:29:50 PM

Matthew Keene: I'm always rooting for a higher kill score. Twenty-seven was impressive, but we can do better.


Here is a story with 67. It's almost like follow the leader...but who would want to be like them?
 
2012-12-29 10:31:12 PM

fatassbastard: OscarTamerz: The ACLU is the group most directly responsible for the increase in mass murders.

[www.allmotivated.com image 600x480]


Erm, mega means million
 
2012-12-29 10:32:59 PM

HindiDiscoMonster: I wonder what historians will say about us...


Probably shiat just as incorrect as we say about people in the past now. And they can suck it, for all I care. They are mostly pricks.
 
2012-12-29 10:37:33 PM
It's really more bullets killing us as a society.
 
2012-12-29 10:47:14 PM

trappedspirit: Erm, mega means million


Here you go.

You're welcome!
 
2012-12-29 10:52:25 PM

99.998er: gibbon1: I don't remember the guy in Colorado's name, or that guy who shot all those school kids.

Alferd Packer was the Colorado guy.


Let's build a snowman!
 
2012-12-29 11:23:02 PM

HotWingConspiracy: letrole: Spree shootings are caused by a lack of personal restraint. In some cases, such as Charles Whitman, the fellow was suffering from madness with an organic cause ie a brain tumour. He left diaries and letters that showed jumbled and irrational thoughts.

But in nearly all cases, this lack of personal restraint comes from the breakdown of society.

1. If suicide is no longer a sin,
2. If public disobedience and defiance against authority are glorified,
3. If fame or celebrity is rewarded without merit,
4. If Right and Wrong are no longer absolute,
5. If erratic behaviour is no longer shameful,
6. If internal or self justification is held as a virtue,

-- then it will all continue along this path until society completely collapses, and a new order reforms from the ashes

So basically small government conservative gun owners brought this about.


2/10
2,4,5,6 apply in spades to people on the left.
 
2012-12-30 12:02:46 AM

Mentat: Oh look, a member of the media just discovered that the media are vultures.  Welcome to 1775.


The media are vultures?

The media provides a service, hopefully for a profit. To make a profit, they produce what sells, within legal limits. On a high level, Warner Brothers, CBS, Time, etc. operate no differently than GE or Ford.

Every time a professional sport like NFL attempts to make the sport safer, people get on websites like Fark and complain about the "pussification of America". When doctors talk about the dangers of head trauma in sports, people wail and moan that the doctors are going to make sports "boring". When NASCAR has a relatively problem-free race, ratings drop. When Hollywood releases summer movies, the movies that are "blockbusters" are the action movies, not the comedies and romances. Cable companies show boxing matches as pay-per-view because they know people will pay to view it. CBS brought Ultimate Fighting to broadcast TV because it was damned popular. And look at some of the most popular TV shows on the airwaves here in the US: Game of Thrones. Dexter. The older folks watch a whole slew of CSI shows, and Criminal Minds. They're all violent.

Why does the media do it?

Because it sells.

Why is mass media supposedly bloodthirsty?

They aren't. They're just selling a good. You're bloodthirsty, America.
 
2012-12-30 12:08:22 AM
1. Yes, media overcoverage of mass shootings DOES lead to more mass shootings. Virtually every school/mall shooter was obsessed with Columbine, et. al.
2. No, mass shootings are not a major health threat. They freak people out, but the odds of dying in a mass shooting are about the same as the odds of being killed by a beesting.
 
2012-12-30 12:18:22 AM

fatassbastard: trappedspirit: Erm, mega means million

Here you go.

You're welcome!


Mega is now slang? So a megabyte is just some larger than a dozen number of bytes? Weird planet in yo head.
 
2012-12-30 12:29:39 AM

mbillips: 1. Yes, media overcoverage of mass shootings DOES lead to more mass shootings. Virtually every school/mall shooter was obsessed with Columbine, et. al.
2. No, mass shootings are not a major health threat. They freak people out, but the odds of dying in a mass shooting are about the same as the odds of being killed by a beesting.


So, people are incapable of taking responsibility for their own actions.
 
2012-12-30 12:33:03 AM

GORDON: They got obama elected, so who cares? Let them have their sick perversions, as long as the important things are getting done.


Blame the media x2. You must buy Prep H by the case. The media follow the law of supply and demand. The mega corporations running the media wouldn't do anything if it didn't make them money. Like Weaver said this is a sick country and we want sick shiat from the media.
 
2012-12-30 12:36:35 AM

hasty ambush: In the most recent election the people of Michigan re-elected Jesse Jackson Jr, despite him being in a mental hospital and under Federal investigation


That explains a lot; we have the assholes in MI voting for Illinois representatives now. Stick to your own elections, Michigan!
 
2012-12-30 12:37:03 AM

skinink: What a bunch of crock. Of course we can remember all the names, like I remember the name of John Wilkes Booth and the guy he killed with the beard and the stovepipe hat.


Booth killed someone using a hat and a beard? I did not know that.
 
2012-12-30 12:42:51 AM

letrole: letrole: Government used to be smaller. That refers to less expenditure, number of federal employees, as well as the scope of areas that various departments administer and control

cameroncrazy1984: The population used to be smaller too, didn't it, Mr. Troll.

Yes. And there used to be only 48 states. Then they added Alaska and Hawaii. And before aeroplanes were invented, the FAA didn't exist. You go ahead and let those random thoughts continue to bounce around inside your skull. But don't come back until something relevant pops out.

And my surname is Le Trôle.


how do you know he was talking about you, eh?
 
2012-12-30 12:43:05 AM

trappedspirit: Mega is now slang? So a megabyte is just some larger than a dozen number of bytes? Weird planet in yo head.


Does the Mega Millions Lottery really have a million millions?

Does Mega Foods really have a million foods?

Do Mega Bloks really have a million bloks?

Does UrbanDictionary know anything about slang?
 
2012-12-30 12:43:52 AM

Bucky Katt: mega corporations


*snerk*
 
2012-12-30 12:51:35 AM

fatassbastard: trappedspirit: Mega is now slang? So a megabyte is just some larger than a dozen number of bytes? Weird planet in yo head.

Does the Mega Millions Lottery really have a million millions?

Does Mega Foods really have a million foods?

Do Mega Bloks really have a million bloks?

Does UrbanDictionary know anything about slang?


Are bears Catholic? Does the pope shiat in the woods?
 
2012-12-30 01:18:53 AM

fatassbastard: trappedspirit: Mega is now slang? So a megabyte is just some larger than a dozen number of bytes? Weird planet in yo head.

Does the Mega Millions Lottery really have a million millions?

Does Mega Foods really have a million foods?

Do Mega Bloks really have a million bloks?

Does UrbanDictionary know anything about slang?


Wow, that was epic. Take your blood pressure medication before you mega post.
 
2012-12-30 01:27:06 AM

trappedspirit: Take your blood pressure medication before you mega post.


Wow... the "you're so angry" schtick...

G'night, man.
 
2012-12-30 01:34:26 AM

fatassbastard: trappedspirit: Take your blood pressure medication before you mega post.

Wow... the "you're so angry" schtick...

G'night, man.


Wow
 
2012-12-30 01:46:21 AM

theMightyRegeya: Why is mass media supposedly bloodthirsty?

They aren't. They're just selling a good. You're bloodthirsty, America.


Just wait until we arm everybody!*

Bloodlust isn't just limited to "ambulance chasing" events.

We enjoy watching failure. We thrive on schadenfreude. (That's probably a big reason why we come to Fark.) And I think Conservatives are the most bloodthirsty:
+ They're just fine with having this country step off the fiscal cliff. Our credit rating got taken down a notch? They will still turn around and say, "Ha ha, look what happened when you re-elected Savior Obama. See, look what horrible shape this country is in." Yes, they would cut off our nose to spite our face.
+ You're sick? Sorry, lazy bones. Why don't you have a job or health insurance? You should have planned better.
+ We need guns for protection. Plus, we don't need "rule of law" when we can dispense justice ourselves and save the taxpayers some money. Every transgression could come with the death penalty and the perpetrator is guilty of bringing it upon themselves, even when the punishment doesn't fit the crime. ("'Trespassing?' *blam blam* I thought my life was in danger!")
+ Pro-life? No, it's more like, "You got pregnant? The consequences are yours to face." or "We're pro-life, until you're born, and then you're responsible for your own sorry state. Or for dying because you intruded on my property and I felt threatened."

*See [He's] coming right for us! *blam* *blam*
/For starting us down this road, I guess I blame... *spins wheel* America's Funniest Home Videos. (Huh.)
 
2012-12-30 01:54:06 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95: what DOES America stand for these days? Truth? not after the lies Romney told during this last election cycle. Justice? can any country that created/funded and runs secret CIA torture prisons be considered 'just'? I think not.

you whine about Romney's campaign lies but say nothing about 0bama's campaign lies.
then you whine about CIA torture prisons but you say nothing about 0bama killing US Citizens without benefit of trial via drones, much less how he runs the Justice Department or Homeland security.

So what DOES your America stand for these days? Based on your post, it stands for partisan hackery.


You're as bad as letrole when it comes to repeating lies and bullshiat. Time to find a new act, mod alt shill.

Someone who publicly denounces their citizenship, flees the country, hooks up with his new allies in their home country, and actively aids them in spreading terror and death against his former country is no longer a citizen. He is an enemy combatant, and is treated as such.
 
2012-12-30 02:05:02 AM
Let's see...
Brandon Flowers
Dave Keuning
Mark Stoermer
Ronnie Vannucci, Jr.

Victims: my ears.
 
2012-12-30 03:02:28 AM

mbillips: 2. No, mass shootings are not a major health threat. They freak people out, but the odds of dying in a mass shooting are about the same as the odds of being killed by a beesting.


Yep.

People are finally starting to come around to the idea that kids are rarely ever kidnapped by strangers despite that type of kidnapping being severely overrepresented in the media.
Hundreds, maybe thousands of kids are kidnapped each year, but by relatives in custody disputes and other assorted crap. We hear a few of them, but are bombarded by stories about the couple dozen who are kidnapped by strangers. Usually the overall kidnapping stats are usually tossed out in a such a way to mislead people into thinking that thousands of kids are kidnapped by strangers when in reality the kids are more likely to die or be injured by nearly anything else.

Hundreds of kids under the age of 7 died this year from abuse, yet no one runs wall-to-wall coverage of it.
We get stats on firearm homicides as a while (something like 10,000 each year) in discussions about "assault weapon" bans despite the fact that the targeted scary firearms (primarily semi-auto rifles) are only one type of rifle, and all rifles together are around 3-3.5% of firearm homicide and around 1-1.5% of all homicides, so we're using large scary numbers to justify bans on things used in a fraction of a fraction of killings.

Mass killings are exceptionally rare. Maybe 200 people killed across the country all year?. Out of the 26,000 pople killed each year, it's not even whole number percentages (~0.7%). Each one is sad, but no sadder than the other 25,800.
 
2012-12-30 03:09:20 AM

pedrop357: mbillips: 2. No, mass shootings are not a major health threat. They freak people out, but the odds of dying in a mass shooting are about the same as the odds of being killed by a beesting.

Yep.

People are finally starting to come around to the idea that kids are rarely ever kidnapped by strangers despite that type of kidnapping being severely overrepresented in the media.
Hundreds, maybe thousands of kids are kidnapped each year, but by relatives in custody disputes and other assorted crap. We hear a few of them, but are bombarded by stories about the couple dozen who are kidnapped by strangers. Usually the overall kidnapping stats are usually tossed out in a such a way to mislead people into thinking that thousands of kids are kidnapped by strangers when in reality the kids are more likely to die or be injured by nearly anything else.

Hundreds of kids under the age of 7 died this year from abuse, yet no one runs wall-to-wall coverage of it.
We get stats on firearm homicides as a while (something like 10,000 each year) in discussions about "assault weapon" bans despite the fact that the targeted scary firearms (primarily semi-auto rifles) are only one type of rifle, and all rifles together are around 3-3.5% of firearm homicide and around 1-1.5% of all homicides, so we're using large scary numbers to justify bans on things used in a fraction of a fraction of killings.

Mass killings are exceptionally rare. Maybe 200 people killed across the country all year?. Out of the 26,000 pople killed each year, it's not even whole number percentages (~0.7%). Each one is sad, but no sadder than the other 25,800.


Still a good idea to address the causes for them and try to lower it even more, wouldn't you agree? I mean, you DO prefer a safer, non-crazy America, right?
 
2012-12-30 03:36:13 AM

Keizer_Ghidorah: Still a good idea to address the causes for them and try to lower it even more, wouldn't you agree? I mean, you DO prefer a safer, non-crazy America, right?


Maybe, but only solutions that aren't sweeping infringements on rights with the insulting bonus that they won't actually help the problem in question. Mass killers have managed high body counts with far less weaponry then a semi-auto rifle; one killer in England managed 12 killed, 11 injured with a .22 caliber rifle and double barrel shotgun.

I said maybe, because we may just have to accept that many solutions will either be completely or almost completely ineffective and/or unacceptably costly in terms of money, time, or freedom.

About the only thing that could really stop mass killings or at least make a large dent in them is a full out ban and confiscation on firearms. That would probably cut the already very small number from 200 down to say 30, but the costs are enormous if our experience is anything like the UK or Australia where crime went up after their gun bans. We would still have gun crime and plenty of murders just like those two countries. With our country's penchant for killing each other, there's a good chance every large/dense city could have a crime rate like DC or Chicago.

I talk of full out bans because nothing else will make even a dent in mass killings-the very very small number of killers* will find any bans on magazine size or scary looking guns to be a minor impediment to what they plan to do.

I only talk of mass killings because the day-to-day killings will continue unabated with or without guns because their problems are far more numerous and/or complex then simply availability of guns. The non-firearm murder rate everywhere and the firearm murder rate in handgun ban happy DC & Chicago (pre-SCOTUS cases) show that pretty well.

BTW, has anyone considered the futility, stupidity, or outright inappropriateness of basically allowing the bad acts of 15 or 20 people (the killers) to determine how national policy gets shaped?
 
2012-12-30 07:52:19 AM
its not the media, its being human. haven't you ever waited through a traffic jam on the highway only to find it was purely about people rubbernecking a crash? the media give readers what they want. if you don't like it, go learn the names of the victims and do your best to better society n e long run.
 
2012-12-30 08:23:48 AM
trappedspirit: fatassbastard: OscarTamerz: The ACLU is the group most directly responsible for the increase in mass murders.

[www.allmotivated.com image 600x480]

Erm, mega means million


According to Webster's 1 vast 2 of the highest level of rank, excellence, or importance. Neither of those has anything to do with the number 1 million, So quit butchering the Queen's English and trying to use it for that.
 
2012-12-30 10:05:26 AM
letrole: Government used to be smaller.
cameroncrazy1984: The population used to be smaller too, didn't it, Mr. Troll.
letrole:Yes. And there used to be only 48 states. And my surname is Le Trôle.
Bucky Katt: how do you know he was talking about you, eh?

Because he responded to a post that I made. If you ever have any doubts about your ability to read and comprehend, just remember this thread.
 
2012-12-30 10:10:27 AM
Keizer_Ghidorah: You're as bad as letrole when it comes to repeating lies and bullshiat. Time to find a new act, mod alt shill.


And that was the amusing call of the yellow-belly butthurt cuckoo.
 
2012-12-30 11:43:12 AM
It's because we get off on details about the crime. The blood, the gore, the planning, the mindset, what the killer thought and felt, how their clothes felt against their skin, all of it. It's a form of arousal. No, the bloody execution of dozens of school kids in and of itself isn't erotic, but the crime is. People don't like to admit it, but it's those details the people yearn for, need, gain satisfaction out of reading. We're sick farks and that's not about to change.
 
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