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(ABC)   Newspaper helpfully publishes names and addresses of local houses not to rob while occupied. Hilarity is ensuing   (abcnews.go.com) divider line 535
    More: Stupid, Putnam County  
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23231 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Dec 2012 at 11:11 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-25 02:14:52 PM

moonscatter: I'm aware safes can be broken into, that, however does not excuse not using one.


Note I suggested no such thing, and lock my weapons up as well.

However, advertising where weapons are kept, so that an enterprising criminal doesn't have to look hard to find one, is still a bad idea.
 
2012-12-25 02:16:12 PM
Wow, this is 1 hell of a train wreck troll thread.

/ejecting!
 
2012-12-25 02:17:14 PM

ParaHandy: Authoritarianism is a goal of the right

political class / rich / people already in power.

It generally applies across the board, regardless of professed ideology.
 
2012-12-25 02:20:44 PM

Eatin' Queer Fetuses for Jesus: What, don't all you tough-guy six-shootin' cowboys want everyone to know how big and bad you are with your big bad guns? Pussies. Learn to fist-fight, like a real man.


I can fist-fight just fine, but I won't if I can help it.

I'll avoid any fight I possibly can. I happily walk away (or run), swallow my pride, whatever it takes if I can get away without violence.

If I absolutely can't avoid it though, if they give me absolutely no choice about fighting, I don't owe them a "fair" fight. There's no rules and no ref to enforce them. People get killed even in ordinary fist fights and that's not a risk I'm willing to take.
 
2012-12-25 02:23:07 PM
papundits.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-12-25 02:23:21 PM

chumboobler: Bell-fan: IamKaiserSoze!!!: God, but zealots do some thoroughly brain dead stuff. I mean, that's Westboro Baptist crazy.

I hope those assholes lose every gun owners subscription, as well as those who don't own guns but still have common sense. Advertisers should be dropping them right and left too.

Fire the editor and whatever writers were involved with this.

I'll go further than that... I say that the paper should be seized, it's license to do business pulled, and the entire enterprise disbanded. This is civic irresponsibility. The Editor and whoever runs the paper should be jailed under the same laws that ban yelling "fire" in a crowded theater.

This is just plain westboro baptist church crazy and irresponsible.

The proceeds of the sale of the newspaper and its entire holding should go to the people whose names were published.

This is flat outright invasion of privacy. I understand that need to publish stories of interest, but these people are not public figures, and as such they have a reasonable expectation of privacy and that others will not publish their names for perfectly law abiding behavior.

Oh and gun control advocates... you just lost me right there. You've just shown that your cause is run by crazies that'll do any irresponsible thing that they can to get what they want. That sort of fanaticism need to be curb stomped.

I'm not saying I agree with what the paper did but there is no law against it. If the information is available thru an FOIA request then it is in the public domain already. All the paper did was display information available to anyone in a highly public manner. Was it the right thing to do? Not in my opinion. Was it illegal? Nope.

People need to stop all the "ban all guns" and "from my cold dead hand" crap. There is a place of balance where we can put safety first and still respect the rights afforded by the 2nd Amendment. If you go into a discussion with the hate and fear at max levels, nothing productive can come from it. ...


If more people were like you, we might actually come up with something worth talking about, not something so divisive that it kills any chance of success.
 
2012-12-25 02:23:55 PM

s2s2s2: TheDirtyNacho: I know you jest, but Texas, which has recently attempted to prevent Planned Parenthood from getting any money (even the clinics that don't perform abortions), realized that the loss of family planning clinics would result is an extra $273 million a year in taxpayer costs due to unplanned birth care.

I got a kick out of that.



The legislative focus on PP is baffling. Only 3% of their services performed are abortion related. The rest are providing affordable birth control, STD testing, gynecological care and other reproductive health services. In Texas especially, in many rural and immigrant heavy areas Planned Parenthood is the only clinic for gynecology services for women without health insurance. In those same areas, the majority of women do not have health insurance.
 
2012-12-25 02:24:06 PM
Publishing public information? Like they do for people who have been arrested but not convicted? Or any other of a million embarrassing things it's legal to publish?
 
2012-12-25 02:25:08 PM
The people that should be pissed are the ones that DON'T own guns. Now everone knows that they have to legal way to defend themselves. This is just plain batshiat crazy.Well, legal gun owners. Those houses may illegally own homes.
 
2012-12-25 02:26:22 PM

computerguyUT: England has 1/5 the the population of the US and their Violent crime is 4x ours


Wow, do you really believe this? Amazing. I don't know whether to feel sorry for you or be impressed by your trolling.

computerguyUT: They have also recently banned cricket bats in public.


LOL. You really are a retard. No, I take it back, you're right - we have to smuggle them around in paper bags, really, we do. It's made matches on the village green very tricky for us.

And, just for the record, I have zero problems with keeping under-18s away from giant knives - it's just common sense; something America seems to have lost since Clinton.

Seriously, people like you give Americans such a bad image abroad, it's such a shame. But you wouldn't care... I'll bet you don't even own a passport.

\Happy Festivus
 
2012-12-25 02:26:42 PM

gunsmack: So you publish folks who, like myself, have handgun permits. Keep in mind that some states require no such permit for shotguns and rifles.


No one is worried about shotguns and rifles. Of course shotguns and rifles and revolvers do not work for home defense.
 
2012-12-25 02:30:49 PM
Without reading through the litany of Fark comments, I hope someone has pointed out that this little stunt effectively points out to potential home invaders which houses in the area are unarmed (at least concerning legal registry) and therefore shows which houses would be safest to rob.
 
2012-12-25 02:31:00 PM
This introduction of abortion into a gun control thread is most puzzling. It's not that relevant.

Actually, it may just be. If you have a hankering to make a big fuss over a couple dozen murdered kids, just have a poke in the big bucket behind the clinic.
 
2012-12-25 02:33:24 PM
This is why all of my guns are unregistered.
Just like my sex offenses.
Any my nurses.
And my securities.
And my apps.
And my cohabitants.
And my OLE objects.
And my easements

/But not my annoyance at the quasi-political attention-whore-outrage nonsense which always fills threads like this. That sort of thing is outrageous.
 
2012-12-25 02:35:17 PM

mwfark: Without reading through the litany of Fark comments, I hope someone has pointed out that this little stunt effectively points out to potential home invaders which houses in the area are unarmed (at least concerning legal registry) and therefore shows which houses would be safest to rob.


As has been pointed out, my shotguns and rifles are not listed. And, if you just wait for those listed to leave their house, you know you can break in and steal guns.
 
2012-12-25 02:35:40 PM
These are the same people that saw no problem with hard-right anti-abortionist sites posting abortion doctors names, addresses, and photos online and outright calling them murderers.

fark em.

You want to own a gun it's going into public records where people can aggregate the information and post it online. Don't like it? Don't own a gun. Your right to bear arms has not been infringed, only your right to bear arms secretly.
 
2012-12-25 02:36:05 PM

mwfark: Without reading through the litany of Fark comments, I hope someone has pointed out that this little stunt effectively points out to potential home invaders which houses in the area are unarmed (at least concerning legal registry) and therefore shows which houses would be safest to rob.


I do not own a gun.

But I can promise you that it would not be safe or wise to try and rob me.
 
2012-12-25 02:37:00 PM

Uisce Beatha: moonscatter: I'm aware safes can be broken into, that, however does not excuse not using one.

Note I suggested no such thing, and lock my weapons up as well.

However, advertising where weapons are kept, so that an enterprising criminal doesn't have to look hard to find one, is still a bad idea.


Do you know an easier way to find out who has funs? Facebook. They are all over talking about the issues, hinting season etc. or the idiots posting coments after the Newtown articles. Follow any sticker-laden pick up truck out of a Gander Mountain parking lot. Heck, look for the guy making a big deal about cleaning his gun at the campsite next to yours. Raid a boys out storage facility.it isn't like this is unknown information.

And if you dont like it, get the equivalent of HIPAA passed with the exception that the cops do get to know who you are.
 
2012-12-25 02:38:48 PM
This sounds a lot like the local Nazi Party newspaper publishing the names and addresses of all the local Jews.
 
2012-12-25 02:40:35 PM

Amos Quito: PopularFront: This version of the article contains the the following:

"Editor's note: Journal News reporter Dwight R. Worley owns a Smith & Wesson 686 .357 Magnum and has had a residence permit in New York City for that weapon since February 2011."

Dwight R. Worley is the reporter who wrote the story. These gun owners were outed by one of their own.


Well, I just clicked every dot in NYC, and his name / address isn't there.

Say, you don't suppose he edited his OWN name and address out for some reason, do you?


A 2 minute glance over teh Google yielded this. 2nd post on the page.

http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/news-good-bad-ugly/154729-gun-own e rs-names-addresses-published-new-york-s-journal-news-2.html
 
2012-12-25 02:42:35 PM

theotherles: This sounds a lot like the local Nazi Party newspaper publishing the names and addresses of all the local Jews.


Did you really just equate this stupid act with the setup of the largest systematic genocide ever conducted in history? This is nowhere even close to the same thing. It was a poorly thought out political stunt. The Nazi's were setting up the EXTERMINATION of an entire race. The phone book publishes names and addresses too, they are just like Hitler.
 
2012-12-25 02:44:17 PM
If I was one of the gun owners lited, I wouldn't be upset. Can be sure anyone in the area that burglarizes homes will consult that map to determine which houses not hit.

I would be upset if I didn't have a gun and this farking paper broadcast that information to every criminal in the area.
 
2012-12-25 02:47:51 PM

RexTalionis: Pfaw, public records. I could've gotten the same information if I go to the local town halls.


I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.
 
2012-12-25 02:48:01 PM

skodabunny: computerguyUT: England has 1/5 the the population of the US and their Violent crime is 4x ours

Wow, do you really believe this? Amazing. I don't know whether to feel sorry for you or be impressed by your trolling.

computerguyUT: They have also recently banned cricket bats in public.

LOL. You really are a retard. No, I take it back, you're right - we have to smuggle them around in paper bags, really, we do. It's made matches on the village green very tricky for us.

And, just for the record, I have zero problems with keeping under-18s away from giant knives - it's just common sense; something America seems to have lost since Clinton.

Seriously, people like you give Americans such a bad image abroad, it's such a shame. But you wouldn't care... I'll bet you don't even own a passport.

\Happy Festivus


I dunno about him, but I personally cherish that image we have abroad. We find positions like "[you] have zero problems with keeping under-18s away from giant knives"...as silly and asinine as you find our enjoyment of firearms. You seriously have no problems controlling *knives* to the point where cooking utensils and other tools like this are micromanaged? Would you freak out if a 15-year-old had a pocket knife, too?

Anyway, the rest of the world can suck an egg.
 
2012-12-25 02:48:06 PM

mwfark: Without reading through the litany of Fark comments, I hope someone has pointed out that this little stunt effectively points out to potential home invaders which houses in the area are unarmed (at least concerning legal registry) and therefore shows which houses would be safest to rob.


Or even better, which places could be burgled to obtain a firearm. You just have to stake the place out until you're sure the occupants aren't home.
 
2012-12-25 02:48:59 PM

Madame Ovary: RexTalionis: Pfaw, public records. I could've gotten the same information if I go to the local town halls.

I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.


Let's say the answer is 'yes'. What then?
 
2012-12-25 02:50:43 PM

Dear Jerk: As a fan of everything in the bill of rights, I find this hilarious. As strident as some gun owners can be about their rights, they tend to lose sight of free speech and what bits of information should be public knowledge. After all, when you ban lists of gun owners, only outlaws will have lists of gun owners.

/we're getting carried away with privacy rights at the expense of the public good.
//It takes nerve for a newspaper to do this. They will lose more revenue than they will gain.


This isn't a problem with the First Amendment. Gun owners are pissed because they are forced to disclose this information.

Their 4th Amendment rights are being violated.
 
2012-12-25 02:53:01 PM
Madame: I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.


Perhaps you need to worry less about guns and judgmental labels and more about how you might be able to help your neighbour.
 
2012-12-25 02:53:04 PM

jjorsett: Madame Ovary: RexTalionis: Pfaw, public records. I could've gotten the same information if I go to the local town halls.

I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.

Let's say the answer is 'yes'. What then?


Madame Ovary would then have the chance to talk to her neighbor regarding concerns and get assurances that the gun is out of the sons reach. Or she could choose to move out of that location. It gives her choices where she had none before.
 
2012-12-25 02:53:53 PM

ParaHandy: Authoritarianism is a goal of the right. They like to be told what to do by people in funny hats, invisible sky wizards, and a militarized police force.

They apply authoritarianism against things they fear, mostly women and plants. They favour deadly firearms, overseas wars and pollution, as long as some rich fark is making money.



Bullshiat.

Authoritarianism is the goal of those who wish to concentrate power in the hands of a few, and they will happily use whatever method is politically convenient  - be it "left" or "right", to accomplish that goal.
 
2012-12-25 02:55:42 PM

kim jong-un: Dear Jerk: As a fan of everything in the bill of rights, I find this hilarious. As strident as some gun owners can be about their rights, they tend to lose sight of free speech and what bits of information should be public knowledge. After all, when you ban lists of gun owners, only outlaws will have lists of gun owners.

/we're getting carried away with privacy rights at the expense of the public good.
//It takes nerve for a newspaper to do this. They will lose more revenue than they will gain.

This isn't a problem with the First Amendment. Gun owners are pissed because they are forced to disclose this information.

Their 4th Amendment rights are being violated.


If the information is already in the public domain as it must be for an FOIA request to be granted then this is not a 4th Amendment issue. It is a dick move by the paper but it is not illegal.
 
2012-12-25 02:55:44 PM

moonscatter: Uisce Beatha: moonscatter: I'm aware safes can be broken into, that, however does not excuse not using one.

Note I suggested no such thing, and lock my weapons up as well.

However, advertising where weapons are kept, so that an enterprising criminal doesn't have to look hard to find one, is still a bad idea.

Do you know an easier way to find out who has funs? Facebook. They are all over talking about the issues, hinting season etc. or the idiots posting coments after the Newtown articles. Follow any sticker-laden pick up truck out of a Gander Mountain parking lot. Heck, look for the guy making a big deal about cleaning his gun at the campsite next to yours. Raid a boys out storage facility.it isn't like this is unknown information.

And if you dont like it, get the equivalent of HIPAA passed with the exception that the cops do get to know who you are.


I'm a gun owner, I live in a state with mandatory registration of handguns, and I'm OK with the cops knowing I have them. As long as registration is not used inappropriately, I have no problems with it. I also have no problem with the fact that having a CCW means that the state knows I carry, either. I'm required to tell the cops if I get pulled over by law, regardless.

I don't fear police knowing I'm armed, I don't fear anyone else knowing I own guns. They're just a thing, like a wrench, a chainsaw, or a backhoe, and are treated no differently.

I also believe that many gun owners have said they're okay with firearms ownership being akin to getting a driver's license. As long as the state is not using this to actively infringe on the right to obtain such a license and exercise it at will, it's fine.

It's already on the books in most states that possession of a firearm by a felon adds special circumstances to the conviction, and bring a whole new world of hurt, though, so I'm not sure it would accomplish much more than another expenditure by the state to set up a system to issue and so on.

Closing the so-called "gun show loophole", with mandatory jail time for anyone selling a firearm without a license, might cut down some of the trafficking, though, provided that police were given enough extra cash to cover a special unit, like the drug enforcement units, to police these new laws.
 
2012-12-25 02:56:05 PM

Madame Ovary: RexTalionis: Pfaw, public records. I could've gotten the same information if I go to the local town halls.

I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.


Feel free to mosey on down to city hall and ask. Don't whine about privacy should your kid be caught in a drug sting and his name makes the police blotter in your local rag.
 
2012-12-25 02:57:33 PM

letrole: Madame: I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.


Perhaps you need to worry less about guns and judgmental labels and more about how you might be able to help your neighbour.


Like they helped Nancy Lanza?
 
2012-12-25 02:59:49 PM
Madame Ovary: Like they helped Nancy Lanza?

Exactly.
 
2012-12-25 03:00:00 PM
Well perhaps a handy list of the home addresses of the reporters and editorial staff along with photos of their cars and children would be ok? Maybe go online and get as much info as you can get on one of those pay background check websites? That would be ok right?

Of course it wouldn't. Even if it's public domain information, it doesn't make it right any more than it is to advertise who has guns. It's just creepy and passive aggressive.
 
2012-12-25 03:05:32 PM

moonscatter: Do you know an easier way to find out who has funs? Facebook.


First off - equating idiots self-promoting on myfacetwitspace to a paper publishing the info for its entire circulation it is a false equivalence. Especially since one can, if smart, restrict access to their social media exposure. And there are plenty of responsible folk who don't do any of the retarded things you just broad-brushed all gun owners with.

And again - how is letting any half-clever thief know where to get weapons when a house is unoccupied a good idea?
 
2012-12-25 03:08:52 PM
Looks like the cleanup and banhammer crew needs to show up
 
2012-12-25 03:13:20 PM
Lol. People are STILL raging over this topic?

Meanwhile 300+ people will die from drunk drivers over the holiday. And I remember when MADD was a favorite target of mockery for braindead liberals. Lol.

/idiots
 
2012-12-25 03:15:34 PM
Let me get this strait:

The gun control people say that most illegal guns are stolen guns from law-abiding owners.
They also defend a newspaper publishing records where the registered guns are, ensuring that someone wanting stolen guns knows where to go.

Now doesn't that sound vindictive and counterproductive to you?

In b4 "WHY DO U HAET FIRST AMENDMENT". I'm criticizing the paper's actions and the availability of records that should be given to law enforcement only.
 
2012-12-25 03:16:23 PM

Spanky McStupid: tlchwi02: isn't it generally known when you apply that it will be publically available? pretty sure i knew that when i got my permit in MA.

Available for someone to discover, perhaps; but published is another thing.


But publishing the names and addresses of sex offenders or those arrested for DWI is okay, amirite?
 
2012-12-25 03:20:24 PM

Kit Fister: You seriously have no problems controlling *knives* to the point where cooking utensils and other tools like this are micromanaged? Would you freak out if a 15-year-old had a pocket knife, too?


skodabunny: just for the record, I have zero problems with keeping under-18s away from giant knives


I dunno though, maybe your pockets are really huge. You do have that obesity thing over there so maybe it's changing the definition of pocket knife.

I'm sure there may be one or two under 18 year olds in need of a large knife for cooking. But I don't see why, in all reality, their parents can't supply the knife in that case. I don't think this is something that is ruining many aspiring teenage chef's lives. It's something that improves life for the majority of people though - people who'd rather not be stabbed by an immature neighbours kid over some bullshiat non-issue.
 
2012-12-25 03:22:59 PM

skodabunny: Kit Fister: You seriously have no problems controlling *knives* to the point where cooking utensils and other tools like this are micromanaged? Would you freak out if a 15-year-old had a pocket knife, too?

skodabunny: just for the record, I have zero problems with keeping under-18s away from giant knives

I dunno though, maybe your pockets are really huge. You do have that obesity thing over there so maybe it's changing the definition of pocket knife.

I'm sure there may be one or two under 18 year olds in need of a large knife for cooking. But I don't see why, in all reality, their parents can't supply the knife in that case. I don't think this is something that is ruining many aspiring teenage chef's lives. It's something that improves life for the majority of people though - people who'd rather not be stabbed by an immature neighbours kid over some bullshiat non-issue.


It's Assault Knives - c'mon you guys, help me get this going.
 
2012-12-25 03:25:05 PM
Next up, a map of the home addresses of abortion doctors.
I'm sure the same "public records" defenders of this will also be all for that.
 
2012-12-25 03:25:40 PM

NewportBarGuy: coco ebert: Oh, my. Judging from the comments, we have a quite a number of revolutionaries on our hands here.

What purpose does this serve? I've tried to find a positive aspect and found none. They want to create a visual to get across the point of how many guns are out there? Fine, just stick with the numbers. I honestly see no need to list the names and addresses of every pistol permit holder. I understand that this information is available under FOIA, but what possible purpose does it serve to collate it and put it out like that?

It's just going to piss people off more and that is not going to further the debate, nor will it help convince other gun owners to embrace new legislation or increased enforcement of current legislation.

If they want to collect the data, they should also pull all criminal records of those they are targeting and combine that with the data and find out how many people with pistol permits should a) not have been given them or b) who should have them taken away because of a crime after they got it. That? I'm fine with that.

Just putting it out there like they did? Not cool with that at all.




I'm also not sure what the journalistic purpose of this was.
 
2012-12-25 03:27:29 PM

noitsnot: skodabunny: Kit Fister: You seriously have no problems controlling *knives* to the point where cooking utensils and other tools like this are micromanaged? Would you freak out if a 15-year-old had a pocket knife, too?

skodabunny: just for the record, I have zero problems with keeping under-18s away from giant knives

I dunno though, maybe your pockets are really huge. You do have that obesity thing over there so maybe it's changing the definition of pocket knife.

I'm sure there may be one or two under 18 year olds in need of a large knife for cooking. But I don't see why, in all reality, their parents can't supply the knife in that case. I don't think this is something that is ruining many aspiring teenage chef's lives. It's something that improves life for the majority of people though - people who'd rather not be stabbed by an immature neighbours kid over some bullshiat non-issue.

It's Assault Knives - c'mon you guys, help me get this going.


I'm going to start calling any object I am against beginning with the term 'assault'. For example, My sister in-law made a salad with assault broccoli.

Any who oppose my opinions will be labeled as being racist.
 
2012-12-25 03:28:34 PM

Lenny_da_Hog: It's not my fault you're too stupid to understand a sentence more complex than you'd find in "Dick & Jane" books. The god was the subject of the sentence. Go ask your sixth-grade neighbor to explain it to you.


You are right. I skimmed and made a mistake. I went back and re-read it. Now I understand the point you were trying to make. I've corrected my mistake, you are still a dick.
 
2012-12-25 03:30:12 PM

jjorsett: Madame Ovary: RexTalionis: Pfaw, public records. I could've gotten the same information if I go to the local town halls.

I would want to know if my neighbor with the crazy, drug-addicted son has a gun.

Let's say the answer is 'yes'. What then?


Get a bigger gun.
 
2012-12-25 03:30:52 PM
Didn't read all the comments, but names and addresses of the newspaper staff are already available to anyone with access to the White Pages. Likewise, detailed driving records can easily be obtained from the DMV by whoever wants to pay for them. When law dictates that legal guns be registered and the fine print allows such information into public domain, don't be so surprised when others exercise their own rights to know this. Sharing such knowledge can prove beneficial when utilized by a civilized society yet detrimental when exploited by criminal minds, thus the *real* threat in this situation is those who could harbor ill intent and these bad guys are the ones that we need to pay attention to. If people showed more interest in the general safety and potential hazards within their communities by mutual communication, wouldn't this extreme measure be unnecessary in the first place?
 
2012-12-25 03:30:54 PM

Kit Fister: moonscatter: Uisce Beatha: moonscatter: I'm aware safes can be broken into, that, however does not excuse not using one.

Note I suggested no such thing, and lock my weapons up as well.

However, advertising where weapons are kept, so that an enterprising criminal doesn't have to look hard to find one, is still a bad idea.

Do you know an easier way to find out who has funs? Facebook. They are all over talking about the issues, hinting season etc. or the idiots posting coments after the Newtown articles. Follow any sticker-laden pick up truck out of a Gander Mountain parking lot. Heck, look for the guy making a big deal about cleaning his gun at the campsite next to yours. Raid a boys out storage facility.it isn't like this is unknown information.

And if you dont like it, get the equivalent of HIPAA passed with the exception that the cops do get to know who you are.

I'm a gun owner, I live in a state with mandatory registration of handguns, and I'm OK with the cops knowing I have them. As long as registration is not used inappropriately, I have no problems with it. I also have no problem with the fact that having a CCW means that the state knows I carry, either. I'm required to tell the cops if I get pulled over by law, regardless.

I don't fear police knowing I'm armed, I don't fear anyone else knowing I own guns. They're just a thing, like a wrench, a chainsaw, or a backhoe, and are treated no differently.

I also believe that many gun owners have said they're okay with firearms ownership being akin to getting a driver's license. As long as the state is not using this to actively infringe on the right to obtain such a license and exercise it at will, it's fine.

It's already on the books in most states that possession of a firearm by a felon adds special circumstances to the conviction, and bring a whole new world of hurt, though, so I'm not sure it would accomplish much more than another expenditure by the state to set up a system to issue and so on.

Closing the so-called "gun show loophole", with mandatory jail time for anyone selling a firearm without a license, might cut down some of the trafficking, though, provided that police were given enough extra cash to cover a special unit, like the drug enforcement units, to police these new laws.


My proposal is to shift the burden a bit on the whole private sale issue. You want to buy, private or at a dealer? You apply for a gun buyer's permit with background checks and the like. Sell to seo e without one? Felony. Sell to one with one? Indemnification civil and criminal against bd acts by the purchaser.

Or, require all guns be painted hot pink. Interest in gun ownership will drop dramatically.
 
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