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(ESPN)   The Cleveland Indians sign a top free agent to a large contract, immediately causing archaeologists to review the Mayan calendar to ensure that the end of the world wasn't scheduled for December 23rd, 2012   (espn.go.com) divider line 50
    More: Cool, Indians, Nick Swisher, free agent, Thad Matta, switch hitter, Shin-Soo Choo, Progressive Field, Shane Victorino  
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1013 clicks; posted to Sports » on 23 Dec 2012 at 1:44 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-23 10:44:53 AM
4 years, 56 million may be overpaying, but hopefully the Dolans have realized now that they're going to have to overpay to get free agents in Cleveland. Great move.

Now if we could get some more pitching for Asdrubal and maybe Chris Perez, we may actually have something here...
 
2012-12-23 11:01:52 AM
Only Cleveland would consider Swisher a "top free agent".
 
2012-12-23 11:31:23 AM

Tunk87: Only Cleveland would consider Swisher a "top free agent".


It's a pretty weak FA class and he's one of the best left.
 
2012-12-23 01:15:48 PM
Unless he's improved since he was on the White Sox, Nick Swisher is not a "top free agent".

Just because someone played for the Yankees does not make them a "top free agent".
 
2012-12-23 01:43:02 PM
Nick Swisher?  LOL
 
2012-12-23 01:54:48 PM
They're still shiatty
 
2012-12-23 01:57:45 PM

downstairs: Unless he's improved since he was on the White Sox, Nick Swisher is not a "top free agent".

Just because someone played for the Yankees does not make them a "top free agent".


Pretty much this.
 
2012-12-23 02:02:49 PM

ChrisDe: downstairs: Unless he's improved since he was on the White Sox, Nick Swisher is not a "top free agent".

Just because someone played for the Yankees does not make them a "top free agent".

Pretty much this.


Yep.

/White Sox Fan
 
2012-12-23 02:11:49 PM
Don't worry, he's an aging outfielder that benefitted from a stupidly designed stadium. It will be an albatross of a contract when the last year vests while he's a fourth outfielder that gets some swings at Dh.
 
2012-12-23 02:22:50 PM
It was.

No, seriously. Warren Jeffs predicted the Yellowstone supervolcano would blow today.
 
2012-12-23 02:24:20 PM
Nick Swisher? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
 
2012-12-23 02:27:00 PM
I'm tired of the unlikely event = Mayan apocalypse theme. Let it go. It's over.

Also, it's Nick farking Swisher.
 
2012-12-23 02:30:03 PM
They have secured fourth in the AL Central now.
 
2012-12-23 02:33:22 PM
Any word on whether Swisher worships Jobu?
 
2012-12-23 02:34:39 PM

Prey4reign: Any word on whether Swisher worships Jobu?


They're shiatty.
 
2012-12-23 02:37:49 PM
Go Tribe!

/watched swisher play at Ohio State a few times.
 
2012-12-23 02:38:35 PM
Doesn't matter how many times I hear his name, I still think it's a bad morning zoo radio skit waiting to happen.
 
2012-12-23 03:01:21 PM
Good deal for the Tribe, since they'll never have to worry about how shiat he is in the playoffs.
 
2012-12-23 03:09:09 PM
Oh boy, a .250 hitter for 12 million per. Thanks, Santa!

Can't wait to see that knucklehead pitcher Trevor Bauer, who was widely hated by his teammates and coaches in Arizona. Won't THAT be interesting.
 
2012-12-23 03:34:47 PM

Glenechocreek: Oh boy, a .250 hitter for 12 million per. Thanks, Santa!

Can't wait to see that knucklehead pitcher Trevor Bauer, who was widely hated by his teammates and coaches in Arizona. Won't THAT be interesting.


He's been hitting .274 over the last three seasons and in his Yankee tenure he averaged just under 90 RBI and 26 HR a season and he gets on base pretty consistently at around a .360 clip.

Is he a superstar? No, but if he plays as well as he did with the Yankees, he'd actually be worth $3M more per season than he's on contract for.
 
2012-12-23 04:14:11 PM

bulldg4life: Don't worry, he's an aging outfielder that benefitted from a stupidly designed stadium. It will be an albatross of a contract when the last year vests while he's a fourth outfielder that gets some swings at Dh.


He played for the Astros?

/Yankee Stadium is fine, let it go
 
2012-12-23 04:14:51 PM
Cleveland has a long, fruitless history of over-paying for free agent starters past their prime.

/nothing new to see here
 
2012-12-23 05:07:25 PM
Oh look, a thread full of people who only care about batting average. That's a new one for fark.
 
2012-12-23 05:53:18 PM
I'm glad for the Tribe, but they had a better OF and traded him to the Reds. So no big net win this offseason coming to Jacobs Field Progressive Park.
 
2012-12-23 06:10:49 PM

Tunk87: Only Cleveland would consider Swisher a "top free agent".


For each of the past two seasons, Swish has been a 3.9 and a 3.8 win player.  For comparison, Josh Hamilton has been a 4.1 win player and a 4.4 win player over the same period.  Hamilton will cost $55 million dollars more for the same number of years, assuming Swish's final year vests.

Good signing for the Tribe.
 
2012-12-23 07:15:11 PM

downstairs: Unless he's improved since he was on the White Sox, Nick Swisher is not a "top free agent".

Just because someone played for the Yankees does not make them a "top free agent".


You probably don't want to hear it but his season with the White Sox was far and away the worst of his career. He's been productive before and after, as a pretty consistent 4 WAR guy, year in and year out, with good durability. As I mentioned in the Ibanez thread, Yankee fans will attest that he disappears in the postseason, but most non-Yankee organizations would love just to get to that point and then see what their players can do (especially since we know there's no such thing as a magical postseason ability or inability). This is a very good signing for Cleveland. Obviously he's not getting them to the postseason by himself, but every team needs to start somewhere.
 
2012-12-23 07:19:39 PM

pastorkius: Glenechocreek: Oh boy, a .250 hitter for 12 million per. Thanks, Santa!

Can't wait to see that knucklehead pitcher Trevor Bauer, who was widely hated by his teammates and coaches in Arizona. Won't THAT be interesting.

He's been hitting .274 over the last three seasons and in his Yankee tenure he averaged just under 90 RBI and 26 HR a season and he gets on base pretty consistently at around a .360 clip.

Is he a superstar? No, but if he plays as well as he did with the Yankees, he'd actually be worth $3M more per season than he's on contract for.


At Yankee Stadium, land of the hitter
 
2012-12-23 07:47:25 PM

bhcompy: pastorkius: Glenechocreek: Oh boy, a .250 hitter for 12 million per. Thanks, Santa!

Can't wait to see that knucklehead pitcher Trevor Bauer, who was widely hated by his teammates and coaches in Arizona. Won't THAT be interesting.

He's been hitting .274 over the last three seasons and in his Yankee tenure he averaged just under 90 RBI and 26 HR a season and he gets on base pretty consistently at around a .360 clip.

Is he a superstar? No, but if he plays as well as he did with the Yankees, he'd actually be worth $3M more per season than he's on contract for.

At Yankee Stadium, land of the hitter


Ignoring the fact that he spent the first four years of his career putting up roughly the same numbers as he did at Yankee Stadium while hitting at Oakland Coliseum, one of the tougher hitters' parks in the league.
 
2012-12-23 07:55:40 PM

CavalierEternal: bhcompy: pastorkius: Glenechocreek: Oh boy, a .250 hitter for 12 million per. Thanks, Santa!

Can't wait to see that knucklehead pitcher Trevor Bauer, who was widely hated by his teammates and coaches in Arizona. Won't THAT be interesting.

He's been hitting .274 over the last three seasons and in his Yankee tenure he averaged just under 90 RBI and 26 HR a season and he gets on base pretty consistently at around a .360 clip.

Is he a superstar? No, but if he plays as well as he did with the Yankees, he'd actually be worth $3M more per season than he's on contract for.

At Yankee Stadium, land of the hitter

Ignoring the fact that he spent the first four years of his career putting up roughly the same numbers as he did at Yankee Stadium while hitting at Oakland Coliseum, one of the tougher hitters' parks in the league.


Not ignoring the fact that he was younger and not yet in his peak years as an A. Now he's in his decline years by age.
 
2012-12-23 07:57:24 PM

DeWayne Mann: Oh look, a thread full of people who only care about batting average. That's a new one for fark.


Please of wise one, tell us Swishers BAIP+OOOSS rating.
 
2012-12-23 08:16:36 PM

WTF Indeed: Please of wise one, tell us Swishers BAIP+OOOSS rating.


Well that's not a thing. But to quote an earlier post in this thread:

ignatius_crumbcake: For each of the past two seasons, Swish has been a 3.9 and a 3.8 win player. For comparison, Josh Hamilton has been a 4.1 win player and a 4.4 win player over the same period. Hamilton will cost $55 million dollars more for the same number of years, assuming Swish's final year vests.

 
2012-12-23 08:28:43 PM
I'm not a numbers guy.. I'm a gut guy. My gut is telling me Swisher is on the serious decline.
 
2012-12-23 08:38:30 PM

DeWayne Mann: Well that's not a thing. But to quote an earlier post in this thread:


It's a thing called "ceiling" Swisher's best will never match Hamilton's best. Again, Sabermaterics screamed for years that the baseball used to few numbers to analyze and you need lots of numbers, then they invent one number to be the ultimate gauge, a number that even other Sabr guys say is calculated wrong.
 
2012-12-23 08:50:17 PM

WTF Indeed: It's a thing called "ceiling" Swisher's best will never match Hamilton's best.


And Swisher's worst will never match Hamilton's worst. Quite a bet for $55mil.

WTF Indeed: Again, Sabermaterics screamed for years that the baseball used to few numbers to analyze and you need lots of numbers, then they invent one number to be the ultimate gauge, a number that even other Sabr guys say is calculated wrong.


For some reason, I suspect that if I had used lots of numbers, you would've replied with something to the effect of "None of those numbers mean anything at all."
 
2012-12-23 09:48:40 PM
I like the guy even though he is from OSU, however, I don't consider him a top tier free agent. My prediction, his numbers will decline by not playing in NY or Chcago. Mann, what does his numbers for Cleveland vs his previous parks look like.
 
2012-12-23 10:19:12 PM

great_tigers: I like the guy even though he is from OSU, however, I don't consider him a top tier free agent. My prediction, his numbers will decline by not playing in NY or Chcago. Mann, what does his numbers for Cleveland vs his previous parks look like.


Via Yahoo! Sports

Nick Swisher @ Progressive Field

36 Games
135 AB
20 R
41 H
12 2B
0 3B
5 HR
23 RBI
17 BB
23 K
0 SB
0 CS
.304 AVG
.381 OBP
.504 SLG
.884 OPS
 
2012-12-23 10:23:51 PM

CavalierEternal: great_tigers: I like the guy even though he is from OSU, however, I don't consider him a top tier free agent. My prediction, his numbers will decline by not playing in NY or Chcago. Mann, what does his numbers for Cleveland vs his previous parks look like.

Via Yahoo! Sports

Nick Swisher @ Progressive Field

36 Games
135 AB
20 R
41 H
12 2B
0 3B
5 HR
23 RBI
17 BB
23 K
0 SB
0 CS
.304 AVG
.381 OBP
.504 SLG
.884 OPS


Thanks, do you have his saber metrics stuff. Really wanted to know what Mann that of them. I am too stupid to find them and to decipher them.
 
2012-12-23 10:26:37 PM

great_tigers: CavalierEternal: great_tigers: I like the guy even though he is from OSU, however, I don't consider him a top tier free agent. My prediction, his numbers will decline by not playing in NY or Chcago. Mann, what does his numbers for Cleveland vs his previous parks look like.

Via Yahoo! Sports

Nick Swisher @ Progressive Field

36 Games
135 AB
20 R
41 H
12 2B
0 3B
5 HR
23 RBI
17 BB
23 K
0 SB
0 CS
.304 AVG
.381 OBP
.504 SLG
.884 OPS

Thanks, do you have his saber metrics stuff. Really wanted to know what Mann that of them. I am too stupid to find them and to decipher them.


Ha, you're asking the wrong guy. Advanced baseball statistics are above my paygrade.
 
2012-12-23 10:28:00 PM

CavalierEternal: great_tigers: CavalierEternal: great_tigers: I like the guy even though he is from OSU, however, I don't consider him a top tier free agent. My prediction, his numbers will decline by not playing in NY or Chcago. Mann, what does his numbers for Cleveland vs his previous parks look like.

Via Yahoo! Sports

Nick Swisher @ Progressive Field

36 Games
135 AB
20 R
41 H
12 2B
0 3B
5 HR
23 RBI
17 BB
23 K
0 SB
0 CS
.304 AVG
.381 OBP
.504 SLG
.884 OPS

Thanks, do you have his saber metrics stuff. Really wanted to know what Mann that of them. I am too stupid to find them and to decipher them.

Ha, you're asking the wrong guy. Advanced baseball statistics are above my paygrade.


That's why I had asked DeWayne Mann. Thanks though.
 
2012-12-23 10:28:15 PM

CognaciousThunk: I'm glad for the Tribe, but they had a better OF and traded him to the Reds. So no big net win this offseason coming to Jacobs Field Progressive Park.


There wasn't a snowballs chance in hell that Choo, a Boras client, was resigning with Cleveland after the 2013 season. I hated to see him go, but it was better to move him now given what they were able to get in return.

Is the Tribe a playoff team now with Swish on board? Of course not. But at least they're a little closer to being watchable next season.
 
2012-12-23 10:36:32 PM

SouthpawSlicer: CognaciousThunk: I'm glad for the Tribe, but they had a better OF and traded him to the Reds. So no big net win this offseason coming to Jacobs Field Progressive Park.

There wasn't a snowballs chance in hell that Choo, a Boras client, was resigning with Cleveland after the 2013 season. I hated to see him go, but it was better to move him now given what they were able to get in return.

Is the Tribe a playoff team now with Swish on board? Of course not. But at least they're a little closer to being watchable next season.


Fact of the matter is that the Dolans' main focus is money, and they were finally faced with the prospect of this team starting to lose money after two straight horrendous second half collapses. They didn't have a choice but to go out and actually try to build a watchable team this year. Do I feel good that the team had to hit rock bottom and then keep burrowing to motivate the owners to actually try and field a winning team? No. In the end, as a Cleveland fan, do I care by what means we get a winning team? F*ck no.

Also, fun fact: Even after the Swisher signing, our payroll is still lower now than it was after the 2012 season, thanks to Hafner and Sizemore coming off the books. Goes to show that it isn't how much money you spend, but how you spend it.
 
2012-12-24 12:29:16 AM

CavalierEternal: SouthpawSlicer: CognaciousThunk: I'm glad for the Tribe, but they had a better OF and traded him to the Reds. So no big net win this offseason coming to Jacobs Field Progressive Park.

There wasn't a snowballs chance in hell that Choo, a Boras client, was resigning with Cleveland after the 2013 season. I hated to see him go, but it was better to move him now given what they were able to get in return.

Is the Tribe a playoff team now with Swish on board? Of course not. But at least they're a little closer to being watchable next season.

Fact of the matter is that the Dolans' main focus is money, and they were finally faced with the prospect of this team starting to lose money after two straight horrendous second half collapses. They didn't have a choice but to go out and actually try to build a watchable team this year. Do I feel good that the team had to hit rock bottom and then keep burrowing to motivate the owners to actually try and field a winning team? No. In the end, as a Cleveland fan, do I care by what means we get a winning team? F*ck no.

Also, fun fact: Even after the Swisher signing, our payroll is still lower now than it was after the 2012 season, thanks to Hafner and Sizemore coming off the books. Goes to show that it isn't how much money you spend, but how you spend it.


Oy, no kidding... The Hafner contract, you kinda figured it would end poorly. He was in his late 20's when he got the big contract, so it wasn't a huge surprise the injuries caught up with him. Sizemore though, that one just plain sucked. Bad luck with injuries that he could never recover from.

Which means that Swisher will probably have his ribcage explode or something like that for signing the big contract.
 
2012-12-24 01:28:34 AM

great_tigers: That's why I had asked DeWayne Mann. Thanks though.


As a tip, if you either put my name in bold or quote one of my posts directly, I'll get the email. Makes it so I'll respond a lot quicker.

Progressive Field generally plays a bit pitcher friendly. A large portion of that is the fact that it's nearly impossible to hit triples, though, so that won't affect Swisher much. It's actually above average for hitting doubles, though, which will help him a lot. Yankee Stadium, it should be noted, is below average for doubles, but above average for HRs.

That being said, Swisher wasn't really affected much by the porch in right; he only hit 5 HR down the line this year. Most of his HRs come to right center when he hits lefty; as a righty they're pretty evenly spread across left. At a glance, it looks like only one HR he hit last year would've stayed in Progressive.

I really see no obvious reason to expect his numbers to go down much if at all.
 
2012-12-24 01:29:11 AM

DeWayne Mann: I really see no obvious reason to expect his numbers to go down much if at all.


...from the park, I mean. Obviously, he's getting older.
 
2012-12-24 02:37:21 AM
yankee fan since 1977. farwell Swishilicious!

/i liked you man
 
2012-12-24 10:10:09 AM

DeWayne Mann: That being said, Swisher wasn't really affected much by the porch in right; he only hit 5 HR down the line this year. Most of his HRs come to right center when he hits lefty; as a righty they're pretty evenly spread across left. At a glance, it looks like only one HR he hit last year would've stayed in Progressive.


Not withstanding the winds that blow to right at Yankee Stadium, of course. Distance isn't just power
 
2012-12-24 12:08:17 PM

bhcompy: DeWayne Mann: That being said, Swisher wasn't really affected much by the porch in right; he only hit 5 HR down the line this year. Most of his HRs come to right center when he hits lefty; as a righty they're pretty evenly spread across left. At a glance, it looks like only one HR he hit last year would've stayed in Progressive.

Not withstanding the winds that blow to right at Yankee Stadium, of course. Distance isn't just power


I was using Home Run Tracker, which accounts for wind. Obviously, you can't do a perfect comparison, but it gives an idea of "true distance."
 
2012-12-24 12:50:37 PM
I'm going to miss Swisher - love the guy's personality. I won't miss his crap performance in the playoffs, but he was mostly fun to have around.
 
2012-12-24 01:16:52 PM

Super Chronic: downstairs: Unless he's improved since he was on the White Sox, Nick Swisher is not a "top free agent".

Just because someone played for the Yankees does not make them a "top free agent".

You probably don't want to hear it but his season with the White Sox was far and away the worst of his career. He's been productive before and after, as a pretty consistent 4 WAR guy, year in and year out, with good durability. As I mentioned in the Ibanez thread, Yankee fans will attest that he disappears in the postseason, but most non-Yankee organizations would love just to get to that point and then see what their players can do (especially since we know there's no such thing as a magical postseason ability or inability). This is a very good signing for Cleveland. Obviously he's not getting them to the postseason by himself, but every team needs to start somewhere.


All good.  I honestly didn't follow him at all last year.  Still, "top free agent" is a bit of a stretch.

I'll also say this- he seems like a real good guy who enjoys playing the game.  I can always get behind those sorts of players.
 
2012-12-24 02:11:46 PM

bulldg4life: Don't worry, he's an aging outfielder that benefitted from a stupidly designed stadium. It will be an albatross of a contract when the last year vests while he's a fourth outfielder that gets some swings at Dh.


"Albatross"? lol.... They were paying Grady Sizemore and Travis Hafner each that kind of money.... I think they'll be fine.
 
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