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(Salon)   Some of the "bravest atheists in the country" are waging a war on Christmas. And they must be stopped   (salon.com) divider line 131
    More: Scary, Pottery Barn, St. Nick, American Atheists, religious denomination, Philadelphians, Baby Jesus, Easter Sunday, American Museum of Natural History  
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19831 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Dec 2012 at 1:30 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2012-12-23 09:05:12 AM
16 votes:
We atheists get the blame for everything bad that happens. The talking head fungelicals were on TV mere hours after some nut bag shoots up a school, to say it was our fault. F*ck them, they are what is wrong with this world, not the people who value reason over superstition. I have no respect for magical thinking, it is wrong and dangerous.
2012-12-23 08:50:55 AM
11 votes:
Hey, Christians. Rampant commercialism destroyed Christmas long before atheists even bothered to care.
2012-12-23 02:18:31 PM
6 votes:

bunner: I AM NOT GOING TO STAND FOR ALL OF THIS STAMP COLLECTING! STAMP COLLECTORS ARE IDIOTS AND YOU CAN'T COLLECT STAMPS WITHIN 500 FEET OF ME!


Get it?


Good straw man. It's more like "stop using public lands and resources to advocate and subsidize stamp collecting. Stop giving stamp collector shops tax exempt status when they use that money to lobby for stamp collecting regulation repeal. Also, I'm tired of getting shiat from stamp collectors for not collecting stamps. My self worth is not determined by your stamp almanac."
gad
2012-12-23 01:49:39 PM
6 votes:
The only people who 'must be stopped' are people who don't like the beliefs of others and who think they 'must be stopped' - Atheists are doing what they need to do to be heard and to gain some position in the society. Rather than continuing to let the religious folks define atheists and telling their children that atheists are bad and evil, we're out there befuddling fundamentalists by our existence and by our being normal folks - putting the lie to the hate mongering of religious folks. Like gay marriage and democrats - you all need to just learn to deal with us all not being like you and not hiding in the corner or the closet where you can slander us all with impunity.
2012-12-23 01:52:20 PM
5 votes:

BronyMedic: Vodka Zombie: St_Francis_P: And they must be stopped

Uhm...why?

Because JESUS!!!

You've got to remember the reason for the season.
[feyboy.com image 467x256]
Drunken debauched violence-filled sex for everyone.


Actually.... the real reason for the season...
scienceblogs.com
2012-12-23 01:02:07 PM
5 votes:

Vodka Zombie: St_Francis_P: And they must be stopped

Uhm...why?

Because JESUS!!!


You've got to remember the reason for the season.

feyboy.com

Drunken debauched violence-filled sex for everyone.
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-12-23 12:32:44 PM
5 votes:
"Here's the bottom line: Where religion is weak, atheism is weak" in its intensity, says Pitzer sociologist Phil Zuckerman. "Where religion is strong, atheism is strong."

This organized Atheism thing is just a reaction to obnoxious bible thumpers.
2012-12-23 09:09:53 AM
5 votes:
That argument makes a lot of sense. When you live down here, you really do feel threatened just for being nonreligious and are treated as a threat by supposedly good Christians who hate you.
2012-12-23 02:24:58 PM
4 votes:

Shazam999: So yeah, see, it's okay for you act the way you do, but heaven forbid someone acts they way you don't want them to. And forget letting people make judgements on their own - you need to protect them from what is obviously false, to you - because there's no way they're as smart as you, and therefore can't make the same judgement.


Everyone has their own belief system, so there is no practical way to have state-approved religious displays without discriminating against someone. Hence the only way to keep it clean is to keep the religious stuff where it belongs, in religious places.

Most people aren't as smart as me, that is a simple fact, and I won't apologise for it.

It is possible for a really smart person to be religious, and many draw comfort from it, but they have to be sure not to apply critical thinking to the myths of their chosen religion. My mother was a Unitarian at heart, but dragged me to the Church of Scotland as a kid. At 10 years old, I did a bit of back of the envelope on Santa's business and decided it just didn't make sense; religion ran afoul of the same problem about a year later. From the outside looking in, religions are simply ridiculous, and once you've stepped outside the bubble there really is no way back in. I am literally as incapable of believing in supernatural myths as you are in the Korean Fan Death myth.

Which of the 5,500 active major religions you follow (or none) is purely an accident of birth; humans are credulous by nature, and if you get told something often enough by adults as a child, you'll believe literally anything[1]

Religions were created by humans for a variety of purposes: the wise shaman telling the middle east tribe not to eat shellfish, which are hard to keep in a desert with no fridge, and not to mix raw and cooked food (basic food hygeine); as tools of social control for the oligarchy (Napoleon Bonaparte, the Vatican); but most often they were an attempt to understand and exert control of the world around us, much as a belief in the afterlife is a way to cheat death.

However, we have better tools for understanding and controlling the world - science and engineering. These are reliable and consistent (in the way that e.g. praying for an outcome is not) because they have a real impact in the physical world and are based on facts.

One way to view religions is a false step in the endeavour of scientific inquiry, much like phlogiston. Religion claims its authority from myths, and as these myths are disproven, then religion has to fight a rear gaurd action to protect its power (c.f. Vatican vs Galileo).


[1] here's one that stayed with me until I was 18, and comes from the world of science ... in UK schools, kids are commonly taught that water swirls down a drain from a sink or bath due to the earth's rotation. It's total BS, but even though I had the scientific background to figure that out (as of course did the teacher :) I never questioned it until encouraged to do so by a Mech Eng professor at college. I've had people with scientific degrees argue apopleptically over this point. If they can cling to a mistaken belief about science that the knowledge in their own head can easily disprove, how easy is it to adhere to a myth which is carefully periodically re-framed to avoid evidentiary tests?
2012-12-23 02:19:34 PM
4 votes:

ParaHandy: It's actually a war on the Christina religion piggybacking the various winter solstice traditions. It was Saturnalia and Yule and all that long before the god botherers came around.

My personal war is against dis-information and its negative effects. All religions are disinformation, and their adherents to believe untrue myths. This is their absolute right in their private spaces and churches, but it impacts us all when they try to insert it into public life.

The billboard in Times Square is a bit unfortunate .... there is some evidence (and no, writings 400 years after the fact are not evidence) that there was a real, historical philosopher called Jesus / Issa, who was in fact crucified by the Romans. Admittedly less than there is for the existence of Paul and some others, and the Jesus in the bible may in fact be a fictional idealized amalgam of Paul and others.

Why can't they all just move into compounds?


Well put.

Here is liberal Massachusetts I have not seen any signs of a war on Christmas but I do see, from time to time, a war on science. I haven't seen any advertising by atheist but I have seen billboards by young earth creationists claiming their myths trump scientific facts. A few years back I took the kids to the Smithsonian Museum of Natural History and found that some fool was dropping creationist pamphlets on the floor all over the museum. Every one I saw I picked up and threw in the trash (boy scout training ftw!). Drive through the midwest and scan through AM radio and you are sure to find some creationist spewing psuedoscience bs. I can only imagine what it is like in the south.
2012-12-23 02:12:27 PM
4 votes:
guitarsandaudio.com
2012-12-23 02:06:14 PM
4 votes:

Rufus Lee King: Seriously, though, you "atheist" types: what's the deal with trying to rain on people's parades? It's infantile, and speaks volumes about you. Shut the f__k up.



Ahh, Christians. Demonstrating why there have to be "militant atheists."

Seriously, shut the fark up. Because you are a bad example for whatever it is you believe. As in, "If Rufus is an example of a Christian, I'll be something else, because those people are dicks."
2012-12-23 01:51:10 PM
4 votes:

Gosling: telling all who will listen of the benefits of atheism, trying to convert people to atheism


If that's your criteria for a religion, just about everything is a religion. Every product advertised on your TV is a religion, here's the benefits of the Ford Focus and why you should convert from your stupid Toyota.
2012-12-23 01:45:57 PM
4 votes:
Atheists who try to get all up in peoples' faces about it are just as bad as religious nuts who try to get all up in peoples' faces abut it.
2012-12-23 02:30:45 PM
3 votes:
Yeah brave atheists, go go go. Brave atheists keep up the work.

Next up, start the war on muslim holiday, go to a mosque and draw pictures of mocking Mohammed.

yeah, brave atheists go do that.
2012-12-23 02:29:14 PM
3 votes:

Shazam999: had98c: In this alternate world do people worship Harry Potter as a god and base their views on same sex marriage on lines from The Goblet of Fire?

Honestly, so what?

When you get older in life, you will find that a great deal of people will disagree with you on a great deal of subjects.

You live in a country where free speech is sacrosanct. So you can either live your life and enjoy it or keep griping about what other people think.

Are you sure you're not the lunatic?


People's beliefs inform their actions. When those actions have an impact on others, especially with regards to things like legal rights, I think it's perfectly reasonable to be critical of other people's beliefs.
2012-12-23 02:17:20 PM
3 votes:

Rufus Lee King: If you want to be an atheist, be an atheist.

However, the "HEY, EVERYBODY!!! LOOKIT ME!!! I'M AN ATHEIST!!!" thing is best left out.

No one cares about your personal problems.


Who said it was a problem?

Use your "screaming out your beliefs" observations towards religious people too.
2012-12-23 02:15:02 PM
3 votes:
"In small-town USA, people are much more likely to be anti-religious because they have religion thrown in their face all the time - prayers at little league, prayers at city council meetings, Nativity scenes and Ten Commandments billboards, preachers on the radio and TV, etc. - and their lack of religion is often associated with being immoral."

So much THIS. I lived in a smaller community, roughly 40K, for about 7 years. I am a Pagan, my best friend (who recently passed, sadly) was a die hard atheist. Let's just say that she and I compared notes time and time again about the discrimination and bigotry of our community over the years. Narrow minded, and sometimes very nasty people would give each of us a hard time, and don't get me started on the teasing and questioning I got from me being a person of faith and my best friend being godless. Ridiculous. I'm not one bit anti Christmas (Christians however should be aware by now that they basically co-opted beliefs of many older systems and be accepting about it) and neither was my atheist friend-she and her husband celebrated it as a secular holiday that was all about food and seeing family and friends together and rejoicing that spring would be on the way. She just got her back up, as did I, when dealing with bigoted arseholes in small town America who were utterly convinced we would be the downfall of their fair community.

/my departed godless friend was one of only a handful of people I could discuss ethics, religion and politics sensibly with
//ashes to ashes and all that
2012-12-23 02:04:02 PM
3 votes:

letrole: Atheism is a Religion.


Le Troll, eh? I'll bite anyway, I"m bored.

Christianity is a religion. Theism is a belief in a deity, a trait many religions have.

Atheism is a lack of belief in a deity. Some religions are atheistic, but atheism itself is not a religion. It's like saying stamp collecting is a hobby, therefore not collecting stamps is also a hobby.
2012-12-23 02:00:13 PM
3 votes:
Whats wrong with celebrating the winter solstice with gifts decorated trees and music?

People have been doing this sort of thing long before Jesus was born
2012-12-23 01:52:30 PM
3 votes:
I just want to point out that some of the most obnoxious christians are the passive aggressive ones who say things like "I'm asking God to give me the heart to forgive someone here who did me wrong..." at social gatherings while looking in one particular person's direction.
2012-12-23 01:43:10 PM
3 votes:

Theonceovertwice: I'm an atheist, and I have no problem with Christmas.


Agnostic, but this.

The 90% of atheists who act like expressions of other peoples belief is a supernatural force that will harm them make the reasonable 10% look bad.
2012-12-23 01:36:59 PM
3 votes:
I'm an atheist, and I have no problem with Christmas.
2012-12-23 10:48:42 AM
3 votes:
This year the Christmas season started before most people were done eating their Thanksgiving dinner. The War on Christmas is a lie.
2012-12-23 06:58:00 PM
2 votes:

bunner: Keizer_Ghidorah: Yeah, it makes it hard to discuss anything with someone who petulantly dismisses everything shown to him and insists on acting like a child when discussing things.

Can't be more difficult than trying to discuss things with dime store pedagogues with blanket authority postures and "dear me, I just SAID everything works like THIS" as a scientific absolute. And that's fine, but pull my ear and you lose a hand. : )


People have given you the actual scientific statements, formulas, and workings of why and how, and you dismiss them with the same petulant attitude as you dismiss what Farkers say, with the "We just don't know, therefore both sides are equal" fallacy as your justification, and then you project your attitude onto others so you can continue to be a child.
2012-12-23 06:32:48 PM
2 votes:
Brave? When these Atheists go to Egypt to oppose Sharia, then they can claim courage.
2012-12-23 04:22:55 PM
2 votes:
Christians demand that America be turned into a Christian nation and have the nerve to act surprised when people say no. The Founding Fathers didn't want ANY religion to be the singular one of America. Freedom of religion also means freedom FROM religion. I've yet to have Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, or atheists knock at my door and tell me that I'm going to burn in everlasting torture unless I join their club. And it's really ironic how much Christianity whines about being persecuted, then turns around and persecutes other religions, homosexuals, and women. The entire history of Christianity has been one of persecuting others, assimilating other religions into itself, and trying to spread itself across the world.
2012-12-23 02:39:42 PM
2 votes:

Rufus Lee King: Seriously, though, you "atheist" types: what's the deal with trying to rain on people's parades? It's infantile, and speaks volumes about you. Shut the f__k up.


Why? Should I also tell you that 2+2 is not 5, or that lower taxes for the rich won't help the economy?

The First Amendment gives you the right to spout religious nonsense, and me to call you on it. Welcome to the land of the semi-free.
2012-12-23 02:29:51 PM
2 votes:
Its really all boils down to Christians feeling butthurt because we won't let them put giant statues of Jesus in front of courthouses and city halls.
2012-12-23 02:27:44 PM
2 votes:
Noncombatants killed and injured when atheists attack agnostic stronghold...said no headline ever.
2012-12-23 02:25:26 PM
2 votes:

mediablitz: Anyone claiming atheism is a religion is a farking retard. Period. End of story.


I think the funniest part is that their argument is basically "you guys are so awful you're just as bad as us" and they're too dumb to even realize it.
2012-12-23 02:25:20 PM
2 votes:
If you're all f*cked up about people knocking up some blowmold figurines and some straw and a balsa wood hut once a year, I mean if this DEEPLY AFFECTS YOU, I'd ease up on the intellectual superiority fandango a bit.
2012-12-23 02:20:52 PM
2 votes:

Rufus Lee King: If you want to be an atheist, be an atheist.

However, the "HEY, EVERYBODY!!! LOOKIT ME!!! I'M AN ATHEIST!!!" thing is best left out.

No one cares about your personal problems.


The same should go for your religious convictions as well.  Nobody gives a shiat about your relationship with Jesus/Buddha/The Almighty Cheesewhiz.  And keep that stuff out of my laws, kthnx.
2012-12-23 02:20:14 PM
2 votes:
Give me a call the next time an angry mob of atheists burns someone to death because of their religion.

Anyone claiming atheism is a religion is a farking retard. Period. End of story.
2012-12-23 02:19:44 PM
2 votes:

mediablitz: If I can't see the nativity scene at the public park while I'm driving to Walmart to support CHRISTmas, my religion will collapse!


More accurately, if my religion is no longer afforded the unjustified special privileges from the state that it had been receiving up until now, my world will collapse.
2012-12-23 02:19:20 PM
2 votes:

bunner: Get it?


Yea, I get it:

"Waaaaaaaaahhhhh people get annoyed with me for trying to constantly throw my personal magical beliefs in their face and IT'S SO UNFAIR I CAN'T FORCE THEM TO LISTEN OR USE THEIR MONEY TO DO IT!"

I'll be sure to remember your idiotic post the next time some religious loon is on my front step bothering me about their stupid beliefs or standing on the curb outside my office littering the place with their stupid little pamphlets. Or some nut is marching up and down the street with a sign telling me god is going to make me burn if I don't go to church.

Which will be some time this week since it's farking constant.
2012-12-23 02:12:24 PM
2 votes:
If I can't see the nativity scene at the public park while I'm driving to Walmart to support CHRISTmas, my religion will collapse!
2012-12-23 02:11:22 PM
2 votes:
I wonder if atheists know that many churches contain a great amount of really nice, easy pussy. Nice young pussy too.
2012-12-23 01:58:31 PM
2 votes:

letrole: Atheism is a Religion.


Religion is an Atheism.
2012-12-23 01:53:49 PM
2 votes:

ToxicMunkee: This year the Christmas season started before most people were done eating their Thanksgiving dinner. The War on Christmas is a lie.


This is exactly right. Christmas is probably the most powerful phenomenon in Western culture. It is a social and commercial juggernaut.

Christmas drives decision-making and scheduling within a huge number of industries, touching all retail sectors, travel, movies, music, all forms of entertainment really...shipping, food, etc.

And consider the number of businesses in the Americas, Europe, and down under that simply shut-down for the week, a huge number of factories, offices, warehouses, agencies, that are just closed for a week (or more!).

Every school in Christendom, closed.

The impact of Christmas on our society - even beyond the huge amount of cultural and sentimental significance, and the huge amount of creative energy devoted to it - is probably too big to be measured. What would the transactional value of Christmas be? The absolute dollar value of all the plusses and minuses? 100's of billions? More than a trillion?

Americans were shocked that nearly $2B was spent on this year's Presidential election. Americans spend nearly $1B dollars on candy canes EVERY YEAR.

No group of atheists could ever hope to make a dent. It's so strange to us in fact, that discussing it is considered newsworthy!
2012-12-23 01:53:22 PM
2 votes:

ParaHandy: My personal war is against dis-information and its negative effects. All religions are disinformation, and their adherents to believe untrue myths. This is their absolute right in their private spaces and churches, but it impacts us all when they try to insert it into public life.


So yeah, see, it's okay for you act the way you do, but heaven forbid someone acts they way you don't want them to. And forget letting people make judgements on their own - you need to protect them from what is obviously false, to you - because there's no way they're as smart as you, and therefore can't make the same judgement.
2012-12-23 01:42:39 PM
2 votes:

Shazam999: They don't really seem pro-atheist as they mostly anti-religion.


That'd be me. Faith is cool but keep your religion over there.
2012-12-23 01:41:56 PM
2 votes:
Can't we all just get along shut the fark up about it already?
2012-12-23 01:41:17 PM
2 votes:
Ahhh, another hate speech thread.
2012-12-23 01:39:12 PM
2 votes:
I think Christians will find that there's a war against their superstitious nonsense, and against psychic hooey, flim-flam of all sorts, and fraud.

However, their brand of nonsense is In Charge of Things, and that's what must be stopped. Any time your leaders make decisions hedged by "but there's this sky wizard and he'll make sure everything turns out okay", you have problems when said sky wizard fails to show.
2012-12-23 01:34:55 PM
2 votes:
FTA: What's more, most American nonbelievers are not even atheists

Um, no. Most non-religious Americans might not be atheists, but if you are nonbeliever, you are, by definition, an atheist.
2012-12-23 12:42:47 PM
2 votes:
I think the real takeaway from this article is that, once again, the heavily-populated areas of this country are the best places to live.
2012-12-23 09:01:06 AM
2 votes:
I really hope they come through. Christmas farking blows. An entire perfectly good week, destroyed.
2012-12-23 08:23:56 AM
2 votes:
And they must be stopped

Uhm...why?
2012-12-24 05:12:38 PM
1 votes:

TerminalEchoes: Because many atheists are simply miserable people who won't stop until the rest of the planet is miserable along with them.


The difference between the misery of an atheist and the happiness of a theist is that the atheist's misery is real.
2012-12-24 03:45:28 PM
1 votes:

Quaker: Mambo Bananapatch: Gyrfalcon: Why exactly is it wrong to want "Peace on earth, good will to men"?

It's not....?Quaker: ParaHandy: You can't prove a negative, ever. There is an invisible monster under your bed that only I can see.

Guest: There is a Unicorn in your kitchen.

I completely agree that either of those things could be true. I'm betting that they aren't so that is what I would base any actual decisions I make on, but I would never go as far as to say I'm absolutely sure that you're wrong about that.

I can say, with absolute certainty, that there is not an invisible monster under anybody's bed that only they can see, or that there is a unicorn in anybody's kitchen.

If I'm proved wrong I shall, red-faced, admit it. But keeping an open mind doesn't mean you have to be stupid.

The fact that you acknowledge the possibility of being proven wrong, however remote, proves my point that you're not really absolutely certain.


It does nothing of the sort. Let me assure you in the most unambiguous language one can use in polite society: I am absolutely certain that there are no invisible monsters or unicorns. Absolutely, 100% certain. I am equally certain that no proof exists to the contrary. I DO NOT ADMIT THE POSSIBILITY OF BEING PROVEN WRONG. (Forgive the shouting; I wish only to emphasize the point.)

If, despite my certainty, such evidence were to turn up, and if it were irrefutable, I would acknowledge that I was wrong.
2012-12-24 09:26:07 AM
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: Why exactly is it wrong to want "Peace on earth, good will to men"?


It's not....?

Quaker: ParaHandy: You can't prove a negative, ever. There is an invisible monster under your bed that only I can see.

Guest: There is a Unicorn in your kitchen.

I completely agree that either of those things could be true. I'm betting that they aren't so that is what I would base any actual decisions I make on, but I would never go as far as to say I'm absolutely sure that you're wrong about that.


I can say, with absolute certainty, that there is not an invisible monster under anybody's bed that only they can see, or that there is a unicorn in anybody's kitchen.

If I'm proved wrong I shall, red-faced, admit it. But keeping an open mind doesn't mean you have to be stupid.
2012-12-24 08:58:04 AM
1 votes:

ParaHandy: You can't prove a negative, ever. There is an invisible monster under your bed that only I can see.


Guest: There is a Unicorn in your kitchen.


I completely agree that either of those things could be true. I'm betting that they aren't so that is what I would base any actual decisions I make on, but I would never go as far as to say I'm absolutely sure that you're wrong about that.
2012-12-24 02:53:34 AM
1 votes:
I'm an Atheist. I'm not anti-religion. I couldn't care less what anyone else believes. I don't reject the idea of God, and I'm certainly not convinced He doesn't exist. When my mother died I wanted so badly to believe that she was in a better place, looking down on us. Two years later, and not a day goes by when I don't wish she were somewhere, smiling down on me, wishing she could tell me not to be sad.

I accept nothing on faith, including the idea that supernatural creatures don't exist. Let me repeat that: I accept nothing on faith. Faith and belief are a part of the religious experience, but are not are part of mine (i.e. Atheism is NOT a religion, but then you trolls already knew that, didn't you?). But it doesn't require faith to observe the world around you and draw conclusions from those observations, nor does it require belief in anything at all. Logic and observation were sufficient for me to conclude that the Easter Bunny was a myth. It didn't require faith or belief, just an educated, adult mind.

Given how badly I want to believe in God, it seems unlikely that I would overlook any sign of magic and miracles in my life. There's still time for me to find God, and I've got a very open mind regarding this. After all, if I had a scientific hypothesis and it proved to be incorrect, I would modify my theory to be consistent with observation. The paradox is that I know of no more insightful instrument for determining truth than the Scientific Method, which -- by definition -- favors science over religion.

I open my Bible, and on page one it says that the Earth was created before the stars existed in the heavens -- a testable hypothesis. Science tells me this is false, and paints an entirely different picture than Genesis. I have no reason to believe Genesis is true; in my world the scientific method must at least be a starting point to getting at the truthfulness of a thing. So using Occam's Razor I choose the internally consistent and flexible Science over the rigid and self-contradictory Biblical account.

Does magic exist in the Universe? Maybe. Have I been able to reliably observe magic forces at work? Alas, no. Never.

Christians: Serious question. Do you believe that the children at Sandy Hook Elementary were meant to die? Was that all part of God's plan for the little 6-year-old's that day? I understand the doctrine of "free will," but how does that apply to the children? According to Christian doctrine, as I understand it, we are given the free will to defy God's wishes. But what about the victims? Do they deserve to die (as Pat Robertson said about Katrina victims) for past sins? Will God only take those who were baptized (and are therefore washed of Original Sin), or will he take them all? If so, why be baptized in the first place???

Religion confuses me. Science enlightens me. Both views describe a Universe of almost unimaginable wonder and variety. But only science sincerely searches for the truth, and only science has the adaptability to someday actually find it.
2012-12-24 01:33:48 AM
1 votes:

RabidJade: Gato Blanco: Atheism is a lack of belief in a deity. Some religions are atheistic, but atheism itself is not a religion. It's like saying stamp collecting is a hobby, therefore not collecting stamps is also a hobby.

I would say "proving the fact why collecting stamps is wrong and I will prove it to you based on my opinion" is a hobby. For a lot out there, Atheism is not a non-hobby as your comparison described.


It's not that atheists go out of their way to take apart religion on religious grounds(sure, some few do, but not many really), it's that religion tries to insinuate itself into territories that should be non-religious(Ie government).

When people paste their stamp collection on my TV, car windows, money, pages of text books, etc....Me trying to stop that is not a hobby.

Despite what the naive would like to think of reality, religion in many such places can cause a real harm to society.

Christians tend to not get it. If it was Allah and his teachings plastered everywhere, women in burka's, stonings, what would their reaction be? I predict actual riots and violence, yet another holy war, literally.

Atheists? They just want the shiat off of the courthouse lawn and for religion to not influence law and educational standards.

Is that so much to ask?
2012-12-24 12:52:25 AM
1 votes:

Clemkadidlefark: Anyway ... if you have no values, there's no point in tradition ....


Lacking religion =/= lacking values

Most of us still value a good education for our nation's youth(especially this one, as so many religions want to use that education system to dumb down the kids by teaching false "science" placing kids at a distinct disadvantage), being kind to those around you(ie as peaceful as any other human being can stand to be), fixing societal problems such as poverty and crime, maintaining freedom and equality

Atheism =/= Apathy in all aspects of life

You don't need belief in a diety to care about those things or to legitimize a path towards them, you only need a bit of intelligence and a base survival drive.
2012-12-23 10:17:10 PM
1 votes:

DaCaptain19: I am an atheist and personally I'd love to see any person who follows a "higher power" strung up by the neck until dead.

Religion has been the most destructive force since the beginning of mankind. F*ck the religious - I'd love to have a license to kill you all.

It's not genocide, it's godocide. So f*ck god, f*ck jesus, f*ck mary, f*ck allah and f*ck whatever other "gods" are out there.

You're all fools.


Brilliant. Will you call this maneuver the Yeehaw then? There's a Jihad on the religious side. So at least make a name for it.

Also I hope all the political farkers of all party affiliation who are Christian, Buddhist, etc make note of your name in order to see if you'll be at a fark party. The last place they want to drink and be merry with Drew is one containing a farker that's only restraining himself/herself from killing them by waiting for a license.
2012-12-23 10:06:28 PM
1 votes:

DaCaptain19: I am an atheist and personally I'd love to see any person who follows a "higher power" strung up by the neck until dead.

Religion has been the most destructive force since the beginning of mankind. F*ck the religious - I'd love to have a license to kill you all.

It's not genocide, it's godocide. So f*ck god, f*ck jesus, f*ck mary, f*ck allah and f*ck whatever other "gods" are out there.

You're all fools.


0/10
2012-12-23 09:01:44 PM
1 votes:

BillDozer357: Bhruic: FTA: What's more, most American nonbelievers are not even atheists

Um, no. Most non-religious Americans might not be atheists, but if you are nonbeliever, you are, by definition, an atheist.

Or agnostic, or non-theist, or Laveyan Satanists even. There are many types of non-believers.


This!

People like to lump everyone into some type of philosophical container or group so they can break them down easier. Be definition I am Agnostic but I will never say I am with that group because I don't agree with that view entirely.
2012-12-23 09:00:14 PM
1 votes:

Slam1263: It's almost the end of another year.

I am still not small minded, nor mean spirited enough to be a Atheist.

To each their own, I like to say, unless your own is telling others what they can or cannot believe in.


And yet, you just dismissed those who don't see the universe in your terms as "small-minded", and "Mean-spirited".
You are a full-of-shiat hypocrite.
2012-12-23 08:35:13 PM
1 votes:

The One True TheDavid: That said, to return to "the reason for the season," where would Jesus shop?

If the Lord were alive today, what would you give him this Christmas?
What would you give someone who has everything and more?He can heal the sick, so don't give him an aspirinHe can walk on water, so don't give him support.If the lord were alive today, what would you give him this Christmas?You'd give him a $20 certificate at Pizza Joe's!joelamoroney.files.wordpress.com/Darkest TV show ever made.
2012-12-23 07:34:16 PM
1 votes:
For what it's worth, the true essence of Christianity is "Slaves, obey your masters!" (Ephesians 6:5 and Colossians 3:22) In return, after a life of being bossed around, beaten, robbed, raped and maimed while forgiven those who sin against you and turning the other cheek, you'll get to feel special because you think you'll go to Heaven. This is why the Roman Empire turned it into the official religion. And while on the one hand the Church taught the rulers a little bit about treating their underlings as if they might be worth a penny or two, they also encouraged Christian rulers to send their underlings to become sick, maimed or dead fighting against pagans, heretics, eventually allowing the rulers to conquer and enslave the peasants of the Christian land next door in exchange for money, power and influence. It's hard to imagine worshippers of Isis doing likewise. "Old Testament" Judaism was right out because reading was widespread among the Jews of the Empire and their community had some money from long-distance trade and medicine: before the days of th Internet it was far safer to build a state religion on the faith of illiterate and superstitious slaves. (Islam, the "Conquer the world for Allah!" religion, would have done as well or better, for slightly different reasons, but it hadn't been invented yet.)

That said, to return to "the reason for the season," where would Jesus shop?
2012-12-23 07:32:43 PM
1 votes:

jso2897: I don't get "angry atheists". If I had time for horseshiat like religion, I'd join one of the more profitable ones and get paid for it. I don't. And I don't have time, energy, or inclination to go around deliberately riling up the stupidest, most ignorant, and most violent people in our culture.
F**k you, angry atheists - when you deliberately provoke killer apes, you deserve to get your face bitten off.
But I would like to thank you for making life more difficult and unpleasant for normal non-believers like me - in fact, I'd like to thank your face with an aluminum softball bat.


images.retecool.com
2012-12-23 06:57:15 PM
1 votes:

ten foiled hats: bunner: ten foiled hats: I think it just scares the sh*t out of some people. For others, eh, good riddance to bad rubbish.

I think false dichotomies are the impetus of flags and flags are a bad idea, so far.

Alright. I drink beer to keep the scary jewish zombie from returning and casting me into the eternal hellfire.

Working so far.


So is my elephant talisman. I had an old British sixpence blessed by a Ghanain juju master and i have yet to be trampled by an elephant, or for that matter attacked by any large African animals of any species.
2012-12-23 06:54:54 PM
1 votes:

Keizer_Ghidorah: bunner: We're all twitchy about all of this because all of the things we built upon, belief or non belief, are losing their meaning. What we're not bright enough to do, it seems, is take a hard, long view look at what were all replacing it with, without question.

When humans were more primitive and stupid, they created gods for everything. Lightning and thunder were two divine brothers fighting over a woman, Zeus tossing thunderbolts at things that annoyed him, or a gigantic bird who fired lightning with each flap of its wings. The turning of the seasons was the deity of the climate being sad when her daughter was in the underworld and happy when she was with her. Every tree, every rock, every animal was the home of some manner of god, demigod, or other divine being. People once believed that sneezing causes your soul to fly out of your body, and saying "Bless you" prevented the Devil from taking its place. As we became smarter, as we began to explore and test and observe, we no longer needed gods to explain how things work. Like a child growing up and learning that Santa Claus is really his parents buying the presents from the store, humanity is growing up and leaving behind the need for fairy tales.

And ever notice how many gods and goddesses are created in the image of man? Even the more non-human, like the Egyptian gods, were humans with animal heads. Humans are a very self-centered and arrogant species.


When I was a child, I thought, and spoke as a child. When I became a man, I put away childish things. Including religion.
2012-12-23 06:51:37 PM
1 votes:

letrole: Atheism is a Religion. A piss-poor Religion, but a Religion regardless.

The amusing part is where an almost endless supply of Schoolboy Atheists will launch into ever-decreasing circles of denial, and exercises of semantics worthy of any medieval theologian.


I think people who beleive atheism is a religion is worthy to be called a religion based on a leap of faith and lack of logical thinking.

Religion is a belief system that contains a supernatural element.
Atheism contains no such dogma.
2012-12-23 06:50:44 PM
1 votes:
"Do you believe in god?"

"No."

*BANG!*

"Do you believe in god?"

"Yes."

"My god?

"No."

*BANG!*

"Do you believe in god?"

"Yes."

*BANG!*

"Do you believe in a completely secular view?"

"Yes."

"My completely secular view?"

"No."

*BANG!*


Next reel, please.
2012-12-23 06:31:26 PM
1 votes:

Boojum2k: Theonceovertwice: I'm an atheist, and I have no problem with Christmas.

Agnostic, but this.

The 90% of atheists who act like expressions of other peoples belief is a supernatural force that will harm them make the reasonable 10% look bad.



IMO, you make the reasonable look bad.

Government ruled by religion, or that favors religion, is a force that can harm non-religious people, and society at large.

An education system that's not allowed to teach actual science because it's against some people's creation beliefs can harm society at large. That kind of enforcement of willful ignorance is never a boon.

These are things that you are apparently grossly ignorant of, or willfully ignorant of, considering their frequent appearance even on fark.
2012-12-23 06:22:41 PM
1 votes:

bunner: So far, all I see is a lot of dismissive snorting, arrogant authority postures, some pretty nebulous science and straight off the ready to wear rack trolling. I do have the advantage of expecting nothing else, though. Nobody knows, folks. That's the adventure.


Yeah, it makes it hard to discuss anything with someone who petulantly dismisses everything shown to him and insists on acting like a child when discussing things.

Sorry, actual researched, observable, existing facts have more power and relevance than impossible-to-prove gods who you can attribute anything to and say anything about to make your opinions seem true.

letrole: ParaHandy: so nearly all of it is moving away from us faster than the speed of light
letrole: wat
ParaHandy: No, really it's true. Would I troll a trole?

It's a crock, like dark matter. Pure conjecture. Frankly, the numbers don't add up. So as a matter of faith, two cheats are used: the idea that space itself expands, and that the majority of the universe is missing in the form of purposely scare-quoted "dark matter".


Yep, the only reason they called it "dark matter" was for the scariness. Not because it's, you know, DARK as in "no light or color". For someone who dismisses science so much, you sure seem to know the intimate details of it and the minds of scientists.
2012-12-23 05:46:14 PM
1 votes:

ParaHandy: There is nothing super special about earth,


Huh. From what I've been informed of by every single science organization you can name, Earth, at least from our limited perspective, since we live here, is ASTOUNDINGLY special.
2012-12-23 05:44:43 PM
1 votes:
Atheism is a Religion. A piss-poor Religion, but a Religion regardless.

The amusing part is where an almost endless supply of Schoolboy Atheists will launch into ever-decreasing circles of denial, and exercises of semantics worthy of any medieval theologian.
2012-12-23 05:41:26 PM
1 votes:

bunner: Keizer_Ghidorah: What does being there have to do with it? Science and logic, along with the history of Earth, shows that there's no evidence of super-duper beings. Earth is 4.5 billion years old, not 6,000 years. That alone throws the Christian side out the window.

But.. teh AL1ENS! See, the thing is, the only one provable thing in this whole maelstrom of "huh UH!" is we don't really know. We do, it seems NEED to know, though. I think we should focus on that.


What we do know is already enough to reduce the scope of possibility of deities to the minimum possible: ones that exist outside our universe (or multiverse) and basically pressed the PLAY button and set it going like a little clockwork. Whether such a deity exists or not is a completely moot question of metaphysics, since they have no impact on what goes on in our world.

What religions do to try to maintain their credibility and reconcile their myths with reality is to back pedal .... "the writer of Genesis didn't really mean the earth is only 6,000 years old, it's an allegory" or "it's ok to wear polyester now, and you can no longer keep slaves, but gays are still bad" and "we changed our minds, yes the bible says the earth is round" once they could no longer contain the truth.

There is nothing super special about earth, and so it seems likely that life exists on other planets given their vast numbers (astronomers estimates just went up another order of magnitude or so recently). However, until I see evidence of it, I remain skeptical.

Similarly, any true scientist like me is definitionally agnostic (if evidence is found, then we'll believe) and an atheist based on current evidence (people have been trying to prove the existence of tens of thousands of deities for thousands of years, and not a single shred of evidence for any of them has turned up). The odds are not looking good for the sky fairies.

The value of hypothesis about how the universe works is in its ability to enable us to predict and control it. For example, Christian prayer has been scientifically tested hundreds of times in the last few decades and has never beaten the null hypothesis in outcomes. Thus, the hypothesis that there is a Christian god who can be coerced or persuaded by prayer can be roundly rejected.

Quantum mechanics sounds just as fanciful as religion - even Einstein famously said "God does not play dice". However, it became established science, and so he changed his position. In later life, he also became an atheist.
2012-12-23 05:41:21 PM
1 votes:

bunner: They are. Nothing turning into everything is just as ludicrous as some big guy with a beard knocking together a petri dish with us in it. It really, really is. The fact that you need to rabidly attack me with false assertions, strawmen ("Oh so you're saying that...") IS a strawman, kid) and to equate being annoying and insulting with some sort of intellectual acuity got boring about 20 posts ago. Kid. And frankly, nothing says "Um, this guy is a little too worked up about this" like being a rabid, pushy dolt. It's an absolute plastic bag over the head of anything like a self evidently valid argument, Ask anybody who has chased Mormons away from his door. So... here is where I shut your silly ass off and the universe continues to do whatever it's doing and you say "z0mG!11 I am s0 teh W1N cause he had to like IGNOR3 ME!" You get the feeling I've sat through this movie before? : )


It's so much goddamned fun playing chess with someone who only knows the rules for checkers.
2012-12-23 05:20:52 PM
1 votes:

bunner: "All this shiat evolved from some carbon and water that suddenly got a huge bug up it's ass and decided to mutate into about 290457892783498579028375689724958 different things from single cells." "Uh, otay, Pokey."


Carbon is everything. Most fats are composed almost entirely of carbon and hydrogen. Most proteins are carbon, hydrogen, oxygen, and nitrogen in different arrangements. Hell, METH is just  C10H15N. The chemicals of life are built from what's floating around in the atmosphere and mixing with the water.

Do yourself a take an introductory biochem course. Or some light reading. Evolution isn't hard at all. Take some naturally-occurring minerals in some water and hit them with lightning. BOOM, amino acids. Notable in chemistry for their ability to self-arrange into polypeptide chains of arbitrary length. Leave an entire lake's worth, or ocean's worth, of them chaotically bouncing off of each other and rearranging for, say, 50,000 years and it becomes a bad bet that a self-replicating chain DIDN'T form at some point.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molecular_evolution

And, listen. I don't know if there's a god. I just think it's complete lunacy for someone to tell me, based on their access to the same evidence that I have, that THEY not only KNOW that god exists, but they have an extremely specific list of that god's likes and dislikes, and there's some kind of reward for me at the end if I follow the rules. And punishment if I don't.

Based on my complete lack of any evidence that this life isn't it, I tend to live my life under the assumption that it is, that there's nothing after.
2012-12-23 05:17:52 PM
1 votes:

letrole: gad: Atheists are doing what they need to do to be heard and to gain some position in the society.

bunner: So stop trying to get a gold star from the people you insist oppress and loathe you. It makes you look silly.

Atheists demand respect and expect acceptance of their beliefs. Atheists feel dirty inside. All the anger, the forced arrogance, the belligerence -- it's simply shame turned inside out.


You're cute
2012-12-23 05:16:15 PM
1 votes:
I really couldn't care less about what people believe runs this universe, or how obstinately ignorant people can be about obvious, proven, scientific fact (evolution). Everybody has a right to be as crazy/retarded as they want to be as long as nobody gets hurt. I politely decline flyers from various nuts all year and never feel the need to correct anyone's assumptions about what Jesus' favorite dinosaur was to ride to work.

Its when I hear someone with authority start preaching while operating in their authoritarian capacity that angers me. Like when I hear a small town judge at night court tell some teenager "That's not Gods plan." as I did last week. I want to peel the flesh off his back, nail him to the top of a picnic table and set it on end at the top of a hill then proceed to poke him with a sharp stick and ask "WHERE IS YOUR FARKING GOD NOW YOU DISGUSTING PIECE OF SHIAT?"
2012-12-23 05:03:35 PM
1 votes:

rko281: I'd actually be an atheist if I could somehow muster that kind of deep, unquestioning faith that I was absolutely, infallibly right and there were no other possibilities.


You'd be a terrible atheist, as you think it involves "deep, unquestioning faith". Most of us have chosen atheism because we are reasonable, and reason precludes deep unquestioning faith.
2012-12-23 05:00:38 PM
1 votes:

Rufus Lee King: Medic Zero: You mean like all those fine folks who can't speak a sentence without a "praise the lord" or somesuch included?

I don't know any of these folks you mention. I'm fifty-five years old, and have never met one.


Oh. Well, they must not exist then. Because your 55 years of life experience equals the sum total of all human existence.
2012-12-23 04:46:19 PM
1 votes:

bunner: With all due respect, nothing about "whatever you think is super dumb" begs much of a response that I can actually say with a straight face.


And, with all due respect, I completely stand by it. Whatever superstitious belief you hold, or anyone holds, is laughable when viewed from a rational perspective. History is not kind to any superstition.

"Fire, a natural chemical reaction, was originally stolen from heaven."
"Yeah, there was probably a guy born of a virgin, who cured illnesses, and rose from the dead."
"Yeah, there was probably a god who had a bunch of hybrid children with farm animals out of boredom."
"Oh, the land masses of the Earth were originally giants that fell from the sky into the ocean. Obviously."
2012-12-23 04:30:57 PM
1 votes:
Quick history lesson...

There was a War on Christmas, it was in 2005-2006. Religious symbols have no place on public property but there was this drive to purge the word "Christmas" out of everything and even demands to remove Christmas trees from various schools/public places.

Yes, that did happen, and it was stupid, and the people who were behind it were arseholes.

I remember repeatedly making the statement "I'm an atheist, the name of the holiday is Christmas, and there is nothing wrong with trees. Get over yourselves"

The effort to completely destroy the word "Christmas" from being used by anyone created a justified backlash but unfortunately the religious cannot let it go so they have to act like the efforts to remove teh baby jesus from the public square where he does not belong are the same as the people who tried to yank Christmas trees out of schools 5-6 years ago.
2012-12-23 04:30:24 PM
1 votes:
i49.tinypic.com.
2012-12-23 04:15:42 PM
1 votes:

Rufus Lee King: If you want to be an atheist, be an atheist.

However, the "HEY, EVERYBODY!!! LOOKIT ME!!! I'M AN ATHEIST!!!" thing is best left out.

No one cares about your personal problems.


Because religious people NEVER promote their beliefs/problems?
2012-12-23 04:13:57 PM
1 votes:

letrole: I noticed a lot of these goobers have started bleating about strawman this and strawman that.

The bad part is that there aren't any strawman arguments being exposed. Please learn a new farking word.

Strawman is the new Troll.


While you are still nothing more than an old one.  Also, asking people to "please learn a new farking word" is rich coming from the child who trots out "atheism is a religion" every goddamn time one of these threads hit the main page.

You bore me.  *Plonk*
2012-12-23 04:10:27 PM
1 votes:
I'm an athiest and really dont care if people want to celebrate thier holiday. Most athiests are more annoying than christains. STFU and let people enjoy themselves the way they see fit. Merry Xmas, happy holidays, and that jewish thing that I cant spell or care to learn. Peace on earth and good will toward men...and women. Now go make me a sandwich.
2012-12-23 04:10:00 PM
1 votes:

kingoomieiii: bunner: Buffalo77: Yeah brave atheists, go go go. Brave atheists keep up the work.

Next up, start the war on muslim holiday, go to a mosque and draw pictures of mocking Mohammed.

yeah, brave atheists go do that.

Hey, Hey HEY! Let's not get all out of hand here!

Atheists in Islamic countries take on Islam.



Now THOSE would be brave atheists indeed.
2012-12-23 04:01:09 PM
1 votes:

Darth_Lukecash:
Who said it would be better? I'm sure we'll find some philosophical/political theory to fight about. I'm just saying that certain things will be abandoned.


Have you seen the episode of South Park where Cartman travels to 3000 AD and finds out that they have turned science into a religion and worship video games? :)

It's true that most humans will eventually eschew religion, just like we put behind us any other false belief ... the earth is flat, blood ebbs and flows, phlogiston, banging sticks together to make it rain, ...

Religion has left us some cool shiat. Scotland is covered in stone circles, and the beautiful disused churches in Edinburgh make great pubs, restaurants and theatres.
2012-12-23 03:47:17 PM
1 votes:

Amos Quito: thornhill: Amos Quito: Do atheists ever troll Jews? Not in Israel (Jews trolling Jews), but here in the US?

Probably not because Jews generally don't push public policy based on their religion.





 






They don't?


I don't recall any Jewish person demanding a menorah be placed a court house lawn.

Nor have they demanded shrimp be outlawed.

But they do hsve a great interest not in being executed in genocide. Nor do they wish to see the country that was founded to protect their people, wiped out.
2012-12-23 03:38:23 PM
1 votes:

thornhill: Amos Quito: Do atheists ever troll Jews? Not in Israel (Jews trolling Jews), but here in the US?


Probably not because Jews generally don't push public policy based on their religion.

momentmagazine.files.wordpress.com

ericpalmer.files.wordpress.com

 www.bollyn.com


atljewishtimes55.1upprelaunch.com

www.globalpost.com

They don't?
2012-12-23 03:38:04 PM
1 votes:

fluffy2097: Cheesus: fluffy2097: Cheesus: I'm sure there are athiests out there that despise Christmas and want it completely destroyed. Most of us just want the constitution upheld.

That's a good laugh.

/r/atheism regularly talks about how much better the world will be when the final solution of getting rid of all religion is implemented.

And Freepers are representative of all Republicans.

Unlike free republic, Reddit actually has a sizable user base and the people who post regularly number in the tens to hundreds of thousands (since it's a default sub you can't tell who's just stuck reading their garbage).

so yes, /r/atheism is in fact a representative sample.


Eh, if you say so. Anonymity tends to bring out the worst in people. That, combined with the fact that atheists tend to be blamed for everything bad that's ever happened, ever makes them angry and want to lash out. Been there, grown up.
2012-12-23 03:36:50 PM
1 votes:

rko281: I'd actually be an atheist if I could somehow muster that kind of deep, unquestioning faith that I was absolutely, infallibly right and there were no other possibilities.


To be fair, it took me a considerable amount of soul searching and observation to come by my lack of faith in an invisible sky wizard. What sealed the deal for me was hearing the many accounts of people -- and I'm not talking about schizophrenics necessarily -- who claimed to hear "God's voice." They were so inconsistent, contradictory, often ridiculously petty, self-serving, and sometimes weapons-grade crazy. What sort of singular entity would behave so capriciously? Surely the One True God would proffer a consistent message. My conclusion: it ain't God, it's your brain chemistry.
2012-12-23 03:35:46 PM
1 votes:

GAT_00: When you live down here, you really do feel threatened just for being nonreligious and are treated as a threat by supposedly good Christians who hate you.


I've been agnostic, and indifferent to religion, and religious holidays for 35 years. I don't go to people's christmas gatherings, don't participate in the office shindig, etc. I've never, ever, ever, even once, felt threatened or treated wrongly because of my lack of belief.

If people hate you, it may just be because of your personality. It is at least an explanation you should strongly consider.
2012-12-23 03:27:12 PM
1 votes:

thornhill: Amos Quito: Do atheists ever troll Jews? Not in Israel (Jews trolling Jews), but here in the US?

Probably not because Jews generally don't push public policy based on their religion. I mean, when was the last time you heard someone who was Jewish complain about the lack of school prayer or teaching evolution?


Um...you familiar with U.S. foreign policy?
2012-12-23 03:23:39 PM
1 votes:

Amos Quito: Pitabred: Buffalo77: Yeah brave atheists, go go go. Brave atheists keep up the work.

Next up, start the war on muslim holiday, go to a mosque and draw pictures of mocking Mohammed.

yeah, brave atheists go do that.

Done

Next?


Okay, now troll Jews!

Do atheists ever troll Jews? Not in Israel (Jews trolling Jews), but here in the US?


Not really. Jews don't tend to be douchebags about their religion, though, and try to get it inserted into politics.

fluffy2097: Pitabred: Buffalo77: Yeah brave atheists, go go go. Brave atheists keep up the work.

Next up, start the war on muslim holiday, go to a mosque and draw pictures of mocking Mohammed.

yeah, brave atheists go do that.

Done

Next?

So the internet is a mosque now?

Do something beyond the confines of your keyboard.


Wait... you expect me to actually go vandalize someone else's property because I disagree with them, rather than simply contest their ideas in public? How Christian of you.
2012-12-23 03:22:51 PM
1 votes:

Amos Quito: Do atheists ever troll Jews? Not in Israel (Jews trolling Jews), but here in the US?


Probably not because Jews generally don't push public policy based on their religion. I mean, when was the last time you heard someone who was Jewish complain about the lack of school prayer or teaching evolution?
2012-12-23 03:22:39 PM
1 votes:

letrole: Now I Is! The moral code of a Druid, for example, is quite staunchly against any form of bigotry, misogyny, or dogmatic disbelief in the fundamental principles of nature.


Off to good and inclusive start, but then they lose points with the bit concerning human sacrifices and playing football with the skulls of the enemy killed in battle.


But that's the advantage of having no strict dogma, admitting that your ancestors were wrong is actually quite easy.
2012-12-23 03:06:57 PM
1 votes:

Molavian: Darth_Lukecash: It's not faith, it's knowlege. It's what you can prove.

I'm pretty sure you have to take a ton of shiat that other people prove on faith, since you can't possibly understand how to prove it on your own.


I have no understanding of computer programming and electronics. Yet here I am typing to you from my phone.

I have hard evidence that science works. I also know from evidence that science can be wrong due to lack of information or misinterpretation.

Why? Because of all of mans intellectual tools, science always demands proof- not faith.
2012-12-23 03:04:20 PM
1 votes:

Fade2black: How did Atheists manage to go about their daily lives for the past hundreds of years before these Wars on Christmas started? THE HUGE MANATEE!!!

Or you could be some seculiar sect of the douchebag liberal "i'm a victim" by proxy. Either way even Penn Jillette thinks most Atheists act like retards.


They managed because they kept it to themselves and pretended to be good little Christians or whatever the dominant religion of the area was. If they didn't, they would've been ran out of town or killed.

There are assholes in every crowd, and I'm sure there are athiests out there that despise Christmas and want it completely destroyed. Most of us just want the constitution upheld. Religion is for church. Nativity scenes and other religious displays do not belong on public property. Outside of that, Merry Christmas, Happy Hannukah, and whatever else is going on in December/January.
2012-12-23 03:03:50 PM
1 votes:

Amos Quito: Sorry atheists, but I really don't understand the POUTRAGE!

WTF do you care?

[i1121.photobucket.com image 496x484]

^ What "activist atheists" might look like ^


People's beliefs have an effect on what they do and how they stand on issues. Beliefs don't exist in a vacuum, they aren't cordoned off in some corner somewhere where it's all happy fun time and anyone can believe anything they want without it having any impact on others. That's why we care.
2012-12-23 03:03:39 PM
1 votes:

Fade2black: Any Atheist already took that medal home.



Lets look at some real bravery at work.

www.csmonitor.com

/This, you pansy assed Atheists, is what being brave is. Go walk yourself into the lions den like the WBC, and then maybe I'll think you're brave.
2012-12-23 03:01:48 PM
1 votes:
farm3.staticflickr.com
2012-12-23 03:01:41 PM
1 votes:

12349876: Gosling: telling all who will listen of the benefits of atheism, trying to convert people to atheism

If that's your criteria for a religion, just about everything is a religion. Every product advertised on your TV is a religion, here's the benefits of the Ford Focus and why you should convert from your stupid Toyota.


Because consumerism is the only REAL religion.

/we worship the almighty dollar

//all of us
2012-12-23 02:56:44 PM
1 votes:

Repo Man: whatshisname: david_gaithersburg: On the bright side, we can take some enjoyment in the fact that a number of these evangelical atheist will off themselves at some point between now and Valentine's Day.

WTF?

He seems to be under the impression that we're having a Who Can Be The Biggest Asshole contest on Fark, and he's going for gold.


Any Atheist troll in this thread already took that medal home about 10 minutes ago.
2012-12-23 02:47:54 PM
1 votes:
i.qkme.me
2012-12-23 02:44:41 PM
1 votes:

Darth_Lukecash: It's not faith, it's knowlege. It's what you can prove.


I'm pretty sure you have to take a ton of shiat that other people prove on faith, since you can't possibly understand how to prove it on your own.
2012-12-23 02:43:51 PM
1 votes:
As an Agnostic with Neo-Pagan sympathies, I've grown tired of how the various crimes against common sense committed by certain Abrahamic fundamentalists are presumed to be, by some Atheists, the fundamental traits of anyone who purports to be religious. The moral code of a Druid, for example, is quite staunchly against any form of bigotry, misogyny, or dogmatic disbelief in the fundamental principles of nature.
2012-12-23 02:40:44 PM
1 votes:

Rufus Lee King: First, no one is trying to "oppress" you, or anything of that nature.


Then let's talk about fetuses, shall we?
2012-12-23 02:40:26 PM
1 votes:

rko281: I'd actually be an atheist if I could somehow muster that kind of deep, unquestioning faith that I was absolutely, infallibly right and there were no other possibilities.


It's not faith, it's knowlege. It's what you can prove. There never has been proof of any higher power.

It's has never been on the Atheist to prove a negative, it's alway up to those who believe something exist, to show evidence.

" the other possibility" leads to Allah, Zeus, Satan, Great Father, Harry Potter and Superman.
2012-12-23 02:38:22 PM
1 votes:

bunner: If you're all f*cked up about people knocking up some blowmold figurines and some straw and a balsa wood hut once a year, I mean if this DEEPLY AFFECTS YOU, I'd ease up on the intellectual superiority fandango a bit.


Says somebody who would never, ever complain about billboards with Atheist sayings.

Give it a rest; we've heard this song and dance many, many times before.
2012-12-23 02:25:41 PM
1 votes:

mediablitz: Give me a call the next time an angry mob of atheists burns someone to death because of their religion.


That's just sidestepping the issue. It's a way for you to cop out on all of the evil things Atheists have done and not take responsibility for it.

"It wasn't done in the name of this thing I claim I don't have therefore the evil I do commit doesn't matter"
2012-12-23 02:25:11 PM
1 votes:
Almost forgot. We were at WalMart yesterday, in a big city, mind you, and there was a mob of 6-10 year olds standing outside and offering to shake people's hands. Couldn't get past the little mites although I tried to do so politely and unobtrusively. So, this one little boy offers his hand to me and after hesitating for a moment I shook it. He said, "Merry Christmas, Jesus loves you!", I turned to my old man and kind of pointed him out to the kid and said thanks, but he's the Christian, not me. I know it wasn't nice, I hope I didn't mess with the kid too much, but please don't mob me on my way out of WalMart. I know my way to a very nice Christian church should I ever choose to convert, thankyouverymuch (old man is an officer of his church and still lives in sin with me). I know the kid didn't know that, and I should've watched my tongue, but after 2 hours in WalMart, I was a little short on patience.
2012-12-23 02:23:01 PM
1 votes:

mediablitz: Give me a call the next time an angry mob of atheists burns someone to death because of their religion.


Yeah, just last week, or was it 1630, non-believers were burned at the stake. I could be a little off on the date. then again, I'm pretty sure they repealed the laws allowing slavery, so, don't take my word for it.
2012-12-23 02:22:22 PM
1 votes:

specialkae: "In small-town USA, people are much more likely to be anti-religious because they have religion thrown in their face all the time - prayers at little league, prayers at city council meetings, Nativity scenes and Ten Commandments billboards, preachers on the radio and TV, etc. - and their lack of religion is often associated with being immoral."

So much THIS. I lived in a smaller community, roughly 40K, for about 7 years. I am a Pagan, my best friend (who recently passed, sadly) was a die hard atheist. Let's just say that she and I compared notes time and time again about the discrimination and bigotry of our community over the years. Narrow minded, and sometimes very nasty people would give each of us a hard time, and don't get me started on the teasing and questioning I got from me being a person of faith and my best friend being godless. Ridiculous. I'm not one bit anti Christmas (Christians however should be aware by now that they basically co-opted beliefs of many older systems and be accepting about it) and neither was my atheist friend-she and her husband celebrated it as a secular holiday that was all about food and seeing family and friends together and rejoicing that spring would be on the way. She just got her back up, as did I, when dealing with bigoted arseholes in small town America who were utterly convinced we would be the downfall of their fair community.

/my departed godless friend was one of only a handful of people I could discuss ethics, religion and politics sensibly with
//ashes to ashes and all that


You will find the same thing everywhere. People are mean regardless of belief or political bent. It is not limited to small towns or big cities. People are simply assholes and will be judgmental and biased no matter where you live.
2012-12-23 02:21:43 PM
1 votes:

Iron Felix: Atheists who try to get all up in peoples' faces about it are just as bad as religious nuts who try to get all up in peoples' faces abut it.


I don't think that there are many atheists that get up in peoples' faces. Most simply want the religious sorts to stop getting up in their faces.

That seemed to be the focus of the first half of the article, that atheists seem to be more aggressive when they have religion forced onto them, such as prayers before government meetings, city sponsored nativity scenes, new installations of the ten commandments, the newly placing "In God we Trust" on courthouses all over Tennessee (they are trying this shiat all over Tennessee, just google it), etc...

If the religious people would simply mellow out and leave things at the status quo, the atheists would be more mellow too. But not a day goes by in the bible belt where some paster or religious zealot isn't trying to force their religious view point on others, and so atheists react.
2012-12-23 02:21:13 PM
1 votes:

rko281: I'd actually be an atheist if I could somehow muster that kind of deep, unquestioning faith that I was absolutely, infallibly right and there were no other possibilities.


Great strawman.
2012-12-23 02:14:34 PM
1 votes:

letrole: Atheism is a Religion.



I don't believe in anything unfalsifiable. Is that a religion?
2012-12-23 02:00:27 PM
1 votes:

Rufus Lee King: If you want to be an atheist, be an atheist.

However, the "HEY, EVERYBODY!!! LOOKIT ME!!! I'M AN ATHEIST!!!" thing is best left out.

No one cares about your personal problems.


You mean like all those fine folks who can't speak a sentence without a "praise the lord" or somesuch included?
2012-12-23 01:59:15 PM
1 votes:
I would bet that the most militant and reactionary atheists are generally those who were brought up with religion. This is of course based on my own anecdotal experience. Everyone that I know who has been brought up agnostic/atheist/secular celebrates Christmas with their families and lets religion alone. The real reactionaries I know were those who were brought up religious and later rejected it.

Does anyone know if this correlation has been shown to exist?
2012-12-23 01:52:39 PM
1 votes:

david_gaithersburg: Ahhh, another hate speech thread.


Poor Christianity!
2012-12-23 01:52:24 PM
1 votes:

vpb: "Here's the bottom line: Where religion is weak, atheism is weak" in its intensity, says Pitzer sociologist Phil Zuckerman. "Where religion is strong, atheism is strong."

This organized Atheism thing is just a reaction to obnoxious bible thumpers.


Or, the desire and/or need for an organized religion is independent of actual beliefs and in areas where the culture instils such a social need people will participate in these organizations.
2012-12-23 01:52:01 PM
1 votes:
Atheism is a Religion.
2012-12-23 01:51:56 PM
1 votes:

RexTalionis: Hey, Christians. Rampant commercialism destroyed Christmas long before atheists even bothered to care.


Done in three.
2012-12-23 01:50:54 PM
1 votes:
*rtfa*

That phenomena is known as "overcompensation," and I can't say I necessarily disagree with it. You have to push as hard against the wind as the wind pushes against you.
2012-12-23 01:50:39 PM
1 votes:
It's actually a war on the Christina religion piggybacking the various winter solstice traditions. It was Saturnalia and Yule and all that long before the god botherers came around.

My personal war is against dis-information and its negative effects. All religions are disinformation, and their adherents to believe untrue myths. This is their absolute right in their private spaces and churches, but it impacts us all when they try to insert it into public life.

The billboard in Times Square is a bit unfortunate .... there is some evidence (and no, writings 400 years after the fact are not evidence) that there was a real, historical philosopher called Jesus / Issa, who was in fact crucified by the Romans. Admittedly less than there is for the existence of Paul and some others, and the Jesus in the bible may in fact be a fictional idealized amalgam of Paul and others.

Why can't they all just move into compounds?
2012-12-23 01:47:14 PM
1 votes:

GAT_00: That argument makes a lot of sense. When you live down here, you really do feel threatened just for being nonreligious and are treated as a threat by supposedly good Christians who hate you.


Nonreligious is all well and good, but what i think a lot of atheists don't realize is that even though they don't have a religion of their own, they exhibit so many of the mannerisms of religion- telling all who will listen of the benefits of atheism, trying to convert people to atheism- that they are effectively treated as a religion. It's the same basic idea as Jon Stewart saying he's not a journalist. Yeah, Jon, you kind of are.

I put up a blog post with further thoughts on the topic a few days ago, using Penn Jillette as my foil.
2012-12-23 01:44:12 PM
1 votes:
Christmas is pretty much a secular holiday anyway.

It celebrates when Santa died on the cross to give you eternal low low doorbuster prices.
2012-12-23 01:43:01 PM
1 votes:
All the bible thumpers need to do is to have a miracle occur during prime time viewing hours.
2012-12-23 01:42:20 PM
1 votes:

RexTalionis: Hey, Christians. Rampant commercialism destroyed Christmas long before atheists even bothered to care.


Oh, that sounds a terrible bother. Do go on at length at the travails and tribulations of trying to EDUCATE the poor Jesus idiots. *snort* Take away the smirk and the down the nose harrumph and the atheist "movement" looks a lot like a bunch of kids playing "Oh, nuh UH!, *I* am smarter!" As if staunch non-belief in something had some air of inherent intellectual credibility about it. It doesn't. Would that not be be interesting if it did?
2012-12-23 01:40:34 PM
1 votes:

Bhruic: FTA: What's more, most American nonbelievers are not even atheists

Um, no. Most non-religious Americans might not be atheists, but if you are nonbeliever, you are, by definition, an atheist.


Or agnostic, or non-theist, or Laveyan Satanists even. There are many types of non-believers.
2012-12-23 01:15:56 PM
1 votes:

Dead for Tax Reasons: ToxicMunkee: This year the Christmas season started before most people were done eating their Thanksgiving dinner. The War on Christmas is a lie.

Thanksgiving?

Halloween is starting to feel threatened


Can Decemberween be far behind?
2012-12-23 09:28:33 AM
1 votes:

swaniefrmreddeer: fungelicals


Fun evangelicals? Do they have cake, play games, have great picnics with clowns and stuff?

I may have to take another look at this Christianity thing...
2012-12-23 08:39:38 AM
1 votes:

St_Francis_P: And they must be stopped

Uhm...why?


Because JESUS!!!
 
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