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(Huffington Post)   "It was worse than if the NRA had not spoken at all," says PR exec for firearms manufacturers   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 700
    More: Obvious, Wayne LaPierre, NRA, Cerberus Capital Management, armed police, strategic communication, Freedom Group, Smith & Wesson, Sandy Hook  
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8091 clicks; posted to Politics » on 22 Dec 2012 at 10:59 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-22 10:14:24 AM
Ya think?
 
2012-12-22 10:42:03 AM
That applies to most of what the Conservative Entertainment Complex has been saying lately, too. They would have been better off to just STFU.
 
2012-12-22 10:59:25 AM

St_Francis_P: That applies to most of what the Conservative Entertainment Complex has been saying lately, too. They would have been better off to just STFU.


The people that run the NRA and by and large join the NRA are people that have massive egos and power fantasies. In the case of the people in charge, this manifests as a delusion that "Everyone is waiting to see what we have to say about this travesty." They had to get out SOMETHING, or else everyone would think them powerless or too horrified to act in the face of overwhelming horror.

They see themselves on the side of a war that, if nothing is done in the face of a national heartache, will turn against them. Those twenty kids are simply pawns in their game of blame chess, and they need to make sure the blame goes somewhere else other than the availability of guns to crazy people.
 
2012-12-22 11:00:42 AM
Republicans putting their foot in their mouths. Film at 11.
 
2012-12-22 11:01:50 AM
Sounds like they shot themselves in the foot this time.....
 
2012-12-22 11:02:53 AM
Acting as if it is "just" any one thing, like "just" mental health issues, or "just" violent video games is so ignorant. To be able to tell yourself guns are absolutely not part of the problem seems not only ignorant, but stupid and impossible.
 
2012-12-22 11:04:10 AM
I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??
 
2012-12-22 11:05:33 AM
Best use of the "obvious" tag in months.  Even NRA members want La Pierre to just farking go away...
 
2012-12-22 11:05:53 AM

TimonC346: Acting as if it is "just" any one thing, like "just" mental health issues, or "just" violent video games is so ignorant. To be able to tell yourself guns are absolutely not part of the problem seems not only ignorant, but stupid and impossible.


YOU SHUT UP WITH YOUR NUANCE!

No, I agree. I don't want to ban these guns (especially since it would be impossible anyway), but some restriction and a mental health care system that can actually be equipped to maybe catch and help some of these guys before the bullets start flying would be nice.
 
2012-12-22 11:07:15 AM

Shadowknight: The people that run the NRA and by and large join the NRA are people that have massive egos and power fantasies.


I would almost argue the opposite. They are by and large very scared and insecure people. They just put up a big front. It's a real life equivalent to being an internet tough guy.
 
2012-12-22 11:07:54 AM
If the NRA wants to put armed guards in schools, then let's tax gun manufacturers so we can afford to put armed guards at our schools.

You want to act like Big Tobacco, better be ready to pay up like Big Tobacco.
 
2012-12-22 11:08:18 AM
Hey, if you're gonna crash and burn, CRASH AND BURN GUNS A'BLAZIN!!!
 
2012-12-22 11:09:03 AM

Kome: I would almost argue the opposite. They are by and large very scared and insecure people. They just put up a big front. It's a real life equivalent to being an internet tough guy.


Isn't that true of anyone who feels unsafe going to the mall without a gun in their pants?
 
2012-12-22 11:09:41 AM
NRA logic: guns don't kill people, but video games do.  Why is the gun not to blame when someone kills a child with it, but the video game is to blame?
 
2012-12-22 11:10:16 AM

raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??


Kindergarten Killer was and still is the number one video game of all time. My students quote it as they walk past me into the classroom. They are obsessed. They make shooting motions with their fingers all the time.
 
2012-12-22 11:11:40 AM

raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??


That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.
 
2012-12-22 11:12:18 AM
Best thing I read: the constitution says we need to be armed against the government ...and now the NRA says we must fully arm the government.
 
2012-12-22 11:13:52 AM
I play violent video games and own guns. I feel like I'm dividing by zero.
 
2012-12-22 11:13:54 AM

theteacher: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

Kindergarten Killer was and still is the number one video game of all time. My students quote it as they walk past me into the classroom. They are obsessed. They make shooting motions with their fingers all the time.


I still can't believe he listed a 10-year-old Flash game as somehow relevant.
 
2012-12-22 11:14:07 AM

BarkingUnicorn: But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.


for mad libs fun, replace 'fox news' with video games in the above.

well, not that they 'play' it, unless calling the dog 'Pinhead' and yelling at it about socialism counts.
 
2012-12-22 11:14:17 AM
Seriously, did anybody really expect the NRA to say something constructive about the Sandy Hook massacre? I wasn't the least bit surprised their "statement" was just straw man arguments full of piss and vinegar.
 
2012-12-22 11:14:23 AM

Kome: Shadowknight: The people that run the NRA and by and large join the NRA are people that have massive egos and power fantasies.

I would almost argue the opposite. They are by and large very scared and insecure people. They just put up a big front. It's a real life equivalent to being an internet tough guy.


These things aren't mutually exclusive.

TimonC346: Acting as if it is "just" any one thing, like "just" mental health issues, or "just" violent video games is so ignorant. To be able to tell yourself guns are absolutely not part of the problem seems not only ignorant, but stupid and impossible.


But don't worry, they have the solution: MOAR GUNS
 
2012-12-22 11:14:48 AM

Shadowknight: The people that run the NRA and by and large join the NRA are people that have massive egos and power fantasies. In the case of the people in charge, this manifests as a delusion that "Everyone is waiting to see what we have to say about this travesty." They had to get out SOMETHING, or else everyone would think them powerless or too horrified to act in the face of overwhelming horror.


...and now everyone thinks of them as nuts who are overreacting in the face of overwhelming horror. That and deflecting, rationalizing apologetics.
 
2012-12-22 11:15:43 AM

Rincewind53: theteacher: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

Kindergarten Killer was and still is the number one video game of all time. My students quote it as they walk past me into the classroom. They are obsessed. They make shooting motions with their fingers all the time.

I still can't believe he listed a 10-year-old Flash game as somehow relevant.


Huckabee specifically singled out Natural Born Killers. A movie that came out in 1992. You underestimate the power of the Derp side.
 
2012-12-22 11:16:09 AM

Coelacanth: If the NRA wants to put armed guards in schools, then let's tax gun manufacturers so we can afford to put armed guards at our schools.


These are the same types of people who don't vote for school levies because their kids don't go to public school.
 
2012-12-22 11:16:27 AM
24.media.tumblr.com
 
2012-12-22 11:17:00 AM

raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??


Thankfully, video games are protected by the first amendment. And 1st beats 2nd, right?
 
2012-12-22 11:17:24 AM

Close2TheEdge: Seriously, did anybody really expect the NRA to say something constructive about the Sandy Hook massacre?


when i saw the speaker was LaPierre, i expected nothing less than the high quality lunacy i've come to know and revile.

if they (somehow, someway) had aimed towards constructive, it would have been somebody else at the podium. but you go to ideology with the crank you have, not the crank you wish you had. or something.
 
2012-12-22 11:17:25 AM

BarkingUnicorn: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.


Which wouldn't have been a problem if his NRA Survivalist mother had properly secured her weapons.  Instead, she had unsecured weapons in a house with someone she was trying to get committed for being mentally unstable.  The only surprising thing about incidents like this is that they don't happen more.
 
2012-12-22 11:18:04 AM

Close2TheEdge: Rincewind53: theteacher: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

Kindergarten Killer was and still is the number one video game of all time. My students quote it as they walk past me into the classroom. They are obsessed. They make shooting motions with their fingers all the time.

I still can't believe he listed a 10-year-old Flash game as somehow relevant.

Huckabee specifically singled out Natural Born Killers. A movie that came out in 1992. You underestimate the power of the Derp side.


Well, I guess that makes sense from a guy who runs his life from a 1700-year-old book.
 
2012-12-22 11:18:23 AM

BarkingUnicorn: That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.


...y'know what? I'm gonna have to put out a [citation needed] on that. I don't think I've seen one real instance of any sort of death occuring because the perp got the idea playing video games, or the perp thought the real world was a video game. There are more deaths that can be directly attributed to watching pro wrestling.
 
2012-12-22 11:19:10 AM

Kome: Shadowknight: The people that run the NRA and by and large join the NRA are people that have massive egos and power fantasies.

I would almost argue the opposite. They are by and large very scared and insecure people. They just put up a big front. It's a real life equivalent to being an internet tough guy.


Kind of what I'm saying, though. The ego may or may not be a front, and they may or may not actually believe it. But the gun and power fantasies reinforce it either way. The kind of people that made me not want to carry a gun off duty while I was with the PD.

If I were at a convenience store in civies and saw it getting held up, I was supposed to be able to draw my weapon and announce myself and command the situation. But there were a couple times in our country around that time, one of which was in my city, where something like this happened and some gun toting wannabe hero heard the ruckus, saw a gun drawn, and began firing on the off duty officer. Because they aren't trained to access the situation, only to acquire and fire, they became dangerous for us.

Thankfully, I only had to draw my weapon a handful of times on duty (never fired) and never off, but the prospect was not one I liked. I would have killed a person to save myself and others, yes, but I wouldn't like it. These big talkers seem to relish the idea, like it will make the be like Bruce Willis or something.

Maybe that's why they blamed video games. Because they can't separate fantasy from reality, they assume others can't either.
 
2012-12-22 11:19:35 AM

raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??


Conservatives have been doing that since the Kentucky school shooting in 98. That argument is bound to work one of these days.
 
2012-12-22 11:20:10 AM
NRA position:

"It's not the guns, it's the gunman."
"It's not the gamer, it's the games."

But no, no contradiction in their viewpoint at all.
 
2012-12-22 11:20:12 AM

raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??


i.imgur.com
 
2012-12-22 11:20:23 AM

BarkingUnicorn: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.


Said mentally ill person is losing the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality due to his mental illness, not video games. And if it weren't video games providing the fantasy, it would be movies, or the voices he's imagining, or some other thing.

Mentally ill people don't get convinced to do things they really don't want to do, for the most part. They seek a means to justify the things they really want to do. When they recover from the illness, they can see the twisted "logic" for what it is and are horrified by what they chose to do, but that doesn't mean they didn't make that choice. We don't hold them responsible for the choice, because they were ill, which isn't the same thing.


If a crazy guy is going to get violent, keeping him away from video games won't stop that. And if a crazy guy won't get violent, letting him play Call of Duty won't suddenly make him so.
 
2012-12-22 11:20:36 AM

BarkingUnicorn: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.


Yes but if they do somehow get inspired by mortal kombat and decide ripping the still beating hearts from their enemies' chests sounds like lots of fun, they're not *actually* going to be able to do it with a videogame. They're going to need a weapon for that.

No one is saying that you can prevent people from killing people. Sadly, murder is a thing the world over. All we're saying is it might be a bit harder for a disturbed person to take out a classroom of kids in 3 minutes if it was just a little harder to get your hands on the type of weaponry that can wipe out a classroom of kids in 3 minutes.
 
2012-12-22 11:20:59 AM
My dad stopped his membership with the NRA right after they endorsed Romney for President. We know what kind of group it is, don't we?
 
2012-12-22 11:22:07 AM

GAT_00: BarkingUnicorn: raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??

That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.

Which wouldn't have been a problem if his NRA Survivalist mother had properly secured her weapons.  Instead, she had unsecured weapons in a house with someone she was trying to get committed for being mentally unstable.  The only surprising thing about incidents like this is that they don't happen more.


Exactly. A maniac who wants to shoot up a school needs motivation and means. There is no way you will completely eradicate the motivation unless you want to forcibly institutionalize the mentally ill for "they might become violent", ban all violent video games, movies, hate speech, Fox News, etc. You can, however, put severe restrictions on their ability to access the means (i.e high powered guns and Kevlar) to carry out said act.
 
2012-12-22 11:23:15 AM
Anyone in the gun industry with an ounce of sense realizes that the smart thing to do is to just keep quiet and wait out the initial spasm of emotional rhetoric and grand standing. Unfortunately, that leaves them to be represented by the folks with less than an ounce of sense.
 
2012-12-22 11:23:33 AM
"The same message about the culture in another time and place might have made sense, but in context of tragedy, it seemed mean-spirited, cold and misguided."

Grabowski also said the NRA made a mistake by remaining silent on its social media channels last week. After the Sandy Hook tragedy, the organization stopped activity on all of its Twitter, Facebook and YouTube accounts.


So it's a damned if you do and damned if you don't?

Anything other than saying that they take full responsibility for it would have elicited a negative response.

I see no reason why we have to lie about who is responsible for these type of incidents. America had more liberal gun laws for almost 200 years of its history and spree killing did not become an issue till just recently. And before some dope says that we didn't have semi-automatics till recently, semi-autos have been around for over a century.

Americans are violent self-righteous people. See any fark thread about violence to see people justify it.
 
2012-12-22 11:25:12 AM
I suggest putting a teacher in every gun store.

/stolen
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-12-22 11:25:26 AM

raerae1980: I CANNOT believe dude blamed videogames. Seriously??


Real guns don't kill people, cartoon guns kill people.
 
2012-12-22 11:26:36 AM
Some day, someone should make a movie about the NRA's 1977 national convention. It was something of a turning point in recent American history, and what little I know about the subject makes it sound like it was quite dramatic, with lots of backstabbing, blindsiding, and gritty drama seasoned with absurd humor.
 
2012-12-22 11:26:45 AM

Shadowknight: But there were a couple times in our country around that time, one of which was in my city, where something like this happened and some gun toting wannabe hero heard the ruckus, saw a gun drawn, and began firing on the off duty officer.


I'd like some cites on this for future reference.
 
2012-12-22 11:27:56 AM

BMulligan: Some day, someone should make a movie about the NRA's 1977 national convention. It was something of a turning point in recent American history, and what little I know about the subject makes it sound like it was quite dramatic, with lots of backstabbing, blindsiding, and gritty drama seasoned with absurd humor.


Real Housewives of Washington D.C.?
 
2012-12-22 11:28:41 AM
Having a nutcase front your organization is bad for Public Relations? Who knew?
 
2012-12-22 11:29:39 AM
The gun control nuts are doing a lot for people selling AR 15's right now. They were selling on gunbroker for around 1000-3000 dollars. Now theyre going for 3000-7000.
 
2012-12-22 11:31:01 AM

IlGreven: BarkingUnicorn: That certainly won't win friends.  But it's quite plausible that a mentally ill person who plays violent video games heavily loses the ability to distinguish between fantasy and reality with regard to violence.

...y'know what? I'm gonna have to put out a [citation needed] on that. I don't think I've seen one real instance of any sort of death occuring because the perp got the idea playing video games, or the perp thought the real world was a video game. There are more deaths that can be directly attributed to watching pro wrestling.


THIS.  Prove it.  Stop pulling "intuitions" out of your ass and present facts that back this up or stop saying it.  If we are going to do ANYTHING to curb 1st Amendment rights, there better be irrefutable evidence to do so and I haven't seen any presented anywhere.
 
2012-12-22 11:31:28 AM

1derful: The gun control nuts are doing a lot for people selling AR 15's right now. They were selling on gunbroker for around 1000-3000 dollars. Now theyre going for 3000-7000.


A fool and his money.
 
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