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(Washington Post)   Boehner aborts Plan B, Plan C is to go home for Christmas   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 485
    More: Fail, Boehner, christmas, Harry M. Reid, GOP leaders, House Speaker, Eric Cantor  
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10266 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Dec 2012 at 11:19 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-21 03:51:03 AM

hdhale: MaliFinn: Electing Republicans in 2012... not since Waterworld has so much money been invested in this magnitude of failure

[i208.photobucket.com image 750x600]

No, everyone in both parties owns this charles foxtrot. The Dems are being just as inflexible and stupid. Now everybody gets to eat a shiat sandwich and like it.

/you as a people who elected this collection of grabass you see in the White House and in Congress are getting exactly the government you deserve


Show your work. How are both parties being equally inflexible?
 
2012-12-21 03:53:01 AM

slimkibbles: Keep taxes low and stop spending so damn much.


As business owners know, you have to spend money to make money.
The U.S. is not a household trying to pay off its credit cards; we don't have a fixed salary like a working family does. It is a business trying to expand: our income depends on our economic growth. We need to stimulate growth with spending, and we need to pay for that stimulus in part with spending cuts, yes, but also with taxes. Obama's plan contains both. While it's true that taxes can sometimes drive people to hide money, reciting that mantra like it is some kind of inevitable law of the universe is silly. It is NOT always true under every possible circumstance. Clinton raised taxes and the economy boomed, despite all the doomsday speeches and hand-wringing from the conservatives. Plus, the austerity route is exactly the way that Europe has gone, and it hasn't helped their financial situation. This sort of blanket argument for lowering taxes and spending is just too simplistic to be correct. Taken to extremes, it hurts the middle class and decreases their discretionary spending power which ends up hurting big businesses.
 
2012-12-21 03:56:11 AM

hdhale: /you as a people


Not "We, the People", eh?

Don't let your arsehole stain our doorknob on your way out.

Well ... bye.
 
2012-12-21 04:06:13 AM

hdhale: The Dems are being just as inflexible and stupid.


That's a laugh.
Aside from the fact that Obama has modified his offer far more than Boehner (and even his plan got shot down by Repubs), Obama was elected while running on exactly the fiscal platform he offered up. I guess Republicans are all about letting the people decide when it comes to banning gay marriage, but don't have two f*cks to give for the people when it comes to fiscal policy.
 
2012-12-21 04:07:02 AM
"Instead, Cantor has taken on a behind-the-scenes role. Where a year-and-a-half ago he ferried the conservatives' message to Boehner, drilling home the idea that a plan involving raising taxes could never get enough votes to pass, now he shuttles in the opposite direction, arguing Boehner's case for tax hikes to often-dubious caucus members. Publicly, he issues statements of support; privately, he counsels unity."

Link

LOL. What "often-dubious caucus members" may look like:

threatqualitypress.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-12-21 04:10:33 AM

hdhale: No, everyone in both parties owns this charles foxtrot. The Dems are being just as inflexible and stupid. Now everybody gets to eat a shiat sandwich and like it.


Put down the crack pipe.

The President just won an electoral landslide running on the platform of tax increases for those making over $250K. You don't have to like it, but that's the fact jack.

Even after winning another four years, along with netting more seats in both the House and Senate, the President has been negotiating with the Republicans in good faith. Why? I don't know, I'd tell them to get farked, but Obama actually went well past 1/2 way towards their position. He moved from $250K to $400k, he also accepted cuts to social programs, he didn't have to do any of that. The Bush tax cuts will automatically expire on January 1. Obama has an automatic win on January 1, yet Obama is still negotiating, still giving ground.

Exactly what ground have the Republican given?

Now, the Republican House can't even pass their own farking bill? A bill purely designed to provide political cover, a bill the President would never sign? They couldn't pass THAT?

The problem is not in both parties. The President is not being inflexible. The voters have made their intent clear, even with the voters mandate the President is negotiating, the Republicans are not. Even if they were, the Republican House wouldn't pass any reasonable middle ground legislation.

The dysfunction is overwhelmingly in the Republican party, over-Farking-whelmingly.  Any other interpretation is a drug-addled hallucination.
 
2012-12-21 04:11:37 AM

Smackledorfer: hdhale: MaliFinn: Electing Republicans in 2012... not since Waterworld has so much money been invested in this magnitude of failure

[i208.photobucket.com image 750x600]

No, everyone in both parties owns this charles foxtrot. The Dems are being just as inflexible and stupid. Now everybody gets to eat a shiat sandwich and like it.

/you as a people who elected this collection of grabass you see in the White House and in Congress are getting exactly the government you deserve

Show your work. How are both parties being equally inflexible?


Well, the Democrats aren't giving the Republicans every goddamn thing they want, just most of it. They should compromise by giving the Repubs more than they even asked for and accepting a shiat sandwich in return.
 
2012-12-21 04:13:38 AM
Let the Bush Tax Cuts expire. Let the Sequestration begin. I'm good with that.

When the next House and Senate are seated, Obama should offer up a new bill that cuts taxes for everyone making less than $250,000/year, still has some responsible cuts to Defense (even the Pentagon is for some cuts to their budget) but protects social programs. It should be carefully crafted to specifically mention raises for military personnel, protecting Social Security and Medicare for the poor, disabled and elderly, etc. This bill would also include scaling tax increases on those making more than $1,000,000/year, up to a top tax rate of 70% (up from ~39%, where they will be after the Bush cuts sunset).

The GOP will of course balk at this, despite it being popular with most Americans. Obama can then offer up a compromise, once the media has gone out of their way to paint the economy as ready to tank due to Republicans refusal to work with the President, and the GOP is on the ropes. The compromise? Same bill, but the top tax rate is lowered to 60% on those making more than $1,000,000/year.

I love political theater, and the next couple of months should prove to be very entertaining, indeed. It's time to make the GOP squirm, and make it clear to all what the Tea Party really is: A bunch of toadies only looking out for millionaires.
 
2012-12-21 04:13:40 AM
Why do people keep electing these asshats?
 
2012-12-21 04:22:31 AM
I know it'd be crossing a dangerous line of concentrating power in the Executive branch, but at what point does "obstructionism" cross the line to treason? Isn't there some law on the books the DOJ could use to drag some of these congresscritters before a judge for knowingly allowing the country as a whole to be damaged for the sake of their political agenda?
 
2012-12-21 04:30:11 AM

MmmmBacon: It's time to make the GOP squirm, and make it clear to all what the Tea Party really is: A bunch of toadies only looking out for millionaires.


The Tea Party is the GOP's Frankenstein, the millionaires who built it no longer control it. Fox News created the first artificial lifeform in the form of the Tea Party Patriot. It is completely impervious to logic, reason and exists only for confrontation with Liberals. They made it to see only in black and white, any shade of gray only enrages it.

Even the US Chamber of Commerce has, although begrudgingly, endorsed Obama's plan. Stocks are already falling overseas tonight on the uncertainty, big business has been urging the GOP leadership to get something done. And they can't. Any member of the Tea Bag contingent in the House seems to be far more afraid of being burned as a RINO than of even a global economic collapse.

They endanger the whole world, and America's security, by playing games with the economy over ideas that the sensible on both sides of the aisle have already dismissed. They're un-American assholes and petty little tyrants.
 
2012-12-21 04:32:52 AM

TheJoe03: Why do people keep electing these asshats?


In the House of Representatives? Largely, it's gerrymandering.

There were move votes for Democratic House members than Republicans this past elections, yet Republics retained control of the House. Some nations fix this by electing party slates, then seating members based on how many votes each party receives. We don't, we suffer severe gerrymandering.

I'd like to see districts assigned by random, computer drawn maps, randomly reselected once a decade. It wouldn't be completely fair, but it would be a lot more fair than the purposeful gerrymandering we have today.

Rachel Maddow: Republican Gerrymandering
 
2012-12-21 04:38:55 AM
My federal agency has already put out the word that due to sequestration, there may be furloughs. They want to kiss ass on millionaires while the common folks starve in the streets...just because Boehner can't negotiate or persuade. Why is he even in politics?
 
2012-12-21 04:42:24 AM

gideon: Maybe it's my naiveitae, but can someone, in a logical fashion, explain to me why the economic practices of 1992 to 2000 were bad?


The problem is with the fiscal cliff is that it cuts the deficit too quickly and will probably damage the economy as a result.

It's actually what the Tea Party wanted, except that it cuts Defense spending as well as domestic spending. It's like Hoover all over again.

www.ecommcode2.com
 
2012-12-21 04:43:12 AM

EmmaLou: My federal agency has already put out the word that due to sequestration, there may be furloughs. They want to kiss ass on millionaires while the common folks starve in the streets...just because Boehner can't negotiate or persuade. Why is he even in politics?



Boehner is an ass of extreme magnitude, but you can't fault him for not being able to reason with the angry Tea Party mob in the House. Nobody can. Cantor is trying, I guess he speaks retard the best, and even he doesn't seem to be getting anywhere.

Somebody needs to start coming up with some pics of these Tea Baggers going down on their pages, it's time for some real political nut twisting.
 
2012-12-21 04:58:00 AM
Boehner should go home for Christmas and don't come back to Washington.
 
2012-12-21 05:04:22 AM

Insatiable Jesus: Boehner is an ass of extreme magnitude, but you can't fault him for not being able to reason with the angry Tea Party mob in the House. Nobody can. Cantor is trying, I guess he speaks retard the best, and even he doesn't seem to be getting anywhere.

Somebody needs to start coming up with some pics of these Tea Baggers going down on their pages, it's time for some real political nut twisting.


The funny thing is that Cantor doesn't really have much of anything in common with the average tea bagger. Cantor is an upper class high-finance Jewish guy. Prior to the tea party, he really only seemed to give a fark about high wealth individuals. He's a poster boy for Club for Growth, not the tea party. His wife had a high paying no-show job with a big New York bank, one that received a lot of TARP funds.

The upper class high-finance demo of the tea party has to be small, the Jewish demo? A lot smaller Cantor's got as much in common with the average tea bagger as Obama does. My guess is that he only went all tea baggy to avoid a primary challenge, probably just riding the wave ever since.

Waves do crash, I have to wonder if the 2014 mid-terms are going to be a tea bagger massacre.
 
2012-12-21 05:07:46 AM
Hey Tea Baggers!...


com·pro·mise[kom-pruh-mahyz] Show IPA noun, verb, com·pro·mised, com·pro·mis·ing. noun 1. a settlement of differences by mutual concessions; an agreement reached by adjustment of conflicting or opposing claims, principles, etc., by reciprocal modification of demands. 2. the result of such a settlement. 3. something intermediate between different things: The split-level is a compromise between a ranch house and a multistoried house. 4. an endangering, especially of reputation; exposure to danger, suspicion, etc.: a compromise of one's integrity. You work for us. Nut up and stop blocking political progress because you are bitter about the election results. The majority of us don't want you working for us, and the more you continue to be a hindrance to progress, the more likely we are to vote your stupid asses out in 2014.

Just saying.
 
2012-12-21 05:20:09 AM

RandomRandom: Insatiable Jesus: Boehner is an ass of extreme magnitude, but you can't fault him for not being able to reason with the angry Tea Party mob in the House. Nobody can. Cantor is trying, I guess he speaks retard the best, and even he doesn't seem to be getting anywhere.

Somebody needs to start coming up with some pics of these Tea Baggers going down on their pages, it's time for some real political nut twisting.

The funny thing is that Cantor doesn't really have much of anything in common with the average tea bagger. Cantor is an upper class high-finance Jewish guy. Prior to the tea party, he really only seemed to give a fark about high wealth individuals. He's a poster boy for Club for Growth, not the tea party. His wife had a high paying no-show job with a big New York bank, one that received a lot of TARP funds.

The upper class high-finance demo of the tea party has to be small, the Jewish demo? A lot smaller Cantor's got as much in common with the average tea bagger as Obama does. My guess is that he only went all tea baggy to avoid a primary challenge, probably just riding the wave ever since.

Waves do crash, I have to wonder if the 2014 mid-terms are going to be a tea bagger massacre.


The Atlantic article I linked earlier seems to say that Cantor tried to harness the Tea Party for his own political gains, and sort of created, or helped create, this mess before giving up on trying to turn a bunch of crazies into their own bona fide power bloc. I don't think they're too happy with him upstairs at the GOP.
 
2012-12-21 05:29:53 AM

DarkSkyForever: Now... just stay with me here... now why can't we just let tax rates rise back to Clinton levels?


Because socialism?
 
2012-12-21 05:33:26 AM

RandomRandom: hdhale: No, everyone in both parties owns this charles foxtrot. The Dems are being just as inflexible and stupid. Now everybody gets to eat a shiat sandwich and like it.

Put down the crack pipe.

The President just won an electoral landslide running on the platform of tax increases for those making over $250K. You don't have to like it, but that's the fact jack.

Even after winning another four years, along with netting more seats in both the House and Senate, the President has been negotiating with the Republicans in good faith. Why? I don't know, I'd tell them to get farked, but Obama actually went well past 1/2 way towards their position. He moved from $250K to $400k, he also accepted cuts to social programs, he didn't have to do any of that. The Bush tax cuts will automatically expire on January 1. Obama has an automatic win on January 1, yet Obama is still negotiating, still giving ground.

Exactly what ground have the Republican given?


They haven't given up any ground at all. For twenty years, they've pledged to never vote for a tax increase on anyone under any circumstances. With John Boehner pulling this bill, we know for sure that at least a majority of his caucus is still holding to that plege and refusing to vote for tax increases on anyone under any circumstances. And this is even though three out of four self-identified Republicans say such a pledge is a bad idea. We also have Mitch McConnell filibustering a bill that he personally took to Harry Reid for a vote because he didn't want it to be put to an up-or-down vote. And that doesn't even account for the debt ceiling shenanigans that happened last summer or the numerous insane attempts of state legislatures to nullify federal laws that have been affirmatively declared to be constitutional by the Supreme Court.

Merriam-Wester defines insurgency as "the quality or state of being insurgent; specifically a condition of revolt against a government that is less than an organized revolution and that is not recognized as belligerency." Similarly, insurgent is defined as "a person who revolts against civil authority or an established government; especially a rebel not recognized as a belligerent."

It's time to face reality. It's time to stop mincing words. The Republican Party as constitutied in Congress and many state legislatures today is an insurgency. They are trying to kill the federal government and the country.
 
2012-12-21 05:39:40 AM

Serious Black: It's time to face reality. It's time to stop mincing words. The Republican Party as constitutied in Congress and many state legislatures today is an insurgency. They are trying to kill the federal government and the country.



But if we're a legitimate democracy, we have a way to shut that whole thing down, right?

Seriously? What's left? Is there some point where they break the law in their shenanigans? Have they broken them already? Can we do ABSCAM again?
 
2012-12-21 05:51:07 AM

Corvus: and the Obvious question:

How in the hell do you ever suggest a plan like this unless you are 100% sure you have the votes. Because if you don't it makes your position much much weaker. Your position now is "I need Democrat support even in the house to pass it".


that shouldn't be an issue! Every bill does NOT have to pass on party lines!
 
2012-12-21 05:54:46 AM

GungFu: How can you be so obtuse?

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 850x557]


1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-12-21 06:03:11 AM

06wildcat: Doctors will shun Medicaid and Medicare patients beginning immediately, defense contractors probably won't lay people off wholesale at the beginning, but it could happen if programs start getting chopped pretty quick. Lots of other areas where spending will dry up will be affected too.


nonsense.
 
2012-12-21 06:20:31 AM

Insatiable Jesus: Serious Black: It's time to face reality. It's time to stop mincing words. The Republican Party as constitutied in Congress and many state legislatures today is an insurgency. They are trying to kill the federal government and the country.


But if we're a legitimate democracy, we have a way to shut that whole thing down, right?

Seriously? What's left? Is there some point where they break the law in their shenanigans? Have they broken them already? Can we do ABSCAM again?


I don't think there is sadly, especially not with how SCOTUS has neutered corruption rules for legislators.

I think the best-case scenario for crushing this insurgency is probably for Obama to call for a clean hike of the debt ceiling. He's already done a form of that by calling for the McConnell provision to be made permanent, but I'm almost certain he would ask for a clean hike in lieu of of that. When the GOP refuses to raise the debt ceiling and we hit it, Obama should refuse to declare the debt ceiling unconstitutional and let the GOP off the hook. He's also done that by saying he does not believe the 14th Amendment makes the debt ceiling unconstitutional. Instead, he should make interest obligations the first priority to pay from tax withholding, and he should direct other federal agencies to shut down and direct state contributions to end based on his priorities with the remaining incoming funds from tax withholding. This would almost certainly trigger a market collapse that, if left to continue for long enough, would cause a worldwide recession and push countries to start looking for a new reserve currency since they couldn't buy US bonds. As long as President Obama continually reiterated that he does not have the power to violate the debt ceiling and issue new bonds to reopen the government, the public would surely break against the GOP and force them to do what Obama wants.
 
2012-12-21 06:23:55 AM
Aside from my own personal taxes going up, the fiscal cliff will also mean that the grants that I need to do science for the next three years will also be canceled. This isn't money for salaries for scientists (though it is so I can hire field technicians), but also for the equipment and overhead needed to do these studies. It was a study on the impacts of sea levels to heavily utilized natural resources.

This makes me incredibly nervous and sad.
 
2012-12-21 06:25:28 AM

Seth'n'Spectrum: enry: For all the misguided hate on Pelosi, she really got stuff done.

You clearly don't remember the healthcare reform wrangling. Half the fault was Obama's for not pushing forward on his own, but she should get a lot of flack for the bill being reduced to the husk it is now.


Yeah I remember it. But she still got it to pass, and thay was my point.

Also why I said misguided hate rather than just hate.
 
2012-12-21 06:28:16 AM
Weird how Obama is holding the middle class hostage, all to punish people who create jobs.

But that is what Democrats do. Punishing successful people to no gain is worth more than doing the right thing.
 
2012-12-21 06:29:01 AM

Thunderpipes: Weird how Obama is holding the middle class hostage, all to punish people who create jobs.

But that is what Democrats do. Punishing successful people to no gain is worth more than doing the right thing.


How is he holding the middle class hostage?
 
2012-12-21 06:31:57 AM

gulogulo: Aside from my own personal taxes going up, the fiscal cliff will also mean that the grants that I need to do science for the next three years will also be canceled. This isn't money for salaries for scientists (though it is so I can hire field technicians), but also for the equipment and overhead needed to do these studies. It was a study on the impacts of sea levels to heavily utilized natural resources.

This makes me incredibly nervous and sad.


taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.
 
2012-12-21 06:32:43 AM

Thunderpipes: Weird how Obama is holding the middle class hostage, all to punish people who create jobs.

But that is what Democrats do. Punishing successful people to no gain is worth more than doing the right thing.


preview.turbosquid.com
 
2012-12-21 06:34:27 AM
Here's what will happen:

Everyone will posture and make deals to serve themselves, and the American public will pay for it.

In the end, nothing will be done except through smoke and mirrors, just like always. All we will do is kick the can down the road, AGAIN. And we will continue our descent into abyss.

Who was it (de Toqueville?) who said democracy won't work because eventually they figure out they can vote themselves the treasury?

Look to Greece. That's where we are headed. Look to California, they are almost already there.

Rewarding failure and inprofligance is the new American way. Why work if Uncle Sucker will steal from your neighbor to give you the same crap?

Now is the time that a whole new generation of people get to learn what is meant by "out years". This budget deal will do nothing now BUT YOU JUST WAIT, it will totally turn around in the out years. Uhm-hmmm.

I say take the cliff. Anything we pass at this point will just be worse. It will be a different version of the same cliff, but with payola to the critters on top.

Take the cliff. Call your representative and demand that he take the cliff.
 
2012-12-21 06:36:51 AM

relcec: gulogulo: Aside from my own personal taxes going up, the fiscal cliff will also mean that the grants that I need to do science for the next three years will also be canceled. This isn't money for salaries for scientists (though it is so I can hire field technicians), but also for the equipment and overhead needed to do these studies. It was a study on the impacts of sea levels to heavily utilized natural resources.

This makes me incredibly nervous and sad.

taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.


Or (hear me out) we could radically broaden the tax base so that a lot of people can actually get a tax cut and a few people who have been lucky duckies avoiding taxes so far get a small tax hike. Why not use a transaction tax?
 
2012-12-21 06:39:56 AM

relcec: taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.


I'm not rich. In fact, on my salary, I am not even middle class. And I don't even mind the taxes as much as I do the cuts to important things like..conserving our natural resources. How dare I want shiat, right?
 
2012-12-21 06:40:22 AM

SevenizGud: Look to Greece. That's where we are headed.


Greece fails to collect over 30% of its tax burden because tax avoidance is the national sport. We are nothing like Greece.
 
2012-12-21 06:42:18 AM

Corvus: There is almost nothing that gives me more joy than watching the GOP screw themselves over.

How can he not take Obama's deal now? He can't get the votes to pass his own deal in the Republican house.

GOP you suck!!!


He was prepared to accept Pelosi's old plan, but she suddenly was not. Not that any of this matters.

When Clinton balanced the budget, it was because he had a republican congress. No one ever really remembers who was in congress and writing laws after the fact, they just remember who the president was when things are either good or go to shiat.

All this bickering between Rs and Ds is emblematic of a greater problem. The tax hikes requested were going to cover new spending and we still don't have a legit budget. If you spend like a drunken salor you have to pay that bill and bumming a few bucks off the rich guy ain't going to cut it for long.
 
2012-12-21 06:43:37 AM
And when Boehner says that now the President and the Senate needs to figure it out, what does that even mean?

Is he pretending that they can pass a bill without the house? Is he trying to pretend the Senate has not already passed a bill which they have? Or is he just being butthurt because he lost and pretending the dumbass political stunt he failed out was trying to actually accomplish something?

It makes no sense.
 
2012-12-21 06:44:16 AM
There is no abyss.  We're doing fine.  This is a crisis which was made up by the Republican party, who now refuse to fix their made-up crisis.  It is time to sit back and drink a glass of eggnog.  Happy holidays!
 
2012-12-21 06:44:39 AM

Serious Black: relcec: gulogulo: Aside from my own personal taxes going up, the fiscal cliff will also mean that the grants that I need to do science for the next three years will also be canceled. This isn't money for salaries for scientists (though it is so I can hire field technicians), but also for the equipment and overhead needed to do these studies. It was a study on the impacts of sea levels to heavily utilized natural resources.

This makes me incredibly nervous and sad.

taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.

Or (hear me out) we could radically broaden the tax base so that a lot of people can actually get a tax cut and a few people who have been lucky duckies avoiding taxes so far get a small tax hike. Why not use a transaction tax?


dude, you may be a little to wrapped in all this. you just called republicans a rebel treasonous faction in so many words, for not extending bush tax cuts.
bush tax cuts that don't come close to bringing in enough revenue for the federal government to function.

and who the f*ck doesn't get tax cuts? the average family in the united states, the middle class if you will, doesn't pay jackshiat. they don't pay close to what is necessary.

an average family sitting at the median household income, that has two kids, and a mortgage
pays around a 2% income tax. 2%. wtf. that is the middle class.
they pay almost nothing. that's a big reason why we have no money. you know this. wtf is going on here?
 
2012-12-21 06:47:31 AM

gulogulo: relcec: taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.

I'm not rich. In fact, on my salary, I am not even middle class. And I don't even mind the taxes as much as I do the cuts to important things like..conserving our natural resources. How dare I want shiat, right?


you want stuff, but don't want to help pay for it. you are biatching about taxes. you are part of the problem. if people like you weren't all around me they wouldn't even be contemplating whatever it is you like that they are contemplating cutting.
chose one, cool stufff, or tax cuts.
 
2012-12-21 06:48:04 AM

jaybeezey: When Clinton balanced the budget, it was because he had a republican congress. No one ever really remembers who was in congress and writing laws after the fact, they just remember who the president was when things are either good or go to shiat.


Actually no the tax rates Clinton passed was the first year in office when there was a democrat congress. The Republicans stood up and said the budget was going to destroy America. Only at the midterms were the republicans but those tax rates were already locked in and spending went UP when those Republicans got in.


Please stop the BS revisionist BS, because it's not true. Democrats passed the tax increases which Republicans said would destroy the economy (it didn't) and when Republicans got in SPENDING WENT UP.
 
2012-12-21 06:48:36 AM

relcec: you just called republicans a rebel treasonous faction in so many word


He probably said that because it's true.
 
2012-12-21 06:54:30 AM

PonceAlyosha: relcec: you just called republicans a rebel treasonous faction in so many word

He probably said that because it's true.


why don't you people want the bush tax cuts to be sunset? you've been biatching about them nonstop for a decade. what is wrong with all of you?
 
2012-12-21 06:54:57 AM

jaybeezey: Corvus: There is almost nothing that gives me more joy than watching the GOP screw themselves over.

How can he not take Obama's deal now? He can't get the votes to pass his own deal in the Republican house.

GOP you suck!!!

He was prepared to accept Pelosi's old plan, but she suddenly was not. Not that any of this matters.

When Clinton balanced the budget, it was because he had a republican congress. No one ever really remembers who was in congress and writing laws after the fact, they just remember who the president was when things are either good or go to shiat.

All this bickering between Rs and Ds is emblematic of a greater problem. The tax hikes requested were going to cover new spending and we still don't have a legit budget. If you spend like a drunken salor you have to pay that bill and bumming a few bucks off the rich guy ain't going to cut it for long.


How about making the rich guys actually pay a reasonable tax rate for their income, to pay off wars that Bush refused to put on the books at all? I make about $70,000/year, and I pay a much higher percentage of my income in taxes than Mitt Romney (for example) does. That is extremely wrong.

Fox News and many Right-wing pundits talk about going back to a simpler time, like the 50's, when everything was so much better. I agree with those douchebags in that regard, because in the 50's the top Federal tax rate was 90%, not less than 35% as it is now!
 
2012-12-21 06:56:41 AM

Serious Black: Insatiable Jesus: Serious Black: It's time to face reality. It's time to stop mincing words. The Republican Party as constitutied in Congress and many state legislatures today is an insurgency. They are trying to kill the federal government and the country.


But if we're a legitimate democracy, we have a way to shut that whole thing down, right?

Seriously? What's left? Is there some point where they break the law in their shenanigans? Have they broken them already? Can we do ABSCAM again?

I don't think there is sadly, especially not with how SCOTUS has neutered corruption rules for legislators.

I think the best-case scenario for crushing this insurgency is probably for Obama to call for a clean hike of the debt ceiling. He's already done a form of that by calling for the McConnell provision to be made permanent, but I'm almost certain he would ask for a clean hike in lieu of of that. When the GOP refuses to raise the debt ceiling and we hit it, Obama should refuse to declare the debt ceiling unconstitutional and let the GOP off the hook. He's also done that by saying he does not believe the 14th Amendment makes the debt ceiling unconstitutional. Instead, he should make interest obligations the first priority to pay from tax withholding, and he should direct other federal agencies to shut down and direct state contributions to end based on his priorities with the remaining incoming funds from tax withholding. This would almost certainly trigger a market collapse that, if left to continue for long enough, would cause a worldwide recession and push countries to start looking for a new reserve currency since they couldn't buy US bonds. As long as President Obama continually reiterated that he does not have the power to violate the debt ceiling and issue new bonds to reopen the government, the public would surely break against the GOP and force them to do what Obama wants.


Hmm, that sounds suspiciously like assuming your opponents are more compassionate than you are.. I'd call that a bad bet.
 
2012-12-21 06:57:20 AM

relcec: Serious Black: relcec: gulogulo: Aside from my own personal taxes going up, the fiscal cliff will also mean that the grants that I need to do science for the next three years will also be canceled. This isn't money for salaries for scientists (though it is so I can hire field technicians), but also for the equipment and overhead needed to do these studies. It was a study on the impacts of sea levels to heavily utilized natural resources.

This makes me incredibly nervous and sad.

taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.

Or (hear me out) we could radically broaden the tax base so that a lot of people can actually get a tax cut and a few people who have been lucky duckies avoiding taxes so far get a small tax hike. Why not use a transaction tax?

dude, you may be a little to wrapped in all this. you just called republicans a rebel treasonous faction in so many words, for not extending bush tax cuts.
bush tax cuts that don't come close to bringing in enough revenue for the federal government to function.

and who the f*ck doesn't get tax cuts? the average family in the united states, the middle class if you will, doesn't pay jackshiat. they don't pay close to what is necessary.

an average family sitting at the median household income, that has two kids, and a mortgage
pays around a 2% income tax. 2%. wtf. that is the middle class.
they pay almost nothing. that's a big reason why we have no money. you know this. wtf is going on here?


It's possible to give a lot of people a (admittedly small) tax cut while increasing revenue to the government by a decent amount if you expand the tax base from $14 trillion to $1 quadrillion. And it would certainly be a lot more fair than the byzantine system we have today with child tax credits, mortgage interest deductions, health insurance exemptions, preferential rates for dividends, and tends of thousands of pages solely used to define what counts as income and what doesn't.
 
2012-12-21 07:01:14 AM
alright, I give up. you all may now go on biatching about the possibility you might actually have to pay a little closer to an appropriate tax rate for all that government you constantly demand.
you are all extremely selfish assholes.
 
2012-12-21 07:05:16 AM

relcec: alright, I give up. you all may now go on biatching about the possibility you might actually have to pay a little closer to an appropriate tax rate for all that government you constantly demand.
you are all extremely selfish assholes.


Happy holidays, darling!  It's the darkest day of the year, and we made it through.  Congratulations to all of us, we made it!  It all gets brighter from here.  You could look it up.
 
2012-12-21 07:10:16 AM

relcec: gulogulo: relcec: taxes have to go up. can't you see that? we are in this predicament because people like you want shiat, but do not want to pay taxes in the first place.

I'm not rich. In fact, on my salary, I am not even middle class. And I don't even mind the taxes as much as I do the cuts to important things like..conserving our natural resources. How dare I want shiat, right?

you want stuff, but don't want to help pay for it. you are biatching about taxes. you are part of the problem. if people like you weren't all around me they wouldn't even be contemplating whatever it is you like that they are contemplating cutting.
chose one, cool stufff, or tax cuts.


What do you mean? Do you have problem reading? I pay taxes. I'm not biatching about paying for shiat at all. I'm biatching about unilateral cuts
 
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