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(Christian Science Monitor)   Obama proposes using "chained CPI" to index benefits, which is a polite way of saying you can survive on dog food if steak gets too expensive   (csmonitor.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, Social Security Reform, dog food, steaks  
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1313 clicks; posted to Politics » on 19 Dec 2012 at 9:56 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-19 09:19:41 AM  
More on chained CPI.
 
Link
 
Link
 
Link
 
2012-12-19 09:21:07 AM  
So he's offering spending cuts? Is that the takeaway here?
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-12-19 09:29:44 AM  

unlikely: So he's offering spending cuts? Is that the takeaway here?



Looks like it.  You can't make a deal unless you offer something.
 
2012-12-19 09:58:20 AM  
Dog food is actually more expensive than human food. We'll just have to get by on home cooked chicken, dried beans, and frozen spinach and broccoli for a while. Which is actually what you should eat in the first place given how damn fat we have gotten.
 
2012-12-19 09:58:40 AM  
Invest in Taco Bell.
 
2012-12-19 10:00:24 AM  
One the one hand, it seems pointlessly cruel, and not particularly efficient. On the other hand, the old bastards are voting Republican and doing it to themselves. I'm not so compassionate or industrious that I'll battle with someone to better their life.
 
2012-12-19 10:00:31 AM  
Wait, so are Republicans against spending cuts now?
 
2012-12-19 10:01:17 AM  
Say it with me...
SUBS-TIT-OOH-SHUN
 
2012-12-19 10:01:39 AM  
So Obama's gone back on his promise to not raise middle class taxes and totally upended Biden's promise to leave SS alone.

Dude, Boehner played you like a fiddle. Again.

Obama runs a ruthless campaign but refuses to do the same while governing. It's pathetic.
 
2012-12-19 10:01:48 AM  
Devil's in the details. There is a lot of wiggle room in how you interpret "Chained CPI"
 
2012-12-19 10:02:16 AM  

vpb: unlikely: So he's offering spending cuts? Is that the takeaway here?


Looks like it.  You can't make a deal unless you offer something.


The thing is that SS shouldn't have jack all to do with this deal. It is self funded, and solvent for the near-term and mid-term. Is it a problem in the long run, yes, but as many farkers will point out, it is actually an easily solvable problem once politics is out of the way. Switching to chained CPI is just going to make places like WalMart and Target stronger as people are forced to buy the absolute cheapest stuff that will have to be replaced over and over again.

Welcome to the race to the bottom.
 
2012-12-19 10:02:22 AM  
is country kitchen and old country buffet covered in the CPI? if not, a lot of old people will starve.
 
2012-12-19 10:02:59 AM  
more proof that fartbama wants to chain the poors

and you libs laughed at romney
 
2012-12-19 10:03:07 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: Invest in Taco Bell.


I'm not convinced Taco Bell actually qualifies as "food".
 
2012-12-19 10:03:31 AM  

TofuTheAlmighty: So Obama's gone back on his promise to not raise middle class taxes and totally upended Biden's promise to leave SS alone.

Dude, Boehner played you like a fiddle. Again.

Obama runs a ruthless campaign but refuses to do the same while governing. It's pathetic.


It doesn't matter. Republicans will reject anything he offers, and there will be no deal. Obama is just trying to win brownie points so he looks like the reasonable person in the room. Once we "go over the cliff", then the real negotiation will take place to re-institute various aspects
 
2012-12-19 10:04:22 AM  
Go be Republican somewhere else.
 
2012-12-19 10:05:25 AM  
OBAMA NEEDS TO OFFER CUTS
 
SO WE CAN SAY THOSE CUTS ARE BAD
 
2012-12-19 10:05:39 AM  
So this is the one cut he offers? No touching of Medicare? No raising of the social security eligibility age? No other mention of entitlements at all?

I'm sorry...I wish SS wasn't being touched at all but this is something that can be lived with. Depending on what he gets for it at any rate.
 
2012-12-19 10:05:46 AM  

hiker9999: HotWingConspiracy: Invest in Taco Bell.

I'm not convinced Taco Bell actually qualifies as "food".


The basic chicken soft taco and bean burrito are actually pretty good.

/the "beef" on the other hand is revolting
 
2012-12-19 10:05:52 AM  

TofuTheAlmighty: So Obama's gone back on his promise to not raise middle class taxes and totally upended Biden's promise to leave SS alone.

Dude, Boehner played you like a fiddle. Again.

Obama runs a ruthless campaign but refuses to do the same while governing. It's pathetic.


Yea, people totally aren't going to vote for Obama next election. And I'm sure there will be no blow back from all the House republicans breaking their no tax pledge.
 
2012-12-19 10:06:25 AM  
Republicans want chained-CPI and old people vote Republican so this is an easy thing for Obama to concede in negotiations.
 
2012-12-19 10:07:15 AM  

Lost Thought 00: Devil's in the details. There is a lot of wiggle room in how you interpret "Chained CPI"


Very true. It depends on how far the "chain" it is taken.
 
2012-12-19 10:07:48 AM  

TofuTheAlmighty: So Obama's gone back on his promise to not raise middle class taxes and totally upended Biden's promise to leave SS alone.

Dude, Boehner played you like a fiddle. Again.

Obama runs a ruthless campaign but refuses to do the same while governing. It's pathetic.


No, he's just a genuine right winger who wants cuts. Fark, how have you not grasped this yet?

Vote for lesser evil
[Advice liberal]
Shocked about evil
 
2012-12-19 10:07:58 AM  
I applaud the President's realistic approach to the problem.  Good job.  He may be the guy credited with saving the system in the long run. 
 
2012-12-19 10:11:58 AM  
Wait! Are we feeding pensioners steak? We can cut that out and save money. Hell, half of 'em can't even chew it. What were we thinking?
 
/We've already been feeding some of them dog food.
 
2012-12-19 10:13:03 AM  

beta_plus: Dog food is actually more expensive than human food. We'll just have to get by on home cooked chicken, dried beans, and frozen spinach and broccoli for a while. Which is actually what you should eat in the first place given how damn fat we have gotten.



Here is a map of parts of the US were those items cannot even be purchased.
 
http://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-desert-locator/go-to-the- lo cator.aspx
 
2012-12-19 10:13:15 AM  
I don't like it, but what's the GOP complaint here? That the change isn't drastic enough?
 
2012-12-19 10:14:13 AM  

dynomutt: Say it with me...
SUBS-TIT-OOH-SHUN


Treguna Mekoides Tracorum Satis Dee!
 
2012-12-19 10:15:53 AM  

Holocaust Agnostic: No, he's just a genuine right winger who wants cuts. Fark, how have you not grasped this yet?


I never labored under the delusion that Obama was either a transformative figure or a liberal. But I expected him to use his hard won leverage to enact his campaign promises. And once again, he's folded despite having an absurdly strong hand, in fact the strongest of his presidency.
 
2012-12-19 10:15:59 AM  

Gunny Walker: Wait! Are we feeding pensioners steak? We can cut that out and save money. Hell, half of 'em can't even chew it. What were we thinking?
 
/We've already been feeding some of them dog food.


We've come a long way from feeding them lobster so much they demanded another meal.
 
2012-12-19 10:18:17 AM  
This is a small, reasonable, pragmatic change that ensures that social security will remain viable for awhile longer.

There are lots of small, simple, reasonable solutions to just about all of our fiscal problems. We just don't have any political will to implement them because the American political system is now a head to head, zero sum game. It's like watching an episode of Red vs Blue.

It still just floors me that people can claim America is the strongest, best, greatest nation in the world, but if we reduce benefits by $10 a month from peoples future retirement income our society is so weak it will simply collapse into the abyss.

If this sort of proposal is really too dramatic a change to implement, we just need to scrap the entire social security system, because it's already dead.
 
2012-12-19 10:20:39 AM  

TofuTheAlmighty: Holocaust Agnostic: No, he's just a genuine right winger who wants cuts. Fark, how have you not grasped this yet?

I never labored under the delusion that Obama was either a transformative figure or a liberal. But I expected him to use his hard won leverage to enact his campaign promises. And once again, he's folded despite having an absurdly strong hand, in fact the strongest of his presidency.



He literally campaigned on a balanced approach with revenue and cuts. This is what's happening. You've not been cheated, you're getting what it said on the tin.
 
2012-12-19 10:21:06 AM  

TofuTheAlmighty: Holocaust Agnostic: No, he's just a genuine right winger who wants cuts. Fark, how have you not grasped this yet?

I never labored under the delusion that Obama was either a transformative figure or a liberal. But I expected him to use his hard won leverage to enact his campaign promises. And once again, he's folded despite having an absurdly strong hand, in fact the strongest of his presidency.


obama's biggest problem, is that he tries to reason with the unreasonable. way more than half of the country would applaud him for calling out congress on their bullshiat.
 
2012-12-19 10:21:53 AM  
Should be tied to prices in the "Dollar Menu" at McDonald's, which have few items for a $.
 
2012-12-19 10:22:24 AM  
As long as they add the cost of multiple wars justified by Saudis crashing planes into Wall Street back in after decreasing whatever gets decreased. One Trillion for a war, one trillion added to Social Security. And cut up that special credit card.
 
2012-12-19 10:24:22 AM  

Carth: Wait, so are Republicans against spending cuts now?


Republicans were demanding the chained CPI change to Social Security and raising the age of Medicare eligibility by two years. Obama offered to go along with the less harmful/regressive option.

Then again, it's possible if this deal is agreed to they will rail against chained CPI as another way Democrats want to hurt the elderly. It wouldn't be the first time their positions are what they run against once the opposition agrees to them; see Medicare coverage of living will consultations being characterized as death panels. I honestly think Republicans have decided the cliff is the best option available to them: they say they'll just pass a tax cut for everyone making less than $1 million a year and and make all the defense cuts non-defense discretionary cuts instead and then say if Obama and the Senate don't agree to it it's their fault for not compromising. The fact that we have so many fatalists in office these days willing to let the "perfect" be the enemy of the good horrifies me.
 
2012-12-19 10:25:04 AM  
Obama proposes using "chained CPI" to index benefits, which is a polite way of saying you can survive on dog food F35s, Abrams tanks, corporate subsidies and tax breaks if steak dog food gets too expensive 
 
FTFY
 
2012-12-19 10:28:03 AM  

LasersHurt: He literally campaigned on a balanced approach with revenue and cuts.

 
 
24% of retirees depend on SS for 90% or more of their income. Another 26% depend on SS for at least half of their income. 
 
1.bp.blogspot.com
 
Link, .pdf
 
SS has nothing to do with the deficit. This is not reasonable or necessary, and it's certainly not balanced.
 
2012-12-19 10:28:52 AM  
Well I thinks I am going to have to pick up and install a red light on grandmas front porch. Looks like she will have to go back to hooking after her SS COLAs shift from 3.1% from 3.2%. There just is no way she can live off of the decrease of an increase.
 
2012-12-19 10:28:55 AM  
Obama giveth, and Obama taketh away.

Definition of "Chained CPI": No matter how much prices go up, your benefits check will get smaller. In other words, "Sorry Mr and Mrs. Taxpayer, even though you payed into your SS benefits your entire life, we politicians in Washington raided your SS Trust Fund, promising to pay the money back, but since we are politicians, you know we never will". Ha, ha, jokes on you, stupid taxpayer.
 
2012-12-19 10:29:02 AM  

LasersHurt: He literally campaigned on a balanced approach with revenue and cuts. This is what's happening. You've not been cheated, you're getting what it said on the tin.


One of Obama's central planks was that taxes won't go up on the middle class. Chained CPI is weirdly regressive and does precisely that. Making matters worse is that this "solution" effectively transfers wealth from the middle and working classes AND senior citizens to pay for tax cuts for the wealthy. Oh yes, that's really balanced - make the rich toss in tip money while Granny doesn't eat for three days a month.
 
2012-12-19 10:29:32 AM  
Biden_rant.jpg

"He's gonna put y'all back in chains!"
 
2012-12-19 10:29:51 AM  

TofuTheAlmighty: Holocaust Agnostic: No, he's just a genuine right winger who wants cuts. Fark, how have you not grasped this yet?

I never labored under the delusion that Obama was either a transformative figure or a liberal. But I expected him to use his hard won leverage to enact his campaign promises. And once again, he's folded despite having an absurdly strong hand, in fact the strongest of his presidency.


Well he takes decisive action whenever he can kill a bunch of Libyans or whatever, so there's that at least.
 
2012-12-19 10:31:15 AM  

LasersHurt: TofuTheAlmighty: Holocaust Agnostic: No, he's just a genuine right winger who wants cuts. Fark, how have you not grasped this yet?

I never labored under the delusion that Obama was either a transformative figure or a liberal. But I expected him to use his hard won leverage to enact his campaign promises. And once again, he's folded despite having an absurdly strong hand, in fact the strongest of his presidency.


He literally campaigned on a balanced approach with revenue and cuts. This is what's happening. You've not been cheated, you're getting what it said on the tin.


Social Security has nothing to do with the deficit. Republicans want it gone because it goes against their ideology. Cutting it is not good policy or politics, and few people on either side voted for this in November.
 
2012-12-19 10:32:43 AM  

Rapmaster2000: Republicans want chained-CPI and old people vote Republican so this is an easy thing for Obama to concede in negotiations.


And in a few years from now all those Republican voting seniors will be scratching their heads wondering why they can't afford some of the things they used to.
 
2012-12-19 10:33:39 AM  

vpb: unlikely: So he's offering spending cuts? Is that the takeaway here?


Looks like it.  You can't make a deal unless you offer something.


So, we starve the poor even more in order that Billionaires have to look through TWO of their couches for the extra tax money they gotta pay?
 
2012-12-19 10:33:51 AM  

mrshowrules: beta_plus: Dog food is actually more expensive than human food. We'll just have to get by on home cooked chicken, dried beans, and frozen spinach and broccoli for a while. Which is actually what you should eat in the first place given how damn fat we have gotten.

 
 
Here is a map of parts of the US were those items cannot even be purchased.

I'm sure there's some value to this map, but I don't know what it is. No population density is given with it which might make the midwest look very different, and it fails a basic hometown check for methodology.
 
i.imgur.com
 
2012-12-19 10:36:29 AM  

beta_plus: Dog food is actually more expensive than human food. We'll just have to get by on home cooked chicken, dried beans, and frozen spinach and broccoli for a while. Which is actually what you should eat in the first place given how damn fat we have gotten.


Wut!?

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-12-19 10:36:32 AM  

The Evil That Lies In The Hearts Of Men: And in a few years from now all those Republican voting seniors will be scratching their heads wondering why they can't afford some of the things they used to.


Nonsense. Fox will be telling them "Obama cut yer Social Security! We tried to stop him but his bloodthirst could not be slaked!"
 
2012-12-19 10:39:24 AM  
FTA: Differences between the two inflation measures are small, often about 0.3 percent in a given year.

It won't even significantly affect current or near-future recipients. In 30 years it may be, but i think Obama is banking that other benefits and entitlements would make up for it. And even if it doesn't, you can deal with it in 20 or 30 years when it does become a problem. But right now, he has to be willing to give the Republicans something that they want.
 
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