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(WXYZ Detroit)   Utah student takes NRA's advice and everyone's in a tizzy   (wxyz.com) divider line 48
    More: Dumbass, NRA, Utah, Newtown, KSL-TV, Granite School District, students  
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18202 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Dec 2012 at 5:19 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


Archived thread
2012-12-18 05:33:55 PM
5 votes:

mexicymru: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Not a bad idea on some level, but do you really think you can guarantee that an 11 year old cannot figure out where your weapons are and how to get to them?



As a parent of an 11 year old, and a gun owner, I can state categorically that yes, I can guarantee he doesn't have access to them. That is my responsibility. If an 11 year old can "figure out where they are and get access to them" then you're doing it wrong. If I ever doubted my ability to assert positive control over my guns, I would get rid of them.

I'd be hard-pressed to commit myself to that guarantee. Of course, I don't own any guns, so it's not actually an issue.

That's fine, and a perfectly valid reason to not own guns.
2012-12-18 05:28:27 PM
5 votes:
I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.
2012-12-18 05:35:05 PM
4 votes:

mexicymru: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Not a bad idea on some level, but do you really think you can guarantee that an 11 year old cannot figure out where your weapons are and how to get to them? I'd be hard-pressed to commit myself to that guarantee. Of course, I don't own any guns, so it's not actually an issue.


This may sound extreme, but if you can't guarantee that, you shouldn't get to own guns in America.

/But 11-year-olds are so clever!
//If you're not smarter than a 6th grader, you won't be much help in an armed overthrow of tyranny anyway.*
///And you might be a redneck.
2012-12-18 10:20:35 PM
3 votes:
[shrug]
 
There were people right here on Fark, the day of the shooting, insisting that people in the school should have had guns, then this tragedy would not have happened.
 
Now they're backpedaling, saying what they MEANT was that TEACHERS should have had the guns. So, what, when a teacher gets caught with a gun tomorrow, they'll backpedal some more and say what they MEANT was that only PROPERLY LICENSED GUARDS should have had the guns?
 
This is why you don't go making up new laws & rules on the spur of the moment.
2012-12-18 10:07:29 PM
2 votes:

uttertosh: way south: uttertosh: diaphoresis: //Lots more money for mental health issues needed

But where should that money come from? The People?

We've been raising the debt ceiling to pay for stealth bombers and pork barrel projects.
Raise it a hair more and get this done.

So, not socialized medicine, then? Not your countrymen looking after thier own? MOAR DEBT. nice


I wasn't in favor of socialized medicine, but congress is powered by the magic flowing from our wallets so SURE, why not?!

/Ever notice that the federal government is kind of like a cheapskate father?
/He tells you there's no money in the budget to buy the name brand breakfast cereal, then gets himself a nice leather lay-z-boy and a mini fridge for his beer.
2012-12-18 06:39:41 PM
2 votes:
Is this boy not a citizen?

What I want to know is, why don't we follow the constitution? The right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Arms, not firearms. So bazookas and hand grenades and mortars and artillery.

And the constitution does not say "except in these cases." It says shall not be infringed.

If this kid wants to take a pistol to school, that's his constitutional right. If I want to take a bazooka onto a plane, that's my right. It's right there in the constitution. No exceptions listed.

I'm sick of the weaselly NRA talking about limited rights when we have the right to carry arms without restriction. I can carry grenades into a church. I can carry mines into Congress. I can mount a 50 caliber machine gun on my car. Let freedom ring.

Why are we denied our obvious, plainly-stated constitutional rights?
2012-12-18 06:18:48 PM
2 votes:
fyi,
for those of you that make fun of florida.
well, hate to break it to you
the rest of the world feels the same way about your entire country.
2012-12-18 06:13:38 PM
2 votes:

mittromneysdog: Rent Party: mittromneysdog: Lochsteppe: This may sound extreme, but if you can't guarantee that

Contrary to the bravado, it is actually impossible to guarantee kids won't get ahold of one of your guns. You can decrease the odds to pretty low. But you can't decrease them to zero.

Horseshiat. If you can't outsmart an 11 year old, don't own guns.

If you think you can decrease the odds of your child getting ahold of your weapon to zero, then I'd say there's a better chance than you imagine that you can't outsmart an 11 year old.


I haven't ruled out the Earth being taken over by space aliens, either, but right now I'm going to bet it ain't gonna happen.
2012-12-18 06:11:06 PM
2 votes:

Rent Party: mittromneysdog: Lochsteppe: This may sound extreme, but if you can't guarantee that

Contrary to the bravado, it is actually impossible to guarantee kids won't get ahold of one of your guns. You can decrease the odds to pretty low. But you can't decrease them to zero.

Horseshiat. If you can't outsmart an 11 year old, don't own guns.


If you think you can decrease the odds of your child getting ahold of your weapon to zero, then I'd say there's a better chance than you imagine that you can't outsmart an 11 year old.
2012-12-18 06:08:38 PM
2 votes:

mittromneysdog: Lochsteppe: This may sound extreme, but if you can't guarantee that

Contrary to the bravado, it is actually impossible to guarantee kids won't get ahold of one of your guns. You can decrease the odds to pretty low. But you can't decrease them to zero.


Horseshiat. If you can't outsmart an 11 year old, don't own guns.
2012-12-18 06:07:47 PM
2 votes:

way south: Broktun: Firearm homicide is the leading cause of death for African Americans ages 1-44.

Source:

Nat'l Ctr. for Injury Prevention & Control, U.S. Centers for Disease Control & Prevention, Web-Based Injury Statistics Query & Reporting System (WISQARS) Leading Causes of Death Reports, 1999-2009, for National, Regional, and States (RESTRICTED), at http://webappa.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/dataRestriction_lcd.html (last visited Mar. 8, 2012) (hereinafter WISQARS Leading Causes of Death Reports, 1999-2009;

African Americans are also a minority among legal gun owners.
Much of the problem is caused by poverty and the drug war.


And the culture that accepts it.
2012-12-18 06:06:39 PM
2 votes:

stampylives: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

i actually think this is close to an idea, but the failing point is when you take someone's gun and then shoot them with it.


Being assaulted and having the gun taken from your physical person by force shall be a positive defense against 1st Degree "Storing Your Gun Like an Asshole."


still, the idea is the deterrent to careless gun storage/access, not that its isntantly going to solve all gun crime... nothing ever will (nor any other kind of crime ever be solved).


Nothing is ever going to solve all of *any* kind of crime. That doesn't mean we should just throw up our hands and say "Fark it! Anarchy!"



yeah thats kind of the point. i think "if you can't keep a gun secure from an 11 year old, you shouldn't own a gun" is pretty close to a factual statement. i think the more troubling case isnt the 11 year old, its the "my ex-wife knew the combination to my gun safe, gave my gun to a drug dealer, and locked it back up in the hopes i wouldnt know it was missing" case.


In that case, you were irresponsible by allowing someone to know the combo to the gun safe that shouldn't. Six months in the poke for you with an additional three month ex-wife penalty.

Change the combo regularly, or get bio-metric locks.
2012-12-18 06:01:30 PM
2 votes:

Lochsteppe: This may sound extreme, but if you can't guarantee that


Contrary to the bravado, it is actually impossible to guarantee kids won't get ahold of one of your guns. You can decrease the odds to pretty low. But you can't decrease them to zero.
2012-12-18 05:49:49 PM
2 votes:
FTA: Horsley says school police are investing reports that the boy pointed the gun at another child's head.

But we're going to report that he brought it for self-defense.
2012-12-18 05:44:44 PM
2 votes:

Rent Party: JesseL: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Just be aware that that policy will have its own cost in lives.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-06-23/phoenix- te en-shoots-intruder/55782484/1

Every policy has it's cost in lives.

This is the cost of the current policy.

Link


Not all those firearms homicides were murder. The statistics linked include people killed in justifiable self-defense.
2012-12-18 05:36:22 PM
2 votes:
Secure your guns people. If your kid (or someone breaking into your home) has free access to your firearms and ammunition, you're doing it wrong.
2012-12-18 05:21:54 PM
2 votes:

tallguywithglasseson: The more guns in schools, the less likely someone will be injured or killed by one.


Well, that's just common sense.
2012-12-18 05:21:04 PM
2 votes:
The more guns in schools, the less likely someone will be injured or killed by one.
2012-12-19 01:58:30 AM
1 votes:
Drop the hammer on the parents.
If my dog bites someone, _I_ am held responsible.
Once mom & dad have to take off of work to go to court, or they have to start paying fines for little Johnny's behavior, or are forced to pay for child care because the kid got suspended ... watch how quick this doesn't happen again.
2012-12-19 12:10:13 AM
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: [shrug]
 
There were people right here on Fark, the day of the shooting, insisting that people in the school should have had guns, then this tragedy would not have happened.
 
Now they're backpedaling, saying what they MEANT was that TEACHERS should have had the guns. So, what, when a teacher gets caught with a gun tomorrow, they'll backpedal some more and say what they MEANT was that only PROPERLY LICENSED GUARDS should have had the guns?
 
This is why you don't go making up new laws & rules on the spur of the moment.

 
 
Professional soldiers shoot themselves in friendly fire incidents all the time, but we're supposed to believe that civilians who have probably never been in a combat situation are going to be popping off head shots like they were the cast of The Walking Dead?  Demand for guns and ammo has been outstripping supply ever since Obama's election and we just get more mass shootings.  I'm sorry, but there has to be a better solution.
2012-12-18 11:20:58 PM
1 votes:
Just like sex education, a lot of adults expect someone else to do it so they don't hurt their snowflake's feelings. A lot of gun accidents in the households and kids carrying guns for this reason are usually offspring of those types of parents. I think a lot of the issues come from these types of parents raising their kids without educating them in dangers and consequences of weapons and their actions in general.

But hey, let's just get media over-sensationalism of tragedies and then rush through some half baked laws into place restricting rights even more and call it good, eh?
2012-12-18 10:21:56 PM
1 votes:

hdhale: tallguywithglasseson: The more guns in schools, the less likely someone will be injured or killed by one.

So what you are saying is when they were handing out brains, you were very polite and held the door for everyone instead. Thanks.

Subby: thanks for confirming my belief that any moron can get a submission green lit if they try hard enough


I believe tallguywithglasseson was partaking of some sarcasm.
2012-12-18 10:15:32 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: JesseL: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Just be aware that that policy will have its own cost in lives.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-06-23/phoenix- te en-shoots-intruder/55782484/1

Every policy has it's cost in lives.

This is the cost of the current policy.

Link


Yeah, but if gun control was tightened up surely those 11,493 homicides would be committed with a butter knife or a comb instead.
2012-12-18 09:57:33 PM
1 votes:

tallguywithglasseson: The more guns in schools, the less likely someone will be injured or killed by one.

 
 
If guns aren't the problem, then guns are also not the solution.

 
2012-12-18 09:19:19 PM
1 votes:

Anonymocoso: There are kids in Kearns that don't bring guns to school?

Wait, what?

/Used to live by 6200 South and 5600 West


I currently live near 6200S 5600W...

stalker.
gonna get me a gun.
2012-12-18 08:52:33 PM
1 votes:

way south: /Can you believe there was only one ringtone?


Not if you were on a party line.
2012-12-18 07:58:55 PM
1 votes:

uttertosh: diaphoresis: //Lots more money for mental health issues needed

But where should that money come from? The People?


We've been raising the debt ceiling to pay for stealth bombers and pork barrel projects.
Raise it a hair more and get this done.
2012-12-18 07:37:57 PM
1 votes:
If your 11 year old child takes one of your guns to school you have failed so many ways as a parent and probably need to be sterilized
2012-12-18 07:33:48 PM
1 votes:

Felgraf: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Wouldn't have helped in the Sandy case, though, because he kind of *killed* the legal owner (his mom).


Wouldn't have helped? What did he kill her with?

We might infer, then, that she did not exercise proper care over those very same weapons. If she hadn't have been guilty of "Storing Guns Like as Asshole" he wouldn't have had access to them in the first place.
2012-12-18 07:30:19 PM
1 votes:

JesseL: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Just be aware that that policy will have its own cost in lives.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-06-23/phoenix- te en-shoots-intruder/55782484/1


JesseL, I think you're one of the more reasonable gun enthusiasts on this site, but you are jumping to the conclusion that's most convenient to your philosophy here.

Read that story from a neutral perspective and you can't definitively say what would've happened if the kid just hid with his siblings, or ran out the back door to a neighbor's house. The intruders could've just robbed the place and left without harming any of them. I'm glad it worked out the way it did, but IMO, that article does nothing to support your claim that a policy that imposes consequences for adults who fail to keep guns out of the hands of kids "will have its own cost in lives."

And who's to say that such a policy couldn't be worded to allow for castle doctrine cases? But if a kid shot someone who had a right to be there, such as a utility meter reader or someone like that, then Mom and Dad should be penalized just as if the kid stole the gun out of their bedroom, brought it to school and shot up some classmates.

Until we the people can have reasonable discussions among ourselves about serious topics like this, expect politicians and the media to do what they do best...leverage tragedies to further their own agendas.
2012-12-18 07:27:52 PM
1 votes:
If your kid can remove a gun from your home without your knowledge, you fail as a gun owner and a parent.

I don't understand why the purchase of a gun doesn't require any kind of training or education... Thank goodness the kid didn't decide to play with a loaded gun and blow his out his friend's head off.

I think at the very least you should have to take a safety workshop and pass a test and if you're boneheaded enough to not secure your firearm and your kid gets caught with it, you lose your gun privileges for awhile. Same if you accidentally discharge it and end up shooting someone. Why not? If you drive like an asshole and fark up enough, you lose your driving privileges. Both a car and a gun are potentially deadly and both require knowledge and skills to operate safely, yet only one is closely regulated (and I'd argue that for most people, driving is far more necessary than owning a gun.)
2012-12-18 07:21:43 PM
1 votes:
NRA is a group that protects the right to bear arms but most Farkers say they are evil because the founding fathers only meant things like muskets and knives.

And because weapons such as assault weapons didn't exist at the time, they shouldn't be covered by the 2nd Amendment and that all gun owners should be registered with the government.

Am I understanding this correctly?

If so, I'm all for it.

But then Facebook, Twitter, Fark etc. should hand over all social media registration because things like the internet shouldn't be covered under the 1st Amendment because it didn't exist when the Bill of Rights were drafted.

Freedom of Speech should only be protected by what you can shout out in the town square or write with a quill pen and parchment.
2012-12-18 06:55:26 PM
1 votes:

edgesrealm: This is the cost of the current policy.

Link

Not all those firearms homicides were murder. The statistics linked include people killed in justifiable self-defense.

Really? Were you there? No? Then how could you confirm that? Oh, you can't, because in the section where firearm deaths are explained, the writer of the report makes no mention of self-defense being separate from the number. In fact, he categorizes two only: Suicide, and Homicide.

In any case, death by irresponsible moron with a gun (whether they shoot at themselves or others), is exactly that and in the end is counted by one number only.

// You did sound like an NRA supporter (you know, the brainwashed masses).
/// Nothing wrong with it, just get the facts right and RTFA.


People killed by other people are always homicides - whether it's illegal (and thus murder or manslaughter) or legal (such as justified self defense or a police shooting).

/I am an NRA supporter.
//Life member since 86.
2012-12-18 06:43:58 PM
1 votes:

mittromneysdog: Lochsteppe: This may sound extreme, but if you can't guarantee that

Contrary to the bravado, it is actually impossible to guarantee kids won't get ahold of one of your guns. You can decrease the odds to pretty low. But you can't decrease them to zero.


You're better off making them respect and fear the gun than never letting them see it, anyway, and to practice on it occasionally when they get old enough. The novelty factor is where most accidental deaths come from.
2012-12-18 06:23:41 PM
1 votes:

tallguywithglasseson: The more guns in schools, the less likely someone will be injured or killed by one.


"The closer we are to danger, the further we are from harm."
2012-12-18 06:18:16 PM
1 votes:

Broktun: way south: Broktun: Firearm homicide is the leading cause of death for African Americans ages 1-44.

Source:

Nat'l Ctr. for Injury Prevention & Control, U.S. Centers for Disease Control & Prevention, Web-Based Injury Statistics Query & Reporting System (WISQARS) Leading Causes of Death Reports, 1999-2009, for National, Regional, and States (RESTRICTED), at http://webappa.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/dataRestriction_lcd.html (last visited Mar. 8, 2012) (hereinafter WISQARS Leading Causes of Death Reports, 1999-2009;

African Americans are also a minority among legal gun owners.
Much of the problem is caused by poverty and the drug war.

And the culture that accepts it.


I don't accept it but I can't publicly state that since the left would no doubt label me a racist-homophobe-anti Semite-bigot-fascist-Nazi-whatever other buzzwords they like to use.
2012-12-18 06:01:49 PM
1 votes:

tallguywithglasseson: The more guns in schools, the less likely someone will be injured or killed by one.


So what you are saying is when they were handing out brains, you were very polite and held the door for everyone instead. Thanks.

Subby: thanks for confirming my belief that any moron can get a submission green lit if they try hard enough
2012-12-18 05:52:40 PM
1 votes:

JesseL: Rent Party: JesseL: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Just be aware that that policy will have its own cost in lives.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-06-23/phoenix- te en-shoots-intruder/55782484/1

Every policy has it's cost in lives.

This is the cost of the current policy.

Link

Not all those firearms homicides were murder. The statistics linked include people killed in justifiable self-defense.


Yes, They were probably sporting guns that they acquired when some "responsible gun owner" left his shiat laying around for a scumbag to steal. Most crime guns were illicitly obtained. Put another way, most crime guns were improperly stored by their legal owner.

Link

That is a study from Los Angeles, but I've no reason to doubt the conclusions can't be generalized to criminal classes everywhere.
2012-12-18 05:46:56 PM
1 votes:

Sticky Hands: Sticky Hands: In Kearns?

I'd be surprised if the kids weren't armed.

meh I mixed up Kearns with Glendale.
Still.. Kearns ain't all the great either.


Kearns makes Glendale look like Deer Valley.
2012-12-18 05:44:43 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: JesseL: Rent Party: I'm going to go back to the Rent Party Policy that places 100% of the responsibility for guns on their legal owners. Whichever dipshiat left this gun in an unsecured state, allowing a sixth grader access to it, should be going to prison for two years.

Start directing mandatory minimum sentencing at those "responsible" gun owners that are really "irresponsible assholes" and you'll find far fewer weapons in the hands of those that shouldn't have them.

Just be aware that that policy will have its own cost in lives.
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-06-23/phoenix- te en-shoots-intruder/55782484/1

Every policy has it's cost in lives.

This is the cost of the current policy.

Link


eloquentscience.com
2012-12-18 05:35:50 PM
1 votes:
In Kearns?

I'd be surprised if the kids weren't armed.
2012-12-18 05:32:02 PM
1 votes:
Guns don't kill people, Eric Holder kills people.
2012-12-18 05:28:39 PM
1 votes:

vegasj: Didn't he see the "Gun Free Zone" signage?


Just more and more media pushed anti-gun "news"...

The liberal media will really try to push this agenda now won't they


Absolutely! They'll be comin' fer your guns aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaany day now....

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaany day now.......

/Maybe in the 3rd term?
2012-12-18 05:27:23 PM
1 votes:
I love the hyper-sensitivity to the tragedy.

BAN ALL GUNS, HERP A DERP

We should lock up all people with Asperger Syndrome because they could be violent.

No thought, just react.
2012-12-18 05:26:36 PM
1 votes:
There are kids in Kearns that don't bring guns to school?

Wait, what?

/Used to live by 6200 South and 5600 West
2012-12-18 05:23:49 PM
1 votes:
Didn't he see the "Gun Free Zone" signage?


Just more and more media pushed anti-gun "news"...

The liberal media will really try to push this agenda now won't they
2012-12-18 05:23:19 PM
1 votes:
Man, the government sure is pulling out all stops when it comes to generating public sympathy for their latest gun-ban.
2012-12-18 05:22:13 PM
1 votes:
What advice was that exactly subby?

The only thing they've said since Friday was:
"The NRA is made up of four million moms and dads, sons and daughters - and we were shocked, saddened and heartbroken by the news of the horrific and senseless murders in Newtown. Out of respect for the families, and as a matter of common de
cency, we have given time for mourning, prayer and a full investigation of the facts before commenting. The NRA is prepared to offer meaningful contributions to help make sure this never happens again."
 
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