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(Salon)   A federal judged has banned North Carolina from issuing "Choose Life" license plates unless they offer a "Choose Death" alternative   (salon.com) divider line 285
    More: Interesting, North Carolina, reproductive rights, state legislators, discrimination  
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7489 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Dec 2012 at 12:54 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-12 02:56:29 PM  

Netrngr: Pincy: Rufus Lee King: Pincy: I'm guessing you also think the Confederate flag doesn't represent racism?

Oh, Christ. Here it goes.

Sorry, wasn't trying to start a Confederate flag flame fest here, just pointing out that Netrngr is being (purposefully?) obtuse.
No just making a point bringing that up is akin to saying you are here to start something and acting like a retread. Don't try and encourage flamewars.


Again, you are missing the point entirely. And leave my tires out of this.
 
2012-12-12 02:58:35 PM  

SpiderQueenDemon: Virginia has a 'Trust Women' pro-choice plate. I thought it was nice, kind of like saying "It's okay, guys, I have a uterus and I know what I'm doing here, if I can be a good mom, I'll have the kid, but if not, you have to trust me. I've got this one."

Of course, being a contentious issue, I was hesitant. Sure, I know how to buff out a scratch, but you can only fix paint so many times.

But then I saw that they had one with a kitty and a doggie on it that benefits animal shelters, so that's what I wound up picking for the station wagon, my husband chose one of the general-aviation ones with an airplane on it for the coupe and the minivan got an alumni-association plate with our college logo. Nobody objects to animals, airplanes or to your alumni plate (unless you went to Penn State, which we didn't, and that's kind of blown over...or Duke...) and if I really need street cred at some kind of vehicular abortion debate, I can always impale a foam-rubber fetus on the antenna I fixed with a coat hanger and carry on about my day.


"Trust Women"?

I demand a "Don't trust anything that bleeds for 5 days and doesn't die" plate in response!

/isn't the animal shelter plate the one with the kitten and puppy hugging? That promotes interspecies mating!
 
2012-12-12 02:58:47 PM  

Tman144: Yes. If the state is going to sponsor political speech, it has to sponsor all or nothing


I think NC can legitimately deny those on neutral space considerations. If he can come up with pithy two word summaries of those viewpoints, he might have a case.
 
2012-12-12 02:59:44 PM  

Netrngr: Pincy: Netrngr: I have a novel idea. Lets offer thing people may want, let them choose what they want to purchase, try not to get our selves so farking offended m and finally keep the farking government out of my choices. Strangely this works for both sides of the argument.

You do realize that the government issues license plates, right? Kind of hard to keep government out of your choice of plate.

Yes I realize the state government offers them as a product just like any other vendor. These aren't official state plates. They are a premium that you must choose to purchase at extra expense. The argument being made would be valid if they forced you ta use the plate. as it stands its your choice to buy it or not.


Wow, just wow. First, the state is not just like any other vendor. If they were just like any other vendor then I would be able to purchase a plate from any other vendor. Second, yes, they can't force you to purchase a customized plate but they force you into the limited options you have for customized plates because they are the only one who can issue said plates.

This really isn't that hard. The state has a monopoly over license plates. Thus, the state will always be involved in what choices you have for customized plates.
 
2012-12-12 03:00:14 PM  

deanis: [www.dot.wisconsin.gov image 200x102]


That should actually say "Packers, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" on the bottom. And Mike and the Bots should be riffing on the tag number.
 
2012-12-12 03:01:17 PM  

Somacandra: LaraAmber: Wear anti-abortion and scripture related clothing to your school and in public. This is your fundamental, constitutionally protected, basic human right

/[ACLU] Approves.


Right. A PDF of the decision.

The key issue is whether the speech on the license plate is government speech or private speech in a forum created by the government for private speech. If it is the G talking, it can pretty much say what it wants as long as it doesn't establish religion. But if the G creates a public forum for private speech, it may not discriminate based on viewpoint absent a compelling governmental interest.

The court figured that with all those plates to choose from, it was private speech. Is the answer the same if the state offers only two message plates along with the plain numbers, and one of them is Choose Life and the other Famous Potatoes?
 
2012-12-12 03:03:58 PM  

KatjaMouse: I'm not sure if it's still available here but my sister got this plate:

[www.plannedparenthood.org image 315x163] 

It was actually a plate sponsored and designed by Planned Parenthood.


Still available.
 
2012-12-12 03:06:29 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: Even if they print Choose Life plates and Respect Choice plates, my views are being oppressed if I believe any of the following:

Choose Life except in the case that the mother's life is in danger, then kill that babby.
Choose Life except in cases of danger to mother/rape/incest, then kill babby.
Choose Life except in cases of birf defects/danger to mother/rape/incest, then kill babby
Respect Choice unless in last trimester, then save clump of cells.
Respect Choice unless in last two trimesters, then save clump of cells.
Respect Choice, but institute programs to make potential mothers aware of alternatives
Respect Choice, but force women to undergo transvaginal ultrasounds, so they can see their clump.
Etc...

Is it the state's responsibility to print all of those plates?
Seems silly.


It does seem silly -- the subscript would be too small to read.

Also, you forgot "Thank God for Rape Babies!!" :-)

All of your examples were neatly summarized by their first 2 words, and can be grouped into opposing sides based on that.

Personally I would rather just see neither side represented, that's what bumper stickers are for.
 
2012-12-12 03:10:50 PM  

mittromneysdog: Tman144: Yes. If the state is going to sponsor political speech, it has to sponsor all or nothing

I think NC can legitimately deny those on neutral space considerations. If he can come up with pithy two word summaries of those viewpoints, he might have a case.


I think that's part of the point: There's a ton of nuances and complexities to the abortion argument. To boil it down to a license plate slogan seems retarded.

That's where my "precious little snowflakes with their panties in a bunch" thing came from - it's about those people who just have to tell the world their black and white viewpoints via an incredibly idiotic medium, and if they can't buy the plate that fits their views, well by-golly they're GONNA SUE! It wasn't about conservatives vs liberals, man. It was about idiots.
 
2012-12-12 03:14:14 PM  

mittromneysdog: Even With A Chainsaw: This isn't about freedom of speech, this is about someone getting their panties in a bunch, which any of us could theoretically do if we can't get a license plate that says whatever our precious little snowflake minds can think up.

I remember around 2000, when a judge ordered the state of Missouri to permit the KKK to participate in its "adopt a highway" program on the same basic rationale of this case--i.e., no viewpoint discrimination when the government creates a forum for political speech. Even though the ruling was a victory for the conservative racial point of view, progressives celebrated it as a victory for what should be the universal value of free speech.

Today, by contrast, when a judge orders a state to permit a dissenting view from the government's officially anti-choice stance, do conservatives celebrate a victory for free speech?

Of course not. This is America, after all. Instead they whine about how persecuted they are, and claim 1st Amendment supporters have their "panties in a bunch."


The right to cars?
 
2012-12-12 03:15:52 PM  
Abortion is Murder.

www.abort73.com

"Colored people are like human weeds and are to be exterminated."
-- Margaret Sanger, founder of Planned Parenthood

"We should hire three or four colored ministers, preferably with social-service backgrounds, and with engaging personalities. The most successful educational approach to the Negro is through a religious appeal. We don't want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population. And the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members."
-- Margaret Sanger, also founder of the Negro Project
 
2012-12-12 03:19:57 PM  

letrole: "Colored people are like human weeds and are to be exterminated."
-- Margaret Sanger, founder of Planned Parenthood


"I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And in as much as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
-- Abraham Lincoln

People can be wrong about things and still do good.
 
2012-12-12 03:21:03 PM  

DubyaHater: Being pro-choice and living in Roanoke, VA, I don't think I'd put a "Respect Choice" plate on my car........unless I want a key or two dragged across the paint.


Why stay in a place where you have to hide who you are or face vandalism (and worse)? I left Kentucky for the Philadelphia suburbs over 15 years ago, and looking back think it was one of the best decisions of my life.

There was some culture shock, but the majority was from good surprises, as peoples' warnings and my own preconceived fears turned out to be wrong.
 
2012-12-12 03:21:34 PM  
FESTIVUS FOR THE REST OF US!!
 
2012-12-12 03:22:03 PM  

Deucednuisance: Lumpmoose: Except when it's:

A. Death

What about B: Cake?

[graphjam.files.wordpress.com image 500x265]

Seems like the popular option....


The cake is a lie.
 
2012-12-12 03:23:14 PM  
The only specialty plate that's useful is the 'Organ Donor' plate.
Lets the ambulance drivers know to keep that heart pumpin', at least til they reach the hospital.

/Tho I suppose someone in need of a transplant might try to run you off the road...
"Hey, You - What's your blood type?... Really?..." *crash*
 
2012-12-12 03:24:01 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: mittromneysdog: Tman144: Yes. If the state is going to sponsor political speech, it has to sponsor all or nothing

I think NC can legitimately deny those on neutral space considerations. If he can come up with pithy two word summaries of those viewpoints, he might have a case.

I think that's part of the point: There's a ton of nuances and complexities to the abortion argument. To boil it down to a license plate slogan seems retarded.

That's where my "precious little snowflakes with their panties in a bunch" thing came from - it's about those people who just have to tell the world their black and white viewpoints via an incredibly idiotic medium, and if they can't buy the plate that fits their views, well by-golly they're GONNA SUE! It wasn't about conservatives vs liberals, man. It was about idiots.


If you want to advertise your political opinions on your car, buy a bumper sticker. For the State Government to try and issue only one side of a highly contentious, political argument and not the other boils down to State sponsored disapproval of legal medical procedure. All the Judge said was issue both or neither. Since the Republican led State House (and R who led/sponsored the plate in the first place) refused to allow issuance of the opposing view they can have neither. End of story.

/don't believe I had to study it out for you
 
2012-12-12 03:26:06 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: mittromneysdog: Tman144: Yes. If the state is going to sponsor political speech, it has to sponsor all or nothing

I think NC can legitimately deny those on neutral space considerations. If he can come up with pithy two word summaries of those viewpoints, he might have a case.

I think that's part of the point: There's a ton of nuances and complexities to the abortion argument. To boil it down to a license plate slogan seems retarded.

That's where my "precious little snowflakes with their panties in a bunch" thing came from - it's about those people who just have to tell the world their black and white viewpoints via an incredibly idiotic medium, and if they can't buy the plate that fits their views, well by-golly they're GONNA SUE! It wasn't about conservatives vs liberals, man. It was about idiots.


I agree that people who feel the need to express their political views via license plate are idiots. However, the government cannot discriminate against one group of idiots while supporting another. Besides, what's wrong with a lawsuit? It's how civilized people settle disputes.
 
2012-12-12 03:30:16 PM  
Zasteva: People can be wrong about things and still do good.

Murdering millions of negroes is what she intended, and murdering millions of negroes is what was achieved.

What an odd notion of 'doing good'.
 
2012-12-12 03:37:58 PM  

letrole: Zasteva: People can be wrong about things and still do good.

Murdering millions of negroes is what she intended, and murdering millions of negroes is what was achieved.

What an odd notion of 'doing good'.


9/10 -- your name kind of gives it away.
 
2012-12-12 03:45:18 PM  

Zasteva: Margaret Sanger


Well that and Margret Sanger never actually said that! She thought whites superior to blacks as a race, but she also thought they should have access to birth control.
 
2012-12-12 03:56:25 PM  

Zasteva: letrole: Zasteva: People can be wrong about things and still do good.

Murdering millions of negroes is what she intended, and murdering millions of negroes is what was achieved.

What an odd notion of 'doing good'.

9/10 -- your name kind of gives it away.


I think that is part of the fun for him, he likes to see who will bite when he outright tells them he is trolling.
 
2012-12-12 03:57:15 PM  

WhoopAssWayne: The crackpot liberal freeloaders are more than happy to take away someone else's free speech rights.

It is long past time we re-establish free religious speech in this country. In church. In schools. In public. The liberals have been chipping away at this basic human right for years and now we've reached this ridiculous and sad point. Free speech for them, government censored speech for anyone else.

Demand your basic free speech rights!

Stand up in your church and call out crooked politicians by name. Wear anti-abortion and scripture related clothing to your school and in public. This is your fundamental, constitutionally protected, basic human right and it must not be abridged by these extremist liberal crackpots.


3/10
 
2012-12-12 04:00:14 PM  
The options in Virginia are almost ridiculous.

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov

www.dmv.virginia.gov
 
2012-12-12 04:02:21 PM  
Judge: "he State's offering a Choose Life license plate in the absence of a pro-choice alternative constitutes viewpoint discrimination in violation of the First Amendment."


That's just poppycock, judge.

/Poopycock
 
2012-12-12 04:03:18 PM  

ZAZ: TheSelphie: Massachusetts of all places has these.

Massachusetts is conflicted because the Boston area is very Catholic. Catholics are the liberal wing of the Christian party most of the time, but very conservative on abortion. We also have a lot of CINO who dutifully go to mass but act like ordinary sinners the rest of the week/month/year.


Oh, you don't have to tell me. Was born and raised Catholic, my great-aunt is a former nun and now serves on the Board of one of the major pro-life orgs in the state, and many of my other relatives are vehemently pro-life. They are literally one-issue voters.
 
2012-12-12 04:04:53 PM  
Why are state governments promoting any religious viewpoint, at all?
 
2012-12-12 04:05:45 PM  

FormlessOne: Why are state governments promoting any religious viewpoint, at all?


Because socialism is on the march!
 
2012-12-12 04:06:29 PM  

FormlessOne: Why are state governments promoting any religious viewpoint, at all?


Because they can make money off of the custom plate fees.
 
2012-12-12 04:10:09 PM  

CapeFearCadaver: Even With A Chainsaw: mittromneysdog: Tman144: Yes. If the state is going to sponsor political speech, it has to sponsor all or nothing

I think NC can legitimately deny those on neutral space considerations. If he can come up with pithy two word summaries of those viewpoints, he might have a case.

I think that's part of the point: There's a ton of nuances and complexities to the abortion argument. To boil it down to a license plate slogan seems retarded.

That's where my "precious little snowflakes with their panties in a bunch" thing came from - it's about those people who just have to tell the world their black and white viewpoints via an incredibly idiotic medium, and if they can't buy the plate that fits their views, well by-golly they're GONNA SUE! It wasn't about conservatives vs liberals, man. It was about idiots.

If you want to advertise your political opinions on your car, buy a bumper sticker.


This.

For the State Government to try and issue only one side of a highly contentious, political argument and not the other boils down to State sponsored disapproval of legal medical procedure.

So the argument is that if the government allows a forum for speech to exist, it must allow the same degree of speech to exist in that forum as in all other forums? I can see that making sense, although the speech is already restricted based on space allowed, and all those plates they ban for being "offensive." I think you can't possibly get the same degree of "free speech" on a plate as is guaranteed by the constitution. You'd still be limited by the plates produced by the state.

End of story.

/don't believe I had to study it out for you


I guess Fark is too used to people with set in stone opinions or outright trolls. I came in asking to be convinced and presented some opposing viewpoints. Do you make good arguments? Sure, but I specifically asked how it was "unconstitutional" that a state made a plate that said Choose Life. Since there isn't a right to cars, I'm not sure how car accessories fall under the constitution.

This doesn't mean that I agree that the state has any business in making these plates, and yes, I think that if they're making "one side" they should make the other. I just don't get the constitutional angle.
 
2012-12-12 04:11:34 PM  

Beowoolfie: DubyaHater: Being pro-choice and living in Roanoke, VA, I don't think I'd put a "Respect Choice" plate on my car........unless I want a key or two dragged across the paint.

Why stay in a place where you have to hide who you are or face vandalism (and worse)? I left Kentucky for the Philadelphia suburbs over 15 years ago, and looking back think it was one of the best decisions of my life.

There was some culture shock, but the majority was from good surprises, as peoples' warnings and my own preconceived fears turned out to be wrong.


My chosen occupation makes it difficult to find a job. I'm sort of stuck here.
 
2012-12-12 04:12:24 PM  
Choose Life is now a hateful thing?

I believe you're so f*cked up in your head you can add two and two and get ObamaPotatoes™
 
2012-12-12 04:12:49 PM  

FormlessOne: Why are state governments promoting any religious viewpoint, at all?



Why is this *necessarily* a religious issue?
 
2012-12-12 04:14:08 PM  

Clemkadidlefark: Choose Life is now a hateful thing?

I believe you're so f*cked up in your head you can add two and two and get ObamaPotatoes™



Maybe it might make the wimmins that offed their offspring "feel bad"?
 
2012-12-12 04:18:20 PM  

vpb: I would think a choose death license plate would do will in the bible belt, as long as they though it referred to war, the second amendment, the death penalty, black people, Muslims, liberals, Mexicans, the French, Gays, union members, the UN, Anyone who doesn't like Israel, Jews, Mormons*, Europeans or Asians. And probably some more that I forgot.

(*Temporarily acceptable)


0/10

Trying too hard
 
2012-12-12 04:19:37 PM  
adweek.blogs.com

Promoting starch, carbohydrates and making people FAT, are we, Idaho?

Wait 'til the ACLU and the Onion Growers Association get through with you!
 
2012-12-12 04:20:51 PM  

Amos Quito: FormlessOne: Why are state governments promoting any religious viewpoint, at all?


Why is this *necessarily* a religious issue?


It's a private medical issue that the state should stay the fark out of.
 
2012-12-12 04:24:06 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: Sure, but I specifically asked how it was "unconstitutional" that a state made a plate that said Choose Life.


It's unconstitutional because they were vehemently opposed to offering the opposing viewpoint. Somewhat among these lines:

Even With A Chainsaw: So the argument is that if the government allows a forum for speech to exist, it must allow the same degree of speech to exist in that forum as in all other forums?


Much like offering protest permits to organizations such as the KKK or WBC. Even though most people on all sides disagree with their messages. If you as a State Government are going to give protest permits that are anti-war, you must also give protest permits to pro-war. Issue them all or none.

You can't create one avenue yet restrict the other avenue when it comes to a State's response to free speech.
 
2012-12-12 04:24:44 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: I guess Fark is too used to people with set in stone opinions or outright trolls. I came in asking to be convinced and presented some opposing viewpoints. Do you make good arguments? Sure, but I specifically asked how it was "unconstitutional" that a state made a plate that said Choose Life. Since there isn't a right to cars, I'm not sure how car accessories fall under the constitution.

This doesn't mean that I agree that the state has any business in making these plates, and yes, I think that if they're making "one side" they should make the other. I just don't get the constitutional angle.


I can't find this specific decision but other cases involving "viewpoint neutrality" refer to the Cornelius v. NAACP case in front of the US Supreme Court in 1985:

Control over access to a nonpublic forum can be based on subject matter and speaker identity so long as the distinctions drawn are reasonable in light of the purpose served by the forum and are viewpoint neutral. Perry Education Assn., supra, at 49. Although a speaker may be excluded from a nonpublic forum if he wishes to address a topic not encompassed within the purpose of the forum, see Lehman v. City of Shaker Heights, 418 U.S. 298 (1974), or if he is not a member of the class of speakers for whose especial benefit the forum was created, see Perry Education Assn., supra, the government violates the First Amendment when it denies access to a speaker solely to suppress the point of view he espouses on an otherwise includible subject.
 
2012-12-12 04:25:36 PM  

CapeFearCadaver: It's unconstitutional because they were vehemently opposed to offering refusing to offer the opposing viewpoint.


ftfm
 
2012-12-12 04:36:14 PM  

Pincy: Hoblit: I don't get it. I'm pro-choice (I'm not going to change your mind and you're not going to change mind)

I would still encourage choosing life whenever possible and the plate references that choice. It doesn't say PRO Life, it says CHOOSE life. Simply an encouraging statement. Shouldn't we choose life whenever possible and encourage (not force) those of around us to do the same?

I really think it is a lot to do over nothing.

I'm guessing you also think the Confederate flag doesn't represent racism?


Wow, you're a dense one aren't you. You claim to be pro-choice yet get mad when someone promotes one of those choices over the other.
 
2012-12-12 04:37:47 PM  

giftedmadness: Pincy: Hoblit: I don't get it. I'm pro-choice (I'm not going to change your mind and you're not going to change mind)

I would still encourage choosing life whenever possible and the plate references that choice. It doesn't say PRO Life, it says CHOOSE life. Simply an encouraging statement. Shouldn't we choose life whenever possible and encourage (not force) those of around us to do the same?

I really think it is a lot to do over nothing.

I'm guessing you also think the Confederate flag doesn't represent racism?

Wow, you're a dense one aren't you. You claim to be pro-choice yet get mad when someone promotes one of those choices over the other.


Another person with no critical thinking skills.
 
2012-12-12 04:39:19 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: I guess Fark is too used to people with set in stone opinions or outright trolls. I came in asking to be convinced and presented some opposing viewpoints. Do you make good arguments? Sure, but I specifically asked how it was "unconstitutional" that a state made a plate that said Choose Life. Since there isn't a right to cars, I'm not sure how car accessories fall under the constitution.

This doesn't mean that I agree that the state has any business in making these plates, and yes, I think that if they're making "one side" they should make the other. I just don't get the constitutional angle.


By creating a forum for people to express private views, then suppressing some of those views in favor of others.

Frankly it seems silly for the government to create a forum on license plates, but they did.

Also, whether something exists as a right or not depends on what view you take of the nature of rights. Are rights something we have intrinsically, and the Constitution explicitly restricts the government from attempting to take away, or are they something that we don't have and are granted to us by government?
 
2012-12-12 04:39:43 PM  

CapeFearCadaver: Even With A Chainsaw: Sure, but I specifically asked how it was "unconstitutional" that a state made a plate that said Choose Life.

It's unconstitutional because they were vehemently opposed to offering the opposing viewpoint. Somewhat among these lines:

Even With A Chainsaw: So the argument is that if the government allows a forum for speech to exist, it must allow the same degree of speech to exist in that forum as in all other forums?

Much like offering protest permits to organizations such as the KKK or WBC. Even though most people on all sides disagree with their messages. If you as a State Government are going to give protest permits that are anti-war, you must also give protest permits to pro-war. Issue them all or none.

You can't create one avenue yet restrict the other avenue when it comes to a State's response to free speech.


Got it. Alright, makes sense to me.
 
2012-12-12 04:41:24 PM  

Zasteva: Rufus Lee King: "This is a great victory for the free speech rights of all North Carolinians.", said Chris Brook of the ACLU.

Rufus Lee King: Really? How does that follow? People have the right to free expression until someone says something that you don't agree with?

Perhaps you missed the part in the article where North Carolina rejected the "Respect Choice" license plate.

That means that the state is supporting you in expressing a Pro-Life point of view, but denying you a similar expression of a Pro-Choice point of view.

The judicial order requires the state to either allow both, or deny both, but not promote one view over the other.


Choose Life is a pro-choice point of view!
 
2012-12-12 04:43:21 PM  

Even With A Chainsaw: CapeFearCadaver: Even With A Chainsaw: Sure, but I specifically asked how it was "unconstitutional" that a state made a plate that said Choose Life.

It's unconstitutional because they were vehemently opposed to offering the opposing viewpoint. Somewhat among these lines:

Even With A Chainsaw: So the argument is that if the government allows a forum for speech to exist, it must allow the same degree of speech to exist in that forum as in all other forums?

Much like offering protest permits to organizations such as the KKK or WBC. Even though most people on all sides disagree with their messages. If you as a State Government are going to give protest permits that are anti-war, you must also give protest permits to pro-war. Issue them all or none.

You can't create one avenue yet restrict the other avenue when it comes to a State's response to free speech.

Got it. Alright, makes sense to me.


Yay. Here's your beer:

brainofjay.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-12-12 04:49:49 PM  

giftedmadness: That means that the state is supporting you in expressing a Pro-Life point of view, but denying you a similar expression of a Pro-Choice point of view.

The judicial order requires the state to either allow both, or deny both, but not promote one view over the other.

Choose Life is a pro-choice point of view!


No, it isn't.

"Choose Life" is a directive about what to choose -- life for your unborn child verses abortion.

"Respect Choice", by contrast is a directive that people should be respected and allowed make whatever choice they wish for their unborn child, life or abortion.

Hint: if they are telling you what to choice, they aren't supporting your right to make the choice.
 
2012-12-12 04:53:17 PM  

Netrngr:

Yes I realize the state government offers them as a product just like any other vendor. These aren't official state plates. They are a premium that you must choose to purchase at extra expense. The argument being made would be valid if they forced you ta use the plate. as it stands its your choice to buy it or not.


This would be news to your state legislature, your DMV, and your state troopers. They are issued by the state, they are made by the state, they meet the requirements for your vehicle to be on the road legally, must be surrendered to the state when no longer in use, and in any possible definition are "official state plates". These aren't coming from the Franklin Mint.
 
2012-12-12 04:59:44 PM  

Pincy: giftedmadness: Pincy: Hoblit: I don't get it. I'm pro-choice (I'm not going to change your mind and you're not going to change mind)

I would still encourage choosing life whenever possible and the plate references that choice. It doesn't say PRO Life, it says CHOOSE life. Simply an encouraging statement. Shouldn't we choose life whenever possible and encourage (not force) those of around us to do the same?

I really think it is a lot to do over nothing.

I'm guessing you also think the Confederate flag doesn't represent racism?

Wow, you're a dense one aren't you. You claim to be pro-choice yet get mad when someone promotes one of those choices over the other.

Another person with no critical thinking skills.


Nice comeback.
 
2012-12-12 05:05:38 PM  

Zasteva: giftedmadness: That means that the state is supporting you in expressing a Pro-Life point of view, but denying you a similar expression of a Pro-Choice point of view.

The judicial order requires the state to either allow both, or deny both, but not promote one view over the other.

Choose Life is a pro-choice point of view!

No, it isn't.

"Choose Life" is a directive about what to choose -- life for your unborn child verses abortion.

"Respect Choice", by contrast is a directive that people should be respected and allowed make whatever choice they wish for their unborn child, life or abortion.

Hint: if they are telling you what to choice, they aren't supporting your right to make the choice.


Nice mental gymnastics there. There isn't enough room on a license plate to say,....We respect your right to choose, but we hope you choose life. Get it?
 
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