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(The Raw Story)   Christian radio host: Punch atheists 'in the mouth' for their 'war on Christmas'   (rawstory.com ) divider line
    More: Amusing, Christian radio, Liberty Counsel, Warren, Matt Barber, John Satawa  
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10641 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Dec 2012 at 7:12 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2012-12-10 11:49:59 PM  
37 votes:
Theologian here. Want my take on the War on Christmas?

It's the panicked, flailing reaction of the Religious Right to the sudden realization that the US is celebrating a completely secular holiday in December -- one which could go by Christmas or "the holidays" or Snowflake Day or whatever. They had liked to believe that the country went insane as a sign of religious devotion. Now they see that what is celebrated as Christmas by most of the country is not the same holiday as the Christian Christmas.

Think of it like a child born on the 4th of July. Think of the tantrum he might throw the first time he realizes that the parade and the fireworks aren't for him. "No! They're doing it for ME because it's MY BIRTHDAY!" It's like that, only with more airtime.
2012-12-11 12:23:51 AM  
10 votes:
"You know, what do you do with a bully?" he explained. "If a bully keeps getting his way and intimidating kids on the playground and nobody stands up for themselves then the bully is encouraged and emboldened and continues to bully more and more people.

The author is right. Atheists should stand up to people who demand that everyone else live their lives a certain way because "God said so". Every time the Christians win some kind of battle like transvaginal ultrasounds or what not, they become encouraged and emboldened and go for things like demanding Creationism be taught in science class.

I like this author. He makes pretty good points.
2012-12-11 12:48:04 AM  
5 votes:

ox45tallboy: Asa Phelps: I've never met an atheist who's been up in arms over "christmas".

Maybe a jehova's witness, but those guys don't even have birthdays of their own.

I'm an atheist, and I LOVE Christmas*. Family, gifts, vacation days from work, tons of great food, etc. Online shopping now removes the whole "braving retail stores during Christmas season" thing.

*With the possible exception of my neighbor's life-size singing Santa on their porch hooked up to a motion detector.


Same here. As someone who holds no religious beliefs, I quite enjoy Christmas. I don't really see what snowmen, Santa Claus, decorated pine trees, lights everywhere, and spending time and giving with friends and family has to do specifically with the birth of Jesus or even Christianity as a whole.
2012-12-11 12:18:50 AM  
5 votes:

giftedmadness: L.D. Ablo: Those are the cries of a wounded, cornered and dying animal. The Scary Black Guy got re-elected, they lost the culture war and will be irrelevant in another generation.

it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.


I'm still trying to decide which login you were using before the election. Never saw you post before two weeks or so ago, and a whole bunch haven't showed since November 6th.
2012-12-11 12:56:14 AM  
4 votes:

WorldCitizen: Same here. As someone who holds no religious beliefs, I quite enjoy Christmas. I don't really see what snowmen, Santa Claus, decorated pine trees, lights everywhere, and spending time and giving with friends and family has to do specifically with the birth of Jesus or even Christianity as a whole.


When Christian people ask why I have a Christmas tree if I'm an atheist, I like to point out that the Christmas tree is pagan such as is described in Jeremiah 10:2-4:

2 Thus saith the Lord, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.

3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
2012-12-11 12:07:31 AM  
4 votes:
Those are the cries of a wounded, cornered and dying animal. The Scary Black Guy got re-elected, they lost the culture war and will be irrelevant in another generation.
2012-12-10 11:49:13 PM  
4 votes:
Meh. He was just saying that he thinks we atheists are all being big meanie-heads and we should be stood up to. I don't really believe he meant "literally punch them in the mouth." I do believe he's kind of an idiot, though.
2012-12-10 11:47:47 PM  
4 votes:
The war on Xmas is all in some peoples tiny, deluded minds
2012-12-11 10:20:21 AM  
3 votes:

JackieRabbit: Ebbelwoi: Atheist for over 30 years. There's a certain percentage of us who are complete douchebags and who do, indeed, need to be ****punched for being all douchebaggy about Christmas.

The douchebags you refer to are what are being called "new atheists." Atheists have long fought specific battles to prevent religious dogma from being forced down everyone's throats. The fight against school prayer is a prime example. When I was in grade school in the 1960s, one was required to recite a non-denominational prayer. Atheists rightfully opposed such practices. But they also understood that religious people had just as much right to belive as they did not to belive. This isn't the case with new atheists. For them not believing in a supreme being isn't enough. They are anti-religion; they want to abolish religion. The process of social secularization is too slow for them. Some of this is simply backlash against evangelical absurdity, but for many, their primary motivation is political. They insist on perverting the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to mean that the government opposes all religions, when it's purpose is clearly to prevent the government from formulating official policy in regard to any religion, in order to promote the free practice of any religion. When one tells one of these new atheist that their point of view is actually Stalinist, they become offended.


You are pretty much wrong on every point. So wrong that you might just be the wrongest person in this thread. I bet you came pretty hard after spinning that bit of paranoid fantasy.

Hint: not wanting to live under Jesus sharia isn't "wanting to abolish religion".

I will forever reserve the right to loudly and publicly declaim that I think your religion is literally and specifically as ridiculous to believe in as Thor, Zeus, and Poseidon worship. Jesus riding a farking unicorn with a talking toad sidekick.

But no matter how childish, ignorant, inane and self contradictory I find your religion, I will defend to the death your right to observe it. But not your right to press your fundamentalism on others.

That atheists want to ban religion is what fundamentalists tell people like you to spread around the Internet.
2012-12-11 10:17:35 AM  
3 votes:

giftedmadness: L.D. Ablo: Those are the cries of a wounded, cornered and dying animal. The Scary Black Guy got re-elected, they lost the culture war and will be irrelevant in another generation.

it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.


I know conservatives are racist. I spend the holidays with some of them. In fact, I learn new racial slurs from them all the time. Just last week one used the term mooncrickets and I had to check urban dictionary to figure out which race he was insulting.

Oh, and I went to a gun show with a buddy of mine (another gun loving libtard like myself) and his not a libtard dad went along even though he said didn't need a new gun because had enough to "kill a few ni**ers".


But it's the liberals who are the real racists. Yeah.
2012-12-11 02:33:03 AM  
3 votes:

Rev.K: Can I agree that there's no war on Christmas, but still think that some atheists need a good punch in the mouth?

Is that a defensible point of view?


I'm sure some of any group you can conceive would be punchable. It really just depends on your reasons.
2012-12-11 12:39:02 AM  
3 votes:

Asa Phelps: I've never met an atheist who's been up in arms over "christmas".

Maybe a jehova's witness, but those guys don't even have birthdays of their own.


I'm an atheist, and I LOVE Christmas*. Family, gifts, vacation days from work, tons of great food, etc. Online shopping now removes the whole "braving retail stores during Christmas season" thing.

*With the possible exception of my neighbor's life-size singing Santa on their porch hooked up to a motion detector.
2012-12-11 12:25:09 AM  
3 votes:
Guy wanting to impose his religion on others through their own government while saying people should be punched in the face for standing up for freedom of religion (FTFA): "You know, what do you do with a bully?" he explained. "If a bully keeps getting his way and intimidating kids on the playground and nobody stands up for themselves then the bully is encouraged and emboldened and continues to bully more and more people. But when a little kid is being bullied and he turns around and punches the bully in the mouth - metaphorically speaking, of course - then the bully is oftentimes proven to be a paper tiger."

Apparently, this guy wouldn't recognize himself in a mirror.
2012-12-11 12:20:05 AM  
3 votes:

giftedmadness: it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.


Well, I guess you're right. Conservatives being racist isn't funny. More like sad.
2012-12-11 12:04:07 AM  
3 votes:
That led to a federal lawsuit and the United States Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit ruled earlier this year that Satawa could continue to display his creche.

Curious about that one. So they got their way and the nativity is allowed to remain yet they're STILL pissed? Talk about sore winners.

And as Jon Stewart said the other night (paraphrasing): "If there's a war on Christmas, Christmas is winning because it's started EATING OTHER HOLIDAYS."
2012-12-10 11:57:18 PM  
3 votes:

Relatively Obscure: I don't really believe he meant "literally punch them in the mouth."


0.tqn.com
Let's hope we don't have to find out...again
2012-12-10 11:41:45 PM  
3 votes:
Since that's exactly what Jesus would do then it's good advice.
2012-12-12 09:14:47 PM  
2 votes:
I drove by a church this morning, they were displaying a nice nativity scene, and I thought to myself; "they're doing it right".

That same nativity scene one hundred yards away at the public middle school, that would be wrong.

I dont know how this is hard to understand?
2012-12-11 03:27:06 PM  
2 votes:

purple kool-aid and a jigger of formaldehyde: Maybe, but I don't think it's this upcoming generation. My 17 year old son and all his best friends are 4.0 students and are all basically atheists. Even the ones whose parents still force them to go to church. I have talked with them all about it. The idea of some omnipotent, all seeing creator just seems ridiculous to them, and it wasn't because of anything I tried to convince them of. It's because of logic.
/I'm so proud it brings a tear to my eye.


Yeah ... I think kids are being exposed to other ideas at a much earlier age because of the internet (a good thing IMO). The earlier it is done the more likely it will break through the indoctrination.

They are looking at religion with far more objective eyes that people of their age did in the past ... and religion doesn't fair well against objective scrutiny.
2012-12-11 12:36:52 PM  
2 votes:

Somacandra: I do disagree. As long as the government in question allows multiple displays from different religions on public land, I think its fine. The solution to partial speech is full speech, not shutting down speech. It frustrates me that many governments think shutting down speech is an acceptable solution.


It's not "shutting down speech" to disallow religious displays on public land -- people are free to put them on their homes, businesses, churches, dogs, cars, shoulders, or butt tattoos. The problem with religious displays on public land is that there's limited space, and the government can't endorse one or several religions over any others. What this boils down to ultimately is the government deciding which religions count and get to participate and which don't count and have to go home and sob into their gin. Christians are exceedingly comfortable with their majority and may not see precisely how that sort of precedent is dangerous to them.
2012-12-11 12:02:39 PM  
2 votes:

giftedmadness: L.D. Ablo: Those are the cries of a wounded, cornered and dying animal. The Scary Black Guy got re-elected, they lost the culture war and will be irrelevant in another generation.

it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.


Amusing like segregation, or amusing like a good ol' lynching?

"Conservative" is a meaningless term in America, conflated as it is with religious bigotry, anti-science sentiments (except concerning fracking and space rayguns), and an inability to work double-entry accounting.

I'm a fiscal conservative who thinks gay marriage is great for the tax base, and who really wants dope made legal so we can tax its sale to pay for education and health care.

I also want mandatory donor cards and air bags removed from cars. Freedom! And religion taxed, as it is clearly a business. That business is fraud and child rape. Tax it!

Lastly, my ideal state doesn't care who or how you screw, if everyone's over 18 and animals aren't involved. I do not care nor care to legislate behaviour between consenting adults. You're on your own, folks!

My kind of conservatism, which is a sort of libertarianism with cherry-picked socialist tendencies (socialists who can tell red from black ink), is not only exceedingly rare, but is anathema to the God-bothered baggers that have usurped the term "conservative", and furthermore, are such know-nothings that they don't grasp how Xmas is a recycled pagan celebration of such dubious provenance to a "true believer" that the Puritans banned it for centuries as unChristian.
2012-12-11 11:48:47 AM  
2 votes:
i15.photobucket.com
2012-12-11 11:34:52 AM  
2 votes:

JackieRabbit: Ant: Stop posting. You don't know what the fark you're talking about and I don't like it. You're talking out of your making me feel like an ass.

FTFY to make it the truth. But you are correct. I'm going to quit posting in this and all of the farked up atheist, religion-hating threads. The level of indoctrination and the lack of rationality is depressing. So carry on and revel in your ignorance and mindless hatred. It'll get you nowhere and one day, when you grow up, you will feel ashamed of yourself.


Good, you think atheists want to pervert the first amendment to ban religion. And you call us close minded, ignorant, mindless idiots. You don't have to be a hipster to drink up that irony.

I would make a pot/kettle reference, but I don't want to insult pots and kettles and black folks by comparing them to you.
2012-12-11 10:08:01 AM  
2 votes:

rocketpants: hitlersbrain: Why do these things always HAVE to be on public land? Isn't there a nearby church or a private yard you can put that shiat in?

Exactly.



It has to be on public land because they're farking Xtian jihadists who believe this country and its government are THEIRS and theirs alone, so they're constantly trying to insert their Diseased Dick of Dogma into the ass of the public any way they can.

Think of the Wall of Separation of Church and State as a college freshman who's the only female at a neverending frat party, and the Xtians as drunken frat boys who keep trying to feed her drinks and roofies in a constant effort to get in her pants (or get ANY cheap thrill on the way to that ultimate goal) any way they can.

That's the macro view. On a person-by-person level, it's about dealing with their own fears by changing the world around them.
2012-12-11 09:44:01 AM  
2 votes:

Relatively Obscure: ox45tallboy: I submitted a TFD about it a week or so ago and the best suggestion I got was to reprogram the damn thing so it told dirty jokes. I went so far as to find the wiring scheme for one that looked just like it online, and had actually considered doing this.The following day they had turned off the motion detector, so now I'm wondering if my neighbor has TF, or possibly just realized how f*cking annoying that thing really is.

Nice. If I had those kind of skills, I'd have probably gone with uncomfortable Crazy Old Man style ranting, myself.



Use a bunch of MP3s of Uncle Ruckus' rants from "Boondocks."
2012-12-11 09:15:54 AM  
2 votes:
Speaking as an atheist, I want a war on Christmas

Not Christmas Day- that's ok. I want a war on the goddamn Christmas season. I do not want to be assaulted with Christmas carols in August. I do not want Halloween decorations covered in tinsel. I do not want Thanksgiving (the best holiday of the year) to be turned into pre-black Friday sales. I am thoroughly sick of Christmas shopping and all the stress that entails.

No, I'm not merry, don't want to be merry, not going to be merry, and if you fuss at me about not saying "Merry Christmas" I'm going to jam that completely pagan Christmas tree so far up your ass you're going to cry pine needles.
2012-12-11 09:09:38 AM  
2 votes:
Orginaly posted by Ishkur. Posting it here now because I see someone is spam posting trying for any bites he can get.

I see IDW is in the thread and will probably hang around and badger people. I've prepared a disclaimer for these occasions:

IDW is, essentially, the ultimate troll (with the only difference being that he's not a deliberate one). He's not interested in discussion -- he just wants to dick you around.

His MO is to seize control of the discussion and keep it, and the most basic way to do this is to withhold information from others and never acquiesce to any questions, comments or requests. By claiming some hidden truth that is beyond everyone's insight but keeping it undefined, he places himself in a role as Teacher or Guru or whatever fantasy Authority he imagines himself as. He doesn't mind arguing in his own backyard, but he'd much prefer to constantly hop from backyard to backyard, forcing you to chase him through separate, discordant arguments and fallacies of distraction. If you corner him, he'll usually chop your post up into little pieces and then reply to each piece individually with one these responses:

1) a question attacking your line of questioning, turning it back on you
2) a loaded and nonsensical analogy which may include a dodge, misdirection, or introduction of additional and usually irrelevant subject matter or
3) a sarcastic snipe at the subject and/or you (sometimes with image attached)

And then the chase begins again. There's no knowledge or wisdom to gain here (from either you or him) and he has no insights to impart. His questions have no purpose. He just wants to control you and force you to jump through his hoops that he will constantly move around on you so that you fail and he can claim superiority. You are wasting your time.

For an example, in this 3 year old thread he concocted a logic game similar to the Wason Selection Task with rules that he could change at any time for any reason, foisted it upon the thread, toyed with the posters for a whole day while refusing to give the answer, and then eventually concluded that everyone was wrong.

It's part of his technique to constantly assume Authoritarian control. He gets off on giving people challenges and quests with no point other than so he can withhold the non-existent answers from them (like his "True Definition of Nature" theory -- he poses this riddle to everyone but there's no answer. He just enjoys watching people struggle). It's the old schoolyard power trip: "I know something you don't and I won't tell you what it is".

That he's been doing this schtick for so long is an indication that he will never stop and there's nothing new to be garnered from him, like he's stuck in a perpetual feedback loop, recycling the same arguments in every thread pertinent to his special brand of Christian theology (he's probably already posted the Wason test that he so http://www.fark.com/comments/4236856/49126567#c49126567 many years ago. It's his way of dealing with the embarrassment by mocking it).

Despite the fact that he frequently loses these discussions, he'll continue posting them as if they're unsolvable, ignoring repeated and consistent replies defeating them. He has never been the type to swallow his pride and admit when he's wrong so you'll never get anywhere with him (and he'll always mock you if you try). It is very likely that he has NPD and people replying to him on Fark is how he strokes his ego so he can never stop no matter how many humiliating threads send him down in flames.

In short: He is a complete and total waste of your god damn time. Reply at your peril; I suggest ignore.
2012-12-11 08:36:44 AM  
2 votes:
I love Christmas... I also don't believe in any gods or supernatural beings.

I've been known to attend midnight mass and everything (I like the singing and organ in my parish church).

As far as religious displays on public land, it doesn't really bother me, but If a group of citizens are offended by it, then the space should be open to ALL religious displays or no religious displays. Realistically speaking, it just makes more sense to only have secular displays on public land. Less hassles like this nonsense.

Churches, Synagogs, and private citizens are free to put up all the religious displays on their property they want last I checked. No reason to use public land at all.
2012-12-11 08:26:55 AM  
2 votes:

Chariset: Theologian here. Want my take on the War on Christmas?

It's the panicked, flailing reaction of the Religious Right to the sudden realization that the US is celebrating a completely secular holiday in December -- one which could go by Christmas or "the holidays" or Snowflake Day or whatever. They had liked to believe that the country went insane as a sign of religious devotion. Now they see that what is celebrated as Christmas by most of the country is not the same holiday as the Christian Christmas.

Think of it like a child born on the 4th of July. Think of the tantrum he might throw the first time he realizes that the parade and the fireworks aren't for him. "No! They're doing it for ME because it's MY BIRTHDAY!" It's like that, only with more airtime.


Another theologian here, saying, "THIS!" You nailed it, Chariset.
2012-12-11 08:17:01 AM  
2 votes:
Color me another atheist that likes the holidays. But also one that is fully behind the idea that if jesusy ppl get to put up holiday displays on publicly owned land, so can everyone else. Period.

I personally dream of a day(I probably won't live to see), when Christianity(and the rest of abrahamic, revealed truth desert religions) are talked about the same way we talk about Zeus and Thor. Fantasies of a primitive people in a primitive time. I look forward to belief in Jesus being as ridiculous a proposition as prostrating yourself to Poseidon.

Stop poisoning humanity with the taint of your horrible chalcolithic sky shamanism.

But all that aside, go Christmas. Loving the lights this year, more ppl moving to LEDs.
2012-12-11 08:15:24 AM  
2 votes:
Here's some more fun facts about this asshole:

- Has said that gay male relationships constitute "one man violently cramming his penis into another man's lower intestine and calling it 'love'"

- Has called President Barack Obama an "anti-American" "enemy" who is "determined to destroy America"

- Of a lesbian couple's parental decisions for their transgender child, said: "We shouldn't be surprised that we see this kind of child abuse and brainwashing when we allow children to be placed intentionally in motherless or fatherless homes that model disordered sexual behavior and push the false notion that human sexuality is somehow androgynous," adding that the kid is "the poster child against the unconscionable practice of legalized so-called 'gay adoption.'"

- Routinely uses words like "purveyors of evil" or "satanic" (1:19 in video clip) to refer to his political opponents

- Said Ellen DeGeneres "guides her many adoring housewife fans into rebellion against God's divine and explicit natural order"

- Claims that by supporting LGBT viewers, media outlets are trying "to make the absurd appear reasonable and normal" (0:46 - 0:51)

- Says gays make up violence "as a Trojan Horse to force, to compel nations and individuals and groups and churches that embrace traditional values, relative to sexual behavior, to push them into the closet and say 'no, no, you have to adopt a full affirmation of these perversions.'"

- Says gay rights presents a "clear and present danger" and "internationally the greatest threat" (58:27-59:00)


Total farking scumbag. Also, he appears on FoxNews now and then, no surprise there.
2012-12-11 08:13:11 AM  
2 votes:
apatheist right here enjoys Christmas.

Even though my mom's Catholic, my parents always stressed the importance of focusing on charity, family, forgiveness and thankfulness. It was not much about the birth of Jesus on the Mose homestead, but more about celebrating and extoling the virtues associated with the man. That always seemed like the right priority, anyway. The world could definitely do with more of that.
2012-12-11 07:54:57 AM  
2 votes:
If there was a Christ, he wasn't born in winter. A winter solstice celebration and the traditions of drinking, feasting, caroling, gift-giving, yule logs, bringing evergreen trees indoors, and decorating with red and green all predate Christianity. If the Jesus People want to complain about "the war on Christmas", they ought to at least be aware that they first usurped the holiday in a political power-grab.
2012-12-11 07:43:48 AM  
2 votes:
No bullshiat, there I was six clicks south of the bombed out remains of a Wendy's when I realized it. We weren't going home, the Christmas Wars will never end. I blame the traitors. The secularists pushed their "Holiday War" agenda too far, sucking in the most vocal of all Christians, Kanye West. "Money talks, Jesus walks" he said before executing Santa on the steps of Capitol Hill. That was eight years ago. Christmas is mostly a legend now, nobody is alive that remembers time before the war. Except me. I remember hiding every year with my family as we tried to come up with methods of subversive deception. We'd make gingerbread 9/11s and sing carols by morse code. I even shaved a Crèche into my pubic hair. If we just had the fortitude to punch them in the mouth when we had the chance.
2012-12-11 07:43:40 AM  
2 votes:

HindiDiscoMonster: Something I noticed about Atheists (at least here) is they never complain about Santa or Christmas trees and such... only about Christian decorations... I wonder why they don't attack the Pagan stuff too....

[1.bp.blogspot.com image 240x336]


Other than calling pagans tree-hugging, crystal-gazing, patchouli-sniffing morons? Nope. We never say shiat about them. And no, we don't give a damn about Christian decorations on private land. It's when the Christians insist on trying to put their religious decorations of public land that we get a little pissy. See, we're pretty much okay with either allowing all religions with a winter holiday the ability to plant their trinkets on public land, or none of them. Not this Christians-only crap most of these Christian groups try and pull.
2012-12-11 07:33:40 AM  
2 votes:
Why do these things always HAVE to be on public land? Isn't there a nearby church or a private yard you can put that shiat in?
2012-12-11 07:24:55 AM  
2 votes:

kid_icarus: cretinbob: The war on Xmas is all in some peoples tiny, deluded minds

This.

Although to be more precise, upper-middle class suburban Christians LOVE the drama of feeling like they're embattled and persecuted. It falls very closely to the "first world problems" meme.


Christianity is the religion of persecution. It's so ingrained in the belief system that if they are not being persecuted they invent imaginary persecutions. They still haven't figured out that the Jews and the pagan Romans no longer outnumber them.
2012-12-11 01:59:35 AM  
2 votes:
img.photobucket.com

Et tu, Papa Bear?
2012-12-11 12:03:26 AM  
2 votes:
Hey, looks like we finally found someone engaged in an actual Christmas War.
2012-12-10 11:52:36 PM  
2 votes:
You first, badass.
2012-12-11 06:54:39 PM  
1 vote:

WorldCitizen: Guy wanting to impose his religion on others through their own government while saying people should be punched in the face for standing up for freedom of religion (FTFA): "You know, what do you do with a bully?" he explained. "If a bully keeps getting his way and intimidating kids on the playground and nobody stands up for themselves then the bully is encouraged and emboldened and continues to bully more and more people. But when a little kid is being bullied and he turns around and punches the bully in the mouth - metaphorically speaking, of course - then the bully is oftentimes proven to be a paper tiger."

Apparently, this guy wouldn't recognize himself in a mirror.


The little kid would most likely get the shiat kicked out of him by the bully and his friends. The oft repeated advice that bullies are cowards and will back down if challenged is extremely foolish.
2012-12-11 03:14:22 PM  
1 vote:

foxyshadis: L.D. Ablo: Those are the cries of a wounded, cornered and dying animal. The Scary Black Guy got re-elected, they lost the culture war and will be irrelevant in another generation.

Every time someone believes that, a new Great Awakening occurs. Religion is not a trend in America, it's a generational cycle, fueled by the materiel excesses of every generation that throws off the mantle of religion and thinks that means it's time to go bug fark insane about it.


Maybe, but I don't think it's this upcoming generation. My 17 year old son and all his best friends are 4.0 students and are all basically atheists. Even the ones whose parents still force them to go to church. I have talked with them all about it. The idea of some omnipotent, all seeing creator just seems ridiculous to them, and it wasn't because of anything I tried to convince them of. It's because of logic.
/I'm so proud it brings a tear to my eye.
2012-12-11 02:50:41 PM  
1 vote:

HindiDiscoMonster: Valiente: someonelse: letrole: Atheism is a Religion

Velveeta is cheese

Well, technically it's processed cheese food product. It relates to actual cheese the same way religion relates to actual spirituality, in my experience.

Both go well with Triscuits.

this is what i use on Triscuits:

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 188x250]

Orange cap though...


Easy Cheese, Cheesy Christ, whatever. Blessed are the cheesemakers.

www.darrenbarefoot.com
2012-12-11 02:50:41 PM  
1 vote:
I drunk what: RobSeace: Yeah, that's what I was railing against: the OT interpretation god

big difference

always better to get your info directly from The Word of God

RobSeace: I know that stuff isn't supposed to apply to you Christians anymore

history does apply to us, however:

1. We are not jews.
2. No one is under the Old Law.
3. Not every piece of text found in the Bible == The Word of God

sorry to bust your bubble :(


Actually no piece of text found in the bible is the word of God, if you think anything written in there came from God then you're a dumbass. God did not sit down with a quill pen and write anything, the entire Bible was written by men concerning what events that they claimed had happened, and much of that was originally passed down from word of mouth.
2012-12-11 02:46:50 PM  
1 vote:

I drunk what: Keizer_Ghidorah: And no, America was NOT founded as a Christian nation.

I drunk what: after all this nation was built by atheists for atheists

lulz, i really need to start typing faster

/moar funny that way


Now, now... Keizer's statement doesn't mean or imply your sarcastic one... And, he's correct... While many of the founding fathers were Christians of one stripe or another, many were instead deists or theistic rationalists or something else entirely... But, regardless they all seemed to consider religion a private affair, and something to definitely keep out of government...
2012-12-11 02:40:36 PM  
1 vote:
I have a theory about conservatives. I know it's only a theory, but more and more the evidence seems to support the theory.

Conservatives are shallow, mean people.

That is my theory.
2012-12-11 02:26:22 PM  
1 vote:

I drunk what: perhaps, as a predominantly Christian nation, we should also celebrate hanukkah, ramadan, kwanza and joseph smith's birthday as national holidays...


We do celebrate all those things. The thing is that most of that is celebrated as it should be, by the people who hold the associated beliefs in their homes, places of worship, etc. For some bizarre reason, some Christian groups in the U.S. aren't satisfied with celebrating their own beliefs in their homes and churches and such, and insist on trying to put their faith in public places like schools, courthouses, etc., and to try and force it one everyone else whether they want it or not. It's just rude!
2012-12-11 02:03:10 PM  
1 vote:
The Freedom from Religion Foundation members probably do deserve a good punch in the mouth (as well as members of a lot of religious organizations)

There are religious trolls and there are non-religious trolls. FFRF members are trolls.

They are the atheist version of the Westboro baptist church.
2012-12-11 12:46:38 PM  
1 vote:

RobSeace: Huh, I wouldn't have thought there would be that much competition that space would've been such an issue... Well, in that case, it probably just is in the city's best interest to just ban all displays, since it puts too much work and hassle on them otherwise...


It was a smart move on the secularists' part, honestly. Instead of arguing Christians can't set up a display on public land, they argued that everyone should be able to- not just Christians. As I recall some alternative Athiest displays were vandalized as such... presumably by Christian-minded folk.

At least they didn't punch anyone in the mouth, I suppose.

It's a fair argument, I think. And ultimately the Municipality opted to ban all displays as a white flag in the war of attrition.


Mind you, private land-based displays are still perfectly fine, folks. The nativity scene is far from being in danger of extinction here.
2012-12-11 12:35:17 PM  
1 vote:

Somacandra: Ant: You're missing the point. The argument is that putting a nativity scene on public land is the government favoring a particular religion..

I do disagree. As long as the government in question allows multiple displays from different religions on public land, I think its fine. The solution to partial speech is full speech, not shutting down speech. It frustrates me that many governments think shutting down speech is an acceptable solution.


They aren't shutting down speech, they are simply declining to provide the soapbox.
2012-12-11 12:22:23 PM  
1 vote:

Somacandra: As long as the government in question allows multiple displays from different religions on public land, I think its fine. The solution to partial speech is full speech, not shutting down speech. It frustrates me that many governments think shutting down speech is an acceptable solution.


No.

Perhaps it's not like this all over, but where I grew up the nativity scene displayed downtown belonged to the city, not a church. City tax dollars were used to purchase that nativity scene. City workers set it up and maintained it through December. City workers took it down in January and stored it away.

It's not a matter of "allowing" displays from different religions, which I'd oppose but much less strenuously. It's government subsidizing a display for one religion (or two if they include a menorah and congratulate themselves for being inclusive) with tax dollars.
2012-12-11 11:58:02 AM  
1 vote:
Keep it up Christians.

All these antics do is push more people from organized faith, both into the more nebulous "spiritual but not religious" all the way to full blown atheist.

//The more you tighten your grip, Fundies, the more Christians will slip through your fingers.
2012-12-11 11:44:55 AM  
1 vote:
it's all gay
2012-12-11 11:41:55 AM  
1 vote:
Fark you titsy, and fark your stupid assed religion, which you don't adhere to anyways.
2012-12-11 11:40:33 AM  
1 vote:
Let's combine the different branches of this thread and call for people to hit atheists in the mouth with Cool-Whip pies.
2012-12-11 11:21:33 AM  
1 vote:

Ant: RobSeace: Having to see a farking nativity scene isn't oppressing your lack of belief!

You're missing the point. The argument is that putting a nativity scene on public land is the government favoring a particular religion. If you're going to disagree, at least disagree with the correct argument.


And, if they only allowed Christian nativity scenes to be displayed, that would be a good point... That is exactly why I said the correct response is to seek to add counter-displays alongside the nativity scene rather than simply eliminate the nativity scene... If you tried that and the government rejected your display but kept up the nativity scene, then you would have a strong argument that they are favoring one religion over another (or over a lack thereof), and you'd be well in your rights to sue them to either take it down or put yours up... But, just jumping to "take it down!" seems to be the wrong approach... I'd rather see all points of view, rather than none... *shrug*
2012-12-11 11:21:25 AM  
1 vote:

HindiDiscoMonster: someonelse: jso2897: I only hear about these "angry atheists" on the Internet - I don't know any in real life.

I believe they exist mainly in an alternate universe, along with militant man-hating feminists, Cadillac-driving welfare queens, those hippies who spit on returning Vietnam vets, and unicorns. It's the place where all our lost socks from the laundry go.

What i think is clever is how you can simply ignore reality where those types of Atheists have posted in the very thread in which your comment is in.

/Atheist Bubble?


This is a discussion about atheism and the "war on Christmas." I would expect people to have strong opinions here. I presumed the poster was talking about a stereotypical "angry atheist" who goes out of his/her way to confrontationally inflict their opinions on others when the subject wasn't under discussion already. I've never met one of those in real life either, although I've met a few who will do it with their religious beliefs.
2012-12-11 11:00:56 AM  
1 vote:

JackieRabbit: A little thing called the USSR.


No one takes you seriously when you say things like this.

JackieRabbit: American new atheists cannot accomplish this task here, though I have read right here on Fark rants by several of them who have this as a goal.


I presume this is a bald-faced lie. It's possible you just have no idea what you're talking about, but more likely it's just a lie.
2012-12-11 10:59:32 AM  
1 vote:

HindiDiscoMonster: someonelse: jso2897: I only hear about these "angry atheists" on the Internet - I don't know any in real life.

I believe they exist mainly in an alternate universe, along with militant man-hating feminists, Cadillac-driving welfare queens, those hippies who spit on returning Vietnam vets, and unicorns. It's the place where all our lost socks from the laundry go.

What i think is clever is how you can simply ignore reality where those types of Atheists have posted in the very thread in which your comment is in.

/Atheist Bubble?


Not in this thread. I saw a lot of atheists with contempt for religion. I saw a lot of atheists that love the holiday season. I saw a lot of atheists that are fine with holiday displays, so long as other faiths(or lack thereof) are permitted. But I didn't see a single one advocating the outlawry of religion, or the suggestion that we should sweep faithies out to sea with fire and sword.(amusing as I find it to think about in idle moments).

/Hindu bubble?
2012-12-11 10:58:26 AM  
1 vote:

someonelse: We've seen numerous examples of efforts to inject religion into public life. I'd like you to provide one example of an effort to abolish religion. Not limit it, but actually abolish it.


A little thing called the USSR. They didn't shut the churches down, but they damned sure persecuted them and you could not be a member of the Communist Party if you were a practicing Christian or a Jew. American new atheists cannot accomplish this task here, though I have read right here on Fark rants by several of them who have this as a goal.

Just so everyone knows, I am not a Christian. I was raised one, but like so many people, education made me to first question and finally reject. I am agnostic. And I believe that we may criticize others as misguided, but we have no right to attempt to persecute them for holding different beliefs. This used to be one of the central ideas of American socio-political thought, but in recent years, too many have become ignorant of this or outright reject it. On the right, these people call themselves "patriots," while on the left "free-thinkers." None of them are either.
Ant
2012-12-11 10:58:04 AM  
1 vote:

RobSeace: Let the Christians put up a display, and let the Jews, the Muslims, the Scientologists, the Wiccans, and the atheists put one up as well


No, not the Scientologists. Fark those guys.
2012-12-11 10:48:00 AM  
1 vote:

jso2897: I only hear about these "angry atheists" on the Internet - I don't know any in real life.


I believe they exist mainly in an alternate universe, along with militant man-hating feminists, Cadillac-driving welfare queens, those hippies who spit on returning Vietnam vets, and unicorns. It's the place where all our lost socks from the laundry go.
2012-12-11 10:42:39 AM  
1 vote:

JackieRabbit: Ebbelwoi: Atheist for over 30 years. There's a certain percentage of us who are complete douchebags and who do, indeed, need to be ****punched for being all douchebaggy about Christmas.

The douchebags you refer to are what are being called "new atheists." Atheists have long fought specific battles to prevent religious dogma from being forced down everyone's throats. The fight against school prayer is a prime example. When I was in grade school in the 1960s, one was required to recite a non-denominational prayer. Atheists rightfully opposed such practices. But they also understood that religious people had just as much right to belive as they did not to belive. This isn't the case with new atheists. For them not believing in a supreme being isn't enough. They are anti-religion; they want to abolish religion. The process of social secularization is too slow for them. Some of this is simply backlash against evangelical absurdity, but for many, their primary motivation is political. They insist on perverting the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to mean that the government opposes all religions, when it's purpose is clearly to prevent the government from formulating official policy in regard to any religion, in order to promote the free practice of any religion. When one tells one of these new atheist that their point of view is actually Stalinist, they become offended.


We've seen numerous examples of efforts to inject religion into public life. I'd like you to provide one example of an effort to abolish religion. Not limit it, but actually abolish it.
2012-12-11 10:04:17 AM  
1 vote:

Ebbelwoi: Atheist for over 30 years. There's a certain percentage of us who are complete douchebags and who do, indeed, need to be ****punched for being all douchebaggy about Christmas.


The douchebags you refer to are what are being called "new atheists." Atheists have long fought specific battles to prevent religious dogma from being forced down everyone's throats. The fight against school prayer is a prime example. When I was in grade school in the 1960s, one was required to recite a non-denominational prayer. Atheists rightfully opposed such practices. But they also understood that religious people had just as much right to belive as they did not to belive. This isn't the case with new atheists. For them not believing in a supreme being isn't enough. They are anti-religion; they want to abolish religion. The process of social secularization is too slow for them. Some of this is simply backlash against evangelical absurdity, but for many, their primary motivation is political. They insist on perverting the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to mean that the government opposes all religions, when it's purpose is clearly to prevent the government from formulating official policy in regard to any religion, in order to promote the free practice of any religion. When one tells one of these new atheist that their point of view is actually Stalinist, they become offended.
2012-12-11 09:58:50 AM  
1 vote:

I drunk what: The Why Not Guy: giftedmadness: it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.

Oh, so it was Liberals who sold the "Don't Re-Nig in 2012" bumper stickers? It was Liberals who made the "Put the White Back in the White House" t-shirts? Now that's amusing.

[files.abovetopsecret.com image 621x902]
[25.media.tumblr.com image 650x475]
[www.thestolenolive.net image 850x607]

lulz republicans are the so racist, and since they are conservative that means they are afraid of homosexuals, but i repeat myself



Are you trying to say the bush/chimp comparisons are the same as Obama/chimp comparisons? Try again. One is based on existing racial slurs against blacks and the other is all about relative intelligence and has nothing to do with race.

Troll, or just stupid?
2012-12-11 09:54:34 AM  
1 vote:
Goddamnit. I'm a more of a cynical agnostic... leaning atheist. I LOVE Christmas and can't wait to get paid on Friday so I can go get my Christmas tree. Everyone else I know is the same way, most of them staunch atheists and still trim a damn tree, put up lights, do the gift giving and have parties.

Everyone needs to shut the fark up.
2012-12-11 09:51:39 AM  
1 vote:

RobSeace: 0Icky0: RobSeace: Let them have their nativity scenes; it does me no harm

It does no harm to put these graven images on your own property or on the tax-free property of your local church.
There is no reason to put it on public land other than you wanting it to appear that the government endorses your superstitions.

I assume the "you" and "your" were meant generically? Because, as I already said, I'm an atheist...

But, it is public land; it's for us all to use... The Christians should get to put up their displays, as should the Jews, the Muslims, and us atheists as well, if we want to...


Put the Nativity scene up on the church lawn a block down from the courthouse.

Was that so difficult?
2012-12-11 09:50:52 AM  
1 vote:
Supposedly during the Reformation, the new protestants devoted themselves to the idea of sola scriptura, or scripture only. Yeah, about that.... 

www.christmasisalie.com
www.movetoiceland.com
rlv.zcache.ca
salon.glenrose.net

If you even pretend to be a follower of Yeshua, how on Earth you take part in this evil?
2012-12-11 09:50:37 AM  
1 vote:

doyner: Since that's exactly what Jesus would do then it's good advice.


If you commit violence in the name of religion, be it a Crusade, a suicide bomb, vandalizing a mosque or espousing a hate crime, you have missed the point entirely.
2012-12-11 09:49:46 AM  
1 vote:

I drunk what: RobSeace: and of the remaining 5%, the vast majority deliberately choose not to follow what he said anyway?

that's 101%??!?!!


?? Joke or math fail?

give some examples of this majority, and what they are failing to follow

Well, for example, take this guy suggesting violence in the name of Christ... Seems a pretty clear failure to get Jesus' message of peace and love, doesn't it?

He may not represent the majority of Christians, but him and others like him sure do seem to represent the loud public face of your religion, at least...

RobSeace: Even us atheists generally dig what Jesus had to say about most things

95% of them have no idea what Christ even said, and of the remaining 5%, they uninamimously deliberately choose not to follow what he said anyway


I think a lot of us end up "following" at least some of what he said, without even trying, just because it's generally good advice...

RobSeace: It's his pissed off dad's rantings we don't much care for

such as?


Pretty much all of them... His insecure demand to be worshipped all the time is pretty disgusting... His silly calls for animal sacrifice is primitive and barbaric... His ridiculous dietary restrictions on people are laughable... His commanding that people should be put to death for trivial "sins" is outrageous and unjust... Nearly everything he supposedly said and did is reprehensible and unworthy of the slightest respect, let alone worship... His son, on the other hand, seemed a whole lot mellower and cool...
2012-12-11 09:43:34 AM  
1 vote:
i'm an atheist, but i don't hate religion... i just hate christianity.

there are other bad ones, but it is the worst.
2012-12-11 09:41:59 AM  
1 vote:

Chariset: Theologian here. Want my take on the War on Christmas?

It's the panicked, flailing reaction of the Religious Right to the sudden realization that the US is celebrating a completely secular holiday in December -- one which could go by Christmas or "the holidays" or Snowflake Day or whatever. They had liked to believe that the country went insane as a sign of religious devotion. Now they see that what is celebrated as Christmas by most of the country is not the same holiday as the Christian Christmas.

Think of it like a child born on the 4th of July. Think of the tantrum he might throw the first time he realizes that the parade and the fireworks aren't for him. "No! They're doing it for ME because it's MY BIRTHDAY!" It's like that, only with more airtime.


That's exactly right. It's the religious right that are waging a war on the Christmas the rest of us want to celebrate.
2012-12-11 09:38:25 AM  
1 vote:

ox45tallboy: WorldCitizen: Same here. As someone who holds no religious beliefs, I quite enjoy Christmas. I don't really see what snowmen, Santa Claus, decorated pine trees, lights everywhere, and spending time and giving with friends and family has to do specifically with the birth of Jesus or even Christianity as a whole.

When Christian people ask why I have a Christmas tree if I'm an atheist, I like to point out that the Christmas tree is pagan such as is described in Jeremiah 10:2-4:

2 Thus saith the Lord, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.

3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.


See that is your problem. You assume that they would be interested what is in the bible apart from a few choice verses.
2012-12-11 09:38:15 AM  
1 vote:
Jesus . . .

zapt1.staticworld.net

. . . is the reason . . .

www.washingtonpost.com

. . . for the season

theposhreportonline.com

You'd think this jackhole would be thrilled that people would want to remove his religious icon from the face of a holiday that's become an effigy to mindless excess. Jesus apparently died for your bargain bins.
2012-12-11 09:33:19 AM  
1 vote:
Christmas - people spending money they don't have, to buy people they don't like, crap they don't want or need

It's all marketing to move the merch and make a profit.
TWX
2012-12-11 09:28:30 AM  
1 vote:
Americans aren't Christians.

I repeat, Americans aren't Christians.

Americans, by and large, are Consumerists. They worship their chattel property, their credit limits, and their ability to buy, buy, BUY. The War on Christmas in the religious sense was lost in the 1950s with the rise of consumer culture. Religion is now franchised, with additional services for additional costs by the "faithful" with gym memberships, daycare centers, restaurants, and all other manner of otherwise-businesses tucked into the umbrella of the church.

Can you name the most important day in Christianity? I'll give you a hint, it's not the day he was born.

The most important day in Christianity is Good Friday. The day he died. The day for the death he chose to accept in order to save the souls of everyone else, a personal sacrifice in order to redeem his fellow men. If you really believe in Christianity, in Jesus, this should be the single most important day of your religious life, possibly the most important day, period. This man died for you, and that self-sacrifice, not his birth, not his miracles in curing the sick or feeding the masses, not even his resurrection should be more important to you.

If you do not feel this way then you need to seriously reconsider the nature of your faith, and why you call yourself a Christian, why you worship Jesus. If your church has chosen to do away with the icon of Jesus dying on the cross, for you, then you need to seriously reconsider your church. His death and the reasons for it are why there's a religion in the first place, and an inability to face those reasons means there's no other reason for the religion.
2012-12-11 09:04:34 AM  
1 vote:

I drunk what: i'm more concerned about the war on Christianity


Is that the one where everyone pretends to be Christians, but 95% of them have no idea what Christ even said, and of the remaining 5%, the vast majority deliberately choose not to follow what he said anyway? Because, yeah, you guys are losing that war badly...

The "Christians" that anyone else might be at "war" with are not the ones that follow the teachings of Christ... Even us atheists generally dig what Jesus had to say about most things... It's his pissed off dad's rantings we don't much care for... But, as an atheist, I'd personally love it if everyone in the world who called themselves a Christian really were a true one... The world would be a lot better place for it...
2012-12-11 08:57:27 AM  
1 vote:
I could not care less if a Christian group puts up a nativity in a public space. No one should. But here's the thing I don't get. Christmas is actually supposed to be a somewhat sombre holiday in Christian tradition because it begins Jesus' trail and betrayal by Man. The most important and joyous of Christian holidays is Easter: the new covenant is fulfilled; Christ conquers the death and darkness of sin. But for most Christians, Easter is something of an afterthought holiday. They pay it some lip service, but that's about all. We don't often see them wanting to do passion plays and the Stations of the Cross in public spaces, on Good Friday and, when they do, the atheist thugs tend to ignore it.

Also strange about modern Christians is that Christmastide is supposed to be a 12 day celebration starting at sundown Christmas Eve and running until sundown of the Epiphany (January 6th). But for the vast majority of Christians in America, the holiday is over once the gifts are opened and they've stuffed there bellies. Attention then returns to football and after-Christmas sales. Eastertide, too is a multi-day celebration, commencing at sundown of the Saturday after Good Friday and ending on Pentecost Sunday, for a total of 50 days. The only evidence one will see of this is a white drape on a cross in front of a church (this is not a Christian tradition nor a liturgical practice, but dates back only about 30 years).
2012-12-11 08:53:09 AM  
1 vote:

liam76: If you think cool whip as a distraction, you don't understand good food.


Ugh. It takes about 12 minutes to whip up enough real whipped cream for several pies, and it's well worth the effort. It's criminal to put Cool Whip on a home baked pie, and real whipped cream can even elevate a store pie to a higher level.

Just what is Cool Whip, anyway?
2012-12-11 08:50:24 AM  
1 vote:

I drunk what: RobSeace: and the atheists put one up as well

what did you have in mind?


I'm thinking a completely blank billboard would be appropriate...

No, I really have no idea... Personally, I have no problem with nativity scenes, and wouldn't feel compelled to offer any kind of counter to them... But, I was just saying that if an atheist were so offended by them as to want them removed, then instead they should put up some kind of counter-display alongside them... I have no idea what form that would take, exactly... Probably something like this:

www.theblaze.com

But, the point was that the answer to speech you disagree with should be more speech, not an attempt to silence the speech you disagree with...
2012-12-11 08:39:16 AM  
1 vote:
FTA: If a bully keeps getting his way and intimidating kids on the playground and nobody stands up for themselves then the bully is encouraged and emboldened and continues to bully more and more people.

You're right buddy. This is exactly how the religionists got to where they are today.
2012-12-11 08:30:38 AM  
1 vote:

StrangeQ: Mose: Jorn the Younger: Nick Nostril: Jorn the Younger:

/If you have to add cool whip to distract from the flavor of your pumpkin pie, you're eating bad pie

It's all we can afford, so you can have my Cool hWhip when you pry it from my cold, dead, fat fingers.

If you can only afford bad tasting pie, why not make the pie instead? A small pumpkin hardly costs anything, and a decent vanilla ice cream only a few bucks (for in the pie, not on the pie), and pre-made pie crusts are like 2 for $1.50. There's a bit of seasonings and spices in it, sure, but I'd have to ask my lady what they are, as she does the actual making of the pie

Molasses is key. Only need a little if your squash of choice is naturally sweet. I usually make mine from my garden butternut squash.

Molasses...never tried that. The only thing I know about it was that I bought it on accident once and found out that it is, in fact, not the same thing as maple syrup.


It's sugar cane syrup, basically. It's what makes brown sugar brown. It's very good. A lot of people sweeten boiled or roasted/baked squash with brown sugar. I cut out the middle man and skip right to molasses.

Maple syrup works well too, but it usually has more water in it than molasses so you have to account for that. If you live near a sugaring operation though, you might be able to find maple sugar. That's the crystalized stuff that builds up on the inside of the evaporator. That stuff is awesome.
2012-12-11 08:25:27 AM  
1 vote:

RobSeace: HindiDiscoMonster: I don't know how to break this to you... but I see quite a bit more Pagan decoration during Christmas than Christian... how come no Atheists attack those displays and demand the removal (from public lands) displays of Christmas trees, Santa, or other Pagan symbols... how come only Christians get the hate? Seems to me, you should attack the largest market - Pagan symbols.

How many actual Pagans do you see around these days? Do you believe that everyone that puts up a Christmas tree is truly Pagan? People aren't attacking it, because most people don't even realize that it's based on Pagan traditions! And, those that do, realize it's been co-opted and no longer has anything to do with its roots... Christmas trees, Santa, Yule logs, etc. are all completely secular these days... Nativity scenes, not so much... (Not that anyone should still have a problem with their display, either...)


pagan is part of our history. why do you hate history so much
2012-12-11 08:24:31 AM  
1 vote:

HindiDiscoMonster: I don't know how to break this to you... but I see quite a bit more Pagan decoration during Christmas than Christian... how come no Atheists attack those displays and demand the removal (from public lands) displays of Christmas trees, Santa, or other Pagan symbols... how come only Christians get the hate? Seems to me, you should attack the largest market - Pagan symbols.


How many actual Pagans do you see around these days? Do you believe that everyone that puts up a Christmas tree is truly Pagan? People aren't attacking it, because most people don't even realize that it's based on Pagan traditions! And, those that do, realize it's been co-opted and no longer has anything to do with its roots... Christmas trees, Santa, Yule logs, etc. are all completely secular these days... Nativity scenes, not so much... (Not that anyone should still have a problem with their display, either...)
2012-12-11 08:24:25 AM  
1 vote:

drxym: Some one, some day might actually produce actual evidence of this "war on Christmas". Invariably whenever this stupid seasonal meme crops up its because someone still hasn't gotten the memo about separation of church and state, or of free speech, or simply cannot tolerate the idea that other people might have other ideas of how to celebrate this arbitrary day in the calendar.


Because that would require a nuanced understanding of other people and other cultures and a fundamental respect for others' right to do as they will. No way we have the time and resources to put into that kind of rational solution. "War on %target" is much easier for the ignorant to consume.
2012-12-11 08:24:23 AM  
1 vote:
You're perpetuating a war on Christmas if:

- You're not a Christian yet you think you should have the same right they do to use public land to air your opinions

- You say anything other than "Merry Christmas" to anybody as both a salutation and valediction during the entire month of December

- You dare to even be aware of the exceptional level of absurdity involved with Christians making such a huge stink about a date arbitrarily chosen as the alleged birth of their savior while making much less of a deal about that whole "actually becoming the savior" thing that supposedly happened in the spring

- You dare to suggest that very few people actually give a flying rat turd about the whole stupid concept of a war on Christmas since the vast majority of people just use the time as a nice winter holiday to relax at home with their family anyway and almost nobody in the entire country gives even half a fark about whatever Bill O'Reilly's current outrage from Podunk, Nowhere is tonight.
2012-12-11 08:14:32 AM  
1 vote:

Befuddled: FTA: Conservative Christian radio host Matt Barber says that an atheist group should be punched "in the mouth" after they filed a complaint that sought to stop a Michigan man from erecting a nativity scene on public land.

Why can't the religious assholes get it through their teeny little brains that if they want to put up a religious 'whatever', do it on private property and nobody will have a problem with it. The religious assholes keep trying to push the bounds, to try to make their religion basically endorsed by the government.


As an atheist, I have to say the proper response to this isn't complaining and trying to get the nativity scene removed from public land... Instead, they should've sought to place their own counter-display on the same public land... After all, it is public land, for us all to use... Let the Christians put up a display, and let the Jews, the Muslims, the Scientologists, the Wiccans, and the atheists put one up as well... The poor oppressed Christians like this guy will still complain, probably even louder, but they'll just look foolish and bitter... Instead, when complaining about stuff like this, they look righteous... Doing stuff like this just feeds their persecution complex...

/Plus, it's just a really stupid and trivial thing to worry about in the first place...
//It's like some atheists these days are developing the same persecution complex...
///Having to see a farking nativity scene isn't oppressing your lack of belief!
2012-12-11 08:12:44 AM  
1 vote:

HindiDiscoMonster: I don't know how to break this to you... but I see quite a bit more Pagan decoration during Christmas than Christian... how come no Atheists attack those displays and demand the removal (from public lands) displays of Christmas trees, Santa, or other Pagan symbols... how come only Christians get the hate? Seems to me, you should attack the largest market - Pagan symbols.


Nobody worships Santa, you dolt.
2012-12-11 08:12:21 AM  
1 vote:

Jon iz teh kewl: how do you know he wasn't born in winter?

and why can't you accept it??


Not_sure_if_serious.jpg

So far as I recall, its accepted by most churches that his exact birth date isn't known.
They moved the holidays around to adapt with the Pagan cultures they were trying to convert.

/Its why anyone that tries to predict age of the earth or specific dates from bible lore comes off as a flake.
/It was ancient oral history before it was transcribed dozens of times over.
/You don't get accuracy from that.
2012-12-11 08:11:40 AM  
1 vote:

Jon iz teh kewl:
how do you know he wasn't born in winter?

 

For starters, the shepherds were still "in the fields with their flocks".

 and why can't you accept it?? 

I have this thing about facts.
2012-12-11 08:07:20 AM  
1 vote:
i.imgur.com

/all very punchable
2012-12-11 07:59:28 AM  
1 vote:
My Jesus was born on the 4th of July.
2012-12-11 07:50:50 AM  
1 vote:

TheBeastOfYuccaFlats: At some point some of these wackjobs are going to start a mini-revolution and be smacked down in a military operation that's gonna fuel Military Channel specials for the next decade.


Is happened already.

dl.dropbox.com

Was not great success for to be honored by generations of warriors.

/Was, how you say, total failure. 
/Fueled era of right wing terrorism instead.
2012-12-11 07:46:42 AM  
1 vote:
Not very Christ-like of them.
2012-12-11 07:46:25 AM  
1 vote:

Ed Grubermann: See, we're pretty much okay with either allowing all religions with a winter holiday the ability to plant their trinkets on public land, or none of them. Not this Christians-only crap most of these Christian groups try and pull.


This one, especially those parts.
2012-12-11 07:37:49 AM  
1 vote:
Something I noticed about Atheists (at least here) is they never complain about Santa or Christmas trees and such... only about Christian decorations... I wonder why they don't attack the Pagan stuff too....

1.bp.blogspot.com
2012-12-11 07:24:54 AM  
1 vote:

giftedmadness: it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.


Now, where would we have gotten that idea?

files.abovetopsecret.com

25.media.tumblr.com

www.theawl.com
2012-12-11 07:24:29 AM  
1 vote:

Darth_Lukecash: Rev.K: Can I agree that there's no war on Christmas, but still think that some atheists need a good punch in the mouth?

Is that a defensible point of view?

You really need to brush up on the gospels, my friend.


As a Christian, I think there are a number of people who would benefit from a good punch in the face. Pat Robertson might top my list. Falwell would have, but, well... it's a lot of digging first.

Everyone has the right to freedom of religion, but that doesn't carry over to people of my own religion being stupid and making the world worse.

To the rest of you, have a merry festivus.and a cromulent renewal of your time tracking sheet!
2012-12-11 06:01:52 AM  
1 vote:

giftedmadness: it's so funny that you libs actually believe that conservatives are racist. It's amusing.


I have compiled a list of reading for you.

On The Genealogy of Liberals
Top 7 Reasons Tax Cuts Work
On The Genealogy of Liberals 2: Tax Harder
Barack Obama Locked a Kitten in One Of Those Plastic Rolly Balls For Hamsters And Rolled It Down a Hill: The Shocking Facts
Top 175 All-Time Reasons Liberals Are Stupid
How To Ban More Things Without Getting The Government In Your Life
An Essay on the 1989 World Series: Why The Democrats Caused the Earthquake


I recommend you do not come back until you have read and mastered these works. They will be critical for your survival on this discussion board.
2012-12-11 02:53:59 AM  
1 vote:

ox45tallboy: You sure the monks aren't sneaking a few in on everyone? I mean, they're the ones in charge of letting everyone know about the festivals, right?


So, pretty much the same as any other religion throughout time?
2012-12-11 02:27:21 AM  
1 vote:
Can I agree that there's no war on Christmas, but still think that some atheists need a good punch in the mouth?

Is that a defensible point of view?
2012-12-11 01:46:30 AM  
1 vote:

hubiestubert: I am a Buddhist who enjoys the Christmas season.

This sort of asshat does a lot more damage to the spirit of the season.


Honest question, do Buddhists celebrate any Buddhist holidays?
2012-12-11 01:32:35 AM  
1 vote:
I am a Buddhist who enjoys the Christmas season.

This sort of asshat does a lot more damage to the spirit of the season.
2012-12-11 01:17:59 AM  
1 vote:
On Monday, Barber blasted the Freedom from Religion Foundation for trying to "recreate an America in their own secular, humanist, self-image."

amptoons.com

The obligatory noted, sign me up as another atheist who enjoys the heck out of the Holiday season.

There's just something special about being all snug and warm inside while winter waits outside, eating goodies you only really see around this time of the year, seeing friends and family you may not have seen in a while, warbling drunkenly off key to the Mr Heat Miser song when the ole Rankin Bass lineup gets aired, all that.

/Might just be me on that last one.
2012-12-11 01:12:56 AM  
1 vote:

Relatively Obscure: Nice. If I had those kind of skills, I'd have probably gone with uncomfortable Crazy Old Man style ranting, myself.


Honestly, the skills weren't the problem. Replacing a ROM chip would take about 10 minutes or so, and it's not that hard. I'm currently at my sister's house in semi-rural Alabama where everyone has guns and sneaking onto someone else's porch in the middle of the night, especially considering the number of other Christmas lights they have illuminating their yard, takes a good bit of thrill-seeking I find myself lacking as I've gotten older.
2012-12-11 12:30:43 AM  
1 vote:
I've never met an atheist who's been up in arms over "christmas".

Maybe a jehova's witness, but those guys don't even have birthdays of their own.
2012-12-11 12:25:37 AM  
1 vote:

clancifer: Is this the new Mike Lowell? At least Mike is humorous in his over the top rants full of stupid.


He wishes. Mike is always on the perfect side of Poe's Law. This guy just wants reactions, rather than to provide amusement.
2012-12-10 11:56:36 PM  
1 vote:
At some point some of these wackjobs are going to start a mini-revolution and be smacked down in a military operation that's gonna fuel Military Channel specials for the next decade.
 
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