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(ABC Local)   The Hostess story is worse than originally thought: Turns out they were stealing pension funds to pay for operation costs. Those damn unions   (abclocal.go.com) divider line 495
    More: Followup, unions  
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25862 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Dec 2012 at 5:24 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-10 03:54:06 PM
The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

IANAL - But, how can this be legal?
 
2012-12-10 03:59:42 PM
This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.
 
2012-12-10 04:02:45 PM

unyon: This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.


I see my point has already been made
 
2012-12-10 04:04:58 PM

unyon: This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.


I want my farking Wonder Bread back, damn it!
 
2012-12-10 04:06:36 PM
Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.
 
2012-12-10 04:08:17 PM
Well yah. Were you trapped in a well when the story came out? Hostess gutted the pension and then demanded worker pay cuts (but not executive pay cuts of course), but somehow it was the union and the workers being unreasonable.
 
2012-12-10 04:11:10 PM
Forgive me, but hasn't Hostess referred to the pension as 'unfunded' and that the unions were asking for too much? This new item seems to show Hostess looting the pension fund.

It seems to me that the difference before was them lying about how much the pension would cost them in the long run (instead of focusing on the bad debt they'd created.) I must have missed the part where they were dipping into the fund directly.

Huh... There are just so many thieving companies out there it's tough to keep straight all the various ways they fleece us.
 
2012-12-10 04:13:41 PM
Hostess Brands acknowledged for the first time in a news report Monday that the company diverted workers' pension money for other company uses.

The bankrupt baker told The Wall Street Journal that money taken out of workers' paychecks, intended for their retirement funds, was used for company operations instead
. Hostess, which was under different management at the time the diversions began in August 2011, said it does not know how much money it took.


Yeah. I thought so. This is a new report. Hostess is finally admitting what the union said they had been doing.
 
2012-12-10 04:14:09 PM
This has actually been known since the very first story about this issue. Submitter should pay more attention.
 
2012-12-10 04:16:04 PM

Ambivalence: Well yah. Were you trapped in a well when the story came out? Hostess gutted the pension and then demanded worker pay cuts (but not executive pay cuts of course), but somehow it was the union and the workers being unreasonable.


unyon: This isn't news. It was part of what the union was angry about. Outright theft. Pay attention, people.


I believe you're mistaking the 'unfunded' lie with the outright theft they lied about. Either way, this is the first time that Hostess is admitting to it.
 
2012-12-10 04:22:45 PM

Jackson Herring: This has actually been known since the very first story about this issue. Submitter should pay more attention.

Nov 20, 2012:
According to an article published last summer by Fortune, labor relations at Hostess have been contentious for some time. In order to allow Hostess to come out of bankruptcy, management had wanted to cut wages by 8% this year, gradually giving back half of the cut over the next five years. In addition, management wanted to reduce its contributions to employees' health care and pensions.

The biggest issue is that Hostess' union pension funds are underfunded by $2 billion.
Under its agreements with the unions, Hostess is required to contribute to multi-employer pension plans (MEPPs). MEPPs provide pension benefits to workers within a particular trade, regardless of what company they work for. The concept was that all companies employing workers in a particular trade would contribute to the trade pension fund so that workers would not lose their pension benefits if they changed employers.


Yeah, underfunding (not putting in the money you were supposed to put in ) and stealing the funds that were put there by workers are two different things. They did both - but, they're different.
 
2012-12-10 04:25:21 PM
No, it has literally been known since the story first broke that Hostess had "borrowed" the pension money and then informed the unions that they would not be paying it back.
 
2012-12-10 04:26:35 PM
Nice try, libtardos. If they didn't want their pension money being used to fund operations, they should have said so.

The company can't be liable for stuff the employees don't raise.
 
2012-12-10 04:32:17 PM
Is it libtardos or libtardoes?
 
2012-12-10 04:44:06 PM
And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.
 
2012-12-10 04:50:47 PM

Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.


Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.
 
2012-12-10 04:51:54 PM

Jackson Herring: Is it libtardos or libtardoes?


Libtardeaux

/Frenchier
 
2012-12-10 04:53:25 PM

Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.


I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...
 
2012-12-10 04:53:27 PM
That's a jailing.
 
Somebody is going to know what it a Twinkie being made feels like.
 
2012-12-10 04:57:32 PM

propasaurus: Jackson Herring: Is it libtardos or libtardoes?

Libtardeaux

/Frenchier


i.imgur.com
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2012-12-10 05:09:00 PM
WSJ: The maneuver probably doesn't violate federal law because the money Hostess failed to put into the pension didn't come directly from employees, experts said.

http://online.wsj.com/
article/SB10001424127887323316804578165813739413332.html

(Fark doesn't like links to WSJ main page, so cut and paste and strip the newline if your browser doesn't.)

WSJ had an interesting editorial a few weeks ago pointing out that people keep overlooking that there are two unions here with competing interests: Teamsters and bakers.
 
2012-12-10 05:11:39 PM
See, GOP? The problem with America is not the "47%", or the minorities, or the immigrants, or the gays, or the hipsters.

It's the goddamn corporatist vultures - aka - the goons who write your checks.
 
2012-12-10 05:12:37 PM

Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...


Nope. I learned that lesson after checking out the ingredient list of some of that shelf-stable ranch dip. Now I just assume that things like that have a big label on the back of the box that says "The contents of this container cannot actively kill an otherwise healthy adult." I know whatever's in it is bad for me, and that's all I need to know, thank you very much.
 
2012-12-10 05:18:07 PM

Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...


Did you somehow think that they'd be good for you?

Anyway, I can't stand 'em either, but that's mostly from overdoing it as a kid when a neighbor's mom had a truck full of 'em.
 
2012-12-10 05:19:59 PM

Relatively Obscure: Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...

Did you somehow think that they'd be good for you?


Oh, of course not. I knew they were bad for me. I just didn't know they were appallingly bad for me.
 
2012-12-10 05:27:44 PM

Nabb1: Relatively Obscure: Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...

Did you somehow think that they'd be good for you?

Oh, of course not. I knew they were bad for me. I just didn't know they were appallingly bad for me.


But they have oatmeal! That cures teh diabeetus!
 
2012-12-10 05:27:46 PM
Big Unions need big time restructuring. Union leaders should only make what the average employee in their union makes. I'm looking at you Jimmy Hoffa Jr.

/Some unions do, in fact, do this :)
//Pro-Union, Pro-Worker, PROLETARIAT!
 
2012-12-10 05:30:07 PM

Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.


Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.
 
2012-12-10 05:30:54 PM
Let's not forget that this crack management team also got 40 million bucks in FREE advertising from Talladega Nights a few years ago.
 
2012-12-10 05:31:55 PM
ecx.images-amazon.com
 
2012-12-10 05:32:43 PM
Okay, I haven't followed this story as well as I might have, but how is it possible for Hostess, or any other company, to reach into the union's bank account and take money out of it. My employer can direct-deposit money in my account, but can't take money out of it. I have to presume the same restrictions apply to the union's bank accounts.

IOW, never mind legality...how is this even POSSIBLE?
 
2012-12-10 05:33:21 PM
They fired one million bread truck drivers.
 
2012-12-10 05:33:40 PM
Bigger question, why did the union allow the company to control the pension? Seems like the union failed to protect the employees as well.
 
2012-12-10 05:34:20 PM
@Hostess: We're stealing from union pension funds to stay afloat. #YOLO
 
2012-12-10 05:34:24 PM
I wonder who insisted on those expensive pensions in the first place? Any ideas subby??
 
2012-12-10 05:35:17 PM

Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.


Which is why the company was going down the tubes in the first place, I imagine. You can't blame unions when the only people who are still willing to consume your products are the suicidally insane and/or death row inmates.
 
2012-12-10 05:36:12 PM

Runs_With_Scissors_: The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

IANAL - But, how can this be legal?


It's not. I'm sure hostess will gets sued and will have to declare bankruptcy.........oh wait.
 
2012-12-10 05:36:30 PM
If it were not for some of the outrageous demands of the union, maybe operating costs would be more manageable
 
2012-12-10 05:36:39 PM

Runs_With_Scissors_: The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

IANAL - But, how can this be legal?


fascist judges
 
2012-12-10 05:36:46 PM
And the sad thing is nobody will go to jail for this.
 
2012-12-10 05:36:47 PM

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.


Problem? It's becoming the norm.
 
2012-12-10 05:37:37 PM

Brick-House: If it were not for some of the outrageous demands of the union, maybe operating costs would be more manageable


yeah those cupcake makers were just rolling in the dough.
 
2012-12-10 05:37:46 PM

Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.


owned by hardcore 7th day adventist (fundies).
 
2012-12-10 05:37:52 PM
Was Hostess trying to create their own Clinton surplus?
 
2012-12-10 05:38:24 PM

CygnusDarius: Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.

Problem? It's becoming the norm.


protip: Invest in Brawndo while the stock is still low.
 
2012-12-10 05:38:31 PM

Brick-House: If it were not for some of the outrageous demands of the union, maybe operating costs would be more manageable


If it weren't for the high cost of liquor, maybe I wouldn't have to steal it from you at gunpoint.
 
2012-12-10 05:38:43 PM
You agree to pay people x in wages y in benefits, you farking pay them x in wages and y in benefits. You don't get to take some of y and help support the company without permission. Period. enough is farking enough.
 
2012-12-10 05:38:44 PM
The Wall Street Journal reports Hostess used employee pension money to stay afloat as it sank deeper and deeper toward bankruptcy.

It isn't clear how much money was taken from those pension funds.


Considering that in Hostess's filings with the Southern District court of New York that they owe their employee pension funds just under $2 billion dollars, then I'm going to take a wild guess and say that they stole about $2 billion dollars of pension funds from their employees.
 
2012-12-10 05:38:56 PM

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Fear_and_Loathing: Unions suck, so does management.  They only look out for the top earners.  Neither cares about the workers.  The National head of the union still gets a paycheck, and management will get golden parachutes.

Gah. Idiocy is becoming a real problem in this country.


Revamping the education system would help, but I can't tell you how, because I'm an idiot too.
 
2012-12-10 05:38:56 PM

Nabb1: Jubeebee: Nabb1: And that, folks, is why I won't buy any more of their stupid snack cakes.

Come to think of it, I haven't had one of their snack cakes in 20 years.

Little Debbies are better in every way anyway.

I used to love oatmeal cream pies until I made the mistake of reading the nutritional content not long after I turned 30. Mother of God...


I read that stuff in my early twenties and never went back, even to the Little Debbie stuff. I admit a certain fondness for ice cream and dark chocolate, but they're the only desserts allowed in my house most of the year...

Now if I only I could kick the love of craft beer as easily /sigh
 
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