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(NASA)   NASA page detailing (highly technical) methods they will be trying to use to develop a "Warp Drive" - code named "Eagleworks"   (ntrs.nasa.gov) divider line 91
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4517 clicks; posted to Geek » on 09 Dec 2012 at 10:53 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-09 10:02:49 AM
sg.mindlifesuccess.com 
/Basically how it stands at the moment
 
2012-12-09 10:21:48 AM
www.free-energy-info.co.uk
Nice try, NASA, but it's already been patented.
 
2012-12-09 10:58:53 AM
Just tell me where to go so that I won't get killed by dimension-hopping monsters, thanks.
 
2012-12-09 11:11:07 AM
This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.
 
2012-12-09 11:12:40 AM
I know the guy that is running that lab Sonny White.

Nice guy but a bit vague on the whole power source issues with his theory.

To establish a stable field you'd have to convert the mass of Jupiter to energy.

Small problem, I know but I am a details kind of guy.
 
2012-12-09 11:15:24 AM
Uh-oh. Ancient Alien Theorists believe it's possible that space aliens may have been stealing our technology.
 
2012-12-09 11:18:58 AM

maniacbastard: To establish a stable field you'd have to convert the mass of Jupiter to energy.


I read they changed the shape of the ring around the football ship and lowered the mass to be converted to around the size of Voyager 1...theoretically...

i184.photobucket.com

Less than 12 parsecs.
 
2012-12-09 11:22:56 AM

fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.


Not necessarily:

http://io9.com/5963263/how-nasa-will-build-its-very-first-warp-drive?u tm_source=io9.com&utm_medium=recirculation&utm_campaign=recirculation
 
2012-12-09 11:34:40 AM

fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.


About ten years ago, I saw a short article about warp bubbles. When they were originally theorized, it was thought that making one would take as much energy as exists in the entire universe. As of when that article was written, someone had figured out how to make a warp bubble with "only" the energy output of one star. My knowledge of astrophysics is pretty limited, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone came up with an even more energy-efficient way to make a warp bubble, although I doubt I'd understand most of the math.

/dnrtfPDF
 
2012-12-09 11:35:19 AM
This is something I can get behind throwing endless tax.dollars at.
 
2012-12-09 11:37:13 AM
Warp Field Mechanics 101, yeah...I took that as an undergrad. It was an obscure class given only once a year to selected undergrads. You probably never heard of it.
 
2012-12-09 11:37:29 AM

zobear: I read they changed the shape of the ring around the football ship and lowered the mass to be converted to around the size of Voyager 1...theoretically...


Granted that is an improvement, but it is still a ridiculous amount of energy.

Keep working on it until you can use the power of a reactor we can make.

Oh and the other issue that I doubt has been addressed, what to you do about the radiation created when you shut it off?
 
2012-12-09 11:42:06 AM

there their theyre: This is something I can get behind throwing endless tax.dollars at.


Don't forget the Haloperidol and psychiatric care required for anyone thinking this makes a shred of sense.

anfrind: fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.

About ten years ago, I saw a short article about warp bubbles. When they were originally theorized, it was thought that making one would take as much energy as exists in the entire universe. As of when that article was written, someone had figured out how to make a warp bubble with "only" the energy output of one star. My knowledge of astrophysics is pretty limited, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone came up with an even more energy-efficient way to make a warp bubble, although I doubt I'd understand most of the math.

/dnrtfPDF


Except no one has "made" anything here at all. It's just math. I can make a spreadsheet calculating my annual salary if I made a billion dollars a second. Then I made another one where I only made a million dollars a second.

Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?
 
2012-12-09 11:47:51 AM
First, it required the energy of the entire universe, then it was the energy inside your average star, then it was the energy of Jupiter, then Voyager 1 .... who knows, maybe someday they'll get it down to the unfathomably-impossible energy packed inside a cup of coffee....

But until then, I'd rather see private researchers spend their own time and money on this shiat.
 
2012-12-09 11:49:21 AM

Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.


Actually Sonny has a couple of test articles in his lab that he is getting ready to turn on and measure the curvature of space around them. Granted the measurement will be tiny and the lab is right next to a massive HVAC room that vibrates like Michael J Fox with a dildo in his ass, but they are building stuff.
 
2012-12-09 11:58:55 AM

Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?


Who says "just around the corner"??

Go back to stone age
Ask if they think man will ever walk on the moon
Your argument is now invalid

OR

Go to year 1435
Ask if they think the concept of smartphones will ever exist
Your argument is now invalid

Address that, brainless.
 
2012-12-09 12:00:07 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?


We just need to spend a year or two building the space elevator first.

I mean how hard could it be? To build the largest structure in human history, and make it freestanding, and make it extend into space, AND take down all the satellites in it's way, AND make it safe from debris and harmonics, AND have a way of climbing it AND be able to repair it.
 
2012-12-09 12:02:31 PM

sure haven't: Go back to stone age
Ask if they think man will ever walk on the moon
Your argument is now invalid

OR

Go to year 1435
Ask if they think the concept of smartphones will ever exist
Your argument is now invalid

Address that, brainless.



Quite simple really.

We have the math to make a warp drive, yet we cannot think of math to make it possible to harness enough energy to make it.
 
2012-12-09 12:07:34 PM

fluffy2097: Quantum Apostrophe: But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?

We just need to spend a year or two building the space elevator first.

I mean how hard could it be? To build the largest structure in human history, and make it freestanding, and make it extend into space, AND take down all the satellites in it's way, AND make it safe from debris and harmonics, AND have a way of climbing it AND be able to repair it.


Get a room you two.
 
2012-12-09 12:08:59 PM

threadjackistan: Get a room you two.


We're in a room. Why are you watching us? creep.
 
2012-12-09 12:09:22 PM
WTF?!


Access forbidden!
You don't have permission to access the requested file or directory on this server.
Please contact the STI Information Desk at hel­p[nospam-﹫-backwards]i­t­s*nasa*go­v or 443-757-5802.
You may be asked the following:
IP address.
Time, time zone and day of access.
Your geographic location
Version of browser (Internet Explorer, Firefox, etc.). Check "About" in the browser tab.
Does your organization use a proxy server (a proxy server acts as the intermediary between your web requests and the resource you are trying to access)?
What is the proxy server http number?
Is anyone else in your office or department able to access this site?
Error 403
 
2012-12-09 12:10:43 PM
Space thread : Check
QA shaiting all over it: check

/nothing more to see here
 
2012-12-09 12:10:50 PM

maniacbastard: Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

Actually Sonny has a couple of test articles in his lab that he is getting ready to turn on and measure the curvature of space around them. Granted the measurement will be tiny and the lab is right next to a massive HVAC room that vibrates like Michael J Fox with a dildo in his ass, but they are building stuff.


You mean "gravity"? Like the Forward Mass Sensor? And?

http://jap.aip.org/resource/1/japiau/v39/i7/p3193_s1?isAuthorized=no

threadjackistan: fluffy2097: Quantum Apostrophe: But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?

We just need to spend a year or two building the space elevator first.

I mean how hard could it be? To build the largest structure in human history, and make it freestanding, and make it extend into space, AND take down all the satellites in it's way, AND make it safe from debris and harmonics, AND have a way of climbing it AND be able to repair it.

Get a room you two.


Only if the room comes with a 3D printer.
 
2012-12-09 12:18:46 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: Except no one has "made" anything here at all. It's just math. I can make a spreadsheet calculating my annual salary if I made a billion dollars a second. Then I made another one where I only made a million dollars a second.

Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?


Yep. Everyone knows you're the smartest man in the universe. I mean, hell - you have the word "Quantum" in your handle, so that means you're like super-stringy smart.

If you can't figure out how to make a warp bubble using Excel, no one can. Heck, no one should even TRY. It's imposibru, right?
 
2012-12-09 12:20:32 PM

sure haven't: Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?

Who says "just around the corner"??

Go back to stone age
Ask if they think man will ever walk on the moon
Your argument is now invalid

OR

Go to year 1435
Ask if they think the concept of smartphones will ever exist
Your argument is now invalid

Address that, brainless.


The difference is, WE CAN BUILD SMARTPHONES. They don't require imaginary materials, or the energy output of a star. I can buy a smartphone and show it to someone. WHAT CAN YOU BUILD?
Smartphones are the logical end product of a progression of technology and science traceable all the way back to the Renaissance, including the early 20th century breakthrough in physics coming from the Ultraviolet Catastrophe and DeMorgan's logic theory. Going from early cathode ray tubes, to early solid-state rectifiers and spark gap transmitters, to the materials required to make vacuum tube triodes, to the math required to process information, which requires VERY LITTLE ENERGY.

What can you show me with regards to your delusions? Oh yeah, nothing at all. We use the same rockets, the same fuels, the same engines and the same physics since WWII.

And anyways, are you saying it's going to take 500 years to build warp drives?

Don't you want to live that long?

Oh no, you don't. Right. But I'm brainless.

So, better start building something there, genius. Show me.

Here, let me help you get started.

You're going to need some electronics.

I guess you'll need some nasty old real materials made from real elements from the Periodic Table.

Some lasers and shiat to make it all sciency and stuff.

And our old friend for everything else. I've tried searching for negative mass exotic wormhole matter but they're all out this week.

So, get cracking. BUILD AN ACTUAL REAL PHYSICAL DEVICE AND SHOW ME.

Or go back to your fantasies and delusions and shut the hell up.

The human race ain't going anywhere. What we have now is IT. If you don't understand that, you never will.
 
2012-12-09 12:21:12 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen.


The Wright Brothers made a heavier than air vehichle airborne in 1903. Less than 60 years later, humans put a person into space. Less than 70 years later, we put some dudes on the moon.

Chicago Pile 1 couldn't power a light bulb, yet a few years later we had nuclear reactors that could power cities.

I'd wager most folks right before these events would have said "it could never be done."

Mars is a 9 month trip, but the VASIMR rocket might be able to do it in a bit more than a month. Fractal Antenna recently tested a deflector shield that passes radiation around an object. We're getting closer all the time to safe(er...ish) space travel. I don't think anyone is saying this is "right around the corner."

You're absolutely right...it might never happen. But I think humans will figure it out because that's what we do.

maniacbastard: Oh and the other issue that I doubt has been addressed, what to you do about the radiation created when you shut it off?


I think there's a ton of unanswered practicalities of ftl travel. What happens in the wake of said bubble? How will navigation take place? What happens if you come out of warp too close to something? Even TNG ran into the problem of leaving big rents in the space/time fabric.
 
2012-12-09 12:23:04 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: maniacbastard: Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

Actually Sonny has a couple of test articles in his lab that he is getting ready to turn on and measure the curvature of space around them. Granted the measurement will be tiny and the lab is right next to a massive HVAC room that vibrates like Michael J Fox with a dildo in his ass, but they are building stuff.

You mean "gravity"? Like the Forward Mass Sensor? And?

http://jap.aip.org/resource/1/japiau/v39/i7/p3193_s1?isAuthorized=no

threadjackistan: fluffy2097: Quantum Apostrophe: But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?

We just need to spend a year or two building the space elevator first.

I mean how hard could it be? To build the largest structure in human history, and make it freestanding, and make it extend into space, AND take down all the satellites in it's way, AND make it safe from debris and harmonics, AND have a way of climbing it AND be able to repair it.

Get a room you two.

Only if the room comes with a 3D printer.


The room is a 3D printer..
1-media-cdn.foolz.us

https://1-media-cdn.foolz.us/ffuuka/board/tg/image/1354/21/1354210349 0 22.jpg
 
2012-12-09 12:31:20 PM
Pfftz... we can't even get to the moon.
 
2012-12-09 12:32:57 PM

aspAddict: Quantum Apostrophe: Except no one has "made" anything here at all. It's just math. I can make a spreadsheet calculating my annual salary if I made a billion dollars a second. Then I made another one where I only made a million dollars a second.

Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?

Yep. Everyone knows you're the smartest man in the universe. I mean, hell - you have the word "Quantum" in your handle, so that means you're like super-stringy smart.

If you can't figure out how to make a warp bubble using Excel, no one can. Heck, no one should even TRY. It's imposibru, right?


Hey now... not all of us Quantum people are derpers like Apostrophe.

\I still maintain, that like bevets before bevets turned into a bot, that QA is just an immensely original, but severely dedicated and specific troll.
 
2012-12-09 12:47:47 PM
Couldn'r they just reverse engineer that flying saucer they captured a few years back?

www2.tbo.com
 
2012-12-09 12:56:35 PM

maniacbastard: zobear: I read they changed the shape of the ring around the football ship and lowered the mass to be converted to around the size of Voyager 1...theoretically...

Granted that is an improvement, but it is still a ridiculous amount of energy.

Keep working on it until you can use the power of a reactor we can make.

Oh and the other issue that I doubt has been addressed, what to you do about the radiation created when you shut it off?


Good point. We should probably just give up trying, because obviously challenges like this are things that human innovation has never been able to overcome in the past.
 
2012-12-09 01:06:32 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: So, get cracking. BUILD AN ACTUAL REAL PHYSICAL DEVICE AND SHOW ME.


I know this wasn't directed at me, but...

Bio-engineer/Breed an Immortal Human, AND SHOW ME..

quid pro quo
 
2012-12-09 01:18:10 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: there their theyre: This is something I can get behind throwing endless tax.dollars at.

Don't forget the Haloperidol and psychiatric care required for anyone thinking this makes a shred of sense.

anfrind: fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.

About ten years ago, I saw a short article about warp bubbles. When they were originally theorized, it was thought that making one would take as much energy as exists in the entire universe. As of when that article was written, someone had figured out how to make a warp bubble with "only" the energy output of one star. My knowledge of astrophysics is pretty limited, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone came up with an even more energy-efficient way to make a warp bubble, although I doubt I'd understand most of the math.

/dnrtfPDF

Except no one has "made" anything here at all. It's just math. I can make a spreadsheet calculating my annual salary if I made a billion dollars a second. Then I made another one where I only made a million dollars a second.

Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?


I just used this quote last night,

"It is quantum mechanics that is the foundation of our entire technological revolution. There would be no computers, there would be none of what you take for granted...

Today you hear people saying, "why are we spending money up there, when we got problems on Earth?"

And people don't connect the time delay between the frontier of scientific research and how that's going to transform your life later down the line. All they want is a quarterly report that shows the product that comes out of it.

THAT IS SO SHORT SIGHTED AND THAT's THE BEGINNING OF THE END OF YOUR CULTURE." -- Dr. Niel deGrasse Tyson
 
2012-12-09 01:27:35 PM
I think Alcubierre Warp Drive has a bit of a nicer ring to it than Shaw-Fujikawa Drive.
 
2012-12-09 01:29:25 PM

fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.


I think the point here is to research the technology and perhaps find a way to reduce the power demands to something we can actually achieve.

I hate to use this analogy, because it comes up all the damn time in these discussions, but one of the reasons many people thought powered flight was impossible before the Wright brothers, was the lift equation, as understood at that time, was wrong. New science can always be a game changer, which is why we should never stop looking.
 
2012-12-09 01:30:16 PM
"While warp field mechanics has not had a Chicago Pile moment, the tools necessary to detect a modest instance of the phenomenon are near at hand. "

For those unfamiliar with the term, they're referring to the first nuclear reactor, built in Chicago. It produced a relatively trivial amount of energy, but it was enough to demonstrate that a chain reaction was taking place. That's what they are trying to do here - produce a small but significant effect. They haven't done so yet.
 
2012-12-09 01:44:35 PM

sure haven't: Quantum Apostrophe: Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?

Who says "just around the corner"??

Go back to stone age
Ask if they think man will ever walk on the moon
Your argument is now invalid

OR

Go to year 1435
Ask if they think the concept of smartphones will ever exist
Your argument is now invalid

Address that, brainless.


That's a false equivalency. Those innovations were the result of developing and perfecting our engineering and manufacturing capabilities.

The problem with space travel is that we cannot go faster than the speed of light. We're not going to overcome that through building a faster computer.
 
2012-12-09 01:54:19 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: there their theyre: This is something I can get behind throwing endless tax.dollars at.

Don't forget the Haloperidol and psychiatric care required for anyone thinking this makes a shred of sense.

anfrind: fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.

About ten years ago, I saw a short article about warp bubbles. When they were originally theorized, it was thought that making one would take as much energy as exists in the entire universe. As of when that article was written, someone had figured out how to make a warp bubble with "only" the energy output of one star. My knowledge of astrophysics is pretty limited, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone came up with an even more energy-efficient way to make a warp bubble, although I doubt I'd understand most of the math.

/dnrtfPDF

Except no one has "made" anything here at all. It's just math. I can make a spreadsheet calculating my annual salary if I made a billion dollars a second. Then I made another one where I only made a million dollars a second.

Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?


Hey, let's all stay in our own country since we'll sail off the edge of the world anyway. Hey, let's keep everyone illiterate because it would require too many monks to hand write the necessary reading materials. Hey, let's let people die of infection since we don't have simple antibiotics. Your in the company of some illustrious assholes champ, keep up the hatred and naysaying of research, I'm sure you'll never be proven wrong. What the fark is wrong with you, did some nerd steal your girlfriend? I've never seen someone unrelated to fundamentalist religious indoctrination be such an asshole about scientific research.
 
2012-12-09 02:11:05 PM
Every avenue of humane research should be explored, because we never know when thee most mundane thing will lead to a radical new understanding of the universe.

As I've understood QA's derp over the years his chief complaint is that space travel is too resource intensive for too little benefit. Following that line of reasoning he should be all for this type of research as it should lead to discoveries resulting in our using less resources for greater benefit in the long term.

What will make me lol is if we find the cure for human aging in SPAAAAAAAACE. Someone is going to have to clean QA's brain chunks out of the keyboard if that happens.
 
2012-12-09 02:23:08 PM
Shouldn't we conquer things like a basic understanding of how gravity actually works before screwing around with going faster and faster? Fine and dandy to be able to propel people and craft close to the speed of light, but, your bone density would be shot to sh*t by the time you got to your destination making it impossible to explore, and return to earth later.
 
2012-12-09 02:27:16 PM

Boudyro: Every avenue of humane research should be explored, because we never know when thee most mundane thing will lead to a radical new understanding of the universe.

As I've understood QA's derp over the years his chief complaint is that space travel is too resource intensive for too little benefit. Following that line of reasoning he should be all for this type of research as it should lead to discoveries resulting in our using less resources for greater benefit in the long term.

What will make me lol is if we find the cure for human aging in SPAAAAAAAACE. Someone is going to have to clean QA's brain chunks out of the keyboard if that happens.


I don't see it as derp. He makes a rational that it's a waste of cash, and it is. What did man achieve by setting Armstrong and company on the moon? Dick all. Congratulations, you beat the Russians getting there...It's a big dusty ball. Same goes for Mars. A complete waste of time trying to get there. It's like spending a trillion dollars to fly you to the middle of a desert. It's pointless.
 
2012-12-09 02:28:57 PM

Quantum Apostrophe:

And anyways, are you saying it's going to take 500 years to build warp drives?



If it takes that long, it takes that long, but that's no reason not to start now. Maybe there will be some breakthrough that makes it possible in 10 years, and maybe there are unforeseen challenges and it won't be done for 1,000 years. Maybe it will turn out that it isn't possible at all. We'll never know until we try.

Intellectual curiosity and the drive to build better tools to explore new places and do new things are inherent to the human condition. Everything is impossible until it isn't.
 
2012-12-09 02:35:48 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: there their theyre: This is something I can get behind throwing endless tax.dollars at.

Don't forget the Haloperidol and psychiatric care required for anyone thinking this makes a shred of sense.

anfrind: fluffy2097: This is the warp drive that needs to use ALL the energy contained within a neutron star the size of Jupiter or some shiat right?

Something that requires energy density well beyond that of what a star is capable of producing PROBABLY is only going to be theoretical in our lifetimes.

About ten years ago, I saw a short article about warp bubbles. When they were originally theorized, it was thought that making one would take as much energy as exists in the entire universe. As of when that article was written, someone had figured out how to make a warp bubble with "only" the energy output of one star. My knowledge of astrophysics is pretty limited, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone came up with an even more energy-efficient way to make a warp bubble, although I doubt I'd understand most of the math.

/dnrtfPDF

Except no one has "made" anything here at all. It's just math. I can make a spreadsheet calculating my annual salary if I made a billion dollars a second. Then I made another one where I only made a million dollars a second.

Woopee. None of this means it will ever happen. And I'm using things that exist, like dollars and seconds. You warp morons still need, besides the impossible levels of energy, imaginary materials.

But hey, it's just around the corner, right? Because the endless deadly vacuum of space is just like in the movies, right?


Shut up, Bevets.
 
2012-12-09 02:52:13 PM
QA may be a spectacular derptard, but this is one of those times of day that the broken clock is more or less right. The Alcubierre drive is pure fantasy.

Not because it requires tremendous amounts of energy -- that's an engineering problem, not a physics problem. The trouble is that half of it has to be something with negative energy density, i.e. negative mass. There's a bit of a supply issue with that, seeing as how the current negative-mass-material inventory of the universe is, um, lemme check the numbers here... Oh, right. Zero. Nil. Flat farkin' zip. If you're depending on that to get you to the stars, you'd be better off building a ship out of rainbows and unicorns powered by a tooth fairy/leprechaun reactor using Santa Claus's butt for reaction mass.

This is not an engineering problem. Nature does not care that you can calculate the metric that would be created by a particular arrangement of negative mass. We can calculate the electromagnetic fields that would be created by magnetic monopoles, too, but those things just refuse to pop into existence no matter how many of them we write down on paper. Maybe someday Nature will change her mind, and particles with negative mass will suddenly come into being. I wouldn't hold my breath, and until that happens all this Alcubierre warp crap is nothing but mathematical masturbation.

The lab "demonstration" is silly as hell, too. It's supposed to test the effect of just the positive half of that mass, and we already know that part. We know it really damn well, in fact. We've measured it on lab benches, in low Earth orbit, and in interplanetary space, and your phone's GPS wouldn't work if it weren't programmed to account for it. Measuring it again tells us nothing new, and does nothing to alleviate the fundamental futility of the project, but it will look shiny and impress the sort of people who don't ask the important questions.
 
2012-12-09 03:05:44 PM
Thanks for all this sh*t in here, QAss.
 
2012-12-09 03:06:13 PM

Quantumbunny: \I still maintain, that like bevets before bevets turned into a bot, that QA is just an immensely original, but severely dedicated and specific troll.


He does turn it into an art form, doesn't he?
 
2012-12-09 03:14:49 PM

Professor Science: QA may be a spectacular derptard, but this is one of those times of day that the broken clock is more or less right. The Alcubierre drive is pure fantasy.


If you must always check an instrument against another instrument to know when it is right, it is both consistently wrong and amazingly useless.

Even if these theories are wrong, we'd still learn a lot from proving where they don't jive with reality.

/I think that if we haven't bent space in the lab, writing up a fuel economy theory to prove it is impossible would be premature.
 
2012-12-09 03:17:13 PM

Professor Science: The lab "demonstration" is silly as hell, too. It's supposed to test the effect of just the positive half of that mass, and we already know that part. We know it really damn well, in fact. We've measured it on lab benches, in low Earth orbit, and in interplanetary space, and your phone's GPS wouldn't work if it weren't programmed to account for it. Measuring it again tells us nothing new, and does nothing to alleviate the fundamental futility of the project, but it will look shiny and impress the sort of people who don't ask the important questions.


Wait, you're saying we've tested the space-time curvature of a high-energy plasma field in context warp drive theory to even see if it's possible?

I don't think we were reading the same paper.
 
2012-12-09 03:23:36 PM
I think this is probably unattainable, but I'm very glad NASA will continue to spend some resources trying to work on it. We will learn something.
 
2012-12-09 03:27:58 PM
Design an experiment to produce and/or detect the presence of captured negative mass. Let's make it easy: your working materials are the entire mass of Jupiter, half the continuous power output of the Sun, and a new and improved Supernova Strength (TM) Mr. Fusion that can synthesize every element currently existing in the periodic table.

And just to get it done in a reasonable timeframe, you get self-replicating von neumann factories that can tap into noted solar output.

You don't get to write any NEW rules of physics that can't be verified using current rules. Go.

/Keepin' up with the Kardashevs...
 
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