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(Al Jazeera)   After some thought, Egypt's Morsi decides this whole dictator thing is overrated   (aljazeera.com) divider line 137
    More: News, Egypt, Cairo's Tahrir Square, Egyptian President, political coalition, the Bus Uncle, Bosnian War, Al Jazeera, dictators  
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17633 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Dec 2012 at 11:22 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-09 12:36:35 AM
Cool Maybe the majority did not want to live in a theocracy after all. We need people like this in America.
 
2012-12-09 12:38:21 AM

Spaced Lion: When the government fears the people, you have liberty.

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

We could, but SWAT and the National Guard would start mowing people down like wheat. And then the protestors would be portrayed as worthless hippie welfare leeches, enough people would believe it, and nothing would come of it.


Nah, they would just focus media attention on the undesirables (like the car-pooper in OWS) and marginalize the movement. If that wouldn't be enough the movement would be absorbed into a political party.

Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.
 
2012-12-09 12:40:58 AM

Cuchulane: Amos Quito: Amos Quito: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


To remain in power, as they were under during Mubarak.


FTFM

Mubarak was just a puppet,

Yeah, I'm just trying to figure out what they see as the best way to do that. I mean, in reality there are limits to how far a military can go in only pretending that the government matters before the soldiers themselves start to abandon their posts. That's the theory anyway. Common thinking in the US is that if the military decided to just up and take over that the citizen soldiers themselves would rebel. That hasn't been true in Syria so far though. So how does the military plan to most effectivly keep power and keep the peace?



Obviously the TRUE power lies with the people. The trick to governing is in leading the people to believe that you are serving their best interests.

Oftentimes the best way to do this is to create the illusion of false opposition, whereon the people can be coerced into accepting that which is NOT in their interests based on the (often false) belief that the alternative is even less appetizing.

Play one hand against the other.
 
2012-12-09 12:43:41 AM

Amos Quito: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.


/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial


How do you feel about Turkey? Not precisely the same situation, but that's about what we can hope for in terms of Egypt.
 
2012-12-09 12:44:15 AM

Smackledorfer: Spaced Lion: When the government fears the people, you have liberty.

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

We could, but SWAT and the National Guard would start mowing people down like wheat. And then the protestors would be portrayed as worthless hippie welfare leeches, enough people would believe it, and nothing would come of it.

Nah, they would just focus media attention on the undesirables (like the car-pooper in OWS) and marginalize the movement. If that wouldn't be enough the movement would be absorbed into a political party.

Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.



Those are, quite possibly, the saddest words I've ever seen written. 

:-(
 
2012-12-09 12:46:55 AM

Amos Quito: iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

Yes, but we don't have the balls.


Didn't the Tea Party basically do exactly that?
 
2012-12-09 12:48:10 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


Military is obligatory for males of 18-30 years of age; service obligation 12-36 months, followed by a 9-year reserve obligation. Protesters are usually young men, as such post-service and in the Reserves themselves. The military men know this; that is probably why they do not want to harm the protesters, as it would be fighting amongst brothers.
 
2012-12-09 12:48:34 AM

Smackledorfer: Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.


You might want to read this:
cdn-libertylawsite.s3.amazonaws.com
 
2012-12-09 12:57:49 AM

Krymson Tyde: I suspect he values his head being attached to his torso.


Methinks you are correct.

/Sounds like he's got a ways to go before people are satisfied, though...
 
2012-12-09 12:58:25 AM
Which is a fancy way of saying "America told us they'd stop signing our paychecks if I went forward with that particular plan".
 
2012-12-09 01:00:28 AM
Morsi did not want to get his neck-beard ruined by rope burns, I'm sure
 
2012-12-09 01:01:00 AM
he ends up giving those rebels an inch and they will demand a mile later.

/hook, line ans sinker
//LOL
 
2012-12-09 01:02:49 AM

Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?


Pretend you went on vacation, and you gave your keys to a friend so he could house-sit for you.

While you were away, he let a robbery crew in to take all your stuff.

When you got back, you were pissed, so he said "I'm real sorry, here, you can have your keys back. We're cool now, right?"

Your stuff is Egypt's constitutional referendum. The damage is done.
 
2012-12-09 01:02:50 AM
Now all they need to do is get themselves a better (read: with more secularism and civil rights) constitutional document.
Fortunately they seem to be relatively united in that aim.

Morsi may have saved himself from exile and the harshest criticisms, but if he isn't ousted he is going to at least be a single-term president. After his shenanigans and the resulting protests, I can't see too many Egyptians wanting to vote for him during their next election. The Egyptian people are really showing some admirable fortitude getting back out into the streets to protect the victories they won against Mubarak. Hopefully the dedication will scare off the Brotherhood and others who figure they'll just lull them and then pull the rug out from under them, and in the process teach the people which groups and people should not be involved in bringing them the democracy they want. It will be wonderful if Egypt and Libya can pop out of this mess in a few years with real hope of a modern, free society. Hell, Tunisia and Libya already had something resembling that in the 50s; it'd be nice to see it again.
 
2012-12-09 01:10:18 AM

Modguy: Amos Quito: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.


/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial

How do you feel about Turkey? Not precisely the same situation, but that's about what we can hope for in terms of Egypt.



I feel like humanity has outgrown itself.

We can no longer sustain the tribalist instincts by which we have defined ourselves for so long.

We shall either evolve - as a consciousness - beyond this state, or we shall destroy ourselves.

Our technology has surpassed the collective wisdom necessary to maintain equilibrium.

Either Wisdom evolves, or we become yet another failed experiment in evolution.


/Either way, life will go on
 
2012-12-09 01:15:12 AM
Now if only our current dictator would do the same

/letrole got nothin on me
 
2012-12-09 01:16:07 AM

Emposter: Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?

Pretend you went on vacation, and you gave your keys to a friend so he could house-sit for you.

While you were away, he let a robbery crew in to take all your stuff.

When you got back, you were pissed, so he said "I'm real sorry, here, you can have your keys back. We're cool now, right?"

Your stuff is Egypt's constitutional referendum. The damage is done.


wasn't this person voted in? like obama? we're both(USA and Egypt) farked.

/right
 
2012-12-09 01:19:08 AM

Amos Quito: or we shall destroy ourselves


like ric romero of the 5th century BC. this is exactly what is going to happen. maybe not this generations day. it is inevitable .
 
2012-12-09 01:22:46 AM

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?


Well we actually did it to some just recently.
Scott Brown for instance.
 
2012-12-09 01:27:15 AM

Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?


Yeah just fine. Carry on. Gas is only $3 a gallon.
 
2012-12-09 01:30:54 AM
The folly of President-elect Morsi
Was thinking he'd govern by force,see
But further reflection,
About his selection,
Led to this: Uhhh....That's gonna cost me!
 
2012-12-09 01:36:00 AM

Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket


Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.
 
2012-12-09 01:39:05 AM
"The big question now is how the opposition will respond."

No! The big question is how will the republicans use this against our poor Obama!

/That is the idiocy that was posted last night.
//Many tards defended that stupid line of thinking.
///Egypt doesn't care how you voted.
 
2012-12-09 01:40:01 AM

meyerkev: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?

Kingmakers/Praetorian guard. The military is the de facto power, and has provided the last 3 presidents.

I've also heard that the military is divided between the old and new guard. (Which can largely be defined by whether they fought in the Six Days War and October War or not and their resulting attitude towards Israel ["Oh hell no, we're not doing that again. I don't care if they're Zionist Oppressors"/"Death to the Zionist Oppressors"]). So the old guard wants another Mubarak (military, semi-secular, reasonably friendly to the West, not going to war with Israel), and the partially-Islamist new guard wants a Morsi or similar who they then control. Dunno how true that is though


The military also openly controls/owns most of the industry and infrastructure in the nation. It is in their best interest not to be seen as full time oppressors nor to cede control to any government.
 
2012-12-09 01:40:47 AM

MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.


And you are continuing the derp.
 
2012-12-09 01:47:10 AM
Benghazi in Platforms is his best song.
 
2012-12-09 01:49:41 AM

MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.


Yeah, you know the rules. Anything good happens, either a Republican did it or we had nothing to do with it. But if ANYTHING bad happens, it's all Obama's fault!
 
2012-12-09 01:51:01 AM

LordJiro: MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.

Yeah, you know the rules. Anything good happens, either a Republican did it or we had nothing to do with it. But if ANYTHING bad happens, it's all Obama's fault!


Meanwhile the rest of the world says neither of you tards had anything to do with it, but have fun licking your own balls.
 
2012-12-09 02:01:51 AM
soooo what your saying is Egypt WONT invade gaza, start ww3 along with syria and armagedon WON'T happen in 13 days?

awwwww...
 
2012-12-09 02:04:59 AM

Hickory-smoked: Smackledorfer: Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.

You might want to read this:
[cdn-libertylawsite.s3.amazonaws.com image 300x433]


Should I judge that by its cover then? Is it going to change the view I just put forth, add to it, give me a whole new way of thinking?
 
2012-12-09 02:05:57 AM

Linkster: Apos: Silverstaff: Translation: He didn't want to get the Mubarak treatment.

Bingo.

This!


Whatever works. He doubtless weighed the options of giving in, the Mubarak treatment or the Qaddafi treatment, and figured giving in had the best life expectancy.
 
2012-12-09 02:07:08 AM

Begoggle: Now if only our current dictator would do the same

/letrole got nothin on me


Is your surname beGôggle?
 
2012-12-09 02:09:02 AM
Well, as long as he said it that must mean it's true. And he promises never ever to try anything funny ever again, for real! Not only that, the next guy won't either, double promise!
 
2012-12-09 02:23:50 AM
It it probably wishful thinking on my part, but I can't help but think this was orchestrated to kick the populace in the pants.
 
2012-12-09 02:30:50 AM
Morsi played his hand far too early, doing too much too quickly and expecting to get results.
 
2012-12-09 02:37:46 AM
Being a dictator can be a great gig... if you're backed by the CIA. The retirement plan isn't so great, tho. Just ask Khadafi or Hussein.
 
2012-12-09 02:40:43 AM

FarkedOver: The radical left needs to keep this revolution going. Destroy the ruling class and create a workers state. Keep revolting until worker control is set in stone.


Yeah, that always works well. And what would Egyptians know about setting things in stone?
 
2012-12-09 02:53:07 AM
Asked whether the opposition's goal was to unseat Morsi, Dawood said: "This is definitely not in our agenda at all. Our agenda is basically limited to having a new draft constitution that everybody is satisfied about before going to a referendum.

So where are we now in this?

Morsi has annulled the power grab he made back in November but now insists it's unconstitutional to not go ahead with the December 15th referendum on the primarily MB written constitution but *has* hinted that the whole thing may well be scrapped and re-written with more input from other sources. "Will that make
Egypt more secular or less?" is my main question here after "Is he just making accommodating noises here while planning on ramming it through as is?"
 
2012-12-09 02:56:40 AM

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


Dictators typically meet an ugly end once the army decides it wont enforce the decrees. I suspect the Egyptian military told Morsi,"You and what army?"
 
2012-12-09 03:08:11 AM

Gawdzila: Now all they need to do is get themselves a better (read: with more secularism and civil rights) constitutional document.
Fortunately they seem to be relatively united in that aim.

Morsi may have saved himself from exile and the harshest criticisms, but if he isn't ousted he is going to at least be a single-term president. After his shenanigans and the resulting protests, I can't see too many Egyptians wanting to vote for him during their next election. The Egyptian people are really showing some admirable fortitude getting back out into the streets to protect the victories they won against Mubarak. Hopefully the dedication will scare off the Brotherhood and others who figure they'll just lull them and then pull the rug out from under them, and in the process teach the people which groups and people should not be involved in bringing them the democracy they want. It will be wonderful if Egypt and Libya can pop out of this mess in a few years with real hope of a modern, free society. Hell, Tunisia and Libya already had something resembling that in the 50s; it'd be nice to see it again.


Indeed. I see this now as simply growing pains for Egypt. I'm glad Morsi rescinded his authoritarian grab, this is definitely a positive development.
 
2012-12-09 03:21:33 AM

Modguy: Amos Quito: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.

/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial

How do you feel about Turkey? Not precisely the same situation, but that's about what we can hope for in terms of Egypt.


Isn't Pakistan pretty much that way, too?
 
2012-12-09 03:21:33 AM

What_Would_Jimi_Do: Emposter: Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?

Pretend you went on vacation, and you gave your keys to a friend so he could house-sit for you.

While you were away, he let a robbery crew in to take all your stuff.

When you got back, you were pissed, so he said "I'm real sorry, here, you can have your keys back. We're cool now, right?"

Your stuff is Egypt's constitutional referendum. The damage is done.

wasn't this person voted in? like obama? we're both(USA and Egypt) farked.

/right


This would be the equivalent of Obama deciding to rewrite the Constitution, and forming a convention of almost all Democrats so that they could write worship of Cthulu directly into the Constitution itself, despite the GOP having almost half the country.

So, no, not like Obama. Not at all. But nice attempt to somehow twist this into an attack on BO.
 
2012-12-09 03:23:16 AM
Two words: Saddam Hussein.

Lesson learned.
 
2012-12-09 03:33:49 AM

MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests pyramids in Egypt, Clinton Jews did.

What a joke you are.


Sorry, couldn't resist.

/gots nuthin'
 
2012-12-09 03:55:36 AM
So the Dictator thing didn't work out ? well, time to go back to islamic fundamentalist theocracy.
 
2012-12-09 04:15:04 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


It's kind of important to remember that Egypt has mandatory service. While the generals and other top brass are political military diehards, the boots on the ground are also the citizenry, and the citizens were also members of the armed forces.
 
2012-12-09 04:18:04 AM
On a random note, ducked out of work for 5 minutes today to run across the street to the liquor store, and ran smack dab into an anti-Morsi protest marching up Connecticut Avenue. Did use them as cover to cross the street, and was impressed that they were marching that far up Conn Ave, assuming White House as a starting point. Maybe heading to Biden's?
 
2012-12-09 04:24:40 AM
Never go full Mubarak.
 
2012-12-09 04:25:05 AM
A fair constitution isn't going to arise in a winner-takes-all system.
 
2012-12-09 04:26:22 AM

starsrift: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?

It's kind of important to remember that Egypt has mandatory service. While the generals and other top brass are political military diehards, the boots on the ground are also the citizenry, and the citizens were also members of the armed forces.


I don't think people really understand the nature of the military in Egypt. It is a business in the literal sense. The Egyptian military generates a lot of revenue from its myriad of businesses, and is more concerned about a stable business environment than ideological posturing.
 
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