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(Al Jazeera)   After some thought, Egypt's Morsi decides this whole dictator thing is overrated   (aljazeera.com) divider line 137
    More: News, Egypt, Cairo's Tahrir Square, Egyptian President, political coalition, the Bus Uncle, Bosnian War, Al Jazeera, dictators  
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17631 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Dec 2012 at 11:22 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-08 06:05:02 PM
Good. Now he needs to resign and a new election held. That'd be the right thing, anyway.
 
2012-12-08 06:19:35 PM
Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.
 
2012-12-08 07:00:53 PM
In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check.

Furthermore, all children under 16 years old are now... 16 years old!
 
2012-12-08 10:08:33 PM

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


He probably saw the news that the military might step in and panicked.
 
2012-12-08 11:23:53 PM

themindiswatching: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

He probably saw the news that the military might step in and panicked.


Pretty sure he doesn't get his info from the news. I'm guessing a general called him and said to cut that shait out.
 
2012-12-08 11:24:08 PM
I doubt this will be enough to sate the street.
 
2012-12-08 11:24:28 PM
Translation: He didn't want to get the Mubarak treatment.
 
2012-12-08 11:25:09 PM
At some point, don't we run out of brown people?
 
2012-12-08 11:25:25 PM
And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.
 
2012-12-08 11:25:58 PM

Silverstaff: Translation: He didn't want to get the Mubarak treatment.


Bingo.
 
2012-12-08 11:26:28 PM
Especially after finding out that all the people want to get jihad on his ass.
 
2012-12-08 11:28:10 PM
Wow, common sense broke out. Good news. Hopefully.
 
2012-12-08 11:30:35 PM
I read that headline as Morrisey - still made sense.
 
2012-12-08 11:31:10 PM
Hmmmmh. TFA still makes it seem gloomy.
 
2012-12-08 11:33:22 PM
Now make him sign the Magna Carta.
 
2012-12-08 11:33:53 PM

starsrift: Hmmmmh. TFA still makes it seem gloomy.


Yeah, this is just a bit of public "Lulz, my bad" to hide the backdoor ass-farking he is going to give the secular & minority religion Egyptian peoples.
 
2012-12-08 11:35:12 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.


I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket
 
2012-12-08 11:36:11 PM

starsrift: Hmmmmh. TFA still makes it seem gloomy.


Indeed. He may have already irreversibly harmed Egypt's chance for a fair decision on their new constitution.
 
2012-12-08 11:37:29 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.


Geometric would be nice.
 
2012-12-08 11:37:36 PM

MemeSlave: At some point, don't we run out of brown people?


I don't think the world will run out any time soon.
It's like bamboo or something.
 
2012-12-08 11:37:53 PM
I KEED, I KEED. YOU NOT KILL ME NOW.

KEEDING ONLY.
 
2012-12-08 11:38:31 PM

Spiralmonkey: I read that headline as Morrisey - still made sense.


Glad it wasn't just me.
 
2012-12-08 11:39:38 PM
I'm sure farker independents will be able to explain why drudge report doesn't have

Red and blue sirens blaring with a picture of morsi not being a pharaoh.

Nvm, he'll mention it in a week at the bottom of the page.
 
2012-12-08 11:39:54 PM

Apos: Silverstaff: Translation: He didn't want to get the Mubarak treatment.

Bingo.


This!
 
2012-12-08 11:41:57 PM
So this means Romney is automatically president?
 
2012-12-08 11:46:36 PM
This is just like the Muslim Brotherhood, not seizing total power with military backing. Those guys are clever.

Truly our greatest threat ever!
 
2012-12-08 11:47:05 PM

megarian: Spiralmonkey: I read that headline as Morrisey - still made sense.

Glad it wasn't just me.


Cairo in a coma I know, I know it's serious...
 
2012-12-08 11:48:52 PM
I suspect he values his head being attached to his torso.
 
2012-12-08 11:49:53 PM

Notabunny: megarian: Spiralmonkey: I read that headline as Morrisey - still made sense.

Glad it wasn't just me.

Cairo in a coma I know, I know it's serious...


This just made me happy that I'm marginally intoxicated.

Extreme lulz.
 
2012-12-08 11:52:56 PM
The radical left needs to keep this revolution going. Destroy the ruling class and create a workers state. Keep revolting until worker control is set in stone.
 
2012-12-08 11:54:24 PM
Does this mean everything is ok over there now?
 
2012-12-08 11:56:00 PM
Sounds like they need a Gray Council.
 
2012-12-08 11:58:58 PM
Pharoh has decreed that some power will devolve to the priests.
 
2012-12-09 12:02:22 AM
Egyptian military to Morsi -- "We knew Gamel Abdel Nasser and you're not Gamel Abdel Nasser."
 
2012-12-09 12:03:06 AM

abb3w: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.
Geometric would be nice.


Why not go for linear? Next revolution there will be people being born in the streets! I bet Morsi's good for a couple population explosions in the next few months.

/Or some kind of explosions anyway
 
2012-12-09 12:05:13 AM
Wow, can we do this to Congress?
 
2012-12-09 12:06:52 AM

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.



Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.


/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial
 
2012-12-09 12:07:33 AM

Notabunny: megarian: Spiralmonkey: I read that headline as Morrisey - still made sense.

Glad it wasn't just me.

Cairo in a coma I know, I know it's serious...


Allah knows they're miserable now.
 
2012-12-09 12:07:42 AM
I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?
 
2012-12-09 12:08:53 AM
The draft constitution has been criticised for its potential to weaken human rights and the rights of women, and out of fear it would usher in Islamic interpretation of laws.

I wish at some point they'd actually quote the portions of the draft that relate to that.
 
2012-12-09 12:11:51 AM

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?



Yes, but we don't have the balls.
 
2012-12-09 12:12:53 AM
'Cos life is hard enough when you belong here.
 
2012-12-09 12:13:29 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?



To remain in power, as they were under Mubarak.
 
2012-12-09 12:14:29 AM

Amos Quito: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


To remain in power, as they were under during Mubarak.



FTFM

Mubarak was just a puppet,
 
2012-12-09 12:18:54 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


Kingmakers/Praetorian guard. The military is the de facto power, and has provided the last 3 presidents.

I've also heard that the military is divided between the old and new guard. (Which can largely be defined by whether they fought in the Six Days War and October War or not and their resulting attitude towards Israel ["Oh hell no, we're not doing that again. I don't care if they're Zionist Oppressors"/"Death to the Zionist Oppressors"]). So the old guard wants another Mubarak (military, semi-secular, reasonably friendly to the West, not going to war with Israel), and the partially-Islamist new guard wants a Morsi or similar who they then control. Dunno how true that is though
 
2012-12-09 12:24:25 AM

meyerkev: Kingmakers/Praetorian guard. The military is the de facto power, and has provided the last 3 presidents before Morsi.


FTFM.

I also heard that Mubarak's big sin that brought the military in against him was trying to install his son as successor instead of letting the generals pick.
 
2012-12-09 12:26:01 AM

meyerkev: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?

Kingmakers/Praetorian guard. The military is the de facto power, and has provided the last 3 presidents.

I've also heard that the military is divided between the old and new guard. (Which can largely be defined by whether they fought in the Six Days War and October War or not and their resulting attitude towards Israel ["Oh hell no, we're not doing that again. I don't care if they're Zionist Oppressors"/"Death to the Zionist Oppressors"]). So the old guard wants another Mubarak (military, semi-secular, reasonably friendly to the West, not going to war with Israel), and the partially-Islamist new guard wants a Morsi or similar who they then control. Dunno how true that is though


Yup. And if the figurehead gets too far out of line, I'm sure the Egyptian military still has a healthy supply of grenades on hand.
 
2012-12-09 12:26:29 AM

Amos Quito: Amos Quito: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


To remain in power, as they were under during Mubarak.


FTFM

Mubarak was just a puppet,


Yeah, I'm just trying to figure out what they see as the best way to do that. I mean, in reality there are limits to how far a military can go in only pretending that the government matters before the soldiers themselves start to abandon their posts. That's the theory anyway. Common thinking in the US is that if the military decided to just up and take over that the citizen soldiers themselves would rebel. That hasn't been true in Syria so far though. So how does the military plan to most effectivly keep power and keep the peace?
 
2012-12-09 12:28:33 AM
When the government fears the people, you have liberty.

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?


We could, but SWAT and the National Guard would start mowing people down like wheat. And then the protestors would be portrayed as worthless hippie welfare leeches, enough people would believe it, and nothing would come of it.
 
2012-12-09 12:36:18 AM

GoldenEagle: Why not go for linear? Next revolution there will be people being born in the streets!


The "make love not war" thing seemed to have been shown empirically non-correspondent back at the end of the 1960s to early 1970s. But I suppose there's opportunity for more data...
 
2012-12-09 12:36:35 AM
Cool Maybe the majority did not want to live in a theocracy after all. We need people like this in America.
 
2012-12-09 12:38:21 AM

Spaced Lion: When the government fears the people, you have liberty.

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

We could, but SWAT and the National Guard would start mowing people down like wheat. And then the protestors would be portrayed as worthless hippie welfare leeches, enough people would believe it, and nothing would come of it.


Nah, they would just focus media attention on the undesirables (like the car-pooper in OWS) and marginalize the movement. If that wouldn't be enough the movement would be absorbed into a political party.

Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.
 
2012-12-09 12:40:58 AM

Cuchulane: Amos Quito: Amos Quito: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


To remain in power, as they were under during Mubarak.


FTFM

Mubarak was just a puppet,

Yeah, I'm just trying to figure out what they see as the best way to do that. I mean, in reality there are limits to how far a military can go in only pretending that the government matters before the soldiers themselves start to abandon their posts. That's the theory anyway. Common thinking in the US is that if the military decided to just up and take over that the citizen soldiers themselves would rebel. That hasn't been true in Syria so far though. So how does the military plan to most effectivly keep power and keep the peace?



Obviously the TRUE power lies with the people. The trick to governing is in leading the people to believe that you are serving their best interests.

Oftentimes the best way to do this is to create the illusion of false opposition, whereon the people can be coerced into accepting that which is NOT in their interests based on the (often false) belief that the alternative is even less appetizing.

Play one hand against the other.
 
2012-12-09 12:43:41 AM

Amos Quito: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.


/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial


How do you feel about Turkey? Not precisely the same situation, but that's about what we can hope for in terms of Egypt.
 
2012-12-09 12:44:15 AM

Smackledorfer: Spaced Lion: When the government fears the people, you have liberty.

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

We could, but SWAT and the National Guard would start mowing people down like wheat. And then the protestors would be portrayed as worthless hippie welfare leeches, enough people would believe it, and nothing would come of it.

Nah, they would just focus media attention on the undesirables (like the car-pooper in OWS) and marginalize the movement. If that wouldn't be enough the movement would be absorbed into a political party.

Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.



Those are, quite possibly, the saddest words I've ever seen written. 

:-(
 
2012-12-09 12:46:55 AM

Amos Quito: iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

Yes, but we don't have the balls.


Didn't the Tea Party basically do exactly that?
 
2012-12-09 12:48:10 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


Military is obligatory for males of 18-30 years of age; service obligation 12-36 months, followed by a 9-year reserve obligation. Protesters are usually young men, as such post-service and in the Reserves themselves. The military men know this; that is probably why they do not want to harm the protesters, as it would be fighting amongst brothers.
 
2012-12-09 12:48:34 AM

Smackledorfer: Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.


You might want to read this:
cdn-libertylawsite.s3.amazonaws.com
 
2012-12-09 12:57:49 AM

Krymson Tyde: I suspect he values his head being attached to his torso.


Methinks you are correct.

/Sounds like he's got a ways to go before people are satisfied, though...
 
2012-12-09 12:58:25 AM
Which is a fancy way of saying "America told us they'd stop signing our paychecks if I went forward with that particular plan".
 
2012-12-09 01:00:28 AM
Morsi did not want to get his neck-beard ruined by rope burns, I'm sure
 
2012-12-09 01:01:00 AM
he ends up giving those rebels an inch and they will demand a mile later.

/hook, line ans sinker
//LOL
 
2012-12-09 01:02:49 AM

Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?


Pretend you went on vacation, and you gave your keys to a friend so he could house-sit for you.

While you were away, he let a robbery crew in to take all your stuff.

When you got back, you were pissed, so he said "I'm real sorry, here, you can have your keys back. We're cool now, right?"

Your stuff is Egypt's constitutional referendum. The damage is done.
 
2012-12-09 01:02:50 AM
Now all they need to do is get themselves a better (read: with more secularism and civil rights) constitutional document.
Fortunately they seem to be relatively united in that aim.

Morsi may have saved himself from exile and the harshest criticisms, but if he isn't ousted he is going to at least be a single-term president. After his shenanigans and the resulting protests, I can't see too many Egyptians wanting to vote for him during their next election. The Egyptian people are really showing some admirable fortitude getting back out into the streets to protect the victories they won against Mubarak. Hopefully the dedication will scare off the Brotherhood and others who figure they'll just lull them and then pull the rug out from under them, and in the process teach the people which groups and people should not be involved in bringing them the democracy they want. It will be wonderful if Egypt and Libya can pop out of this mess in a few years with real hope of a modern, free society. Hell, Tunisia and Libya already had something resembling that in the 50s; it'd be nice to see it again.
 
2012-12-09 01:10:18 AM

Modguy: Amos Quito: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.


/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial

How do you feel about Turkey? Not precisely the same situation, but that's about what we can hope for in terms of Egypt.



I feel like humanity has outgrown itself.

We can no longer sustain the tribalist instincts by which we have defined ourselves for so long.

We shall either evolve - as a consciousness - beyond this state, or we shall destroy ourselves.

Our technology has surpassed the collective wisdom necessary to maintain equilibrium.

Either Wisdom evolves, or we become yet another failed experiment in evolution.


/Either way, life will go on
 
2012-12-09 01:15:12 AM
Now if only our current dictator would do the same

/letrole got nothin on me
 
2012-12-09 01:16:07 AM

Emposter: Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?

Pretend you went on vacation, and you gave your keys to a friend so he could house-sit for you.

While you were away, he let a robbery crew in to take all your stuff.

When you got back, you were pissed, so he said "I'm real sorry, here, you can have your keys back. We're cool now, right?"

Your stuff is Egypt's constitutional referendum. The damage is done.


wasn't this person voted in? like obama? we're both(USA and Egypt) farked.

/right
 
2012-12-09 01:19:08 AM

Amos Quito: or we shall destroy ourselves


like ric romero of the 5th century BC. this is exactly what is going to happen. maybe not this generations day. it is inevitable .
 
2012-12-09 01:22:46 AM

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?


Well we actually did it to some just recently.
Scott Brown for instance.
 
2012-12-09 01:27:15 AM

Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?


Yeah just fine. Carry on. Gas is only $3 a gallon.
 
2012-12-09 01:30:54 AM
The folly of President-elect Morsi
Was thinking he'd govern by force,see
But further reflection,
About his selection,
Led to this: Uhhh....That's gonna cost me!
 
2012-12-09 01:36:00 AM

Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket


Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.
 
2012-12-09 01:39:05 AM
"The big question now is how the opposition will respond."

No! The big question is how will the republicans use this against our poor Obama!

/That is the idiocy that was posted last night.
//Many tards defended that stupid line of thinking.
///Egypt doesn't care how you voted.
 
2012-12-09 01:40:01 AM

meyerkev: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?

Kingmakers/Praetorian guard. The military is the de facto power, and has provided the last 3 presidents.

I've also heard that the military is divided between the old and new guard. (Which can largely be defined by whether they fought in the Six Days War and October War or not and their resulting attitude towards Israel ["Oh hell no, we're not doing that again. I don't care if they're Zionist Oppressors"/"Death to the Zionist Oppressors"]). So the old guard wants another Mubarak (military, semi-secular, reasonably friendly to the West, not going to war with Israel), and the partially-Islamist new guard wants a Morsi or similar who they then control. Dunno how true that is though


The military also openly controls/owns most of the industry and infrastructure in the nation. It is in their best interest not to be seen as full time oppressors nor to cede control to any government.
 
2012-12-09 01:40:47 AM

MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.


And you are continuing the derp.
 
2012-12-09 01:47:10 AM
Benghazi in Platforms is his best song.
 
2012-12-09 01:49:41 AM

MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.


Yeah, you know the rules. Anything good happens, either a Republican did it or we had nothing to do with it. But if ANYTHING bad happens, it's all Obama's fault!
 
2012-12-09 01:51:01 AM

LordJiro: MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

What a joke you are.

Yeah, you know the rules. Anything good happens, either a Republican did it or we had nothing to do with it. But if ANYTHING bad happens, it's all Obama's fault!


Meanwhile the rest of the world says neither of you tards had anything to do with it, but have fun licking your own balls.
 
2012-12-09 02:01:51 AM
soooo what your saying is Egypt WONT invade gaza, start ww3 along with syria and armagedon WON'T happen in 13 days?

awwwww...
 
2012-12-09 02:04:59 AM

Hickory-smoked: Smackledorfer: Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.

You might want to read this:
[cdn-libertylawsite.s3.amazonaws.com image 300x433]


Should I judge that by its cover then? Is it going to change the view I just put forth, add to it, give me a whole new way of thinking?
 
2012-12-09 02:05:57 AM

Linkster: Apos: Silverstaff: Translation: He didn't want to get the Mubarak treatment.

Bingo.

This!


Whatever works. He doubtless weighed the options of giving in, the Mubarak treatment or the Qaddafi treatment, and figured giving in had the best life expectancy.
 
2012-12-09 02:07:08 AM

Begoggle: Now if only our current dictator would do the same

/letrole got nothin on me


Is your surname beGôggle?
 
2012-12-09 02:09:02 AM
Well, as long as he said it that must mean it's true. And he promises never ever to try anything funny ever again, for real! Not only that, the next guy won't either, double promise!
 
2012-12-09 02:23:50 AM
It it probably wishful thinking on my part, but I can't help but think this was orchestrated to kick the populace in the pants.
 
2012-12-09 02:30:50 AM
Morsi played his hand far too early, doing too much too quickly and expecting to get results.
 
2012-12-09 02:37:46 AM
Being a dictator can be a great gig... if you're backed by the CIA. The retirement plan isn't so great, tho. Just ask Khadafi or Hussein.
 
2012-12-09 02:40:43 AM

FarkedOver: The radical left needs to keep this revolution going. Destroy the ruling class and create a workers state. Keep revolting until worker control is set in stone.


Yeah, that always works well. And what would Egyptians know about setting things in stone?
 
2012-12-09 02:53:07 AM
Asked whether the opposition's goal was to unseat Morsi, Dawood said: "This is definitely not in our agenda at all. Our agenda is basically limited to having a new draft constitution that everybody is satisfied about before going to a referendum.

So where are we now in this?

Morsi has annulled the power grab he made back in November but now insists it's unconstitutional to not go ahead with the December 15th referendum on the primarily MB written constitution but *has* hinted that the whole thing may well be scrapped and re-written with more input from other sources. "Will that make
Egypt more secular or less?" is my main question here after "Is he just making accommodating noises here while planning on ramming it through as is?"
 
2012-12-09 02:56:40 AM

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.


Dictators typically meet an ugly end once the army decides it wont enforce the decrees. I suspect the Egyptian military told Morsi,"You and what army?"
 
2012-12-09 03:08:11 AM

Gawdzila: Now all they need to do is get themselves a better (read: with more secularism and civil rights) constitutional document.
Fortunately they seem to be relatively united in that aim.

Morsi may have saved himself from exile and the harshest criticisms, but if he isn't ousted he is going to at least be a single-term president. After his shenanigans and the resulting protests, I can't see too many Egyptians wanting to vote for him during their next election. The Egyptian people are really showing some admirable fortitude getting back out into the streets to protect the victories they won against Mubarak. Hopefully the dedication will scare off the Brotherhood and others who figure they'll just lull them and then pull the rug out from under them, and in the process teach the people which groups and people should not be involved in bringing them the democracy they want. It will be wonderful if Egypt and Libya can pop out of this mess in a few years with real hope of a modern, free society. Hell, Tunisia and Libya already had something resembling that in the 50s; it'd be nice to see it again.


Indeed. I see this now as simply growing pains for Egypt. I'm glad Morsi rescinded his authoritarian grab, this is definitely a positive development.
 
2012-12-09 03:21:33 AM

Modguy: Amos Quito: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

Like it or not, reality is that the military still runs the show.

/Backed by USrael from behind the scenes
//Mubarak to Morsi
///Superficial

How do you feel about Turkey? Not precisely the same situation, but that's about what we can hope for in terms of Egypt.


Isn't Pakistan pretty much that way, too?
 
2012-12-09 03:21:33 AM

What_Would_Jimi_Do: Emposter: Djkb: Does this mean everything is ok over there now?

Pretend you went on vacation, and you gave your keys to a friend so he could house-sit for you.

While you were away, he let a robbery crew in to take all your stuff.

When you got back, you were pissed, so he said "I'm real sorry, here, you can have your keys back. We're cool now, right?"

Your stuff is Egypt's constitutional referendum. The damage is done.

wasn't this person voted in? like obama? we're both(USA and Egypt) farked.

/right


This would be the equivalent of Obama deciding to rewrite the Constitution, and forming a convention of almost all Democrats so that they could write worship of Cthulu directly into the Constitution itself, despite the GOP having almost half the country.

So, no, not like Obama. Not at all. But nice attempt to somehow twist this into an attack on BO.
 
2012-12-09 03:23:16 AM
Two words: Saddam Hussein.

Lesson learned.
 
2012-12-09 03:33:49 AM

MyRandomName: Notabunny: StreetlightInTheGhetto: And only 7 people died. Some kind of progress.

Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

I did at first - thought it might take some time but that he would have to - but had kind of started to doubt.

I didn't think he would blink, recalculated in light of popular sentiment, factored in some Clinton behind-the-scenes badassery, left bank, corner pocket

Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests pyramids in Egypt, Clinton Jews did.

What a joke you are.


Sorry, couldn't resist.

/gots nuthin'
 
2012-12-09 03:55:36 AM
So the Dictator thing didn't work out ? well, time to go back to islamic fundamentalist theocracy.
 
2012-12-09 04:15:04 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


It's kind of important to remember that Egypt has mandatory service. While the generals and other top brass are political military diehards, the boots on the ground are also the citizenry, and the citizens were also members of the armed forces.
 
2012-12-09 04:18:04 AM
On a random note, ducked out of work for 5 minutes today to run across the street to the liquor store, and ran smack dab into an anti-Morsi protest marching up Connecticut Avenue. Did use them as cover to cross the street, and was impressed that they were marching that far up Conn Ave, assuming White House as a starting point. Maybe heading to Biden's?
 
2012-12-09 04:24:40 AM
Never go full Mubarak.
 
2012-12-09 04:25:05 AM
A fair constitution isn't going to arise in a winner-takes-all system.
 
2012-12-09 04:26:22 AM

starsrift: Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?

It's kind of important to remember that Egypt has mandatory service. While the generals and other top brass are political military diehards, the boots on the ground are also the citizenry, and the citizens were also members of the armed forces.


I don't think people really understand the nature of the military in Egypt. It is a business in the literal sense. The Egyptian military generates a lot of revenue from its myriad of businesses, and is more concerned about a stable business environment than ideological posturing.
 
2012-12-09 04:27:50 AM

MyRandomName: Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.


It is not impossible to imagine that the US Sec. of State has some influence on the affairs in foreign countries.
 
2012-12-09 04:43:13 AM

Harry_Seldon: I don't think people really understand the nature of the military in Egypt. It is a business in the literal sense. The Egyptian military generates a lot of revenue from its myriad of businesses, and is more concerned about a stable business environment than ideological posturing.


Exactly. It's not quite as if the military are a bully hand that can be brought into play, they're more of a trusted institution. And it's "the military", as in reservists and retirees, who are doing the protesting.
 
2012-12-09 05:03:02 AM
And unless you remove the Muslim Brotherhood completely from power, this is nothing but a minor set back for them.
 
2012-12-09 05:19:47 AM

tomcatadam: MyRandomName: Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

It is not impossible to imagine that the US Sec. of State has some influence on the affairs in foreign countries.


Particularly not in one that's consistently been the second biggest recipient of US foreign aid over the last thirty years.

/You'll never guess who number one is...
 
2012-12-09 05:29:14 AM

quatchi: tomcatadam: MyRandomName: Remember folks. Anytime something good happens, a democrat deserves credit. You didn't build those protests in Egypt, Clinton did.

It is not impossible to imagine that the US Sec. of State has some influence on the affairs in foreign countries.

Particularly not in one that's consistently been the second biggest recipient of US foreign aid over the last thirty years.

/You'll never guess who number one is...



Gee, it's almost like we've been hanging a pork chop around #1's neck so that #2 would be willing to play nicely with it.

So if you think about it, all the money spent on #2 was actually intended to benefit #1, wasn't it?
 
2012-12-09 05:51:35 AM
Alright, here's the thing: this was not really much of a concession at all. The whole point of the first decree was to immunize the constitutional assembly from judicial review. Now that the assembly is finished working, that issue is moot. It is pretty amazing (read: ridiculous) that when the decree was issued, the assembly needed two more months, and then, literally overnight, they finished the draft and were ready for a referendum. Because nothing says "long terms stability" like drafting a foundational document in an all-night marathon session to head off opposition protests....

Don't expect liberals and seculars to be pacified by this. Everyone who is not MB still feels like they are getting this constitution forced on them. Many will do whatever they can to stop the referendum. Heated ongoing debates about the role of majoritarianism in democracy- while morsi is elected, he got 12 million votes out of the 50 million elegible voters in the runoff. That's not exactly a sweeping mandate, or one that authorizes one man to reshuffle the roles of various institutions. Most people agree, meanwhile, that if the referendum goes ahead, it can almost certainly get 50%+1. It seems to me that a supermajority is a reasonable requirement for a constitution. The fact that today nobody really knows the requirement is fairly telling. It is really a farce.

Couple people mentioned wanting to know which clauses in the constitution are problematic. If you are really interested, check out-

Human rights watch here.

Amnesty here.

As far as the military is concerned, there has been no indication that they are willing or prepared to pull another coup. Morsi was successful earlier this year in decapitating SCAF and installing friends in the upper ranks. They might be forced to act in a situation with prolonged widespread violence, but we haven't seen anything like that yet.

The way out of this is to delay the constitution for several months, get the key parties back to the table, and come up with a better document. The constitution as written is basically a redline of the 1971 constitution, a bunch of cross-referencing laws, rather than an outline of basic principles on the structure and roll of government. That wil probably not happen.

It will be interesting to see over the next several days if this move appeases enough people to quiet the street pressure. If the liberals are going to stop the referendum, they not only have to maintain that momentum, but increase it to further strikes and civil disobedience. As of last week, the majority of judges said they would not oversee the referendum. Their reaction will be important.

Point is, this is not Morsi giving in to the opposition. It's Morsi having gotten what he wanted out of the declaration and moving ahead with the controversial constitution. Dunno. We'll see...
 
2012-12-09 05:52:59 AM

What_Would_Jimi_Do: wasn't this person voted in? like obama?


And Hitler. Don't you forget Hitler.
 
2012-12-09 05:56:08 AM
i45.tinypic.com
 
2012-12-09 06:06:16 AM

Amos Quito: So if you think about it, all the money spent on #2 was actually intended to benefit #1, wasn't it?


It was intended to benefit the stated American national security interest of keeping the oil flowing without interruption which has been the basis for almost all US policy in this region since oil was first found there.

/Like spice, the oil must flow.
 
2012-12-09 06:49:18 AM

Amos Quito: We have the congress we want.


Those are, quite possibly, the saddest words I've ever seen written.


I don't agree with it. The last election showed that we want a more heavily democratic congress than republican one, as is evidenced by the popular vote. But the gerrymandering ass hats found a way to keep themselves in the majority regardless of how the people vote. If > 50% of the votes were for (D) congressmen then > 50% of congress should be (D).
assholes.
 
2012-12-09 06:53:32 AM
that's not will of the people, that's will of the party =/
 
2012-12-09 07:05:07 AM
Sweetness, sweetness he was only joking!
 
2012-12-09 07:23:12 AM

Cuchulane: I can see why Morsi turned around out of fear of the crowd, if he doesn't have the support of the military. I'm trying to figure out why the military tolerates these protests. What's their end game?


They rely on US aid. They can't go full Tiannanmen (probably spelled that wrong). They have to think about US press coverage. That's why they're being very shadowy.
 
2012-12-09 07:24:04 AM

Smackledorfer: Spaced Lion: When the government fears the people, you have liberty.

iaazathot: Wow, can we do this to Congress?

We could, but SWAT and the National Guard would start mowing people down like wheat. And then the protestors would be portrayed as worthless hippie welfare leeches, enough people would believe it, and nothing would come of it.

Nah, they would just focus media attention on the undesirables (like the car-pooper in OWS) and marginalize the movement. If that wouldn't be enough the movement would be absorbed into a political party.

Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.


Because they're the Congress America deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll mock them. Because they deserve it. Because they're not our Congress. They're silent filibusters, watchful lobbyists . The derp knights.
 
2012-12-09 07:28:12 AM

one small post for man: Because they're the Congress America deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll mock them. Because they deserve it. Because they're not our Congress. They're silent filibusters, watchful lobbyists . The derp knights.


(Applause)
 
2012-12-09 07:42:37 AM

zamboni: joking


Came here for this, leaving satisfied.
 
2012-12-09 08:52:14 AM
He'll catch on eventually, and simply follow the Americans' lead by expanding his power buy burying legislation in other unrelated bills. Expect him to soon pass the Either You Vote For This and Are a Patriot or You Don't and Are a Terrorist Baby Killing Monster bill.
 
2012-12-09 09:52:16 AM
This coverage of the story is way oversimplified. Egypt is an administrative mess right now.

An interim parliament was put into place that looked like it was going to stay there until a constitution was drafted. A year went by while the parliament did not perform. The parliament knew they would remain in power as long as the constitution did not get done. Why would the parliament want to be held accountable?

The exact same thing happened in Iraq. The provisional government remained in control until an election occurred and a government could be formed. It took six months after the election to form the government.

Morsi realizes the situation is not moving forward, declares emergency powers and, what do you know, the constitution is done two weeks later.

With regards to the courts, the bench is still filled with Mubarak appointed judges. At this point in time, Mubarak officials who murdered protestors in the streets still won't get convicted by these judges because the judges are Mubarak loyalists. The way their legal system works, it doesn't even appear that Morsi can appoint his own attorney general.

The military is the same way. Mubarak appointed all of the guys who run the military and they are not giving up any of the control they have already had.

Two thirds of the Egyptian government has not been elected by anyone, and their hope is, looking at Middle East history, that all they need to do is delay enough and they will hold power forever.

Furthermore, the only model of transition from Dictatorship to Democracy the Arab world has is Turkey. In Turkey, Mustafa Kemal did the exact same thing Morsi did; he consolidated power and adopted modern reforms on the government by force.

I am thinking that Morsi made this move to get a constitution done and get a real government in place so he can start firing the military and judicial cronies of Mubarak legitimately, and now that it is done he is ready to back out.
 
2012-12-09 10:01:00 AM

angryjd:

An interim parliament was put into place that looked like it was going to stay there until a constitution was drafted. A year went by while the parliament did not perform. The parliament knew they would remain in power as long as the constitution did not get done. Why would the parliament want to be held accountable?


Eh? No, after several months the parliament was disbanded by court order, with the elections having been deemed unconstitutional (in the absence of a constitution....wrap your head around that). If anything, this is evidence that Morsi needed to do what he did in order to protect legitimately elected bodies from being disbanded by the Mubarak-era judges. I don't personally believe that, but it is a talking point.

Definitely agree with your Weeners- it is a shame that nobody in the western media can seem to write anything more nuanced than "Clashes Erupt!!1!"
 
2012-12-09 10:11:41 AM

randomjsa: And unless you remove the Muslim Brotherhood completely from power, this is nothing but a minor set back for them.


Ah thank god for Randonjassa, with his direct line to Coulters and Becks assholes.

Heehaw Randomjassa heehaw
 
2012-12-09 10:26:51 AM
damn you, farkin filter
 
2012-12-09 10:37:16 AM

JolobinSmokin: I'm sure farker independents will be able to explain why drudge report doesn't have

Red and blue sirens blaring with a picture of morsi not being a pharaoh.

Nvm, he'll mention it in a week at the bottom of the page.


Who farking cares? This is Fark.
 
2012-12-09 10:38:26 AM
org2.democracyinaction.org
 
2012-12-09 11:07:21 AM

Smackledorfer: Hickory-smoked: Smackledorfer: Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.

You might want to read this:
[cdn-libertylawsite.s3.amazonaws.com image 300x433]

Should I judge that by its cover then? Is it going to change the view I just put forth, add to it, give me a whole new way of thinking?


Only so far as your analysis is incomplete, and misrepresenting the root of the problem.

If you don't feel like picking up a new hardcover just because some Fark told you to, Lessig did a seminar at The Long Now Foundation, among other places, that you could listen to.
 
2012-12-09 11:36:22 AM

Hickory-smoked: Smackledorfer: Hickory-smoked: Smackledorfer: Our political system works. It only looks like it is failing due to apathetic voters and ignorance - and no system can prevent that without giving up democracy.

We have the congress we want.

You might want to read this:
[cdn-libertylawsite.s3.amazonaws.com image 300x433]

Should I judge that by its cover then? Is it going to change the view I just put forth, add to it, give me a whole new way of thinking?

Only so far as your analysis is incomplete, and misrepresenting the root of the problem.

If you don't feel like picking up a new hardcover just because some Fark told you to, Lessig did a seminar at The Long Now Foundation, among other places, that you could listen to.


My issue is that you could simply, you know, just farking type in what you have to say, or at least tell me what the book you are recommending is about. I despise arguments that come from a position of 'you are wrong, I won't say how and I won't say why, nor will I make any points, but I will support my claim by referencing knowledge that you too can have if you spend money and hours'.

You say my analysis is incomplete, yet you have no analysis at all.
 
2012-12-09 11:44:12 AM

modesto: damn you, farkin filter


You could solve all the problems of the world, as often occurs on Fark; but as soon as "boobies" or "weeners" show up... it's all for naught.

On the other hand... it's kinda funny.

The Shiat filter is dangerous, however. I believe that's what happened Neville Chamberlain. The London Newspapers had the same policy and whenever Hitler's name was preceded by an "S" ... well nobody could take a guy named Shiatler seriously. Hitler was so upset that he decided to bomb the source of this embarrassment. Apparently, Drew learned nothing from history. Thanks a lot, Drew. You're going to get us bombed by the Nazis.

The Fark filter is a harsh mistress.
 
2012-12-09 11:49:51 AM
Don't care. I just run with the assumption that all Muslim countries eventually end up with asshole dictators. Saves a lot of hand wringing if you do it that way.
 
2012-12-09 11:55:02 AM

sevenpointsixtwo: He'll catch on eventually, and simply follow the Americans' lead by expanding his power buy burying legislation in other unrelated bills. Expect him to soon pass the Either You Vote For This and Are a Patriot or You Don't and Are a Terrorist Baby Killing Monster bill.


Dude, spare the theatrics. The current protests there are over whether the president can unilaterally throw out decisions by the high court. That is ridiculously far from where the US operates no matter how much hysteria you try to inject into it.
 
2012-12-09 12:50:09 PM

modesto: Point is, this is not Morsi giving in to the opposition. It's Morsi having gotten what he wanted out of the declaration and moving ahead with the controversial constitution. Dunno. We'll see...


Thanks for some perspective on that, very interesting.
 
2012-12-09 12:52:56 PM

Fubini: themindiswatching: Rincewind53: Wow. He blinked. I didn't think he would.

He probably saw the news that the military might step in and panicked.

Pretty sure he doesn't get his info from the news. I'm guessing a general called him and said to cut that shait out.


That seems to be how the Egyptian military operates. They don't up and topple the guy, they just wait for their to be an enough steam that the guy is vulnerable. Then they point out all that needs to happen is someone needs to give a tiny little push and things would get ugly for the President.
 
2012-12-09 01:31:14 PM

Oznog: Now make him sign the Magna Carta.


Actually, that's a freakin' great idea.
 
2012-12-09 01:46:30 PM

JolobinSmokin: I'm sure farker independents will be able to explain why drudge report doesn't have

Red and blue sirens blaring with a picture of morsi not being a pharaoh.

Nvm, he'll mention it in a week at the bottom of the page.


I'm no farker indie, nor a fan of Drudge, but the story is there already. And also these gems:

APOCALYPTO: Panic spreads ahead of Mayan prophecy...
Flashback: Students strike against Michelle Obama rules...
ILLEGAL ALIEN GETS FREE KIDNEY TRANSPLANT...
 
2012-12-09 03:29:49 PM
You know, may be it's time for America to undo the whole leaving England to escape religious oppression thing.
 
2012-12-09 04:27:19 PM

balloot: Don't care. I just run with the assumption that all Muslim countries eventually end up with asshole dictators. Saves a lot of hand wringing if you do it that way.


Which is why we keep telling the nationbuilding-happy neocons to go fark themselves.

Who knows what kinds of stable democracies might have developed in the past 50 years if the West didn't insist on quashing them and installing corporate-friendly dictators to keep them in line?
 
2012-12-09 04:28:06 PM
He shoulda never left The Smiths.
 
2012-12-09 04:36:51 PM

Walt_Jizzney: He shoulda never left The Smiths.


i.telegraph.co.uk

And now I know how Joan of Arc felt
Now I know how Joan of Arc felt
As the flames rose
to her roman nose
And her hearing aid started to melt...bigmouth strikes agaaaaain....
 
2012-12-10 12:53:57 AM
The only thing religious nuts understand is force and violence. It may be ironic, but it's true. No one has ever convinced a religious nut of anything through logic and reasoning. They always have to be defeated on either the political battlefield or the, well, battle battlefield.
 
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