Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Telegraph)   "Catcher in the Rye", and "To Kill a Mockingbird" to be replaced in US classrooms by texts such as "Recommended Levels of Insulation," "Invasive Plant Inventory," and "How to Turn Critical Thinkers in to Welfare Recipients"   (telegraph.co.uk) divider line 73
    More: Asinine, Catcher in the Rye, Harper Lee, classic book, J.D. Salinger, National Governors Association, curriculum, standards-based education reform, critical thinking  
•       •       •

9356 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Dec 2012 at 5:43 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


Archived thread
2012-12-07 02:48:56 PM  
11 votes:
FTFA: "A new school curriculum which will affect 46 out of 50 states will make it compulsory for at least 70 per cent of books studied to be non-fiction, in an effort to ready pupils for the workplace. "
And here is precicely the underlying problem in the US. We have changed our education system into a worker-bee development system.

ed·u·ca·tion/ˌɛdʒʊˈkeɪʃən/ Show Spelled [ej-oo-key-shuhn] noun
1. the act or process of imparting or acquiring general knowledge, developing the powers of reasoning and judgment, and generally of preparing oneself or others intellectually for mature life.

Education has nothing to do with being able to start working at Home Depot or Microsoft. Call me whackadoodle, but this is an indicator of our march from citizens to serfs.
2012-12-07 04:42:16 PM  
7 votes:
OK, the link is both funny and scary, I grant, but something about this does not pass the smell test. Did The Telegraph get punk'd?

First of all, I checked out the Common Core State Standards web page and could find nothing to support any of these assertions. In fact, many of the other claims on the Telegraph page seem to be explicitly contradicted by the Core Standards page. For example, they are certainly not proposing to eliminate or reduce the study of Shakespeare. The site specifically states, "In English‐language arts, the Standards require certain critical content for all students, including: classic myths and stories from around the world, America's Founding Documents, foundational American literature, and Shakespeare."

Second, the Telegraph cites no sources for its various claims about the new curriculum. Where exactly did they get these specifics? From The Onion? I did find a recommended reading list (.pdf) from one school system employing the Core Standards, and it does include "California Invasive Plant Council. Invasive Plant Inventory," but that system recommends it for middle schools, so it is certainly not a substitute for Catcher in the Rye. Check out the list for yourself. Personally, I found it to be a completely appropriate one for 6th to 8th graders, and fail to sense the problems suggested by the Telegraph article.
2012-12-07 01:57:59 PM  
7 votes:
Supporters of the directive argue that it will help pupils to develop the ability to write concisely and factually, which will be more useful in the workplace than a knowledge of Shakespeare.

Bullsh*t. It's not the knowledge of Shakespeare that makes the kid employable or ready for college. It's his or her exposure, however cursory, to a wide range of subjects. Spitting out a kid who can only write as though it were a technical manual is not the way to fix things.
2012-12-07 03:21:13 PM  
5 votes:
"In the end, education has to be about more than simply ensuring that kids can get a job. Isn't it supposed to be about making well-rounded citizens?"

NOTHING in our culture encourages creativity. we despise artists, fear hackers and sideline anyone who steps outside the accepted norms. in some cases, that view is changing...but its moving very slowly, if at all.
2012-12-07 05:57:21 PM  
4 votes:

FlyingLizardOfDoom: Catcher in the Rye was a stupid book.


Agreed. Should be replaced by this

upload.wikimedia.org

Most popular book in my high school
2012-12-07 05:49:36 PM  
4 votes:
This was a horrible breakdown of this issue.

The real problem is apparently administrators' reading comprehension. The Core Curriculum's reading recommendations for informational texts is meant to apply when looking at the whole curriculum, not just English classrooms. In other words, you're supposed to be reading some essays and biographies and such in classes like Geography, Civics, History, and even Math and the Sciences. And yeah, a little in English, but it's only myopic administrators who think that reading only happens in one classroom that are saying they'll have to drastically cut fiction to meet the nonfiction standards.
2012-12-07 04:26:54 PM  
4 votes:

Darth_Lukecash: This is particularly sad. It is imagination that leads to innovation. Innovation leads to efficiency, progress and improvement.


Did someone say efficiency and progress?

Efficiency and progress is ours once more
Now that we have the Neutron bomb
It's nice and quick and clean and gets things done
Away with excess enemy
But no less value to property
No sense in war but perfect sense at home:

The sun beams down on a brand new day
No more welfare tax to pay
Unsightly slums gone up in flashing light
Jobless millions whisked away
At last we have more room to play
All systems go to kill the poor tonight
...

Gonna
Kill kill kill kill Kill the poor:Tonight

The perfect GOP anthem...especially since they don't understand snark

Wait...don't tell me they took Dead Kennedys out of the schools, too!
2012-12-07 02:48:51 PM  
4 votes:

dickfreckle: Supporters of the directive argue that it will help pupils to develop the ability to write concisely and factually, which will be more useful in the workplace than a knowledge of Shakespeare.

Bullsh*t. It's not the knowledge of Shakespeare that makes the kid employable or ready for college. It's his or her exposure, however cursory, to a wide range of subjects. Spitting out a kid who can only write as though it were a technical manual is not the way to fix things.


But, soft! what heat through yonder window escapes?
It is R-8, to protect Juliet from the sun.
2012-12-07 06:09:14 PM  
3 votes:
Idiotic article.

A couple of books were removed from the literature lists (a decision I don't agree with), and a couple of articles were added to a list of reading in "Informational texts: science, mathematics, and technical subjects".
This does NOT mean that the first were replaced by the second.
2012-12-07 06:00:55 PM  
3 votes:
No, no, no, no, no. Professional writing is important. (There's a reason I'm majoring in it.) Knowing how to read and write informational texts is a good thing, and will serve students very well. But such writing is not necessarily easy, and designing an effective professional document takes thought and creativity. Why in the world would schools want to cut down on the practice of critical thinking and the arts? It's not like students currently lack nonfiction textbooks...

/headdesk
2012-12-07 04:24:21 PM  
3 votes:

Darth_Lukecash: This is particularly sad. It is imagination that leads to innovation. Innovation leads to efficiency, progress and improvement.


yes, but then innovation threatens wall street and imagination leads one to question faith....so there's that.
2012-12-07 04:20:32 PM  
3 votes:
This is particularly sad. It is imagination that leads to innovation. Innovation leads to efficiency, progress and improvement.
2012-12-07 03:27:55 PM  
3 votes:
So weird.

Growing up, my parents taught me applicable labor-based skills. How to do basic electronics. How to service a car engine. How to sew. How to build things. How to fix things. And in school I learned literature and science and math and history.

Today my parents would be making me read The Red Badge of Courage at home and at school I'd be learning how to gap a spark plug.
2012-12-07 02:37:06 PM  
3 votes:
All you people bagging on the Catcher in the Rye are a bunch of PHONIES!
2012-12-07 02:35:30 PM  
3 votes:
I hate people.
2012-12-07 02:02:36 PM  
3 votes:
Catcher in the Rye was a stupid book.
2012-12-07 08:14:45 PM  
2 votes:
Okay, I know from my 20 years working as a teacher that this is futile to discuss, and I know from my two years of Fark that no one will read this, but I'm on my third fourth beer, so here goes.

The primary goal of publically funded education is to prepare citizens to be useful, productive members of that public.

So, what does this mean?

I was taught that a productive member of a public needs to know enough about the world to vote, to have an opinion based on more than emotional response. Therefore, a "well-rounded" education covered enough philosophy and history and so on to allow me to think, at least a bit, for myself. The goal, and I felt this throughout my K-12 schooling, was to make me something other than an automaton who voted for someone before they spouted phrases I liked ("I feel your pain") or for something just because it had a pretty name (e.g., The Patriot Act).

Other people (including those of my "generation," I'm sure) doubtlessly got other explanations for what it means to be a "useful, productive member of the public." But it was my impression that, ultimately, the idea was to make everyone a valuable citizen.

Right now, it would seem the definition of "valuable citizen" is "someone who can get a job."

I have no idea if this is a good or bad thing. I strongly distrust anyone right now who claims they know if this is a good or bad thing.

It does reflect, however, that we live in a global economy, where having an unemployable workforce weakens us. It also reflects that we are in a recession, though no longer the Great Recession, where unemployment impacts so many other economic issues.

Moreover, and this is where my personal opinion is going to flop over everything, it reflects a growing schism between a "classical" education and a "practical" or vocational education.

If I could wish one thing for America's educational system, it would be that vocational training would lose its taint as "stupid people's" education. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, "stupid" about learning a trade. We are in desperate need of skilled laborers, and yet we scorn them. We think of them as the "great unwashed."

Why? What good is someone who can quote poetry but cannot produce anything of use?

However, what good is a university education if it cannot produce graduates who can think of life in poetic terms? Do we really want the "great thinkers" of our time to be raised on nothing but practical literature?

We have before us now a generation (I hate the term, but what else can I use?) of people who went to college to get a "better job." They weren't just told that a BA/BS would give them a better life, they were PROMISED it would do so. Moreover, a "better life" was specifically defined as a "better job."

But there just aren't that many "better jobs" to go around. The pyramid narrows at the top. We need more workers than we do managers, and that is never, ever going to change.

So what we have now is a workforce that has been told that being an actual worker is being "stupid" and "uneducated." And when someone with an education who thinks they're smart goes looking for a job, they find only employment for stupid, uneducated people, if they can find any work at all.

And don't forget that many a person with a college degree have applied for a practical job and been turned down for being "overqualified."

The best response to this problem, IMO, is to realize that not everyone needs to study Shakespeare and many people would do much better and be much happier learning a trade (without being labeled "one of those people").

What we see in this article is a somewhat clumsy attempt (but aren't all initial attempts clumsy?) to address this gap between a classical and a practical education. The main reason it's so clumsy, however, is that Americans hate the idea of elitism and refuse to separate children during their primary/secondary education. Since the "elite" ideals of Shakespeare and Modern Lit (by which I mean Catcher in the Rye/The Bell Jar/As I Lay Dying, etc.) don't produce good worker bees, the idea here is that everyone must go to the bottom rung.

(Harrison Bergeron? Anyone? Beuller?)

God forbid we should allow high school students choices, options to follow philosophy or plumbing, law or auto mechanics.

It's a challenge America has set for itself that I fear cannot be resolved. We want to provide the best education we can for our students (provided our taxes stay low), but we don't want to individualize that education, and thus limit students' choices. In the end, the education we provide is bad, and they have no choices at all beyond what they carve out for themselves.
2012-12-07 06:21:03 PM  
2 votes:

Klippoklondike: Somacandra: Dogberry: naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?

Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."

I went to DOE's RTTT website and searched for "Recommended Insulation Levels." Nothing relevant. Searched for "Invasive Plant Inventory." A hit on learning about ecological concepts in 5th grade which is entirely reasonable. If you have some more evidence, please share. This is on Drudge Report too so I'm halfway assuming its Bullshiat to begin with.

There are articles by the Washington Post and the NY Times about it as well. So, looks real to me.

Link


And the author of that piece had to issue a correction because they initially wrote it claiming that the standards applied just to English, when they really apply to reading across all classes.

This is about more reading overall, not less fiction in English class. You would add in the extra nonfiction in other classes, we're not talking about dry technical documents- we're talking a book about A Brief History of Time assigned in Physics, we're talking about Bringing Down the House (the book about the MIT blackjack team) in math. We're talking John Adams in Civics. Good, well written, interesting books that just happen to be about things that actually happened.
2012-12-07 06:00:47 PM  
2 votes:

Weaver95: "In the end, education has to be about more than simply ensuring that kids can get a job. Isn't it supposed to be about making well-rounded citizens?"

NOTHING in our culture encourages creativity. we despise artists, fear hackers and sideline anyone who steps outside the accepted norms. in some cases, that view is changing...but its moving very slowly, if at all.


Sadly true. At the same time we claim to embrace imagination and creativity and all that, anything genuinely imaginative and creative is viewed with deepest suspicion. Anyone who got harassed as a child for reading "The Hobbit" knows that all too well.

"Catcher in the Rye" needs to go, although I don't think technical manuals are a good replacement.
2012-12-07 05:54:05 PM  
2 votes:
Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy.
2012-12-07 05:52:11 PM  
2 votes:
upload.wikimedia.org

I double-checked that this wasn't from The Onion. Nope, it seems legit.

FTFA: Supporters of the directive argue that it will help pupils to develop the ability to write concisely and factually, which will be more useful in the workplace than a knowledge of Shakespeare.

I have less of a problem with this point, in relation to Shakespeare specifically (let the Drama kids read him). However, Catcher in the Rye and To Kill A Mockingbird are NOT Shakespeare. And I would NOT agree that replacing them with Invasive Plant Inventory is a good idea.

/I AM SO GLAD THAT I FINISHED PUBLIC SCHOOL BEFORE THE WORLD WENT INSANE
2012-12-07 03:07:44 PM  
2 votes:

Dogberry: naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?

Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."


I went to DOE's RTTT website and searched for "Recommended Insulation Levels." Nothing relevant. Searched for "Invasive Plant Inventory." A hit on learning about ecological concepts in 5th grade which is entirely reasonable. If you have some more evidence, please share. This is on Drudge Report too so I'm halfway assuming its Bullshiat to begin with.
2012-12-07 02:58:53 PM  
2 votes:
Plus, there are no Cliff Notes for "Recommended Levels of Insulation". Joking aside, I think this is a travesty. Love literature or hate it, I cannot see the logic in removing it from the curriculum in favor of teaching kids about insulation so they are "prepared for the working world." We have to inspire kids to succeed. Not insult them by forcing mediocrity upon them.
2012-12-07 02:50:14 PM  
2 votes:
But I will add that there are far better books than Catcher in the Rye....god that was awful.
2012-12-07 02:25:40 PM  
2 votes:
"In the end, education has to be about more than simply ensuring that kids can get a job. Isn't it supposed to be about making well-rounded citizens?"

HAHA!! Yeah, sure, and prisons are for "rehabilitation."
2012-12-07 02:05:06 PM  
2 votes:

dickfreckle: Spitting out a kid who can only write as though it were a technical manual is not the way to fix things.


Um, what do you think the education systems of half the world have been doing for the last 20 years? Those folks may not even know who Shakespeare is, but they did a dang good job gutting our manufacturing and technology industries. 

Perhaps we need to fight back in the same manner to catch up. Then again, either way, Catcher in the Rye was a horrendously stupid book, so it's of no loss to the classroom, imo.

/puts on flame retardant suit
2012-12-07 01:49:54 PM  
2 votes:
Wow, subby wasn't being satirical in the headline.
2012-12-07 01:48:00 PM  
2 votes:

naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?


Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."
2012-12-07 01:40:04 PM  
2 votes:
Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?
2012-12-08 12:05:30 AM  
1 votes:
I see nothing wrong with the concept. It would be even better if they used books to learn skills since they won't always have a teacher and will have to learn on their own. I think 70% is high though. I think 40-50% is more appropriate.

As to why we under-perform educationally, here are my thoughts:

- We have poor math education. We teach kids early short cuts with shoddy logic so they fail to build the appropriate foundations for more difficult math. We also spend more time teaching procedure rather than understanding of math concepts.

- We have poor logic education over all, and that encompasses math, science, and the informational writing skills needed for both. Kids have to write science papers in school if they're going to get good at this. They also have to be able to read papers and learn from them.

- We teach scientific method all wrong. A hypothesis is supposed to be an informed guess -- but we teach kids to make an uninformed guess. They don't even know what an informed guess is. They aren't given the results of other times this experiment was run, or given texts to read that might allow them to infer the outcome of the experiment. If they aren't doing this, their science miseducation is perhaps more damaging to science than ignorance.

- Kids need to learn not just how to do research, but how to discern a credible source from a questionable one. This is an area in which a large percentage of adults are deficient.

- We waste lots of precious class time teaching kids history-based fairy tales, many of which were introduced as a form of propaganda during the Red Scare. The children are being fed negative information -- information that leaves them more ignorant than if they'd never heard it. And then we go on to teach a slightly less bs version of history in high school, and then again with even less bs in college. That's a lot of time we're wasting.
2012-12-07 10:02:07 PM  
1 votes:

Ishidan: Well, it seems I've triggered a real dogpiling on James F. Campbell.
Fun as it is, I think I'll go get dinner now.

I'll be sure to ask the employed people that I meet while doing so--like the cook, the waiter, the bartender, and the guy driving the reefer truck bringing in the supplies--how they got their jobs.

I'll bet not a single one will say "They were impressed by my knowledge of classical American literature".


Yeah, it's not like you can learn anything from it, right?

Dipshiat.
2012-12-07 09:45:52 PM  
1 votes:

Jixa: My eldest is in 9th grade this year and his reading list for English class is pathetic. "The Hunger Games" is the required reading for his first semester. The farking Hunger Games!? The rest of the list is pretty pathetic. They're going to read excerpts, excerpts of Homer's Odyssey! No Grapes of Wrath, no Catcher in the Rye, no To Kill a Mockingbird, no Steinbeck, no Edgar Allen Poe, no Dickens. They are, at least reading "Romeo and Juliet". I guess it's still a staple of 9th grade English. I foresee a future of uneducated, illiterate boobs.

/I feel old now
//my lawn, etc.


First off as a series I'll say that the hunger games was a great set of books and there are a lot of things in there that you can teach to. Just because it's new and popular doesn't, on its own, make it bad. And if it bothers you so much that your kids aren't reading To Kill a Mockingbird well then as a parent why don't you read it with them.
Isn't that what Aticus did with Scout?
2012-12-07 09:43:17 PM  
1 votes:

Kevin72: I truly loved Catcher in the Rye. But that was 41 years ago. Since FARK is so widely criticizing Hemingway, I will accept criticism of CITR, but only if it was from someone who read CITR in high school. If you read it at college age, duh no wonder you hated it.

That said, the real stinkers are The Crucible and the Great Gatsby.

Also, To Kill a Mockingbird is the greatest and should be read.


I'd suggest The Tin Drum, but that might cause people in other circles to get their panties in a bunch.
2012-12-07 09:40:37 PM  
1 votes:
I truly loved Catcher in the Rye. But that was 41 years ago. Since FARK is so widely criticizing Hemingway, I will accept criticism of CITR, but only if it was from someone who read CITR in high school. If you read it at college age, duh no wonder you hated it.

That said, the real stinkers are The Crucible and the Great Gatsby.

Also, To Kill a Mockingbird is the greatest and should be read.
2012-12-07 08:41:42 PM  
1 votes:
gimmechocolate


I'm generally a dick here, mostly posting out of amusement or annoyance. And I almost never read long posts such as yours, but I found your post to be one of the more thoughtful and eloquent things I have read here. Cheers to you.

/tilts Newcastle
2012-12-07 07:43:14 PM  
1 votes:

Jixa: My eldest is in 9th grade this year and his reading list for English class is pathetic. "The Hunger Games" is the required reading for his first semester. The farking Hunger Games!? The rest of the list is pretty pathetic. They're going to read excerpts, excerpts of Homer's Odyssey! No Grapes of Wrath, no Catcher in the Rye, no To Kill a Mockingbird, no Steinbeck, no Edgar Allen Poe, no Dickens. They are, at least reading "Romeo and Juliet". I guess it's still a staple of 9th grade English. I foresee a future of uneducated, illiterate boobs.

/I feel old now
//my lawn, etc.


Yes, reminds me of Mr. Holland's Opus and his rant about using everything from Beethoven to Rock n Roll. I don't care if they use Shakespeare or Harry Potter or some newer young adult fiction. Get them hooked on reading, then introduce the classical stuff.
2012-12-07 07:35:45 PM  
1 votes:
My eldest is in 9th grade this year and his reading list for English class is pathetic. "The Hunger Games" is the required reading for his first semester. The farking Hunger Games!? The rest of the list is pretty pathetic. They're going to read excerpts, excerpts of Homer's Odyssey! No Grapes of Wrath, no Catcher in the Rye, no To Kill a Mockingbird, no Steinbeck, no Edgar Allen Poe, no Dickens. They are, at least reading "Romeo and Juliet". I guess it's still a staple of 9th grade English. I foresee a future of uneducated, illiterate boobs.

/I feel old now
//my lawn, etc.
2012-12-07 07:33:07 PM  
1 votes:
I'm enjoying that the people who are upset keep mentioning critical thinking.

So, you're telling me you learned critical thinking from reading fiction, but you took the article at face value, maybe only read the headline, and definitely didn't factcheck anything? Does that sound about right?
2012-12-07 06:57:53 PM  
1 votes:
"How to Turn Critical Thinkers in to Welfare Recipients"

Uhh... elect a community organizer president of the united states -- twice? Did I win an internet?
2012-12-07 06:54:06 PM  
1 votes:

Ishidan: Only so many hours in the day, man. Do either one all day and create either little artists or little laborers, or split your time and create people who are perfectly useless because they can only half-think or half-work.


False Dichotomy.
2012-12-07 06:53:47 PM  
1 votes:
20 years from now, the curriculum will look like this..


Lesson 1
The answer to question number 1 is A

Lesson 2
The answer to question number 2 is C

Lesson 3
The answer to question number 3 is D

etc, etc, etc,....
2012-12-07 06:53:02 PM  
1 votes:
Is it any wonder that the monkey's confused?
He said "Mama, Mama, the presiden'ts a fool.
Why do I have to keep reading these technical manuals?"
And the joint chiefs of staff and the brokers on Wall Street said
"Don't make us laugh, you're a smart kid
Time is linear, memory's a stranger, history is for fools,
Man is a tool in the hands of the Great God Almighty."
And they gave him command
of a nuclear submarine
and sent him back
in search of the Garden of Eden.

/Roger Waters
2012-12-07 06:41:32 PM  
1 votes:

Skirl Hutsenreiter: Summercat: Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.

I don't know why anyone uses that piece of crap. Prejudiced me against Hemingway for years. After some more exposure, now I actually quite like Hemingway's short fiction. Still haven't found a novel of his that I'm really a fan of.

\I don't know why teachers seem surprised when modern children don't relate to postwar literature.


Hemingway wrote novels like he talked. Well, he was a raging cokehead who drank like a fish, so you can understand why they get so rambling and annoying in a hurry.

/When I want that, I go party with the art crowd in town.
2012-12-07 06:38:49 PM  
1 votes:
You think teens are rebellious little farks now. Wait until they figure out that schools are trying to mold them into complacent little worker drones.

See, this is what I hate about government departments these days. Why does it have to be either/or? Liberal arts, or trade school stuff? Why can't kids be taught both?
2012-12-07 06:37:31 PM  
1 votes:

Skirl Hutsenreiter: This was a horrible breakdown of this issue.

The real problem is apparently administrators' reading comprehension. The Core Curriculum's reading recommendations for informational texts is meant to apply when looking at the whole curriculum, not just English classrooms. In other words, you're supposed to be reading some essays and biographies and such in classes like Geography, Civics, History, and even Math and the Sciences. And yeah, a little in English, but it's only myopic administrators who think that reading only happens in one classroom that are saying they'll have to drastically cut fiction to meet the nonfiction standards.


I had a feeling it had to be something like this, and I'm not at all surprised the Telegraph got it wrong.
2012-12-07 06:32:03 PM  
1 votes:
American Schools: preparing your children for the best jobs of 1974 since 1980.
2012-12-07 06:27:38 PM  
1 votes:

Skirl Hutsenreiter: tomasso

There's some examples from the actual Common Core standards here.

It's still got some classic classroom fiction through high school, like Canterbury Tales, Jane Eyre, The Great Gatsby, etc. I would've like reading the History and Math and Science nonfiction, and even the English nonfiction looks good. It's got Walden, but also things like "Politics and the English Language" by Orwell.


This looks like a fantastic curriculum that would be the basis of an excellent education from K-12. Supplement with textbooks and all subjects are covered.
2012-12-07 06:27:08 PM  
1 votes:
I love pissing off the FARK Pedant squad. You have an extraneous m added into someone's name, and rather than it being a mistake, you're a illiterate who hasn't read a book, or has no right to criticize literary mind anesthesia.

www.pedanticsociety.com
2012-12-07 06:23:25 PM  
1 votes:

Summercat: Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.


I don't know why anyone uses that piece of crap. Prejudiced me against Hemingway for years. After some more exposure, now I actually quite like Hemingway's short fiction. Still haven't found a novel of his that I'm really a fan of.

\I don't know why teachers seem surprised when modern children don't relate to postwar literature.
2012-12-07 06:15:58 PM  
1 votes:
Ah, the Common Core State Standards.

A private group with the goal of a unified national curriculum

From their FAQ

Q: What is the role of the federal government in standards implementation?

A: The federal government has had no role in the development of the common core state standards and will not have a role in their implementation.

So, stop blaming the Feds, unless you really want them to set a national curriculum (which might not be too bad, unless you are worried someone would implement creationism as something to be taught).
2012-12-07 06:14:52 PM  
1 votes:

willyfreddy: I have less of a problem with this point, in relation to Shakespeare specifically (let the Drama kids read him). However, Catcher in the Rye and To Kill A Mockingbird are NOT Shakespeare. And I would NOT agree that replacing them with Invasive Plant Inventory is a good idea.


Except Shakespeare still features prominently, and no one who writes these guidelines is suggesting replacing To Kill a Mockingbird (still explicitly recommended in grades 9-10 English classrooms) with the Invasive Plant Inventory (recommended for grades 6-8 SCIENCE classrooms).
2012-12-07 06:12:39 PM  
1 votes:

James F. Campbell: Dr.Zom: Just what we need, more morons.

The only thing that matters is that little citizens grow up to be productive, content taxpayers who don't think too hard about the world around them.


obey citizen
2012-12-07 06:11:11 PM  
1 votes:
Well thank goodness we've finally resolved a minor controversy from several decades ago.
2012-12-07 06:10:10 PM  
1 votes:

Dr.Zom: Just what we need, more morons.


The only thing that matters is that little citizens grow up to be productive, content taxpayers who don't think too hard about the world around them.
2012-12-07 06:07:58 PM  
1 votes:
Just what we need, more morons.
2012-12-07 06:07:29 PM  
1 votes:
Oh, and the recommendations explicitly list To Kill a Mockingbird as an exemplar text for grades 9-10. The only surprising thing there is that my school did it in 7th grade, so I never thought of it as a text you'd assign right after finishing up the Odyssey.
2012-12-07 06:04:22 PM  
1 votes:
tomasso

There's some examples from the actual Common Core standards here.

It's still got some classic classroom fiction through high school, like Canterbury Tales, Jane Eyre, The Great Gatsby, etc. I would've like reading the History and Math and Science nonfiction, and even the English nonfiction looks good. It's got Walden, but also things like "Politics and the English Language" by Orwell.
2012-12-07 06:01:32 PM  
1 votes:
Well, to be fair, reading Catcher in the Rye is like listening to the know it all anarchist goth kid we all knew in high school who liked to tell everyone that no one really knew what pain was except for him.

The only books more mind numbingly painful to read are anything written by Hemmingway, and Atlas Shrugged.
2012-12-07 06:01:01 PM  
1 votes:
I don't see a problem with this. Most people are actually fairly dumb. There is no reason for them to read anything but technical manuals and for that matter to write anything. It just makes for painful reading, that's all. We should separate kids young and early around 8th grade and basically have a 3 tier system: 3 year trade school, 5 year technical school and 4 year college prep school. That's how it was when I grew up in Europe and worked really well. 80% percent of the population has the following goals in life: work 8 hours a day for a decent wage, eat, fark, raise another generation of low IQ children.
2012-12-07 05:57:56 PM  
1 votes:

Somacandra: Dogberry: naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?

Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."

I went to DOE's RTTT website and searched for "Recommended Insulation Levels." Nothing relevant. Searched for "Invasive Plant Inventory." A hit on learning about ecological concepts in 5th grade which is entirely reasonable. If you have some more evidence, please share. This is on Drudge Report too so I'm halfway assuming its Bullshiat to begin with.


Whenever I see a "news of America" sort of article like this on a UK site, I tend to assume it's horseshiat. Since the small army of US teachers and librarians I know on Twitter haven't gone apeshiat about it, I tend to assume it's even horseshiattier.
2012-12-07 05:57:55 PM  
1 votes:
You're doing it wrong.


Very, very wrong.

This is bad, and they should feel bad.
2012-12-07 05:57:35 PM  
1 votes:
So it goes.
2012-12-07 05:55:21 PM  
1 votes:
Not all kids needs to read Catcher in the Rye and the like. Have some gifted classes, or an after school book club for the kids who care, where the books are available and it'll be fine.
2012-12-07 05:52:44 PM  
1 votes:
They should replace it with Scrotie McBoogerballs.
2012-12-07 05:49:59 PM  
1 votes:

dickfreckle: Grand_Moff_Joseph: Then again, either way, Catcher in the Rye was a horrendously stupid book, so it's of no loss to the classroom, imo.

/puts on flame retardant suit

You won't need that suit around me. I despise that book. It's not the worst thing I've ever read, but it's clearly the one with the most unearned importance attached to it. On the Road is in that league as well.


Walden Two, by B.F. Skinner. Easily the worst book I've ever read, but then I've never tried Twilight.
2012-12-07 05:45:54 PM  
1 votes:
What u expect... Mericans can't read!
2012-12-07 04:48:47 PM  
1 votes:

Grand_Moff_Joseph: Then again, either way, Catcher in the Rye was a horrendously stupid book, so it's of no loss to the classroom, imo.

/puts on flame retardant suit


You won't need that suit around me. I despise that book. It's not the worst thing I've ever read, but it's clearly the one with the most unearned importance attached to it. On the Road is in that league as well.
2012-12-07 03:52:54 PM  
1 votes:

Diogenes: So weird.

Growing up, my parents taught me applicable labor-based skills. How to do basic electronics. How to service a car engine. How to sew. How to build things. How to fix things. And in school I learned literature and science and math and history.

Today my parents would be making me read The Red Badge of Courage at home and at school I'd be learning how to gap a spark plug.


When you put it that way it makes it even stranger, but it's so true.
2012-12-07 03:26:17 PM  
1 votes:
I say a new petition to the White House is in order.
 
Replace this new book list with Ender's Game, and The Hobbit, and The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo.
2012-12-07 03:20:46 PM  
1 votes:
Atticus wept.
2012-12-07 03:07:30 PM  
1 votes:
I thought this was satire as well. What the hell are people thinking? How could this possibly help kids in any way at all?
2012-12-07 02:32:36 PM  
1 votes:

naughtyrev: They think this will help make kids prepared for college?


Even if true, I fail to see how that would help.
2012-12-07 02:08:50 PM  
1 votes:

Grand_Moff_Joseph: dickfreckle: Spitting out a kid who can only write as though it were a technical manual is not the way to fix things.

Um, what do you think the education systems of half the world have been doing for the last 20 years? Those folks may not even know who Shakespeare is, but they did a dang good job gutting our manufacturing and technology industries. 

Perhaps we need to fight back in the same manner to catch up. Then again, either way, Catcher in the Rye was a horrendously stupid book, so it's of no loss to the classroom, imo.

/puts on flame retardant suit


Our manufacturing and tech industries weren't gutted because we were teaching Shakespeare and other countries weren't.
 
Displayed 73 of 73 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
Advertisement
On Twitter





In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report