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(Telegraph)   "Catcher in the Rye", and "To Kill a Mockingbird" to be replaced in US classrooms by texts such as "Recommended Levels of Insulation," "Invasive Plant Inventory," and "How to Turn Critical Thinkers in to Welfare Recipients"   (telegraph.co.uk) divider line 352
    More: Asinine, Catcher in the Rye, Harper Lee, classic book, J.D. Salinger, National Governors Association, curriculum, standards-based education reform, critical thinking  
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9344 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Dec 2012 at 5:43 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-07 05:57:21 PM

FlyingLizardOfDoom: Catcher in the Rye was a stupid book.


Agreed. Should be replaced by this

upload.wikimedia.org

Most popular book in my high school
 
2012-12-07 05:57:35 PM
So it goes.
 
2012-12-07 05:57:55 PM
You're doing it wrong.


Very, very wrong.

This is bad, and they should feel bad.
 
2012-12-07 05:57:56 PM

Somacandra: Dogberry: naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?

Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."

I went to DOE's RTTT website and searched for "Recommended Insulation Levels." Nothing relevant. Searched for "Invasive Plant Inventory." A hit on learning about ecological concepts in 5th grade which is entirely reasonable. If you have some more evidence, please share. This is on Drudge Report too so I'm halfway assuming its Bullshiat to begin with.


Whenever I see a "news of America" sort of article like this on a UK site, I tend to assume it's horseshiat. Since the small army of US teachers and librarians I know on Twitter haven't gone apeshiat about it, I tend to assume it's even horseshiattier.
 
2012-12-07 05:58:06 PM

TheHumanCannonball: Not all kids needs to read Catcher in the Rye and the like. Have some gifted classes, or an after school book club for the kids who care, where the books are available and it'll be fine.


The only people who deserve to read Catcher in the Rye are sitting on death row and don't need an 8th amendment violation of their civil rights.
 
2012-12-07 05:58:19 PM
To title poorly?
 
2012-12-07 05:59:36 PM

FlyingLizardOfDoom: Catcher in the Rye was a stupid book.


No, U
 
2012-12-07 06:00:47 PM

Weaver95: "In the end, education has to be about more than simply ensuring that kids can get a job. Isn't it supposed to be about making well-rounded citizens?"

NOTHING in our culture encourages creativity. we despise artists, fear hackers and sideline anyone who steps outside the accepted norms. in some cases, that view is changing...but its moving very slowly, if at all.


Sadly true. At the same time we claim to embrace imagination and creativity and all that, anything genuinely imaginative and creative is viewed with deepest suspicion. Anyone who got harassed as a child for reading "The Hobbit" knows that all too well.

"Catcher in the Rye" needs to go, although I don't think technical manuals are a good replacement.
 
2012-12-07 06:00:55 PM
No, no, no, no, no. Professional writing is important. (There's a reason I'm majoring in it.) Knowing how to read and write informational texts is a good thing, and will serve students very well. But such writing is not necessarily easy, and designing an effective professional document takes thought and creativity. Why in the world would schools want to cut down on the practice of critical thinking and the arts? It's not like students currently lack nonfiction textbooks...

/headdesk
 
2012-12-07 06:01:01 PM
I don't see a problem with this. Most people are actually fairly dumb. There is no reason for them to read anything but technical manuals and for that matter to write anything. It just makes for painful reading, that's all. We should separate kids young and early around 8th grade and basically have a 3 tier system: 3 year trade school, 5 year technical school and 4 year college prep school. That's how it was when I grew up in Europe and worked really well. 80% percent of the population has the following goals in life: work 8 hours a day for a decent wage, eat, fark, raise another generation of low IQ children.
 
2012-12-07 06:01:32 PM
Well, to be fair, reading Catcher in the Rye is like listening to the know it all anarchist goth kid we all knew in high school who liked to tell everyone that no one really knew what pain was except for him.

The only books more mind numbingly painful to read are anything written by Hemmingway, and Atlas Shrugged.
 
2012-12-07 06:02:12 PM
media.247sports.com

/oblig
 
2012-12-07 06:02:37 PM
Public school for the masses.

The top 2% or ruling class will still be there to take care of you.
 
2012-12-07 06:03:25 PM
What if.parents would actually take part in their child's development and give them these books to read themselves, leaving school as the basic part of their education?

/Crazy, I know.
 
2012-12-07 06:04:22 PM
tomasso

There's some examples from the actual Common Core standards here.

It's still got some classic classroom fiction through high school, like Canterbury Tales, Jane Eyre, The Great Gatsby, etc. I would've like reading the History and Math and Science nonfiction, and even the English nonfiction looks good. It's got Walden, but also things like "Politics and the English Language" by Orwell.
 
2012-12-07 06:07:29 PM
Oh, and the recommendations explicitly list To Kill a Mockingbird as an exemplar text for grades 9-10. The only surprising thing there is that my school did it in 7th grade, so I never thought of it as a text you'd assign right after finishing up the Odyssey.
 
2012-12-07 06:07:58 PM
Just what we need, more morons.
 
2012-12-07 06:09:14 PM
Idiotic article.

A couple of books were removed from the literature lists (a decision I don't agree with), and a couple of articles were added to a list of reading in "Informational texts: science, mathematics, and technical subjects".
This does NOT mean that the first were replaced by the second.
 
2012-12-07 06:10:10 PM

Dr.Zom: Just what we need, more morons.


The only thing that matters is that little citizens grow up to be productive, content taxpayers who don't think too hard about the world around them.
 
2012-12-07 06:11:11 PM
Well thank goodness we've finally resolved a minor controversy from several decades ago.
 
2012-12-07 06:12:39 PM

James F. Campbell: Dr.Zom: Just what we need, more morons.

The only thing that matters is that little citizens grow up to be productive, content taxpayers who don't think too hard about the world around them.


obey citizen
 
2012-12-07 06:13:23 PM

Rufus Lee King: Cather in Rye was s stoopit book!

Salinger was no can write poo poo head!

I see that FARK is getting the jump on this unfortunate trend.


Frankly I think it says a lot more about a person if they actually liked or could relate to Catcher in the Rye than it did about the vast majority of people who didn't like it.
 
2012-12-07 06:13:34 PM
Thanks, U.S. You keep giving me great reasons to homeschool my kids.

/ I know, it's off the derp-end, but ffs I don't want my kids in these places, it was bad enough for me
 
2012-12-07 06:14:52 PM

willyfreddy: I have less of a problem with this point, in relation to Shakespeare specifically (let the Drama kids read him). However, Catcher in the Rye and To Kill A Mockingbird are NOT Shakespeare. And I would NOT agree that replacing them with Invasive Plant Inventory is a good idea.


Except Shakespeare still features prominently, and no one who writes these guidelines is suggesting replacing To Kill a Mockingbird (still explicitly recommended in grades 9-10 English classrooms) with the Invasive Plant Inventory (recommended for grades 6-8 SCIENCE classrooms).
 
2012-12-07 06:15:58 PM
Ah, the Common Core State Standards.

A private group with the goal of a unified national curriculum

From their FAQ

Q: What is the role of the federal government in standards implementation?

A: The federal government has had no role in the development of the common core state standards and will not have a role in their implementation.

So, stop blaming the Feds, unless you really want them to set a national curriculum (which might not be too bad, unless you are worried someone would implement creationism as something to be taught).
 
2012-12-07 06:17:46 PM

BronyMedic: Well, to be fair, reading Catcher in the Rye is like listening to the know it all anarchist goth kid we all knew in high school who liked to tell everyone that no one really knew what pain was except for him.

The only books more mind numbingly painful to read are anything written by Hemmingway, and Atlas Shrugged.


If you can't spell him correctly, I won't take any of your comments about him seriously, for the record.
 
2012-12-07 06:18:48 PM
There are better books than Catcher in the Rye for high school kids to read. There are some really amazing nonfiction books out there and schools spend way too much time reading novels.

Being able to read and understand government reports is an important skill that high schools should cover. I'd rather they use Congressional Research Service reports than EPA ones but it is a start.
 
2012-12-07 06:20:49 PM

BronyMedic:

The only books more mind numbingly painful to read are anything written by Hemmingway, and Atlas Shrugged.


Seriously? You can't spell Hemingway correctly and you confuse a book title with the person who wrote it? Have you actually read a book this year?
 
2012-12-07 06:21:03 PM

Klippoklondike: Somacandra: Dogberry: naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?

Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."

I went to DOE's RTTT website and searched for "Recommended Insulation Levels." Nothing relevant. Searched for "Invasive Plant Inventory." A hit on learning about ecological concepts in 5th grade which is entirely reasonable. If you have some more evidence, please share. This is on Drudge Report too so I'm halfway assuming its Bullshiat to begin with.

There are articles by the Washington Post and the NY Times about it as well. So, looks real to me.

Link


And the author of that piece had to issue a correction because they initially wrote it claiming that the standards applied just to English, when they really apply to reading across all classes.

This is about more reading overall, not less fiction in English class. You would add in the extra nonfiction in other classes, we're not talking about dry technical documents- we're talking a book about A Brief History of Time assigned in Physics, we're talking about Bringing Down the House (the book about the MIT blackjack team) in math. We're talking John Adams in Civics. Good, well written, interesting books that just happen to be about things that actually happened.
 
2012-12-07 06:22:06 PM

James F. Campbell: taxpayers


And lest anyone think, $deity forbid, that I am a teabag derpster, add, "and consumers" to that. My grief is that education should be the process, as one woman in the article says, of creating well-rounded citizens, but corporations and corrupt politicians don't have any interest in creating citizens who think too much; they'd rather treat education as a profit-making enterprise. They've created an entire generation of debt-laden workers by feeding them the lie that they need a college degree, and now they're working on their children.
 
2012-12-07 06:23:14 PM

FlyingLizardOfDoom: Catcher in the Rye was a stupid book.


Agreed, it's a whiny rich kid with problems book.
 
2012-12-07 06:23:17 PM
Relax everyone. I call shenanigans. This will never happen.
 
2012-12-07 06:23:19 PM
Does Bible study count as fiction or non-fiction?

(article is badly trying to create a controversy. Then again I never read anything in math and science classes other than the textbooks. Maybe some books involving historical perspective would have been nice but they would probably be too dumbed down)
 
2012-12-07 06:23:25 PM

Summercat: Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.


I don't know why anyone uses that piece of crap. Prejudiced me against Hemingway for years. After some more exposure, now I actually quite like Hemingway's short fiction. Still haven't found a novel of his that I'm really a fan of.

\I don't know why teachers seem surprised when modern children don't relate to postwar literature.
 
2012-12-07 06:24:48 PM
I didn't read much past the first sentence, "American literature classics are to be replaced by insulation manuals and plant inventories in US classrooms by 2014," because this is obviously bullshiat.
 
2012-12-07 06:25:18 PM

Klippoklondike: There are articles by the Washington Post and the NY Times about it as well. So, looks real to me.

Link


Dogberry: Would a NYT piece help?


No, because the NYT article actually debunks most of the Telegraph/Drudge fearmongering. Did you even read it, or just link it assuming it supported your assertion?
 
2012-12-07 06:26:12 PM

ommitay: Relax everyone. I call shenanigans. This will never happen.


It is shenanigans.

They are not replacing these books, they are adding them.

It's purely fodder for the "OMG Libs are ruining this country" crowd, which, oddly, overlaps quite a bit with the Homeschooler crowd.
 
2012-12-07 06:26:35 PM

Somacandra: Dogberry: naughtyrev: Please tell me this is satire. They think this will help make kids prepared for college?

Not satire. See US Dept of Education's "Race to the Top."

I went to DOE's RTTT website and searched for "Recommended Insulation Levels." Nothing relevant. Searched for "Invasive Plant Inventory." A hit on learning about ecological concepts in 5th grade which is entirely reasonable. If you have some more evidence, please share. This is on Drudge Report too so I'm halfway assuming its Bullshiat to begin with.


Yep. It's yet another anti-science screed most likely from creationists and GW deniers to scare parents into sending their kids to "private" schools, where they'll learn all about art and culture...but only from one small book with a cross on it.
 
2012-12-07 06:26:45 PM

Skirl Hutsenreiter: Summercat: Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.

I don't know why anyone uses that piece of crap. Prejudiced me against Hemingway for years. After some more exposure, now I actually quite like Hemingway's short fiction. Still haven't found a novel of his that I'm really a fan of.

\I don't know why teachers seem surprised when modern children don't relate to postwar literature.


Try his travel pieces and think.
 
2012-12-07 06:27:08 PM
I love pissing off the FARK Pedant squad. You have an extraneous m added into someone's name, and rather than it being a mistake, you're a illiterate who hasn't read a book, or has no right to criticize literary mind anesthesia.

www.pedanticsociety.com
 
2012-12-07 06:27:23 PM
You can spend more time teaching practical physics (insulation and building codes) and natural biology (plant inventories) or you can spend your time reading FICTION.

I'm part of the generation that read both. I'll be damned if I could tell you, ten years later, what good it did me: when writing corporate reports, flowery vocabulary was not an asset, writing like a machine was.
 
2012-12-07 06:27:38 PM

Skirl Hutsenreiter: tomasso

There's some examples from the actual Common Core standards here.

It's still got some classic classroom fiction through high school, like Canterbury Tales, Jane Eyre, The Great Gatsby, etc. I would've like reading the History and Math and Science nonfiction, and even the English nonfiction looks good. It's got Walden, but also things like "Politics and the English Language" by Orwell.


This looks like a fantastic curriculum that would be the basis of an excellent education from K-12. Supplement with textbooks and all subjects are covered.
 
2012-12-07 06:27:48 PM

Summercat: ....wat.

Theyre finally getting rid of catcher i he wry? Nice

Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.

The Old Man and the Sea

is directly responsible for The Young Boy and the C.
 
2012-12-07 06:28:52 PM

Indubitably: Skirl Hutsenreiter: Summercat: Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.

I don't know why anyone uses that piece of crap. Prejudiced me against Hemingway for years. After some more exposure, now I actually quite like Hemingway's short fiction. Still haven't found a novel of his that I'm really a fan of.

\I don't know why teachers seem surprised when modern children don't relate to postwar literature.

Try his travel pieces and think.


"How can I make history come to light for my students? Is it the text? Or is it me? Or both?"

Whenever I hear about a book that didn't work in a class, I hear about a teacher more...
 
2012-12-07 06:29:01 PM

Snarfangel: Summercat: ....wat.

Theyre finally getting rid of catcher i he wry? Nice

Can we get rid of Hemingway too? Old Man and the Sea was... Blesgh.

The Old Man and the Sea is directly responsible for The Young Boy and the C.


See. Books are a gateway drug! One moment you're reading Hemingway, the next moment you're snorting crushed up hydros in the school bathroom. 2 hours later, you're sucking dick outside of the local walmart to get your next fix.
 
2012-12-07 06:29:20 PM
I expected Catcher to be replaced by Less Than Zero by now. But I guess things have only regressed in the world of US Education.
 
2012-12-07 06:29:56 PM

BronyMedic: I love pissing off the FARK Pedant squad. You have an extraneous m added into someone's name, and rather than it being a mistake, you're a illiterate who hasn't read a book, or has no right to criticize literary mind anesthesia.

[www.pedanticsociety.com image 850x244]


Did you see my previous post about overreacting?

You should.
 
2012-12-07 06:30:25 PM

BronyMedic: I love pissing off the FARK Pedant squad. You have an extraneous m added into someone's name, and rather than it being a mistake, you're a illiterate who hasn't read a book, or has no right to criticize literary mind anesthesia.

[www.pedanticsociety.com image 850x244]


There should be a colon after the top line, and a period at the end.
 
2012-12-07 06:31:05 PM

Indubitably: Did you see my previous post about overreacting?

You should.


Aren't you assuming that I'm "ovrreacting", and not further trolling people who seem to think a single grammatical error matters in a non-academic conversation on the internet?

Tisk tisk. Didn't your mother teach you what happens when you assume?
 
2012-12-07 06:31:33 PM
This makes me so sad. There is so much more to language than cut-and-dry informational texts and rote grammar lessons. A "knowledge of Shakespeare" may not apply directly to the workplace but creative thinking skills do. Also, literature is a wonderful way to connect with our culture and history. All this talk over the past couple decades of getting "back to basics" in education ignores the fact that historically, being well-rounded in the arts WAS considered a basic education.
 
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