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(Gizmodo)   Gizmodo's list of the "15 Most Overpriced Gadgets of All Time" manages to only include 3 from Apple   (gizmodo.com) divider line 39
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15218 clicks; posted to Geek » on 05 Dec 2012 at 12:08 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2012-12-05 12:52:43 PM
3 votes:
upload.wikimedia.org

/am I doing this right?
/not sure
2012-12-05 05:48:43 PM
2 votes:

mcreadyblue: How does Windows 8 fit in car analogies?


upload.wikimedia.org
2012-12-05 05:07:26 PM
2 votes:

mcreadyblue: How does Windows 8 fit in car analogies?


images.businessweek.com
2012-12-05 04:24:50 PM
2 votes:

mcreadyblue: How does Windows 8 fit in car analogies?


i48.tinypic.com
2012-12-05 04:19:40 PM
2 votes:

mcreadyblue: How does Windows 8 fit in car analogies?

IOS is a Ferrari and Windows 8 is a '78 Buick?


Apple:
www.travelandleisure.com

Microsoft:
upload.wikimedia.org
2012-12-05 12:49:16 PM
2 votes:
maxcdn.fooyoh.com
2012-12-05 10:56:46 AM
2 votes:

Mugato: 10 grand for a PC? What do you even do with a PC where there's no internet? Write a paper? Get a typewriter.


Oregon Trail is worth the $10,000 grandpa.
2012-12-06 10:30:18 PM
1 votes:

Teufelaffe: Rent Party: I can have a new Mac running about 20 minutes after I decide I want one.

Either you own a replicator or are completely full of shiat.


Rent Party: And why would that be? Because you know so little about technology that you think bolting a PC together makes you smart? Because you've accomplished so little in your life that doing what a 12 year old can do is a measure of accomplishment?

Choice 1: Spend ~$1000 on a computer that you assemble yourself.
Choice 2: Spend $2000 or more on a computer that is functionally identical, that someone else assembles for you, and get your computer possibly an hour or two faster.

Obviously the "smart" choice between the two is to spend more money. After all, everyone knows that spending money is how you show people how smart you are.


But he said his time is valuable. As evidenced by how long he's spent posting on Fark.
2012-12-05 10:51:49 PM
1 votes:
If Windows 8 were a car, the steering wheel, pedals and gear shift would all be replaced by buttons, and they would be in the same place as the buttons for the heat, A/C, stereo and anything else they decided to cram in. Good luck figuring out how to drive, and not crash. Did I mention that the brakes are in a hidden location, and you have to do a complicated gesture to open a panel and get to them?
2012-12-05 07:51:18 PM
1 votes:

Elzar: List is useless without the Neo Geo... $250 per game - oh yeah!


infiniteexplosions.files.wordpress.com

Actual Neo-Geo ad.
2012-12-05 05:51:19 PM
1 votes:

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: mcreadyblue: How does Windows 8 fit in car analogies?

[i48.tinypic.com image 700x525]


No, that's Vista.
2012-12-05 04:43:21 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: Bullseyed: Rent Party: And now you're back to comparing retail outlets with manufacturing. Keep moving that goalpost. I'm sure you'll find a home eventually.

So you think that Oracle manufactures cell phones. That says a lot.

Oh, and is Quallcomm involved in consumer electronics?

And are you still dumb?


Looking for an electronic gadget that Qualcomm sells. Considering they manufacture components, nope, no results found.
2012-12-05 04:41:08 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: Bullseyed: Rent Party: And now you're back to comparing retail outlets with manufacturing. Keep moving that goalpost. I'm sure you'll find a home eventually.

So you think that Oracle manufactures cell phones. That says a lot.

And you think they don't do high margin deals. Isn't that precious?!

You should just stop, because you're getting dumber every post.


"15 Most Overpriced Gadgets of All Time"

Since software isn't a gadget, find a non-software, electronic gadget product Oracle sells at over 30% margin.

http://www.oracle.com/us/products/index.html
2012-12-05 04:38:00 PM
1 votes:

Saiga410: am willing to put out ther that an object is overpriced when its price point is over the WTP point.

And I personally have sold items at over 50% price point and the customer danced away happy. Not overpriced.


So as long as Warren Buffet or Donald Trump is willing to buy 1 item from you, it isn't overpriced?

Nothing is overpriced then! Yay!

Can anyone find a cell phone or electronic gadget that sold zero units?
2012-12-05 04:30:41 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: And now you're back to comparing retail outlets with manufacturing. Keep moving that goalpost. I'm sure you'll find a home eventually.


So you think that Oracle manufactures cell phones. That says a lot.
2012-12-05 04:28:38 PM
1 votes:

Treygreen13: Bullseyed: You clearly don't know the difference between profit/contribution margin and gross/machine margin.

I'm not the one confusing "overpriced" and "profit margin". Didn't you just say this:

Bullseyed: Overpriced is when the cost to create or value of the product is much less than the price it sells at. Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Why did you choose 15%?


Return on working capital. Less than 15% and you can generally make more money investing elsewhere. Each company has a different cost of capital, but 15% is generally a good baseline according to pretty much every business textbook.
2012-12-05 04:22:29 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: Bullseyed: Rent Party: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Err, no.

Err, yes.

You're aware that, by that metric, essentially everything you could find at a store is overpriced. Right?

Most businesses that are operating at a 15% margin, won't be a business for very long.

I have to get special permission for any deal at less than 43%, and my boss frowns upon those.

What Fortune100 company do you work for so we can check out your Form - 10k and Form 10q?

Privately held, sport. Software services standard margin is usually right around 43%, regardless of the size of the company. Businesses that race to the bottom with "We will do it for free!" don't last long.

And you're also confusing a company's total profit margin (net income vs costs) with the margin for a specific product, which is yet another demonstration of your complete ignorance.

But lets go by your metric, anyway, just for the lulz. Oracle pulled down 24% this year. So did Adobe Systems. Microsoft pulled 29%.

Do you need any other demonstrations of your complete ignorance?


Yeah. Amazon and Walmart are very out of business. HP and Dell have only existed for a year or two. The tiny mom and pop shop you work for is not statistically significant.

Link to Oracle's tablet business? Cell phone business? We're waiting.

Microsoft's margin will drop to 5% if they transition into hardware instead of selling only software.
2012-12-05 04:18:31 PM
1 votes:

Treygreen13: downstairs: Every industry is different. Gorcery stores operate at something like less than 1% margin.

Indeed, and they operate on smaller product markups on many things. But according to the definition provided by Bullseyed a potato that cost 10 cents to produce would be "overpriced" at 12 cents.


For period ending September 2012, profit margin by company:
Apple: 22.86%
Amazon: -1.98%
HP: -22.88%
Dell: 3.46%

For period ending June 2012, profit margin by company:
Apple: 25.19%
Amazon: 0.05%
HP: -29.85%
Dell: 5.05%

For period ending March 2012, profit margin by company:
Apple: 29.66%
Amazon: 0.99%
HP: 5.19%
Dell: 4.40%

For period ending December 2011, profit margin by company:
Apple: 28.20%
Amazon: 1.01%
HP: 4.89%
Dell: 4.77%

http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/profit_margin
http://ycharts.com/companies/AMZN/profit_margin
http://ycharts.com/companies/HPQ/profit_margin
http://ycharts.com/companies/DELL/profit_margin

I'm sure they're just all lying on their financial statements and committing felonies, right? Everyone knows your boss doesn't stand less than 43%!!!!

Average for retail (grocers, etc): 1% margin
Average for electronics (other than Apple): 5% margin
Average for Apple: 25% margin

Apple charges roughly 50% margin on hardware and they lose money on their software.
- Report: iTunes costs $1.3 billon per year to run (http://www.tuaw.com/2011/06/13/report-itunes-costs-1-3billon-per-year -to-run/)
2012-12-05 04:11:17 PM
1 votes:
If you think Apple products aren't overpriced you are a serious farking moron and I'd only take economic advice from you if I hated money
2012-12-05 04:08:00 PM
1 votes:

Treygreen13: Bullseyed: For an entirely different economic term. Nice try though. What you just said is tantamount to "the grass is green therefore the sky is not blue".

You're moving the goalposts. Anything marked up more than 15% over cost isn't overpriced by definition. A business's profit margin takes into account everything, not just the price you sell the good for minus the cost. It's entirely possible to mark a product up 200% and lose money doing it.


If you marked it up 200% and lost money, then you didn't assess your operating costs properly. Operating costs are included in pricing, which is why bread and milk go up when the price of gas goes up. They have to ship the product on trucks, so the price is tied in to the cost of gas.

You clearly don't know the difference between profit/contribution margin and gross/machine margin.
2012-12-05 04:05:40 PM
1 votes:

downstairs: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Err, no.

Err, yes.

You're aware that, by that metric, essentially everything you could find at a store is overpriced. Right?

Most businesses that are operating at a 15% margin, won't be a business for very long.

 
Every industry is different.  Gorcery stores operate at something like less than 1% margin.


Electronics are usually around 5%. The hardware is usually between -2% and 1% and the services/software prop up the hardware.
2012-12-05 04:03:16 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Err, no.

Err, yes.

You're aware that, by that metric, essentially everything you could find at a store is overpriced. Right?

Most businesses that are operating at a 15% margin, won't be a business for very long.

I have to get special permission for any deal at less than 43%, and my boss frowns upon those.


What Fortune100 company do you work for so we can check out your Form - 10k and Form 10q?
2012-12-05 03:57:55 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: Bullseyed: Rent Party: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Funny that people still think Apple's products are overpriced. Guess it's easier to use 20 year old stereotypes than to compare prices.

Cost to make an iPhone5 = $325
Selling price of iPhone5 = $700


Derp.

Oops, looks like you forgot to make a point. Derp indeed.

I guess you believe the iPhone5 is 20 years old then.

I guess you don't understand how supply and demand works, nor did you read my comment which specifically mentioned comparing prices.

Comparing prices has nothing to do with being overpriced. Overpriced is when the cost to create or value of the product is much less than the price it sells at. Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

An object is worth what the market will bear to acquire it. You seem to think that something should be priced according to the cost to produce it, rather than the price people will pay to get it.

That is why you will always be poor.

You're confusing worth with willingness to pay.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willingness_to_pay

"In economics, the willingness to pay (WTP) is the maximum amount a person would be willing to pay, sacrifice or exchange in order to receive a good"

That's your free MBA lesson of the day.

You're an idiot. Your Wiki education just gave you "what the market will bear."

But please do keep it up, as I find it amusing. Also, go ahead and break out your 15% margin business plan and let us know how that works for you.


For an entirely different economic term. Nice try though. What you just said is tantamount to "the grass is green therefore the sky is not blue".
2012-12-05 03:55:58 PM
1 votes:

Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Err, no.

Err, yes.

You're aware that, by that metric, essentially everything you could find at a store is overpriced. Right?


http://ycharts.com/companies/BBY/profit_margin

The highest margin Best Buy has reached in the last decade is 6.2%.

http://ycharts.com/companies/AMZN/profit_margin

Amazon hit 13.67% a while back.


Good luck finding anyone besides Apple pulling in 50% margins on electronics.
2012-12-05 03:51:32 PM
1 votes:

MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Funny that people still think Apple's products are overpriced. Guess it's easier to use 20 year old stereotypes than to compare prices.

Cost to make an iPhone5 = $325
Selling price of iPhone5 = $700


Derp.

Oops, looks like you forgot to make a point. Derp indeed.

I guess you believe the iPhone5 is 20 years old then.

I guess you don't understand how supply and demand works, nor did you read my comment which specifically mentioned comparing prices.

Comparing prices has nothing to do with being overpriced. Overpriced is when the cost to create or value of the product is much less than the price it sells at. Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Looks like someone got an F in econ.


How's that theater degree working out for you?
2012-12-05 03:50:45 PM
1 votes:

Rent Party: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Funny that people still think Apple's products are overpriced. Guess it's easier to use 20 year old stereotypes than to compare prices.

Cost to make an iPhone5 = $325
Selling price of iPhone5 = $700


Derp.

Oops, looks like you forgot to make a point. Derp indeed.

I guess you believe the iPhone5 is 20 years old then.

I guess you don't understand how supply and demand works, nor did you read my comment which specifically mentioned comparing prices.

Comparing prices has nothing to do with being overpriced. Overpriced is when the cost to create or value of the product is much less than the price it sells at. Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

An object is worth what the market will bear to acquire it. You seem to think that something should be priced according to the cost to produce it, rather than the price people will pay to get it.

That is why you will always be poor.


You're confusing worth with willingness to pay.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willingness_to_pay

"In economics, the willingness to pay (WTP) is the maximum amount a person would be willing to pay, sacrifice or exchange in order to receive a good"

That's your free MBA lesson of the day.
2012-12-05 03:48:00 PM
1 votes:

Treygreen13: Bullseyed: Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.

Err, no.


Err, yes.
2012-12-05 03:44:09 PM
1 votes:

MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Funny that people still think Apple's products are overpriced. Guess it's easier to use 20 year old stereotypes than to compare prices.

Cost to make an iPhone5 = $325
Selling price of iPhone5 = $700


Derp.

Oops, looks like you forgot to make a point. Derp indeed.

I guess you believe the iPhone5 is 20 years old then.

I guess you don't understand how supply and demand works, nor did you read my comment which specifically mentioned comparing prices.


Comparing prices has nothing to do with being overpriced. Overpriced is when the cost to create or value of the product is much less than the price it sells at. Anything with more than 15% margin is overpriced.
2012-12-05 03:37:33 PM
1 votes:

Gig103: Bullseyed: Amusing that none of the items on there mention margin at all, which is the key factor in determining if something is overpriced.

I would disagree and define overpriced as compared to competitive products in the same market. That's why I vote for the iPad Mini. An iPad4 is $499, but an iPad Mini is $329. Smaller screen, lower resolution screen, slower processor, but 65% the cost of the full size, and 1.65x the cost of the Nexus w/ Android.


As much as I want to say that you disagreeing with the definition of the word does not change the definition of the word... value is a abstract concept. Some people value at the cost of the components, while others value at the willingness to pay. If you ascribe to the first principle, anything with high margin is overpriced. If you ascribe to the second then anything that doesn't sell well is overpriced.
2012-12-05 03:12:57 PM
1 votes:

MrEricSir: Bullseyed: MrEricSir: Funny that people still think Apple's products are overpriced. Guess it's easier to use 20 year old stereotypes than to compare prices.

Cost to make an iPhone5 = $325
Selling price of iPhone5 = $700


Derp.

Oops, looks like you forgot to make a point. Derp indeed.


I guess you believe the iPhone5 is 20 years old then.
2012-12-05 03:00:23 PM
1 votes:

umad: Teufelaffe: According to reviews, it does have less battery life than the iPad, and a worse display, and the Windows app store is anemic compared to the competition.

So...what was incorrect?

The part where it neglected to mention that the short battery life is due to having much better (i.e. more expensive) hardware inside than the iPad. We know you guys only care about how pretty your gadgets are. The rest of us also care about their performance (which includes much more than just battery life).


He also compared Surface + keyboard to plain old iPad without keyboard.
2012-12-05 02:59:16 PM
1 votes:

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: StrangeQ: At its $499 base price, Microsoft's first tablet costs the same as the fourth-generation iPad, the well-established leader in the tablet market. The attractive Surface has a worse screen than the iPad, it lasts 5 hours less on a charge and, at launch time, had only a handful of decent apps for its nascent Windows RT operating system.

However, you may want the Surface because of its heavily-advertised Touch Cover keyboard, a must-have accessory that will set you back an extra $119, even though it costs Microsoft only $16 to manufacture. That's $619 for a new, unproven tablet which trails the $499 market leader in most ways.

I'm surprised the author was able to take Apple's dick out of their mouth long enough to write all of that. Of course they don't include any recent Apple products, isn't Gizmodo just a paid Apple shill at this point?

/and why the fark do we still link to gawker sites to begin with?

And what part of his quoted text do you find inaccurate?


The part where he compares a base model $499 Surface + $100 keyboard to a base model $499 iPad without a keyboard and then says "SEE OVER PRICED SURFACE!!!!" Because you know, that iPad comes with a keyboard, right? Oh it doesn't? You have to buy it!!! The outrage!!!!

It's almost like he was being disingenuous or something.
2012-12-05 02:36:21 PM
1 votes:
At its $499 base price, Microsoft's first tablet costs the same as the fourth-generation iPad, the well-established leader in the tablet market. The attractive Surface has a worse screen than the iPad, it lasts 5 hours less on a charge and, at launch time, had only a handful of decent apps for its nascent Windows RT operating system.

However, you may want the Surface because of its heavily-advertised Touch Cover keyboard, a must-have accessory that will set you back an extra $119, even though it costs Microsoft only $16 to manufacture. That's $619 for a new, unproven tablet which trails the $499 market leader in most ways.


I'm surprised the author was able to take Apple's dick out of their mouth long enough to write all of that. Of course they don't include any recent Apple products, isn't Gizmodo just a paid Apple shill at this point?

/and why the fark do we still link to gawker sites to begin with?
2012-12-05 02:26:57 PM
1 votes:
Anyone who paid $5 for a TF account has not business complaining about "overpriced junk".

/oblig
2012-12-05 02:26:31 PM
1 votes:
they forgot a month of fark----5$
make you holler
2012-12-05 01:39:11 PM
1 votes:

DubyaHater: You guys ever get tired of ragging on Apple around here? Or is the hate towards Apple products a Pavlovian response at this point?
/yeah yeah, Welcome to Fark


I don't hate their products.

I hate their unethical business practices, their inexorably greedy and paranoiac ex-CEO, their modular upgrade concepts designed for the sole purpose of screwing the consumer, their Russian Communist DRM and their blatant and repetitive patent trolling.

I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in this regard...
2012-12-05 01:01:11 PM
1 votes:
accessory that will set you back an extra $119, even though it costs Microsoft only $16 to manufacture
thumbs.anyclip.com
Ah... It's a profit deal. Takes the pressure off.
2012-12-05 11:58:38 AM
1 votes:
And of the three that are on the list, they didn't mention the iPad Mini? It has the RAM, processor, and screen resolution of something two generations old, but manages to cost 1.65x the amount of a better Android tablet.


/Only hating on the iPad Mini, no issues with the full sized iPad
2012-12-05 11:04:06 AM
1 votes:
Every mac ever has been overpriced, especially lately. Way back when, you could actually somewhat justify the price since they built their own hardware in house. Now, they're exactly the same thing as a Windows computer with a shiny aluminum case, their own proprietary OS, and a $500 markup.
 
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