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(Houston Press)   Teacher to 5-year-olds: There is no Santa Claus   (blogs.houstonpress.com) divider line 126
    More: Asinine, Santa Claus, Good Lord, Susan, Polar Express, teachers  
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10697 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Dec 2012 at 7:45 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


Archived thread
2012-12-04 02:23:59 PM
28 votes:

The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.


I'm okay with other people minding their own goddamn business.
2012-12-04 02:38:56 PM
18 votes:

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


That's really the only reason the parents are upset. Because now they have to figure out how to explain why Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are all made up bullshiat but Jesus is totally real.
2012-12-04 02:20:05 PM
16 votes:
I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.
2012-12-04 04:05:31 PM
9 votes:
They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.
2012-12-04 03:56:30 PM
9 votes:
Reality belongs in education. Fantasy belongs in religion.
2012-12-04 03:06:54 PM
9 votes:
Ugh.

Step one: Something is a lie.

Step two: Someone says it's a lie.

Step three: People freak out.

I wish I could bring myself to care.

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


It's not that I'd be okay with it, it's that I genuinely wouldn't care.

exick: Because now they have to figure out how to explain why Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are all made up bullshiat but Jesus is totally real.


Pretty much, yeah.

Maybe we should try not making things up and passing them off as real?

/big fan of fantasy, sci-fi, supernatural etc., with a love of imagination and playing pretend
//but there's a difference I guess
2012-12-04 03:39:04 PM
6 votes:

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...
2012-12-04 02:35:30 PM
6 votes:

The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.


I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?
2012-12-04 08:21:17 PM
5 votes:
waterman99.files.wordpress.com
2012-12-04 04:22:06 PM
5 votes:

naughtyrev: Mmmm....cult-like school detected.


Not really. Waldorf does draw from Anthroposophy and Rudolf Steiner, but it could hardly be called a "cult" movement. It is an educational framework and impulse designed to cultivate children's relationships with nature and cycles of the nature world. Rudolf Steiner was committed to an esoteric form of Christianity, which did make room for other-than-human Persons in the world--but that's really not exceptional for the Christian tradition, or many other religious traditions for that matter. The problem that I have is that the teacher entirely short circuits the very real and very positive experience of moving from exoteric symbolism to esoteric truth. There is a very real spirit of thankfulness, generosity and giving in humanity often associated with the birth of the new light (the Sun) around the winter solstice. Just as the cosmos gives us this light of increase, so too do we donate to each other's increase. Santa Claus is a way for children to experience this at the level they are capable of doing at that age. There will be a time they'll learn on their own that this is a subtle truth to be experienced inwardly for themselves--but wrenching the sacramental usage of Santa Claus out of the world of the youth does not strike me as a healthy move. We teach children lots of things at the level they are capable of appreciating--and then complicate them later on when they are capable of handling complication. In terms of Zen: "Yes there is a Santa Claus for those who do not know what he is. There is no Santa Claus for those who know what he is."

/flame away, won't bother me
2012-12-04 04:17:51 PM
5 votes:
Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices. - Voltaire

Gotta get 'em while they're young. That way, reasons for waging war seem much more believable.
2012-12-04 08:20:40 PM
4 votes:
2.bp.blogspot.com
2012-12-04 07:59:28 PM
4 votes:

ProfessorOhki: /ho-ho-hot


Son of a...
i47.tinypic.com
2012-12-04 03:52:25 PM
4 votes:
I dunno, telling kids Santa is real is kind of a dick move. My mom never wanted to do the Santa thing but my grandmother convinced her to.
2012-12-04 09:28:29 PM
3 votes:
You can be a douchebag all you want to adults, but leave the kids the fark alone.
i.imgur.com
2012-12-04 08:17:38 PM
3 votes:
Oh, ffs.

There is a big difference between letting little kids have their fantasies about Santa Claus and "lying to kids about God." Guess what: Kids figure out, about age six or seven, that Santa is fake. Often before that, but it's fun for a year or two to pretend you believe in Santa because WHAT IF..... Then there's the year or two that they don't believe in Santa but "We have to pretend because little brother or sister still thinks Santa is real" and it makes them feel all grown up to pretend with the adults for the "babies." (When they're all of 7 or 8)

Pretending like you're enlightening a five-year old because YOU in your adult, non-fantastical, non-religious way, have decided children should not live in a world of lies, it's time to put away childish things, conflating god with Santa, or whatever justification you use for killing the joy in a child's life, is not your call. Five is not a good age to be questioning either god or Santa. Five needs a few absolutes like Disney princesses and Santa Claus. And anyway, it's not up to some substitute kindergarten teacher to make that decision for them.

Ask yourself: Are these kids better off now that someone told them there is no Santa? Are they really going to now decide (at age 5) that there is no god and no Jesus and that Cinderella is really just a marketing tool? Do you think that really makes that much difference in a kid's life, except to ruin a holiday for them?
2012-12-04 07:58:48 PM
3 votes:

Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.


Childish beliefs which are taught to them by adults.

Childish adults.
2012-12-04 07:47:39 PM
3 votes:
Well......there isn't. However, 5-year-olds are supposed to believe in supernatural/mythical beings. They're kids. I stopped believing in Santa when I was 7, only because I figured out the handwriting on my gift tags was my mom's, and the handwriting on my sister's gift tags was my dad's. She was 2, so they kept putting "From: Santa" on hers, but after that they'd just put "From: Mom & Dad" on mine. It never bothered them that I found them out; I think they would have been hurt if I'd found the presents early or something.

Now, when a 40-year-old still believes that a jolly fat man who lives at the top of planet will squeeze himself through their chimney once a year.....then we have a problem.
2012-12-04 05:48:19 PM
3 votes:

The My Little Pony Killer: ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...


Jesus F*cking Christ on a raft, it's not a lie. It's a child's story, a fantasy.
Some of you take this "OMFG THERE IS NO SANTA UR LYING TO OUR CHILLDERN" nonsense much too seriously. What you think simply isn't important to their development.
Let children have their fantasies. It really doesn't concern you.
2012-12-04 04:17:28 PM
3 votes:

Shostie: mattharvest: ManateeGag: I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

Why is a school talking about Santa or any other religious figure at all?

According to TFA, the exercise was to draw a picture of something real and a picture of something made up. Some kids started drawing Santa in the "real" column or whatever and the teacher decided that that is the moment when she must step in and correct these misinformed five year old plebes.


What would you prefer? That she let them draw a fictional character in there? If the point was to understand the difference between things that and real and things that aren't, then that's fair.

Now, perhaps she would have been better off saying "I was talking about things, not people" or something, but that's not the point. I wasn't aware parents were entitled to have their kids' illusions protected by teachers.
2012-12-04 04:12:11 PM
3 votes:
This happens every year, and every year it's a big damn story with the teacher catching so much damn flak from idiot parents.

Wanna fix it? Tell your kids "Hey, your teacher misspoke." 5 year olds will believe it.

No, let's fly off the handle and get nationwide attention.
2012-12-04 04:10:46 PM
3 votes:

Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.


Yeah, lie to your kids about Santa and when they turn 6 or so, "Psych! It's all bullshiat!". Great way to raise a kid.
2012-12-04 04:05:44 PM
3 votes:
"IT'S THE EXPRESSION ON THEIR LITTLE FACES I LIKE, said the Hogfather.

"You mean sort of fear and awe and not knowing whether to laugh or cry or wet their pants?"

YES. NOW THAT IS WHAT I CALL BELIEF."
2012-12-05 01:37:20 AM
2 votes:
I'm willing to bet that most of the responses to this story belong to one of two camps: Those with children, defending the Santa Claus tradition, and those without children, who have more of a zero tolerance for what they perceive as dishonesty.

Kids under 5 or so live in a completely different world, one filled with whimsy, where animals and inanimate objects come alive. If you were to completely remove all fictional, fantastic and invented or imagined objects from that world it would be a very different and much uglier place. Just live to be over 50 (and have children) if you need proof of exactly how much pain comes to us all, eventually. No need to unnecessarily hasten the process.

It is interesting though, when I think about it, just how much of that fictional world of early childhood is designed by adults to teach, motivate, and manipulate children. You may not listen to your mother, but when a purple dinosaur tells you something, you can believe it, because adults can't see him (I think -- my kid is grown up so I don't know children's characters post Barney). And Paddington Bear, Poo Bear, and Curious George are all obvious surrogate little children, whose tales of right and wrong are rendered more palatable by the cuddly nature of the perp, and the certainty that the children's character is essentially good, just a victim of misguided choices.
2012-12-04 11:14:27 PM
2 votes:
The final word on the subject:


"DEAR EDITOR: I am 8 years old.
"Some of my little friends say there is no Santa Claus.
"Papa says, 'If you see it in THE SUN it's so.'
"Please tell me the truth; is there a Santa Claus?

"VIRGINIA O'HANLON.
"115 WEST NINETY-FIFTH STREET."

VIRGINIA, your little friends are wrong. They have been affected by the skepticism of a skeptical age. They do not believe except they see. They think that nothing can be which is not comprehensible by their little minds. All minds, Virginia, whether they be men's or children's, are little. In this great universe of ours man is a mere insect, an ant, in his intellect, as compared with the boundless world about him, as measured by the intelligence capable of grasping the whole of truth and knowledge.

Yes, VIRGINIA, there is a Santa Claus. He exists as certainly as love and generosity and devotion exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest beauty and joy. Alas! how dreary would be the world if there were no Santa Claus. It would be as dreary as if there were no VIRGINIAS. There would be no childlike faith then, no poetry, no romance to make tolerable this existence. We should have no enjoyment, except in sense and sight. The eternal light with which childhood fills the world would be extinguished.

Not believe in Santa Claus! You might as well not believe in fairies! You might get your papa to hire men to watch in all the chimneys on Christmas Eve to catch Santa Claus, but even if they did not see Santa Claus coming down, what would that prove? Nobody sees Santa Claus, but that is no sign that there is no Santa Claus. The most real things in the world are those that neither children nor men can see. Did you ever see fairies dancing on the lawn? Of course not, but that's no proof that they are not there. Nobody can conceive or imagine all the wonders there are unseen and unseeable in the world.

You may tear apart the baby's rattle and see what makes the noise inside, but there is a veil covering the unseen world which not the strongest man, nor even the united strength of all the strongest men that ever lived, could tear apart. Only faith, fancy, poetry, love, romance, can push aside that curtain and view and picture the supernal beauty and glory beyond. Is it all real? Ah, VIRGINIA, in all this world there is nothing else real and abiding.

No Santa Claus! Thank God! he lives, and he lives forever. A thousand years from now, Virginia, nay, ten times ten thousand years from now, he will continue to make glad the heart of childhood.
2012-12-04 10:42:37 PM
2 votes:
images.cheezburger.com
2012-12-04 09:45:49 PM
2 votes:

BigNumber12: I suspect that we're going to see more and more studies investigating correlation between the rates of children who were robbed of their childhoods, and people in their 20s and 30s who seem to regress to adolescence and postpone adulthood as long as possible.


Fark should be ground zero for this long term clinical study.
2012-12-04 09:27:03 PM
2 votes:
The teacher is a farking moron. Everyone stops believing in Santa Claus in their own time. I don't remember the exact age I stopped believing, but it was a natural transition from myth to reality.
2012-12-04 09:05:24 PM
2 votes:
BTW, I see a difference between Santa and God. When my sister and I were little, I don't remember my parents threatening us with no Christmas if we didn't behave, because Santa wouldn't come and leave presents under our tree. I do however, remember them telling us that if we didn't pray every night before going to bed, God would be very angry at us and if God was angry at you, bad things would happen. One night I didn't pray before going to bed, I was maybe 8 or 9 years old, and the next morning, I fell down the stairs and broke my ankle. I was convinced that if I had prayed the night before, I wouldn't have a broken ankle. That kind of shiat psychologically scars a child.

Letting a bunch of kids believe in Santa Claus and flying reindeer and the North Pole and elves and Candy Cane Lane and all this other festive stuff that a) kids grow out of and b) only occurs once a year.....what's the farking problem? I don't have kids, but if some 3-year-old asksme if Santa is real, am I supposed to look at him/her and say, "No, your parents are nothing but filthy liars hell-bent on causing you mental pain and anguish, and nothing is real, life is hell"?
2012-12-04 08:45:03 PM
2 votes:

haywatchthis: it's refreashing to hear people tell the truth for a change
to bad tommorrow alot of people will be saying, bless you, after someone sneezes and you will reply, thank you, for no farking reason


When I say "bless you" (not "god bless you") I intend it as a blessing from me meant to convey my hope for the person's good health. I take it the same way from others and that's my farking reason for thanking them.
2012-12-04 08:26:20 PM
2 votes:

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer:

I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


I'm sure okay with it, though it can't be easily proven one way or another -- unlike Santa Claus. And by the way, it's A T H E I S T: if you're going to be against it learn how to spell it.

Any parent who teaches their kids to believe in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny is committing child abuse by damaging the kid's ability to tell true from false. In the medium run you might be doing them a favor by letting them find out the adults around them, especially Mommy and Daddy, are evil two-faced liars, but all they're likely to do after they find that out is spend the rest of their lives trying to believe in SOMETHING: astrology, Jesus, Gaia, Justin Bieber, "democracy," Prince Charming, ANYTHING to fill that empty space where the Santa Claus myth used to be. "I want to believe!" means "Run a con job on me! Reality is too complicated for my vapid little head!"

Teach your children to reason, not to believe, and to understand that there will always be more questions than there are answers. And if you don't know the answer to something admit it and help them learn. At least don't baffle them with bullshiat.


And any teacher who answers yes to "Is Santa Claus real?" should be fired on the spot. You wouldn't want your kid taught that 2+2=5 would you?
2012-12-04 08:22:55 PM
2 votes:

Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME),


well, you're around enough that I have you favorited as: seriously unfunny "Christian" troll
2012-12-04 08:20:56 PM
2 votes:
I have a toddler and will have to figure out what to do about Santa, as I don't want to lie to my child and am an atheist and consider Santa a bit like God-lite. I think we will end up making it a mystery for her to solve on her own as an exercise to sharpen her critical thinking skills. We are going to make it a bit of a right of passage without so much direct lying involved. I've wrestled with this for a while now.

But what the teacher did was different. It is not her place to do this to these families. Santa is a rich tradition that is much valued by many families. Its basically harmless (according to research, I looked into it) and it isn't the teachers place to replace the judgement of the families.

This isn't biology or math or part of the actual curriculum, so it isn't her/his turf at all. Downplay it if you want. Be cagey about it. Do whatever, but ffs don't just go shiatting on family's valued traditions.

This includes telling them there is no god, or there is a god, or anything else that many people feel strongly about.
2012-12-04 08:18:11 PM
2 votes:
So, here's the thing: "Santa" is real. The spirit of giving, friendship, love for family, and decency to your fellow man are real things that should be taught to children from as early an age as possible.

Santa Claus, however, is not real. And teaching children that imaginary things are real is, well, wrong. Sure, kids should have fantasies, but they should also be taught that fantasies are just that: fantasies. Dora the Explorer? Not real. Elmo? A fiction, make-believe. And there's nothing wrong with make-believe, so long as it's distinguished from reality.

We're teaching our kids that Santa is a game a lot of adults like to play, one that makes gift giving at Christmas a slightly different experience. "Santa" might "bring them gifts," but Santa himself does not.
2012-12-04 08:17:37 PM
2 votes:

Coco LaFemme:
Now, when a 40-year-old still believes that a jolly fat man who lives at the top of planet will squeeze himself through their chimney once a year.....then we have a problem.



.... Or that a zombie-deity can hear your unspoken thoughts to grant you wishes; and just to be on the safe you ceremoniously eat his flesh and drink his blood. And you can't forget that of the 6,000 years Earth has been there was once a point where two of EVERY animal on Earth was put on a boat to survive for over a month with a man and his family who later repopulated the planet.

It's a good thing that no one in power in the United States would believe such outlandish fairy tales.
2012-12-04 08:08:27 PM
2 votes:

The My Little Pony Killer: Mija needs to grab a dictionary and look up "atheist" before they jump into any further conversations on the matter.


Methinks it was a poor attempt at trolling. Then again, there are people who actually think that's what atheism is....or that atheists are "angry with god".
2012-12-04 08:03:04 PM
2 votes:

Coco LaFemme: However, 5-year-olds are supposed to believe in supernatural/mythical beings. They're kids.

Lernaeus: Which is totally why you should treat them like idiots, instead of teaching them the basic skills they need to become independent human beings.

There's nothing wrong with stories and make-believe, but acting like it's real is stupid and insulting to children.


Thank you
2012-12-04 08:02:36 PM
2 votes:

Mija: The My Little Pony Killer: ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...

The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.


LOL @ "atheism is a religion"
2012-12-04 08:02:17 PM
2 votes:
I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME), imitating idiot conservatives to vent my frustration about them.

Anyway, my favorite thing to tell members of my church who think that it's adorable to tell kids about Santa is that many people point to their disillusionment about Santa as the first step in their turning away from God, and that by telling them lies about Santa Claus, you demonstrate that you care more about your own amusement than the spiritual destiny of your child.
2012-12-04 07:59:24 PM
2 votes:
I never believed in Santa Claus. When I was four I told the other kids he wasn't real. The adults were mortified. It seems I was born to piss on your fantasies.
2012-12-04 07:58:44 PM
2 votes:
It's a pretty dick move. It's one thing to accidentally blurt it out, it's another to go into details about the deception. I mean, FFS, the kids are 5 years old. Let them believe in something nice before they grow up to realize that the world is a gigantic shiathole just waiting to crush their dreams.
2012-12-04 07:56:56 PM
2 votes:
Wasn't the teachers place to tell the kids that. What beliefs the kids/family have is none of her damn business.
It's one thing to figure it out themselves, but for an adult to "smash the dream" sucks.
2012-12-04 07:52:39 PM
2 votes:
The guy who wrote that needs to go back to school.

Having said that, it is sort of a dick move for a teacher to tell 5-year-olds there's no Santa, but I wouldn't call this a firing offense.
2012-12-04 07:49:54 PM
2 votes:
I read an article one time that was talking about how learning that there is no Santa is a big part of growing up, and it helps kids feel responsible with that little bit of "adult" knowledge, especially if there are younger siblings in the house.

Was pretty interesting.
2012-12-04 06:48:59 PM
2 votes:

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


There are adults that believe in gods. Are there adults that believe in Santa?

FTFA: "Another adult has no right to submit their own beliefs on a group of 5 year olds and their families - about Santa, God, politics or whatever - especially phrased 'your belief is not right.'"

Is that belief contradictory to yours? That Santa isn't real? The only way the teacher is saying, 'your belief is not right' is if you do, indeed, believe in him.
2012-12-04 06:00:36 PM
2 votes:
Not so at her new school, where the teacher reportedly has a partner-in-grinchiness.

I hate that misuse of the term. I've been called a Grinch or a Scrooge before and it's utter bullshiat. They ended up having a change of heart.
2012-12-04 05:47:40 PM
2 votes:

Mugato: Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.

Yeah, lie to your kids about Santa and when they turn 6 or so, "Psych! It's all bullshiat!". Great way to raise a kid.


I had a nice long reasoned reply for you, but I decided my thoughts can be better summed up by saying fark you.
2012-12-04 03:59:09 PM
2 votes:
biatch
2012-12-04 03:32:13 PM
2 votes:

mattharvest: ManateeGag: I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

Why is a school talking about Santa or any other religious figure at all?


According to TFA, the exercise was to draw a picture of something real and a picture of something made up. Some kids started drawing Santa in the "real" column or whatever and the teacher decided that that is the moment when she must step in and correct these misinformed five year old plebes.
2012-12-04 03:25:38 PM
2 votes:

ManateeGag: I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


Why is a school talking about Santa or any other religious figure at all?
2012-12-05 05:11:09 PM
1 votes:

whidbey: dustygrimp: whidbey: There is no Santa Claus

Well, there isn't. Not really worth 476 comments, though.

Would you care to write the dissenting opinion on that? I mean, it's pretty clear that lots of people disagree with you.

So? This isn't a popularity contest. There is no Santa Claus.

This is a fact. And it's kind of disturbing that people find comfort in continuing to spread that kind of lie throughout generations. Christmas itself is kind of disturbing in that if you don't go along with the busy bees, you get a lot of sh*t for it and are somewhat ostracized.

It's a great excuse and it's a good time. Otherwise, Christmas is a bullshiat mega-capitalist corporatist holiday and you damn well know it. Sorry if that pops your balloon.


I was actually referring to the not being worth 476 comments assertion but...

Is there a Santa Claus? Yes. It is not a jolly fat guy in a red suit who leaves presents for all the good gentile children. It's the spirit of giving that grips many of us this time of year. It's the desire to make our family and friends happy. It's the ability to see that even though it's a boon for capitalists, the spirit of the people can carry us to a better place. It's all those things embodied in the symbol of Santa Claus the man. When my 4 year old asks me if there is a Santa Claus, you're god damn right I say yes because I want her to believe that there is a time when people can rise above the misery that surrounds us and remember how fortunate we are in what we have.
2012-12-05 12:38:04 PM
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: Let's play my favorite game:

"Who here actually has children?"


2-year-old daughter, and anyone who tries to take joy away from her childhood will have to deal with me. To childless Farkers: this is not being an ITG. You'll understand what I mean if / when you have kiddos of your own.
2012-12-05 08:34:23 AM
1 votes:
Good lord, when it comes to some topics, Fark is as hardline as Slashdot's Open Source or the highway types. You don't need to tell 5 year old kids Santa isn't real. Just leave it alone and move on. It wasn't a problem until the teacher made it one. Part of living in society is knowing and following some of it's unsaid rules, one of which is: Don't farking tell 5 year olds Santa isn't real.
2012-12-05 03:31:25 AM
1 votes:
I think the bigger issue is that the mother actually likes the fact her daughter goes to a racially diverse school. What kind of crack is she smoking?
2012-12-05 03:06:21 AM
1 votes:
There is no Santa Claus

Well, there isn't. Not really worth 476 comments, though.
2012-12-05 02:45:17 AM
1 votes:
Hey I'm 34 and I still believe in Santa. The belief in Santa and the magic of Christmas gave me this awesome feeling of joy and warmth as a child that persists today when I see my own children get excited and full of wonder about Santa. It is something that helps sustain me, that little bit of light and wonder that I have buried inside, and I want to give it to them.

I wouldn't freak out about this lady, though. I would just tell the kids she doesn't believe in Santa, but that doesn't mean we can't. People believe different things. Get over it.
2012-12-05 02:44:54 AM
1 votes:
Telling kids that Jesus is fake is awesome but telling kids that Santa isn't real is a dick move? Stay classy, atheists.

/trollface
2012-12-05 01:50:16 AM
1 votes:

ibsalamander: atheism is a religion because it's based on faith in the non-existence of (their) God.


That is just stupid and you should feel stupid for having said it.
2012-12-05 01:32:38 AM
1 votes:
Has anyone actually read the article? What, precisely, is an "echool"? "The mom emailed a complaint to the principal, who told he that she has reprimanded the teacher and given her the 'tools to deal with this situation' in the future."

Seriously - this article is crap and you should feel like crap for falling for it.
2012-12-05 12:37:37 AM
1 votes:
So the hero tag is on vacation subby? I feel the world would be a much better place if we didn't perpetuate these seemingly innocuous lies.
2012-12-05 12:22:05 AM
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: Let's play my favorite game:

"Who here actually has children?"


Bingo. I love all the people who are saying "Well, when I have kids, I won't ever lie to them". It's almost adorable.

I yield the rest of my time to Mr. Louie CK.


"Daddy, does the earth go around the sun?"
"Yeah."
"Does it do it all the time?"
"Yeah."
"Will the Earth always go around the Sun, forever?"
"Well no, at some point the sun is going to explode."
(starts crying)
"Oh honey, this is not going to happen until you and everyone you know has been dead for a very long time!"
2012-12-05 12:18:47 AM
1 votes:

Keizer_Ghidorah: skullkrusher: Keizer_Ghidorah: I like that. How dare those peasants try to teach my children about reality, they should know their place! Such low and feeble things, they should be honored to even look at my kids!

hehe, you are a parody of a stereotype, right? This is performance art?

Keizer_Ghidorah: Hey, don't want teachers teaching your kids, them home-school them. Gotta protect them from the real world.

I am not going to homeschool my kids. They'd turn out to be terribly adjusted, strange people who'd do things like argue that it is cool for a teacher to tell a 5 year old there's no Santa.

Nope, just emulating you.

Sorry if how I think makes you angry, but a school is supposed to teach children about the real world and reality.


by intentionally taking a comment as an offensive statement even though it was clearly not? Says more about you than me.

I think we should replace Valentine's Day projects for mom and dad with explanations of how love is merely a neural chemical response to their parents. Ya know, for reality and stuff.

Don't teach, don't breed.
2012-12-05 12:17:09 AM
1 votes:
Ah, yes, this annual thread. And my annual response.

Christmas in our home has always been first and foremost a religious holiday. All the other "stuff" is secondary to that. Fun, but secondary.

I told my kids from a very early age that there once WAS a Bishop, a holy man named Saint Nikolaus, who went around town at Christmas giving charitable gifts, including some toys. After he died, people continued his giving tradition as a way to honor him and to celebrate our Lord's birthday. Saint Nick was shortened over the years to "Santa Claus". "Santa" means "saint". So Santa WAS a real person, in historical times. But he's not alive today.

People enjoy playing the part of "Santa" because it's a wonderful feeling to give to others. And everybody should get a chance to dress up and play at being "Santa". Kids like to play "secret santa". But over the years, people who make money by selling things, and people who are not particularly religious, have kind of borrowed Santa's identity and story, and made up other myths and fake history about him, as entertainment and as a way to sell things. The original Santa didn't look very much like the fat man in the red suit, that was just a popular painting by an artist selling soda pop, and everybody copied that image after that. They made up new stories, because making up stories is fun. There is no north pole workshop, no flying deer. No elves. It's people that make and give the gifts to each other, to show their love for one another on the birthday of Jesus, and they just like to say "santa" brought it because it's fun, or because they're shy. But there WAS a real Santa, once, and giving people gifts was his thing. And you can be like him and give to others to make them happy. You keep Santa's tradition alive.

None of my kids have become tower snipers yet, the oldest is almost twenty and it didn't warp him, that I can see. I think my way of leveling with my kids was the best way, but I'm not for imposing my approach on any other parent: that should be their own responsibility, and a teacher or caregiver should honor that boundary, at least until age ten. This world is tough enough without robbing kid's innocence on a whim. Like the Speech from "Uncle Buck", when he chews out the school principal.

I DO think what's good about my method is that it is logically consistent and that the kids can look it up for themselves and see I never lied to them. The forced pretending, when the kid has already figured it out for themselves, is just awkward and painful all-around.
2012-12-04 11:56:48 PM
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: Let's play my favorite game:

"Who here actually has children?"


The ones not acting like joyless farkwits I'd imagine

/raises hand
2012-12-04 11:51:12 PM
1 votes:

Keizer_Ghidorah: skullkrusher: Keizer_Ghidorah: Hey, the teacher was doing her job. Why do we get angry at people doing their jobs?

"TEACH OUR CHILDREN!"
"DON'T TEACH OUR CHILDREN!"
"WHY IS MY CHILD STUPID?!"
"TEACHERS ARE WORTHLESS!"

Don't do this. But I am just doing my job. OK, great. That's not part of your job though so don't do it anyway. I AM JUST DOING MY JOB. OK, now you're not anymore. Bye.

So the teacher marks the assignment down because the student didn't follow the rules. Now the parents are angry about that. Should the teacher be punished and insulted for that?


Do you honestly think this way? A teacher is going to grade some kindergarten kids poorly for putting Santa in the real column rather than getting a laugh about it and sending it to the parents so they can get a laugh at the cuteness too?

Damn dude, lighten the fark up. Go sign a non-binding, non-effectual treaty which promises to do shiat we already do for kicks or something
2012-12-04 10:58:25 PM
1 votes:

soupbone: Keizer_Ghidorah: A school is where you learn things about the real world. Santa is not part of the real world.

Santa is part of the real world, both in the mythology sense and the used to be alive sense.


Mythology, by definition, is not real. The idea is real, but not the character. Zeus and Thor are mythology as well, they exist as ideas but not as reality. Santa was inspired by Saint Nicholas, who, yes, was a real person, but he was nothing like Santa Claus except for the kind to children aspect. Santa is also based on the Lord of Misrule, a pagan creation meant to disrupt and bring the fun back to the early Christian seriousness of Christmas/the winter solstice that it had assimilated. Saint Nicholas and the Lord of Misrule combined into the modern idea of Santa Claus.
2012-12-04 10:18:45 PM
1 votes:

SuperNinjaToad: Blue_Blazer: SuperNinjaToad: Blue_Blazer: Oh and the other point I made to the wife and to my dad: why the fark should I allow my kid to think some made-up being gave him all these sweet gifts. I'd much rather he know that he got these presents from Mom and Dad who love him, and that's just what people do this time of year.

wouldn't that be worst for them psychologically at that age? ........ that your love for them is based on material gifts?

Gifts have been an expression of affection since, well, the first gift ever. That's what gifts are, tokens of affection. I suppose I could try it the old-fashioned way, where my beating the shiat out of them is because I love them, but I like my way better.

wow! really? I didn't know parenting to be such simple endevor as a matter of just simply choosing between bearing gifts and/or physical abuse.

No wonder so many kids in America today grow up to become either violent sociopaths or self entitled greedy selfish pricks or maybe a combination of both.

In all seriousness though, if you think just giving them material things is the primary show of your love and affection as parents you're doing it wrong.


Notice the bold part. You are trying to put words in my mouth. Apparently you think that giving gifts at Christmastime is psychologically damaging. You must be a blast at parties.
2012-12-04 10:14:04 PM
1 votes:
I`m not going to let my kids grow up to be idiots and I`m not going to let my kids grow up thinking that their parents aren`t going to be honest with them.

And I am still waiting for farkers to give some evidence of the oh so great contribution of believing in Santa has on creativity.
2012-12-04 10:12:31 PM
1 votes:
I'm ok with this.
Children shouldn't be lied to.
2012-12-04 09:53:40 PM
1 votes:

diaphoresis: you shall only be happy with what we tell you to be happy about


Also, this

upload.wikimedia.org

seems to fit that statement.
2012-12-04 09:50:10 PM
1 votes:

BigNumber12: I suspect that we're going to see more and more studies investigating correlation between the rates of children who were robbed of their childhoods, and people in their 20s and 30s who seem to regress to adolescence and postpone adulthood as long as possible.


For most of history, children were trained at a young age to be little adults. Made sense, they didn't live long. They were also raised in fear. Santa used to beat the crap out of bad children. Also makes sense. Needed to have them fear and respect authority at a young age.

No, I think it is just the opposite. Our culture now puts too much value on childhood. On creating a safe, sanitized, fantasy world for youth. It only makes sense that it now extends to such a late age: Reality is scary.
2012-12-04 09:50:07 PM
1 votes:
DNR all of TFT.

I'm a proud skeptic, and I'm all for teaching kids how to distinguish between bullshiat and fantasy, and I like fantasy as well. But I see the Santa thing as a sort of cultural initiation. At a very young age, it brings to kids a sense of wonder and whimsy that I find delightful. It's something most of us went through at some time in our lives, and it's something we pass on, like a camping or scouting "snipe hunt". We know it's not real, but it's fun to watch the young ones believe, if just for a little while. It brings as much pleasure to the adults as it does to the children.

Whether parents or teachers tell them or not, they eventually figure it out, and many go on to tell their kids the same thing. Some parents are completely up front, saying "I got these presents for you because I wanted you to have them", and some go the Santa route. I don't see a problem with either, but I think it was kind of a dick move for the teacher to do that.
2012-12-04 09:47:21 PM
1 votes:
What the teacher says- "There is no Santa Claus"

What Fark reads- " There is no Jesus" Then they stand behind it obviously, because Athiest...man.

Two different things. I don't expect a teacher to nurture the idea of Santa Claus but I don't expect them to flat out debunk it either. It's not their place to make that call. If they don't like to propiagate it then just ignore it and teach from the textbook like you're supposed to.
2012-12-04 09:44:43 PM
1 votes:
This is a special moment right now We'd like to take this time to tell all the kids at home Send your parents out of the room This is a kid's song
Life's gonna suck when you grow up When you grow up, when you grow up Life's gonna suck when you grow up It sucks pretty bad right now
Hey, if you know the words, sing along
You're gonna have to mow the lawn Do the dishes, make your bed You're gonna have to go to school Until you're seventeen
It's gonna seem about three times as long as that
You might have to go to war Shoot a gun, kill a nun You might have to go to war When you get outta school
Hey, cheer up kids, it gets a lot worse
You're gonna have to deal with stress Deal with stress, deal with stress You're gonna be a giant mess When you get back from the war
Santa Clause does not exist And there is no Easter Bunny You'll find out when you grow up That Big Bird isn't funny (Funny, funny, ya, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha)
Life's gonna suck when you grow up When you grow up, when you grow up Life's gonna suck when you grow up It sucks pretty bad right now
You're gonna wind up smoking crack On your back, face the fact You're gonna wind up hooked on smack And then you're gonna die
And then you're gonna die, hey, hey
2012-12-04 09:43:52 PM
1 votes:
Sometimes, I think I've got it pretty rough.

That's why I like Fark. I browse threads like this, and I think to myself, "no matter how bad I've got it, at least I'm not like some of these soulless assholes".
2012-12-04 09:40:01 PM
1 votes:

The My Little Pony Killer: As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...


And I'm okay with you minding you own goddam business.
2012-12-04 09:18:34 PM
1 votes:

Porous Horace: Who is John Galt?


Fuk Ayn Rand.

She was a self-absorbed, self-described, and self-aggrandized douchebag, period.

To overidentify with a fabricated self
2012-12-04 09:15:34 PM
1 votes:

sendtodave: soupbone: I've said it before on this site, and it's been proven in this thread. There are some truly miserable people that post on this site.

Are we talking about the people that encourage logic, morality, and critical thinking?

Or the ones that are so disappointed with reality that they espouse fantasies?


Because it's impossible to encourage logic and critical thinking while also encouraging the imagination and creativity of children right? We are talking about young children remember? Fark is full of people that need to mind their own farking business, this story included.
gja [TotalFark]
2012-12-04 09:12:32 PM
1 votes:

Indubitably: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Gunny Highway: The pictures are lies and your niece is a brain washed consumer, you evil fark!

Boy, you don't know the half of it! :)

Please don't use that word to start a sentence ever. Thank you.


Hey boy......

/is it any better when one ends a sentence with it?
//lighten up Francis
2012-12-04 09:00:42 PM
1 votes:

mekki: Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination. To imagine how one guy delivers presents all around the world in one night. No one is going to die because a tiny tot believes in a guy with a magic sled and bottomless sack of gifts. Mind you, these same kids will stop believing in him as they grow older without having any permanent damage for believing in the first place.


Yeah unless your parents are too poor to buy you any presents(no they didn't tell me santa was real), and your classmates assume you didn't get toys because you were bad, and then use that as "justification" for bullying/beating you up for your lunch money.

Many years I recieved nothing for christmas, we were lucky to even have food some years.

but yeah, they may not have damage, but they may cause it.
2012-12-04 09:00:33 PM
1 votes:

hasty ambush: possumchild: I'm not sure why it is any teacher's responsibility/ethical mandate to perpetuate a myth foisted upon their little snowflakes by their parents. What other fibs is the teacher supposed to tell, that thunder is God shouting? Or that Fido is 'in doggie heaven'? or stepping on a crack will break mommy's back? How's anyone supposed to keep up with all that?

Where does Santa, religion or anything you consider a myth fit into the lesson plan for five year olds? Let this lower level government employee stick to what she is supposed to be teaching. She and her ilk need to realize their mere education degrees do not make them some all knowing, all powerful social engineers whose job is to contradict the desire of parents in these matters.

Despite the almost $1 trillion combined this country spends on education these government hacks can barely produce a literate product from our school systems. Maybe these union thugs should concentrate on actually doing a better job than they are instead ruining childhoods and trying to usurp parental authority. After all it is the parents who are paying the bills.


Seriously?

Just stop.

Try paying teachers as much as you pay your bankers/fund-managers/douchebags.
2012-12-04 08:58:41 PM
1 votes:

possumchild: I'm not sure why it is any teacher's responsibility/ethical mandate to perpetuate a myth foisted upon their little snowflakes by their parents. What other fibs is the teacher supposed to tell, that thunder is God shouting? Or that Fido is 'in doggie heaven'? or stepping on a crack will break mommy's back? How's anyone supposed to keep up with all that?


Where does Santa, religion or anything you consider a myth fit into the lesson plan for five year olds? Let this lower level government employee stick to what she is supposed to be teaching. She and her ilk need to realize their mere education degrees do not make them some all knowing, all powerful social engineers whose job is to contradict the desire of parents in these matters.

Despite the almost $1 trillion combined this country spends on education these government hacks can barely produce a literate product from our school systems. Maybe these union thugs should concentrate on actually doing a better job than they are instead ruining childhoods and trying to usurp parental authority. After all it is the parents who are paying the bills.
2012-12-04 08:55:03 PM
1 votes:
I've said it before on this site, and it's been proven in this thread. There are some truly miserable people that post on this site.
2012-12-04 08:54:53 PM
1 votes:

sendtodave: Question for parents: Is it OK when your child lies to you? Makes up unbelievable falsehoods to justify their actions?


"Hey Dad! SURPRISE! I am planning you a surprise birthday party. It will be next Tuesday at 5:00PM in the park. old friends you havent see in years will be there and i got you that painting you have been searching for all these lomg years. See ya then."

*phone click*

'I wish I had thought that damn kid about lying'
2012-12-04 08:51:34 PM
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: Santa is not a "lie." This is something that, as I read through the thread, I find very odd. Santa is a "story." People seem to have this idea that telling little kids about Santa is done with some malicious intent, the same kind of evil that fraudsters use to bilk people out of money or something. By that metric, anything told to a child that is "not real" is a lie. So is telling a child a fairy tale a "lie"? If you read "The Hobbit" as a bedtime story without carefully explaining in excruciating detail that there's no such thing as hobbits and no such place as Middle Earth, did you just lie to them?

This is a really idiot angle to argue, that Santa is a "lie."


You ever eat a plate of cookies your encouraged your kid to leave out for Bilbo and then later tell 'em that you're sure he enjoyed them? It's the mixing of story and reality that's the deception. Doesn't quite have the malice to be a "lie", but you're intentionally encouraging them to continue thinking what you know to be untrue.

/Be considerate
//Put them on a low table
2012-12-04 08:50:32 PM
1 votes:
My God! All of you helicopter parents proclaiming the children should never be lied to. You lie to them every day, if not every hour. Spinach gave Popeye super strength. Should they not watch that cartoon? Bugs Bunny could talk...rabbits can't talk. Since when was letting a kid unleash his/her imagination unhealthy? And yes...this is for all of you adults that slept with a lottery ticket under your pillow dreaming of winning the big $500mil. Give your kids a break and let them be kids for Christ's sake.
2012-12-04 08:46:48 PM
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: Santa is not a "lie." This is something that, as I read through the thread, I find very odd. Santa is a "story." People seem to have this idea that telling little kids about Santa is done with some malicious intent, the same kind of evil that fraudsters use to bilk people out of money or something. By that metric, anything told to a child that is "not real" is a lie. So is telling a child a fairy tale a "lie"? If you read "The Hobbit" as a bedtime story without carefully explaining in excruciating detail that there's no such thing as hobbits and no such place as Middle Earth, did you just lie to them?

This is a really idiot angle to argue, that Santa is a "lie."


noun 1. a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood

"Mommy, where do Christmas presents come from?"

"Santa Claus brings them!"

That is a lie.
2012-12-04 08:46:30 PM
1 votes:

haywatchthis: it's refreashing to hear people tell the truth for a change
to bad tommorrow alot of people will be saying, bless you, after someone sneezes and you will reply, thank you, for no farking reason


They are attempting to be polite. I will thank them for their attempt at being polite. The same way that when someone says, "God bless," I say something like, "and you." I don't believe in their mythological gibberish, but I appreciate their intent of wishing me well and will reciprocate the sentiment within their silly context. If the idiom has got a religious connotation or not doesn't matter much.
2012-12-04 08:45:22 PM
1 votes:

possumchild: I'm not sure why it is any teacher's responsibility/ethical mandate to perpetuate a myth foisted upon their little snowflakes by their parents. What other fibs is the teacher supposed to tell, that thunder is God shouting? Or that Fido is 'in doggie heaven'? or stepping on a crack will break mommy's back? How's anyone supposed to keep up with all that?


If asked, the response might be "Ask your parent(s) when you get home"
Not the teachers place to just come out with that statement unasked, as seems to be the case here.
2012-12-04 08:43:41 PM
1 votes:

ColSanders: mekki: I know I am in Fark but, man, this thread is full of robots.

Not robots, just people who have never been parents.


One's capacity for accepting bullshiat increases after they get older and have kids?

Yeah, that jives with my observations.
2012-12-04 08:42:22 PM
1 votes:

Ace Rimmer: mekki: sendtodave: Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.

Childish beliefs which are taught to them by adults.

Childish adults.

They're five year olds. They believe in childish things because they ARE children.

Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination. To imagine how one guy delivers presents all around the world in one night. No one is going to die because a tiny tot believes in a guy with a magic sled and bottomless sack of gifts. Mind you, these same kids will stop believing in him as they grow older without having any permanent damage for believing in the first place.

I know I am in Fark but, man, this thread is full of robots.

And figuring out the truth of Santa on their own is a right of passage of sorts.

The sting of finding out Santa is a lie is almost always softened by finding out it is a lie for the "little kids" and now that they are "big kids" they get to be in on the secret too.


Santa is not a "lie." This is something that, as I read through the thread, I find very odd. Santa is a "story." People seem to have this idea that telling little kids about Santa is done with some malicious intent, the same kind of evil that fraudsters use to bilk people out of money or something. By that metric, anything told to a child that is "not real" is a lie. So is telling a child a fairy tale a "lie"? If you read "The Hobbit" as a bedtime story without carefully explaining in excruciating detail that there's no such thing as hobbits and no such place as Middle Earth, did you just lie to them?

This is a really idiot angle to argue, that Santa is a "lie."
2012-12-04 08:32:41 PM
1 votes:

mekki: sendtodave: Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.

Childish beliefs which are taught to them by adults.

Childish adults.

They're five year olds. They believe in childish things because they ARE children.

Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination. To imagine how one guy delivers presents all around the world in one night. No one is going to die because a tiny tot believes in a guy with a magic sled and bottomless sack of gifts. Mind you, these same kids will stop believing in him as they grow older without having any permanent damage for believing in the first place.

I know I am in Fark but, man, this thread is full of robots.


And figuring out the truth of Santa on their own is a right of passage of sorts.

The sting of finding out Santa is a lie is almost always softened by finding out it is a lie for the "little kids" and now that they are "big kids" they get to be in on the secret too.
2012-12-04 08:31:07 PM
1 votes:

Gunny Highway: Everything is so black and white in here.


Nope.

It's as colored as the sky...
2012-12-04 08:28:24 PM
1 votes:

Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME), imitating idiot conservatives to vent my frustration about them.


Huh. Never seen you before. Never will again.
2012-12-04 08:28:11 PM
1 votes:
I see a bright dividing line here between people that have kids and people that don't.
2012-12-04 08:24:52 PM
1 votes:

Mija: The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.



Actually it makes perfect sense to refrain from believing in every extraordinary story of beings with magic powers until solid evidence of the story's truth is presented.

Since there are thousands upon thousands of stories of magical beings and no proof that any of them are real whatsoever it is perfectly rational to disbelieve in all of them equally - and I'd go so far as to say irrational to believe otherwise. The Judeo-Christian god is no different from any other religious myth in this respect, and in fact you can find many elements of the Yahweh myth present in other competing mythologies from the era and region where the myth originated.
2012-12-04 08:22:11 PM
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: Ask yourself: Are these kids better off now that someone told them there is no Santa? Are they really going to now decide (at age 5) that there is no god and no Jesus and that Cinderella is really just a marketing tool? Do you think that really makes that much difference in a kid's life, except to ruin a holiday for them?


Please. Only no gifts or cookies would ruin the holiday for them.
2012-12-04 08:22:09 PM
1 votes:
Well, the teacher is correct and also incorrect. While there isn't a magical nose-tweaking chimney-jumper, I'm pretty sure someone somewhere goes around calling themselves Santa (either by way of moronic parents, delusions and psychological deficiencies, or just to make money.) So, meh.
2012-12-04 08:21:45 PM
1 votes:
Well I bet that most of the anti-santa people here on Fark will still end up telling their kids that santa brings their presents when they have them.
2012-12-04 08:19:39 PM
1 votes:

mekki: Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination.


Kids don't need lies to use their imaginations. Parents do themselves a disservice by perpetuating the myth of Santa Claus because it undermines the child's faith in their parents.
2012-12-04 08:17:55 PM
1 votes:
Guess what? She was right. Santa is a tool designed to make your spoiled crotch fruit behave out of their intrinsic sense of greed. God and Jesus were made up to control the population out of fear of 'eternal fire" or some such bullshiat. Seeing a pattern here?
2012-12-04 08:17:05 PM
1 votes:
I would imagine that an educator must, at one time, draw the line on fact and fiction. If your job is to cultivate the knowledge and development of our future, yet consciously allow them to believe something that is factually inaccurate, then you are not doing your job.

The consequence is anger and sadness, but only temporary from the children. The parents (the liars) are a different matter. Instantly this defensive, "I know what is right for my children" rage comes into play, and never once do they realize that if Santa was real or not - makes no difference.

Your kids trust you from birth to be honest to them. To love them enough to guide them and teach them so that they can grow up to be great people. To let them make their own decisions and theories as they become responsible.
2012-12-04 08:14:25 PM
1 votes:
My plan, when I have children, is to tell them that Santa is a game people play, and give them the choice of whether or not to play it too, with the understanding that even if they don't play, it's still considered extremely rude to spoil the game for others.

This teacher is a jerk.
2012-12-04 08:10:45 PM
1 votes:

sendtodave: Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.

Childish beliefs which are taught to them by adults.

Childish adults.


They're five year olds. They believe in childish things because they ARE children.

Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination. To imagine how one guy delivers presents all around the world in one night. No one is going to die because a tiny tot believes in a guy with a magic sled and bottomless sack of gifts. Mind you, these same kids will stop believing in him as they grow older without having any permanent damage for believing in the first place.

I know I am in Fark but, man, this thread is full of robots.
2012-12-04 08:10:37 PM
1 votes:
Wahhhhhhhh. Some one told my child a fact in school.
This is how creationists start.
2012-12-04 08:09:27 PM
1 votes:

Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME), imitating idiot conservatives to vent my frustration about them.

Anyway, my favorite thing to tell members of my church who think that it's adorable to tell kids about Santa is that many people point to their disillusionment about Santa as the first step in their turning away from God, and that by telling them lies about Santa Claus, you demonstrate that you care more about your own amusement than the spiritual destiny of your child.


So you're all right with telling lies about the existence of deities, but you draw the line at telling lies about the existence of Santa? That's some impressive cognitive dissonance, assuming you're not trolling here as well...
2012-12-04 08:09:23 PM
1 votes:
Santa Claus is the patron saint of children and "giving without expectation," or charity, so teaching your kids about him is a GOOD idea. But a lot of parents use the idea of literalism to infantilize their children. I have an aunt who kept her children believing that there was a Santa Claus until the oldest one was THIRTEEN. When a family member spilled the beans, the aunt stopped speaking to her.

If your kids want to believe in Santa, that's one thing; keeping them believing in Santa because you're getting something out of it is selfish.

So yeah, when someone says that Santa isn't literally real and that infuriates some parent or other, I get the warm fuzzies. Someone's just been taught two things: 1) critical thinking skills are a thing, and 2) Mommy is a manipulative liar. Otherwise she wouldn't be offended that the jig was up.
2012-12-04 08:09:01 PM
1 votes:
As a former child, I recall a period of bitter resentment as I discovered lie after lie. Not so much for the mythical figures like Santa and the Easter Bunny but more general bullshiat answers to the typical "why" questions. Mostly from my grandfather because he would give bullshiat answers with the same sense of sincerity as the scientific answers. Adults think that kind of thing is funny but young kids haven't learned to tell the difference between truth and bullshiat. When a trusted authority figure tells a kid something they believe it. When something the kid stored away as a fundamental truth turns out to be a complete fabrication, the kid's left wondering just how much of our reality is false. I spent quite a bit of time fact checking in my tween years.

While that process is probably a necessary part of building a prudent level of skepticism and I got over it eventually, it doesn't change the fact that I felt betrayed at the time because someone I trusted implicitly had filled my head with bullshiat because it was amusing at the time.
2012-12-04 08:07:24 PM
1 votes:
Mija needs to grab a dictionary and look up "atheist" before they jump into any further conversations on the matter.
2012-12-04 08:06:15 PM
1 votes:
I guess the Hero tag took a trip to the North Pole. People need to stop justifying lying to their children.

Oh wait. Religion.


Nuts.
2012-12-04 08:01:13 PM
1 votes:
Texas, where Santa Claus is fake, but a big all seeing man who lives in the clouds invented everything ever in 7 days, and humans rode around on dinosaurs.

Makes sense, they do have the highest drop out rate, guessing their qualifications to become a teacher are probably pretty damn low.
2012-12-04 07:58:38 PM
1 votes:

Mija: The My Little Pony Killer: ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...

The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.


Casting stones in this glass house of earth is dangerous, for all the panes are just one tink from breaking, and if that happens, your calculus just differentiated. *)
2012-12-04 07:57:30 PM
1 votes:

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


I'd be OK with people learning to spell "atheist". If that ever happened I'd believe in a god.
2012-12-04 07:57:07 PM
1 votes:

Mija: The My Little Pony Killer: ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...

The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.


The non-existence of deities does not require belief. It is a simple basic fact.
2012-12-04 07:55:23 PM
1 votes:

The My Little Pony Killer: ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...


The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.
2012-12-04 07:54:26 PM
1 votes:
Stop lying to your farking children about a mascot being real and there won't be a problem.
2012-12-04 07:54:24 PM
1 votes:
The mother said another parent told her that a second teacher assigned her students to draw two pictures on a piece of paper, one of something real, and the other of something imaginary. When the student started drawing Santa on the "real" side of the page, the teacher said Saint Nick belonged on the fake side.

Namby pamby hand-holding new-age nonsense. Let the girl finish her assignment, turn it in and give her the F for being 50% correct. That's how learning works; you have to let them make mistakes.
2012-12-04 07:53:19 PM
1 votes:
Because she is disrupting the school atmosphere, can she be fired under her teaching contract's sanity clause?
2012-12-04 06:18:54 PM
1 votes:
He shouldn't have, but this is a good example of something not being a BFD.
2012-12-04 05:55:16 PM
1 votes:

Mugato: Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.

Yeah, lie to your kids about Santa and when they turn 6 or so, "Psych! It's all bullshiat!". Great way to raise a kid.


It's too bad such an insignifant event damaged you much. Fortunately, most children are far more resilient.
2012-12-04 05:50:18 PM
1 votes:
I've never lied to my kids about Santa.
2012-12-04 05:49:57 PM
1 votes:

exick: ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

That's really the only reason the parents are upset. Because now they have to figure out how to explain why Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are all made up bullshiat but Jesus is totally real.


Really? You know them? What a great coincidence! What else can you tell us about them that those of us who don't know them personally aren't privy to?
2012-12-04 04:40:26 PM
1 votes:

Somacandra: naughtyrev: Mmmm....cult-like school detected.

Not really. Waldorf does draw from Anthroposophy and Rudolf Steiner, but it could hardly be called a "cult" movement. It is an educational framework and impulse designed to cultivate children's relationships with nature and cycles of the nature world. Rudolf Steiner was committed to an esoteric form of Christianity, which did make room for other-than-human Persons in the world--but that's really not exceptional for the Christian tradition, or many other religious traditions for that matter. The problem that I have is that the teacher entirely short circuits the very real and very positive experience of moving from exoteric symbolism to esoteric truth. There is a very real spirit of thankfulness, generosity and giving in humanity often associated with the birth of the new light (the Sun) around the winter solstice. Just as the cosmos gives us this light of increase, so too do we donate to each other's increase. Santa Claus is a way for children to experience this at the level they are capable of doing at that age. There will be a time they'll learn on their own that this is a subtle truth to be experienced inwardly for themselves--but wrenching the sacramental usage of Santa Claus out of the world of the youth does not strike me as a healthy move. We teach children lots of things at the level they are capable of appreciating--and then complicate them later on when they are capable of handling complication. In terms of Zen: "Yes there is a Santa Claus for those who do not know what he is. There is no Santa Claus for those who know what he is."

/flame away, won't bother me


Fair enough. I know the kids who attend these schools do tend to perform well on standard measures later in life (SATs, for one). Pedagogically, they seem a bit mushy to me, but then again, most public schools are most certainly far too data, testing and outcomes oriented which is certainly bad for children I believe.
2012-12-04 03:50:59 PM
1 votes:
Obligatory:

reverendogore.files.wordpress.com
2012-12-04 03:21:42 PM
1 votes:
"Aven had previously attended a Waldorf school, where belief in fairies and other supernatural beings was nurtured."

Is this true?
2012-12-04 02:25:04 PM
1 votes:
FTFA: "Aven had previously attended a Waldorf school, where belief in fairies and other supernatural beings was nurtured."

Mmmm....cult-like school detected.
 
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