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(Houston Press)   Teacher to 5-year-olds: There is no Santa Claus   (blogs.houstonpress.com) divider line 544
    More: Asinine, Santa Claus, Good Lord, Susan, Polar Express, teachers  
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10696 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Dec 2012 at 7:45 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-04 08:14:25 PM
My plan, when I have children, is to tell them that Santa is a game people play, and give them the choice of whether or not to play it too, with the understanding that even if they don't play, it's still considered extremely rude to spoil the game for others.

This teacher is a jerk.
 
2012-12-04 08:14:32 PM

haywatchthis: invisible sky wizard didn't create, magic flying pedofile that breaks in to houses and steal cookies and leave crap


Comma-splice.
 
2012-12-04 08:15:31 PM
People have an issue with telling kids Santa Claus is real?

I really hate this website sometimes.
 
2012-12-04 08:17:02 PM
Is this the same teacher that tells the adoptees that those are not their real parents?
 
2012-12-04 08:17:05 PM
I would imagine that an educator must, at one time, draw the line on fact and fiction. If your job is to cultivate the knowledge and development of our future, yet consciously allow them to believe something that is factually inaccurate, then you are not doing your job.

The consequence is anger and sadness, but only temporary from the children. The parents (the liars) are a different matter. Instantly this defensive, "I know what is right for my children" rage comes into play, and never once do they realize that if Santa was real or not - makes no difference.

Your kids trust you from birth to be honest to them. To love them enough to guide them and teach them so that they can grow up to be great people. To let them make their own decisions and theories as they become responsible.
 
2012-12-04 08:17:37 PM

Coco LaFemme:
Now, when a 40-year-old still believes that a jolly fat man who lives at the top of planet will squeeze himself through their chimney once a year.....then we have a problem.



.... Or that a zombie-deity can hear your unspoken thoughts to grant you wishes; and just to be on the safe you ceremoniously eat his flesh and drink his blood. And you can't forget that of the 6,000 years Earth has been there was once a point where two of EVERY animal on Earth was put on a boat to survive for over a month with a man and his family who later repopulated the planet.

It's a good thing that no one in power in the United States would believe such outlandish fairy tales.
 
2012-12-04 08:17:38 PM
Oh, ffs.

There is a big difference between letting little kids have their fantasies about Santa Claus and "lying to kids about God." Guess what: Kids figure out, about age six or seven, that Santa is fake. Often before that, but it's fun for a year or two to pretend you believe in Santa because WHAT IF..... Then there's the year or two that they don't believe in Santa but "We have to pretend because little brother or sister still thinks Santa is real" and it makes them feel all grown up to pretend with the adults for the "babies." (When they're all of 7 or 8)

Pretending like you're enlightening a five-year old because YOU in your adult, non-fantastical, non-religious way, have decided children should not live in a world of lies, it's time to put away childish things, conflating god with Santa, or whatever justification you use for killing the joy in a child's life, is not your call. Five is not a good age to be questioning either god or Santa. Five needs a few absolutes like Disney princesses and Santa Claus. And anyway, it's not up to some substitute kindergarten teacher to make that decision for them.

Ask yourself: Are these kids better off now that someone told them there is no Santa? Are they really going to now decide (at age 5) that there is no god and no Jesus and that Cinderella is really just a marketing tool? Do you think that really makes that much difference in a kid's life, except to ruin a holiday for them?
 
2012-12-04 08:17:55 PM
Guess what? She was right. Santa is a tool designed to make your spoiled crotch fruit behave out of their intrinsic sense of greed. God and Jesus were made up to control the population out of fear of 'eternal fire" or some such bullshiat. Seeing a pattern here?
 
2012-12-04 08:18:03 PM

Indubitably: haywatchthis: invisible sky wizard didn't create, magic flying pedofile that breaks in to houses and steal cookies and leave crap

Comma-splice.


P.S. I know everyone says that they hate the grammarian, but I don't actually believe them, because we all crave learning, and I secretly suspect we applaud ourselves when we learn something, and my life has been all about that. To learn something in the now is a beautiful thing...I did it just now with you. Huzzah!
 
2012-12-04 08:18:11 PM
So, here's the thing: "Santa" is real. The spirit of giving, friendship, love for family, and decency to your fellow man are real things that should be taught to children from as early an age as possible.

Santa Claus, however, is not real. And teaching children that imaginary things are real is, well, wrong. Sure, kids should have fantasies, but they should also be taught that fantasies are just that: fantasies. Dora the Explorer? Not real. Elmo? A fiction, make-believe. And there's nothing wrong with make-believe, so long as it's distinguished from reality.

We're teaching our kids that Santa is a game a lot of adults like to play, one that makes gift giving at Christmas a slightly different experience. "Santa" might "bring them gifts," but Santa himself does not.
 
2012-12-04 08:18:42 PM

sendtodave: Coco LaFemme: 5-year-olds are supposed to believe in supernatural/mythical beings. They're kids.

Why, exactly? Wouldn't that age, when their minds are like sponges, be better spent developing their reason,?Not on some fantasy to be later discarded.

That's right Komrad, why in the hell should kids have a childhood ? Let them know just how much the real world sucks right from the get go. Piss on their dreams and crush their imagination. And that fantasy to be later discarded? They used to be called fond childhood memories, let's smash them too.

 
2012-12-04 08:18:46 PM
There is nothing wrong about telling kids the reality about Santa Claus. They can still enjoy christmas even without believing in some fat dude who invades everybody's home to plant gifts under the tree. What is real is that you have a loving family and friends who will take care of you and even give you gifts, with or without Santa Claus.

If kids start asking questions about the truth on a subject matter, then they deserve to know the truth. When they grow up and find out about all the lies that you've been using to control them, the more they'll become rebellious. For example, if you keep telling a child that if he doesn't listen to you, the monster from the closet will eat him at night, when he grows up, he'll rebel. He'll have all the ammunition to fight against you. Why? Because he can easily say "You always used fear to control me, well not anymore!".

The story of Santa Claus can also be used to fit your needs to control kids. You can easily say Santa Claus is a creature from another dimension who rewards good children with gifts and kidnaps bad kids and turns them into toy making slaves. I'd rather tell kids the truth that the "Santa Claus" of the world are loving family members who really care about you whether you've been bad or good, not some fair weathered entity who will ignore you if you don't act as he pleases.
 
2012-12-04 08:19:39 PM

mekki: Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination.


Kids don't need lies to use their imaginations. Parents do themselves a disservice by perpetuating the myth of Santa Claus because it undermines the child's faith in their parents.
 
2012-12-04 08:19:57 PM

Mugato: I dunno, telling kids Santa is real is kind of a dick move. My mom never wanted to do the Santa thing but my grandmother convinced her to.


That's not so bad...at least she was aware of it.

OTOH, some parents tag team a kid into complying with some variation of the Boogyman and Santa.

The children DO eventually pick up on the fact that those parents resort to that sort of thing instead of assertiveness and consistency. Then, when those children find out (like from that teacher) that it was a clever ruse for manipulation, many of those children then learn to make up stuff and maneuver the parents and then the parents get what they deserve; a manipulative child who gets his way most of the time.
 
2012-12-04 08:20:37 PM

Krymson Tyde: The My Little Pony Killer: I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm okay with other people minding their own goddamn business.


ummm, teaching them facts is exactly their goddamned business. that is why i pay taxes, not to foster some farking christian wizard shiat . go to a private school for that. no farking wonder we are last in math/science in elementary age kids amongst industrialized nations.
 
2012-12-04 08:20:40 PM
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-12-04 08:20:56 PM
I have a toddler and will have to figure out what to do about Santa, as I don't want to lie to my child and am an atheist and consider Santa a bit like God-lite. I think we will end up making it a mystery for her to solve on her own as an exercise to sharpen her critical thinking skills. We are going to make it a bit of a right of passage without so much direct lying involved. I've wrestled with this for a while now.

But what the teacher did was different. It is not her place to do this to these families. Santa is a rich tradition that is much valued by many families. Its basically harmless (according to research, I looked into it) and it isn't the teachers place to replace the judgement of the families.

This isn't biology or math or part of the actual curriculum, so it isn't her/his turf at all. Downplay it if you want. Be cagey about it. Do whatever, but ffs don't just go shiatting on family's valued traditions.

This includes telling them there is no god, or there is a god, or anything else that many people feel strongly about.
 
2012-12-04 08:20:59 PM
I'm torn on the whole Santa thing. My son just turned two so he doesn't really get it yet but next year he will. I'm an absolutely terrible liar but I remember the awesome feeling when I was little and believed. What to do, what to do.
 
2012-12-04 08:21:06 PM
To reholiday?
 
2012-12-04 08:21:17 PM
waterman99.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-12-04 08:21:45 PM
Well I bet that most of the anti-santa people here on Fark will still end up telling their kids that santa brings their presents when they have them.
 
2012-12-04 08:22:09 PM
Well, the teacher is correct and also incorrect. While there isn't a magical nose-tweaking chimney-jumper, I'm pretty sure someone somewhere goes around calling themselves Santa (either by way of moronic parents, delusions and psychological deficiencies, or just to make money.) So, meh.
 
2012-12-04 08:22:11 PM

Gyrfalcon: Ask yourself: Are these kids better off now that someone told them there is no Santa? Are they really going to now decide (at age 5) that there is no god and no Jesus and that Cinderella is really just a marketing tool? Do you think that really makes that much difference in a kid's life, except to ruin a holiday for them?


Please. Only no gifts or cookies would ruin the holiday for them.
 
2012-12-04 08:22:18 PM
Teacher, you don't still seriously believe you are making a difference in the lives of any of us, do you?
 
2012-12-04 08:22:21 PM
Deserves the HERO tag IMO.
 
2012-12-04 08:22:44 PM
Whats really sad is that so many farkers came from broken homes where there was noone to love them.

They probably never had children either cause they didn't want to repeat the cycle.......
 
2012-12-04 08:22:55 PM

Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME),


well, you're around enough that I have you favorited as: seriously unfunny "Christian" troll
 
2012-12-04 08:24:46 PM

Shostie: lumn or whatever and the teacher decid


uh, yes, santa is usually dispelled by 2-4. if you make it to a public school and are not prepared for math and solar system diagrams and still believe in flying toy gods, your parents have crippled you.
 
2012-12-04 08:24:47 PM
Johnny : Mommy, is santa real? and the easter bunny? the tooth fairy?

Mom "No son, santa is made up because daddy and mommy want you be less irritating,and behave, so we use santa to threaten "no presents" to make you be less of a screaming meme. Mommy and daddy made these characters up to control you dear, because we suck at parenting.
'
Johnny "Um..ok...but what about God? Did man make up God too? To control us?"

Mom.."no hunny, God is real."

Johnny "well...santa is in a book, and the easter bunny, and the tooth fairy, and all those books were written by men, wasn't the bible written by man too?"

Mom "ON YOUR KNEES YOU BLASPHEMOUS HEATHEN...REPENT OR BURN IN HELL..THE GOD WHO LOVES YOU COMMANDS IT!!" smack..punch...kick...
 
2012-12-04 08:24:52 PM

Mija: The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.



Actually it makes perfect sense to refrain from believing in every extraordinary story of beings with magic powers until solid evidence of the story's truth is presented.

Since there are thousands upon thousands of stories of magical beings and no proof that any of them are real whatsoever it is perfectly rational to disbelieve in all of them equally - and I'd go so far as to say irrational to believe otherwise. The Judeo-Christian god is no different from any other religious myth in this respect, and in fact you can find many elements of the Yahweh myth present in other competing mythologies from the era and region where the myth originated.
 
2012-12-04 08:25:20 PM

Giltric: Whats really sad is that so many farkers came from broken homes where there was noone to love them.

They probably never had children either cause they didn't want to repeat the cycle.......


I don't remember you having an apostrophe problem b4?

What happened?
 
2012-12-04 08:25:48 PM
My five-year-old niece asked me yesterday, about the reality of Santa Claus. We looked up Saint Nicholas on Wikipedia, and I read to her of some of the things he did to achieve sainthood. We looked at the pictures of how different cultures view Santa Claus, and discussed what she knew about him. Then I turned her question around on her, and asked her "Well, do you believe in Santa Claus?" She told me "Of course! I just saw his pictures!"

She was satisfied, and I was relieved.
 
2012-12-04 08:26:20 PM

ManateeGag: The My Little Pony Killer:

I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies like that.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?


I'm sure okay with it, though it can't be easily proven one way or another -- unlike Santa Claus. And by the way, it's A T H E I S T: if you're going to be against it learn how to spell it.

Any parent who teaches their kids to believe in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny is committing child abuse by damaging the kid's ability to tell true from false. In the medium run you might be doing them a favor by letting them find out the adults around them, especially Mommy and Daddy, are evil two-faced liars, but all they're likely to do after they find that out is spend the rest of their lives trying to believe in SOMETHING: astrology, Jesus, Gaia, Justin Bieber, "democracy," Prince Charming, ANYTHING to fill that empty space where the Santa Claus myth used to be. "I want to believe!" means "Run a con job on me! Reality is too complicated for my vapid little head!"

Teach your children to reason, not to believe, and to understand that there will always be more questions than there are answers. And if you don't know the answer to something admit it and help them learn. At least don't baffle them with bullshiat.


And any teacher who answers yes to "Is Santa Claus real?" should be fired on the spot. You wouldn't want your kid taught that 2+2=5 would you?
 
2012-12-04 08:27:32 PM

mongbiohazard: Mija: The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.


Actually it makes perfect sense to refrain from believing in every extraordinary story of beings with magic powers until solid evidence of the story's truth is presented.

Since there are thousands upon thousands of stories of magical beings and no proof that any of them are real whatsoever it is perfectly rational to disbelieve in all of them equally - and I'd go so far as to say irrational to believe otherwise. The Judeo-Christian god is no different from any other religious myth in this respect, and in fact you can find many elements of the Yahweh myth present in other competing mythologies from the era and region where the myth originated.


Please read Joe Campbell, and disavow racial prejudices.
 
2012-12-04 08:27:34 PM

LazarusLong42: Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME), imitating idiot conservatives to vent my frustration about them.

Anyway, my favorite thing to tell members of my church who think that it's adorable to tell kids about Santa is that many people point to their disillusionment about Santa as the first step in their turning away from God, and that by telling them lies about Santa Claus, you demonstrate that you care more about your own amusement than the spiritual destiny of your child.

So you're all right with telling lies about the existence of deities, but you draw the line at telling lies about the existence of Santa? That's some impressive cognitive dissonance, assuming you're not trolling here as well...


har har. Yes yes, God is the same as Santa whatever. I know you guys think that. The difference, the CRUCIAL difference, is that people who tell kids about God ACTUALLY believe in God, whereas very few people who tell kids about santa actually believe in santa.

Even from an Atheist perspective, telling children about Santa is a systematic lie; Telling them about God is merely perpetuating a harmful misconception. there's a real difference between telling a child something you know to be false and telling a child something false which you actually yourself believe. surely you must admit that?
 
2012-12-04 08:28:06 PM
Everything is so black and white in here.
 
2012-12-04 08:28:11 PM
I see a bright dividing line here between people that have kids and people that don't.
 
2012-12-04 08:28:24 PM

Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME), imitating idiot conservatives to vent my frustration about them.


Huh. Never seen you before. Never will again.
 
2012-12-04 08:29:45 PM

Indubitably: mongbiohazard: Mija: The lie is that God does not exist and that atheists are not religious. You have faith that God is not real. You certainly cannot prove it. You are a sad, angry person who wants to push your beliefs on others while you pretend to be the opposite. You are pathetic.


Actually it makes perfect sense to refrain from believing in every extraordinary story of beings with magic powers until solid evidence of the story's truth is presented.

Since there are thousands upon thousands of stories of magical beings and no proof that any of them are real whatsoever it is perfectly rational to disbelieve in all of them equally - and I'd go so far as to say irrational to believe otherwise. The Judeo-Christian god is no different from any other religious myth in this respect, and in fact you can find many elements of the Yahweh myth present in other competing mythologies from the era and region where the myth originated.

Please read Joe Campbell, and disavow racial prejudices.


P.S. Let kids learn themselves, through experiential exposure to learning opportunity with the best tools available. You can quote me on that.
 
2012-12-04 08:29:47 PM

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: My five-year-old niece asked me yesterday, about the reality of Santa Claus. We looked up Saint Nicholas on Wikipedia, and I read to her of some of the things he did to achieve sainthood. We looked at the pictures of how different cultures view Santa Claus, and discussed what she knew about him. Then I turned her question around on her, and asked her "Well, do you believe in Santa Claus?" She told me "Of course! I just saw his pictures!"

She was satisfied, and I was relieved.


The pictures are lies and your niece is a brain washed consumer, you evil fark!
 
2012-12-04 08:29:50 PM

Millennium: My plan, when I have children, is to tell them that Santa is a game people play, and give them the choice of whether or not to play it too, with the understanding that even if they don't play, it's still considered extremely rude to spoil the game for others.

This teacher is a jerk.


My parents told me santa was a "let's play make believe",made it easier when they decided to not take me to the more expensive santa in one mall but to a cheaper one a block down instead(n, he wasn't a hobo dressed in a Santa suit, thanks for asking)
 
2012-12-04 08:29:59 PM
Santa is and always was a way to bribe your kids into not be such little shiats. Kids are dumb, they need a reason not to set the cat on fire.
 
2012-12-04 08:31:07 PM

Gunny Highway: Everything is so black and white in here.


Nope.

It's as colored as the sky...
 
2012-12-04 08:31:11 PM

timujin: Slesfo: I'm a (relatively theologically conservative) pastor, and part time troll on fark (part time enough that nobody recognizes me, but i've been here a LONG TIME),

well, you're around enough that I have you favorited as: seriously unfunny "Christian" troll


Awww, dang. I try to walk the line and be funny, but sometimes idiotic derp isn't funny anymore. it's a tough line to cross
 
2012-12-04 08:31:39 PM

Gunny Highway: The pictures are lies and your niece is a brain washed consumer, you evil fark!


Boy, you don't know the half of it! :)
 
2012-12-04 08:31:59 PM
And the fact there is no Santa is a "harsh reality"? Then maybe we shouldn't have a farking Santa at all. All Santa is is an early indoctrination into believing in imaginary things, like God. Maybe you Christians ought to rethink this. Maybe less of you would leave the church when you reach adulthood if you weren't taught the first thing you REALLY want to believe with all your heart is a fricking sham.

In my heart, the moment Santa went *poof* is the same moment God did. Think about that for a minute, brainiacs.
 
2012-12-04 08:32:41 PM

mekki: sendtodave: Krymson Tyde: They will learn many truths about the world soon enough. Let them be children and believe in childish things while they can.

Childish beliefs which are taught to them by adults.

Childish adults.

They're five year olds. They believe in childish things because they ARE children.

Santa Claus is a chance for kids to play with their imagination. To imagine how one guy delivers presents all around the world in one night. No one is going to die because a tiny tot believes in a guy with a magic sled and bottomless sack of gifts. Mind you, these same kids will stop believing in him as they grow older without having any permanent damage for believing in the first place.

I know I am in Fark but, man, this thread is full of robots.


And figuring out the truth of Santa on their own is a right of passage of sorts.

The sting of finding out Santa is a lie is almost always softened by finding out it is a lie for the "little kids" and now that they are "big kids" they get to be in on the secret too.
 
2012-12-04 08:33:07 PM

Indubitably: It's actually possible to be respectful to each other, but online, that filter appears to be lost...

To app

*)


none of us are 'here together' and no one can find anyone else to smack them in the mouth. so, we get true honesty. and trolls.
 
2012-12-04 08:33:27 PM

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Gunny Highway: The pictures are lies and your niece is a brain washed consumer, you evil fark!

Boy, you don't know the half of it! :)


Please don't use that word to start a sentence ever. Thank you.
 
2012-12-04 08:33:42 PM
I have a 2yo. First time parent. Wife loves Christmas and Santa and stuff, whereas I really think it's a bunch of crap. I was having this conversation with my dad just the other day. He went on and on about how my sister and I loved the whole Santa thing, but how I figured it out. He starts in with the usual "oh what's the harm it's all in good fun." So I waited, and then I finally made my point:

When children figure out their parents have been lying to them their whole life, they ask themselves the next logical question:
If my parents have been lying to me about this, what ELSE have they been lying to me about?

Pretty sure my kid is gonna be that one that ruins Christmas for all the kids in his class, and I am going to get some nasty phone calls from the school and from other parents.
 
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