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(Orange County Register)   We are Not facing the fiscal cliff because the rich are not paying their fair share. It's because you want too many freebies   (ocregister.com) divider line 505
    More: Unlikely, Mark Steyn, American Love, sissy, Charles Schumer, surrender monkeys, government expenditure, syndicated columnist, Party leaders of the United States Senate  
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3576 clicks; posted to Politics » on 03 Dec 2012 at 2:15 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-12-03 04:27:57 PM  

eraser8: We can't give up Alaska. Too many natural resources.


I'm glad that was caught early. How about Wyoming?
 
2012-12-03 04:29:23 PM  

pciszek: eraser8: Here's the wealth distribution in the USA v. wealth distribution in Sweden (although, it's facetiously called "Equalden" in the chart):

Um, what do the colors represent? Without that information, this chart is very uninformative. The numbers are clearly the size of each pie slice, but what fraction of the US controls 84% of the wealth?


Yeah. It's not the greatest chart...but, as I wrote earlier, it comes straight from a paper written by Michael I. Norton of the Harvard Business School and Dan Ariely of Duke University (PDF). And, even there, it's not spectacular. In any case, according to the paper, "in the United States, the top wealth quintile owns 84% of the total wealth, the second highest 11%, and so on."
 
2012-12-03 04:30:35 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Corvus: So are people on welfare right? They are playing by the rules too. Or is that magically different?

We allow them to have it. I can't blame anyone for working the system! If they really do need it I want them to have it. And because of that, and I know human nature there will be some people who take it that do not need it. I can get mad about it, and sometimes I do, but at the end of the day I understand that in order for people to get the help they need we are going to have bottom feeders
.


Good so you have no problem with people on welfare taking lots of money as long at it's legal? Sorry I thought you did (because you actually said you had a problem with this earlier) but now that you have been show the hypocrisy it is you seemed to have changed your tune.

So why do you get mad a poor people who take advantage of the system but not rich people? And rich people take more money from the system. It seems like a double standard.

Believe it or not I get mad at both people taking advantage of the system. i know that might hurt your brain.
 
2012-12-03 04:31:20 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: Percentages, how the fark do they work? Are you on some kind of special taxation system where you pay a set amount? Because I personally have to pay this thing known as a "percentage".


Apparently the fellow complaining that the richest 20% of the US pays 70% of the taxes would like to tax a fixed amount per person rather than a percentage of income. If we had everyone pay the same dollar amount, total revenue would be zero (since there are some people who have nothing to confiscate, and everyone is paying the same amount, right?) so that would solve the deficit problem--no one would be willing to loan the US money anymore, so there would be no deficit spending. Or any non-deficit spending, either. On the bright side, no more wars.
 
2012-12-03 04:31:43 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: eraser8: We can't give up Alaska. Too many natural resources.

I'm glad that was caught early. How about Wyoming?


I already suggested Florida. What natural resources does it have other than derp? I can't think of any.

Or, Arizona. Yeah, Arizona would work, too.
 
2012-12-03 04:31:46 PM  
Buying stock is so much harder than working 40 hours a week.
 
2012-12-03 04:34:35 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: bradkanus: Maybe it's time for a consumption tax?

Because the poor and middle class aren't getting screwed over enough as it is?


I think he meant a tax on people with tuberculosis. Incentivize people not to get it
 
2012-12-03 04:34:43 PM  

Corvus: The Stealth Hippopotamus: Corvus: So are people on welfare right? They are playing by the rules too. Or is that magically different?

We allow them to have it. I can't blame anyone for working the system! If they really do need it I want them to have it. And because of that, and I know human nature there will be some people who take it that do not need it. I can get mad about it, and sometimes I do, but at the end of the day I understand that in order for people to get the help they need we are going to have bottom feeders
.

Good so you have no problem with people on welfare taking lots of money as long at it's legal? Sorry I thought you did (because you actually said you had a problem with this earlier) but now that you have been show the hypocrisy it is you seemed to have changed your tune.

So why do you get mad a poor people who take advantage of the system but not rich people? And rich people take more money from the system. It seems like a double standard.

Believe it or not I get mad at both people taking advantage of the system. i know that might hurt your brain.


I think many people don't get mad at rich folks for doing it because the rich folks are contributing a lot more to society just by being rich than a poor person is. But of course, it's still a double standard. I get mad at both of them, too.
 
2012-12-03 04:35:02 PM  

eraser8: The Stealth Hippopotamus: eraser8: We can't give up Alaska. Too many natural resources.

I'm glad that was caught early. How about Wyoming?

I already suggested Florida. What natural resources does it have other than derp? I can't think of any.

Or, Arizona. Yeah, Arizona would work, too.


Bonus: That's where our old people live. Medicare and Social Security problems solved!
 
2012-12-03 04:35:08 PM  

Corvus: So you have no problem with people who legally get more from the government through medicare or welfare?


As long as it is corporate welfare I am fine with it... but if it is money for poor people to buy groceries, we gotta put a stop to that!
 
2012-12-03 04:35:29 PM  

The Jami Turman Fan Club: Elzar: These farkclowns in Washington DC just need to use the NY Times Balanced Budget calculator and we can avoid all the fiscal cliff nastiness. Its only been around for the last 2 years...

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/11/13/weekinreview/deficits- gr aphic.html(Pops Like a motherfarker)

Wow, I picked:
Eliminate Earmarks
Reduce Federal workforce by 10% and cut 250,000 government contractors.
Reduce Military to pre-Iraq War size, Reduce Navy and Air Force Fleets, Cancel or Delay some weapons programs.
Reduce the number of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan to 30,000
President Obama's proposals on the taxes.
Reduce mortgage deduction for high-income households
And the bank tax.

And that virtually balanced the budget. I thought it would take a lot more than that.


Yeah it doesn't take much and instead we get this fiscal cliff Bukake Theatre. Throw in a few more things like rolling back tax rates to clinton levels, raise eligibility for SS and Medicare and we are not only balanced, but we are motherfarking paying down the deficit in a meaningful way...
 
2012-12-03 04:38:03 PM  

Corvus: bradkanus: I get it just fine. Is it fair? Nope, but our laws were written more than 100 years ago on income taxes and they don't cover what they should. No tax increase on the rich is going to reach the bulk of what hedge fund managers make.

Maybe it's time for a consumption tax?

WTF are you talking about? We pass budget bills every year!

So you are saying "thigns are broken so let's not ever try to fix it"? What a stupid ass statement that is. You made a comment and you were wrong. you made statement and you were wrong now you are trying to move the goal posts.


How is it wrong to agree with you? I'm just giving your dumb ass a history lesson why we tax income and not assets. You can't change the 16th amendment in a budget bill, dipshiat. You don't understand why hedge fund managers can pay a lesser ratethan you and I explained that to you.

You don't know enough about the tax system to be arguing with me about it.
 
2012-12-03 04:39:12 PM  

urbangirl: Captain_Sunshine: So -

On the gripping hand, we have a cumulative failure of enjoying more government than we've paid for, for over the past thirty years. It's time to pay your bills, kids. Taxes need to go up for everybody, and stay there for a while. Or they'll have to go up even more later.

/Larry Niven is my co-pilot
//But Pournelle is my bombardier

How the hell did you get a bombadier? Will that be in my Obama gift basket?


The "gripping hand" reference is from a set of books by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle. And Pournelle tends to be the more bombastic of the two.

And the "Obama gift basket" is pretty classless, really.
 
2012-12-03 04:40:31 PM  

sprawl15:

[i.imgur.com image 455x270] 

as you can see on this chart it is actually highest at 0%


That can't be the Laffer curve--the Laffer curve always has completely unlabeled axes.
 
MFK
2012-12-03 04:41:22 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Marcus Aurelius: Percentages, how the fark do they work? Are you on some kind of special taxation system where you pay a set amount? Because I personally have to pay this thing known as a "percentage".

There's a good article on Wikipedia about it, you should check it out.


And that's how we pay for roads and bridges, wages for employees and national defense? Do we pay for them with percentages?! No, we pay for them with dollars. Dollars are what count. Romney pays more dollars for you. Gratitude wouldn't be uncalled for.

gilgigamesh: Hey, if you don't ever have the occasion to use those federally regulated air traffic routes for your private jet, that's on you.

Actually you have to pay extra for that.


hey, If people like Romney would stop taking such a huge share of the pie, perhaps they wouldn't have to pay such a huge share of the taxes. But seriously. Cry me a farking river. I have to pay at least 25% of ALL my money in taxes and farks like Romney and their accountants' tricks pay a fraction of that percentage.

These guys are not entitled to such fortunes, they are allowed by the society they exist in to amass such fortunes. They might want to remember that when they start talking about dismantling the social safety nets because they are greedy.
 
2012-12-03 04:45:23 PM  

bradkanus: You don't know enough about the tax system to be arguing with me about it.


LMAO. Yeah dude, you're a regular font of intellectualism.
 
2012-12-03 04:46:09 PM  

Corvus: So you believe if something is legal it's ok to do?

So you have no problem with people who legally get more from the government through medicare or welfare?



People will always get more or less. My mother paid in her entire life and died of a heart attack at 65 before she ever got dime of ss or disability. I dont think that there is a way to be completely even with every single person out there.

And yes I have a problem with it. I have some wonderful ideas on how, what and when taxes are collected. But that's not the discussion here and I dont want to kitchen sink this thread. I'm trying (and sometimes failing) to stay on topic here.
 
2012-12-03 04:46:12 PM  

bradkanus: I'm just giving your dumb ass a history lesson why we tax income and not assets.


Capital gains are....what is that word you used? Oh yes. Income.

Now explain why that income is taxed at half the rate of earned income.
 
2012-12-03 04:49:51 PM  
Services to the poor and middle class="gifts"

Regressive tax breaks for the wealthy=tribute to job creators
 
2012-12-03 04:50:51 PM  
While I am a democrat, i still think the size of the entitlement programs are too big. yes i understand they are largely important, but they are also largely bloated as alot of US programs are (*cough* Defense *cough*)

I wish that congress had more economists because the lack of them really bothers me.
 
2012-12-03 04:52:48 PM  

Uglybarnacle: While I am a democrat, i still think the size of the entitlement programs are too big. yes i understand they are largely important, but they are also largely bloated as alot of US programs are (*cough* Defense *cough*)

I wish that congress had more economists because the lack of them really bothers me.


I'd settle for more English majors provided that they were smarter than the mooks we have now in large part
 
2012-12-03 04:55:34 PM  

Corvus: Mitt Romney has not paid any taxes on that money.


So what? You're equating tax deferred with tax free when they're a world of farking difference.
 
2012-12-03 04:56:18 PM  

skullkrusher: Uglybarnacle: While I am a democrat, i still think the size of the entitlement programs are too big. yes i understand they are largely important, but they are also largely bloated as alot of US programs are (*cough* Defense *cough*)

I wish that congress had more economists because the lack of them really bothers me.

I'd settle for more English majors provided that they were smarter than the mooks we have now in large part


For the 1000th time: members of Congress are not dumb, generally speaking (well, maybe Hank Johnson)...they're just really, really unethical.
 
2012-12-03 04:57:22 PM  

eraser8: pciszek: eraser8: Here's the wealth distribution in the USA v. wealth distribution in Sweden (although, it's facetiously called "Equalden" in the chart):

Um, what do the colors represent? Without that information, this chart is very uninformative. The numbers are clearly the size of each pie slice, but what fraction of the US controls 84% of the wealth?

Yeah. It's not the greatest chart...but, as I wrote earlier, it comes straight from a paper written by Michael I. Norton of the Harvard Business School and Dan Ariely of Duke University (PDF). And, even there, it's not spectacular. In any case, according to the paper, "in the United States, the top wealth quintile owns 84% of the total wealth, the second highest 11%, and so on."


It still doesn't work. According to what you just said, the cyan must represent the top quintile and the off-white the next quintile. But the pie chart for Equalden shows the off-white pie piece twice as big as the cyan one. By definition, each quintile contains the same number of people. If the top quintile has 18% of the wealth and the next quintile has 36%, then each person in the second quintile is twice as wealthy as each person in the top quintile, in which case, they should be the top quintile. I will attempt to repeat the chart for easy reference:
apt46.net 
In short, the fraction of the wealth controlled by each quintile must be greater than the fraction controlled by the quintile beneath it, and the top quintile must control at least 20% of the wealth, or the math doesn't work.
 
2012-12-03 04:57:33 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: bradkanus: I'm just giving your dumb ass a history lesson why we tax income and not assets.

Capital gains are....what is that word you used? Oh yes. Income.

Now explain why that income is taxed at half the rate of earned income.


I have no idea other than what I remember the rhetoric being at teh time - encourage investment. Again, I'm not defending the cap gains tax rate. I will point out that the 15% applies to everyone.
 
2012-12-03 04:58:23 PM  

Corvus: Good so you have no problem with people on welfare taking lots of money as long at it's legal? Sorry I thought you did (because you actually said you had a problem with this earlier) but now that you have been show the hypocrisy it is you seemed to have changed your tune.


no. I said right there that I do get mad about it. I hate human nature some times and this includes people take welfare money they dont need and shouldn't have. They have no right to that money. They are getting charity and should be thankful that other people have provided it for them.

Corvus: So why do you get mad a poor people who take advantage of the system but not rich people? And rich people take more money from the system. It seems like a double standard.


But them taking money isn't theirs isn't the same as someone who has found a way to shelter their money from the revenuers. Your money is yours up until the IRS can prove it isn't. We the people have no right to your money.

MFK: hey, If people like Romney would stop taking such a huge share of the pie, perhaps they wouldn't have to pay such a huge share of the taxes. But seriously. Cry me a farking river. I have to pay at least 25% of ALL my money in taxes and farks like Romney and their accountants' tricks pay a fraction of that percentage.


Romney is taking any part of any pie. He's paid in more than he could take out. And as far as your 25%, I would rather have 15% of Romney's paycheck than 25% of yours. Remember percentages don't pay bills, dollars do. And Romney has done more to help our government cover it's bills than all of us combined.

And he give 10% to charity. I'll stack that up against anyone on capital hill!!
 
2012-12-03 04:58:52 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: An industrialized nation's government needs about 20% of GDP to function well, and if I am not mistaken we're well below that. Taxation is also at near historic lows.


First, comparisons from the US to other systems are often flawed in that in the US, state and local government spending accounts for a large percentage of total taxes and spending. Certain people (some already in this thread) love to compare US Federal spending to spending by European governments that don't have a similar system. It makes it look like the US has far lower taxes and government spending relative to other similar nations. And while it's true that we are lower, it's not by as much as those skewed numbers would have you think. So while the federal government's taxes as a % of GDP is under 20%, total tax burden is closer to 27%. Which is still lower than the average European country, but not as much as it is if you look at just federal spending.

But regardless, if you're goal is to make total government spending in the US look like some of the more socialized (I don't mean to use the term pejoratively) systems in Europe, well frankly we're already there. The US spends about 39% of GDP on government. That's more than Switzerland (32%), in the same ballpark as Norway and Spain (40.2 & 41.1) and below, but not way below, the Germany, the UK, and Sweden (43.7, 47.3, & 52.0).

One reason our spending is in the same ballpark as those countries, but our social services are (arguably) not, is that we spend such a larger portion of GDP on defense. So one obvious solution is to cut defense spending and insist that our allies in Europe start paying for their fair share. Right now, most of Europe doesn't have to worry about large defense budgets because they know they can rely on ours in times of need. That needs to end.

Of course, in the US the problem is that our revenue (27%) is well below our spending (39%). But unfortunately, even if we raised income taxes on those individuals making more than $200k and families making more than $250k to levels that would maximize revenue that wouldn't come close to closing the 12% gap in GDP (and note, there's little doubt that we are below the revenue maximizing point currently, but note also that the 'Laffer Curve' does exist, the only debate is over where the revenue maximizing point is, not if there is one). Current estimates are that taxing 'the rich' at a revenue optimizing rate would generate about $400B a year. But that's only about 1/3rd of the current deficit. And keep in mind that no one (not even President Obama) is proposing raising taxes that much.

The rest of that gap must be made up by either spending cuts or taxes on the rest of the population. Even cutting the defense budget in half, which is something that has virtually 0 political support, would raise only roughly another $400B. That still leaves another $400B that needs to come from higher taxes on the rest of us, or from entitlement spending.

So if we want to maintain current levels of spending (or even raise them to be more like other advanced countries) we only need to raise spending by at most a couple of percent. However, we'll also need massive cuts to defense spending, and those cuts will likely have devastating short term effects on the economy, as it will require a massive shift in resources out of one sector of the economy (defense contractors) and into others. Even with revenue maximizing tax increases on the wealthy *and* massive defense cuts, we'll still need to either raise taxes on the rest of the population or make major cuts to entitlement spending.
 
2012-12-03 04:59:51 PM  

garron: Welfare programs and food stamps are a waste for healthy people who choose not to work.


How many recipients of "welfare programs and food stamps" are "healthy people who choose not to work", and how many *do* work at places like Walmart that are too damn tightfisted to pay their staff enough to live on?
 
2012-12-03 05:00:33 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Romney isnt taking any part of any pie.


isnt.....
 
2012-12-03 05:01:13 PM  

pciszek: It still doesn't work. According to what you just said, the cyan must represent the top quintile and the off-white the next quintile. But the pie chart for Equalden shows the off-white pie piece twice as big as the cyan one. By definition, each quintile contains the same number of people.


Yes. As was pointed out earlier, Norton and Ariely made the mistake of confusing US wealth distribution with Swedish income distribution. So, the comparison isn't apples to apples. You're the jerk... jerk first brought this to my attention.  And, I accepted it.
 
2012-12-03 05:01:34 PM  

bradkanus: I have no idea other than what I remember the rhetoric being at teh time - encourage investment. Again, I'm not defending the cap gains tax rate. I will point out that the 15% applies to everyone.


Which is a big part of the problem. The capital gains tax is regressive.
 
2012-12-03 05:03:59 PM  

joonyer: I think many people don't get mad at rich folks for doing it because the rich folks are contributing a lot more to society just by being rich than a poor person is.


Just once, I would like to see this claim carefully examined, with numbers. If the "job creators" are creating jobs elsewhere rather than here, then they are not contributing to American society. If they are also receiving massive government handouts in the form of government contracts or corporations paying negative income tax, then they are leeching on American society.
 
2012-12-03 05:07:12 PM  

eraser8: skullkrusher: Uglybarnacle: While I am a democrat, i still think the size of the entitlement programs are too big. yes i understand they are largely important, but they are also largely bloated as alot of US programs are (*cough* Defense *cough*)

I wish that congress had more economists because the lack of them really bothers me.

I'd settle for more English majors provided that they were smarter than the mooks we have now in large part

For the 1000th time: members of Congress are not dumb, generally speaking (well, maybe Hank Johnson)...they're just really, really unethical.


difference without distinction. If their lack of ethics makes them support stupid ideas, I don't really care if it is scumminess or stupidity behind it
 
2012-12-03 05:08:32 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: bradkanus: I have no idea other than what I remember the rhetoric being at teh time - encourage investment. Again, I'm not defending the cap gains tax rate. I will point out that the 15% applies to everyone.

Which is a big part of the problem. The capital gains tax is regressive.


it's progressive. You can certainly argue that it causes our overall federal income tax system to become regressive after a point, you would be correct. However, the cap gains tax itself is progressive
 
2012-12-03 05:09:17 PM  

pciszek: eraser8:
In short, the fraction of the wealth controlled by each quintile must be greater than the fraction controlled by the quintile beneath it, and the top quintile must control at least 20% of the wealth, or the math doesn't work.


Isn't this weighted by the size of each group?
 
2012-12-03 05:12:46 PM  

SixOfDLoC: pciszek: eraser8:
In short, the fraction of the wealth controlled by each quintile must be greater than the fraction controlled by the quintile beneath it, and the top quintile must control at least 20% of the wealth, or the math doesn't work.

Isn't this weighted by the size of each group?


the size of each group is equal
 
2012-12-03 05:23:05 PM  

bradkanus: cameroncrazy1984: bradkanus: I'm just giving your dumb ass a history lesson why we tax income and not assets.

Capital gains are....what is that word you used? Oh yes. Income.

Now explain why that income is taxed at half the rate of earned income.

I have no idea other than what I remember the rhetoric being at teh time - encourage investment. Again, I'm not defending the cap gains tax rate. I will point out that the 15% applies to everyone.


So you decided to argue about something else entirely?
 
2012-12-03 05:26:40 PM  

doczoidberg: I just want to loot the system as much as possible before it collapses.

Is that so wrong?


You are not a CEO of a international mega corporation.
 
2012-12-03 05:26:55 PM  
Have you even seen what rich people spend money on? Fast cars and shiat. Big houses, with multiple hot tubs. The latest, most expensive HDTV.

What they fark are they so passionately complaining about? There comes a point, let's say around 2 million a year income, that you really, really don't need any more money for yourself. You're just pissing it away on diamond encrusted toilet seats and whale penis leather toilet paper (whale penis leather is a real thing, btw, look it up).

The point is, there is only so much money to go around, and lots of people don't have enough of it. And then the people who have far, far too much of it, cry like little babies at the mention that they might want to give some more of it up.

I know you might say 'they worked really hard for their money', well so does a farking toilet cleaner, or a supermarket clerk, or any other depressing dead end worker, so maybe instead of buying that gold plated xbox for your shiatty kids, consider paying your workers a dollar more an hour so that they don't have to go to the food bank at Christmas, you tight-assed arrogant farking assholes.
 
2012-12-03 05:29:35 PM  

epoc_tnac: Have you even seen what rich people spend money on? Fast cars and shiat. Big houses, with multiple hot tubs. The latest, most expensive HDTV.

What they fark are they so passionately complaining about? There comes a point, let's say around 2 million a year income, that you really, really don't need any more money for yourself. You're just pissing it away on diamond encrusted toilet seats and whale penis leather toilet paper (whale penis leather is a real thing, btw, look it up).

The point is, there is only so much money to go around, and lots of people don't have enough of it. And then the people who have far, far too much of it, cry like little babies at the mention that they might want to give some more of it up.

I know you might say 'they worked really hard for their money', well so does a farking toilet cleaner, or a supermarket clerk, or any other depressing dead end worker, so maybe instead of buying that gold plated xbox for your shiatty kids, consider paying your workers a dollar more an hour so that they don't have to go to the food bank at Christmas, you tight-assed arrogant farking assholes.


Every time we have our septic tank pumped, I think to myself "no matter how much we're paying that man, he's not making enough."

But yes, anyone who says that the rich deserve their money need to look at Paris Hilton. She has done nothing for her money but be born to the right parents. Hereditary nobility is something we should not encourage in this country.
 
2012-12-03 05:31:52 PM  

Lord Dimwit: But yes, anyone who says that the rich deserve their money need to look at Paris Hilton. She has done nothing for her money but be born to the right parents. Hereditary nobility is something we should not encourage in this country.


That or Mitt Romney, the guy who had everything handed to him because of his dad and was still biatching that the government treated people like him unfairly when it comes to taxes. 

Do you think Mitt Romney would've been in that same spot if his parents were some middle class family in Boston?
 
2012-12-03 05:34:30 PM  

qorkfiend: ghare: InmanRoshi: PsiChick: verbaltoxin: Europe makes use of the VAT a lot more than we do, also. It makes goods more expensive but it does feed back into social spending.

Strangely enough the European countries doing the worst, are the ones who borrowed cheaply on high risk, and created bubbles in their economies. Libertarians like to point out Greece but the fact is, Greece doesn't print its own money, and it is an example of spending run amok at the cost of production. The US isn't Greece but pointing out reality doesn't penetrate the gold bug's bubble.

Greece also considers it a social virtue to cheat tax collectors.

Yep. Cheating and not paying your taxes is such an accepted practice in Greece, they're afraid that they'll see a mass exodus of doctors and other white collar professionals if they ever start cracking down on tax fraud (as the EU has been pressuring them to do) and requiring them to pay rates competitive with the rest of the industrialized world.

So, they're going to flee Greece for places with even higher tax rates?

Yeah, that was my reaction as well.

When your country asks you to pay taxes, the only correct response is "fark off, I'd rather pay taxes in another country than give you anything."


I think the issue is "Holy shart, I've been blatantly cheating on my taxes for the past 20 years. If they start auditing and prosecuting tax cheats, I'm getting the fark out of here before I get a phone call."

But specifically when it comes to doctors fleeing, as that's one of the biggest concerns, as the EU takes away more autonomy from Greece and starts (attempting) to implement a different culture in return for the bailouts. Most doctors in Greece are self employed and most under-declare their earnings to keep from paying taxes (a lot of plastic surgeons in Greece living in amazing houses reporting to just make the $35k a year). The second is the culture of 'fakelaki' (bribery envelopes) which are ubiquitous in Greece, and doctors typically take them from their patients in exchange for better or faster treatment. So yeah, once you take away the the lifestyle they're accustomed to of paying no taxes and the money they're accustomed to being paid under the table, many might say "If I'm going to have to work and pay taxes like every other doctor in the world, I might as well do it in a country where unemployment isn't 26%".
 
2012-12-03 05:47:49 PM  

pciszek: If they are also receiving massive government handouts in the form of government contracts or corporations paying negative income tax, then they are leeching on American society.


I'd also like to know the rate of underemployment in the forms of government subsidizes employees take in.
 
2012-12-03 05:56:23 PM  
I love how when government wastes money on defense contractors, FTC investigations protecting shareholders, and SEC protections for the rich, it's necessary, but if I want the government to do something with my money that might be useful to me, it's a "freebie" or a "gift," and I'm a "taker" not a "make." Talk to me about freebies when Mitt Romney's tax rate is as high as mine... until then, shove it.
 
2012-12-03 06:01:18 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: tenpoundsofcheese: Marcus Aurelius: Mitt Romney pays half of what I pay. Maybe taxing that farker at my rate won't balance the budget, but it would be a start.

But he contributed a lot more to the economy than you, so don't complain.

It is only a start for you feeling better in your class warfare struggle.

What exactly did Mitt Romney contribute to the economy last year?


They think he's a contributor because he gets jobs shipped to china, then gets crappy lead laden products shipped to Wal-Mart for less money. To some of us though... ya know, those who understand math, this is not something that we should celebrate. Though we were established by a bunch of venture capitalists, our nation succeeded based on hard work, we shouldn't give a pass to the investor class while continually waging war against the working class. Dems should just tack riders onto every department closure Republicans want... you want to get rid of the EPA, then we'll also scrap the SEC... you try to do away with OSHA, we scrap the FTC... make gambling in the stock market every bit as risky as doing actual work and the "creator" class will see what it's really like in the jungle they've created.
 
2012-12-03 06:03:52 PM  

firefly212: I love how when government wastes money on defense contractors, FTC investigations protecting shareholders, and SEC protections for the rich, it's necessary, but if I want the government to do something with my money that might be useful to me, it's a "freebie" or a "gift," and I'm a "taker" not a "make." Talk to me about freebies when Mitt Romney's tax rate is as high as mine... until then, shove it.


Doublespeak of the highest order. And it works. 

/keep big government freebies out of my medicare
 
2012-12-03 06:03:55 PM  
" Jews earn like Episcopalians but vote like Puerto Ricans, Americans are taxed like Puerto Ricans but vote like Scandinavians." The insulting Genius that is Mark Steyn
 
2012-12-03 06:09:45 PM  

epoc_tnac: firefly212: I love how when government wastes money on defense contractors, FTC investigations protecting shareholders, and SEC protections for the rich, it's necessary, but if I want the government to do something with my money that might be useful to me, it's a "freebie" or a "gift," and I'm a "taker" not a "make." Talk to me about freebies when Mitt Romney's tax rate is as high as mine... until then, shove it.

Doublespeak of the highest order. And it works. 

/keep big government freebies out of my medicare


It's just surreal, people who get 80k tax breaks chiding people struggling to get enough food to survive over how they're taking advantage of the system. Orwell lives.
 
2012-12-03 06:10:32 PM  
80k tax breaks ^for dancing horses
 
2012-12-03 06:12:48 PM  
Everyone who makes more money than me is racist and deserves to be taxed for all of their income and possessions. That's what fair means, you racist.

/This is what Fark Libs actually believe
 
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