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(SFGate)   Give a man a pair of boots his feet will be warm for a night, treat his underlying issues and his feet will be warm forever   (sfgate.com) divider line 38
    More: Followup, pairs, treating, New York City Police Department  
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11183 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Dec 2012 at 10:33 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2012-12-03 10:06:34 AM
7 votes:
That we allow our mentally ill to live like this is just abhorrent. I truly admire that officer for trying to help, but individuals can't overcome diseases this insidious. We need to, and can, do better. There is no excuse for this in the wealthiest nation on the planet.
2012-12-03 09:59:21 AM
4 votes:
Bare feet=more donations
2012-12-03 10:43:57 AM
3 votes:
I didn't read any of the original threads if there were any, but someone had to have called this. Homeless people are homeless for a reason. They deserve our efforts and our passion, but you have to be willing to accept that, for many, your help is temporary. I sort of think of it as treating a terminally ill patient. Just make it as reasonably comfortable and dignified as you can while they're still on earth.
2012-12-03 09:34:41 AM
3 votes:
It's a nice gift, but having a pair of nice boots will make him a target.
2012-12-03 12:14:07 PM
2 votes:

skullkrusher: ErinPac: I don't see why anyone would buy $100 shoes for this anyways. It doesn't seem like the guy asked for them, and there are always decently sturdy boots at Walmart or similar places for about $20. It just isn't likely to help him anymore, makes him less likely to keep them, and wastes money that could have been socks or food or whatever.

There are no Walmarts in NYC. There are similar stores like Target but nowhere near Times Square


One thing I've never understood: the 'I'm stuck' mentality. this one usually applies to inner-city 'bangers and the like. You could sling crack for a weekend and make enough to get a greyhound ticket to the middle of the woods in the middle of the country. Start a nice life that doesn't have anything to dowith gangs or drugs or being a stupid asshole. But they are stupid assholes, so they say "I do what I gotta, to get by" and "YOLO" and nothing changes.


/sorry, I had a point when that started
2012-12-03 11:22:36 AM
2 votes:
Cop thought he was giving the guy a nice pair of boots to make his life better. The guy thought the cop was giving him an item of value which had to be traded or protected. This is what happens when incompatible worlds collide.
2012-12-03 11:04:17 AM
2 votes:
There was another story floating around about this guy (the bootless/shoeless one) and his brother was quoted as saying something to the effect of "I love my brother and we have an open door policy for him if/when he wants to come home, but he has chosen his life on the street"...dealing with psychos is exhausting, and eventually people get tired of putting up with their shiat....
2012-12-03 10:54:04 AM
2 votes:
This is a prime example of why you should donate to homeless shelters and reputable aid organizations and NOT give donations directly to homeless people. Not only will the charity prioritize your donation to get to the people who need or deserve it the most, many also provide the vital service of following up with the recipient and working with them for the longer-term.
2012-12-03 10:49:26 AM
2 votes:

ginandbacon: That we allow our mentally ill to live like this is just abhorrent. I truly admire that officer for trying to help, but individuals can't overcome diseases this insidious. We need to, and can, do better. There is no excuse for this in the wealthiest nation on the planet.


We actually used to institutionalize the mentally ill. But then people would put Aunt Ginny in the asylum to get her house or put their wild son Ronny or their gay son Ronny in an asylum because he was just too hard to handle. The only answer was to swing the pendulum 100% the other way and close down all the Asylums and make it very hard to institutionalize anyone. So instead of One Flew over the Cuckoo's Next, you get the streets full of the Mentally Ill. Progress!

//I have no idea how to solve this problem but there must be some middle ground somewhere that protects people while letting those that need help get help even against their unstable will.
2012-12-03 10:48:32 AM
2 votes:

ginandbacon: That we allow our mentally ill to live like this is just abhorrent. I truly admire that officer for trying to help, but individuals can't overcome diseases this insidious. We need to, and can, do better. There is no excuse for this in the wealthiest nation on the planet.


I wholeheartedly agree, but something I've witnessed while living in Manhattan is people's unwillingness to accept that they need help. Patients' rights are that they can refuse treatment, so being forcibly committed is extremely difficult. Just the other day, I rode the train with a woman who burst out shrieking at the top of her lungs because she thought the other commuters' newspapers, if read on the train, would pose a deadly threat (Seemed like OCD/Schizophrenia). It was terrifying, but the woman didn't see anything wrong with her fears and didn't seem to realize the problem. She was normal, we were the fools with the deadly newspapers.

As a side note, I wouldn't give someone who is homeless any trade-able good; not because "he'll just sell it for crack", but because it could make him/her an easy mark for theft and attack. I will give them food, but if you'd like to donate, give to homeless shelters and outreach programs.
2012-12-03 10:48:00 AM
2 votes:
"hidden because they're worth a lot of money"

More like "I pawned them and bought a buncha Richard's Wild Irish Rose"
2012-12-03 10:46:53 AM
2 votes:
Hidden at the pawn shop. And they hid 10 bucks in his pocket before he left.
2012-12-03 10:43:45 AM
2 votes:
Is it possible this guy might not actually be homeless? Just playing a shoeless bum because it happens to be profitable?

/cynic
2012-12-03 10:41:59 AM
2 votes:
Hate to say it, but how much you want to bet he sold/swapped them for some sauce?
2012-12-03 05:15:48 PM
1 votes:

gregscott: Darn cop screwed up his begging ploy. This guy makes $800 per day because he doesn't wear shoes in winter. That's buy lots of recreational chemicals.


Does it? sounds like you know from personal experience.
2012-12-03 01:18:19 PM
1 votes:

TV's Vinnie: It's nice someone cared enough to help him, but the plastering around of this guy in such a pitiful state seems a bit like exploitation.


An honest good deed needs no publicity.

If it's truly from the heart, you do it on the sly.
2012-12-03 12:41:36 PM
1 votes:
Bunch of hemming and hawing, and she moved off in search of better prospects. That being said, if she was at the pump, I would have filled the tank and wished her a happy Thanksgiving. I just don't give money..


Good for you!

Let your convictions stop you from helping out another human being!

biatch didn't have a car, she was just trying to scam some money out of you so she could buy a pack of cigs and a 40 oz. so she could go drink herself out of her misery under the bridge where she lives until she passes out.

Hopefully instead now she'll remain completely sober while crying herself to sleep under that bridge.

Good for you!
2012-12-03 12:28:14 PM
1 votes:
Because if you deal with the public, mostly idiots, you end up that way.


I deal with idiots every day as well and I've managed not to end up like them.

Would you really care about sitting down and making a concerted and sympathetic effort to solve a domestic violence situation when you've been to that house five times in the past two months and nothing changes? Woman refuses to get counseling, or press charges, or do whatever and you keep going back.


This is where the job of the Police Officer ends and the role of professional help comes into play.

Yes it's difficult to get called back to the same house over and over again when one of the abused couples won't get help but that's something that has to be understood as going to happen and if you can't handle that kind of stress than find another job or institute mental health screenings to ensure Police Officers are coping with their roles properly.

You can either act all sympathetic and nice and try to help again when you know it's useless or you can just act like a dick and throw everybody in jail because it's really the only damn thing you can do at that point.


You don't have to throw everyone in jail you can calm the situation down, offer assistance and if none is accepted than leave and come back if another call is made.

You don't have to make the situation worse or escalated because you're not happy with the outcome of the situation.

Most of the cops who are jaded ass holes probably got that way through experience. If you actually talk to cops you learn they get to deal with parts of society most of us never get to see and it isn't a happy place.


Then quit your job.

There are plenty of abuse counselors and other professional health care employees who see just as worse if not worse situation on a daily basis and they manage to not let it turn them into insufferable assholes.
2012-12-03 12:24:13 PM
1 votes:
The whole "cop gives homeless guy boots" story was scripted crap, anyway - a somewhat clever "viral marketing" PR campaign.
2012-12-03 12:19:44 PM
1 votes:

machoprogrammer: MycroftHolmes: I know a few cops, though not a ton. They are people, humans like the rest of us. When most of them start reacting the same way to certain situations, I start to wonder if they see or know something that I don't. I don't sit in my ivory tower and harp about how evil they are and how things should be when I am above the fray.

Most cops I have seen are total dickwads. That is why they get up in arms about being video taped on the job, particularly for traffic stops. They are mainly just revenue generators for cities (see: speed traps)

There are certain exceptions, and I know some great cops, but a lot I have met are just bullies with badges.


Most of the cops that I know can be dicks.

Because if you deal with the public, mostly idiots, you end up that way.

Would you really care about sitting down and making a concerted and sympathetic effort to solve a domestic violence situation when you've been to that house five times in the past two months and nothing changes? Woman refuses to get counseling, or press charges, or do whatever and you keep going back.

You can either act all sympathetic and nice and try to help again when you know it's useless or you can just act like a dick and throw everybody in jail because it's really the only damn thing you can do at that point.

Most of the cops who are jaded ass holes probably got that way through experience. If you actually talk to cops you learn they get to deal with parts of society most of us never get to see and it isn't a happy place.
2012-12-03 12:18:25 PM
1 votes:

Masta Kronix: snip...


I think we're actually on the same page here. I was just implying that police overlook the simplest things, while you're giving examples of the worst.

Whether or not they or you want to believe it, every interaction a cop has with another person is critical, regardless of the situation. You'd better believe every officer is trained in and spoken to regularly about maintaining a good relationship with the public. The public is their most important resource.
My point was (and we're off track and out of hand) that officers can be disingenuous with something as simple as giving directions - giving the requestor the impression that they are looked at in the same light as the criminals they deal with.

Trying to connect your point - Now take that bad PR, and the situation in New Orleans; watch the police canvas a neighborhood and see how much cooperation they get. Those who are mistreated by an officer have to dig a little bit deeper and contradict their instincts to give an actual effort to help. More likely they say they don't know or don't want to get involved. If they know that officer and his group's reputation for being helpful, they're going to help just as easily as being asked (assuming their lives aren't in danger).

It helps when one nice officer provides a homeless man with shoes - but this can't just happen at Christmas; we're talking a major structural overhaul of the PD's in major cities across the US. The link you provided has examples of a disconnect between the constitution, laws, the mayor, the chief, and the ranks of his staff devolving into a form of treatment that can not be described as law enforcement. I'm talking officers need to uphold the constitution, risk their lives, put in honest effort, and maintain a good relationship with the public, paying attention to the simplest details. That's the vision. I dare you to say THAT to a NYC (or New Orleans) cop.
2012-12-03 12:10:08 PM
1 votes:
But you have to acknowledge that a social welfare state will breed class resentment. Thats where people become assholes.


No ignorance breeds resentment.

Social Welfare actually brings about higher quality of life and living for society as a whole.

I hold no resentment to those on Welfare or for the fact that society needs Social Welfare programs. If I can understand it's necessity, so can others.

It's a matter of education and understanding the issues.
2012-12-03 12:06:25 PM
1 votes:
So, if cops act like bullies, could it be because they are frequently placed in situation where control, and therefore safety, is dependent on maintaining dominance of the situation (which could be perceived as bullying).

Not saying that all police actions are appropriate, but whenever I hear 'All cops are (racists\thugs\bullies\criminals), I always stop and ask 'why do they act the way they act?'


If a Police Officer acts like a Bully it's because they are not properly trained or mentally fit for the job.

It's really that simple.
2012-12-03 12:02:43 PM
1 votes:

machoprogrammer: MycroftHolmes: I know a few cops, though not a ton. They are people, humans like the rest of us. When most of them start reacting the same way to certain situations, I start to wonder if they see or know something that I don't. I don't sit in my ivory tower and harp about how evil they are and how things should be when I am above the fray.

Most cops I have seen are total dickwads. That is why they get up in arms about being video taped on the job, particularly for traffic stops. They are mainly just revenue generators for cities (see: speed traps)

There are certain exceptions, and I know some great cops, but a lot I have met are just bullies with badges.


So, this brings me back to my original point. My contention is, and remains, that cops act a certain way because of the job conditions and the behavior they have to deal with. So, if cops act like bullies, could it be because they are frequently placed in situation where control, and therefore safety, is dependent on maintaining dominance of the situation (which could be perceived as bullying).

Not saying that all police actions are appropriate, but whenever I hear 'All cops are (racists\thugs\bullies\criminals), I always stop and ask 'why do they act the way they act?'
2012-12-03 12:01:45 PM
1 votes:

Nana's Vibrator: I didn't read any of the original threads if there were any, but someone had to have called this. Homeless people are homeless for a reason. They deserve our efforts and our passion, but you have to be willing to accept that, for many, your help is temporary. I sort of think of it as treating a terminally ill patient. Just make it as reasonably comfortable and dignified as you can while they're still on earth.


I tip homeless people for the same reason I tip baristas: it makes me feel good. What they do with my tip is none of my business, nor is it within my control.
2012-12-03 11:58:27 AM
1 votes:

Masta Kronix: If the story works, they will keep using it.

When I lived in Hawaii, the same guy would come up to me every Wednesday when I went to a particular business office... he always had the exact same story.

It's almost as if homeless people need to make themselves more desperate looking or sound more desperate in order for people to actually provide them with assistance and/or money.

You have a cell phone? Pshhh you should be able to afford a house, insurance, a car and 3 kids if you got a cell phone, I'm not giving you any money!


Its resentment.

There's nothing wrong with it... but its what it comes down to.

When someone in front of me has all their groceries paid for with Food Stamps, and I put down a quarter of my paycheck for the same... it *does* feel resentful.

It doesnt matter that the person has 7 kids and no job. Its that bluntness that says "Im getting this for free. You arent."

It goes through all classes, creeds, and incomes.
2012-12-03 11:19:53 AM
1 votes:

Nobody else found it funny that the link directly above this one featured two police officers beating the shiat out of another homeless man?

Come on I couldn't have been the only one to notice it!!

know a few cops, though not a ton. They are people, humans like the rest of us. When most of them start reacting the same way to certain situations, I start to wonder if they see or know something that I don't. I don't sit in my ivory tower and harp about how evil they are and how things should be when I am above the fray.


No most police officers would rather throw you in jail than actually provide you with assistance once they've made up their mind about you. There are plenty enough examples and proof of that. Only the ignorant or disingenuous would argue against it.

Not that I fully blame the officers, the system is set up to where they are actively encourage to treat everyone like criminals, but it doesn't make it any better in my opinion.
2012-12-03 11:16:30 AM
1 votes:

skullkrusher: Asked about the $100 all-weather boots Officer Larry DePrimo gave him on Nov. 14, Hillman says he's hidden them because "they are worth a lot of money."

Worth a lot more money not on his feet when it comes to people giving him money I'd imagine


A whole lot of this.

Dont want to fark up that "pity" image. Its the only way someone will throw a quarter his way.

You know damn well if you see a homeless dude with Jordans and an iPhone he isnt *that* poor.
2012-12-03 11:16:01 AM
1 votes:

Godscrack: Brainsick: And I hate to tell you, but if the day comes (disaster, etc) the strongest, meanest bastards with the most food, guns, and manpower are going to be running things, at least for awhile.

We can all dream, or have a plan!


No. No we can't. That's the reality. That's life, at the level of tooth and claw. Survival is not a pantry full of canned goods, a stockpile of ammo and a warm house with fire and water ready. That would be civilization. The type of survival you're thinking of hasn't been an issue for 200 years or so in the developed world and NO ONE in the U.S., especially the 'survivalists' I've met, is 'ready' in that sense.
2012-12-03 11:10:12 AM
1 votes:

Snarfangel: mr_a: It is very important to boldly treat the underlining issues where no issues have been treated before! 

--Shoe Trek


Al Bundy?
2012-12-03 10:59:08 AM
1 votes:

Godscrack: Fake photo-op by the cop. And right before Christmas.

Badge-lickers are creaming their pants because one cop bought a homeless man shoes. They have no idea how many laws there that target poor people and the homeless in many states. In many states it's illegal to give homeless people food, clothing or money without a 'permit'. And police are more than enthusiastic about enforcing these laws.

Homeless people die terrible deaths. Even in jail. And it's easy for poor/homeless people to just disappear. People don't care. Police don't care. Police say they're all criminals, just because of the sins of a few. Naturally, they treat them all the same way.

If the day comes when a disaster hits this planet, changing everyone's way of life and the way people live. People will all be on the same level. Money wont matter, it will have no value. All you have is your true character.


Never survived a true disaster.eh?
2012-12-03 10:50:20 AM
1 votes:

Tax Boy: ginandbacon: That we allow our mentally ill to live like this is just abhorrent. I truly admire that officer for trying to help, but individuals can't overcome diseases this insidious. We need to, and can, do better. There is no excuse for this in the wealthiest nation on the planet.

[www.boingboing.net image 368x340]


I think the adage is (too lazy to look it up) that if each nation gave up just 1% of its GDP $, all poverty could be eradicated.
2012-12-03 10:48:30 AM
1 votes:
Fake photo-op by the cop. And right before Christmas.

Badge-lickers are creaming their pants because one cop bought a homeless man shoes. They have no idea how many laws there that target poor people and the homeless in many states. In many states it's illegal to give homeless people food, clothing or money without a 'permit'. And police are more than enthusiastic about enforcing these laws.

Homeless people die terrible deaths. Even in jail. And it's easy for poor/homeless people to just disappear. People don't care. Police don't care. Police say they're all criminals, just because of the sins of a few. Naturally, they treat them all the same way.

If the day comes when a disaster hits this planet, changing everyone's way of life and the way people live. People will all be on the same level. Money wont matter, it will have no value. All you have is your true character.
2012-12-03 10:43:03 AM
1 votes:
Here you go, shoeless, homeless moran, your piece of the pie for that picture:

i.imgur.com
2012-12-03 10:42:20 AM
1 votes:

ginandbacon: That we allow our mentally ill to live like this is just abhorrent. I truly admire that officer for trying to help, but individuals can't overcome diseases this insidious. We need to, and can, do better. There is no excuse for this in the wealthiest nation on the planet.


He hid the boots because he knew he'd be mugged for them. I don't see any mental illness in that.
2012-12-03 10:42:09 AM
1 votes:
The cake is a lie.
2012-12-03 10:41:15 AM
1 votes:
He wants a piece of the pie? Quick, someone set this guy up with a free Facebook account and shift over 75% of those "Likes". I think 75% is a fair cut.
2012-12-03 09:01:19 AM
1 votes:
It is very important to boldly treat the underlining issues.
 
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