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(Lexington Herald Leader)   Thanks to the War On Pain Pills, now real hillbillies are using real heroin   (kentucky.com) divider line 217
    More: Ironic, Kentucky, Kentucky State Police, heroin, Ohio River, White House Office, oxycodone, Appalachia  
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8692 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Nov 2012 at 11:10 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-30 08:41:22 PM

Marcus Aurelius: Lunaville: I'm sure the increased supply of heroin has little to nothing to do with our liberating Afghanistan. That said some people seem to have an internal need to destroy themselves.

It's more of a need to self-medicate. Opiate addicts can be perfectly functional in society. It's the lack of a clean, cheap, and and reliable opium source that does all the damage.


How many opiate addicts do you actually know? Most of the ones I know are miserable and disabled, and it's somewhat unclear if they need the narcotics because they have a disabling condition, or if they have a disabling condition because they need an easy way to get their drugs.

Of course, we may have a different definition for "perfectly functional". The ones I know aren't sticking up Walgreeens as long as they can get their scripts.
 
2012-11-30 08:46:29 PM
Just stop with War On American Citizens already. Just unlock the pharmacy. Period. Want to get high on medical heroin (yes, it's evderywhere else just not here)? Get hot. Like some vicodin for big cleaning days? Head on over to Walgreens. Want some adderal to help with that lard ass? Motor on over to CVS. Have a legit medical need for the pain pills, antibiotics, blood pressure pills etc? Get a chit (prescription) from your doctor and get the drugs for 1/2 price and even covered under insurance. No chit? You pay. Had that illness, injury etc. before and know what the doc is going to give you? Save a buck on M.D. fees and just get the meds. Let the M.D. use his time to actually help someone who needs it.

All that extra money from OTC drug sales? It should be split 4 ways. 25% to the retailer for his new paper work, 25% tax to support inspection etc. 25% manufacturer profit (offset real need discounts) 25% rehab superfund. Watch enough friends and family pay a real consequence for a change drug use will moderate on its own.

Employers will still be free to mandate only non-recreational use of drugs. Just like some treat nicotine like drugs now. If you want a safety critical job like police, EMS, driver you may have to abstain.

Doing drugs doesn't make you a criminal any more than eating carrots makes you a scientist or smoking cigars makes you a deer poacher. Engaging in criminal activity makes you a criminal.

Laws of prohibition, support of laws of prohibition is anti-freedom, anti-civil rights anti-american.
 
2012-11-30 09:05:22 PM

simon_bar_sinister: Just stop with War On American Citizens already. Just unlock the pharmacy. Period. Want to get high on medical heroin (yes, it's evderywhere else just not here)? Get hot. Like some vicodin for big cleaning days? Head on over to Walgreens. Want some adderal to help with that lard ass? Motor on over to CVS. Have a legit medical need for the pain pills, antibiotics, blood pressure pills etc? Get a chit (prescription) from your doctor and get the drugs for 1/2 price and even covered under insurance. No chit? You pay. Had that illness, injury etc. before and know what the doc is going to give you? Save a buck on M.D. fees and just get the meds. Let the M.D. use his time to actually help someone who needs it.

All that extra money from OTC drug sales? It should be split 4 ways. 25% to the retailer for his new paper work, 25% tax to support inspection etc. 25% manufacturer profit (offset real need discounts) 25% rehab superfund. Watch enough friends and family pay a real consequence for a change drug use will moderate on its own.

Employers will still be free to mandate only non-recreational use of drugs. Just like some treat nicotine like drugs now. If you want a safety critical job like police, EMS, driver you may have to abstain.

Doing drugs doesn't make you a criminal any more than eating carrots makes you a scientist or smoking cigars makes you a deer poacher. Engaging in criminal activity makes you a criminal.

Laws of prohibition, support of laws of prohibition is anti-freedom, anti-civil rights anti-american.


Stop making sense.
 
2012-11-30 09:20:57 PM

Huck And Molly Ziegler: me society. Listen, Society, if you were more enriching, fulfilling and lucrative, people wouldn't need to "do drugs" to erase the pain and fill the void.


I think we all have a bacon-shaped hole in our soul.
 
2012-11-30 09:32:21 PM

DrBreRuthlessVillain: ThrobblefootSpectre: I do however disagree with the "legalize everything" crowd. I think that's naive and would be socially disastrous. Unfortunately, many people who repeat the "drug war is a failure" rhetoric fall into the latter category.

Minimal snark intended here, but if you're able to say that legalizing everything would be "socially disastrous," then you must have a special ability to see the future that the rest of us--even on the "legalize everything" side of the argument--lack. If I had that ability I'd be busy picking lottery numbers and enjoying the winnings instead of wasting the workday on Fark, but I digress.

The point of legalizing everything, at least for me, is a matter of principle. Would legalization be a "disaster" for society? I don't pretend to know that with any real certainty, but what I do know is that a society that tolerates laws that make contraband out of certain substances is, in effect, an open air prison colony. I support legalization because it's the right thing to do and a good starting point considering what an authoritarian shiatshow prohibition has been. I don't doubt that some people's lives will be disasters post-legalization, but I can only really say that with any certainty because the existing laws haven't done a thing to prevent it in the here and now. One thing is certain: it will still be an imperfect world post-legalization; it's just that do-gooders might be able to channel their efforts a little more productively once the artificial (legal) problems are eliminated.

Start by doing the right thing, then address the problems that remain.


THIS.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences."
― P.J. O'Rourke
 
2012-11-30 11:34:53 PM

megarian: But that wouldn't even kind of work. At all.


ANy dead junkie is a good junkie.
 
2012-12-01 06:30:06 AM

ThrobblefootSpectre: Um, Portugal didn't "legalize everything". Drug possession and use is still against the law, just not a major crime including a prison sentence in some cases. You do realize you need a prescription to get pain pills there right, just like in the US.? You can't just go to the pharmacist and order up a pound of Oxy's for the weekend - just like in the U.S.? Okay, maybe you didn't. Go ahead and read a little about it, instead of repeating what you heard about it on fark, and then get back to us. It's hard to know how to respond to the rest of your post when nothing you just said is true.


Except it did. And you're a liar. And who's talking about Oxycotin here? Only you. Nobody else.

Go back under your rock you daft bastard.
 
2012-12-01 11:37:35 AM
Jon iz teh kewl:

an alcoholic isn't an addict to alcohol. he's a violent man that beats his family. someone else who treats their family nicely and drinks the same amount is considered normal

Until he passes out in an important meeting with a big customer and gets fired. Or until his wife finds somebody handsomer, younger, stupider and richer, then it becomes an excuse for divorce.
 
2012-12-01 11:39:13 AM

Tenatra: Jon iz teh kewl:

an alcoholic isn't an addict to alcohol. he's a violent man that beats his family. someone else who treats their family nicely and drinks the same amount is considered normal

Spend some time around heavy alcoholics and watch their withdrawals, they can't function without it.


Um, I believe your sarcasm meter needs recalibrating, that Jon was talking about the label "alcoholic." You know, as in "the map is not the territory."
 
2012-12-01 12:03:14 PM

Jon iz teh kewl: Tenatra: Jon iz teh kewl:

an alcoholic isn't an addict to alcohol. he's a violent man that beats his family. someone else who treats their family nicely and drinks the same amount is considered normal

Spend some time around heavy alcoholics and watch their withdrawals, they can't function without it.

i used to drink about 3-6 beers every night to fall asleep. i quit like 11 months later and had no withdrawal symptoms


Although I'm not a properly degreed, certified and peer-monitored expert, it's my impression that except for the very unlucky rarity, actual physical addiction to alcohol takes a few years to develop -- if it happens at all. Of course when I think about withdrawal from physical addiction to alchohol what comes to mind is a bad case of the shakes, convulsions and DTs: there are many other possible symptoms (link), a lot of which might be attributed to something else. It could be that people sometimes withdraw from alcohol with symptoms so mild they think it's just the flu or something.

Most of the people I've known and heard about who quit drinking struck me as being either non-habituated heavy users (who can quit any time) or psychologically but not physically dependent (who can quit pretty easily any time they make up their mind to). I have heard of people who got bad DTs, had seizures or even died from withdrawal, but what I hear more is just that quitters miss their booze, are a little nervous and short-tempered and have trouble getting to sleep at first, which happen to me when deprived of an Internet connection. (I doubt anybody can really get physically addicted to the World Wide Web without a direct hard-wired neural hookup.)

So my opinion resembles Jon's, that someone gets labelled "alcoholic" because somebody disapproves of his drinking or behavior when he's drunk, regardless of what's actually going on with the actual person. Maybe he just gets drunk as an excuse to beat his wife, maybe his wife got Born Again and finds that disapproving of any drinking at all is part of what that label means, or maybe he got busted for DUI and found that if he volunteered for AA the judge would suspend his sentence.

Be that as it may, I'm never going to move to a dry county; drinking is too much fun to give up, regardless of how easily I might do it. (That's my story and I'm sticking to it.)
 
2012-12-01 12:16:30 PM
Tenatra:

My habit was nightly but I have however had friends that needed it right when they woke up. Withdrawal looks ugly and it was a big motivator for me to get away from it before I fell deeper. For them if they didn't start drinking their bottles right when they woke up it would lead to convulsions and vomiting.

Yeah but how many of those hard-core cases were there? Were all the "alcohol abusers" you knew like that or only some? Two of my buddies back in Louisville and one roommate in Baltimore started drinking as soon as they got up, right after morning coffee if they bothered with that, but most of the drinkers I know wait till evening and then don't get so drunk that they can't walk a straight line.

I'm beginning to think that AA might be partly right: maybe some people are born with a heightened propensity to get physically addicted to alcohol, while most drinkers, even most "heavy" drinkers, just really like the stuff.

The problem I have with the label is when you start calling everybody who usually has two glasses of wine with dinner "alcoholic." In France they call that "over 16."
 
2012-12-01 12:35:03 PM

Fentanyl Bomb: A fentanyl bomb has hit Appalachia. Not surprised that Heroin is close behind.

In my day it was something you used to dislodge Chechnyan separtists from theatres.

/adjusts opioid onion


I'd heard that was a public attempt at aerosolizing opiods. Poor bastards. Any links?
 
2012-12-01 12:39:56 PM

Dirtybird971: is imported into the United States from Mexico and Central America. It's first going to Illinois, Michigan and Ohio, then migrating across the Ohio River into Kentucky.


Are you suggesting heroin migrates?
 
2012-12-01 12:45:01 PM
I don't know about the bigger cities, but here, oxy is $10/mg.

/got a friend working at the county jail
//hookers price their tricks according to what pills they want to buy
///knows WAY too much about what hookers charge for bj/hj/regular sex/anal
 
2012-12-01 12:54:09 PM

Tenatra: Tenatra:

I felt like I needed it at night but I was able to quit.

I should add that even though I've been away from alcohol for close to 2 1/2 years (aside from having 1 beer with dinner every 3 months). I want to drink really bad if it comes up in conversation. Oh damn you are all drinkin at the house tonight? I know not to do hard liquor because I'll have 1 drink, then it leads to another. BAM! Crazy drunk me makes enters the room and I won't be back until the next day after I pass the fark out.


See, that's not me. I don't know what not drinking every day till I was 42 (2005) has to do with it if anything, but I've always been able to stop drinking before I get that drunk. Indeed sometimes I have to work to get very drunk at all.
 
2012-12-01 04:40:15 PM

The One True TheDavid: Jon iz teh kewl:

an alcoholic isn't an addict to alcohol. he's a violent man that beats his family. someone else who treats their family nicely and drinks the same amount is considered normal

Until he passes out in an important meeting with a big customer and gets fired. Or until his wife finds somebody handsomer, younger, stupider and richer, then it becomes an excuse for divorce.


but if he passes out in an important meeting it won't be because of alcohol, cause nobody drinks before work :)
 
2012-12-02 08:28:20 AM
The clinical definition of alcoholism is someone whose alcohol consumption interferes with his life.

If he either gets violent or it somehow affects his relationship with his spouse...
If he gets arrested for DUI or public intox...
If his job performance suffers...
If he sex life falters...
...

Oddly enough what isn't in the clinical definition of alcohol is the amount or frequency of consumption.
The once every six months binge drinker is much of an alcoholic as the guy who starts with beer for breakfast.
 
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